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Groups > comp.sys.mac.system > #57163 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Stephen <gratefuldead@xs4all.nl> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2014-02-27 16:53 +0100 |
| Last post | 2014-03-08 20:38 +0000 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 181 — 35 participants |
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Snow Leopard retires.. Stephen <gratefuldead@xs4all.nl> - 2014-02-27 16:53 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Stephen <gratefuldead@xs4all.nl> - 2014-02-27 17:00 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Another John <lalaw44@hotmail.com> - 2014-02-27 18:27 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Stephen <gratefuldead@xs4all.nl> - 2014-02-27 19:50 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-02-27 17:13 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. gtr <xxx@yyy.zzz> - 2014-02-28 14:08 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Davoud <star@sky.net> - 2014-02-27 11:39 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Stephen <gratefuldead@xs4all.nl> - 2014-02-27 18:41 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-27 18:35 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Howard.not@home.com (Howard) - 2014-02-27 23:26 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-27 18:34 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Mark Storkamp <mstorkamp@yahoo.com> - 2014-02-27 13:03 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-27 21:22 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. David Lesher <wb8foz@panix.com> - 2014-03-03 17:53 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-04 15:37 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-04 22:20 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-05 12:51 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-05 22:33 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2014-03-05 17:50 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-05 23:59 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2014-03-06 07:40 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Patty Winter <patty1@wintertime.com> - 2014-03-06 18:49 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-06 17:06 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-07 02:54 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Ted Lee <tmplee@gmail.com> - 2014-03-07 11:41 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-06 17:03 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-05 16:54 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-06 01:20 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-06 17:01 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-07 16:35 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-08 14:25 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Howard.not@home.com (Howard) - 2014-02-27 23:26 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-02-28 19:53 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2014-02-28 17:58 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-02-27 20:50 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-02-27 21:44 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-02-27 18:36 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-28 00:49 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2014-02-27 20:45 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-28 10:43 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-02-28 19:52 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-01 06:41 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-01 15:29 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-01 11:42 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-01 18:09 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-02 11:38 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-02 17:28 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-02 11:40 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-02 12:23 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Ted Lee <tmplee@gmail.com> - 2014-03-02 18:17 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-02 19:28 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-03 18:39 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-03 13:25 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-03 00:47 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-02 20:29 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-03 03:11 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-03 16:52 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-03 04:06 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-04 12:02 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-03 18:38 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-04 12:55 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-03 19:51 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-04 01:32 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2014-03-05 12:33 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-05 18:11 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-04 00:18 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Ant <ant@zimage.comANT> - 2014-03-04 06:43 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-04 17:04 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-04 17:59 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-05 12:49 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Kit <kitzyme@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-03-04 14:55 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-04 17:05 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-05 12:49 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dob@trwxxa-2.local (David Blanchard) - 2014-03-09 18:16 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-09 21:56 -0400
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dob@trwxxa-2.local (David Blanchard) - 2014-03-10 16:45 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-01 18:08 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-02 17:28 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. David Fritzinger <dfritzin@nospam.mac.com> - 2014-03-01 12:50 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-01 18:21 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. David Fritzinger <dfritzin@nospam.mac.com> - 2014-03-02 12:16 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-02-28 11:02 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Laszlo Lebrun <lazlo_lebrun@googlemail.com> - 2014-02-28 17:25 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-02-28 18:38 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-02-28 20:47 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2014-02-28 18:37 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Ronnie Bateman <OurOwnRonnieBateman@earthlinc.net> - 2014-02-28 13:09 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-02-28 21:57 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-02-28 19:52 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-03-01 08:08 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-02-28 20:49 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-02-28 19:50 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dorayme <do_ray_me@bigpond.com> - 2014-03-01 13:29 +1100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. David Fritzinger <dfritzin@nospam.mac.com> - 2014-03-01 12:48 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> - 2014-02-28 21:23 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-02-28 19:50 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-01 06:40 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-01 09:31 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. RonTheGuy@null.invalid (Ron) - 2014-03-01 19:24 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> - 2014-03-01 19:44 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-01 23:38 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-02 17:51 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> - 2014-03-02 11:25 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-02 05:21 