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Groups > comp.sys.mac.system > #118044 > unrolled thread

No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server

Started byNomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com>
First post2018-09-09 00:32 +0200
Last post2018-09-09 23:54 +0800
Articles 20 on this page of 287 — 26 participants

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Contents

  No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> - 2018-09-09 00:32 +0200
    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-09-09 17:19 +1200
      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-09-09 11:26 -0400
        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2018-11-06 09:14 -0500
          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-06 23:23 -0500
      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Arlen Holder <arlenholder@nospam.net> - 2018-09-09 18:17 +0000
        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-09 11:50 -0700
          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server anon <noreply@mixnym.net> - 2018-09-10 15:26 -0500
            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-10 13:34 -0700
            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-09-10 16:39 -0400
              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-10 17:34 -0700
            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server anon <noreply@mixnym.net> - 2018-09-10 16:56 -0500
              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-09-11 13:34 +1200
                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-10 18:39 -0700
                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-09-11 16:35 +1200
                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2018-09-11 06:51 -0500
                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-09-12 08:41 +1200
                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-11 14:42 -0700
                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Rene Lamontagne <rlamont@shaw.ca> - 2018-09-11 16:51 -0500
                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-11 14:55 -0700
                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-11 06:21 -0700
                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-09-12 08:46 +1200
                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-11 14:47 -0700
                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-09-12 13:47 +1200
                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-09-12 06:51 -0700
                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2018-11-06 09:21 -0500
                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Mark Lloyd <not@mail.invalid> - 2018-11-06 10:48 -0600
                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-06 11:59 -0400
                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server anon <noreply@mixnym.net> - 2018-09-10 20:39 -0500
                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2018-09-10 23:20 -0400
                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-09-11 16:30 +1200
                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-09-11 14:59 +0000
                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server ANTant@zimage.com (Ant) - 2018-09-11 17:08 -0500
                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-09-12 00:28 +0000
                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server ANTant@zimage.com (Ant) - 2018-09-11 20:46 -0500
                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2018-09-12 18:17 +1200
                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server ANTant@zimage.com (Ant) - 2018-09-12 19:34 -0500
                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-09-13 13:59 +0000
                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server ANTant@zimage.com (Ant) - 2018-09-13 16:57 -0500
                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-09-13 22:39 +0000
                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Elden <usenet@moondog.org> - 2018-09-14 20:13 -0700
                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2018-09-15 11:54 +0000
                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-09-15 08:41 -0400
                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-09-15 16:04 +0000
                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-09-15 15:55 +0000
                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2018-11-06 09:24 -0500
                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2018-11-06 15:53 +0000
                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-06 12:29 -0500
                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-06 12:34 -0400
                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-06 12:51 -0500
                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-06 12:55 -0400
                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-06 13:35 -0500
                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-06 11:17 -0800
                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-06 17:51 -0500
                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-06 15:05 -0800
                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-06 20:00 -0500
                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-06 17:29 -0800
                                                            OT: About OS/2 (Was:Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server) Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-07 09:16 -0500
                                                              Re: OT: About OS/2 (Was:Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server) SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-07 09:58 -0500
                                                              Re: OT: About OS/2 Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2018-11-09 19:07 +0000
                                                                Re: OT: About OS/2 Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 14:25 -0500
                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nobody <nobodysaysitalldoesntit@nobo.org> - 2018-11-06 18:14 -0500
                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-06 20:01 -0500
                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Chris <ithinkiam@gmail.com> - 2018-11-06 19:06 +0000
                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-06 14:13 -0500
                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends   it to Chinese server "John Varela" <newlamps@verizon.net> - 2018-11-07 18:58 +0000
                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-07 18:04 -0500
                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Leonard Blaisdell <leoblaisdell@sbcglobal.net> - 2018-11-07 17:13 -0800
                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Dave Yeo <dave.r.yeo@gmail.com> - 2018-11-08 14:58 -0800
                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 21:19 -0500
                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 21:25 -0500
                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-07 09:25 -0500
                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-07 09:33 -0400
                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-07 10:44 -0500
                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-07 11:13 -0400
                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-07 08:43 -0800
                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-07 11:46 -0400
                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-07 11:51 -0500
                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-07 12:05 -0400
                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-07 12:36 -0500
                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-07 13:11 -0400
                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-07 12:41 -0600
                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-07 14:23 -0500
                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 00:33 -0400
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 09:20 -0500
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 10:49 -0400
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-08 10:13 -0800
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 07:45 -0700
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 14:12 -0500
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 14:22 -0500
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 13:22 -0700
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 16:30 -0500
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 19:00 -0700
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 21:52 -0500
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 20:10 -0700
                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 22:16 -0500
                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 20:18 -0700
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 21:09 -0500
                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-08 10:06 -0800
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 15:00 -0500
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-08 12:37 -0800
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 19:08 -0500
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-08 16:19 -0800
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 21:52 -0500
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 14:31 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-09 11:56 -0800
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 15:51 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 17:11 -0500
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 19:25 -0500
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 21:52 -0500
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 16:30 -0500
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 21:12 -0500
                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-07 17:46 -0500
                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 00:33 -0400
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 08:58 -0500
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 10:49 -0400
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 21:03 -0500
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 21:52 -0500
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 22:13 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 20:22 -0700
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 20:06 -0700
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 22:19 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 21:29 -0700
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-10 08:38 -0500
                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-10 09:53 -0500
                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-10 11:13 -0700
                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-07 14:19 -0500
                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-07 13:51 -0700
                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 00:33 -0400
                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 07:47 -0700
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 10:49 -0400
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 09:15 -0700
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 11:57 -0400
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 11:09 -0700
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 13:23 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 12:14 -0700
                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-08 10:10 -0800
                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 00:33 -0400
                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 08:48 -0500
                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 09:33 -0500
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 10:49 -0400
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 11:56 -0600
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 13:23 -0500
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 21:07 -0500
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 21:52 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 22:06 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 20:11 -0700
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 22:19 -0500
                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 20:32 -0700
                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-09 09:54 +0000
                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-09 11:48 -0500
                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 11:45 -0700
                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-09 21:35 +0000
