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Working for Linux/Debian

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  Working for Linux/Debian Zayd Ahmed <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-08-04 17:30 +0200
    Re: Working for Linux/Debian Gunnar Wolf <gwolf@debian.org> - 2021-08-04 20:40 +0200
    Re: Working for Linux/Debian Onildo R Ribeiro - Pessoal <onildoricardo@gmail.com> - 2021-08-05 06:20 +0200
      Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd Ahmed <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-08-05 06:20 +0200
        Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-08-05 10:50 +0200
          Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-08-05 21:50 +0200
            Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-08-05 23:40 +0200
              Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-08-06 00:50 +0200
                Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-08-06 00:50 +0200
                  Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-08-06 17:10 +0200
                    Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-08-07 16:20 +0200
                      Re: Working for Linux/Debian Peter Pentchev <roam@ringlet.net> - 2021-08-08 00:10 +0200
                        Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-08-08 02:10 +0200
                          Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd Ahmed <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-08-08 05:20 +0200
                      Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-08-08 09:20 +0200
                        Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-08-08 10:40 +0200
                          Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-08-08 12:40 +0200
                          Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-08-08 12:40 +0200
                        Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd Ahmed <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-11-23 17:20 +0100
                          Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-11-23 18:30 +0100
                            Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd Ahmed <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-11-23 18:30 +0100
                              Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-11-23 19:30 +0100
                                Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-11-23 20:30 +0100
                                  Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-11-23 21:00 +0100
                                    Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-11-23 21:20 +0100
                                      Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-11-23 21:50 +0100
                                        Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-11-23 22:00 +0100
                          Re: Working for Linux/Debian Felix Lechner <felix.lechner@lease-up.com> - 2021-11-23 20:30 +0100
              Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-08-06 00:50 +0200
                Re: Working for Linux/Debian Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> - 2021-08-06 10:10 +0200
                  Re: Working for Linux/Debian Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> - 2021-08-06 11:40 +0200
        Mail privacy (was: Working for Linux/Debian) Martin <debacle@debian.org> - 2021-08-05 10:50 +0200
          Re: Mail privacy (was: Working for Linux/Debian) Felix Lechner <felix.lechner@lease-up.com> - 2021-08-05 18:50 +0200
          Re: Mail privacy (was: Working for Linux/Debian) Parodper <parodper@gmail.com> - 2021-08-05 20:40 +0200
    Re: Working for Linux/Debian Paul Wise <pabs@debian.org> - 2021-08-05 06:20 +0200
      Re: Working for Linux/Debian Zayd <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> - 2021-08-05 21:50 +0200

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#12525

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Lol no problem yeah sorry I had asked for some help on here a while ago breaking into the open source/development stuff and there were a lot of answers. So yeah sort of fell of at some point. Maybe will look through this later and see if there was anything specific that I missed. Good luck with whatever you’re doing!

