Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust]

From	Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk>
Newsgroups	linux.debian.user
Subject	Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust]
Date	2017-05-25 20:30 +0200
Message-ID	<tL5Gi-3fL-15@gated-at.bofh.it> (permalink)
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On Thu 25 May 2017 at 10:38:22 -0500, David Wright wrote:

> On Thu 25 May 2017 at 12:18:44 (+0100), Brian wrote:
> > On Wed 24 May 2017 at 18:57:01 -0500, David Wright wrote:
> > 
> > > On Wed 24 May 2017 at 17:28:52 (-0500), Michael Milliman wrote:
> > > 
> > > > I installed and have been using feh as a stop-gap until the Debian
> > > > repositories catch up to upstream and/or fix the problem in Stretch.
> > > > Been working just fine, with its limitations.  It's better than a black
> > > > desktop. :)  I had to read the man page a couple of times and try it
> > > > another couple of times to make it work, but work it does.
> > > 
> > > I prefer to keep feh off my systems; its description is a lie.
> > > 
> > > feh - image viewer and cataloguer
> > > 
> > > It's an editor that has no concept of a buffer, but just scribbles
> > > over the original file. And, IIRC, the error message, when thwarted
> > > by a read-only file, is incorrect: it blames the permissions of
> > > the directory, not the file.
> > 
> > The description is not intended to deceive
> 
> It calls itself a viewer, and that is plainly deceptive when
> the program irrecoverably modifies the file with one keystroke,
> whether deliberate or not.

We'll agree on the deceptive, non-deceitful nature of the description,
then.

> > and the limited editing
> > functions are described in the manual.
> 
> One would hope they are. But most viewers I've come across do
> not modify the file when carrying out the trivial but vital
> operations one would expect to be present: orientation,
> flipping etc.
> 
> I would also point out that these single dangerous keystrokes
> are adjacent to other keys that one might expect to use, and
> can use, safely. Eg _ (invert) is next to +, | (flip) is next
> (British layout) to both A and Shift itself.
> 
> I really can't understand why these particular operations
> have been chosen to be in-place; it's grossly incompetent
> interface design.
> 
> > Scribbling can be avoided
> > (Ctrl+2 in the manual):
> 
> I wonder whether you realise that's a mouse command. Have you

It's strange what people wonder about. I suppose it comes from assuming
the other person lacks reading skills and never tests anything. Sad.

> tried holding down Control, then pressing and holding down
> both buttons within the prescribed time constraint, then
> trying to move another digit on the touchpad to get anything
> resembling a precise rightangle rotation?
> 
> No, this is an entirely different function from the flip/invert/
> rotate functions one expects in a viewer. Apropos these mouse
> commands, what's the mysterious "null button" (first in the list)
> that's meant to restore the image?
> 
> > https://github.com/derf/feh/issues/86
> 
> Oh, I see people agree with me. Depressingly, the < and > commands
> are legacy baggage, and derf (flagged as "Owner") says they will
> be kept. So, my choice, and it's no feh, period.

Glad to have helped. A primary source is rarely deceptive or deceitful.

Sometimes feh's modification of a file could have unwanted consequences.
Other times it is of no consequence. But carrying out any operation on
an original file at any time is to be avoided. I might be persuaded to
move from feh to something like qiv or mirage. Meanwhile, I'll stick
with action0, action1, etc to save and restore a file before it is
manipulated.

-- 
Brian.

-- 
Brian.

Thread

Desktop Background Bites the Dust Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 07:00 +0200
  Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Cindy-Sue Causey <butterflybytes@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 07:30 +0200
    Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Jimmy Johnson <field.engineer@gmail.com> - 2017-05-19 12:00 +0200
    Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Mike Kupfer <mkupfer@alum.berkeley.edu> - 2017-05-20 20:50 +0200
      Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 01:30 +0200
  Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2017-05-20 04:20 +0200
    Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Jimmy Johnson <field.engineer@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 07:10 +0200
      Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust RavenLX <ravenlx@sitesplace.net> - 2017-05-21 15:00 +0200
        Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Fungi4All <fungilife@protonmail.com> - 2017-05-21 18:10 +0200
        Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust David Christensen <dpchrist@holgerdanske.com> - 2017-05-21 23:40 +0200
          Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2017-05-22 10:00 +0200
            Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-22 22:30 +0200
            Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-05-23 01:50 +0200
          Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust RavenLX <ravenlx@sitesplace.net> - 2017-05-25 13:40 +0200
            Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-27 01:10 +0200
    Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 01:30 +0200
  Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Mike Kupfer <mkupfer@alum.berkeley.edu> - 2017-05-20 21:00 +0200
    Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 01:40 +0200
      Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 04:40 +0200
        Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 18:00 +0200
        Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-24 19:30 +0200
          Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-25 00:30 +0200
            Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-05-25 02:00 +0200
              Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-25 02:30 +0200
              Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-05-25 13:20 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-05-25 17:40 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-05-25 20:30 +0200
          Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-25 13:00 +0200
            Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Dejan Jocic <jodejka@gmail.com> - 2017-05-25 13:10 +0200
              Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-25 13:30 +0200
              Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-27 01:10 +0200
            Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Ric Moore <wayward4now@gmail.com> - 2017-05-26 16:50 +0200
              Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-26 17:20 +0200
              Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-27 01:10 +0200
            Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-27 01:00 +0200
              Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-05-27 13:40 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] David Wright <deblis@lionunicorn.co.uk> - 2017-05-27 17:00 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Curt <curty@free.fr> - 2017-05-27 17:20 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-05-27 20:20 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-05-29 20:20 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-05-30 06:00 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-05-30 11:20 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Brian <ad44@cityscape.co.uk> - 2017-05-30 11:40 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Greg Wooledge <wooledg@eeg.ccf.org> - 2017-05-30 14:30 +0200
                Re: Clairification - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2017-05-30 15:10 +0200
  SOLVED? - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2017-06-10 23:00 +0200
    Re: SOLVED - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-06-11 02:40 +0200
    Re: SOLVED? - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] songbird <songbird@anthive.com> - 2017-06-11 03:10 +0200
      Re: SOLVED? - was [Re: Desktop Background Bites the Dust] Michael Milliman <michael.e.milliman@gmail.com> - 2017-06-11 03:10 +0200

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