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Groups > comp.sys.mac.comm > #1723 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Michelle Steiner <email@michelle@michelle.org> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2013-10-27 09:41 -0700 |
| Last post | 2015-03-29 13:03 +1300 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 289 — 45 participants |
Back to article view | Back to comp.sys.mac.comm
Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <email@michelle@michelle.org> - 2013-10-27 09:41 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-27 11:56 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Matti Haveri <nospam@here.invalid> - 2014-02-16 15:20 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Davoud <star@sky.net> - 2013-10-27 13:01 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-27 12:36 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-27 14:41 -0500
Re: Newsreaders snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) - 2013-10-27 19:58 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-27 15:05 -0500
Re: Newsreaders snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) - 2013-10-27 20:42 +0000
Re: Newsreaders dorayme <dorayme@optusnet.com.au> - 2013-10-28 10:23 +1100
Thoth (not) breaking long URL (was: Newsreaders) "J.P. Kuypers" <Jean-Pierre.Kuypers@adresse.invalid> - 2013-10-28 09:37 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2013-10-27 19:57 +0000
Re: Newsreaders gtr <xxx@yyy.zzz> - 2013-10-27 19:16 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-28 08:21 -0500
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-28 10:58 +1300
Re: Newsreaders M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> - 2013-10-27 19:24 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-10-27 23:42 +0000
Re: Newsreaders M-M <nospam.m-m@ny.more> - 2013-10-27 20:09 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-27 19:16 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-10-28 00:16 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-28 08:11 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-10-28 13:54 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-28 09:01 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-29 09:09 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-28 20:44 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-28 01:26 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-27 21:04 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-28 02:11 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-27 22:01 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-28 03:40 +0000
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-28 17:26 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-28 08:17 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-28 08:16 -0500
Re: Newsreaders "J.P. Kuypers" <Jean-Pierre.Kuypers@adresse.invalid> - 2013-10-28 14:20 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-28 13:39 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-28 08:43 -0500
Re: Newsreaders "J.P. Kuypers" <Jean-Pierre.Kuypers@adresse.invalid> - 2013-11-15 15:29 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-11-15 09:26 -0600
Re: Newsreaders Ted Lee <tmplee@mr.net> - 2013-10-27 20:30 -0500
Re: Newsreaders AV3 <arvimide@earthlink.net> - 2013-10-28 11:02 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Wes Groleau <Groleau+news@FreeShell.org> - 2013-10-28 00:48 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-28 15:16 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-28 15:16 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-28 15:21 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <email@michelle@michelle.org> - 2013-10-28 08:31 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> - 2013-10-28 08:57 -0700
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-29 05:25 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-29 09:22 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-28 21:22 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-29 13:29 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-29 01:43 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Martin Τrautmann <t-usenet@gmx.net> - 2013-10-29 05:04 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-29 18:25 +1300
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2013-10-29 01:33 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Martin Τrautmann <t-usenet@gmx.net> - 2013-10-29 05:37 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-29 19:25 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Martin Τrautmann <t-usenet@gmx.net> - 2013-10-29 07:25 +0000
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2013-10-29 04:07 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Martin Τrautmann <t-usenet@gmx.net> - 2013-10-29 09:00 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-29 17:01 +0000
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-30 10:24 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-30 14:39 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-30 09:26 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-29 21:35 +0000
Re: Newsreaders bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2013-10-29 16:28 -0700
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-30 13:33 +1300
Re: Newsreaders bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2013-10-29 23:14 -0700
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-30 21:43 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-30 12:39 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-30 14:39 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-31 09:31 +1300
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-31 08:52 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-30 19:36 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-30 12:42 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-30 14:39 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-29 17:01 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Erilar <drache@chibardun.netinvalid> - 2013-10-29 17:01 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-30 09:29 +1300
Re: Newsreaders "D.F. Manno" <dfmanno@mail.com> - 2013-10-30 16:44 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-30 23:22 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Your Name <YourName@YourISP.com> - 2013-10-31 13:15 +1300
Re: Newsreaders "J.P. Kuypers" <Jean-Pierre.Kuypers@adresse.invalid> - 2013-10-29 10:10 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Lloyd <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-29 08:36 -0500
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-30 10:25 +1300
Re: Newsreaders spamfalle2@arcor.de (Marc Stibane) - 2013-11-05 20:31 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Matti Haveri <nospam@here.invalid> - 2014-02-08 00:49 +0200
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2014-02-07 18:42 -0600
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-08 02:05 +0000
Re: Newsreaders me@home.spamsucks.ca (Király) - 2014-02-08 16:12 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2014-02-08 15:21 -0600
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2014-02-08 20:01 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-02-08 18:09 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2014-02-08 21:48 -0600
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2014-02-08 20:51 -0600