> On Nov 23, 2021, at 10:18 AM, Agata Erminia Pennisi <agataerminiapennisi@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Thanks for your sharing, but this is an excerpt from a closed discussion, which also does not include my complete answers. Discussion that I do not intend to open again.
> 
> Il mar 23 nov 2021, 17:01 Zayd Ahmed <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com <mailto:zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com>> ha scritto:
> Responding to these messages after a long time but I took a bootcamp and hope to pursue further education in order to learn more computer science so then I can hopefully find a career in the field!
> 
> > On Aug 8, 2021, at 12:00 AM, Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk <mailto:dr@jones.dk>> wrote:
> > 
> > Quoting Agata Erminia Pennisi (2021-08-06 23:56:10)
> >> *Red pill r*efers to (becoming enlightened to) the truth about 
> >> reality, especially a truth that is difficult to accept or exposes 
> >> disillusions.
> > 
> > Funny you should emphasize redpill in the context of how to make a 
> > living off of Free software, because it is at the heart of my work.
> > 
> > My use of the term is summarized here¹:
> > https://web.archive.org/web/20190811015333/http://support.redpill.dk/redpill/ <https://web.archive.org/web/20190811015333/http://support.redpill.dk/redpill/>
> > 
> > In my use, a "Redpill" is a standardized way of sharing ICT resources 
> > across multiple organisations, without the need for sharing secrets 
> > (access codes or content).
> > 
> > It grew from my strong interest in long-term sustainability of my work.  
> > When at the beginning working independently I mostly did tuning of 
> > desktop/laptop systems, I realized that it became quite repetitive for 
> > me, without being easy to codify the steps I made.  I noticed the same 
> > when moving to maintaining servers and networks, and wanted to try 
> > standardize some of the structures, in a modular way to still serve each 
> > client uniquely yet do so with reusable components.
> > 
> > My first steady client paying me a monthly subscription fee (established 
> > after 1-2 years of charging by the hour) was a small business 
> > university, but also a related business consultancy firm and a small 
> > team of volunteer activism consultants in their backyard.  I developed a 
> > computer setup for them all, called "Homebase", and slowly generalized 
> > that into something reusable for other groups of organizations - called 
> > "Redpill".
> > 
> > Now, 25 years later, Homebase still exists (see the dusty documentation 
> > at https://support.homebase.dk/ <https://support.homebase.dk/> and a newer draft at 
> > https://docs.homebase.dk/ <https://docs.homebase.dk/> ) but the business university recently decided 
> > to switch to a Microsoft solution so its future is uncertain.
> > 
> > One other experimental Redpill exists, consisting of my own network also 
> > used by my life partner in her business as a graphics designer using 
> > purely Free software, a server run by another Debian developer and 
> > friend of mine, and another friend of mine in couple of his projects on 
> > ICT education and eco activism in Germany.
> > 
> > My hope is to introduce redpill as packages in Debian, but I am not 
> > quite there yet.  If anyone wants to help, please to get in touch :-)
> > 
> > 
> > Kind regards,
> > 
> > - Jonas
> > 
> > 
> > ¹ I reference an archive.org <http://archive.org/> snapshot both because that main web page 
> > (which is also what you would be redirected to if you went to 
> > https://redpill.dk/ <https://redpill.dk/> ) is not currently online, and because it might 
> > interest you for how long that web page has existed.
> > 
> > -- 
> > * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
> > * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/ <http://dr.jones.dk/>
> > 
> > [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private
> 

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#12526

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Hi Zayd,

Quoting Zayd Ahmed (2021-11-23 18:21:38)
> Lol no problem yeah sorry I had asked for some help on here a while 
> ago breaking into the open source/development stuff and there were a 
> lot of answers. So yeah sort of fell of at some point. Maybe will look 
> through this later and see if there was anything specific that I 
> missed. Good luck with whatever you’re doing!

Hapy to hear from you again.

You are most welcome to continue the conversation.

When you get back to an old conversation after longer time, it can help 
if you reply to the part of the thread you were more directly involved 
yourself, instead of a subthread that others may feel they have 
"ownership" on and consider "closed" (as happened here).

Kind regards,

 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#12527

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No "ownership" on my part. I do not wish to be directly or indirectly
involved in discussions extracted ad libitum. That's all.

Bye, bye

Il mar 23 nov 2021, 19:24 Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> ha scritto:

> Hi Zayd,
>
> Quoting Zayd Ahmed (2021-11-23 18:21:38)
> > Lol no problem yeah sorry I had asked for some help on here a while
> > ago breaking into the open source/development stuff and there were a
> > lot of answers. So yeah sort of fell of at some point. Maybe will look
> > through this later and see if there was anything specific that I
> > missed. Good luck with whatever you’re doing!
>
> Hapy to hear from you again.
>
> You are most welcome to continue the conversation.
>
> When you get back to an old conversation after longer time, it can help
> if you reply to the part of the thread you were more directly involved
> yourself, instead of a subthread that others may feel they have
> "ownership" on and consider "closed" (as happened here).
>
> Kind regards,
>
>  - Jonas
>
> --
>  * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
>  * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/
>
>  [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#12529

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Quoting Agata Erminia Pennisi (2021-11-23 20:00:51)
> No "ownership" on my part.

Sorry for misrepresenting your intent.


> I do not wish to be directly or indirectly involved in discussions 
> extracted ad libitum. That's all.

I urge you to simply refrain from posting to the thread if you wish to 
no longer take part in it.

