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Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events?

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  Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-02-28 16:35 -0500
    Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-02-28 16:51 -0500
    Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-02-28 23:13 +0000
      Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-02-28 18:23 -0500
        Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-01 06:38 +0000
          Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-01 09:26 -0500
            Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-01 18:07 +0000
              Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-02 11:01 -0500
                Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-02 17:53 +0000
                  Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> - 2014-03-02 11:17 -0700
                    Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-02 22:05 +0000
                  Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-02 14:04 -0500
                    Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2014-03-02 23:31 -0500
                      Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-03 18:07 -0500
                  Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-02 21:37 +0000
                    Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-02 22:16 +0000
                      Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2014-03-02 22:20 +0000
                      Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-02 17:39 -0500
                        Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-03 00:06 +0000
                          Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-03 18:02 -0500
                            Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2014-03-03 23:16 +0000
                              Re: Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events? Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> - 2014-03-03 18:32 -0500

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#21243 — Apple Calendar - notify contact when deleting past events?

Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to 
notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like 
cleaning up the calendar.

I can't find anything in Calendar preferences to defeat that... anyone?

-- 
   Those who have reduced our privacy, whether they are state
   or commercial actors, prefer that we do not reduce theirs.
                  - Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.

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#21244

On 2014.02.28, 16:35 , Alan Browne wrote:
>
> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to
> notify them.

Oy!  Talk about badly written.

Meant to say, " ... Calendar wants to notify anyone to whom I'd shared 
the invitation/appointment."

> I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like
> cleaning up the calendar.

>
> I can't find anything in Calendar preferences to defeat that... anyone?
>


-- 
   Privacy has become an essential personal chore that most
   people are not trained to perform.
                  - Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.

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#21245

In message <9rudnWMFyvSMnIzOnZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@giganews.com> 
  Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to 
> notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like 
> cleaning up the calendar.

So, you think it should silently delete events that other people are
linked to without notifying them?

> I can't find anything in Calendar preferences to defeat that... anyone?

Don't invite them?

-- 
'Does he have people put to death?' said Mort.  SOMETIMES. THERE ARE
SOME THINGS YOU HAVE TO DO, WHEN YOU'RE A KING.

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#21246

On 2014.02.28, 18:13 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <9rudnWMFyvSMnIzOnZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@giganews.com>
>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to
>> notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like
>> cleaning up the calendar.
>
> So, you think it should silently delete events that other people are
> linked to without notifying them?

I just want it off my calendar.  I don't care if it sticks to theirs.


>
>> I can't find anything in Calendar preferences to defeat that... anyone?
>
> Don't invite them

I guess the word "past" sailed over your head.



-- 
    ... it may be that "in the cloud" really isn't the best term
    for the services these companies offer.  What they really
    want is to have us "on the leash."
                   -David Pogue, Scientific American, 2014.02

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#21249

In message <lv6dnVKEgsQbh4zOnZ2dnUVZ_smdnZ2d@giganews.com> 
  Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> On 2014.02.28, 18:13 , Lewis wrote:
>> In message <9rudnWMFyvSMnIzOnZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>>> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to
>>> notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like
>>> cleaning up the calendar.
>>
>> So, you think it should silently delete events that other people are
>> linked to without notifying them?

> I just want it off my calendar.  I don't care if it sticks to theirs.

That's not how shared events work.


>>> I can't find anything in Calendar preferences to defeat that... anyone?
>>
>> Don't invite them

> I guess the word "past" sailed over your head.

No, but I didn't feel like getting into why you felt the need to delete
past events, I have my own OCD (it's not OCD, it's just I like things
right!) to deal with.

-- 
Nihil est--in vita priore ego imperator Romanus fui.

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#21250

On 2014.03.01, 01:38 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <lv6dnVKEgsQbh4zOnZ2dnUVZ_smdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>> On 2014.02.28, 18:13 , Lewis wrote:
>>> In message <9rudnWMFyvSMnIzOnZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>     Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to
>>>> notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like
>>>> cleaning up the calendar.
>>>
>>> So, you think it should silently delete events that other people are
>>> linked to without notifying them?
>
>> I just want it off my calendar.  I don't care if it sticks to theirs.
>
> That's not how shared events work.