                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 12:01 -0700
                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-09 21:33 +0000
                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 15:13 -0700
                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-09 22:19 +0000
                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 15:23 -0700
                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-09 22:29 +0000
                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 15:46 -0700
                                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-09 23:27 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 16:50 -0700
                                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-10 00:19 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 21:29 -0700
                                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-10 09:40 -0500
                                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-10 11:17 -0700
                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-09 17:59 -0500
                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 15:09 -0500
                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 15:20 -0700
                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 19:41 -0500
                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-10 00:51 +0000
                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 21:30 -0500
                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-10 18:14 +0000
                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-10 11:17 -0700
                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-10 18:27 +0000
                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 21:26 -0700
                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-10 18:22 +0000
                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-10 18:56 -0700
                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-11 12:09 +0000
                                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 16:08 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-11 16:38 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 17:26 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-11 18:01 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 11:30 -0700
                                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-11 18:53 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 12:54 -0700
                                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-11 21:03 +0000
                                                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 14:52 -0700
                                                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-11 22:26 +0000
                                                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 15:39 -0700
                                                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-11 19:26 -0500
                                                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-12 02:43 +0000
                                                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 20:45 -0700
                                                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 20:43 -0700
                                                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-12 09:03 -0500
                                                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-12 12:08 -0500
                                                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-12 13:40 -0500
                                                                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-12 18:33 -0500
                                                                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-13 08:53 -0700
                                                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-12 16:35 +0000
                                                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-12 14:22 -0700
                                                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-12 22:00 +0000
                                                                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-13 08:51 -0700
                                                                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-13 23:49 +0000
                                                                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-13 19:51 -0700
                                                                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 13:22 +0000
                                                                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-15 09:27 -0500
                                                                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 16:35 +0000
                                                                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-15 12:09 -0500
                                                                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 17:17 +0000
                                                                                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-15 12:49 -0500
                                                                                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 18:01 +0000
                                                                                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-15 13:23 -0500
                                                                                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 18:36 +0000
                                                                                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 19:01 +0000
                                                                                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-15 14:32 -0500
                                                                                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 19:47 +0000
                                                                                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-15 15:52 -0500
                                                                                                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 21:09 +0000
                                                                                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-15 20:02 +0000
                                                                                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-15 13:49 -0500
                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-10 09:48 -0500
                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-10 11:16 -0700
                                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-10 18:20 +0000
                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-10 18:57 -0700
                                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-11 09:06 -0500
                                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Spooge <sp00ge@goop.invalid> - 2018-11-11 17:11 +0000
                                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-11 17:26 +0000
                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 21:27 -0700
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 14:57 -0500
                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-09 15:21 -0700
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 14:57 -0500
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Rene Lamontagne <rlamont@shaw.ca> - 2018-11-08 15:05 -0600
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 16:30 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Rene Lamontagne <rlamont@shaw.ca> - 2018-11-08 15:35 -0600
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 19:09 -0500
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2018-11-09 14:35 +0000
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 16:30 -0500
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 14:50 -0500
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 14:23 -0600
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 16:30 -0500
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 19:02 -0500
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 19:04 -0700
                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 16:30 -0500
                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 19:39 -0500
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 21:52 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 14:50 -0500
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Ken Blake <Ken@invalid.news.com> - 2018-11-09 13:19 -0700
                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 17:11 -0500
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 17:11 -0500
                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 19:38 -0500
                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 20:08 -0500
                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 21:33 -0500
                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 22:22 -0500
                                                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-10 10:02 -0500
                                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-10 13:55 -0500
                                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 19:47 -0500
                                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 20:08 -0500
                                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 21:45 -0500
                                                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 22:22 -0500
                                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Frank Slootweg <this@ddress.is.invalid> - 2018-11-09 14:53 +0000
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 10:20 -0500
                                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-09 09:29 -0600
                                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-09 15:13 -0500
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 20:56 -0500
                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 10:49 -0400
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-08 20:57 -0500
                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 09:05 -0500
                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Alan Baker <nunya@ness.biz> - 2018-11-08 12:35 -0800
                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 16:30 -0500
                                                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 18:56 -0700
                                                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 21:52 -0500
                                                                  Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-08 20:11 -0700
                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-07 12:41 -0500
                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-07 13:11 -0400
                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2018-11-07 11:47 -0700
                                                    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-07 12:31 -0500
                                                      Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-07 13:11 -0400
                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-07 14:31 -0500
                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 00:33 -0400
                                                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Wolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> - 2018-11-08 09:11 -0500
                                                        Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-11-07 17:55 -0500
                                                          Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2018-11-08 00:33 -0400
                            Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-09-12 16:11 +0000
                              Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2018-09-12 14:10 -0400
                                Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server SilverSlimer <silver@slim.er> - 2018-09-12 18:35 +0000
    Re: No. 1 paid utility in Mac App Store steals browser history, sends it to Chinese server "Mr. Man-wai Chang" <toylet.toylet@gmail.com> - 2018-09-09 23:54 +0800