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-02 01:59 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-02 02:39 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-02 07:49 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-02 21:34 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-02 17:59 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-03 13:25 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-03 03:14 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-03 17:05 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-02 20:12 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-03 03:22 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-03 04:29 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-02 20:02 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-03 03:17 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-03 03:47 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-02 23:02 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-03 05:12 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-03 00:39 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Andreas Rutishauser <andreas@macandreas.ch> - 2014-03-03 07:27 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-03 01:29 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Andreas Rutishauser <andreas@macandreas.ch> - 2014-03-04 06:51 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-03 04:11 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-03 04:27 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-03 05:09 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-03 16:16 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-03 16:29 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-03 12:35 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-03 20:28 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Laszlo Lebrun <lazlo_lebrun@googlemail.com> - 2014-03-04 22:51 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-04 22:19 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-01 23:38 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-02 01:56 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-02 02:39 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-02 07:50 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-03-02 08:05 -0700
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-03 13:25 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2014-03-01 21:13 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-02 05:20 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-02 10:07 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-02 16:28 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-03 09:13 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Laszlo Lebrun <lazlo_lebrun@googlemail.com> - 2014-02-28 17:23 +0100
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Ronnie Bateman <OurOwnRonnieBateman@earthlinc.net> - 2014-02-28 13:07 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-02-28 19:49 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. David Fritzinger <dfritzin@nospam.mac.com> - 2014-03-01 12:30 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-02-28 12:04 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-02-27 18:40 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-02-28 19:48 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. David Fritzinger <dfritzin@nospam.mac.com> - 2014-03-01 12:22 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-02 11:54 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-02 11:59 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-02-27 18:31 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-06 12:20 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2014-03-06 09:39 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2014-03-06 10:57 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-06 19:05 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2014-03-06 11:41 -0800
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-07 12:12 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-07 02:47 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-07 03:13 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-07 09:38 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-07 14:43 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2014-03-07 07:50 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-07 14:45 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2014-03-07 11:24 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-07 16:39 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> - 2014-03-07 16:43 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2014-03-07 18:06 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-08 03:37 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-07 15:04 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-03-07 19:37 +1300
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-07 18:38 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-07 19:21 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-08 00:31 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-03-07 19:36 -0500
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-03-08 01:35 +0000
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> - 2014-03-08 14:25 -0600
Re: Snow Leopard retires.. Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-08 20:38 +0000
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| From | erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-02-28 19:52 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <drache-C00D5D.19524128022014@news.eternal-september.org> |
| In reply to | #57233 |
In article <slrnlh0q3e.8ll.g.kreme@amelia.local>, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break. Lie. -- Erilar, biblioholic medievalist
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-01 06:41 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnlh308g.10tf.g.kreme@oswin.local> |
| In reply to | #57270 |
In message <drache-C00D5D.19524128022014@news.eternal-september.org> erilar <drache@chibardun.net.invalid> wrote: > In article <slrnlh0q3e.8ll.g.kreme@amelia.local>, > Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: >> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break. > Lie. No it's not, you fucking troll. -- Ahahahahaha! Ahahahaha! Aahahaha! BEWARE!!!!! Yrs sincerely The Opera Ghost
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-01 15:29 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <lesucr$4g8$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #57279 |
Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > >> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break. > > > Lie. > > No it's not, you fucking troll. There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC. -- K. Lang may your lum reek.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-01 11:42 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <BqCdnUxcu75wkI_OnZ2dnUVZ_jidnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #57282 |
On 2014.03.01, 10:29 , Király wrote:
> Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>>> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break.
>>
>>> Lie.
>>
>> No it's not, you fucking troll.
>
> There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not
> work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC.
Can you run "Rosetta" OS X under Fusion/Parallels?
Any s/w worth re-issue in intel-only has been done (and of course the
dual comps still work). Unless the app is business critical it's time
to move on - or hey, I have a G4 for sale. With screen, KB and mouse.
Free if you're here by tomorrow night. Or any night.
Bitching about usenet readers is a pretty hilarious reason to stick with
Rosetta OS X'.
1. There are plenty of newsreaders for intel OS X. They don't work
like the old ones? Too bad! The developer has moved on to other things.
2. Usenet has been in a steady decline since blogs and web based groups
has emerged. There's little benefit to mankind in maintaining each and
every newsreader.
--
Privacy has become an essential personal chore that most
people are not trained to perform.
- Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-01 18:09 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnlh48j8.l4g.g.kreme@amelia.local> |
| In reply to | #57284 |
In message <BqCdnUxcu75wkI_OnZ2dnUVZ_jidnZ2d@giganews.com> Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote: > On 2014.03.01, 10:29 , Király wrote: >> Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: >>>>> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break. >>> >>>> Lie. >>> >>> No it's not, you fucking troll. >> >> There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not >> work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC. > Can you run "Rosetta" OS X under Fusion/Parallels? > Any s/w worth re-issue in intel-only has been done (and of course the > dual comps still work). Unless the app is business critical it's time > to move on - or hey, I have a G4 for sale. With screen, KB and mouse. > Free if you're here by tomorrow night. Or any night. > Bitching about usenet readers is a pretty hilarious reason to stick with > Rosetta OS X'. Rosetta has nothing to do with MT Newswatcher, the System 7.5-era library it uses to talk to the netowrk is the issue, and that was dropped in 10.9 -- Oh, no! Not *ANOTHER* learning experience!
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| From | Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-02 11:38 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <R6SdnYP0Pv4Iw47OnZ2dnUVZ_t-dnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #57293 |
On 2014.03.01, 13:09 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <BqCdnUxcu75wkI_OnZ2dnUVZ_jidnZ2d@giganews.com>
> Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>> On 2014.03.01, 10:29 , Király wrote:
>>> Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>>>>> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break.
>>>>
>>>>> Lie.
>>>>
>>>> No it's not, you fucking troll.
>>>
>>> There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not
>>> work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC.
>
>> Can you run "Rosetta" OS X under Fusion/Parallels?
>
>> Any s/w worth re-issue in intel-only has been done (and of course the
>> dual comps still work). Unless the app is business critical it's time
>> to move on - or hey, I have a G4 for sale. With screen, KB and mouse.
>> Free if you're here by tomorrow night. Or any night.
>
>> Bitching about usenet readers is a pretty hilarious reason to stick with
>> Rosetta OS X'.
>
> Rosetta has nothing to do with MT Newswatcher, the System 7.5-era
> library it uses to talk to the netowrk is the issue, and that was
> dropped in 10.9
True enough, but the prior poster referred to PowerPC (above) as well
and that got all mixed into my reply.
--
Those who have reduced our privacy, whether they are state
or commercial actors, prefer that we do not reduce theirs.
- Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.
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| From | dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-02 17:28 +1300 |
| Message-ID | <1lhvrb8.7xut6i1eykjnpN%dempson@actrix.gen.nz> |
| In reply to | #57284 |
Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote: > On 2014.03.01, 10:29 , Király wrote: > > Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > >>>> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break. > >> > >>> Lie. > >> > >> No it's not, you fucking troll. > > > > There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not > > work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC. > > Can you run "Rosetta" OS X under Fusion/Parallels? Yes, by running Snow Leopard Server in the virtual machine. > Any s/w worth re-issue in intel-only has been done (and of course the > dual comps still work). Unless the app is business critical it's time > to move on - or hey, I have a G4 for sale. With screen, KB and mouse. > Free if you're here by tomorrow night. Or any night. > > Bitching about usenet readers is a pretty hilarious reason to stick with > Rosetta OS X'. As Lewis noted, MT-Newswatcher's issue is not Rosetta, since it is a Universal app. MT-Newswatcher works on 10.7 or 10.8, but not on 10.9, because it was still using the System 7 era Open Transport library for its network communications, which Apple had deprecated in Mac OS X 10.4, and finally got around to eliminating in 10.9. -- David Empson dempson@actrix.gen.nz
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| From | Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-02 11:40 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <R6SdnYL0Pv6Uwo7OnZ2dnUVZ_t-dnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #57328 |
On 2014.03.01, 23:28 , David Empson wrote:
> Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2014.03.01, 10:29 , Király wrote:
>>> Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>>>>> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break.
>>>>
>>>>> Lie.
>>>>
>>>> No it's not, you fucking troll.
>>>
>>> There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not
>>> work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC.
>>
>> Can you run "Rosetta" OS X under Fusion/Parallels?
>
> Yes, by running Snow Leopard Server in the virtual machine.
>
>> Any s/w worth re-issue in intel-only has been done (and of course the
>> dual comps still work). Unless the app is business critical it's time
>> to move on - or hey, I have a G4 for sale. With screen, KB and mouse.
>> Free if you're here by tomorrow night. Or any night.
>>
>> Bitching about usenet readers is a pretty hilarious reason to stick with
>> Rosetta OS X'.
>
> As Lewis noted, MT-Newswatcher's issue is not Rosetta, since it is a
> Universal app.
