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Merging the PAPT and the DMPT

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  Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Louis-Philippe Véronneau <pollo@debian.org> - 2020-08-27 22:30 +0200
    Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Andrey Rahmatullin <wrar@debian.org> - 2020-08-28 11:30 +0200
      Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Louis-Philippe Véronneau <pollo@debian.org> - 2020-08-28 15:30 +0200
        Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-08-28 16:00 +0200
          Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Emmanuel Arias <eamanu@yaerobi.com> - 2020-08-28 17:00 +0200
            Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Louis-Philippe Véronneau <pollo@debian.org> - 2020-08-28 17:10 +0200
          Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Emmanuel Arias <eamanu@yaerobi.com> - 2020-08-28 17:00 +0200
          Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-09-14 10:20 +0200
            Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Emmanuel Arias <eamanu@yaerobi.com> - 2020-09-14 14:30 +0200
              Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-09-14 22:00 +0200
            Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Dmitry Shachnev <mitya57@debian.org> - 2020-09-14 14:40 +0200
              Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-09-14 22:00 +0200
              Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> - 2020-09-20 02:30 +0200
                Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Dmitry Shachnev <mitya57@debian.org> - 2020-09-20 11:10 +0200
            Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Christian Kastner <ckk@debian.org> - 2020-09-15 00:20 +0200
              Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Louis-Philippe Véronneau <pollo@debian.org> - 2020-09-18 21:40 +0200
              Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-09-21 11:10 +0200
                Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Christian Kastner <ckk@debian.org> - 2020-09-21 19:20 +0200
            Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-09-21 13:30 +0200
              Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Nick Morrott <knowledgejunkie@gmail.com> - 2020-09-21 15:00 +0200
              Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-09-24 09:50 +0200
                Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> - 2020-11-06 03:30 +0100
    Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-08-28 15:30 +0200
      Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> - 2020-09-07 14:00 +0200
        Re: Merging the PAPT and the DMPT Christian Kastner <ckk@debian.org> - 2020-09-08 01:10 +0200

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#12840 — Merging the PAPT and the DMPT

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Hello folks!

Yesterday during the Python BoF at DebConf20 I brought up the question
of merging the PAPT and the DMPT into a single, coherent Python Team.

Most of the people present at the BoF agreed the merge would be a good
idea to:

* improve documentation
* have a consistent workflow between the PAPT and the DMPT
* reduce the bureaucracy of needing to ask membership twice when you
work on python packages

In October 2019, following a short discussion on the ML [1], I opened a
merge request on the policy [2] for this. Most if not all issues in that
MR have since been resolved and the only blocker is getting the admins
approval.

Can we make this happen? If people are against that merge, could you
please speak up and tell us why you think it's a bad idea? At the moment
I feel like I'm fighting the void...

Cheers,

[1]: https://lists.debian.org/debian-python/2019/09/msg00128.html
[2]:
https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/tools/python-modules/-/merge_requests/10

-- 
  ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
  ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁  Louis-Philippe Véronneau
  ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋   pollo@debian.org / veronneau.org
  ⠈⠳⣄

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#12841

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Can you please also describe the current plans for changing/not changing
the Git paths after the merge?

-- 
WBR, wRAR

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#12842

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On 2020-08-28 05 h 28, Andrey Rahmatullin wrote:
> Can you please also describe the current plans for changing/not changing
> the Git paths after the merge?
> 

During the BoF, most people were against changing the git paths after
the merge and this differs from the discussion we had in the Merge Request.

In the MR, people proposed we move everything to a "/packages" path to
simplify things. The rationale is Gitlab should be taking care of
redirecting the old URLs to the new ones for us seamlessly.

I think changing the path would be a good idea, as I don't see the point
between the libraries and applications divide. Then again, if people
prefer we don't move things around, I don't really mind either.

-- 
  ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
  ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁  Louis-Philippe Véronneau
  ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋   pollo@debian.org / veronneau.org
  ⠈⠳⣄

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#12844

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Hi,

pá 28. 8. 2020 v 15:27 odesílatel Louis-Philippe Véronneau <pollo@debian.org>
napsal:

> I think changing the path would be a good idea, as I don't see the point
> between the libraries and applications divide.