Re: Newsreaders Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2014-02-28 12:19 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-09 01:40 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2014-02-08 21:50 -0600
Re: Newsreaders Matti Haveri <nospam@here.invalid> - 2014-02-09 19:26 +0200
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-09 17:31 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-09 23:22 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-09 23:44 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-02-10 02:01 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2014-02-10 10:00 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-11 13:27 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2014-02-11 09:51 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-11 18:55 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-11 23:28 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2014-02-09 19:40 -0600
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-10 04:34 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-02-08 02:04 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-08 03:33 +0000
Re: Newsreaders android <here@there.was> - 2014-02-09 09:50 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Matti Haveri <nospam@here.invalid> - 2014-02-09 16:19 +0200
Re: Newsreaders android <here@there.was> - 2014-02-09 09:53 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-27 04:07 -0700
Re: Newsreaders spamfalle2@arcor.de (Marc Stibane) - 2015-03-27 14:45 +0100
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-27 14:18 +0000
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-29 11:44 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 22:50 +0000
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-29 13:03 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 00:30 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-03-27 14:27 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-27 13:10 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-27 20:14 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-28 01:26 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 14:30 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-29 01:41 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 13:22 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <hshubs@foxtrot.local> - 2015-03-29 19:43 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2015-03-28 06:29 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-03-28 14:47 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 20:36 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-28 21:27 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-03-28 19:22 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 23:47 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 01:26 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 14:51 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2015-03-28 14:00 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 20:30 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-03-28 17:08 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 21:13 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-03-28 19:10 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 23:46 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-29 01:45 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 13:23 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "D.F. Manno" <dfmanno@mail.com> - 2015-03-28 17:09 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 21:18 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-28 21:29 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2015-03-28 20:15 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 00:30 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2015-03-28 21:28 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 13:21 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 13:15 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2015-03-29 16:37 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 20:44 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "M. John Matlaw" <nouser@invalid.com> - 2015-03-29 17:58 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 00:07 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-28 21:26 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 22:17 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 01:25 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 12:53 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 16:46 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 17:32 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-27 22:33 +0000
Re: Newsreaders tmo1138 <tmo1138@tmo1138.com> - 2015-03-28 01:33 +0000
Re: Newsreaders TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft@me.com> - 2015-03-27 22:16 -0500
Re: Newsreaders tmo1138 <tmo1138@tmo1138.com> - 2015-03-28 05:10 +0000
Re: Newsreaders bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2015-03-27 21:03 -0700
Re: Newsreaders tmo1138 <tmo1138@tmo1138.com> - 2015-03-28 05:11 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-28 06:12 +0000
Re: Newsreaders bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2015-03-28 10:32 -0700
Re: Newsreaders DaveC <not@home.cow> - 2015-03-28 12:53 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-28 21:18 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 22:16 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 01:27 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 12:56 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 16:49 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 17:33 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 18:25 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-29 02:00 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 13:30 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <hshubs@foxtrot.local> - 2015-03-29 19:32 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 20:43 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 03:16 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 15:22 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-03-29 14:40 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 03:23 +0000
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-30 00:02 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-03-29 21:38 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 07:43 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-03-30 08:30 -0700
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-30 11:36 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 20:18 +0000
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-30 16:34 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 07:20 +0000
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-04-01 20:46 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-04-01 09:37 -0700
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-04-01 04:22 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-30 21:22 +0000
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-31 13:53 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-31 01:02 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 07:23 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "D.F. Manno" <dfmanno@mail.com> - 2015-03-30 21:49 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 07:24 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-04-01 09:39 -0700
Re: Newsreaders spamfalle2@arcor.de (Marc Stibane) - 2015-04-20 20:46 +0200
