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Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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  Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package David Bremner <david@tethera.net> - 2018-06-25 13:50 +0200
    Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> - 2018-06-25 23:10 +0200
      Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2018-06-26 09:30 +0200
        Bug#889056: [RFC: original vs fork] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> - 2018-07-03 23:40 +0200
          Bug#889056: [RFC: original vs fork] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package David Bremner <david@tethera.net> - 2018-07-04 12:20 +0200
            Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> - 2018-07-21 21:50 +0200
              Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Lev Lamberov <dogsleg@debian.org> - 2018-07-22 07:10 +0200
                Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> - 2018-07-23 00:40 +0200
                  Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2018-07-23 01:50 +0200
                    Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Lev Lamberov <dogsleg@debian.org> - 2018-07-23 07:40 +0200
                      Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2018-07-23 08:40 +0200
                        Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Lev Lamberov <dogsleg@debian.org> - 2018-07-23 10:10 +0200
                          Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2018-07-23 11:00 +0200
                            Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Lev Lamberov <dogsleg@debian.org> - 2018-07-23 12:40 +0200
                              Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> - 2018-07-24 00:00 +0200
          Bug#889056: [RFC: original vs fork] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name> - 2018-07-04 23:50 +0200
            Bug#889056: [RFC: original vs fork] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> - 2018-07-21 05:30 +0200

#904648 — Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

control: retitle -1 replace apache-mode.el with elpa-apache-mode
control: user debian-emacsen@lists.debian.org
control: usertag +elpify

There is a newer version of apache-mode available from

https://github.com/emacs-php/apache-mode/

We should track package that instead; this will also more or less solve
the reported problem at least on a per system basis, since people can
uninstall elpa-apache-mode without losing other functionality.

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#904744

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On Mon, Jun 25, 2018 at 08:45:58AM -0300, David Bremner wrote:
> 
> There is a newer version of apache-mode available from
> 
> https://github.com/emacs-php/apache-mode/
> 
> We should track package that instead; this will also more or less solve
> the reported problem at least on a per system basis, since people can
> uninstall elpa-apache-mode without losing other functionality.

I also found https://github.com/martenjj/apachemode
which has much nicer documentation.  Last commit was 1.5 years ago vs
emacs-php's copy which is 1 year old.

At any rate, I'd be happy to do the work to elpafy this one, but it's
not a package that I use so it would be best if someone else
maintained it.

P.S. Will RFSs or ITPs need to be filed for each of the 90
emacs-goodies-el subpackages? :-/

Cheers,
Nicholas

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#904797

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Hello,

On Mon, Jun 25 2018, Nicholas D. Steeves wrote:

> P.S. Will RFSs or ITPs need to be filed for each of the 90
> emacs-goodies-el subpackages? :-/

ITPs definitely not.  They are not new in Debian.

I would suggest a joint RFS containing all of them.

-- 
Sean Whitton

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#905961 — Bug#889056: [RFC: original vs fork] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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Hi!

Thank you for your comments, they are much appreciated :-)

On Tue, Jun 26, 2018 at 08:21:41AM +0100, Sean Whitton wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> On Mon, Jun 25 2018, Nicholas D. Steeves wrote:
> 
> > P.S. Will RFSs or ITPs need to be filed for each of the 90
> > emacs-goodies-el subpackages? :-/
> 
> ITPs definitely not.  They are not new in Debian.

What about in the case of forks?  Eg: goodies' apache-mode is the
original, by Jonathan Marten.

https://github.com/martenjj/apachemode is also by Jonathan Marten
  - Notes that it merges the features of three forks back into the
    original.
https://github.com/emacs-php/apache-mode/ is a fork by Karl Chen, and
I wonder if it would be as smooth of a transition.  The fork would
be new to Debian...

At any rate, the RFC: Do we want the version by the original author,
which merges the features from three forks, or do we want the version
on MELPA.  If necessary, I'd be happy to contact Jonathan Marten to
ask him if he would be willing to push his package to MELPA.

> I would suggest a joint RFS containing all of them.

Ok, I'll do this for all the legacy subpackages we decide to maintain.


Cheers,
Nicholas

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#906011 — Bug#889056: [RFC: original vs fork] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> writes:

> https://github.com/martenjj/apachemode is also by Jonathan Marten
>   - Notes that it merges the features of three forks back into the
>     original.
> https://github.com/emacs-php/apache-mode/ is a fork by Karl Chen, and
> I wonder if it would be as smooth of a transition.  The fork would
> be new to Debian...
>
> At any rate, the RFC: Do we want the version by the original author,
> which merges the features from three forks, or do we want the version
> on MELPA.  If necessary, I'd be happy to contact Jonathan Marten to
> ask him if he would be willing to push his package to MELPA.

Being on melpa is not a prerequisite for being in Debian, as long as the
upstream seems maintained.