As I replied to Lewis, that statement got rolled into one in reference
to the prior poster's mention of PowerPC compiled apps. Sloppy writing
on my part.
--
Privacy has become an essential personal chore that most
people are not trained to perform.
- Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-02 12:23 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <SOydnZ3yjt1l9Y7OnZ2dnUVZ_omdnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #57328 |
On 2014.03.01, 23:28 , David Empson wrote:
> Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2014.03.01, 10:29 , Király wrote:
>>> Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>>>>> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break.
>>>>
>>>>> Lie.
>>>>
>>>> No it's not, you fucking troll.
>>>
>>> There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not
>>> work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC.
>>
>> Can you run "Rosetta" OS X under Fusion/Parallels?
>
> Yes, by running Snow Leopard Server in the virtual machine.
Or ordinary Rosetta'd OS X ... perhaps w/o obeying license terms?
--
Privacy has become an essential personal chore that most
people are not trained to perform.
- Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.
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| From | Ted Lee <tmplee@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-02 18:17 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <lf0hn3$au8$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #57377 |
On 3/2/14, 11:23 AM, Alan Browne wrote: > > Or ordinary Rosetta'd OS X ... perhaps w/o obeying license terms? > Mmmm, I didn't know you could "install" Rosetta on anything beyond the last OS it's approved for and supplied with. That's what I get for not following the hacker sites. (That's why one of my machines is frozen at Snow Leopard -- there are some PPC apps I use that have no successors and I've been too lazy to migrate all their data.) -- Ted
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| From | nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-02 19:28 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <020320141928308617%nospam@nospam.invalid> |
| In reply to | #57436 |
In article <lf0hn3$au8$1@dont-email.me>, Ted Lee <tmplee@gmail.com> wrote: > Mmmm, I didn't know you could "install" Rosetta on anything beyond the > last OS it's approved for and supplied with. That's what I get for not > following the hacker sites. (That's why one of my machines is frozen at > Snow Leopard -- there are some PPC apps I use that have no successors > and I've been too lazy to migrate all their data.) it's not possible to install rosetta. it's either built in or not available.
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| From | Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-03 18:39 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <TdKdnUhua84_j4jOnZ2dnUVZ_scAAAAA@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #57436 |
On 2014.03.02, 19:17 , Ted Lee wrote:
> On 3/2/14, 11:23 AM, Alan Browne wrote:
>>
>> Or ordinary Rosetta'd OS X ... perhaps w/o obeying license terms?
>>
>
> Mmmm, I didn't know you could "install" Rosetta on anything beyond the
> last OS it's approved for and supplied with. That's what I get for not
> following the hacker sites. (That's why one of my machines is frozen at
> Snow Leopard -- there are some PPC apps I use that have no successors
> and I've been too lazy to migrate all their data.)
What I'm suggesting is once updated to, say Mavericks, that one could
run Leopard (or SL) in virtualization to retain access those PPC
programs. There may be license or Fusion/Parallels barriers against
that, however.
--
Privacy has become an essential personal chore that most
people are not trained to perform.
- Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.
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| From | dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-03 13:25 +1300 |
| Message-ID | <1lhxeo7.135thhm14bqdc7N%dempson@actrix.gen.nz> |
| In reply to | #57377 |
Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote: > On 2014.03.01, 23:28 , David Empson wrote: > > Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote: > > > >> On 2014.03.01, 10:29 , Király wrote: > >>> Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote: > >>>>>> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break. > >>>> > >>>>> Lie. > >>>> > >>>> No it's not, you fucking troll. > >>> > >>> There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not > >>> work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC. > >> > >> Can you run "Rosetta" OS X under Fusion/Parallels? > > > > Yes, by running Snow Leopard Server in the virtual machine. > > Or ordinary Rosetta'd OS X ... perhaps w/o obeying license terms? Are you suggesting adding Rosetta to 10.7 or later? Not possible. Rosetta requires both the code translation engine (licensing issues) plus most of the library and framework code in OS X which can be used by applications needs to include PowerPC binaries. (This is because with Rosetta, the entire process executes PowerPC code, so any libraries or frameworks called by a PowerPC application process must also have PowerPC code.) Only Apple has the source code to the libraries and frameworks, and in 10.7 and later, only Intel binaries are included. Apple isn't going to release either the source code or start building (and testing) PowerPC library code again. -- David Empson dempson@actrix.gen.nz
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| From | me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-03 00:47 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <lf0jf9$ki3$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #57438 |
David Empson <dempson@actrix.gen.nz> wrote: > > > Yes, by running Snow Leopard Server in the virtual machine. > > > > Or ordinary Rosetta'd OS X ... perhaps w/o obeying license terms? > > Are you suggesting adding Rosetta to 10.7 or later? I'm pretty sure he's talking about the "ordinary" Snow Leopard, as opposed to Snow Leopard Server. It can be done but it's hardly worth the trouble when Snow Leopard Server only costs $20 and is fully supported. -- K. Lang may your lum reek.