Page 7 of 15 — ← Prev page 1 … 5 6 [7] 8 9 … 15  Next page →


#119337

FromSnit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>
Date2018-11-08 20:06 -0700
Message-ID<g4kbu2FtqpiU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#119322
On 11/8/18 7:03 PM, SilverSlimer wrote:
> On 2018-11-08 9:49 a.m., nospam wrote:
>> In article <ziXED.643698$cL2.14429@fx43.iad>, SilverSlimer
>> <silver@slim.er> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> It had DOS as much as it needed to since people, by using Windows 95,
>>> were migrating from a massive platform onto a new one and still needed
>>> some sort of assurance that their software would continue to operate.
>>> Much of it could within Windows 9x, but some couldn't and being able to
>>> load DOS to run it became necessary.
>>
>> win 95 was a shell on top of dos, which greatly limited what it could
>> do.
> 
> That's how most people saw it as well and I have to admit that I had no 
> reason to think otherwise but Peter Köhlmann in comp.os.linux.advocacy 
> made a decent case for why it _wasn't_ just a shell.

It was still DOS... with some changes / improvements and a GUI shell.

>>> However, 9x in general was more
>>> capable than MacOS at the time and even Apple knew it.
>>
>> nonsense.
> 
> Nope.

Largely opinion based, but in most ways Mac OS was ahead in the GUI 
area, Windows had some benefits in its multitasking and the like (though 
the difference was not as big as some claimed -- BOTH were too prone to 
crashing).

>>> That's why they
>>> started to develop Copland in response to it and eventually felt the
>>> obligation to attempt to purchase BeOS. It didn't happen and they moved
>>> onto NeXT.
>>
>> no, that's not why they started to develop copland.
>>
>> copland actually began in the late 1980s, long before there was a
>> windows 95 or even win 3.x, but by 1995, it was a mismanaged mess, in a
>> mismanaged company.
> 
> Regardless of when the development started, there was no doubt that 
> Copland was going to end up being a response to Windows 9x since 9x 
> remedied many of the drawbacks of MacOS.

Mac OS was beginning to struggle under Extensions and other changed 
tacked on to an older OS. Apple knew they had to move to a newer / 
better kernel.

>>>>> The original Mac line was very much proprietary.
>>>>
>>>> it was not.
>>>
>>> You clearly see the Mac's history with rose-coloured glasses and have a
>>> skewed definition of proprietary.
>>
>> more accurately, you have a clear *lack* of knowledge about many things
>> apple, believing many of the myths.
> 
> I have no reason to doubt the historians especially since they are not 
> zealots in any way.

By all means show support. I am open to it.

...

>>> We're still at an impasse in regards to your definition of proprietary.
>>> Proprietary does not prevent anyone from developing for a platform.
>>> Windows is proprietary yet people develop for it all the time. However,
>>> on the PC side, only the operating system is proprietary if you use
>>> Windows and the hardware is very much standardized across the board,
>>> unlike the original Mac and much of Apple's hardware going into the late
>>> 90s.
>>
>> apple uses industry standards wherever possible.
>>
>> the problem is that many of those are not that good, so apple either
>> chose something more capable or they designed something better.
>>
>> the original mac had rs422 serial ports, which were a superset of
>> rs232. existing rs232 devices worked perfectly fine without *any*
>> issue, however, they could never be as fast as rs422 devices.
>>
>> the mac ii's slots were nubus, which was designed by texas instruments.
>> later, apple switched to pci slots, also not their design.
>>
>> as mentioned above, macs supported postscript, another industry
>> standard.
>>
>> the list goes on...
> 
> You make a good case and I'd be a fool to challenge you. I surrender to 
> your wealth of knowledge, good sir.

I am impressed.


-- 
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They 
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel 
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

<https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119345

Fromnospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date2018-11-08 22:19 -0500
Message-ID<081120182219259140%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to#119337
In article <g4kbu2FtqpiU1@mid.individual.net>, Snit
<usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:

> Mac OS was beginning to struggle under Extensions and other changed 
> tacked on to an older OS. 

that's because extensions patched all sorts of stuff, often not that
well, causing problems with other extensions, especially ones that
patched the same traps, as well as unrelated apps.

> Apple knew they had to move to a newer / 
> better kernel.

yep. and they're thinking about that even now. technology moves fast.
nothing lasts forever.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119416

FromSnit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>
Date2018-11-09 21:29 -0700
Message-ID<g4n560Fi4ucU5@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#119345
On 11/8/18 8:19 PM, nospam wrote:
> In article <g4kbu2FtqpiU1@mid.individual.net>, Snit
> <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> 
>> Mac OS was beginning to struggle under Extensions and other changed
>> tacked on to an older OS.
> 
> that's because extensions patched all sorts of stuff, often not that
> well, causing problems with other extensions, especially ones that
> patched the same traps, as well as unrelated apps.

Yes. I remember playing with the Extensions manager and having different 
sets for different needs. I do NOT miss that. :)

>> Apple knew they had to move to a newer /
>> better kernel.
> 
> yep. and they're thinking about that even now. technology moves fast.
> nothing lasts forever.

I know they are always looking to improve macOS, but are they looking to 
replace the full kernel? Would be interested in hearing about that.

When Mac OS X was first released, Jobs *did* say the plan was to have it 
work for the next 20 years. We are not too far from that. :)


-- 
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They 
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel 
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

<https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119425

Fromnospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date2018-11-10 08:38 -0500
Message-ID<101120180838066001%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to#119416
In article <g4n560Fi4ucU5@mid.individual.net>, Snit
<usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:

> >> Mac OS was beginning to struggle under Extensions and other changed
> >> tacked on to an older OS.
> > 
> > that's because extensions patched all sorts of stuff, often not that
> > well, causing problems with other extensions, especially ones that
> > patched the same traps, as well as unrelated apps.
> 
> Yes. I remember playing with the Extensions manager and having different 
> sets for different needs. I do NOT miss that. :)

some were rather slick while others were pretty bad. some had to run in
a particular order because one or more patched things incorrectly.

> >> Apple knew they had to move to a newer /
> >> better kernel.
> > 
> > yep. and they're thinking about that even now. technology moves fast.
> > nothing lasts forever.
> 
> I know they are always looking to improve macOS, but are they looking to 
> replace the full kernel? Would be interested in hearing about that.

nobody outside of specific groups at apple knows what's being
considered for future products, let alone actually released, but
they're always looking at options.

> When Mac OS X was first released, Jobs *did* say the plan was to have it 
> work for the next 20 years. We are not too far from that. :)

yep.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119429

FromSilverSlimer <silver@slim.er>
Date2018-11-10 09:53 -0500
Message-ID<5iCFD.967164$Vl2.772419@fx46.iad>
In reply to#119425
On 2018-11-10 8:38 a.m., nospam wrote:
> In article <g4n560Fi4ucU5@mid.individual.net>, Snit
> <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:

< snip >

Useless diatribe, most likely.

