Groups > comp.sys.mac.system > #73487 > unrolled thread

How do mac users create a blank text file where you want it?

Started by	"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com>
First post	2015-04-20 00:40 +0000
Last post	2015-04-22 09:09 -0700
Articles	20 on this page of 379 — 28 participants

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#73506

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-20 02:27 +0000
Message-ID	<cpj6g3F5p92U5@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73494

On 2015-04-20, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote in message
> cpj4o2F5p92U1@mid.individual.net
>  
>> 1. Open TextEdit (or any text editor).
>> 2. Save the file wherever you want it.
>> 3. There is no step 3.
>
> Which of these TextEdit "Save As" options is the ASCII text option 
> (so that I can save the file as a portable filename.txt)?
> http://i.imgur.com/FDYa45h.png

TextEdit default to creating rich text documents. 

1. Open TextEdit.
2. Choose Format > Make Plain Text.
3. Save the file.

-or-

1. Open TextEdit.
2. Change Preferences > New Document > Format: Plain text.

From this point on, all you have are two steps:

1. Open TextEdit.
2. Save the file.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73543

From	"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com>
Date	2015-04-20 03:23 +0000
Message-ID	<mh1rfc$i5o$2@news.albasani.net>
In reply to	#73506

Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote in message
cpj6g3F5p92U5@mid.individual.net

> 1. Open TextEdit.
> 2. Change Preferences > New Document > Format: Plain text.

Thanks. 

Only nospam, up to your post above, had actually explained *how* 
to unhide the hidden option for the default text editor to save as 
portable ASCII text files.

Now everything is fine.

What I learned was two important things about Macintosh protocols.

1. In most operating system, you have a variety of options of how you 
   want to create your ASCII text files but on the Macintosh, one of
   those options doesn't exist. This is fine, as long as you're aware 
   that this option doesn't exist, as the other options work almost
   as well (depending on the need).

2. In most default text editors (on other operating systems), you can
   immediately save the file as ASCII text but on the Macintosh, you
   have to know to first unhide the hidden option to save ASCII text
   as ASCII text (because the default text editor defaults to RTL).

Thanks for helping me understand how mac users create text files.

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#73547

From	Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org>
Date	2015-04-19 20:27 -0700
Message-ID	<190420152027140383%michelle@michelle.org>
In reply to	#73543

In article <mh1rfc$i5o$2@news.albasani.net>, Adam H. Kerman
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote in message
> cpj6g3F5p92U5@mid.individual.net
> 
> > 1. Open TextEdit.
> > 2. Change Preferences > New Document > Format: Plain text.
> 
> Thanks. 
> 
> Only nospam, up to your post above, had actually explained *how* 
> to unhide the hidden option for the default text editor to save as 
> portable ASCII text files.

Actually, I explained it before he did.  Further, there's nothing
hidden about it.

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#73559

From	nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date	2015-04-19 23:38 -0400
Message-ID	<190420152338587793%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to	#73543

In article <mh1rfc$i5o$2@news.albasani.net>, Adam H. Kerman
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> What I learned was two important things about Macintosh protocols.

no you didn't.

> 1. In most operating system, you have a variety of options of how you 
>    want to create your ASCII text files but on the Macintosh, one of
>    those options doesn't exist. This is fine, as long as you're aware 
>    that this option doesn't exist, as the other options work almost
>    as well (depending on the need).

wrong.

*one* app doesn't have it in the save panel.

what other apps do is likely to be different.

> 2. In most default text editors (on other operating systems), you can
>    immediately save the file as ASCII text but on the Macintosh, you
>    have to know to first unhide the hidden option to save ASCII text
>    as ASCII text (because the default text editor defaults to RTL).

textwrangler.

> Thanks for helping me understand how mac users create text files.

you're making stupid generalizations again.