I don't use apache so I can't really comment on the merits of the two
modes. I do notice that the emacs-php one has tags, and is more recently
active (2017 vs 2016). So I guess go for that one if you don't find a
better way to break the tie.

d

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#908655 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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On Wed, Jul 04, 2018 at 07:08:26AM -0300, David Bremner wrote:
> Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com> writes:
> 
> > https://github.com/martenjj/apachemode is also by Jonathan Marten
> >   - Notes that it merges the features of three forks back into the
> >     original.
> > https://github.com/emacs-php/apache-mode/ is a fork by Karl Chen, and
> > I wonder if it would be as smooth of a transition.  The fork would
> > be new to Debian...
> >
> > At any rate, the RFC: Do we want the version by the original author,
> > which merges the features from three forks, or do we want the version
> > on MELPA.  If necessary, I'd be happy to contact Jonathan Marten to
> > ask him if he would be willing to push his package to MELPA.
> 
> Being on melpa is not a prerequisite for being in Debian, as long as the
> upstream seems maintained.
> 
> I don't use apache so I can't really comment on the merits of the two
> modes. I do notice that the emacs-php one has tags, and is more recently
> active (2017 vs 2016). So I guess go for that one if you don't find a
> better way to break the tie.

https://github.com/martenjj/apachemode
 + original author
 + merges features from three forks
 + has a LICENSE file
 + has an issue tracker
 + easier to extend by patching keyword lists--CSVs

https://github.com/emacs-php/apache-mode/
 + more up-to-date
 + tags releases
 + could also become the version people come to expect, because it's
   on MELPA
 - no description or documentation beyond the short description
   and a code snippet for how to auto-enable the mode.

Ftpmasters would prefer martenjj's copy, because it has a LICENSE
file.  I've filed an upstream issue to investigate if martenjj would be
willing to tag a stable release, and reveal plans for future updates:
  https://github.com/martenjj/apachemode/issues/1

and have emailed Karl Chen (CCed our list) to address the issues on
his copy.

Cheers,
Nicholas

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#908694 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

Сб 21 июл 2018 @ 15:41 Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com>:

> https://github.com/emacs-php/apache-mode/
>  + more up-to-date
>  + tags releases
>  + could also become the version people come to expect, because it's
>    on MELPA
>  - no description or documentation beyond the short description
>    and a code snippet for how to auto-enable the mode.
>
> Ftpmasters would prefer martenjj's copy, because it has a LICENSE
> file.  I've filed an upstream issue to investigate if martenjj would be
> willing to tag a stable release, and reveal plans for future updates:
>   https://github.com/martenjj/apachemode/issues/1

It contains an excerpt from GPL-2 in the code, stating that it is
licensed under GPL-2+. Why do you think FTPMaster will require a LICENSE
file in this case?

Regards,
Lev

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#908859 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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On Sun, Jul 22, 2018 at 10:07:20AM +0500, Lev Lamberov wrote:
> Сб 21 июл 2018 @ 15:41 Nicholas D Steeves <nsteeves@gmail.com>:
> 
> > https://github.com/emacs-php/apache-mode/
> >  + more up-to-date
> >  + tags releases
> >  + could also become the version people come to expect, because it's
> >    on MELPA
> >  - no description or documentation beyond the short description
> >    and a code snippet for how to auto-enable the mode.
> >
> > Ftpmasters would prefer martenjj's copy, because it has a LICENSE
> > file.  I've filed an upstream issue to investigate if martenjj would be
> > willing to tag a stable release, and reveal plans for future updates:
> >   https://github.com/martenjj/apachemode/issues/1
> 
> It contains an excerpt from GPL-2 in the code, stating that it is
> licensed under GPL-2+. Why do you think FTPMaster will require a LICENSE
> file in this case?

In the past FTPMaster has emailed me stating that upstream sources
must contain a full-text copy of the appropriate license.

Cheers,
Nicholas

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#908867 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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Hello,

On Sun 22 Jul 2018 at 06:26PM -0400, Nicholas D Steeves wrote:

> In the past FTPMaster has emailed me stating that upstream sources
> must contain a full-text copy of the appropriate license.

Debian Policy does indeed says something about this.

-- 
Sean Whitton

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#908890 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

Пн 23 июл 2018 @ 07:43 Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name>:
> On Sun 22 Jul 2018 at 06:26PM -0400, Nicholas D Steeves wrote:
>
>> In the past FTPMaster has emailed me stating that upstream sources
>> must contain a full-text copy of the appropriate license.
>
> Debian Policy does indeed says something about this.

Could you provide a concrete link to such requirement, please?

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#908898 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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Hello,

On Mon 23 Jul 2018 at 10:31AM +0500, Lev Lamberov wrote:

> Could you provide a concrete link to such requirement, please?

Hmm.  I was thinking of the first sentence of section 2.3, but that's
not actually the requirement, so perhaps it is not in Policy after all,
sorry.

-- 
Sean Whitton

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#908906 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

Пн 23 июл 2018 @ 14:31 Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name>:

> On Mon 23 Jul 2018 at 10:31AM +0500, Lev Lamberov wrote:
>
>> Could you provide a concrete link to such requirement, please?
>
> Hmm.  I was thinking of the first sentence of section 2.3, but that's
> not actually the requirement, so perhaps it is not in Policy after all,
> sorry.

