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Windows application on a Mac

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  Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 09:49 -0700
    Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 13:02 -0400
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 11:47 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 11:49 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-04 20:40 +0100
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 19:43 +0000
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 09:23 +0200
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 15:28 +0000
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 19:42 +0200
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 18:10 +0000
          Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 15:50 -0400
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 22:37 +0000
              Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 19:18 -0400
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 23:23 +0000
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 23:07 -0400
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:26 +0000
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 00:21 +0100
                Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 01:37 +0100
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 00:56 +0000
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 02:59 +0100
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:21 -0700
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 03:44 +0100
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:08 -0700
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 00:27 +0100
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 17:15 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-05 17:30 -0700
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:09 -0700
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:17 +0000
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-07-05 01:40 -0400
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-05 00:26 -0700
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 06:57 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-07-05 22:18 -0400
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 23:07 -0400
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 00:57 +0100
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-06 21:56 -0400
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-07 07:35 +0100
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:15 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 03:23 +0100
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-05 14:45 +1200
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 00:11 +0100
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-06 12:41 +1200
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 02:11 +0100
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:06 -0700
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 00:13 +0100
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:14 +0000
              Re: Windows application on a Mac jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2014-07-07 17:36 +1200
            Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 01:27 +0100
              Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 23:07 -0400
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 13:49 +0200
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 13:06 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 22:38 +0000
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:24 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:17 +0000
            Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 01:44 +0100
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:57 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 20:00 -0700
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:20 -0700
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 20:22 -0700
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:28 +0000
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 21:54 -0700
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 21:59 -0700
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 22:11 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:19 -0700
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 01:05 +0100
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac billy@MIX.COM - 2014-07-06 03:10 +0000
                Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 23:07 -0400
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 21:28 -0700
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 04:39 +0000
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 21:41 -0700
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 01:09 +0100
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 17:38 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 01:00 +0100
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-05 03:26 +0000
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 22:02 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:03 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-05 05:23 +0000
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 06:36 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 09:28 +0200
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-06 10:44 +1200
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 23:30 +0000
                Re: Windows application on a Mac billy@MIX.COM - 2014-07-06 03:52 +0000
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 09:10 +0200
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2014-07-05 07:19 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2014-07-07 14:52 +1200
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-07 16:36 +1200
            Re: Windows application on a Mac jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2014-07-07 17:25 +1200
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-07 16:22 +0000
      Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-04 20:38 +0100
        Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 15:50 -0400
          Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 01:22 +0100
            Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 23:07 -0400
    Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 17:05 +0000
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 17:17 +0000
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 11:49 -0700
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 18:55 +0000
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 09:16 +0200
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-07-04 22:36 +0100
          Re: Windows application on a Mac dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-07-05 11:34 +1200
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 16:42 -0700
              Re: Windows application on a Mac dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-07-05 12:04 +1200
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 17:45 -0700
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 00:59 +0000
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 03:08 +0100
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2014-07-05 17:57 +1200
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 15:26 +0000
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 03:11 +0100
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 00:51 +0000
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 00:49 +0000
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 00:46 +0000
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 09:14 +0200
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 04:14 +0200
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:07 +0000
    Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 10:08 -0700
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 11:55 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 11:57 -0700
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 12:12 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 19:39 +0000
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 12:58 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 13:22 -0700
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 22:26 +0000
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 22:25 +0000
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:06 -0700
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 19:45 -0700
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:05 +0000
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:24 -0700
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 20:31 -0700
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:35 +0000
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 21:58 -0700
                              Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:01 -0700
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 21:57 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:01 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 15:50 +0000
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:32 +0000
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 22:01 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:02 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 15:23 +0000
                              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 08:28 -0700
                                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-05 09:27 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 12:50 -0700
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 13:09 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 13:23 -0700
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 14:01 -0700
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 15:07 -0700
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 15:24 -0700
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 22:47 +0000
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:02 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 19:43 -0700
                              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:08 -0700
                                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 20:12 -0700
                                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 21:33 -0700
                                    Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 21:39 -0700
                                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 22:08 -0700
                                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:18 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 03:34 +0000
                              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 22:02 -0700
                                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:04 -0700
                                Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-05 15:24 +0000
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 15:57 -0700
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:03 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 19:44 -0700
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 01:49 +0100
                          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:05 -0700
                            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 19:45 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2014-07-04 14:32 -0700
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 15:01 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Jim Gibson <jimsgibson@gmail.com> - 2014-07-07 16:46 -0700
    Re: Windows application on a Mac Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-07-04 19:14 +0100
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-05 10:38 +1200
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-07-04 23:43 +0100
          Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 01:59 +0100
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:23 -0700
              Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-05 03:48 +0100
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:18 -0700
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 08:56 +0200
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-05 08:01 +0000
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-05 14:20 +0200
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-05 22:55 +0000
    Re: Windows application on a Mac Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2014-07-04 14:13 -0700
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 14:58 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-04 18:05 -0400
          Re: Windows application on a Mac billy@MIX.COM - 2014-07-06 00:20 +0000
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 22:41 +0000
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:26 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2014-07-04 19:54 -0700
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:19 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2014-07-04 21:03 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-05 03:44 +0000
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2014-07-04 21:11 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-05 05:29 +0000
              Re: Windows application on a Mac John <Man@the.keyboard> - 2014-07-06 01:39 +0100
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-06 14:26 +1200
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-05 10:39 +1200
    Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-04 22:10 +0000
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 15:26 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-04 22:52 +0000
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:11 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 19:47 -0700
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 20:15 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 20:19 -0700
                  Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 21:36 -0700
                    Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 21:40 -0700
                      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 22:09 -0700
                        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:18 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 15:59 -0700
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-04 19:13 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 19:48 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-07-05 03:51 +0000
    Re: Windows application on a Mac Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-07-05 01:30 -0400
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-04 22:32 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 06:54 -0700
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-07-05 22:15 -0400
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Baker <alangbaker@telus.net> - 2014-07-05 19:19 -0700
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 06:43 -0700
    Re: Windows application on a Mac cb <cb@aol.com> - 2014-07-05 12:39 +0200
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-07-05 06:53 -0400
        Re: Windows application on a Mac cb <cb@aol.com> - 2014-07-05 14:53 +0200
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 07:04 -0700
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-07-05 22:14 -0400
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 20:14 -0700
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 07:00 -0700
    Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-07-05 06:59 -0400
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-05 07:06 -0700
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-07-06 08:35 -0400
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-07-06 06:54 -0700
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-07-06 12:55 -0400
    Re: Windows application on a Mac Mitch Bujard <nonono@schoolfonts.com> - 2014-07-16 17:40 -0400
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-07-17 09:39 -0400
      Re: Windows application on a Mac Juan I. Cahis <jiclbchSINBASURA@attglobal.net> - 2014-07-17 09:22 -0500
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-07-17 15:23 +0000
        Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-18 09:08 +1200
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2014-07-17 22:41 +0100
          Re: Windows application on a Mac Juan I. Cahis <jiclbchSINBASURA@attglobal.net> - 2014-07-21 11:07 -0400
            Re: Windows application on a Mac Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2014-07-22 09:47 +1200
              Re: Windows application on a Mac Juan I. Cahis <jiclbchSINBASURA@attglobal.net> - 2014-07-26 11:35 -0400
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Michael Vilain <vilain@NOspamcop.net> - 2014-07-26 10:17 -0700
                Re: Windows application on a Mac Laszlo Lebrun <lazlo_lebrun@googlemail.com> - 2014-07-27 17:55 +0200

