Groups > comp.sys.mac.system > #73487 > unrolled thread

How do mac users create a blank text file where you want it?

Started by	"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com>
First post	2015-04-20 00:40 +0000
Last post	2015-04-22 09:09 -0700
Articles	20 on this page of 379 — 28 participants

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#73947

From	jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet)
Date	2015-04-23 10:55 +1200
Message-ID	<1m3bvj9.1fkz67913n9q4bN%jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz>
In reply to	#73933

JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> On 15-04-22 15:10, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
> 
> > Aye. Plus it makes no sense to me in a text editor/lightweight word
> > processor to have to Save As in order to switch between plain text and
> > RTF editing modes.
> 
> You don't have to use SAVE AS to change your editor mode. There is a
> menu option to do that.

Yes, I know :-) But Alan didn't.

> But this doesn't mean that you shouldn't be able to use your rich text
> doc as a source to do a SAVE AS to plain text without first having to
> conver the doc to plain text.

Just change format, then Save As.

> The big UI question is whether a SAVE AS operation should change the
> context of the current window to that of the newly created copy, or
> whether the original document should remain the context of the window.
> 
> (say I have A.RTF in rich text, and do a SAVE AS  B.txt in plain text,
> should the window still have A.RTF in rich text or  B.txt in plain text
> ?). There are arguments for both scenarios.
> 
> Photoshop has "SAVE AS" and "SAVE A COPY" to distinguich between the two.

Save As, so far as I recall, always left one with the new document in
it's new form on screen, if the app could handle the document type
exported to.
-- 
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.

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#73948

From	Alan Baker <email@domain.com>
Date	2015-04-22 15:56 -0700
Message-ID	<mh98vn$hr$1@news.datemas.de>
In reply to	#73947

On 2015-04-22 22:55:28 +0000, Jamie Kahn Genet said:

> JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> 
>> On 15-04-22 15:10, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
>> 
>>> Aye. Plus it makes no sense to me in a text editor/lightweight word
>>> processor to have to Save As in order to switch between plain text and
>>> RTF editing modes.
>> 
>> You don't have to use SAVE AS to change your editor mode. There is a
>> menu option to do that.
> 
> Yes, I know :-) But Alan didn't.

Again: "Adam didn't", not "Alan didn't"

Alan must certainly did know.

:-)

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#73955

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-22 23:57 +0000
Message-ID	<cpqqruF3ijcU7@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73948

On 2015-04-22, Alan Baker <email@domain.com> wrote:
> On 2015-04-22 22:55:28 +0000, Jamie Kahn Genet said:
>
>> JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
>> 
>>> On 15-04-22 15:10, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Aye. Plus it makes no sense to me in a text editor/lightweight word
>>>> processor to have to Save As in order to switch between plain text and
>>>> RTF editing modes.
>>> 
>>> You don't have to use SAVE AS to change your editor mode. There is a
>>> menu option to do that.
>> 
>> Yes, I know :-) But Alan didn't.
>
> Again: "Adam didn't", not "Alan didn't"
>
> Alan must certainly did know.
>
>:-)

I would expect Alan to know, yes. : D

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73958

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-23 00:57 +0000
Message-ID	<cpquc4F3ijcU8@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73933

On 2015-04-22, JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> On 15-04-22 15:10, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
>
>> Aye. Plus it makes no sense to me in a text editor/lightweight word
>> processor to have to Save As in order to switch between plain text and
>> RTF editing modes.
>
> You don't have to use SAVE AS to change your editor mode. There is a
> menu option to do that.
>
> But this doesn't mean that you shouldn't be able to use your rich text
> doc as a source to do a SAVE AS to plain text without first having to
> conver the doc to plain text.

I don't have a problem with that as long as the user is fully aware of
what is happening.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73959

From	Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com>
Date	2015-04-23 13:09 +1200
Message-ID	<230420151309345357%YourName@YourISP.com>
In reply to	#73933

In article <55380be6$0$19479$c3e8da3$b1356c67@news.astraweb.com>, JF
Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:
> On 15-04-22 15:10, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
> > 
> > Aye. Plus it makes no sense to me in a text editor/lightweight word
> > processor to have to Save As in order to switch between plain text and
> > RTF editing modes.
> 
> You don't have to use SAVE AS to change your editor mode. There is a
> menu option to do that.
> 
> But this doesn't mean that you shouldn't be able to use your rich text
> doc as a source to do a SAVE AS to plain text without first having to
> conver the doc to plain text.
> 
> The big UI question is whether a SAVE AS operation should change the
> context of the current window to that of the newly created copy, or
> whether the original document should remain the context of the window.
> 
> (say I have A.RTF in rich text, and do a SAVE AS  B.txt in plain text,
> should the window still have A.RTF in rich text or  B.txt in plain text
> ?). There are arguments for both scenarios.
> 
> Photoshop has "SAVE AS" and "SAVE A COPY" to distinguich between the two.