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#73650

From	"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com>
Date	2015-04-20 07:04 +0000
Message-ID	<mh28e8$i5o$45@news.albasani.net>
In reply to	#73559

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
190420152338587793nospamospam@nospam.invalid

> *one* app doesn't have it in the save panel.
> 
> what other apps do is likely to be different.

I do agree that every app can be different.
I'm *only* speaking about the default text editor in this thread.
Certainly, I had *expected* a default text editor to be able to "save as" 
plain text, so it was a shocker that you have to find the plain text 
option in a different menu sequence.

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#73757

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-20 14:51 +0000
Message-ID	<cpki4aFg4haU21@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73650

On 2015-04-20, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
> 190420152338587793nospamospam@nospam.invalid
>
>> *one* app doesn't have it in the save panel.
>> 
>> what other apps do is likely to be different.
>
> I do agree that every app can be different.
> I'm *only* speaking about the default text editor in this thread.
> Certainly, I had *expected* a default text editor to be able to "save as" 
> plain text

Translation: I expected TextEdit to treat all documents as plain text
rather than rich text by default.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73914

From	Alan Baker <email@domain.com>
Date	2015-04-22 12:12 -0700
Message-ID	<mh8rr2$4l4$2@news.datemas.de>
In reply to	#73650

On 2015-04-20 07:04:40 +0000, Adam H. Kerman said:

> nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
> 190420152338587793nospamospam@nospam.invalid
> 
>> *one* app doesn't have it in the save panel.
>> 
>> what other apps do is likely to be different.
> 
> I do agree that every app can be different.
> I'm *only* speaking about the default text editor in this thread.

There really isn't a default text editor on the Mac. There is a text 
editor it happens to have included.

> Certainly, I had *expected* a default text editor to be able to "save as"
> plain text, so it was a shocker that you have to find the plain text
> option in a different menu sequence.

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#73624

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-20 04:10 +0000
Message-ID	<cpjci6F7dq8U2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73543

On 2015-04-20, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote in message
> cpj6g3F5p92U5@mid.individual.net
>
>> 1. Open TextEdit.
>> 2. Change Preferences > New Document > Format: Plain text.
>
> Thanks. 
>
> Only nospam, up to your post above, had actually explained *how* 
> to unhide the hidden option for the default text editor to save as 
> portable ASCII text files.

Bullshit. You ignored other responses that told you how to do it.

> Now everything is fine.

Not really. You changed preferences on a machine that is not yours. I
told you a simpler and better way but you ignored it.

> What I learned was two important things about Macintosh protocols.

You haven't learned anything at all.

> 1. In most operating system, you have a variety of options of how you 
>    want to create your ASCII text files but on the Macintosh, one of
>    those options doesn't exist.

Bullshit. 

> 2. In most default text editors (on other operating systems), you can
>    immediately save the file as ASCII text but on the Macintosh, you
>    have to know to first unhide the hidden option to save ASCII text
>    as ASCII text (because the default text editor defaults to RTL).

That's a lie.

> Thanks for helping me understand how mac users create text files.

You understand nothing, troll.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73507

From	nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date	2015-04-19 22:28 -0400
Message-ID	<190420152228173386%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to	#73494

In article <mh1nul$3dm$6@news.albasani.net>, Adam H. Kerman
<ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> Which of these TextEdit "Save As" options is the ASCII text option 

its not in save as. pay attention. you set the app to plain text in the
app and then it will save plain text.

and don't even waste your time with text edit. get text wrangler. 

<http://www.barebones.com/products/textwrangler/>

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#73544

From	"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com>
Date	2015-04-20 03:25 +0000
Message-ID	<mh1ris$i5o$3@news.albasani.net>
In reply to	#73507

nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote in message
190420152228173386nospamospam@nospam.invalid

> its not in save as. pay attention. you set the app to plain text in the
> app and then it will save plain text.

I don't have the Macintosh in front of me now, as the person who was 
asking for help went home, but I will need to check tomorrow if unhiding
the hidden option for the default text editor to save ASCII text actually
disabled the Save As dialog by mistake.