There is no reason why, once an event is past in time, that it shouldn't 
be removed (or at least flagged to not display) w/o sending an update to 
a correspondent.

>>>> I can't find anything in Calendar preferences to defeat that... anyone?
>>>
>>> Don't invite them
>
>> I guess the word "past" sailed over your head.
>
> No, but I didn't feel like getting into why you felt the need to delete
> past events, I have my own OCD (it's not OCD, it's just I like things
> right!) to deal with.

It's my calendar.  If I want to de-clutter it, that's my affair.  OTOH I 
don't want to annoy my friends and colleagues with update notices over 
something that is over.

Pretty straightforward.

-- 
    ... it may be that "in the cloud" really isn't the best term
    for the services these companies offer.  What they really
    want is to have us "on the leash."
                   -David Pogue, Scientific American, 2014.02

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#21254

In message <kL6dnVmEtP-uc4zOnZ2dnUVZ_tednZ2d@giganews.com> 
  Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> On 2014.03.01, 01:38 , Lewis wrote:
>> In message <lv6dnVKEgsQbh4zOnZ2dnUVZ_smdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>> On 2014.02.28, 18:13 , Lewis wrote:
>>>> In message <9rudnWMFyvSMnIzOnZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>>     Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to
>>>>> notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like
>>>>> cleaning up the calendar.
>>>>
>>>> So, you think it should silently delete events that other people are
>>>> linked to without notifying them?
>>
>>> I just want it off my calendar.  I don't care if it sticks to theirs.
>>
>> That's not how shared events work.

> There is no reason why, once an event is past in time, that it shouldn't 
> be removed (or at least flagged to not display) w/o sending an update to 
> a correspondent.

It will be removed from THEIR calendar. They should know about it. Maybe
they don't want their paste events going away? Maybe they need to keep
them so that they can go back and track their time?

>>>>> I can't find anything in Calendar preferences to defeat that... anyone?
>>>>
>>>> Don't invite them
>>
>>> I guess the word "past" sailed over your head.
>>
>> No, but I didn't feel like getting into why you felt the need to delete
>> past events, I have my own OCD (it's not OCD, it's just I like things
>> right!) to deal with.

> It's my calendar.

When you share events with others it is no longer just your calendar. At
least not for the events you share.

> Pretty straightforward.

I would think so, but evidently not.

If I went to look at my calender, as I did today, so see what day it was
that I had lunch with my mom so I could tell the credit card company
"No, I haven't been in Boulder since x of January" and I found the event
had been deleted, I'd be pretty damn pissed.

-- 
'You're your own worst enemy, Rincewind,' said the sword.
Rincewind looked up at the grinning men.  'Bet?' --Colour of Magic

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#21263

On 2014.03.01, 13:07 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <kL6dnVmEtP-uc4zOnZ2dnUVZ_tednZ2d@giganews.com>
>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>> On 2014.03.01, 01:38 , Lewis wrote:
>>> In message <lv6dnVKEgsQbh4zOnZ2dnUVZ_smdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>     Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>> On 2014.02.28, 18:13 , Lewis wrote:
>>>>> In message <9rudnWMFyvSMnIzOnZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>>>      Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to
>>>>>> notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like
>>>>>> cleaning up the calendar.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, you think it should silently delete events that other people are
>>>>> linked to without notifying them?
>>>
>>>> I just want it off my calendar.  I don't care if it sticks to theirs.
>>>
>>> That's not how shared events work.
>
>> There is no reason why, once an event is past in time, that it shouldn't
>> be removed (or at least flagged to not display) w/o sending an update to
>> a correspondent.
>
> It will be removed from THEIR calendar. They should know about it. Maybe
> they don't want their paste events going away? Maybe they need to keep
> them so that they can go back and track their time?

You're winning the award for missing the point.