+1. GitLab will take care with redirects. It's a mess now :)

-- 
Best regards
 Ondřej Nový

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#12845

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oops, I forgot, I think we must update the line

```
Copyright (c) 2005-2019 Debian Python Team. All rights reserved.
```

to 2020, isn't?

On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 11:52 AM Emmanuel Arias <eamanu@yaerobi.com> wrote:

> Hi everybody!
>
> +1 for the merge.
>
> I think it's easy to change the link to vcs-* in bulk? (Talking from my
> ignorance)
>
> Cheers!
> Emmanuel
>
>
> On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 10:54 AM Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> wrote:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> pá 28. 8. 2020 v 15:27 odesílatel Louis-Philippe Véronneau <
>> pollo@debian.org> napsal:
>>
>>> I think changing the path would be a good idea, as I don't see the point
>>> between the libraries and applications divide.
>>
>>
>> +1. GitLab will take care with redirects. It's a mess now :)
>>
>> --
>> Best regards
>>  Ondřej Nový
>>
>>

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#12847

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On 2020-08-28 10 h 53, Emmanuel Arias wrote:
> oops, I forgot, I think we must update the line
> 
> ```
> Copyright (c) 2005-2019 Debian Python Team. All rights reserved.
> ```
> 
> to 2020, isn't?

Fixed.

-- 
  ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
  ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁  Louis-Philippe Véronneau
  ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋   pollo@debian.org / veronneau.org
  ⠈⠳⣄

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#12846

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Hi everybody!

+1 for the merge.

I think it's easy to change the link to vcs-* in bulk? (Talking from my
ignorance)

Cheers!
Emmanuel


On Fri, Aug 28, 2020 at 10:54 AM Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> pá 28. 8. 2020 v 15:27 odesílatel Louis-Philippe Véronneau <
> pollo@debian.org> napsal:
>
>> I think changing the path would be a good idea, as I don't see the point
>> between the libraries and applications divide.
>
>
> +1. GitLab will take care with redirects. It's a mess now :)
>
> --
> Best regards
>  Ondřej Nový
>
>

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#12869

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Hi,

I prepared scripts for:

   - cloning ACLs from modules+applications subgroups to newly created
   packages subgroup
   - transferring all project from modules+applications to packages subgroup
   - tested on one project:
   https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic

It looks like old web URLs works just fine:
https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/modules/alembic

and cloning too:
$ git clone ssh://git@salsa.debian.org/python-team/modules/alembic.git
Cloning into 'alembic'...
remote: Enumerating objects: 1141, done.
remote: Counting objects: 100% (1141/1141), done.
remote: Compressing objects: 100% (558/558), done.
remote: Total 1141 (delta 720), reused 932 (delta 543), pack-reused 0
Receiving objects: 100% (1141/1141), 882.54 KiB | 989.00 KiB/s, done.
Resolving deltas: 100% (720/720), done.
$

$ git clone https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/modules/alembic.git
Cloning into 'alembic'...
remote: Enumerating objects: 1141, done.
remote: Counting objects: 100% (1141/1141), done.
remote: Compressing objects: 100% (558/558), done.
remote: Total 1141 (delta 720), reused 932 (delta 543), pack-reused 0
Receiving objects: 100% (1141/1141), 882.54 KiB | 3.33 MiB/s, done.
Resolving deltas: 100% (720/720), done.
$

Any thoughts?

pá 28. 8. 2020 v 15:36 odesílatel Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> napsal:

> Hi,
>
> pá 28. 8. 2020 v 15:27 odesílatel Louis-Philippe Véronneau <
> pollo@debian.org> napsal:
>
>> I think changing the path would be a good idea, as I don't see the point
>> between the libraries and applications divide.
>
>
> +1. GitLab will take care with redirects. It's a mess now :)
>
> --
> Best regards
>  Ondřej Nový
>
>

-- 
S pozdravem/Best regards
 Ondřej Nový

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#12873

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Hi,
On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 5:15 AM Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> wrote:

> Hi,
>
> I prepared scripts for:
>
>    - cloning ACLs from modules+applications subgroups to newly created
>    packages subgroup
>    - transferring all project from modules+applications to packages
>    subgroup
>    - tested on one project:
>    https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic
>
> It looks like old web URLs works just fine:
> https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/modules/alembic
>

So, we shouldn't be worried about changing the VCS-*  path during the
migration process, isn't it?