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-04-20 14:52 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-04-20 18:53 +0000
Re: Newsreaders dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-04-21 10:45 +1200
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-04-21 02:08 +0000
Re: Newsreaders dempson@actrix.gen.nz (David Empson) - 2015-04-21 15:07 +1200
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-04-21 04:22 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-04-21 11:58 -0500
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-04-21 13:05 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-04-21 23:49 +0000
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-04-21 20:53 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-04-22 03:30 +0000
Re: Newsreaders spamfalle2@arcor.de (Marc Stibane) - 2015-04-22 12:03 +0200
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-04-22 17:32 -0500
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-04-23 18:08 +1200
Re: Newsreaders Gordon Sande <Gordon.Sande@gmail.com> - 2015-04-20 17:05 -0300
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-04-21 05:41 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-03-30 23:13 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 15:32 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 20:20 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 20:38 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-03-30 23:08 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-30 10:01 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 20:24 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-03-30 14:54 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 15:27 +0000
Re: Newsreaders "D.F. Manno" <dfmanno@mail.com> - 2015-03-30 21:43 -0400
Re: Newsreaders "D.F. Manno" <dfmanno@mail.com> - 2015-03-30 21:45 -0400
Re: Newsreaders bill van <billvan@delete.shaw.ca> - 2015-03-30 19:46 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-03-31 14:55 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 07:30 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 16:43 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <hshubs@foxtrot.local> - 2015-03-29 19:36 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-03-29 23:36 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 07:39 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 15:35 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 20:14 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 20:35 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-03-30 22:59 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 07:18 +0000
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-04-01 04:22 -0400
Re: Newsreaders TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft@me.com> - 2015-04-01 08:11 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 23:59 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-04-02 02:14 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-04-01 09:05 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-04-01 16:51 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-04-01 17:51 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-02 00:03 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-04-01 17:06 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-03-30 22:56 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-03-30 15:17 +0000
Re: Newsreaders nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2015-03-30 11:22 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 15:38 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-03-30 20:27 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 20:39 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 07:26 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-30 21:17 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> - 2015-03-30 23:04 -0500
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 07:27 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> - 2015-03-31 14:28 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Warren Oates <warren.oates@gmail.com> - 2015-03-31 12:41 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> - 2015-04-01 07:28 +0000
Re: Newsreaders tmo1138 <tmo1138@tmo1138.com> - 2015-04-01 23:47 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-30 15:33 +0000
Re: Newsreaders FPP <fredp151@gmail.com> - 2015-03-28 01:49 -0400
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-29 11:44 +1300
Re: Newsreaders DaveC <not@home.cow> - 2015-03-28 09:03 -0700
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-29 11:44 +1300
Re: Newsreaders gtr <xxx@yyy.zzz> - 2015-03-28 09:17 -0700
Re: Newsreaders sctvguy1 <sctvguy1@invalid.net> - 2015-03-28 20:52 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-03-28 16:00 -0700
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-28 23:06 +0000
Re: Newsreaders sctvguy1 <sctvguy1@invalid.net> - 2015-03-29 03:00 +0000
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-29 23:51 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2015-03-29 12:48 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Buster Friendly <lah@de.da.ru.ru> - 2015-03-29 09:01 -0400
Re: Newsreaders "J.P. Kuypers" <Jean-Pierre.Kuypers@adresse.invalid> - 2015-03-29 15:33 +0200
Re: Newsreaders Buster Friendly <lah@de.da.ru.ru> - 2015-03-29 09:40 -0400
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 17:04 +0000
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-30 13:37 +1300
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-29 13:03 +1300
Re: Newsreaders Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2015-03-29 01:28 +0000
Re: Newsreaders Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2015-03-28 15:59 -0700
Re: Newsreaders jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2015-03-29 13:03 +1300
Page 13 of 15 — ← Prev page 1 … 11 12 [13] 14 15 Next page →
| From | Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 15:35 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <cnt8ptFbj9lU5@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #2643 |
On 2015-03-30, Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > > The only reason MT-NW doesn't work is because Apple broke it by changing > the environment in such a way as to break backward compatability with > MT-NW and other such programs. It's EXACTLY Apple's fault, and no others'. Cry me a river. It doesn't seem to have posed problems for many other Usenet clients that have existed int he same time frame. Those developers adjusted to the changes rather than ignoring them, which is what got MT-NW where it is today. -- E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter. I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead. JR
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| From | Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 20:14 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnmhjblp.kg7.howard@foxtrot.local> |
| In reply to | #2655 |
On 2015-03-30, Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote: > Cry me a river. It doesn't seem to have posed problems for many other > Usenet clients that have existed int he same time frame. Those > developers adjusted to the changes rather than ignoring them, which is > what got MT-NW where it is today. Not all software is being maintained. Nevertheless, even that software remains in use. It's not for Apple to break it. Quite the reverse. Breaking software leads to people going to other vendors, since they have no reason to stay.