Thanks for that warning. I'll have to check tomorrow to see if there is
still the option to Save As, or if that option now disappears.

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#73510

From	"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com>
Date	2015-04-20 02:23 +0000
Message-ID	<mh1nul$3dm$6@news.albasani.net>
In reply to	#73494

Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote in message
cpj4o2F5p92U1@mid.individual.net
 
> 1. Open TextEdit (or any text editor).
> 2. Save the file wherever you want it.
> 3. There is no step 3.

Which of these TextEdit "Save As" options is the ASCII text option 
(so that I can save the file as a portable filename.txt)?
http://i.imgur.com/FDYa45h.png

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#73545

From	David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
Date	2015-04-19 22:10 -0500
Message-ID	<alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192135570.57809@mako.ath.cx>
In reply to	#73487

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
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On Monday, 20 April 2015 00:40 -0000, 
 in article <mh1htc$3dm$2@news.albasani.net>, 
 Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:

> Since the Mac is different from what I am used to, I am sure I am 
> doing something very wrong since it can't be this complex to do 
> something as simple as create an empty text file where you want it 
> to exist with a file name that indicates it's a text file.

It's quite easy, actually.

> Given the simple goal of 
> a) Creating a blank text file
> b) In a desired location
> c) With some indication that it's a text file
> How would a Mac user have done this task?

The easiest way I can come up with, to create a new text file, in the 
directory of your choice, is via Terminal application, found in 
/Applications/Utilities/.  To create the file, type

    touch /full/path/to/file.txt

 $ touch ~/Desktop/file.txt

 $ ls -alF ~/Desktop/file.txt
 -rw-r--r--+ 1 dritz  staff  0 Apr 19 21:42 /Users/dritz/Desktop/file.txt

 $ file /Users/dritz/Desktop/file.txt
 /Users/dritz/Desktop/file.txt: empty

Is that empty enough for you, Adam?

Optionally, a Mac user might launch whatever text editor they're 
using, create a new document within the application and save it to 
disk, wherever you want it to exist, within the Save dialog.  Common 
GUI Mac text editors include TextWrangler (free) and BBEdit (paid), 
both from Bare Bones Software.  Common CLI text editors, found in a 
default Mac installation include ed, vi (asiased to vim), nano and 
emacs, all of which are quite common on Unix and Unix-like platforms.

/Applications/TextEdit.app is even usable for the creation of an empty 
text file, although I find it extremely limited for actual text 
editing and formatting.

-- 
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
 Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.

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#73562

From	dorayme <do_ray_me@bigpond.com>
Date	2015-04-20 13:52 +1000
Message-ID	<do_ray_me-0B0122.13525720042015@aioe.org>
In reply to	#73545

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192135570.57809@mako.ath.cx>,
 David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> The easiest way I can come up with, to create a new text file, in the 
> directory of your choice, is via Terminal application, found in 
> /Applications/Utilities/.  To create the file, type
> 
>     touch /full/path/to/file.txt
> 
>  $ touch ~/Desktop/file.txt
> 
>  $ ls -alF ~/Desktop/file.txt
>  -rw-r--r--+ 1 dritz  staff  0 Apr 19 21:42 /Users/dritz/Desktop/file.txt
> 
>  $ file /Users/dritz/Desktop/file.txt
>  /Users/dritz/Desktop/file.txt: empty

That's the easiest way eh on a Mac? Did you have a common-sense bypass 
at some stage?

-- 
dorayme

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#73578

From	David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
Date	2015-04-19 23:35 -0500
Message-ID	<alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192302500.57809@mako.ath.cx>
In reply to	#73562

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1
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On Monday, 20 April 2015 13:52 +1000, 
 in article <do_ray_me-0B0122.13525720042015@aioe.org>, 
 dorayme <do_ray_me@bigpond.com> wrote:

> In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192135570.57809@mako.ath.cx>,
>  David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

>> The easiest way I can come up with, to create a new text file, in 
>> the directory of your choice, is via Terminal application, found in 
>> /Applications/Utilities/.  To create the file, type

>>     touch /full/path/to/file.txt

> That's the easiest way eh on a Mac? Did you have a common-sense 
> bypass at some stage?

