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DNS records for the Debian Academy

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  DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 07:30 +0200
    Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dominik George <natureshadow@debian.org> - 2022-09-30 08:30 +0200
      Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 10:40 +0200
        Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dominik George <natureshadow@debian.org> - 2022-09-30 10:50 +0200
          Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 11:20 +0200
            Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dominik George <natureshadow@debian.org> - 2022-09-30 11:40 +0200
              Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 13:00 +0200
                Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy "Jonathan Carter (highvoltage)" <jcc@debian.org> - 2022-09-30 13:10 +0200
                  Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 15:10 +0200
                    Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 15:10 +0200
                    Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dominik George <natureshadow@debian.org> - 2022-09-30 15:40 +0200
                      Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Geert Stappers <stappers@stappers.nl> - 2022-09-30 16:20 +0200
                Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dominik George <natureshadow@debian.org> - 2022-09-30 13:40 +0200
    Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Nilesh Patra <nilesh@debian.org> - 2022-09-30 09:40 +0200
      Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 10:50 +0200
    Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Stefano Rivera <stefanor@debian.org> - 2022-09-30 10:50 +0200
      Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 11:20 +0200
      Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy stefanor@debian.org - 2022-09-30 11:20 +0200
        Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> - 2022-09-30 13:00 +0200
      Re: DNS records for the Debian Academy Joost van Baal-Ilić <joostvb-debian@mdcc.cx> - 2022-09-30 11:20 +0200

#12940 — DNS records for the Debian Academy

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Hi,

Debian Academy has been granted already a VPS for installing Moodle and
other needed tools:
https://salsa.debian.org/debian.net-team/requests/-/issues/10

But we still need some help for registering the domain academy.debian.net,
since this can be done only by a DD. The details of how it can be done are
described here: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianDotNet

More information about the DNS records that need to be registered is given
in this message:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-academy/2022/09/msg00048.html

Is there any DD that can help us?
Alternatively, how can I get DD permissions, so that I can try it myself?

If we are not able to add the DNS records, we should request the DebianNet
team to shut down the provided VPS, because it cannot be used.

Regards,
Dashamir

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#12941

Hi,


> But we still need some help for registering the domain academy.debian.net[http://academy.debian.net], since this can be done only by a DD. The details of how it can be done are described here: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianDotNet
> 
> More information about the DNS records that need to be registered is given in this message: https://lists.debian.org/debian-academy/2022/09/msg00048.html
> 
> Is there any DD that can help us?
> Alternatively, how can I get DD permissions, so that I can try it myself?

What is your relation to the Debian project?

I have not seen any contributions so far (besides from trying out Debian Edu), so I wonder what your motivations and goals are.

Also, Debian Academy very much used to be run by project members (DDs). Where have they gone? Who is Debian Academy now?

-nik

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#12943

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 8:21 AM Dominik George <natureshadow@debian.org>
wrote:

>
> What is your relation to the Debian project?
>

I try to take advantage of it, if possible. Like everyone else.

I have not seen any contributions so far (besides from trying out Debian
> Edu), so I wonder what your motivations and goals are.
>

Exactly. Besides DebianEdu, I am also trying to help Debian Academy, as
much as I can.
I consider my motivations and goals a private thing, so I'd prefer to not
share them with the wider public, if possible.

Also, Debian Academy very much used to be run by project members (DDs).
> Where have they gone? Who is Debian Academy now?
>

Good questions. Let's wait for their replies. It wouldn't be appropriate
for me to speak for them.

Dashamir

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#12946

Hi,

> Exactly. Besides DebianEdu, I am also trying to help Debian Academy, as much as I can.
> I consider my motivations and goals a private thing, so I'd prefer to not share them with the wider public, if possible

If your motivations are private, then I'd suggest you not use Debian's community infrastructure and not request privileges within the community for it.

-nik

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#12950

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 10:39 AM Dominik George <natureshadow@debian.org>
wrote:

>
> > I consider my motivations and goals a private thing, so I'd prefer to
> not share them with the wider public, if possible
>
> If your motivations are private, then I'd suggest you not use Debian's
> community infrastructure and not request privileges within the community
> for it.
>

Thanks for your suggestion. With all due respect, please allow me to
decline it. I am giving it a try anyway.