I want it out of my calendar, not theirs.  If they want to keep it or 
delete it, that's their affair.

Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any 
effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.

In effect I want to sever the link and delete the event.  That's really 
trivial.


>>>>>> I can't find anything in Calendar preferences to defeat that... anyone?
>>>>>
>>>>> Don't invite them
>>>
>>>> I guess the word "past" sailed over your head.
>>>
>>> No, but I didn't feel like getting into why you felt the need to delete
>>> past events, I have my own OCD (it's not OCD, it's just I like things
>>> right!) to deal with.
>
>> It's my calendar.
>
> When you share events with others it is no longer just your calendar. At
> least not for the events you share.

What a strange view of the world.  My calendar on my computer is not my 
colleague's.  So I'd like to control my calendar on my computer.  If he 
wants to retain the event, so be it - that's his affair.


>
>> Pretty straightforward.
>
> I would think so, but evidently not.
>
> If I went to look at my calender, as I did today, so see what day it was
> that I had lunch with my mom so I could tell the credit card company
> "No, I haven't been in Boulder since x of January" and I found the event
> had been deleted, I'd be pretty damn pissed.

Your use/needs of the calendar are not mine.  The s/w should allow me to 
delete my copy w/o affecting your copy.  Trivial.  But of course not 
possible with Apple's Calendar.

(And IIRC it used to be that one could update ones own copy and not 
update someone else's copy - it was an option.  Now all you get is 
"Cancel" or "Notify others".).

-- 
   Privacy has become an essential personal chore that most
   people are not trained to perform.
                  - Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#21269

In message <1LydnY8C8d9tyI7OnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@giganews.com> 
  Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> On 2014.03.01, 13:07 , Lewis wrote:
>> In message <kL6dnVmEtP-uc4zOnZ2dnUVZ_tednZ2d@giganews.com>
>>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>> On 2014.03.01, 01:38 , Lewis wrote:
>>>> In message <lv6dnVKEgsQbh4zOnZ2dnUVZ_smdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>>     Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>> On 2014.02.28, 18:13 , Lewis wrote:
>>>>>> In message <9rudnWMFyvSMnIzOnZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>>>>      Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to
>>>>>>> notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like
>>>>>>> cleaning up the calendar.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So, you think it should silently delete events that other people are
>>>>>> linked to without notifying them?
>>>>
>>>>> I just want it off my calendar.  I don't care if it sticks to theirs.
>>>>
>>>> That's not how shared events work.
>>
>>> There is no reason why, once an event is past in time, that it shouldn't
>>> be removed (or at least flagged to not display) w/o sending an update to
>>> a correspondent.
>>
>> It will be removed from THEIR calendar. They should know about it. Maybe
>> they don't want their paste events going away? Maybe they need to keep
>> them so that they can go back and track their time?

> You're winning the award for missing the point.

> I want it out of my calendar, not theirs.  If they want to keep it or 
> delete it, that's their affair.

But it is *YOUR* event. When you delete it, it goes away.

> Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any 
> effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.

Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.

> In effect I want to sever the link and delete the event.  That's really 
> trivial.

It may seem trivial to you, I doubt that it is, in fact, trivial.


> Your use/needs of the calendar are not mine.  The s/w should allow me to 
> delete my copy w/o affecting your copy.  Trivial.  But of course not 
> possible with Apple's Calendar.

You say it is trivial, but where is your evidence of that. A shared
event is a SUBSCRIPTION to that event. If you make changes to it, for
example, everyone sees those changes. 

> (And IIRC it used to be that one could update ones own copy and not 
> update someone else's copy - it was an option.  Now all you get is 
> "Cancel" or "Notify others".).

Probably related. Having a shared event that you could update without
notifying others is not a shared event.

The Calendar event sharing is designed for business people who need to
manage their schedules and setup meetings and appointments. When an
event is shared it is critical that that event be shared identically to
all the people who are part of that event.

Deleting events off someone else' calendar is allowed, but those people
do deserve to be at least notified of the deletion so that, for example,
they can keep the event on their own calendar.