Page 9 of 12 — ← Prev page 1 … 7 8 [9] 10 11 12  Next page →

#61824

On Fri, 04 Jul 2014 15:24:30 -0700, Michelle Steiner
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

>In article <lp78i7$a3k$1@news.datemas.de>, Alan Baker
><alangbaker@telus.net> wrote:
>
>> On 2014-07-04 21:01:51 +0000, Michelle Steiner said:
>> 
>> > In article <lp72g4$du2$1@news.datemas.de>, Alan Baker
>> > <alangbaker@telus.net> wrote:
>> > 
>> >>> It doesn't have to say it; if you don't have the application to be
>> >>> installed, you can't install it.  The only legal way for me to have the
>> >>> application is for me to purchase it.
>> >>> 
>> >>> What is so hard to understand about that?
>> >> 
>> >> Do you have the application?
>> > 
>> > No, not yet.
>> > 
>> >> If you do, then this discussion makes sense.
>> >> 
>> >> If you don't, why does it matter WHAT Windows setup you choose?
>> > 
>> > Because when I get it, I'd like to know what else, if anything, I'd
>> > need to get.
>> 
>> And you've been told.
>
>I've been told conflicting information, or reiteration of information I
>already knew.
>
>> There is nothing about using CrossOver that requires anything more than 
>> having the installer, and that's the same as you'd need for a VM 
>> solution, or for Boot Camp.
>
>But you made it sound that I could install it without having to buy it,
>and when I said that I would have to buy it, you got defensive and said
>that all I needed was an installer, implicitly denying that I would
>have to buy it.