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| From | Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 20:35 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <cntqcaFg7qmU4@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #2659 |
On 2015-03-30, Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > On 2015-03-30, Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote: >> Cry me a river. It doesn't seem to have posed problems for many other >> Usenet clients that have existed int he same time frame. Those >> developers adjusted to the changes rather than ignoring them, which is >> what got MT-NW where it is today. > > Not all software is being maintained. Nevertheless, even that software > remains in use. It's not for Apple to break it. You're full of it. Apple didn't break anything. MT-NewsWatcher was last updated seven years ago in 2008, when OS X 10.5 was current. MT-NewsWatcher then continued to work on major new OS X operating system versions (10.6, 10.7, and 10.8) until 2013 when 10.9 was released without Open Transport support. Apple didn't force anyone to upgrade their operating system. And anyone who wishes can still run MT-NW on any OS X operating system version from classic Mac OS to OS X 10.8. > Quite the reverse. Breaking software leads to people going to other > vendors, since they have no reason to stay. Don't let the door hit your ass on the way out. You and your incredibly silly attitude certainly won't be missed here. -- E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter. I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead. JR
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| From | Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 22:59 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <slrnmhk6sb.feb.timmcn@sugaree-2.local> |
| In reply to | #2659 |
On 30 Mar 2015 20:14:49 GMT, Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > On 2015-03-30, Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote: >> Cry me a river. It doesn't seem to have posed problems for many other >> Usenet clients that have existed int he same time frame. Those >> developers adjusted to the changes rather than ignoring them, which >> is what got MT-NW where it is today. > > Not all software is being maintained. Nevertheless, even that > software remains in use. It's not for Apple to break it. Quite the > reverse. Breaking software leads to people going to other vendors, > since they have no reason to stay. LOL! Yer gonna go use Linux because MT-NW got broken? Or Windows 8.1? Maybe dump computers altogether and buy n Android phablet? Howard, I've known you on Usenet for seems like 20 years- what's gotten into you?
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| From | Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-01 07:18 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnmhn6te.l7n.howard@foxtrot.local> |
| In reply to | #2677 |
On 2015-03-31, Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote: > LOL! Yer gonna go use Linux because MT-NW got broken? Or Windows 8.1? > Maybe dump computers altogether and buy n Android phablet? Howard, I've > known you on Usenet for seems like 20 years- what's gotten into you? That and other reasons. I've been moving in that direction for years, but until recently it was fairly low priority. Now... I don't like where Apple is taking things. I've said that before, long since. Not liking the Dock was just part of it. I have zero interest in iOS, yet its "features" are being integrated into Mac OS bit by bit. I have tried an iPhone. Got one last June, when I started working at Apple. As soon as I left Apple, I went back to my Nexus 4. "closed garden" vs "open garden". My iPhone 5s is now unused, except a little as an iPod, I suppose. But I mainly use it to play Monopoly. And I'm stuck paying for it for the next 15 months. That's another problem I've never had with my Nexus 4. The main problem I see with using Linux as a desktop OS is that there's no regular user-level commercial software for it. Lots of custom software, and lots of server software, sure. If Microsoft and Adobe and others started developing for Linux, I'd be there in an instant. Things like GIMP don't cut it. Volunteer development for these things just doesn't work, because as soon as someone loses interest, such as during debugging of those last, tricky, hard-to-fix bugs, the software stops being fixed. And the programmer goes on to the next interesting feature. So we end up with lots of half-assed software with lots of buggy features. That's Linux' worst problem, IMnsHO. It basically won the war for lots of server-side use, but desktop... not in the near future. And I still don't like the Dock. Accustomed to it, but that's all.