-- 
"Getting married for sex is like buying a 747 for the free peanuts." -
Jeff Foxworthy

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#21273

In article <slrnlh6s1l.1uj.g.kreme@amelia.local>, Lewis
<g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> > Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any 
> > effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
> 
> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.

He did say *past* event.

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#21282

In message <020320141117029278%michelle@michelle.org> 
  Michelle Steiner <michelle@michelle.org> wrote:
> In article <slrnlh6s1l.1uj.g.kreme@amelia.local>, Lewis
> <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

>> > Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any 
>> > effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
>> 
>> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
>> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.

> He did say *past* event.

That assumes that the Calnendar apps treats events differently. I don'
think it does (or should).

Here's the thing, the way the calendar events work now is how most
people will want them to work. Some small minority of users will want to
be able to share events and then change them without changing those
shared events. An even smaller minority will want to make changes to
PAST events. And an even smaller percentage will want to delete past
events.

I'd rather the situation we have no where shared events work as they
should and have the annoyance factor for those very very few people who
feel the need to "clean up" past events from the calendar than the
situation we had before when shared events were a crapshoot that largely
came up craps.

-- 
Age is only important if you're cheese.

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#21275

On 2014.03.02, 12:53 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <1LydnY8C8d9tyI7OnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>> On 2014.03.01, 13:07 , Lewis wrote:
>>> In message <kL6dnVmEtP-uc4zOnZ2dnUVZ_tednZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>     Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>> On 2014.03.01, 01:38 , Lewis wrote:
>>>>> In message <lv6dnVKEgsQbh4zOnZ2dnUVZ_smdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>>>      Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>> On 2014.02.28, 18:13 , Lewis wrote:
>>>>>>> In message <9rudnWMFyvSMnIzOnZ2dnUVZ_uidnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>>>>>       Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Whenever I want to delete a past even from my Calendar it wants to
>>>>>>>> notify them.  I don't want to annoy my friends/colleagues - but I like
>>>>>>>> cleaning up the calendar.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> So, you think it should silently delete events that other people are
>>>>>>> linked to without notifying them?
>>>>>
>>>>>> I just want it off my calendar.  I don't care if it sticks to theirs.
>>>>>
>>>>> That's not how shared events work.
>>>
>>>> There is no reason why, once an event is past in time, that it shouldn't
>>>> be removed (or at least flagged to not display) w/o sending an update to
>>>> a correspondent.
>>>
>>> It will be removed from THEIR calendar. They should know about it. Maybe
>>> they don't want their paste events going away? Maybe they need to keep
>>> them so that they can go back and track their time?
>
>> You're winning the award for missing the point.
>
>> I want it out of my calendar, not theirs.  If they want to keep it or
>> delete it, that's their affair.
>
> But it is *YOUR* event. When you delete it, it goes away.
>
>> Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any
>> effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
>
> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.
>
>> In effect I want to sever the link and delete the event.  That's really
>> trivial.
>
> It may seem trivial to you, I doubt that it is, in fact, trivial.

If it isn't trivial then there is a profound design error.

>> Your use/needs of the calendar are not mine.  The s/w should allow me to
>> delete my copy w/o affecting your copy.  Trivial.  But of course not
>> possible with Apple's Calendar.
>
> You say it is trivial, but where is your evidence of that. A shared
> event is a SUBSCRIPTION to that event. If you make changes to it, for
> example, everyone sees those changes.
>
>> (And IIRC it used to be that one could update ones own copy and not
>> update someone else's copy - it was an option.  Now all you get is
>> "Cancel" or "Notify others".).
>
> Probably related. Having a shared event that you could update without
> notifying others is not a shared event.

What part of "past" is troubling you?

>
> The Calendar event sharing is designed for business people who need to
> manage their schedules and setup meetings and appointments. When an
> event is shared it is critical that that event be shared identically to
> all the people who are part of that event.
>
> Deleting events off someone else' calendar is allowed, but those people
> do deserve to be at least notified of the deletion so that, for example,
> they can keep the event on their own calendar.