 Uh, CrossOver do a 14-day free trial.
 It used to be unlimited but slightly crippled. I had the crippled
version on the wife's Mac for ages before I decided to buy it. 
 http://www.codeweavers.com/products/crossover-mac/download/
                                                     hth,
                                                         John

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#61835

In article <2nier95e1fin43u8ahmmfs2qkr2b8djbto@4ax.com>, John
<Man@the.keyboard> wrote:

> >But you made it sound that I could install it without having to buy it,
> >and when I said that I would have to buy it, you got defensive and said
> >that all I needed was an installer, implicitly denying that I would
> >have to buy it.
> 
>  Uh, CrossOver do a 14-day free trial.
>  It used to be unlimited but slightly crippled. I had the crippled
> version on the wife's Mac for ages before I decided to buy it. 

So?  That has nothing to do with what I wrote.  Furthermore if you had
been reading the whole thread, you'd know that I have a purchased
version of Crossover.

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#61854

On 2014-07-05 02:05:10 +0000, Michelle Steiner said:

> In article <2nier95e1fin43u8ahmmfs2qkr2b8djbto@4ax.com>, John
> <Man@the.keyboard> wrote:
> 
>>> But you made it sound that I could install it without having to buy it,
>>> and when I said that I would have to buy it, you got defensive and said
>>> that all I needed was an installer, implicitly denying that I would
>>> have to buy it.
>> 
>> Uh, CrossOver do a 14-day free trial.
>> It used to be unlimited but slightly crippled. I had the crippled
>> version on the wife's Mac for ages before I decided to buy it.
> 
> So?  That has nothing to do with what I wrote.  Furthermore if you had
> been reading the whole thread, you'd know that I have a purchased
> version of Crossover.

Which has nothing to do with you claim that something at the 
CodeWeavers site suggested you have to buy software to install it using 
CrossOver.

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#61782

On 2014-07-04 19:12:06 +0000, Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> said:

> In article <lp6tfl$53f$2@news.datemas.de>, Alan Baker
> <alangbaker@telus.net> wrote:
> 
>> On 2014-07-04 18:55:56 +0000, Michelle Steiner said:
>> 
>>> In article <lp6n1g$pi1$1@news.datemas.de>, Alan Baker
>>> <alangbaker@telus.net> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> And...
>>>> 
>>>> <http://www.codeweavers.com/compatibility/browse/name/?app_id=6694>
>>> 
>>> I've looked into that; you have to buy Bridge Master 2000 in order to
>>> do that.
>> 
>> What do you mean?
>> 
>> Do you have an installer for Bridge Master 2000? Then you can install it.
> 
> I mean that the steps involved in that web site requires me to have to
> have bought Bridge Master 2000 in order to install it.

I haven't played bridge since my college days way back in the fog of 
time, so just out of interest I did some exploring and found this, 
which might, or might not be of use or interest to you as a Mac user.
http://www.greatgameproducts.com/our-products/BridgeBaron

-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

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#61788

In article <2014070414323273557-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

> I haven't played bridge since my college days way back in the fog of 
> time, so just out of interest I did some exploring and found this, 
> which might, or might not be of use or interest to you as a Mac user.
> http://www.greatgameproducts.com/our-products/BridgeBaron

Thanks.  It appears to be a bidding program; Bridge Master 2000 is
concerned with play of the hand.  But BB24 does bear looking into.

-- Michelle

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#62067

In article <040720141501065974%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> In article <2014070414323273557-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
> Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:
> 
> > I haven't played bridge since my college days way back in the fog of 
> > time, so just out of interest I did some exploring and found this, 
> > which might, or might not be of use or interest to you as a Mac user.
> > http://www.greatgameproducts.com/our-products/BridgeBaron
> 
> Thanks.  It appears to be a bidding program; Bridge Master 2000 is
> concerned with play of the hand.  But BB24 does bear looking into.