Dashamir

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#12951

Hi,

> Thanks for your suggestion. With all due respect, please allow me to decline it. I am giving it a try anyway.

I know you are aware that the hosting of Moodle and such for Debian Academy is actually a solved issue.

If Debian Academy wants to restart their efforts and wants a machine with Moodle and academy.debian.net pointing to it, all that is needed is a friendly ping with that information to the DD who has been managing it during the first iteration (which is me).

-nik

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#12953

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 11:27 AM Dominik George <natureshadow@debian.org>
wrote:.

>
> I know you are aware that the hosting of Moodle and such for Debian
> Academy is actually a solved issue.
>

Your information is outdated. Maybe it was 2 years ago. It is not now.

If Debian Academy wants to restart their efforts and wants a machine with
> Moodle and academy.debian.net pointing to it, all that is needed is a
> friendly ping with that information to the DD who has been managing it
> during the first iteration (which is me).
>

We have had discussions on the mailing list, we have had several meetings,
where have you been? What kind of ping do you need?

You know how the first iteration ended, don't you? We are trying to do
something better this time. Maybe the "second iteration" is going to have
the same end and the first one, I don't know. But we are giving it a try
anyway.

Dashamir

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#12954

Hi Dashamir

On 2022/09/30 12:28, Dashamir Hoxha wrote:
>     If Debian Academy wants to restart their efforts and wants a machine
>     with Moodle and academy.debian.net <http://academy.debian.net>
>     pointing to it, all that is needed is a friendly ping with that
>     information to the DD who has been managing it during the first
>     iteration (which is me).
> 
> 
> We have had discussions on the mailing list, we have had several 
> meetings, where have you been? What kind of ping do you need?

I think some more patience and understanding about how Debian works 
might go a long way in making this easier for you.

Any DD can set up a subdomain on debian.net (as per 
https://wiki.debian.org/DebianNetDomains) - all that Dominik was saying 
is that he registered academy.debian.net before, so, he is the one 
person who is able to point it to a new location if needed (so, he's 
actually trying to help you here).

-Jonathan

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#12956

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 1:08 PM Jonathan Carter (highvoltage) <
jcc@debian.org> wrote:

>
> I think some more patience and understanding about how Debian works
> might go a long way in making this easier for you.
>

Thanks Jonathan, but I am not having a hard time. If only it was just my
impatience, but I am not a teenager.

Any DD can set up a subdomain on debian.net (as per
> https://wiki.debian.org/DebianNetDomains) - all that Dominik was saying
> is that he registered academy.debian.net before, so, he is the one
> person who is able to point it to a new location if needed (so, he's
> actually trying to help you here).
>

I'm afraid it is not so (look at the other message).
But I am not going to engage in his discourse.

By the way, we (Debian Academy) are having a meeting soon about DNS records.
Any DD that is interested is invited.
The date and time are not final yet, but most probably it will on "Tue Oct
04, 2022 14:30 UTC", at: https://jitsi.debian.social/DebAcademy
date --date="Tue Oct 04, 2022 14:30 UTC"
https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=DebianAcademy+meeting&iso=20221004T1430&p1=%3A&ah=1

Regards,
Dashamir

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#12957

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 2:32 PM Dashamir Hoxha <dashohoxha@gmail.com> wrote:

> By the way, we (Debian Academy) are having a meeting soon about DNS
> records.
>

I forgot to include this reference:
https://lists.debian.org/debian-academy/2022/09/msg00071.html

Any DD that is interested is invited.
> The date and time are not final yet, but most probably it will on "Tue Oct
> 04, 2022 14:30 UTC", at: https://jitsi.debian.social/DebAcademy
> date --date="Tue Oct 04, 2022 14:30 UTC"
>
> https://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/fixedtime.html?msg=DebianAcademy+meeting&iso=20221004T1430&p1=%3A&ah=1
>

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#12958

Dashamir,


> I'm afraid it is not so (look at the other message).
> But I am not going to engage in his discourse.

I'm afraid you still refuse to learn about proceedings in the Debian project.

Also, you seem to repeatedly read "I do not want to hand over full control to you" as "I do not want to help you".

I offered to reestablish the Moodle hosting for your project. If you think this is not helping you, then this is something you have to cope with. My only condition was that you get another DD involved.

