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Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router

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On 15.11.2023 07:56, Stefan Monnier wrote:
>> This looks too good to be true and raises many red flags.
>> According to Intel specs [1] for this processor it's 28W of heat to
>>   dissipate and that is Base Power only, Turbo Boost is whooping 64W(!).
>> IMO it is impossible to do with fan-less design at this small size, so there
>> will be at least small fan running at full speed at all time and there has
>> to be quite beefy heatsink also.
> The marketing material does say fairly clearly that there's a fan inside
> (it even boasts of it being "efficient" and "low noise", mentioning
> "45db").
I wrote that email as a word of caution, because Roberto had mentioned 
he is looking for the device with the same conditions as OP, which is 
"no fans".
And this model will be very noisy at all times.

> Also my understanding is that this CPU is like the one in many NUCs which
> means that its 4.7GHz turbo mode can be used only for *very* short
> bursts, so it may be unnecessary to size the heatsink&fan for the full
> 64W as long as it can withstand it for a long enough "short burst".
And this is why there is no reason to have high power CPU inside.
I expect the CPU temperature to be at 98 degrees Celsius at all times 
and constant throttling under minimal load.
There is also VRM zone often neglected, most likely it will be air 
cooled (without heatsink) with temperatures close to 100C at all times and
there is a limit of how much heat a PCB could dissipate until carbonation.
Even NVMe SSD and RAM generate substantial amounts of heat and I doubt 
this device has the same design as NUC that has extra heatsink under the 
top cover.
What good will it be if with high probability the device will burn out 
in 3 months?

> Note they also offer a fanless system with somewhat similar specs for
> $100 more.  That sounds a lot more atttractive to my ears.
Intel NUC with the same CPU [1] and fan cooling, draws 40-90W from PSU 
and struggle with throttling, overheating and noise.
And NUCs are usually expected to have much better thermal solution 
design than its clones.

If I needed a fan-less PC of this form factor I'd look for 10-15W low 
power CPUs and
refused to buy anything if there is no video review of it, with complete 
disassembly and temperatures under load,
or at least a complete service manual with accurate pictures of components.


[1] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fZbYSUwvea0
-- 
With kindest regards, Alexander.

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Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2023-11-14 00:00 +0100
  Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router jeremy ardley <jeremy.ardley@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 00:10 +0100
  Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Roberto C. Sánchez <roberto@debian.org> - 2023-11-14 00:10 +0100
    Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router "Alexander V. Makartsev" <avbetev@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 07:20 +0100
      Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2023-11-15 04:00 +0100
        Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router "Alexander V. Makartsev" <avbetev@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 08:40 +0100
          Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2023-11-15 14:50 +0100
            Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router "Alexander V. Makartsev" <avbetev@gmail.com> - 2023-11-15 22:00 +0100
              Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2023-11-15 23:50 +0100
                Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router "Alexander V. Makartsev" <avbetev@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 00:40 +0100
                Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router gene heskett <gheskett@shentel.net> - 2023-11-16 01:00 +0100
    Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router debian-user@howorth.org.uk - 2023-11-14 13:40 +0100
  Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Jeffrey Walton <noloader@gmail.com> - 2023-11-14 00:50 +0100
  Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Dan Ritter <dsr@randomstring.org> - 2023-11-14 02:10 +0100
    Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router jeremy ardley <jeremy.ardley@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 02:10 +0100
      Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2023-11-16 03:20 +0100
        Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router jeremy ardley <jeremy.ardley@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 03:40 +0100
      Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Tixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk> - 2023-11-16 08:50 +0100
        Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router jeremy ardley <jeremy.ardley@gmail.com> - 2023-11-16 09:00 +0100
          Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Tixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk> - 2023-11-16 19:40 +0100
        Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2023-11-16 16:50 +0100
          Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router basti <mailinglist@unix-solution.de> - 2023-11-16 17:10 +0100
          Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Tixy <tixy@yxit.co.uk> - 2023-11-16 19:30 +0100
  Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Anssi Saari <anssi.saari@debian-user.mail.kapsi.fi> - 2023-11-14 10:50 +0100
    Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router basti <mailinglist@unix-solution.de> - 2023-11-14 11:20 +0100
  Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2023-11-30 00:20 +0100
    Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Jeffrey Walton <noloader@gmail.com> - 2023-11-30 00:40 +0100
      Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2023-11-30 13:00 +0100
        Set UEFI boot target with Windows (was: Hardware Advice Wanted:  Router) Arno Lehmann <al@its-lehmann.de> - 2023-11-30 13:30 +0100
          Re: Set UEFI boot target with Windows Max Nikulin <manikulin@gmail.com> - 2023-11-30 13:50 +0100
          Re: Set UEFI boot target with Windows (was: Hardware Advice Wanted:  Router) Joe <joe@jretrading.com> - 2023-11-30 14:40 +0100
        Getting UEFI to boot Debian (was: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router) Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2023-12-02 18:10 +0100
    Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2023-12-02 18:00 +0100
      Re: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router Charles Curley <charlescurley@charlescurley.com> - 2023-12-02 20:00 +0100
        memtest86+ on UEFI (was: Hardware Advice Wanted: Router) Stefan Monnier <monnier@iro.umontreal.ca> - 2023-12-02 20:20 +0100
          Re: memtest86+ on UEFI Max Nikulin <manikulin@gmail.com> - 2023-12-03 05:30 +0100

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