-- 
SilverSlimer
Minds: @silverslimer

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119432

FromSnit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>
Date2018-11-10 11:13 -0700
Message-ID<g4olemFshfsU4@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#119429
On 11/10/18 7:53 AM, SilverSlimer wrote:
> On 2018-11-10 8:38 a.m., nospam wrote:
>> In article <g4n560Fi4ucU5@mid.individual.net>, Snit
>> <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> 
>>>>> Mac OS was beginning to struggle under Extensions and other changed
>>>>> tacked on to an older OS.
>>>>
>>>> that's because extensions patched all sorts of stuff, often not that
>>>> well, causing problems with other extensions, especially ones that
>>>> patched the same traps, as well as unrelated apps.
>>>
>>> Yes. I remember playing with the Extensions manager and having different 
>>> sets for different needs. I do NOT miss that. :)
>> 
>> some were rather slick while others were pretty bad. some had to run in
>> a particular order because one or more patched things incorrectly.
>> 
>>>>> Apple knew they had to move to a newer /
>>>>> better kernel.
>>>>
>>>> yep. and they're thinking about that even now. technology moves fast.
>>>> nothing lasts forever.
>>>
>>> I know they are always looking to improve macOS, but are they looking to 
>>> replace the full kernel? Would be interested in hearing about that.
>> 
>> nobody outside of specific groups at apple knows what's being
>> considered for future products, let alone actually released, but
>> they're always looking at options.
>> 
>>> When Mac OS X was first released, Jobs *did* say the plan was to have it 
>>> work for the next 20 years. We are not too far from that. :)
>> 
>> yep >
> Useless diatribe, most likely.

Why did you post when you had nothing to say other than to insult others 
in an effort to feel better about yourself.

Oh.

Got it.


-- 
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They 
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel 
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

<https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119224

FromWolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca>
Date2018-11-07 14:19 -0500
Message-ID<VUGED.487372$oM2.402822@fx07.iad>
In reply to#119213
On 2018-11-07 11:05, nospam wrote:
> In article <uKEED.198613$LL1.84557@fx23.iad>, Wolf K
> <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> 
>>> microsoft windows was mostly a copy of classic mac os,
>>
>> IOW, mac os was really DOS? There's something wrong with your memory of
>> those far off days. Or else your confusing the user interface with the
>> OS. mac OS
> 
> i didn't say macos was dos. i said microsoft copied macos to create
> windows.

Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.

>>> not amiga os,
>>> and even that took a decade for windows to be even somewhat useful,
>>> with windows '95.
>>
>> Windows was DOS with a pre-built menu system plus a few simple to use
>> settings (such as customising the menus for different users). It was
>> essentially useless until 3.x.
> 
> win 3.x was only slightly better than earlier versions. as i said,
> windows '95 was when it was actually usable.
>
>> To control user access, you had to go
>> into DOS. But that was so limited in the early versions of DOS that any
>> attempt to limit access could be over-ridden during boot, something our
>> students found out almost immediately. From Win95 one, user access was
>> better controlled, but still easy to work around.
>>
>> Windows NT was the first non-DOS version. It was a derivative of OS/2,
>> whose first version MS developed for IBM. Up to Windows 2000 IIRC, a
>> system folder was labelled OS/2
> 
> so far, so good.
> 
>> There's more. FWIW, I preferred DOS over Windows, and OS/2 over both.
>> I liked Mac OS, but didn't like Apple's unwillingness to permit device
>> customisation beyond what they decided was acceptable. A DOS machine,
>> and hence Windows, was almost infinitely customisable.
> 
> complete nonsense.
> 
> apple did not stop *anyone* from customizing anything, and in fact, mac
> os was designed to be tweaked and modified in all sorts of ways, with
> full documentation as to how to do it.
> 
> because of that, a whole category of mac software and hardware existed,
> doing things not possible on dos or windows.

OK, my error. FTR, DOS was fully documented, too: I spent a lot of time 
learning DOS (have of course forgotten 90% or more of it) and batch 
files and such. Plus all the undocumented stuff that fellow geeks 
discovered.

However, Apple very quickly built a walled garden, for good reasons, at 
the time when MS was strong-arming PC makers into selling Windows 
machines, giving away API data, and encouraging everybody and his goat 
to write for Windows. Apple's design philosophy diverged from the then 
prevailing attitudes. Steve Jobs realised that a computer is an 
appliance, and set out to design the most reliable and easy to use 
appliance possible. He also realised that for a lot of people computers 
were geeky weirdness, so he set out to make it both a useful and very 
cool appliance, one that you didn't have to understand in order to use. 
Just like a car. That was his innovation. [1] Technologically, Apple 
innovated hardly at all.

Ever since, Apple's competitors tried to catch up, and have succeeded in 
doing so. Since Steve's death, Apple's ability to innovate design and 
function has slowed, so that current smartphones equal or exceed the 
iPhone's capabilities, and the high end tablet has become a new form 
factor for the PC. Fromm what I've seen/read of the latest iPad, it's 
finally catching up to that level.

>> As was
>> Commodore's OS, but that's another story.
> 
> actually, not as much, but the key problem was it had very little
> software available compared to mac, dos and windows. software
> developers were not interested.

I think it was because Commodore didn't understand that a computer isn't 
just the hardware. Unlike Apple and the DOS machine makers, they sold a 
bare machine, with a few pointers to where usable software could be 
acquired. They also for too long neglected both in-house and supported 
3rd party software development. By the time they realised that a 
personal computer is an appliance, it was too late.

That's how I see it, anyhow.

[1] My brother has been an Apple user since Apple II. He never cared to 
know how the machine worked, he just wanted an easy to use way of 
cataloguing his stamp collection. He 's used Filemaker for years.

-- 
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
"Gentics is not genealogy." (Gragham Coop, Ph.D.)