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| From | nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-01 04:22 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <010420150422449395%nospam@nospam.invalid> |
| In reply to | #2684 |
In article <slrnmhn6te.l7n.howard@foxtrot.local>, Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > I have zero interest in iOS, yet its "features" are being integrated into Mac > OS bit by bit. I have tried an iPhone. Got one last June, when I started > working at Apple. As soon as I left Apple, I went back to my Nexus 4. > "closed garden" vs "open garden". My iPhone 5s is now unused, except a little > as an iPod, I suppose. But I mainly use it to play Monopoly. And I'm stuck > paying for it for the next 15 months. That's another problem I've never had > with my Nexus 4. don't blame apple for signing a 2 year contract. iphones are available off-contract and android phones are available on-contract. users can choose which plan works best. > The main problem I see with using Linux as a desktop OS is that there's no > regular user-level commercial software for it. exactly. > Lots of custom software, and > lots of server software, sure. If Microsoft and Adobe and others started > developing for Linux, I'd be there in an instant. not going to happen since there aren't enough users to justify it > Things like GIMP don't cut > it. Volunteer development for these things just doesn't work, because as soon > as someone loses interest, such as during debugging of those last, tricky, > hard-to-fix bugs, the software stops being fixed. And the programmer goes on > to the next interesting feature. So we end up with lots of half-assed > software with lots of buggy features. That's Linux' worst problem, IMnsHO. > It basically won the war for lots of server-side use, but desktop... not in > the near future. > > And I still don't like the Dock. Accustomed to it, but that's all. disable it and use dragthing. or nothing.
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| From | TaliesinSoft <taliesinsoft@me.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-01 08:11 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <co293cFku02U3@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #2693 |
On 2015-04-01 08:22:44 +0000, nospam said: [in response to Howaard Shubs stating....] >> And I still don't like the Dock. Accustomed to it, but that's all. > > disable it and use dragthing. or nothing. I'm running Yosemite version 10.10.3. My dock shows only the currently active applications along with Finder and Trash. I launch applications using Spotlight, a launch taking pressing Cmd-Space, followed by one or two letters which then identify the application, and that followed by a return. I find this much quicker than moving the cursor down to the dock with my Magic Trackpad. I also like the clean appearance of the Yosemite dock in compaarison to the three dimensional appearance of the preceding dock design. -- James Leo Ryan - Austin, Texas
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| From | Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-01 23:59 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnmhp1j8.lpa.howard@foxtrot.local> |
| In reply to | #2693 |
On 2015-04-01, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote: >> Lots of custom software, and >> lots of server software, sure. If Microsoft and Adobe and others started >> developing for Linux, I'd be there in an instant. > > not going to happen since there aren't enough users to justify it It's a chicken-and-egg thing.
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| From | Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-02 02:14 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <mfi8m5$nii$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #2704 |
For your reference, records indicate that Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > On 2015-04-01, nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> wrote: > >> Lots of custom software, and > >> lots of server software, sure. If Microsoft and Adobe and others started > >> developing for Linux, I'd be there in an instant. > > > > not going to happen since there aren't enough users to justify it > > It's a chicken-and-egg thing. Given that the egg came first, which thing is the egg in your metaphor? I’m going to have to guess it’s money, because people had money before they had software, and Linux people have money before they have commercial apps. So, again, the solution seems to be you actually putting forward your pile of money that is the oh-so-big reason you think everyone should be scrambling to give you your apps. -- "Also . . . I can kill you with my brain." River Tam, Trash, Firefly
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| From | Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-01 09:05 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <slrnmhnuoe.gc7.timmcn@sugaree-2.local> |
| In reply to | #2684 |
On 1 Apr 2015 07:18:06 GMT, Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > On 2015-03-31, Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote: >> LOL! Yer gonna go use Linux because MT-NW got broken? Or Windows >> 8.1? Maybe dump computers altogether and buy n Android phablet? >> Howard, I've known you on Usenet for seems like 20 years- what's >> gotten into you? > > That and other reasons. I've been moving in that direction for years, > but until recently it was fairly low priority. Now... I don't like > where Apple is taking things. I've said that before, long since. Not > liking the Dock was just part of it. Umm, it can't have buggd you that much since the Dock has been around for a decade or so. > I have zero interest in iOS, yet its "features" are being integrated > into Mac OS bit by bit. I have tried an iPhone. Got one last June, > when I started working at Apple. As soon as I left Apple, I went back > to my Nexus 4. "closed garden" vs "open garden". My iPhone 5s is now > unused, except a little as an iPod, I suppose. But I mainly use it to > play Monopoly. And I'm stuck paying for it for the next 15 months. > That's another