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| From | JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-02 20:29 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <5313dafe$0$22308$c3e8da3$f6268168@news.astraweb.com> |
| In reply to | #57438 |
On 14-03-02 19:25, David Empson wrote: > Not possible. Rosetta requires both the code translation engine > (licensing issues) plus most of the library and framework code in OS X > which can be used by applications needs to include PowerPC binaries. > (This is because with Rosetta, the entire process executes PowerPC code, > so any libraries or frameworks called by a PowerPC application process > must also have PowerPC code.) What about extracting all components of Rosetta from Snow Leopard and installing them on Mavericks ? There would still be a problem getting OS-X to invoke Rosetta to load a PowerPC app. But theoretically, if a Power PC app runs in a Power-PC version of OS-X, the App wouldn't really know it is running on Mavericks, right ? And those libraries would make calls to the underlying OS-X the same way an app compiled under Snow Leopard will run without recompile on Mavericks. Would be a nice hacker challenge.
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| From | Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-03 03:11 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnlh7smb.8ik.g.kreme@amelia.local> |
| In reply to | #57467 |
In message <5313dafe$0$22308$c3e8da3$f6268168@news.astraweb.com> JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote: > On 14-03-02 19:25, David Empson wrote: >> Not possible. Rosetta requires both the code translation engine >> (licensing issues) plus most of the library and framework code in OS X >> which can be used by applications needs to include PowerPC binaries. >> (This is because with Rosetta, the entire process executes PowerPC code, >> so any libraries or frameworks called by a PowerPC application process >> must also have PowerPC code.) > What about extracting all components of Rosetta from Snow Leopard and > installing them on Mavericks ? Not possible. -- Where am I going and why am I in this handbasket?
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| From | dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-03 16:52 +1300 |
| Message-ID | <1lhxvex.vdwvx3hm47osN%dempson@actrix.gen.nz> |
| In reply to | #57467 |
JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote: > On 14-03-02 19:25, David Empson wrote: > > > Not possible. Rosetta requires both the code translation engine > > (licensing issues) plus most of the library and framework code in OS X > > which can be used by applications needs to include PowerPC binaries. > > (This is because with Rosetta, the entire process executes PowerPC code, > > so any libraries or frameworks called by a PowerPC application process > > must also have PowerPC code.) > > What about extracting all components of Rosetta from Snow Leopard and > installing them on Mavericks ? Also not feasible. There are changes in the system libraries and frameworks even between minor updates of OS X; typically there are major changes between major versions, e.g. restructuring components, changing database schemas, APIs, low level tools, etc. Parts of OS X expect to be consistent with other parts of OS X. If you tried to mix and match arbitrary bits from other versions, especially three major OS X releases apart, much of it would be broken. The only practical way this could have been achieved was if Apple had continued to include Rosetta with 10.7 or later, and had continued to maintain, build and test the PowerPC library and framework code every time they released an update. That didn't happen. -- David Empson dempson@actrix.gen.nz
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| From | JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-03 04:06 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <53144617$0$47894$c3e8da3$5d8fb80f@news.astraweb.com> |
| In reply to | #57481 |
On 14-03-02 22:52, David Empson wrote: > Also not feasible. There are changes in the system libraries and > frameworks even between minor updates of OS X; typically there are major > changes between major versions, e.g. restructuring components, changing > database schemas, APIs, low level tools, etc. Wouldn't the Power PC libraries be "stubs" that convert endianness of arguments and then call the equivalent intel system routine that then runs natively ? If the Rosetta library dynamically links to Intel libraries, it should be able to find the same routine on a different version of the OS. On the other hand, if the Rosetta libraries are truly PowerPC full compile of the system code, and Rosetta is the one that translates execution on the fly, then I can see how it would not be compatible since data structures used by the Intel OS would not necessarily be the same (or same location) as those used in a previous version which the running code would assume. However, i would suspect Apple would have use the "stub" method to call the native system routines instead of running basically 2 systems concurrently with 2 sets of routines accessing the same data structures (which makes for locking and resource allocation problems when you have 2 processes that control exclusive structures meant to be controlled by only one (such as window manager).