It's too early for the *Whoosh* award of the month, but you're in very 
strong contention.

I want it off my calendar.  I don't care if it stays on theirs.  OTOH, I 
don't want to annoy them with an alert (courtesy).

-- 
    ... it may be that "in the cloud" really isn't the best term
    for the services these companies offer.  What they really
    want is to have us "on the leash."
                   -David Pogue, Scientific American, 2014.02

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#21297

In article <pKqdnVTCMLs2HY7OnZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
 Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:

> What part of "past" is troubling you?

What about the Preference option to delete events older than N days? 
Does this not work if the event has been shared?

-- 
Barry Margolin, barmar@alum.mit.edu
Arlington, MA
*** PLEASE post questions in newsgroups, not directly to me ***

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#21310

On 2014.03.02, 23:31 , Barry Margolin wrote:
> In article <pKqdnVTCMLs2HY7OnZ2dnUVZ_g6dnZ2d@giganews.com>,
>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>
>> What part of "past" is troubling you?
>
> What about the Preference option to delete events older than N days?
> Does this not work if the event has been shared?

I don't see that in Calendar anymore (Calendar 7.0 (1841)) and nothing 
in system Prefs to that effect.

--
Privacy has become an essential personal chore that most
   people are not trained to perform.
                  - Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#21280

On 2014-03-02, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> In message <1LydnY8C8d9tyI7OnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@giganews.com> 
>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>
>> Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any 
>> effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
>
> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.

It should be an option. When I delete a shared event, simply ask me
whether or not to delete it, or at the very least send a notice to
shared calendars that the event is being deleted from the source
calendar. It's really that simple.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#21283

In message <bnhmjvF7sesU1@mid.individual.net> 
  Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
> On 2014-03-02, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>> In message <1LydnY8C8d9tyI7OnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@giganews.com> 
>>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>
>>> Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any 
>>> effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
>>
>> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
>> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.

> It should be an option. When I delete a shared event, simply ask me
> whether or not to delete it, or at the very least send a notice to
> shared calendars that the event is being deleted from the source
> calendar. It's really that simple.

He wants to delete it and NOT notify other people it's been deleted.
Basically, he wants to delete the event out from under them and remove
it from their calendars. Or he wants the magic option (which is never
ever going ot happen for many reasons) of deleting the event and then
having everyone else's shared event turn into a non-shared events.

He also claims this must be 'trivial'

Here is how it works, for Event Abscam from user Adam:

Adam creates Abscam.
     invites Bob
     invites carol
     invites Daria
     invites Edward
     invites Frances
     invites George

Now, what happens if Adam deletes his event?

1) Bob, Carol, Daria, Edward, Frances, and George have their events
deleted.

2) B-F do NOT have their events deleted... ok, but now?

   2a) B-F still have a shared event that lists B-F as invited. But
   there is no owner for the event.

   2b) B-F no longer have a shared event at all, just an event that
   shows no invitees. Did Daria attend or did she send her assistant
   Dave? No one knows.

Neither of the 'solutions' in 2 are trivial to implement nor a
reasonable default choice.

3) The event is deleted and B-F are notified that the event is deleted
so that they can take whatever action is needed (or none) to preserve
the event in their own calendars.

3 is the current way it works, it used to be 1 (the only other option
that is actually trivial to implement) and 1 is a far worse choice than
3.

-- 
Incredible! One of the worst performances of my career and they never
doubted it for a second.

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#21284

On 2014-03-02, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> In message <bnhmjvF7sesU1@mid.individual.net> 
>   Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>> On 2014-03-02, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>> In message <1LydnY8C8d9tyI7OnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@giganews.com> 
>>>   Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any 
>>>> effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
>>>
>>> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
>>> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.
>
>> It should be an option. When I delete a shared event, simply ask me
>> whether or not to delete it, or at the very least send a notice to
>> shared calendars that the event is being deleted from the source
>> calendar. It's really that simple.
>
> He wants to delete it and NOT notify other people it's been deleted.