problem I've never had with my Nexus 4. Huh. I bought my 5S outright and use the Straight Talk plan- no contract, half the price of AT&T and using the same network. I was surprised to actually like the iPhone. > The main problem I see with using Linux as a desktop OS is that > there's no regular user-level commercial software for it. Lots of > custom software, and lots of server software, sure. If Microsoft and > Adobe and others started developing for Linux, I'd be there in an > instant. Things like GIMP don't cut it. Volunteer development for > these things just doesn't work, because as soon as someone loses > interest, such as during debugging of those last, tricky, hard-to-fix > bugs, the software stops being fixed. And the programmer goes on to > the next interesting feature. So we end up with lots of half-assed > software with lots of buggy features. That's Linux' worst problem, > IMnsHO. It basically won the war for lots of server-side use, but > desktop... not in the near future. Linux will never be a widespread user-side OS. It's just too hard to use. 99% of the compuer using public wants an appliance that they can turn on, use, and turn off once they're done. The other 1% mostly want Linux. There have been attempts to consumerize Linux with varying success. One of the biggest holdups for Linux is that many of not most distributions are obsessed with licensing issues (GPL 2 vs 3, etc.) and they will use crappy-but-free-as-in-speech applications preferentially to applications that actually work but have more restrictive licensing. if you've got the skills to overcome the deficiencies, that's fine, but few people do. The big players like Adobe are never, ever going to develop for a platform that essentially requires them to give away the source code. While I sympathize with Stallman and Lessig a lot, I think that their idealism is doomed to being unworkable unless the laws governing copyright and patents are substantially revised. > And I still don't like the Dock. Accustomed to it, but that's all. Huh. It works fine. Set it to hide and stay away from it, if you don't like it.
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| From | Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-01 16:51 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <mfh7lr$s6$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #2696 |
For your reference, records indicate that Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote: > Linux will never be a widespread user-side OS. It's just too hard to > use. 99% of the compuer using public wants an appliance that they can > turn on, use, and turn off once they're done. If the Mac could do it (well, really, it was NeXT that mainly did it), so could Linux. By some measure, you could say that Android already *is* the Linux appliance that most people can use. Not to mention that I still have an original TiVo that is chugging along. :-) > One of the biggest holdups for Linux is that many of not most > distributions are obsessed with licensing issues (GPL 2 vs 3, etc.) and > they will use crappy-but-free-as-in-speech applications preferentially > to applications that actually work but have more restrictive licensing. Plus the insular developer mindset. For example, GNUstep use should have taken off when iOS turned out to be a hit, but they seem to have absolutely no desire to work with anyone who wants to port to/from Apple platforms. Steering this back to newsreaders, it’s why all these different command line readers you’re stuck with can’t *bear* to either develop or use a common NNTP library to do the meat of what they do. Usenet might not be in such a sad state if there hadn’t been so much wasted effort. -- "Also . . . I can kill you with my brain." River Tam, Trash, Firefly
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| From | Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-01 17:51 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <co2pgjFp29bU2@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #2699 |
On 2015-04-01, Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> wrote: > For your reference, records indicate that > Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote: > >> Linux will never be a widespread user-side OS. It's just too hard to >> use. 99% of the compuer using public wants an appliance that they can >> turn on, use, and turn off once they're done. > > If the Mac could do it (well, really, it was NeXT that mainly did it), > so could Linux. Uh huh. Then why hasn't Linux done it? It's only been, what, 15 years so far. >> One of the biggest holdups for Linux is that many of not most >> distributions are obsessed with licensing issues (GPL 2 vs 3, etc.) and >> they will use crappy-but-free-as-in-speech applications preferentially >> to applications that actually work but have more restrictive licensing. > > Plus the insular developer mindset. For example, GNUstep use should have > taken off when iOS turned out to be a hit, but they seem to have absolutely > no desire to work with anyone who wants to port to/from Apple platforms. Cry me a river. > Steering this back to newsreaders, it’s why all these different command > line readers you’re stuck with can’t *bear* to either develop or use > a common NNTP library to do the meat of what they do. Usenet might not > be in such a sad state if there hadn’t been so much wasted effort. And those of us using command-line news clients aren't bitching about it nearly as much as you. Go figure. -- E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter. I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead. JR
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| From | Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-02 00:03 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnmhp1re.lpa.howard@foxtrot.local> |
| In reply to | #2701 |
On 2015-04-01, Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote: > Uh huh. Then why hasn't Linux done it? It's only been, what, 15 years so far. Like standards, lots of people have tried to come up with a usable distribution for more people. Hasn't worked yet. That doesn't mean it can't.