"Save A Copy" is a completely redundant and silly option. You simply
"Save As" without changing the file format ... or duplicate the file in
the Finder.

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#73965

From	Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net>
Date	2015-04-23 08:46 +0100
Message-ID	<230420150846444418%timstreater@greenbee.net>
In reply to	#73959

In article <230420151309345357%YourName@YourISP.com>, Your Name
<YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

>In article <55380be6$0$19479$c3e8da3$b1356c67@news.astraweb.com>, JF
>Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

>> Photoshop has "SAVE AS" and "SAVE A COPY" to distinguich between the two.
>
>"Save A Copy" is a completely redundant and silly option. You simply
>"Save As" without changing the file format ... or duplicate the file in
>the Finder.

I don't know about PS, but I use TextWrangler's Save a Copy all the
time. If you use Save As in TW (and perhaps this is how it works in
other apps, too), then after Save As you're no longer editing the
original file, you're now editing the copy you made with Save As, under
its new name.

Save a Copy, by contrast, allows you to save somewhere else, while
leaving you editing the original file. When doing this, I really don't
want to be leaving the app I'm using (TW).

-- 
"Freedom is sloppy. But since tyranny's the only guaranteed byproduct of
those who insist on a perfect world, freedom will have to do." -- Bigby Wolf

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#73941

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-22 22:01 +0000
Message-ID	<cpqk25F3ijcU2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73909

On 2015-04-22, Jamie Kahn Genet <jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz> wrote:
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>
>> On 2015-04-22, Jamie Kahn Genet <jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz> wrote:
>> > Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
>> >
>> >> In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504221037270.31550@mako.ath.cx>, David
>> >> Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:
>> >> 
>> >> >As it happens, I agree with Adam, that the way TextEdit works isn't as
>> >> >intuitive as having the option of saving a file, in whatever format
>> >> >one desires, directly from the Save dialog.
>> >> 
>> >> A trivially unimportant difference. Most people would either figure it
>> >> out for themselves, or have understood it in short order after a few
>> >> posts. As it was "Adam" is either terminally thick, or was being
>> >> deliberately obtuse with a view to trolling, or is Harry Worth.
>> >
>> > Plus given the switch between RTF and plain text changes formatting
>> > options available, as well as save options, it only makes sense to have
>> > it be a menu option, instead of a 'Save As…' dialog option.
>> 
>> Absolutely. Loss of data is something that should be respected in the
>> design. Converting a rich text document containing images, styling, and
>> so on to a plain text document removes those things which may be
>> important to users. Doing that *while* saving the document isn't a good
>> user experience.
>
> Aye. Plus it makes no sense to me in a text editor/lightweight word
> processor to have to Save As in order to switch between plain text and
> RTF editing modes.

Totally agree.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73891

From	Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com>
Date	2015-04-22 13:08 -0400
Message-ID	<5537d59b$0$38646$b1db1813$65575428@news.astraweb.com>
In reply to	#73876

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504221037270.31550@mako.ath.cx>,
 David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> As it happens, I agree with Adam, that the way TextEdit works isn't as 
> intuitive as having the option of saving a file, in whatever format 
> one desires, directly from the Save dialog.

The other thing is, I think in Windows you can right click on the 
"desktop" and get an option (in a contextual menu) to create and open a 
text file. I think. I don't have a Windows open at the moment to try it 
out.
-- 
Where's the Vangelis music?
Pris' tongue is sticking out in in the wide shot after Batty has kissed her.
They have put back more tits into the Zhora dressing  room scene.
  -- notes for Blade Runner

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#73895

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-22 17:31 +0000
Message-ID	<cpq47kFt5tjU4@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73891

On 2015-04-22, Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> wrote:
> In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504221037270.31550@mako.ath.cx>,
>  David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>> As it happens, I agree with Adam, that the way TextEdit works isn't as 
>> intuitive as having the option of saving a file, in whatever format 
>> one desires, directly from the Save dialog.
>
> The other thing is, I think in Windows you can right click on the 
> "desktop" and get an option (in a contextual menu) to create and open a 
> text file. I think. I don't have a Windows open at the moment to try it 
> out.

Yes, but you won't be creating any other type of document that way which
means it is an inconsistent UI. Expecting OS X to incorporate every
brain-dead feature from Windows is a big mistake. Ain't gonna happen. 

