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Lion and scrollbar arrows?

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  Lion and scrollbar arrows? ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> - 2014-02-24 03:03 +0100
    Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Davoud <star@sky.net> - 2014-02-23 21:42 -0500
      Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-24 02:46 +0000
        Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> - 2014-02-24 14:09 +0100
          Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-24 16:13 +0000
            Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-02-24 16:45 +0000
              Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-02-24 18:42 +0000
                Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-02-24 17:09 -0600
                  Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-02-24 23:13 +0000
                Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-02-28 04:05 +0000
                  Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-28 04:38 +0000
                    Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> - 2014-02-27 23:56 -0800
                  Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> - 2014-02-28 19:12 +0100
    Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-02-24 16:33 +1300
      Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-02-24 04:08 +0000
        Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> - 2014-02-24 14:59 +0100
        Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Oregonian Haruspex <bob_davis_retired@yahoo.com> - 2014-02-25 09:30 +0000
          Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> - 2014-02-25 14:54 +0100
      Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> - 2014-02-24 14:56 +0100
        Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-02-24 17:01 -0500
          Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-02-25 12:21 +1300
            Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-02-25 08:47 +0000
              Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-02-25 17:06 -0500
                Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-26 23:24 +0000
        Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-24 22:29 +0000
          Re: Lion and scrollbar arrows? ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> - 2014-02-24 23:39 +0100

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#57022

JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> On 14-02-24 08:56, ErikRS wrote:
> 
> > As already answered to Vaveud and JollyRoger I can't use a normal 
> > trackpad - not even a normal mouse will do for me. I only have 
> > Kensington trackballs, which I mostly can use - also using the palm of
> > my hand(s).
> 
> Note that scroll bars become important when you have multiple scollable
> areas inside the same scrollable window. It becomes hard for the
> software to know which scroll you want to do with mouse/trackpad.

No it doesn't. The same logic is used: scrolling applies to whichever
object you are pointing to with the cursor.

The significant difference is that when you are using a trackpad or
mouse gesture/wheel/ball to scroll, your target for the mouse cursor is
much larger, since you only need to aim for the object to scroll, not a
specific point within the scroll bar on the edge of the object to
scroll.

I find scrolling with a trackpad substantially easier than clicking on a
scrollbar, and the only time I've scrolled the wrong thing is if I
didn't realise I had accidentally moved the cursor outside the area to
be scrolled (which would also be a problem with a scrollbar - clicking
would result in something like activating another window, which is even
worse).

> The scroll bar makes it explicit which scrollable area you are
> controlling.

So does moving the cursor to the area to be scrolled.

-- 
David Empson
dempson@actrix.gen.nz

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#57060

In article <1lhmhgt.fe7tegclm18mN%dempson@actrix.gen.nz>, David Empson
<dempson@actrix.gen.nz> wrote:

> The significant difference is that when you are using a trackpad or
> mouse gesture/wheel/ball to scroll, your target for the mouse cursor is
> much larger, since you only need to aim for the object to scroll, not a
> specific point within the scroll bar on the edge of the object to
> scroll.

Yes, and not only that, you can scroll a document in the background
(apart from Word) even if the scroll bars of that document are hidden
by a foreground window. The larger target is a crucial factor IMO.

The scroll bars are nonetheless useful so as to be able to see *where*
you are in a document, and also as a visual clue that the document is
scrollable.

-- 
Tim

"That excessive bail ought not to be required, nor excessive fines imposed,
nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted"  --  Bill of Rights 1689

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#57089

On 14-02-25 03:47, Tim Streater wrote:

> The scroll bars are nonetheless useful so as to be able to see *where*
> you are in a document, and also as a visual clue that the document is
> scrollable.

There are times where the magic mouse seems unresponsive to movement of
fingers to scroll. (unreliable betters describes to unresponsive, or
there is a big lag). Grabbing the actual widget in the scroll bar allows
explicit and more rapid movement. (especially when wanting to goto the
top of bottom of a long document).

On the iPhone for instance, when I switch to twitter after not having
updated it for a lobg time, it takes a LOT of finger movements to scroll
to the top. Having a scroll bar would make it faster.

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#57151

In message <530d13f8$0$47876$c3e8da3$5d8fb80f@news.astraweb.com> 
  JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> On 14-02-25 03:47, Tim Streater wrote:

>> The scroll bars are nonetheless useful so as to be able to see *where*
>> you are in a document, and also as a visual clue that the document is
>> scrollable.

> There are times where the magic mouse seems unresponsive to movement of
> fingers to scroll. (unreliable betters describes to unresponsive, or
> there is a big lag). Grabbing the actual widget in the scroll bar allows
> explicit and more rapid movement. (especially when wanting to goto the
> top of bottom of a long document).

> On the iPhone for instance, when I switch to twitter after not having
> updated it for a lobg time, it takes a LOT of finger movements to scroll
> to the top. Having a scroll bar would make it faster.

No it doesn't, it just takes tapping int he menu bar to get to the top.

-- 
My biggest problem is that Steve insists on serving PURPLE Kool Aid, an
I don't like PURPLE <sip sip> Kool Aid.

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#57005

In message <lefj2a$592$1@solani.org> 
  ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> wrote:
> As I read the possibilities in Lion you can only set the 
> scrollbar scrolling to either 'jump to mouse point' or 'jump to 
> next/previous page'...

No, that is the setting when you click in the scrollbar, has nothing to
do with scrolling.

-- 
"It's unacceptable to think" - George W Bush 15/Sep/2006

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#57009

Lewis wrote:
> ErikRS <mac-dane@is.invalid> wrote:
>> As I read the possibilities in Lion you can only set the
>> scrollbar scrolling to either 'jump to mouse point' or 'jump to
>> next/previous page'...
>
> No, that is the setting when you click in the scrollbar, has nothing to
> do with scrolling.

Well... yes and no... - If you mean a smooth scrolling using clicking in 
the scrollbars, you're right... But in some of the applications that I 
use, clicking in the scrollbars do scroll the window content 2-4 lines...

Cheers, Erik Richard

-- 
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Erik Richard Sørensen, Member of ADC, <mac-daneRE@MOVEstofanet.dk>
NisusWriter - The Future In Multilingual Text Processing - www.nisus.com
Openoffice.org - The Modern Productivity Solution - www.openoffice.org
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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