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| From | Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-04-01 17:06 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <mfh8iv$4tt$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #2684 |
For your reference, records indicate that Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > The main problem I see with using Linux as a desktop OS is that there's no > regular user-level commercial software for it. Lots of custom software, and > lots of server software, sure. If Microsoft and Adobe and others started > developing for Linux, I'd be there in an instant. So you say, but why should Microsoft or Adobe believe you? Have you put $5K in an escrow account awaiting a Linux version of PhotoShop (or whatever)? Have you organized 99,999 other people to do the same? If not, do you have any hard numbers of your own that shows *any* company would be able to profit on an effort to bring their user-level software to Linux? > Volunteer development for these things just doesn't work, because as soon > as someone loses interest, such as during debugging of those last, tricky, > hard-to-fix bugs, the software stops being fixed. And the programmer goes on > to the next interesting feature. So we end up with lots of half-assed > software with lots of buggy features. That's Linux' worst problem, IMnsHO. It’s a problem with open source on general. Projects are run by brogrammer coders, because those of us who can architect, design, and document a system well are less willing to work for free, and certainly not in an environment where the mindset is to measure worth by the number of commits that have been made to the repository. The lack of curation is a real anchor around of neck of a digital society. -- "Also . . . I can kill you with my brain." River Tam, Trash, Firefly
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| From | Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 22:56 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <slrnmhk6n8.feb.timmcn@sugaree-2.local> |
| In reply to | #2643 |
On 30 Mar 2015 07:39:08 GMT, Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > On 2015-03-30, Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote: >> That doesn't even make sense, Howard. Apple progresses, must >> progress, like the rest of the tech sector. I've got a nearly 25 >> year old SCSI 40 MB hard drive, back when 40 MB was an appreciable >> amount of space- there is no reason to expect Apple to maintain >> backwards compatibility to hardware that frankly might not even turn >> on if I plugged it in. Support for obsolete technology eventually >> has to be jettisoned, and at the speed the tech sector advances at >> times "obsolete" might be three weeks ago. How long do you expect >> them to maintain "backwards compatibility?" (The answer, of course, >> is as long as I want to use that old tech; I don't give a crap >> whether they support it once I no longer want to use it). > > Exactly, and they should. DEC did. I suspect IBM does. Apple has > the same amount of control as they did/do over its hardware. > Microsoft can't claim that, but they maintain compatability longer, as > I understand it. Not as long as DEC, granted, but longer than Apple. That's completely unreasonable IMHO. You want to use old obsolete stuff, keep an old obsolete computer around that runs it. Or do what the mainframe guys do- never update. Half or more of the financial sector runs on ancient mainframes that haven't been properly updated in decades. >> You seem to be confusing Apple and third party developers. It was >> not up to Apple to keep MT-NW going, it was up to Simon. He opted >> not to, probably for very good reasons (e.g., the code probably needs >> a complete rewrite to bring it into this century. You'd probably be >> better starting from scratch). > > The only reason MT-NW doesn't work is because Apple broke it by > changing the environment in such a way as to break backward > compatability with MT-NW and other such programs. It's EXACTLY > Apple's fault, and no others'. It no longer works because Apple no longer supports software written for OS 7 which got kludged along into OS X. Do you think Open Transport software should still work? Should all Macs come with X86, PPC and 68xxx chips, too? And serial, parallel, SCSI, USB 1/2/3, Ethernet, Lightning, etc. ports. Seriously? Times move on. All dharmas end. Get over it.