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119227

FromSnit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>
Date2018-11-07 13:51 -0700
Message-ID<g4h1hvF75c4U1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#119224
On 11/7/18 12:19 PM, Wolf K wrote:
> On 2018-11-07 11:05, nospam wrote:
>> In article <uKEED.198613$LL1.84557@fx23.iad>, Wolf K
>> <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> wrote:
>>
>>>> microsoft windows was mostly a copy of classic mac os,
>>>
>>> IOW, mac os was really DOS? There's something wrong with your memory of
>>> those far off days. Or else your confusing the user interface with the
>>> OS. mac OS
>>
>> i didn't say macos was dos. i said microsoft copied macos to create
>> windows.
> 
> Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.

Nope. Apple did copy Xerox some but they PAID to do so. And they then 
made a LOT of modifications to the GUI. Here are just some:

* Double clicking
* Trash can (or the like)
* Graying out inactive items
* Full file system in GUI (as icons)
* GUI based hierarchical folder structure
* Drag and drop
* meta-data associations with icons
* self-redrawing windows (and double buffering)
* Checkmarks next to menu items
* Keyboard shortcuts
* X to close a window (NeXT, really)

...

-- 
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They 
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel 
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

<https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119243

Fromnospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date2018-11-08 00:33 -0400
Message-ID<081120180033234111%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to#119227
In article <g4h1hvF75c4U1@mid.individual.net>, Snit
<usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:

> >>>> microsoft windows was mostly a copy of classic mac os,
> >>>
> >>> IOW, mac os was really DOS? There's something wrong with your memory of
> >>> those far off days. Or else your confusing the user interface with the
> >>> OS. mac OS
> >>
> >> i didn't say macos was dos. i said microsoft copied macos to create
> >> windows.
> > 
> > Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.
> 
> Nope. Apple did copy Xerox some but they PAID to do so. And they then 
> made a LOT of modifications to the GUI. Here are just some:
> 
> * Double clicking
> * Trash can (or the like)
> * Graying out inactive items
> * Full file system in GUI (as icons)
> * GUI based hierarchical folder structure
> * Drag and drop
> * meta-data associations with icons
> * self-redrawing windows (and double buffering)
> * Checkmarks next to menu items
> * Keyboard shortcuts
> * X to close a window (NeXT, really)

that's a good list, however, there was no 'x' to close a window in
macos. that came later with nextstep, which microsoft also copied.

one key difference not listed was arbitrary regions, allowing for
overlapping windows. xerox thought it was too difficult to do. bill
atkinson thought xerox actually had done it, so he went off and did it,
not realizing it hadn't been done. xerox was stunned when they saw mac
os with regions. he tells the story better than i do.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119261

FromSnit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>
Date2018-11-08 07:47 -0700
Message-ID<g4j0k7Fke45U2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#119243
On 11/7/18 9:33 PM, nospam wrote:
> In article <g4h1hvF75c4U1@mid.individual.net>, Snit
> <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> 
>>>>>> microsoft windows was mostly a copy of classic mac os,
>>>>>
>>>>> IOW, mac os was really DOS? There's something wrong with your memory of
>>>>> those far off days. Or else your confusing the user interface with the
>>>>> OS. mac OS
>>>>
>>>> i didn't say macos was dos. i said microsoft copied macos to create
>>>> windows.
>>>
>>> Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.
>>
>> Nope. Apple did copy Xerox some but they PAID to do so. And they then
>> made a LOT of modifications to the GUI. Here are just some:
>>
>> * Double clicking
>> * Trash can (or the like)
>> * Graying out inactive items
>> * Full file system in GUI (as icons)
>> * GUI based hierarchical folder structure
>> * Drag and drop
>> * meta-data associations with icons
>> * self-redrawing windows (and double buffering)
>> * Checkmarks next to menu items
>> * Keyboard shortcuts
>> * X to close a window (NeXT, really)
> 
> that's a good list, however, there was no 'x' to close a window in
> macos. that came later with nextstep, which microsoft also copied.

Sure... and on the list I note that came from NeXT. But the point is 
many of these things we take for granted on pretty much any desktop GUI 
are things that Apple introduced.

> one key difference not listed was arbitrary regions, allowing for
> overlapping windows. xerox thought it was too difficult to do. bill
> atkinson thought xerox actually had done it, so he went off and did it,
> not realizing it hadn't been done. xerox was stunned when they saw mac
> os with regions. he tells the story better than i do.

I have read it... and I allude to it briefly with the "self-redrawing 
windows (and double buffering)" item... but I admit that could be more 
clear. :)


-- 
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They 
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel 
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

<https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119267

Fromnospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date2018-11-08 10:49 -0400
Message-ID<081120181049070998%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to#119261
In article <g4j0k7Fke45U2@mid.individual.net>, Snit
<usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:

> >>> Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.
> >>
> >> Nope. Apple did copy Xerox some but they PAID to do so. And they then
> >> made a LOT of modifications to the GUI. Here are just some:
> >>
> >> * Double clicking
> >> * Trash can (or the like)
> >> * Graying out inactive items
> >> * Full file system in GUI (as icons)
> >> * GUI based hierarchical folder structure
> >> * Drag and drop
> >> * meta-data associations with icons
> >> * self-redrawing windows (and double buffering)
> >> * Checkmarks next to menu items
> >> * Keyboard shortcuts
> >> * X to close a window (NeXT, really)
> > 
> > that's a good list, however, there was no 'x' to close a window in
> > macos. that came later with nextstep, which microsoft also copied.
> 
> Sure... and on the list I note that came from NeXT. But the point is 
> many of these things we take for granted on pretty much any desktop GUI 
> are things that Apple introduced.

yep

> > one key difference not listed was arbitrary regions, allowing for
> > overlapping windows. xerox thought it was too difficult to do. bill
> > atkinson thought xerox actually had done it, so he went off and did it,
> > not realizing it hadn't been done. xerox was stunned when they saw mac
> > os with regions. he tells the story better than i do.
> 
> I have read it... and I allude to it briefly with the "self-redrawing 
> windows (and double buffering)" item... but I admit that could be more 
> clear. :)

i have heard it firsthand, and what you're calling self-redrawing
windows is not the same as arbitrary regions.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119274