Yes, and I believe that should be an option.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#21286

On 2014.03.02, 17:16 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <bnhmjvF7sesU1@mid.individual.net>
>    Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>> On 2014-03-02, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>> In message <1LydnY8C8d9tyI7OnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any
>>>> effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
>>>
>>> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
>>> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.
>
>> It should be an option. When I delete a shared event, simply ask me
>> whether or not to delete it, or at the very least send a notice to
>> shared calendars that the event is being deleted from the source
>> calendar. It's really that simple.
>
> He wants to delete it and NOT notify other people it's been deleted.

To be clear: I want to delete it from _my_ calendar and not annoy others 
of the fact that it's no longer in _my_ calendar.

> Basically, he wants to delete the event out from under them and remove
> it from their calendars.

THAT IS NOT WHAT I SAID AT ALL.

I said, several times, clearly, that I want:

1- to delete the PAST event from my calendar
2- not annoy my colleagues with a notifiction
3- that the event could remain in their calendar - it's really no 
concern of mine at all.

Or he wants the magic option (which is never
> ever going ot happen for many reasons) of deleting the event and then
> having everyone else's shared event turn into a non-shared events.

I never said that at all.  I just want the record on my calendar removed 
or even (as stated earlier) made invisible.

>
> He also claims this must be 'trivial'
>
> Here is how it works, for Event Abscam from user Adam:
>
> Adam creates Abscam.
>       invites Bob
>       invites carol
>       invites Daria
>       invites Edward
>       invites Frances
>       invites George
>
> Now, what happens if Adam deletes his event?
>
> 1) Bob, Carol, Daria, Edward, Frances, and George have their events
> deleted.

Why should it?  Just delete it from my calendar.  Done.  They retain all 
info about the event and who was involved - incl. the originator of the 
event.

> 2) B-F do NOT have their events deleted... ok, but now?
>
>     2a) B-F still have a shared event that lists B-F as invited. But
>     there is no owner for the event.
>
>     2b) B-F no longer have a shared event at all, just an event that
>     shows no invitees. Did Daria attend or did she send her assistant
>     Dave? No one knows.
>
> Neither of the 'solutions' in 2 are trivial to implement nor a
> reasonable default choice.

It depends on how the events are stored on each calendar.  If each event 
has all of the 'attendees' then the links remain.  Indeed, the fact that 
Adam created the event can remain in the record; even the link would be 
there (in the attendees copies), but Adam's instance would no longer 
respond to updates since it would no longer find the record.

Trivial enough.  To be sure there will be implementation details.

>
> 3) The event is deleted and B-F are notified that the event is deleted
> so that they can take whatever action is needed (or none) to preserve
> the event in their own calendars.

They don't need to.  Everything they knew about the event is kept in 
their copy of the event record - if implemented as I see it and describe 
in part above.

>
> 3 is the current way it works, it used to be 1 (the only other option
> that is actually trivial to implement) and 1 is a far worse choice than
> 3.

Sez u.




-- 
   Those who have reduced our privacy, whether they are state
   or commercial actors, prefer that we do not reduce theirs.
                  - Jaron Lanier, Scientific American, 2013.11.

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#21290

In message <TcCdnUsfHpy7Lo7OnZ2dnUVZ_uWdnZ2d@giganews.com> 
  Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
> On 2014.03.02, 17:16 , Lewis wrote:
>> In message <bnhmjvF7sesU1@mid.individual.net>
>>    Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>>> On 2014-03-02, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>>> In message <1LydnY8C8d9tyI7OnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any
>>>>> effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
>>>>
>>>> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
>>>> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.
>>
>>> It should be an option. When I delete a shared event, simply ask me
>>> whether or not to delete it, or at the very least send a notice to
>>> shared calendars that the event is being deleted from the source
>>> calendar. It's really that simple.
>>
>> He wants to delete it and NOT notify other people it's been deleted.

> To be clear: I want to delete it from _my_ calendar and not annoy others 
> of the fact that it's no longer in _my_ calendar.