Posting to tell others not to post will involve you more, not less.


Kind regards,

 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#12530

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I'm sorry for you, next time read all messages before replying or quoting.
That's all.

Il mar 23 nov 2021, 20:59 Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> ha scritto:

> Quoting Agata Erminia Pennisi (2021-11-23 20:00:51)
> > No "ownership" on my part.
>
> Sorry for misrepresenting your intent.
>
>
> > I do not wish to be directly or indirectly involved in discussions
> > extracted ad libitum. That's all.
>
> I urge you to simply refrain from posting to the thread if you wish to
> no longer take part in it.
>
> Posting to tell others not to post will involve you more, not less.
>
>
> Kind regards,
>
>  - Jonas
>
> --
>  * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
>  * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/
>
>  [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#12531

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Quoting Agata Erminia Pennisi (2021-11-23 21:04:59)
> I'm sorry for you, next time read all messages before replying or 
> quoting. That's all.

In fact that was not all, only one part of my reply, but... oh well.

 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#12532

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"To not practice what you preach" is a form of hypocrisy, that doesn't
belong to me.
You're welcome.

Il mar 23 nov 2021, 21:33 Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> ha scritto:

> Quoting Agata Erminia Pennisi (2021-11-23 21:04:59)
> > I'm sorry for you, next time read all messages before replying or
> > quoting. That's all.
>
> In fact that was not all, only one part of my reply, but... oh well.
>
>  - Jonas
>
> --
>  * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
>  * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/
>
>  [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#12528

Hi Zayd,

On Tue, Nov 23, 2021 at 8:16 AM Zayd Ahmed <zayd.ahmed92@gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I can hopefully find a career in the field!

I also enjoyed reading your follow-up message.

Kind regards
Felix Lechner

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#12436

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That makes sense. For me I want to know everything I can and solve my own
problems and do projects but I do think that I want to make something so
that I can afford what I need and then also maybe help to support projects
in the community. So I I have my interests and passions but also want to
make some money. So I sort of want to do both. Just trying to manage that
if that makes sense. So I basically like open source and Debian because of
the freedom it offers but see them as both sort of existing. Idealism and
ethics and money making so the best thing to do is maybe just to have a
limit on business practices. And living and learning so if I gain more
insight and find a better way then I’ll try and do that lol

On Thu, Aug 5, 2021 at 17:29 Jonas Smedegaard <dr@jones.dk> wrote:

> Quoting Zayd (2021-08-05 21:26:03)
> > That is really awesome and my mindset is similar. It’s just that there
> > are sometimes cultural pressures and such so I’m just trying to figure
> > out a way to pursue my passions, learn what I am interested in
> > practically while making the money I need in the mean time. Awesome to
> > have met someone that has a similar mindset and really inspiring to
> > hear that you have been able to make it work. How did you go about
> > building your knowledge?
>
> Like Paul Wise also suggested you to do, I did a lot of volunteer work.
> I also offered my services at a very low price until I grew confident
> that I was worth more.
>
>
> > I’ve just tried different things on Linux and completed An
> > Introductory certification through the Linux foundation. I’m
> > comfortable with the basics of how to operate Debian and other distros
> > but want to learn more. I’m most comfortable with apt and Debian based
> > systems at this point.
>
> Training courses and certifications are nice, but experience is better:
> Your future employer or client don't care if you learned your lessons at
> a well-paid job or through volunteer work, but they do care if you have
> _experience_ or only know theoretically how to solve a task.
>
>
> > That is really helpful that you point out that you’re basically a
> > freelancer and that you’ve been able to make it work. I wasn’t sure if
> > that was possible and up to this point was assuming that you just had
> > to work for a big company in order to make the money you need and then
> > do various projects on the side.
>
> Certainly possible, but not glamorous.  I do my hobby full-time, and
> earn about half of the standard wage in my country for a taxi driver or
> garbage man.
>
> To me, money is nice but also a distraction: I strongly prefer the
> freedom of working on things that I value and enjoy.
>
>
>  - Jonas
>
> --
>  * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
>  * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/
>
>  [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#12439

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Quoting Zayd (2021-08-06 00:29:41)
> That makes sense. For me I want to know everything I can and solve my 
> own problems and do projects but I do think that I want to make 
> something so that I can afford what I need and then also maybe help to 
> support projects in the community. So I I have my interests and 
> passions but also want to make some money. So I sort of want to do 
> both. Just trying to manage that if that makes sense.