I've got Bridge Baron, although I don't use it very much. It does both
bidding and play.

-- 
Jim Gibson

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#61749

In article <040720140949213663%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
> desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
> that runs only on Windows.
> 
> What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
> Crossover?

Virtual Box is free. I run Win7 in it. Seems to work fine.

-- 
"Once you adopt the unix paradigm, the variants cease to be a problem - you
bitch, of course, but that's because bitching is fun, unlike M$ OS's, where 
bitching is required to keep your head from exploding." - S Stremler in afc

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#61799

In article <040720141914430735%timstreater@greenbee.net>, Tim Streater
<timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
> In article <040720140949213663%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
> <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> > 
> > I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
> > desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
> > that runs only on Windows.
> > 
> > What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
> > Crossover?
> 
> Virtual Box is free. I run Win7 in it. Seems to work fine.

Virtual Box (and a couple of other freeware / shareware options) are
more difficult to set-up for novice users. Parallels Desktop and VMWare
Fusion are much more professional applications which are easi*er*, not
necessarily easy, to set-up.

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#61804

In article <050720141038069234%YourName@YourISP.com>, Your Name
<YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:

> In article <040720141914430735%timstreater@greenbee.net>, Tim Streater
> <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
> > In article <040720140949213663%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
> > <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> > > 
> > > I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
> > > desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
> > > that runs only on Windows.
> > > 
> > > What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
> > > Crossover?
> > 
> > Virtual Box is free. I run Win7 in it. Seems to work fine.
> 
> Virtual Box (and a couple of other freeware / shareware options) are
> more difficult to set-up for novice users. Parallels Desktop and VMWare
> Fusion are much more professional applications which are easi*er*, not
> necessarily easy, to set-up.

Michelle doesn't come across as a novice user.

-- 
"The idea that Bill Gates has appeared like a knight in shining armour to
 lead all customers out of a mire of technological chaos neatly ignores 
 the fact that it was he who, by peddling second-rate technology, led them
 into it in the first place."                             - Douglas Adams

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#61829

On Fri, 04 Jul 2014 23:43:13 +0100, Tim Streater
<timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:

>In article <050720141038069234%YourName@YourISP.com>, Your Name
><YourName@YourISP.com> wrote:
>
>> In article <040720141914430735%timstreater@greenbee.net>, Tim Streater
>> <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
>> > In article <040720140949213663%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
>> > <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>> > > 
>> > > I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
>> > > desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
>> > > that runs only on Windows.
>> > > 
>> > > What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
>> > > Crossover?
>> > 
>> > Virtual Box is free. I run Win7 in it. Seems to work fine.
>> 
>> Virtual Box (and a couple of other freeware / shareware options) are
>> more difficult to set-up for novice users. Parallels Desktop and VMWare
>> Fusion are much more professional applications which are easi*er*, not
>> necessarily easy, to set-up.
>
>Michelle doesn't come across as a novice user.

 You are correct, that she is *not*. She has helped me with Mac stuff
on occasion  and I would trust her advice as I would that of almost
any skilled and experienced Mac user with the possible exception of
nospam.
 I wouldn't trust him to hit the urinal.
 Michelle doesn't seem to use Windows very often but on Macs she's hot
stuff. 
                               J.  

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#61845

In article <pvier9po2ek06rhvrp985org7ncgsap8lt@4ax.com>, John
<Man@the.keyboard> wrote:

>  Michelle doesn't seem to use Windows very often but on Macs she's hot
> stuff. 

Michelle doesn't use Windows at all.

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#61858

On Fri, 04 Jul 2014 19:23:42 -0700, Michelle Steiner
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

>In article <pvier9po2ek06rhvrp985org7ncgsap8lt@4ax.com>, John
><Man@the.keyboard> wrote:
>
>>  Michelle doesn't seem to use Windows very often but on Macs she's hot
>> stuff. 
>
>Michelle doesn't use Windows at all.

 Well, I would call that "not very often". When I saw that response,
my first thought was to ask if you'd like to be taught how to use
Windows and the softwares that go with it but you seem to be annoyed
with me for some reason so I won't make the offer.
 My loss, I suppose.
 Goodbye.
                    J.  