>
>
> and cloning too:
> $ git clone ssh://git@salsa.debian.org/python-team/modules/alembic.git
> Cloning into 'alembic'...
> remote: Enumerating objects: 1141, done.
> remote: Counting objects: 100% (1141/1141), done.
> remote: Compressing objects: 100% (558/558), done.
> remote: Total 1141 (delta 720), reused 932 (delta 543), pack-reused 0
> Receiving objects: 100% (1141/1141), 882.54 KiB | 989.00 KiB/s, done.
> Resolving deltas: 100% (720/720), done.
> $
>
> $ git clone https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/modules/alembic.git
> Cloning into 'alembic'...
> remote: Enumerating objects: 1141, done.
> remote: Counting objects: 100% (1141/1141), done.
> remote: Compressing objects: 100% (558/558), done.
> remote: Total 1141 (delta 720), reused 932 (delta 543), pack-reused 0
> Receiving objects: 100% (1141/1141), 882.54 KiB | 3.33 MiB/s, done.
> Resolving deltas: 100% (720/720), done.
> $
>
> Any thoughts?
>
> pá 28. 8. 2020 v 15:36 odesílatel Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> napsal:
>
>> Hi,
>>
>> pá 28. 8. 2020 v 15:27 odesílatel Louis-Philippe Véronneau <
>> pollo@debian.org> napsal:
>>
>>> I think changing the path would be a good idea, as I don't see the point
>>> between the libraries and applications divide.
>>
>>
>> +1. GitLab will take care with redirects. It's a mess now :)
>>
>> --
>> Best regards
>>  Ondřej Nový
>>
>>
>
> --
> S pozdravem/Best regards
>  Ondřej Nový
>
>

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#12875

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Hi,

po 14. 9. 2020 v 14:26 odesílatel Emmanuel Arias <eamanu@yaerobi.com>
napsal:

> So, we shouldn't be worried about changing the VCS-*  path during the
> migration process, isn't it?
>

right, we should update them in d/control, but it will work with old one
too, which simplifies that process.

-- 
Best regards
 Ondřej Nový

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#12874

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Hi Ondrej!

On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 09:59:00AM +0200, Ondrej Novy wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I prepared scripts for:
>
>    - cloning ACLs from modules+applications subgroups to newly created
>    packages subgroup
>    - transferring all project from modules+applications to packages subgroup
>    - tested on one project:
>    https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic
>
> It looks like old web URLs works just fine:
> https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/modules/alembic

I think it's better to update Vcs fields in all packages to point to the
new location, not one that redirects.

Probably also update Maintainer/Uploader fields with the new team name/email.

--
Dmitry Shachnev

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#12876

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Hi,

po 14. 9. 2020 v 14:39 odesílatel Dmitry Shachnev <mitya57@debian.org>
napsal:

> I think it's better to update Vcs fields in all packages to point to the
> new location, not one that redirects.
>
> Probably also update Maintainer/Uploader fields with the new team
> name/email.
>

yep. But updating these is a "never ending process". Because we can simply
commit change to git, but upload of some packages will take ages :)

Good news is we don't need to hurry with this update.

-- 
Best regards
 Ondřej Nový

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#12887

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Hi,

Dmitry Shachnev <mitya57@debian.org> writes:

> Hi Ondrej!
>
> On Mon, Sep 14, 2020 at 09:59:00AM +0200, Ondrej Novy wrote:
>> Hi,
>>
>> I prepared scripts for:
>>
>>    - cloning ACLs from modules+applications subgroups to newly created
>>    packages subgroup
>>    - transferring all project from modules+applications to packages subgroup
>>    - tested on one project:
>>    https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic
>>
>> It looks like old web URLs works just fine:
>> https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/modules/alembic
>
> I think it's better to update Vcs fields in all packages to point to the
> new location, not one that redirects.
>
> Probably also update Maintainer/Uploader fields with the new team name/email.
>

Are there plans to do this team-wide (for team email in Maintainer) in
one fell swoop, or will this be a per-maintainer task?

Thanks,
Nicholas

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#12888

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On Sat, Sep 19, 2020 at 06:24:06PM -0600, Nicholas D Steeves wrote:
> Are there plans to do this team-wide (for team email in Maintainer) in
> one fell swoop, or will this be a per-maintainer task?