FromSnit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>
Date2018-11-08 09:15 -0700
Message-ID<g4j5o8FljecU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#119267
On 11/8/18 7:49 AM, nospam wrote:
> In article <g4j0k7Fke45U2@mid.individual.net>, Snit
> <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> 
>>>>> Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.
>>>>
>>>> Nope. Apple did copy Xerox some but they PAID to do so. And they then
>>>> made a LOT of modifications to the GUI. Here are just some:
>>>>
>>>> * Double clicking
>>>> * Trash can (or the like)
>>>> * Graying out inactive items
>>>> * Full file system in GUI (as icons)
>>>> * GUI based hierarchical folder structure
>>>> * Drag and drop
>>>> * meta-data associations with icons
>>>> * self-redrawing windows (and double buffering)
>>>> * Checkmarks next to menu items
>>>> * Keyboard shortcuts
>>>> * X to close a window (NeXT, really)
>>>
>>> that's a good list, however, there was no 'x' to close a window in
>>> macos. that came later with nextstep, which microsoft also copied.
>>
>> Sure... and on the list I note that came from NeXT. But the point is
>> many of these things we take for granted on pretty much any desktop GUI
>> are things that Apple introduced.
> 
> yep
> 
>>> one key difference not listed was arbitrary regions, allowing for
>>> overlapping windows. xerox thought it was too difficult to do. bill
>>> atkinson thought xerox actually had done it, so he went off and did it,
>>> not realizing it hadn't been done. xerox was stunned when they saw mac
>>> os with regions. he tells the story better than i do.
>>
>> I have read it... and I allude to it briefly with the "self-redrawing
>> windows (and double buffering)" item... but I admit that could be more
>> clear. :)
> 
> i have heard it firsthand, and what you're calling self-redrawing
> windows is not the same as arbitrary regions.
> 
Fair enough. I may have things worded poorly, too. Here is where I got 
that info:

   <http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2005/05/gui.ars>
     -----
     One critical advance from the Lisa team came from an Apple
     engineer who was not a former PARC employee, but had seen the
     demonstration of Smalltalk. He thought he had witnessed the
     Alto's ability to redraw portions of obscured windows when a
     topmost window was moved: this was called "regions". In fact,
     the Alto did not have this ability, but merely redrew the
     entire window when the user selected it.
     -----
     Aqua introduced the idea of a GUI where every window was
     double-buffered in memory, so that any redraws happen
     off-screen and aren't visible
     -----

Actual quotes shown there are on page 4 and 7.

-- 
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They 
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel 
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

<https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119275

Fromnospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date2018-11-08 11:57 -0400
Message-ID<081120181157417822%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to#119274
In article <g4j5o8FljecU1@mid.individual.net>, Snit
<usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:

> >>> one key difference not listed was arbitrary regions, allowing for
> >>> overlapping windows. xerox thought it was too difficult to do. bill
> >>> atkinson thought xerox actually had done it, so he went off and did it,
> >>> not realizing it hadn't been done. xerox was stunned when they saw mac
> >>> os with regions. he tells the story better than i do.
> >>
> >> I have read it... and I allude to it briefly with the "self-redrawing
> >> windows (and double buffering)" item... but I admit that could be more
> >> clear. :)
> > 
> > i have heard it firsthand, and what you're calling self-redrawing
> > windows is not the same as arbitrary regions.
> > 
> Fair enough. I may have things worded poorly, too. Here is where I got 
> that info:
> 
>    <http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2005/05/gui.ars>
>      -----
>      One critical advance from the Lisa team came from an Apple
>      engineer who was not a former PARC employee, but had seen the
>      demonstration of Smalltalk. He thought he had witnessed the
>      Alto's ability to redraw portions of obscured windows when a
>      topmost window was moved: this was called "regions". In fact,
>      the Alto did not have this ability, but merely redrew the
>      entire window when the user selected it.
>      -----
>      Aqua introduced the idea of a GUI where every window was
>      double-buffered in memory, so that any redraws happen
>      off-screen and aren't visible
>      -----
> 
> Actual quotes shown there are on page 4 and 7.

aqua is os x, long after quickdraw in classic mac os, and very
different in all sorts of ways.

classic mac os actually didn't have double-buffered windows initially,
although some games implemented it on their own and offscreen drawing
was added later.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119282

FromSnit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>
Date2018-11-08 11:09 -0700
Message-ID<g4jcfgFn4btU2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#119275
On 11/8/18 8:57 AM, nospam wrote:
> In article <g4j5o8FljecU1@mid.individual.net>, Snit
> <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> 
>>>>> one key difference not listed was arbitrary regions, allowing for
>>>>> overlapping windows. xerox thought it was too difficult to do. bill
>>>>> atkinson thought xerox actually had done it, so he went off and did it,
>>>>> not realizing it hadn't been done. xerox was stunned when they saw mac
>>>>> os with regions. he tells the story better than i do.
>>>>
>>>> I have read it... and I allude to it briefly with the "self-redrawing
>>>> windows (and double buffering)" item... but I admit that could be more
>>>> clear. :)
>>>
>>> i have heard it firsthand, and what you're calling self-redrawing
>>> windows is not the same as arbitrary regions.
>>>
>> Fair enough. I may have things worded poorly, too. Here is where I got
>> that info:
>>
>>     <http://arstechnica.com/old/content/2005/05/gui.ars>
>>       -----
>>       One critical advance from the Lisa team came from an Apple
>>       engineer who was not a former PARC employee, but had seen the
>>       demonstration of Smalltalk. He thought he had witnessed the
>>       Alto's ability to redraw portions of obscured windows when a
>>       topmost window was moved: this was called "regions". In fact,
>>       the Alto did not have this ability, but merely redrew the
>>       entire window when the user selected it.
>>       -----
>>       Aqua introduced the idea of a GUI where every window was
>>       double-buffered in memory, so that any redraws happen
>>       off-screen and aren't visible
>>       -----
>>
>> Actual quotes shown there are on page 4 and 7.
> 
> aqua is os x, long after quickdraw in classic mac os, and very
> different in all sorts of ways.