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#61888

In article <hlper9l688fur1addndneuvn4kmjlo3d1s@4ax.com>, John
<Man@the.keyboard> wrote:

> >>  Michelle doesn't seem to use Windows very often but on Macs she's hot
> >> stuff. 
> >
> >Michelle doesn't use Windows at all.
> 
>  Well, I would call that "not very often". When I saw that response,
> my first thought was to ask if you'd like to be taught how to use
> Windows and the softwares that go with it 

No need; I wrote that in the present tense.  I guess that I should have
said that I haven't used windows at all since I retired in 2001.  I had
to use Windows at times at work.

> but you seem to be annoyed with me for some reason so I won't make the offer.

Whatever.

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#61942

On 2014-07-04, Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
> In article <040720140949213663%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
><michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>
>> I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
>> desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
>> that runs only on Windows.
>> 
>> What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
>> Crossover?
>
> Virtual Box is free. I run Win7 in it. Seems to work fine.

I've also had Windows 8 running in VirtualBox on my Mac.  The only problem
with that was the ever ballooning size of the virtual disk.

All three VM products will by default create a virtual disk as a sparse
image so you can create it with say, 50GB, but it will only expand to that
size if you put that much data on the disk.  Windows 8 has different ideas
and will happily keep on expanding the amount used towards the maximum
allocation.  I am reasonably confident that this is down to the Windows 8
defragger; I have seen it expand by a gigabyte just by booting and leaving
it running for a couple of hours, even when inside Windows I haven't added
any files.

I initially made the mistake of allocating 100 GB to Windows 8 under 
VirtualBox and it had got as far as 70GB physical allocation by the time
I migrated it to VMware Fusion, even though inside Windows only 25GB or
so was used.

VMware Fusion has a neat bit of functionality here.  It can determine how
much of the physical space consumed is unused by Windows and release it. 
I've no idea how it does this but it presumably has enough knowledge about
NTFS to do it quite nicely.

When I migrated Windows 8 from VirtualBox to VMware I managed to use that
functionality to shrink the physical space used to about 25 GB.

This functionality isn't there for Linux clients (i.e. I've never seen it
offered), but there you are free to reorganise disks without running into
the Windows licence reactivation palaver.

Backups are another consideration. You really don't want TM chugging away
at those huge virtual disks all the time, and there's the problem of
consistency in the event of a restore.  From the latter point of view
you are best off shutting down the VM and then backing up.  Here both
VMware and Parallels offer the option of setting the virtual disks to
2GB chunks, and backups will only pick up the modified ones.

VMware's advice in this area is to exclude your VM disk directory from
TM backups and periodically shut down the VM and copy the lot to a
directory which is backed up.  In their marketing blurb Parallels claim
some sort of integration with TM but when I looked carefully at their
website they were giving pretty much the same advice as VMware.

I have no idea how TM works with BootCamp partitions.  Can anyone else
offer advice on that please?

-- 
Big Data is any data that is expensive to manage and hard to extract
value from.                                      -- Michael Franklin

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#61952

Okay, so one time? In band camp? Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> was all, like: 
 --> 	 Sat, 5 Jul 2014 08:56:49 +0200 <h6kk8b-hce2.ln1@news.chingola.ch>
> On 2014-07-04, Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
>> In article <040720140949213663%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
>><michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>>
>>> I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
>>> desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
>>> that runs only on Windows.
>>> 
>>> What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
>>> Crossover?
>>
>> Virtual Box is free. I run Win7 in it. Seems to work fine.

> I've also had Windows 8 running in VirtualBox on my Mac.  The only problem
> with that was the ever ballooning size of the virtual disk.

That happens with Parallels and VMWare and, hell, a "real PC" install of
Windows.

-- 
And she was looking at herself
And things were looking like a movie
She had a pleasant elevation
She's moving out in all directions

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#61982

On 2014-07-05, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> Okay, so one time? In band camp? Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> was all, like: 
>  --> 	 Sat, 5 Jul 2014 08:56:49 +0200 <h6kk8b-hce2.ln1@news.chingola.ch>
>> On 2014-07-04, Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
>>> In article <040720140949213663%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
>>><michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
>>>> desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
>>>> that runs only on Windows.
>>>> 
>>>> What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
>>>> Crossover?
>>>
>>> Virtual Box is free. I run Win7 in it. Seems to work fine.
>
>> I've also had Windows 8 running in VirtualBox on my Mac.  The only problem
>> with that was the ever ballooning size of the virtual disk.
>
> That happens with Parallels and VMWare and, hell, a "real PC" install of
> Windows.

