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Retiring from the Project (vv221)

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  Retiring from the Project (vv221) Antoine Le Gonidec <vv221@debian.org> - 2026-08-29 13:20 +0200
    Re: Retiring from the Project (vv221) Sotir Danailov <sndanailov@gmail.com> - 2026-08-29 16:50 +0200
    Re: Retiring from the Project (vv221) Aaron Rainbolt <arraybolt3@gmail.com> - 2026-08-30 05:10 +0200
      Re: Retiring from the Project (vv221) <tomas@tuxteam.de> - 2026-08-30 08:50 +0200
        Re: Retiring from the Project (vv221) Aaron Rainbolt <arraybolt3@gmail.com> - 2026-08-30 16:30 +0200
      Re: Retiring from the Project (vv221) Sotir Danailov <sndanailov@gmail.com> - 2026-08-30 12:50 +0200

#14425 — Retiring from the Project (vv221)

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Initially sent to debian-private, shared here because I want the consequences
of Debian fully embracing fascist-backed technology to be known.

I do not expect any other Debian Developer to follow my example, that the most
pro-LLM of all options won the last vote tells me all I need to know about the
people I used to work with.

Do not CC me if you answer to that e-mail, I am no longer interested in anything
coming from Debian.

-----

I can not support the current decision of Debian about LLM use, and am no longer willing to be seen as a part of Debian under these new rules. Pretending to have a "neutral stance" when faced with fascism is not neutrality, it’s active collaboration.

Fuck that, I’m out, I don’t really care if it’s through "emeritus" status or erasure from databases. You can replace me with some agentic AI anyway, so do not even try to pretend you’re going to miss me.

I don’t think I have ever been so disappointed by a community I used to trust.

Antoine Le Gonidec (via nm.debian.org)

For details and to comment, visit https://nm.debian.org/process/1571/

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#14426

On Sat, Aug 29, 2026 at 1:19 PM Antoine Le Gonidec <vv221@debian.org> wrote:
> I don’t think I have ever been so disappointed by a community I used to trust.

Reminds me of the resignations after systemd was accepted. And yeah,
software seems to be getting even worse since then. I don't know why I
expected open source to be holding the line and remain at least
somewhat sane. Hope you find something more worthwhile, thanks for
your work, for this community!

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#14427

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On Sat, 29 Aug 2026 12:17:23 +0200
Antoine Le Gonidec <vv221@debian.org> wrote:

> Initially sent to debian-private, shared here because I want the
> consequences of Debian fully embracing fascist-backed technology to
> be known.
> 
> I do not expect any other Debian Developer to follow my example, that
> the most pro-LLM of all options won the last vote tells me all I need
> to know about the people I used to work with.
> 
> Do not CC me if you answer to that e-mail, I am no longer interested
> in anything coming from Debian.

(Intentionally removed Antoine from the CC list as requested.)

> -----
> 
> I can not support the current decision of Debian about LLM use, and
> am no longer willing to be seen as a part of Debian under these new
> rules. Pretending to have a "neutral stance" when faced with fascism
> is not neutrality, it’s active collaboration.

Not sure if there's any point in saying this, but the fact that the
technology has notable companies pushing it forward that are often
associated with fascism does not mean that the technology itself is
somehow inextricably linked to fascism, just like how Microsoft making
an operating system doesn't associate operating systems in general with
Microsoft or their goals. The GR was concerned with the technology as a
whole AFAICT, not the companies developing some variants of it.

I also can't help but feel that this sentiment expressed in this way is
probably is not comfortable for anyone contributing to the Debian AI
Team [1].

--
Aaron

[1] https://wiki.debian.org/Teams/DebianAI

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#14428

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On Sat, Aug 29, 2026 at 11:03:30PM -0400, Aaron Rainbolt wrote:

[...]

> Not sure if there's any point in saying this, but the fact that the
> technology has notable companies pushing it forward that are often
> associated with fascism does not mean that the technology itself is
> somehow inextricably linked to fascism [...]

At the risk of veering off-topic, I'd like to point out that things
aren't that easy. There's that widespread idea that you can separate
technology from ideology/politics. This is an illusion. You can't --
they interact in very complex and interesting ways.

In the current case, where there are enormous bets at stake, gobs of
money go to wages paid to people like you and me to work for those
"companies associated with fascism" (wonder why those are the ones
which always end up with the cash?). This is but one of the myriad
threads of interaction.

I for one am sad for Antoines decision, but hold it in highest
respect.

Cheers
-- 
t

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#14430

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On Sun, 30 Aug 2026 08:45:42 +0200
<tomas@tuxteam.de> wrote:

> On Sat, Aug 29, 2026 at 11:03:30PM -0400, Aaron Rainbolt wrote:
> 
> [...]
> 
> > Not sure if there's any point in saying this, but the fact that the
> > technology has notable companies pushing it forward that are often
> > associated with fascism does not mean that the technology itself is
> > somehow inextricably linked to fascism [...]  
> 
> At the risk of veering off-topic, I'd like to point out that things
> aren't that easy. There's that widespread idea that you can separate
> technology from ideology/politics. This is an illusion. You can't --
> they interact in very complex and interesting ways.

My point is, even if one believes that a particular model is linked to
fascism, they can always just use another model that isn't. They're out
there (unless I'm severely misunderstanding what people mean by
fascism). People use them. Those would have been banned too under some
of the other proposals. Now they are not.

Certainly one can make a case that a particular software product is not
just a tool. But there is no reasonable case to be made that an entire
field of research is inherently linked to something evil unless the
research itself is fundamentally evil. If there is a way to argue for
that, then we should probably all stop using Debian given that the
three largest developers of operating systems (Google, Microsoft, and
Apple, in roughly that order) are all pursuing goals that many of us
find highly unethical, and therefore operating systems must be linked
to unethical motives as well. (I am aware this claim is absurd.)

--
Aaron

> In the current case, where there are enormous bets at stake, gobs of
> money go to wages paid to people like you and me to work for those
> "companies associated with fascism" (wonder why those are the ones
> which always end up with the cash?). This is but one of the myriad
> threads of interaction.
> 
> I for one am sad for Antoines decision, but hold it in highest
> respect.
> 
> Cheers

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#14429

On Sun, Aug 30, 2026 at 7:57 AM Aaron Rainbolt <arraybolt3@gmail.com> wrote:
> technology has notable companies pushing it forward that are often
> associated with fascism does not mean that the technology itself is
> somehow inextricably linked to fascism

The focus on the "fascism" part, seems to distract from the fact, that
this investment in the "technology" is completely irrational
currently.

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