Right... the Aqua comment is about double-buffering to speed the process 
and leads to less tearing and the like.

> classic mac os actually didn't have double-buffered windows initially,
> although some games implemented it on their own and offscreen drawing
> was added later.



-- 
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They 
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel 
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

<https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#119286

Fromnospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date2018-11-08 13:23 -0500
Message-ID<081120181323038193%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to#119282
In article <g4jcfgFn4btU2@mid.individual.net>, Snit
<usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:

> >>       -----
> >>       Aqua introduced the idea of a GUI where every window was
> >>       double-buffered in memory, so that any redraws happen
> >>       off-screen and aren't visible
> >>       -----
> >>
> >> Actual quotes shown there are on page 4 and 7.
> > 
> > aqua is os x, long after quickdraw in classic mac os, and very
> > different in all sorts of ways.
> 
> Right... the Aqua comment is about double-buffering to speed the process 
> and leads to less tearing and the like.

there's more to it than just that.

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#119290

FromSnit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com>
Date2018-11-08 12:14 -0700
Message-ID<g4jg9bFnvehU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#119286
On 11/8/18 11:23 AM, nospam wrote:
> In article <g4jcfgFn4btU2@mid.individual.net>, Snit
> <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> 
>>>>        -----
>>>>        Aqua introduced the idea of a GUI where every window was
>>>>        double-buffered in memory, so that any redraws happen
>>>>        off-screen and aren't visible
>>>>        -----
>>>>
>>>> Actual quotes shown there are on page 4 and 7.
>>>
>>> aqua is os x, long after quickdraw in classic mac os, and very
>>> different in all sorts of ways.
>>
>> Right... the Aqua comment is about double-buffering to speed the process
>> and leads to less tearing and the like.
> 
> there's more to it than just that.
> 

Sure... though really my focus was on the first quote. :)

-- 
Personal attacks from those who troll show their own insecurity. They 
cannot use reason to show the message to be wrong so they try to feel 
somehow superior by attacking the messenger.

They cling to their attacks and ignore the message time and time again.

<https://youtu.be/H4NW-Cqh308>

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#119283

FromAlan Baker <nunya@ness.biz>
Date2018-11-08 10:10 -0800
Message-ID<ps1u5u$k1c$1@gioia.aioe.org>
In reply to#119243
On 2018-11-07 8:33 PM, nospam wrote:
> In article <g4h1hvF75c4U1@mid.individual.net>, Snit
> <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> wrote:
> 
>>>>>> microsoft windows was mostly a copy of classic mac os,
>>>>>
>>>>> IOW, mac os was really DOS? There's something wrong with your memory of
>>>>> those far off days. Or else your confusing the user interface with the
>>>>> OS. mac OS
>>>>
>>>> i didn't say macos was dos. i said microsoft copied macos to create
>>>> windows.
>>>
>>> Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.
>>
>> Nope. Apple did copy Xerox some but they PAID to do so. And they then
>> made a LOT of modifications to the GUI. Here are just some:
>>
>> * Double clicking
>> * Trash can (or the like)
>> * Graying out inactive items
>> * Full file system in GUI (as icons)
>> * GUI based hierarchical folder structure
>> * Drag and drop
>> * meta-data associations with icons
>> * self-redrawing windows (and double buffering)
>> * Checkmarks next to menu items
>> * Keyboard shortcuts
>> * X to close a window (NeXT, really)
> 
> that's a good list, however, there was no 'x' to close a window in
> macos. that came later with nextstep, which microsoft also copied.
> 
> one key difference not listed was arbitrary regions, allowing for
> overlapping windows. xerox thought it was too difficult to do. bill
> atkinson thought xerox actually had done it, so he went off and did it,
> not realizing it hadn't been done. xerox was stunned when they saw mac
> os with regions. he tells the story better than i do.
> 

<https://www.folklore.org/StoryView.py?project=Macintosh&story=I_Still_Remember_Regions.txt>

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#119242

Fromnospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date2018-11-08 00:33 -0400
Message-ID<081120180033224043%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to#119224
In article <VUGED.487372$oM2.402822@fx07.iad>, Wolf K
<wolfmac@sympatico.ca> wrote:

> >>> microsoft windows was mostly a copy of classic mac os,
> >>
> >> IOW, mac os was really DOS? There's something wrong with your memory of
> >> those far off days. Or else your confusing the user interface with the
> >> OS. mac OS
> > 
> > i didn't say macos was dos. i said microsoft copied macos to create
> > windows.
> 
> Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.

not quite. apple and xerox had a financial agreement allowing for apple
to use xerox's ideas and build upon them.

apple added significant ideas from what xerox had. classic mac os was
*not* a direct copy, and the difference between them is significant.



> >> There's more. FWIW, I preferred DOS over Windows, and OS/2 over both.
> >> I liked Mac OS, but didn't like Apple's unwillingness to permit device
> >> customisation beyond what they decided was acceptable. A DOS machine,
> >> and hence Windows, was almost infinitely customisable.
> > 
> > complete nonsense.
> > 
> > apple did not stop *anyone* from customizing anything, and in fact, mac
> > os was designed to be tweaked and modified in all sorts of ways, with
> > full documentation as to how to do it.
> > 
> > because of that, a whole category of mac software and hardware existed,
> > doing things not possible on dos or windows.
> 
> OK, my error. FTR, DOS was fully documented, too: I spent a lot of time 
> learning DOS (have of course forgotten 90% or more of it) and batch 
> files and such. Plus all the undocumented stuff that fellow geeks 
> discovered.

there was dos documentation, but it wasn't available at the local
bookstore in a book published by microsoft. many third party authors
wrote about it, some better than others. 