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| From | Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 15:17 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <mfbpep$p7$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #2640 |
For your reference, records indicate that Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote: > How long do you expect them to maintain "backwards > compatibility?" I propose a compromise solution: break out the actual cost of supporting old software. Whether it’s an old network stack or PPC binaries, it would be at the very least amusing to see a price tag put on them as add-on products. I really would like to see the market play out the long tail more often than it does. If Apple is willing to sell a watch for $17K, why not at least *try* to sell Rosetta for $99 or $399 or whatever. That’s one of the reasons Usenet itself has stagnated; it can no longer take advantage of the economies of scale. And I suspect that’s the same minuscule market that exists for Open Transport itself. MT-NW is the only thing I recall losing when it went away. Are people who won’t pay $5 or $50 for a newsreader going to pay $5000 to keep the ancient underpinnings working on a modern OS? -- "Also . . . I can kill you with my brain." River Tam, Trash, Firefly
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| From | nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 11:22 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <300320151122021033%nospam@nospam.invalid> |
| In reply to | #2648 |
In article <mfbpep$p7$1@dont-email.me>, Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> wrote: > > How long do you expect them to maintain "backwards > > compatibility?" > > I propose a compromise solution: break out the actual cost of supporting > old software. Whether it¹s an old network stack or PPC binaries, it would > be at the very least amusing to see a price tag put on them as add-on > products. I really would like to see the market play out the long tail > more often than it does. If Apple is willing to sell a watch for $17K, > why not at least *try* to sell Rosetta for $99 or $399 or whatever. they don't own rosetta, so it's not theirs to sell.
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| From | Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 15:38 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <cnt8usFbj9lU6@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #2648 |
On 2015-03-30, Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> wrote: > For your reference, records indicate that > Tim McNamara <timmcn@bitstream.net> wrote: > >> How long do you expect them to maintain "backwards >> compatibility?" > > I propose a compromise solution: break out the actual cost of supporting > old software. Whether it’s an old network stack or PPC binaries, it would > be at the very least amusing to see a price tag put on them as add-on > products. I really would like to see the market play out the long tail > more often than it does. If Apple is willing to sell a watch for $17K, > why not at least *try* to sell Rosetta for $99 or $399 or whatever. If they were stand-alone modules that didn't require significant changes to other parts of the operating system that might fly. That is *not* the case, though. > That’s one of the reasons Usenet itself has stagnated; it can no longer > take advantage of the economies of scale. And I suspect that’s the same > minuscule market that exists for Open Transport itself. MT-NW is the > only thing I recall losing when it went away. That's because other application developers modified their apps to use newer frameworks than Open Transport. You do realize that most Mac networking apps used Open Transport, historically, right? -- E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter. I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead. JR
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| From | Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 20:27 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnmhjccr.kg7.howard@foxtrot.local> |
| In reply to | #2648 |
On 2015-03-30, Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> wrote: > That’s one of the reasons Usenet itself has stagnated; it can no longer > take advantage of the economies of scale. And I suspect that’s the same > minuscule market that exists for Open Transport itself. MT-NW is the > only thing I recall losing when it went away. Are people who won’t pay > $5 or $50 for a newsreader going to pay $5000 to keep the ancient > underpinnings working on a modern OS? There's no equivalent to MT-NW for any money we might want to pay, unless someone develops a replacement. SLRN and Unison don't seem to be "it", at least to me so far. I haven't learned more than the basics of slrn so far, so I could be missing a wonderful filtering facility. Hopefully, I'll have time to notice it soon.
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| From | Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2015-03-30 20:39 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <cntqjqFg7qmU6@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #2663 |
On 2015-03-30, Howard S Shubs <howard@shubs.net> wrote: > On 2015-03-30, Doc O'Leary <droleary@2usenet2014.subsume.com> wrote: >> That’s one of the reasons Usenet itself has stagnated; it can no longer >> take advantage of the economies of scale. And I suspect that’s the same >> minuscule market that exists for Open Transport itself. MT-NW is the >> only thing I recall losing when it went away. Are people who won’t pay >> $5 or $50 for a newsreader going to pay $5000 to keep the ancient >> underpinnings working on a modern OS? > > There's no equivalent to MT-NW for any money we might want to pay, > unless someone develops a replacement. SLRN and Unison don't seem to be > "it", at least to me so far. I haven't learned more than the basics of > slrn so far, so I could be missing a wonderful filtering facility. > Hopefully, I'll have time to notice it soon. slrn's scoring is quite sufficient. -- E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter. I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead. JR
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