So say we all ;-)


> So I basically like open source and Debian because of the freedom it 
> offers but see them as both sort of existing. Idealism and ethics and 
> money making so the best thing to do is maybe just to have a limit on 
> business practices. And living and learning so if I gain more insight 
> and find a better way then I’ll try and do that lol

You will certainly gain more insights, but beware that best time to 
explore a radically different way of life is *now*.

Your "needs" are likely fewer than you think but easily "get stuck" by 
life choices, making them harder to let go of later - after you have 
established family and friends and living conditions and bank loans.

My point is don't postpone if you wanna experiment - do it *now*.

It is not a "black or white" question of choosing money or freedoms, but 
that universal human ongoing challenge of striking a balance between 
needs and dreams.

Enjoy your life and the freedoms you decide to sustain in it,

 - Jonas

-- 
 * Jonas Smedegaard - idealist & Internet-arkitekt
 * Tlf.: +45 40843136  Website: http://dr.jones.dk/

 [x] quote me freely  [ ] ask before reusing  [ ] keep private

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#12440

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"You can only gain experience for free.
I told this to a restaurateur who had opened his first restaurant. So, in
order to help him, I asked to eat in his restaurant for free. Oddly, he
said No. 🤔"

Dear Zeid,
I am not part of the Debian project and I'm just an end user.
You can create your own open source projects, projects that are useful for
your use cases. Then you can communicate this to open source communities
and companies to get financial support (crowdfunding). I will do so. In
this way you will experience, but will use your time only to projects that
interest you. If your projects will not be appreciated by the community or
by the companies, these projects will be still useful for your use cases.
For your first job in a company you don't need certification or talent,
just someone (a family member, friend, etc) who suggests your name. In all
industries and around the world is so. Furthermore, your first job must be
recognized financially otherwise it is called exploitation.

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#12429 — Mail privacy (was: Working for Linux/Debian)

Dears,

On 2021-08-04 20:09, Zayd Ahmed wrote:
> When I originally sent this message I just saw the contact information on the Debian website and didn’t realize that this was a chain email.

I wonder, if we should point out more clearly, that certain email
addresses on our website point to public mailing lists, therefore no
privacy can be provided. The term "mailing list" is well-known among us
and explained in wikipedia etc., but not everybody understands its
implications.

I suggest to put *bold* warning signs on the top page(s), where such
email addresses appear:

> Any email to this or that address will end up on a public mailing
> list, visible to the whole world. Do not post any private information
> to that address.

Cheers

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#12430 — Re: Mail privacy (was: Working for Linux/Debian)

Hi,

On Thu, Aug 5, 2021 at 1:45 AM Martin <debacle@debian.org> wrote:
>
> I suggest to put *bold* warning signs on the top page(s), where such
> email addresses appear:

What a great suggestion! So much empathy. How about:

WARNING: Do not post private information here! Your message will be
read by many people and remain visible to the world in public archives
forever.

Kind regards
Felix Lechner

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#12431 — Re: Mail privacy (was: Working for Linux/Debian)

O 05/08/21 ás 10:25, Martin escribiu:
> 
> Dears,
> 
> On 2021-08-04 20:09, Zayd Ahmed wrote:
>> When I originally sent this message I just saw the contact
>> information on the Debian website and didn’t realize that this was
>> a chain email.
> 
> I wonder, if we should point out more clearly, that certain email 
> addresses on our website point to public mailing lists, therefore no 
> privacy can be provided. The term "mailing list" is well-known among
> us and explained in wikipedia etc., but not everybody understands
> its implications.
> 
> I suggest to put *bold* warning signs on the top page(s), where such 
> email addresses appear:
> 
>> Any email to this or that address will end up on a public mailing 
>> list, visible to the whole world. Do not post any private
>> information to that address.
> 
> Cheers
> 

I don't know where did Zayd get the address from, but
https://www.debian.org/contact does have a link to
https://www.debian.org/MailingLists/disclaimer.