> However, Apple very quickly built a walled garden, for good reasons, at 
> the time when MS was strong-arming PC makers into selling Windows 
> machines, giving away API data, and encouraging everybody and his goat 
> to write for Windows. 

absolutely wrong. apple never built a walled garden. period.

i don't know why, but these myths never seem to die.

classic mac os was *extremely* customizable, so much so that the entire
os could be patched out. apple not only didn't stop developers from
patching the os, but there was extensive documentation how, including
safe practices to minimize problems. there was also extensive
documentation on hardware cards as well.

> Apple's design philosophy diverged from the then 
> prevailing attitudes. Steve Jobs realised that a computer is an 
> appliance, and set out to design the most reliable and easy to use 
> appliance possible. He also realised that for a lot of people computers 
> were geeky weirdness, so he set out to make it both a useful and very 
> cool appliance, one that you didn't have to understand in order to use. 
> Just like a car. 

that part is true.

> That was his innovation. [1] Technologically, Apple 
> innovated hardly at all.

that part is absolutely false. 

> Ever since, Apple's competitors tried to catch up, and have succeeded in 
> doing so. 

it took a decade for microsoft to catch up with windows 95.

currently, apple's competitors are again trying to catch up, microsoft
in particular. windows phone was a complete failure and surface is
trying to copy the ipad and not doing very well at it.

> Since Steve's death, Apple's ability to innovate design and 
> function has slowed, so that current smartphones equal or exceed the 
> iPhone's capabilities, 

nonsense.

> and the high end tablet has become a new form 
> factor for the PC. 

yep, mobile is the future, not just apple. 

> Fromm what I've seen/read of the latest iPad, it's 
> finally catching up to that level.

then you haven't read much. 
 
> >> As was
> >> Commodore's OS, but that's another story.
> > 
> > actually, not as much, but the key problem was it had very little
> > software available compared to mac, dos and windows. software
> > developers were not interested.
> 
> I think it was because Commodore didn't understand that a computer isn't 
> just the hardware. Unlike Apple and the DOS machine makers, they sold a 
> bare machine, with a few pointers to where usable software could be 
> acquired. They also for too long neglected both in-house and supported 
> 3rd party software development. By the time they realised that a 
> personal computer is an appliance, it was too late.

another problem was there was very little developer support. 

apple and microsoft had developer programs, conferences, trade shows
and quite a bit more. 

> That's how I see it, anyhow.

unfortunately, some of what you see is incorrect.

> [1] My brother has been an Apple user since Apple II. He never cared to 
> know how the machine worked, he just wanted an easy to use way of 
> cataloguing his stamp collection. He 's used Filemaker for years.

there's absolutely nothing wrong with that. 

one need not be a mechanical engineer to drive a car.

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#119252

FromSilverSlimer <silver@slim.er>
Date2018-11-08 08:48 -0500
Message-ID<W8XED.391569$oH2.194656@fx10.iad>
In reply to#119242
On 2018-11-07 11:33 p.m., nospam wrote:
> In article <VUGED.487372$oM2.402822@fx07.iad>, Wolf K
> <wolfmac@sympatico.ca> wrote:
> 
>>>>> microsoft windows was mostly a copy of classic mac os,
>>>>
>>>> IOW, mac os was really DOS? There's something wrong with your memory of
>>>> those far off days. Or else your confusing the user interface with the
>>>> OS. mac OS
>>>
>>> i didn't say macos was dos. i said microsoft copied macos to create
>>> windows.
>>
>> Nah, they both copied Xerox. And it was the GUI they copied, not the OS.
> 
> not quite. apple and xerox had a financial agreement allowing for apple
> to use xerox's ideas and build upon them.
> 
> apple added significant ideas from what xerox had. classic mac os was
> *not* a direct copy, and the difference between them is significant.

I agree here. If anything, the Lisa operating system was closer to what 
Xerox had and the first Mac OS had already significantly built upon that.

< snip >

>> That was his innovation. [1] Technologically, Apple
>> innovated hardly at all.
> 
> that part is absolutely false.
> 
>> Ever since, Apple's competitors tried to catch up, and have succeeded in
>> doing so.
> 
> it took a decade for microsoft to catch up with windows 95.
> 
> currently, apple's competitors are again trying to catch up, microsoft
> in particular. windows phone was a complete failure and surface is
> trying to copy the ipad and not doing very well at it.

I agree that on the tablet scene, Windows is a complete joke. However, 
Windows Phone was quite good and I miss it terribly every day. 
Unfortunately, an update to Windows 10 Mobile caused the in-call mic to 
stop working and since it wasn't clear whether it was a hardware issue 
or a software issue (I'm banking on the latter even though a number of 
people said it was a hardware problem), I was forced to move away from 
the platform. Third-party applications were lacking and therefore caused 
it to be ignored but on its own, it was pretty damned good.

< snip >

-- 
SilverSlimer
Minds: @silverslimer

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#119258

FromWolf K <wolfmac@sympatico.ca>
Date2018-11-08 09:33 -0500
Message-ID<UOXED.220105$292.124959@fx21.iad>
In reply to#119252
On 2018-11-08 08:48, SilverSlimer wrote:
[...]
> 
> I agree that on the tablet scene, Windows is a complete joke.
[...]

Um have you browsed Staples, etc lately? Even low-end tablets are 
selling well, at the one I visit most, there are more tablets than 
laptops displayed. They do what most people want: surf the web, email, 
photo, and video, plus connect to anything wi-fi or Bluetooth. Most 
people do _not_ want to add all kinds of programs to their devices, or 
tweak them with 3rd party hardware and software. Some tablets are being 
offered with 4G, ie, you can use them as a phone if you want. Some 
people want.

And then there's the Surface. I have a Surface 2, it's a PC the size of 
a sheet of paper, albeit somewhat thicker. ;-) It's our travel computer. 
I'm trying to persuade myself I "need" a Surface 4, but so far my 
Presbyterian hangover has stopped me form doing that. You know, 
"self-discipline good, self-indulgence bad."

Best,

-- 
Wolf K
kirkwood40.blogspot.com
"Gentics is not genealogy." (Gragham Coop, Ph.D.)

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