If you *insist* on using the desktop to create new text files, there are
ways to do that in OS X. If you dislike third-party solutions like Neu
(link below), you can write a three-line AppleScript or single-line bash
script to do it and launch that from your Dock or Desktop.

<http://www.macupdate.com/app/mac/34606/neu>

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73918

From	Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org>
Date	2015-04-22 12:21 -0700
Message-ID	<220420151221072981%michelle@michelle.org>
In reply to	#73891

In article <5537d59b$0$38646$b1db1813$65575428@news.astraweb.com>,
Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> wrote:

> The other thing is, I think in Windows you can right click on the 
> "desktop" and get an option (in a contextual menu) to create and open a 
> text file. I think. I don't have a Windows open at the moment to try it 
> out.

I made a service, using automator, that creates a blank text file on
the desktop.

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#73893

From	JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca>
Date	2015-04-22 13:22 -0400
Message-ID	<5537d8d8$0$64023$b1db1813$2411a48f@news.astraweb.com>
In reply to	#73876

On 15-04-22 11:57, David Ritz wrote:

> Sure, there be trolls here, but assuming everyone with a basic 
> question is a troll is counterproductive, 

That is because the 3 people who constantly accuse people of being
trolls are in fact the trolls. They constantly shift topics from the
actual related topic to personal accusations of trolling and ill intent.

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#73904

From	Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com>
Date	2015-04-22 14:05 -0400
Message-ID	<5537e2db$0$63950$b1db1813$2411a48f@news.astraweb.com>
In reply to	#73893

In article <5537d8d8$0$64023$b1db1813$2411a48f@news.astraweb.com>,
 JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> On 15-04-22 11:57, David Ritz wrote:
> 
> > Sure, there be trolls here, but assuming everyone with a basic 
> > question is a troll is counterproductive, 
> 
> That is because the 3 people who constantly accuse people of being
> trolls are in fact the trolls. They constantly shift topics from the
> actual related topic to personal accusations of trolling and ill intent.

So what about them Habs?
-- 
Where's the Vangelis music?
Pris' tongue is sticking out in in the wide shot after Batty has kissed her.
They have put back more tits into the Zhora dressing  room scene.
  -- notes for Blade Runner

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#73920

From	Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org>
Date	2015-04-22 12:23 -0700
Message-ID	<220420151223110374%michelle@michelle.org>
In reply to	#73893

In article <5537d8d8$0$64023$b1db1813$2411a48f@news.astraweb.com>, JF
Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote:

> On 15-04-22 11:57, David Ritz wrote:
> 
> > Sure, there be trolls here, but assuming everyone with a basic 
> > question is a troll is counterproductive, 
> 
> That is because the 3 people who constantly accuse people of being
> trolls are in fact the trolls. They constantly shift topics from the
> actual related topic to personal accusations of trolling and ill intent.
> 
In a word, "baloney".

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#73995

From	Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies>
Date	2015-04-24 06:54 +0000
Message-ID	<slrnmjjq7c.l8.g.kreme@amelia.local>
In reply to	#73876

In message <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504221037270.31550@mako.ath.cx> 
  David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> On Wednesday, 22 April 2015 11:13 -0400, 
>  in article <mh8dqc$fi0$1@news.albasani.net>, 
>  AV3 <arvimide@earthlink.net> wrote:

>> On 4/22/15, 10:06, David Ritz wrote:

>>> Adam has been posting to Usenet, using the same address, for 
>>> significantly longer than a decade.  While this may have been his 
>>> first appearance in comp.sys.mac.*, he's been around a while.

>> However long "Adam" has been around other news groups, he has been 
>> around this one under various nyms from "Vinny" to most recently 
>> "Sunshine" and "Sobriquet," making "inquiries" about how difficult 
>> it is to use MacOS compared with Linux. He "fails to understand" 
>> clear instruction about using Mac, claiming that his instructors 
>> agree with his absurd assertions, and drags out these discussions ad 
>> nauseam. Those who continue "assisting" him without result are 
>> partly to blame for the nausea.

> This assumes facts not in evidence.  You may believe your assumption, 
> that everyone who comes from a different OS, expecting OS X to work 
> exactly the same way things work under Windows or Linux, is the same 
> individual, but it seems to be a lot to accept on its face.

It is obviously the same person. Anyone can see that.

-- 
'Now what?' it said. IT'S UP TO YOU. IT'S ALWAYS UP TO YOU. --Maskerade

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#73872

From	John McWilliams <jpmcw@comcast.net>
Date	2015-04-22 08:14 -0700
Message-ID	<mh8dq5$qod$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#73870

On 4/22/15   PDT 7:06 AM, David Ritz wrote:
In reply to Michelle S.