>> Basically, he wants to delete the event out from under them and remove
>> it from their calendars.

> THAT IS NOT WHAT I SAID AT ALL.

> I said, several times, clearly, that I want:

> 1- to delete the PAST event from my calendar
> 2- not annoy my colleagues with a notifiction
> 3- that the event could remain in their calendar - it's really no 
> concern of mine at all.

> Or he wants the magic option (which is never
>> ever going ot happen for many reasons) of deleting the event and then
>> having everyone else's shared event turn into a non-shared events.

> I never said that at all.  I just want the record on my calendar removed 
> or even (as stated earlier) made invisible.

>>
>> He also claims this must be 'trivial'
>>
>> Here is how it works, for Event Abscam from user Adam:
>>
>> Adam creates Abscam.
>>       invites Bob
>>       invites carol
>>       invites Daria
>>       invites Edward
>>       invites Frances
>>       invites George
>>
>> Now, what happens if Adam deletes his event?
>>
>> 1) Bob, Carol, Daria, Edward, Frances, and George have their events
>> deleted.

> Why should it?  Just delete it from my calendar.  Done.  They retain all 
> info about the event and who was involved - incl. the originator of the 
> event.

>> 2) B-F do NOT have their events deleted... ok, but now?
>>
>>     2a) B-F still have a shared event that lists B-F as invited. But
>>     there is no owner for the event.
>>
>>     2b) B-F no longer have a shared event at all, just an event that
>>     shows no invitees. Did Daria attend or did she send her assistant
>>     Dave? No one knows.
>>
>> Neither of the 'solutions' in 2 are trivial to implement nor a
>> reasonable default choice.

> It depends on how the events are stored on each calendar.  If each event 
> has all of the 'attendees' then the links remain.  Indeed, the fact that 
> Adam created the event can remain in the record; even the link would be 
> there (in the attendees copies), but Adam's instance would no longer 
> respond to updates since it would no longer find the record.

Once again, you do not understand how shared events work. A shared event
is a subscription from Adam to the invitees.

> Trivial enough.

Everything is trivial to someone who has no idea how complicated it is.

> To be sure there will be implementation details.

Uh-huh

>> 3) The event is deleted and B-F are notified that the event is deleted
>> so that they can take whatever action is needed (or none) to preserve
>> the event in their own calendars.

> They don't need to.  Everything they knew about the event is kept in 
> their copy of the event record - if implemented as I see it and describe 
> in part above.

>> 3 is the current way it works, it used to be 1 (the only other option
>> that is actually trivial to implement) and 1 is a far worse choice than
>> 3.

> Sez u.

Sez me *and Apple*.

It *used* to be that when an event was deleted the subscriptions were
also deleted. People (rightly) thought that was a terrible idea.

-- 
The trouble with being a god is that you've got no one to pray to.