I know Ondrej has the tooling to do mass updates, so I hope he will do it :)

Of course this is only about updating fields in git, there is no need to
upload to archive just because of metadata change.

--
Dmitry Shachnev

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#12878

On 2020-09-14 09:59, Ondrej Novy wrote:
>   * transferring all project from modules+applications to packages subgroup

Has getting rid of the subgroups entirely been considered, IOW: moving
the packages directory to python-team/<package>?

The only remaining subgroup seems to be "tooling", and that could live
on as a subgroup unless I'm misunderstanding GitLab.

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#12886

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On 2020-09-14 17 h 54, Christian Kastner wrote:
> On 2020-09-14 09:59, Ondrej Novy wrote:
>>   * transferring all project from modules+applications to packages subgroup
> 
> Has getting rid of the subgroups entirely been considered, IOW: moving
> the packages directory to python-team/<package>?
> 
> The only remaining subgroup seems to be "tooling", and that could live
> on as a subgroup unless I'm misunderstanding GitLab.
> 

At this point, I'm not sure it makes a huge difference. I like the
division, as it keeps the tools and the packages separated in a clear way.

-- 
  ⢀⣴⠾⠻⢶⣦⠀
  ⣾⠁⢠⠒⠀⣿⡁  Louis-Philippe Véronneau
  ⢿⡄⠘⠷⠚⠋   pollo@debian.org / veronneau.org
  ⠈⠳⣄

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#12889

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Hi,

út 15. 9. 2020 v 0:12 odesílatel Christian Kastner <ckk@debian.org> napsal:

> Has getting rid of the subgroups entirely been considered, IOW: moving
> the packages directory to python-team/<package>?
>
> The only remaining subgroup seems to be "tooling", and that could live
> on as a subgroup unless I'm misunderstanding GitLab.
>

reason is ACL. We need different access for "tools" and for "packages".

-- 
Best regards
 Ondřej Nový

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#12893

On 2020-09-21 10:45, Ondrej Novy wrote:
> út 15. 9. 2020 v 0:12 odesílatel Christian Kastner <ckk@debian.org
>     Has getting rid of the subgroups entirely been considered, IOW: moving
>     the packages directory to python-team/<package>?
> 
> reason is ACL. We need different access for "tools" and for "packages".  

That makes sense, thank you for the clarification!

Second draft of the announcement looks good to me.

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#12890

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Hi,

po 14. 9. 2020 v 9:59 odesílatel Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> napsal:

> I prepared scripts for:
>
>    - cloning ACLs from modules+applications subgroups to newly created
>    packages subgroup
>    - transferring all project from modules+applications to packages
>    subgroup
>    - tested on one project:
>    https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic
>
> done. Sorry for those notification emails. I globally disabled
notification after suggestion from ansgar so you should receive only ~60
emails.

Todo:

   - send debian-devel-announce (i will)
   - mass-commit vcs+maintainer change
   - figure out if we can remove subgroups "modules" and "applications"
   (will it keep redirects?)
   - cleanup "tools" subgroup (remove application policy, etc.)
   - ...?

Example of mass-commit:
https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic/-/commit/0519af5c5f82cced88431b6c0ec364f2979e0c42
https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic/-/commit/51dbd7b278551fbd33abac72c7a240e6baea6a16

Suggestion for better wording of changelog is welcome.

-- 
Best regards
 Ondřej Nový

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#12892

On Mon, 21 Sep 2020 at 12:21, Ondrej Novy <novy@ondrej.org> wrote:
>

> Example of mass-commit:
> https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic/-/commit/0519af5c5f82cced88431b6c0ec364f2979e0c42
> https://salsa.debian.org/python-team/packages/alembic/-/commit/51dbd7b278551fbd33abac72c7a240e6baea6a16
>
> Suggestion for better wording of changelog is welcome.

Here goes nothing!

d/control: Update Vcs-* fields with new Debian Python Team salsa layout
d/control: Update Maintainer field with new Debian Python Team contact address

For a mass commit it seems sensible to make the messages consistent,
but these may still be too verbose.

Cheers,
Nick

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