As a side note, the contact page should have a link to
https://www.debian.org/MailingLists/#codeofconduct.

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#12427

On Wed, Aug 4, 2021 at 3:28 PM Zayd Ahmed wrote:

> I hope that you are doing well. My name is Zayd. I am currently in the midst of a career change. A couple of years ago, I discovered Linux and realize that I have a passion for it. I have already completed my Bachelors degree. I recently also completed an Introduction to Linux course through the Linux Foundation. I was looking at different jobs and realized there are many different Linux Engineer positions available. I, however, do not have the necessary experience and qualifications. This is something that I would like to pursue and was wondering if you can give me information about pursuing a career in Linux. I enjoy and use Debian but I wasn’t sure who to get in touch with this. If you do not have the information, can you point me in the direction of someone either at Debian or elsewhere who could help me learn how to get into a career with Linux Administration or Software Development geared towards Linux. Thank you and best wishes!

The best option is to pick a job that you would like to have. The
debian-jobs mailing list, as well as the FOSSjobs site and the links
on the FOSSjobs wiki are useful sources of Linux and FLOSS related
jobs. Then review the requirements for the positions you are
interested in, start learning the skills needed and do work on the
related projects as a volunteer in your spare time. Eventually you
will have a track record of relevant experience that will be enough to
apply for the jobs you are interested in.

https://www.fossjobs.net/
https://github.com/fossjobs/fossjobs/wiki/resources

-- 
bye,
pabs

https://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise

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#12432

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Awesome thank you. Jonas spoke about his passion but that really gives a
more concrete plan. Interesting to consider and I will do some more
research to see what I can get started with with working on! Appreciate
your help!


Hey Jonas,

That is really awesome and my mindset is similar. It’s just that there are
sometimes cultural pressures and such so I’m just trying to figure out a
way to pursue my passions, learn what I am interested in practically while
making the money I need in the mean time. Awesome to have met someone that
has a similar mindset and really inspiring to hear that you have been able
to make it work. How did you go about building your knowledge? I’ve just
tried different things on Linux and completed An Introductory certification
through the Linux foundation. I’m comfortable with the basics of how to
operate Debian and other distros but want to learn more. I’m most
comfortable with apt and Debian based systems at this point.

That is really helpful that you point out that you’re basically a
freelancer and that you’ve been able to make it work. I wasn’t sure if that
was possible and up to this point was assuming that you just had to work
for a big company in order to make the money you need and then do various
projects on the side.

Zayd

On Wed, Aug 4, 2021 at 21:55 Paul Wise <pabs@debian.org> wrote:

> On Wed, Aug 4, 2021 at 3:28 PM Zayd Ahmed wrote:
>
> > I hope that you are doing well. My name is Zayd. I am currently in the
> midst of a career change. A couple of years ago, I discovered Linux and
> realize that I have a passion for it. I have already completed my Bachelors
> degree. I recently also completed an Introduction to Linux course through
> the Linux Foundation. I was looking at different jobs and realized there
> are many different Linux Engineer positions available. I, however, do not
> have the necessary experience and qualifications. This is something that I
> would like to pursue and was wondering if you can give me information about
> pursuing a career in Linux. I enjoy and use Debian but I wasn’t sure who to
> get in touch with this. If you do not have the information, can you point
> me in the direction of someone either at Debian or elsewhere who could help
> me learn how to get into a career with Linux Administration or Software
> Development geared towards Linux. Thank you and best wishes!
>
> The best option is to pick a job that you would like to have. The
> debian-jobs mailing list, as well as the FOSSjobs site and the links
> on the FOSSjobs wiki are useful sources of Linux and FLOSS related
> jobs. Then review the requirements for the positions you are
> interested in, start learning the skills needed and do work on the
> related projects as a volunteer in your spare time. Eventually you
> will have a track record of relevant experience that will be enough to
> apply for the jobs you are interested in.
>
> https://www.fossjobs.net/
> https://github.com/fossjobs/fossjobs/wiki/resources
>
> --
> bye,
> pabs
>
> https://wiki.debian.org/PaulWise
>

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