>> Has anyone noticed that Adam H. Kerman seems to have vanished?
>
> He popped up in news.admin.net-abuse.usenet, a day or so after
> dropping out of this thread.  His questions there were answered
> to his satisfaction.
>
> Adam has been posting to Usenet, using the same address, for
> significantly longer than a decade.  While this may have been his
> first appearence in comp.sys.mac.*, he's been around a while.

Indeed. He's seen often at alt.online-service.comcast. Pretty much a 
straight shooter, though this last foray has me wondering.

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#73883

From	nmassello@yahoo.com (Neill Massello)
Date	2015-04-22 10:30 -0600
Message-ID	<1m39yzj.1b11fe548zoxeN%nmassello@yahoo.com>
In reply to	#73870

David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> Adam has been posting to Usenet, using the same address, for 
> significantly longer than a decade.  While this may have been his 
> first appearence in comp.sys.mac.*, he's been around a while.

For the full Kerman experience, dip into rec.arts.tv.

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#73906

From	Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid>
Date	2015-04-22 18:15 +0000
Message-ID	<cpq6q3F1f4U2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73863

On 2015-04-22, Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <mh6tn8$2oq$1@news.datemas.de>, Alan Baker
><email@domain.com> wrote:
>
>> >> But that is what the OP wanted to create.
>> > 
>> > I simply want to paste some ASCII text into a text document.
>> > 
>> > I don't care HOW the text file is created as long as the
>> > ASCII text document has a name and location that I choose
>> > and it contains just the text I want to be in it.
>> 
>> So copy the text, open TextEdit, paste, save.
>> 
>> Done.
>
> Has anyone noticed that Adam H. Kerman seems to have vanished?

Unfortunately, you're still not dead.

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#73912

From	jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet)
Date	2015-04-23 07:10 +1200
Message-ID	<1m3bl7h.1si5lld1s0x8q5N%jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz>
In reply to	#73906

Huge <Huge@nowhere.much.invalid> wrote:

> On 2015-04-22, Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> > In article <mh6tn8$2oq$1@news.datemas.de>, Alan Baker
> ><email@domain.com> wrote:
> >
> >> >> But that is what the OP wanted to create.
> >> > 
> >> > I simply want to paste some ASCII text into a text document.
> >> > 
> >> > I don't care HOW the text file is created as long as the
> >> > ASCII text document has a name and location that I choose
> >> > and it contains just the text I want to be in it.
> >> 
> >> So copy the text, open TextEdit, paste, save.
> >> 
> >> Done.
> >
> > Has anyone noticed that Adam H. Kerman seems to have vanished?
> 
> Unfortunately, you're still not dead.

So who is this insecure blowhard? I can't keep up with the nymshifting.
-- 
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.

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#73499

From	dorayme <do_ray_me@bigpond.com>
Date	2015-04-20 12:19 +1000
Message-ID	<do_ray_me-462889.12193520042015@aioe.org>
In reply to	#73492

In article <190420152135434139%nospam@nospam.invalid>,
 nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> In article <190420151804205941%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
> <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> 
> > > as above, launch text edit or similar, type some text and then save it
> > > to wherever you want.
> > 
> > You don't even have to type some text.
> 
> sure, but an empty file is pointless.

Not so.

-- 
dorayme

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#73491

From	nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date	2015-04-19 20:50 -0400
Message-ID	<190420152050160494%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to	#73487

In article <mh1htc$3dm$2@news.albasani.net>, Adam H. Kerman
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> I tried to help a friend create a simple text file on
> Macintosh OSX 10.9.5 and it was very difficult.

it's very easy. launch the text edit application (or equivalent) and
start writing, then save it.

> Right clicking didn't have any option to create a text file.
> http://i.imgur.com/RkrcG3M.png

of course it doesn't, because creating a text file is not a function of
finder. 

why would anyone expect such a function to be there? you don't see
create a spreadsheet or photo there either, do you?

> So I had to find an existing text file because I couldn't
> just create an empty text file.
> 
> Once I dug around and found a text file, I then found the 
> "duplicate" menu, and I duplicated it to "filename copy", 
> but was unable to just cut and paste it without duplicating
> it first.

dragging a file is much easier than cut/paste.

...

> Given the simple goal of 
> a) Creating a blank text file
> b) In a desired location
> c) With some indication that it's a text file
> How would a Mac user have done this task?

as above, launch text edit or similar, type some text and then save it
to wherever you want.

as usual, you're doing things in the most complicated and fucked up way
possible.

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csiph-web

How do mac users create a blank text file where you want it?

Contents

#73947

#73948

#73955

#73958

#73959

#73965

#73941

#73891

#73895

#73918

#73893

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#73920

#73995

#73872

#73883

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#73912

#73499

#73491