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| From | dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-04 12:02 +1300 |
| Message-ID | <1lhzblh.epdsgnqfft0uN%dempson@actrix.gen.nz> |
| In reply to | #57499 |
JF Mezei <jfmezei.spamnot@vaxination.ca> wrote: > On 14-03-02 22:52, David Empson wrote: > > > Also not feasible. There are changes in the system libraries and > > frameworks even between minor updates of OS X; typically there are major > > changes between major versions, e.g. restructuring components, changing > > database schemas, APIs, low level tools, etc. > > > Wouldn't the Power PC libraries be "stubs" that convert endianness of > arguments and then call the equivalent intel system routine that then > runs natively ? That may be true for a few of them, but the majority are actually implemented as PowerPC code which does whatever work is required, accesses necessary files, etc. The only cases where native Intel code gets invoked is if the library/framework needs to involve another process or make a call to the kernel. In cases where another process gets invoked, that would typically be an Intel-native process. For example, if a PowerPC process executed something in /usr/bin, the executed code would be Intel. In some cases, the other process might also be PowerPC, e.g. a PowerPC-compiled AppleScript controlling a PowerPC application via Apple Events. In cases where the kernel gets invoked, the kernel itself and all drivers are Intel native, so there is a switch from PowerPC to Intel at the point the application invokes the kernel, and a switch back again when the kernel returns to the application process. I think there is PowerPC stub code which runs in user space (via Rosetta) and transforms the PowerPC kernel call parameters so they are compatible with the Intel kernel, and back again after the kernel returns. It wouldn't surprise me if those stubs no longer exist in the 10.7 or later kernel, which would mean no PowerPC process is able to make kernel calls. > If the Rosetta library dynamically links to Intel libraries, it should > be able to find the same routine on a different version of the OS. PowerPC code cannot dynamically link to Intel libraries. Everything running within the same process must be PowerPC code, including library and framework code executed within the application process. > On the other hand, if the Rosetta libraries are truly PowerPC full > compile of the system code, and Rosetta is the one that translates > execution on the fly, then I can see how it would not be compatible > since data structures used by the Intel OS would not necessarily be the > same (or same location) as those used in a previous version which the > running code would assume. Exactly. > However, i would suspect Apple would have use the "stub" method to call > the native system routines instead of running basically 2 systems > concurrently with 2 sets of routines accessing the same data structures > (which makes for locking and resource allocation problems when you have > 2 processes that control exclusive structures meant to be controlled by > only one (such as window manager). The kernel provided locking mechanisms which could be shared between PowerPC and Intel processes, so this wasn't an issue in 10.4 to 10.6. -- David Empson dempson@actrix.gen.nz
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| From | Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-03-03 18:38 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <TdKdnUlua84ej4jOnZ2dnUVZ_sednZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #57438 |
On 2014.03.02, 19:25 , David Empson wrote:
> Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> On 2014.03.01, 23:28 , David Empson wrote:
>>> Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 2014.03.01, 10:29 , Király wrote:
>>>>> Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>>>>>>> You'll be hard pressed to find much beyond NewsWatcher that will break.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lie.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> No it's not, you fucking troll.
>>>>>
>>>>> There is a *lot* of software that works in Snow Leopard that will not
>>>>> work in Mavericks. For instance, anything PowerPC.
>>>>
>>>> Can you run "Rosetta" OS X under Fusion/Parallels?
>>>
>>> Yes, by running Snow Leopard Server in the virtual machine.
>>
>> Or ordinary Rosetta'd OS X ... perhaps w/o obeying license terms?
>
> Are you suggesting adding Rosetta to 10.7 or later?
No - I meant install Mavericks (for example) and also Snow Leopard (for
example) under virtualization so that one could run the PPC programs there.
I do recall there being some license restrictions of some kinds against
running some OS X under virtualization - but I don't recall the details
- or if Fusion or Parallels prevent it..
--
Those who have reduced our privacy, whether they are state
or commercial actors, prefer that we do not reduce theirs.
- Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.
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