Criticize all you like, but I've yet to see anyone else offer a one 
step, or even two step solution.  ;)

The solution Adam appears to have ended up using, TextEdit.app, 
required many, not necessarily intuitive steps.  IIRC, I'm the only 
person to point out that his specific request for ASCII encoding 
required changing yet another default, as TextEdit defaults to UTF-8 
(good), but ASCII isn't even among the default choices available, in 
the application's Save as dialog.

Of course, I understand that he should have been asking about plain 
text, rather than a quite specific ASCII text encoding, as these are 
different concepts.

Do you have a problem with a simple, quite straight forward way of 
creating an empty text file, as requested.  After it's been created, 
double-clicking on that file will, by default, open as a plain text 
file, in TextEdit, for editing.

(Here, it will open in BBEdit 11.0.3, as it is configured as _my_ 
default GUI text editor.  Rich text files still open in TextEdit, by 
default.)

-- 
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
 Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.

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#73582

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-20 04:43 +0000
Message-ID	<cpjeg9F7dq8U11@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73578

On 2015-04-20, David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
> On Monday, 20 April 2015 13:52 +1000, 
>  in article <do_ray_me-0B0122.13525720042015@aioe.org>, 
>  dorayme <do_ray_me@bigpond.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192135570.57809@mako.ath.cx>,
>>  David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:
>
>>> The easiest way I can come up with, to create a new text file, in 
>>> the directory of your choice, is via Terminal application, found in 
>>> /Applications/Utilities/.  To create the file, type
>
>>>     touch /full/path/to/file.txt
>
>> That's the easiest way eh on a Mac? Did you have a common-sense 
>> bypass at some stage?
>
> Criticize all you like, but I've yet to see anyone else offer a one 
> step, or even two step solution.  ;)

In TextEdit:

1. Choose Format > Make Plain Text.
2. Save.

Good enough for me.

> The solution Adam appears to have ended up using, TextEdit.app, 
> required many, not necessarily intuitive steps.

No, he just chose the most complicated one, as usual.

> IIRC, I'm the only 
> person to point out that his specific request for ASCII encoding 
> required changing yet another default, as TextEdit defaults to UTF-8 
> (good), but ASCII isn't even among the default choices available, in 
> the application's Save as dialog.

Bull. All he needed to do was choose Format > Make Plain Text *before*
saving the document. No preferences needed to be changed.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73589

From	Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org>
Date	2015-04-19 21:55 -0700
Message-ID	<190420152155298082%michelle@michelle.org>
In reply to	#73578

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192302500.57809@mako.ath.cx>, David
Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

> Criticize all you like, but I've yet to see anyone else offer a one 
> step, or even two step solution.  ;)

You haven't been paying attention.

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#73659

From	David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
Date	2015-04-20 02:07 -0500
Message-ID	<alpine.OSX.2.20.1504200200150.57809@mako.ath.cx>
In reply to	#73589

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On Sunday, 19 April 2015 21:55 -0700, 
 in article <190420152155298082%michelle@michelle.org>, 
 Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192302500.57809@mako.ath.cx>, David
> Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

>> Criticize all you like, but I've yet to see anyone else offer a one 
>> step, or even two step solution.  ;)

> You haven't been paying attention.

Oh, but I have.  JF mentioned the use of touch, later in the thread.

Only a few of the TextEdit instruction sets have mentioned creating a 
new file; none have mentioned navigating the Save dialog box to the 
directory where the file is to be saved.  You may not count these as 
steps, but I do.

-- 
David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com>
 Be kind to animals; kiss a shark.