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#21309

On 2014.03.02, 19:06 , Lewis wrote:
> In message <TcCdnUsfHpy7Lo7OnZ2dnUVZ_uWdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>    Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>> On 2014.03.02, 17:16 , Lewis wrote:
>>> In message <bnhmjvF7sesU1@mid.individual.net>
>>>     Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> wrote:
>>>> On 2014-03-02, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
>>>>> In message <1LydnY8C8d9tyI7OnZ2dnUVZ_uGdnZ2d@giganews.com>
>>>>>     Alan Browne <alan.browne@FreelunchVideotron.ca> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Calendar should allow me to delete my copy of the event without any
>>>>>> effect on their copy of the event and w/o notification to annoy them.
>>>>>
>>>>> Yeah, I can see that working out well. Create a staff meeting, invite
>>>>> everyone to it, delete the staff meeting. Everyone ELSE still shows up.
>>>
>>>> It should be an option. When I delete a shared event, simply ask me
>>>> whether or not to delete it, or at the very least send a notice to
>>>> shared calendars that the event is being deleted from the source
>>>> calendar. It's really that simple.
>>>
>>> He wants to delete it and NOT notify other people it's been deleted.
>
>> To be clear: I want to delete it from _my_ calendar and not annoy others
>> of the fact that it's no longer in _my_ calendar.
>
>>> Basically, he wants to delete the event out from under them and remove
>>> it from their calendars.
>
>> THAT IS NOT WHAT I SAID AT ALL.
>
>> I said, several times, clearly, that I want:
>
>> 1- to delete the PAST event from my calendar
>> 2- not annoy my colleagues with a notifiction
>> 3- that the event could remain in their calendar - it's really no
>> concern of mine at all.
>
>> Or he wants the magic option (which is never
>>> ever going ot happen for many reasons) of deleting the event and then
>>> having everyone else's shared event turn into a non-shared events.
>
>> I never said that at all.  I just want the record on my calendar removed
>> or even (as stated earlier) made invisible.
>
>>>
>>> He also claims this must be 'trivial'
>>>
>>> Here is how it works, for Event Abscam from user Adam:
>>>
>>> Adam creates Abscam.
>>>        invites Bob
>>>        invites carol
>>>        invites Daria
>>>        invites Edward
>>>        invites Frances
>>>        invites George
>>>
>>> Now, what happens if Adam deletes his event?
>>>
>>> 1) Bob, Carol, Daria, Edward, Frances, and George have their events
>>> deleted.
>
>> Why should it?  Just delete it from my calendar.  Done.  They retain all
>> info about the event and who was involved - incl. the originator of the
>> event.
>
>>> 2) B-F do NOT have their events deleted... ok, but now?
>>>
>>>      2a) B-F still have a shared event that lists B-F as invited. But
>>>      there is no owner for the event.
>>>
>>>      2b) B-F no longer have a shared event at all, just an event that
>>>      shows no invitees. Did Daria attend or did she send her assistant
>>>      Dave? No one knows.
>>>
>>> Neither of the 'solutions' in 2 are trivial to implement nor a
>>> reasonable default choice.
>
>> It depends on how the events are stored on each calendar.  If each event
>> has all of the 'attendees' then the links remain.  Indeed, the fact that
>> Adam created the event can remain in the record; even the link would be
>> there (in the attendees copies), but Adam's instance would no longer
>> respond to updates since it would no longer find the record.
>
> Once again, you do not understand how shared events work. A shared event
> is a subscription from Adam to the invitees.

There is nothing to prevent a shared event from being converted to a 
non-shared event, or flagging a "member" as someone no longer sharing, 
or otherwise no longer up-datable.

( Really - taken to its conclusion - if my computer suddenly ceased to 
exist taking the event along with it - they won't know about it at all).

It is a simple notion akin to splitting a sub tree from another tree.

Or to be simple enough for even you - as previously I would be happy if 
the event were made simply invisible on my machine w/o any notice of any 
kind to anyone else.  They wouldn't notice or be affected.

>> Trivial enough.
>
> Everything is trivial to someone who has no idea how complicated it is.

Done things much more complex... that worked, mind you.

>
>> To be sure there will be implementation details.
>
> Uh-huh
>
>>> 3) The event is deleted and B-F are notified that the event is deleted
>>> so that they can take whatever action is needed (or none) to preserve
>>> the event in their own calendars.
>
>> They don't need to.  Everything they knew about the event is kept in
>> their copy of the event record - if implemented as I see it and describe
>> in part above.
>
>>> 3 is the current way it works, it used to be 1 (the only other option
>>> that is actually trivial to implement) and 1 is a far worse choice than
>>> 3.
>
>> Sez u.
>
> Sez me *and Apple*.
>
> It *used* to be that when an event was deleted the subscriptions were
> also deleted. People (rightly) thought that was a terrible idea.

IIRC it *used* to be that I could delete events and I had three options:

-Inform the others.
-Not inform the others.
-Cancel.

-- 
    ... it may be that "in the cloud" really isn't the best term
    for the services these companies offer.  What they really
    want is to have us "on the leash."
                   -David Pogue, Scientific American, 2014.02

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