Sadly, by now, I have well-founded reasons to believe that you have driven all DDs in the Academy team away with your attitude.

And yet, I am still willing to support your efforts, if you show some will to cooperate instead of insisting on taking over full power right from the start.

-nik

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#12959

On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 03:27:02PM +0200, Dominik George wrote:
> Dashamir,
> 

Dear Peers,


> > I'm afraid it is not so (look at the other message).
> > But I am not going to engage in his discourse.
>
> I'm afraid you still refuse to learn about proceedings in the Debian
> project.
>
> Also, you seem to repeatedly read "I do not want to hand over full
> control to you" as "I do not want to help you".
>
> I offered to reestablish the Moodle hosting for your project. If you
> think this is not helping you, then this is something you have to cope
> with. My only condition was that you get another DD involved.
>
> Sadly, by now, I have well-founded reasons to believe that you have
> driven all DDs in the Academy team away with your attitude.
>
> And yet, I am still willing to support your efforts, if you show some
> will to cooperate instead of insisting on taking over full power right
> from the start.

A possible way out:

* Grant people access to the new VPS
* People can work on the new VPS
* Show the world the new work
* Have future plans
* Consider again the DNS change


The road ahead with notes
* Grant[0] people[1] access[2] to the new VPS
* People[1] can work on the new VPS
* Show[3] the world[4] the new work
* Have future plans[5]
* Consider again[6] the DNS change


[0] Give
[1] Community
[2] enable
[3] have something to show
[4] opposite of alone
[5] understand that it is never finish
[6] accept that there are pauses, accept that silence is not the end of
    the dialog, be aware that each party can/should restart the
    conversion



Groeten
Geert Stappers
-- 
Tomorrow is also September

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#12955

Dashamir,


> We have had discussions on the mailing list, we have had several meetings, where have you been? What kind of ping do you need?
> 
> You know how the first iteration ended, don't you? We are trying to do something better this time. Maybe the "second iteration" is going to have the same end and the first one, I don't know. But we are giving it a try anyway.

I consider your way of interacting with other community members as not helpful. And I ask you to reconsider it, and ask yourself whether you have the skills to drive a community project in Debian forward or not. I conclude that from my observations from Debian Edu as well.

Our first encounter was you grabbing tasks in Debian Edu which others had stood up for, without properly interacting with them. I see the same pattern happening here, and it is the reason why I have refrained from participating in your efforts to date.

The first iteration Endes because no content was produced, because the Academy team did not find the time. It did not end due to any technical issues or issues with the hosting. I see no reason why handing over hosting or DNS to you should change anything about the availability of team members producing content.

Lastly, I do not need to attend any regular meetings in order to manage a VPS and a Moodle installation. I do not have time to get involved with Academy more closely than operating the necessary platforms, but I still can do that.

What I will not do is point a Debian DNS record to a machine managed by you, because I had no chance to build enough trust in your work to date.

The kind of ping I need is a mail with something like "Nik, can Teckids please provide a Moodle VPS for Academy again?". That does not require attending any meetings.

Yet, please make sure that another DD from the Academy team steps up to get root access to that machine.

-nik

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#12942

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 07:13:36AM +0200, Dashamir Hoxha wrote:
> Debian Academy has been granted already a VPS for installing Moodle and
> other needed tools:
> https://salsa.debian.org/debian.net-team/requests/-/issues/10
> 
> But we still need some help for registering the domain academy.debian.net,
> since this can be done only by a DD. The details of how it can be done are
> described here: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianDotNet
> 
> More information about the DNS records that need to be registered is given
> in this message:
> https://lists.debian.org/debian-academy/2022/09/msg00048.html
> 
> Is there any DD that can help us?

Since Jonathan Bustillos created the salsa issue and is also a member of the
debian academy team, it is best if you ask them to do it. They are a DD already and would
have access to master.d.o to do the required setups.

> Alternatively, how can I get DD permissions, so that I can try it myself?

It is not something that can happen in a day out of the blue, I'm afraid.

-- 
Best,
Nilesh

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#12945

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 8:31 AM Nilesh Patra <nilesh@debian.org> wrote:

> > Is there any DD that can help us?
>
> Since Jonathan Bustillos created the salsa issue and is also a member of
> the
> debian academy team, it is best if you ask them to do it. They are a DD
> already and would
> have access to master.d.o to do the required setups.
>

I completely agree with you. Let's wait and see if Jonathan can do it.