No, I'm talking about the physical space consumed by the virtual disk
*far exceeding* the actual space required within the VM client.  This 
*didn't happen* on previous versions of Windows.

Fortunately VMware Fusion allows you to reclaim this real disk space.

-- 
Big Data is any data that is expensive to manage and hard to extract
value from.                                      -- Michael Franklin

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#61990

Okay, so one time? In band camp? Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> was all, like: 
 --> 	 Sat, 5 Jul 2014 14:20:01 +0200 <h47l8b-d5r2.ln1@news.chingola.ch>
> On 2014-07-05, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>> Okay, so one time? In band camp? Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> was all, like: 
>>  --> 	 Sat, 5 Jul 2014 08:56:49 +0200 <h6kk8b-hce2.ln1@news.chingola.ch>
>>> On 2014-07-04, Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:
>>>> In article <040720140949213663%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
>>>><michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
>>>>> desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
>>>>> that runs only on Windows.
>>>>> 
>>>>> What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
>>>>> Crossover?
>>>>
>>>> Virtual Box is free. I run Win7 in it. Seems to work fine.
>>
>>> I've also had Windows 8 running in VirtualBox on my Mac.  The only problem
>>> with that was the ever ballooning size of the virtual disk.
>>
>> That happens with Parallels and VMWare and, hell, a "real PC" install of
>> Windows.

> No, I'm talking about the physical space consumed by the virtual disk
> *far exceeding* the actual space required within the VM client.

Yes. So am I.

> This *didn't happen* on previous versions of Windows.

It happened in Windows 7.

> Fortunately VMware Fusion allows you to reclaim this real disk space.

Not really. The reason my mom stopped using VMWare Fusion was because her
virtual disk grew from 7.2GB on initial setup (minimal Win 7 install
with Lotus and Word Perfect) to 44GB (filling her laptop's drive) and
when she contact VMWare about fixing this they claimed it was normal.
She tried removing snapshot and rollbacks and who the hell knows what
else, but the virtual drive remained at 44GB.

And, it was normal. My Dull PC with Windows 7 initially used about 8GB
total, and then another 22GB for WoW. Within 6 months, it was using 60GB
of hard drive despite my having installed absolutely nothing on the
computer. I didn't investigate further since it was installed on a 1.5TB
drive and I honestly didn't care.

-- 
Not every flower can say love, but a rose can. Not every plant
survives thirst, but a cactus can. Not every vegetable can read, but
bless it, look at you, having a little go.

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#61781

On 2014-07-04 16:49:21 +0000, Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> said:

> I've pretty much been ignoring this topic, but now I have a strong
> desire to run an application (BridgeMaster 2000, if you're curious)
> that runs only on Windows.
> 
> What would be my best option:  Boot Camp, Parallels, VMware Fusion,
> Crossover?
> 
> I know that the biggest disadvantage for running Boot Camp is that I'd
> have to reboot the computer every time I want to switch between OSes.
> And both Parallels and Fusion cost extra money.  I have Crossover
> because it came in one of those bundles that are sometimes offered, so
> price isn't a problem with it, but I'm all that convinced that it would
> be the best way to go.

My personal experience moves me into the VMWare Fusion camp.


-- 
Regards,

Savageduck

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#61787

In article <2014070414135544175-savageduck1@REMOVESPAMmecom>,
Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> wrote:

> My personal experience moves me into the VMWare Fusion camp.

Why?

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#61789

In article <040720141458205998%michelle@michelle.org>, Michelle Steiner
<michelle@michelle.org> wrote:

> > My personal experience moves me into the VMWare Fusion camp.
> 
> Why?

i don't know about his experience, but here are some things about
parallels that should rule it out as a contender:

it installed adware:
<http://mjtsai.com/blog/2012/07/24/turning-off-ads-in-parallels/>

it installed parallels access without permission:
<http://www.tuaw.com/2013/09/09/parallels-responds-to-slashdot-user-conc
erns-over-desktop-9-inst>

they asked beta testers to post positive feedback
<http://itnerd.wordpress.com/2009/02/15/parallels-asking-beta-testers-fo
r-positive-reviews-on-amazon-and-the-apple-store-whats-wrong-with-this-p
icture/>

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