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Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03

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On 5/3/24 11:39 PM, olcott wrote:
> On 5/3/2024 10:24 PM, Richard Damon wrote:
>> On 5/3/24 8:13 PM, olcott wrote:
>>> On 5/3/2024 8:40 AM, olcott wrote:
>>>> 00 int H(ptr x, ptr x)  // ptr is pointer to int function
>>>> 01 int D(ptr x)
>>>> 02 {
>>>> 03   int Halt_Status = H(x, x);
>>>> 04   if (Halt_Status)
>>>> 05     HERE: goto HERE;
>>>> 06   return Halt_Status;
>>>> 07 }
>>>> 08
>>>> 09 void main()
>>>> 10 {
>>>> 11   H(D,D);
>>>> 12 }
>>>>
>>>> We are examining the behavior of D(D) for every possible H/D pair
>>>> where 1 to N steps of D(D) are simulated by H.
>>>>
>>>> *Execution Trace*
>>>> Line 11: main() invokes H(D,D) that simulates D(D)
>>>>
>>>> *keeps repeating* (unless aborted)
>>>> Line 01
>>>> Line 02
>>>> Line 03: simulated D(D) invokes simulated H(D,D) that simulates D(D)
>>>>
>>>> *Simulation invariant*
>>>> D correctly simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03.
>>>>
>>>> (a) It is a verified fact that for every possible H/D pair where
>>>> 1 to N steps of D(D) are simulated by H that this simulated D(D)
>>>> cannot possibly reach past its own line 03.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I only had to add this new step because I found that some people just
>>> do not understand that when the executed H(D,D) aborts its simulated
>>> input that all of the nested simulations (if any) immediately totally 
>>> stop running. No simulated H ever returns any value to any simulated D.
>>> We can sum this up much more concisely with (a).
>>
>> Fixing definitions is good.
>>
>> The refutation of (a) that I gave didn't use that "loop hole" and both 
>> of the examples actually simulated the steps to past line 3.
>>
>> After all, how can you simulate past line 3 and not simulate any steps?
>>
> 
> THIS WAS THE DEFINITION THAT YOU RESPONDED TO
> (a) It is a verified fact that *D(D) simulated by H* cannot
> possibly reach past line 03 of *D(D) simulated by H* whether
> H aborts its simulation or not.
> 
> You took *D(D) simulated by H* to mean *D(D) NEVER simulated by H*
> That is a ridiculously stupid mistake.
> 
> You took *D(D) simulated by H* to mean *D(D) NEVER simulated by H*
> That is a ridiculously stupid mistake.
> 
> You took *D(D) simulated by H* to mean *D(D) NEVER simulated by H*
> That is a ridiculously stupid mistake.
> 
> You took *D(D) simulated by H* to mean *D(D) NEVER simulated by H*
> That is a ridiculously stupid mistake.

You are looking at the wrong case and don't even seem to understand what 
I was saying,

THAT example actually took your assumption that (a) was true, and 
thought, based on this statement being true, what can I show, and I 
showed that you can make a valid H that calls almost every input to be 
non-halting.

You donn't seem to actually understand how logic works.


> 
>> The no-simulation case was just showing that using your conclusion 
>> from (a) and saying that H is correct to abort here, allows, with just 
>> as valid of logic, to allow a decider to trivally decide to abort 
>> either after 0, or with your modification, after 1 step, to just abort 
>> and say it couldn't reach the end.
>>
>>>
>>>> (b) Rebuttals must show a counter example where 1 to N steps
>>>> of D(D) are simulated by H and the simulated D(D) reaches past
>>>> its own line 03.
>>
>> Was done.
>>
>> You need to refute that example or you are just admitting you are a 
>> liar that makes claims that have been disproven.
>>
> 
> No I am proving that one of your rebuttals was a ridiculously stupid
> mistake. When you make a ridiculously stupid mistake that is not me
> lying at all.

But you need to prove that ALL my rebuttals don't work.

> 
> If you have a better rebuttal please provide it.

I did. You ignored it.

> 
>> The fact that you don't understand how it was disproven, the fact that 
>> you know that the statements were made and you haven't refuted it, 
>> means your claims have become unproven statements, and thus not valid 
>> to claim.
>>
> 
> *It was not me that made the ridiculously stupid mistake*

Yep, it was.

> 
>>>>
>>>> *Termination Analyzer H is Not Fooled by Pathological Input D*
>>>> https://www.researchgate.net/publication/369971402_Termination_Analyzer_H_is_Not_Fooled_by_Pathological_Input_D
>>>>
>>>> *Fully operational code implemented in the x86utm operating system*
>>>> https://github.com/plolcott/x86utm
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>
> 

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Thread

D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-05-03 08:40 -0500
  Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-05-03 17:53 -0400
    Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-05-03 21:32 -0500
      Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-05-04 08:55 -0400
  Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-05-03 17:42 -0500
    Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-05-03 18:55 -0500
      Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-05-04 08:56 -0400
    Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-05-03 23:11 -0400
  Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-05-03 19:13 -0500
    Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-05-03 23:24 -0400
      Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-05-03 22:39 -0500
        Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-05-04 08:59 -0400
  Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-02 11:50 +0200
    Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-02 09:50 -0500
      Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-03 10:39 +0300
        Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-03 07:25 -0500
          Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-03 17:17 +0300
            Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-03 13:09 -0500
              Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 "Fred. Zwarts" <F.Zwarts@HetNet.nl> - 2024-06-03 21:47 +0200
              Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Richard Damon <richard@damon-family.org> - 2024-06-03 20:56 -0400
              Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-04 08:19 +0000
                Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-04 12:30 -0500
              Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-05 10:05 +0300
                Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-05 08:05 -0500
                Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 joes <noreply@example.com> - 2024-06-05 18:07 +0000
                Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 Mikko <mikko.levanto@iki.fi> - 2024-06-06 11:07 +0300
                Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 olcott <polcott333@gmail.com> - 2024-06-06 08:04 -0500
                Re: D(D) simulated by H cannot possibly reach past its own line 03 immibis <news2@immibis.com> - 2024-06-07 16:25 +0200

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