When I searched the Debian Policy for "license" I was not able to find
any requirement of the mentioned sort. And the section 2.3 is about
debian/copyright file (which is installed as
/usr/share/doc/package/copyright), not LICENSE (or any similar), it is
about _package_, not upstream source.

I've participated as a FTPTrainee in FTP team for some (quite short, I'd
say) time, and I've never heard about any requirement of the sort. If a
given upstream source has a clear license notice, it should be enough.
In such a case the only problem may be with debian/copyright, which is
not related to the upstream source.

Cheers!
Lev

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#908913 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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Hello,

On Mon 23 Jul 2018 at 01:05PM +0500, Lev Lamberov wrote:

> When I searched the Debian Policy for "license" I was not able to find
> any requirement of the mentioned sort. And the section 2.3 is about
> debian/copyright file (which is installed as
> /usr/share/doc/package/copyright), not LICENSE (or any similar), it is
> about _package_, not upstream source.
>
> I've participated as a FTPTrainee in FTP team for some (quite short, I'd
> say) time, and I've never heard about any requirement of the sort. If a
> given upstream source has a clear license notice, it should be enough.
> In such a case the only problem may be with debian/copyright, which is
> not related to the upstream source.

Found what I had in mind, in the REJECT-FAQ:

"If the upstream tarball does not include a copy of the license,
debian/copyright must document when and how the license information was
obtained (i.e. include "Downloaded by John Doe on 2008-12-24 from
http://example.net/license" or reproduce email correspondence including
some header) in addition to reproducing the license itself. In the past
there were uploads where one couldn't find the license statement in the
tarball or on the website from upstream, which is bad."

-- 
Sean Whitton

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#908948 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

Пн 23 июл 2018 @ 16:52 Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name>:

> Found what I had in mind, in the REJECT-FAQ:
>
> "If the upstream tarball does not include a copy of the license,
> debian/copyright must document when and how the license information was
> obtained (i.e. include "Downloaded by John Doe on 2008-12-24 from
> http://example.net/license" or reproduce email correspondence including
> some header) in addition to reproducing the license itself. In the past
> there were uploads where one couldn't find the license statement in the
> tarball or on the website from upstream, which is bad."

Thank you, Sean!

Still I find it ambiguous. It worth to note that this particular point
was revised last time in Dec 2008. Then, in the first sentence it
mentions "a copy of the license", but the second sentece talks about a
"license statement". In emacs-php's apache-mode we have only the second.

Nevertheless,the most interesting thing about emacs-php's apache-mode is
that its license statement says:

> You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License along
> with your copy of Emacs; see the file COPYING.

Cheers!
Lev

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#909074 — Bug#889056: [update] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

Hi!

On Mon, Jul 23, 2018 at 03:31:00PM +0500, Lev Lamberov wrote:
> Пн 23 июл 2018 @ 16:52 Sean Whitton <spwhitton@spwhitton.name>:
> 
> > Found what I had in mind, in the REJECT-FAQ:
> >
> > "If the upstream tarball does not include a copy of the license,
> > debian/copyright must document when and how the license information was
> > obtained (i.e. include "Downloaded by John Doe on 2008-12-24 from
> > http://example.net/license" or reproduce email correspondence including
> > some header) in addition to reproducing the license itself. In the past
> > there were uploads where one couldn't find the license statement in the
> > tarball or on the website from upstream, which is bad."
> 
> Thank you, Sean!

Yes, thank you :-)

> Still I find it ambiguous. It worth to note that this particular point
> was revised last time in Dec 2008. Then, in the first sentence it
> mentions "a copy of the license", but the second sentece talks about a
> "license statement". In emacs-php's apache-mode we have only the second.
> 
> Nevertheless,the most interesting thing about emacs-php's apache-mode is
> that its license statement says:
> 
> > You should have received a copy of the GNU General Public License along
> > with your copy of Emacs; see the file COPYING.

I agree that's interesting, because apache-mode is GPL-2+ and Emacs is
distributing a copy of GPL-3+.  Thankfully Usami Kenta resolved the
issue.  It's ready to sponsor from here:

  git@salsa.debian.org:emacsen-team/apache-mode-el.git

Cheers,
Nicholas

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#906108 — Bug#889056: [RFC: original vs fork] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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Hello,

On Tue, Jul 03 2018, Nicholas D Steeves wrote:

> What about in the case of forks?  Eg: goodies' apache-mode is the
> original, by Jonathan Marten.

I still don't see any need for an ITP.

-- 
Sean Whitton

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#908554 — Bug#889056: [RFC: original vs fork] Re: Bug#889056: replace apache-mode.el with elpa package

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Hi Sean,

On Wed, Jul 04, 2018 at 10:36:01PM +0100, Sean Whitton wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> On Tue, Jul 03 2018, Nicholas D Steeves wrote:
> 
> > What about in the case of forks?  Eg: goodies' apache-mode is the
> > original, by Jonathan Marten.
> 
> I still don't see any need for an ITP.

Awesome, less work for me :-)  Thank you for confirming!

Cheers,
Nicholas

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