> Alternatively, how can I get DD permissions, so that I can try it myself?
>
> It is not something that can happen in a day out of the blue, I'm afraid.
>

I understand. I was afraid about that too, but it was just another option.

Regards,
Dashamir

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#12944

Hi Dashamir (2022.09.30_05:13:36_+0000)
> Debian Academy has been granted already a VPS for installing Moodle and
> other needed tools:
> https://salsa.debian.org/debian.net-team/requests/-/issues/10
> 
> But we still need some help for registering the domain academy.debian.net,
> since this can be done only by a DD. The details of how it can be done are
> described here: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianDotNet

I could do it for you, but I assumed that you'd want one of your team
members to own the records, rather than having me own them...

That's why I suggested that you (presumably jathan) do it.

SR

-- 
Stefano Rivera
  http://tumbleweed.org.za/
  +1 415 683 3272

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#12947

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 10:35 AM Stefano Rivera <stefanor@debian.org> wrote:

>
> > But we still need some help for registering the domain
> academy.debian.net,
> > since this can be done only by a DD. The details of how it can be done
> are
> > described here: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianDotNet
>
> I could do it for you, but I assumed that you'd want one of your team
> members to own the records, rather than having me own them...
>
> That's why I suggested that you (presumably jathan) do it.
>

Thank you Stefano. You can still do it if you can (if you have time). I
don't expect the DNS records to be changed frequently (unless the IP of the
VPS is changed). So, I don't see much advantage in "owning" them ourselves
(although I agree that this would be better).

As Joost said, jathan has become a bit unresponsive recently, due to
personal issues (as jathan said himself).
Joost himself refuses to do it, and I don't understand his reasons (I don't
think there is a need for a backup DD, at least it is not required for
adding DNS records).
If you add the DNS records, Joost can be a backup for sure (I'd be happy if
he does).

Regards,
Dashamir

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#12948

Hi Joost (2022.09.30_08:41:37_+0000)
> > I could do it for you, but I assumed that you'd want one of your team
> > members to own the records, rather than having me own them...
> > 
> > That's why I suggested that you (presumably jathan) do it.
> 
> I (DD) offered Dashamir my help.  I told him I'd recruit another DD to act as a
> backup for me.  Would you be interested in acting as that other DD?  (jathan
> has left debian-academy project.)

Sorry, I'm not looking to get involved in the academy project. My
involvement was spinning up the VM for the debian.net team.

You (Debian Academy) really do need to find Debian Developers to be part
of your team. The debian.net team rules state that the infrastructure is
for Debian Developers, not the broader community. We're spending Debian
money on this infra, and that's where we drew the line.

SR

-- 
Stefano Rivera
  http://tumbleweed.org.za/
  +1 415 683 3272

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#12952

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On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 11:08 AM <stefanor@debian.org> wrote:

>
> You (Debian Academy) really do need to find Debian Developers to be part
> of your team. The debian.net team rules state that the infrastructure is
> for Debian Developers, not the broader community. We're spending Debian
> money on this infra, and that's where we drew the line.
>

That's what we are trying to do. Better sooner than later. Because if we
can't, we are just wasting resources with that VPS, it is useless.

Dashamir

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#12949

Hi Stefano,

On Fri, Sep 30, 2022 at 08:35:49AM +0000, Stefano Rivera wrote:
> Hi Dashamir (2022.09.30_05:13:36_+0000)
> > Debian Academy has been granted already a VPS for installing Moodle and
> > other needed tools:
> > https://salsa.debian.org/debian.net-team/requests/-/issues/10
> > 
> > But we still need some help for registering the domain academy.debian.net,
> > since this can be done only by a DD. The details of how it can be done are
> > described here: https://wiki.debian.org/DebianDotNet
> 
> I could do it for you, but I assumed that you'd want one of your team
> members to own the records, rather than having me own them...
> 
> That's why I suggested that you (presumably jathan) do it.

I (DD) offered Dashamir my help.  I told him I'd recruit another DD to act as a
backup for me.  Would you be interested in acting as that other DD?  (jathan
has left debian-academy project.)

Thanks, Bye,

Joost

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