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#73674

From	"Adam H. Kerman" <ahk@chinet.com>
Date	2015-04-20 07:34 +0000
Message-ID	<mh2a5r$i5o$58@news.albasani.net>
In reply to	#73659

David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
alpine.OSX.2.20.1504200200150.57809@mako.ath.cx

> Only a few of the TextEdit instruction sets have mentioned creating a
> new file; none have mentioned navigating the Save dialog box to the
> directory where the file is to be saved.  You may not count these as
> steps, but I do.

You, of all those who have posted, understand the concept of steps!
Thank you!

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#73760

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2015-04-20 14:57 +0000
Message-ID	<cpkiehFg4haU23@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#73674

On 2015-04-20, Adam H. Kerman <ahk@chinet.com> wrote:
> David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote in message
> alpine.OSX.2.20.1504200200150.57809@mako.ath.cx
>
>> Only a few of the TextEdit instruction sets have mentioned creating a
>> new file; none have mentioned navigating the Save dialog box to the
>> directory where the file is to be saved.  You may not count these as
>> steps, but I do.
>
> You, of all those who have posted, understand the concept of steps!
> Thank you!

Having been employed as a professional technical writer, I completely
understand the concept of steps, possibly better than you. 

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#73679

From	dorayme <do_ray_me@bigpond.com>
Date	2015-04-20 18:08 +1000
Message-ID	<do_ray_me-60842F.18084620042015@aioe.org>
In reply to	#73578

In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192302500.57809@mako.ath.cx>,
 David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:

Just btw mind you, your posts have always reminded me of flashing neon 
signs in glitzy metro areas, all the extra irrelevant signage that 
appears in my newsreader! 

> On Monday, 20 April 2015 13:52 +1000, 
>  in article <do_ray_me-0B0122.13525720042015@aioe.org>, 
>  dorayme <do_ray_me@bigpond.com> wrote:
> 
> > In article <alpine.OSX.2.20.1504192135570.57809@mako.ath.cx>,
> >  David Ritz <dritz@mindspring.com> wrote:
> 
> >> The easiest way I can come up with, to create a new text file, in 
> >> the directory of your choice, is via Terminal application, found in 
> >> /Applications/Utilities/.  To create the file, type
> 
> >>     touch /full/path/to/file.txt
> 
> > That's the easiest way eh on a Mac? Did you have a common-sense 
> > bypass at some stage?
> 
> Criticize all you like, but I've yet to see anyone else offer a one 
> step, or even two step solution.  ;)
>

It's a one or two step solution in my Text-Edit. Just click the 
dropdown item in the format menu when beginning.

> The solution Adam appears to have ended up using, TextEdit.app, 
> required many, not necessarily intuitive steps.  IIRC, I'm the only 
> person to point out that his specific request for ASCII encoding 
> required changing yet another default, as TextEdit defaults to UTF-8 
> (good), but ASCII isn't even among the default choices available, in 
> the application's Save as dialog.
> 
> Of course, I understand that he should have been asking about plain 
> text, rather than a quite specific ASCII text encoding, as these are 
> different concepts.
>

OK. 

> Do you have a problem with a simple, quite straight forward way of 
> creating an empty text file, as requested.  

No, I don't have a problem but it feels complicated to ask a windoze 
bloke who in turn is helping to show a Mac user (who ipso facto is 
likely a bit of a novice) to create a text file... 

> After it's been created, 
> double-clicking on that file will, by default, open as a plain text 
> file, in TextEdit, for editing.
> 
> (Here, it will open in BBEdit 11.0.3, as it is configured as _my_ 
> default GUI text editor.  Rich text files still open in TextEdit, by 
> default.)

Your way is interesting and beautiful and I am sending you two 
kangaroos for you to kill and eat, the meat is very healthy and lean. 
You need to skill up to cook it right, it's a big mistake to overcook 
it as steak.

-- 
dorayme

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csiph-web

How do mac users create a blank text file where you want it?

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