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Thunderbird or Unison for usenet?

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  Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-23 13:53 +0200
    Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-23 13:36 +0000
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-10-23 15:09 +0100
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2013-10-23 08:46 -0700
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2013-10-23 08:46 -0700
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-23 17:48 +0200
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2013-10-23 08:52 -0700
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-24 02:57 +0000
          Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-24 05:43 +0000
            Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-24 06:46 +0000
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Martin Τrautmann <t-usenet@gmx.net> - 2013-10-24 18:16 +0000
          Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-25 05:01 +0000
          Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> - 2013-10-25 05:24 +0000
    Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) - 2013-10-23 14:57 +0100
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-23 17:49 +0200
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Lloyd E Parsons <lloydparsons@me.com> - 2013-10-23 11:00 -0500
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) - 2013-10-23 19:03 +0100
    Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Jesse <jesse.rehmer@blueworldhosting.com> - 2013-10-23 09:38 -0500
    Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Lloyd  E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-23 12:30 -0500
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-23 19:04 +0000
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Wes Groleau <Groleau+news@FreeShell.org> - 2013-10-23 21:54 -0400
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Lloyd  E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-23 22:27 -0500
    Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Wes Groleau <Groleau+news@FreeShell.org> - 2013-10-23 21:44 -0400
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Wes Groleau <Groleau+news@FreeShell.org> - 2013-10-23 21:51 -0400
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-24 05:40 +0000
          Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Wes Groleau <Groleau+news@FreeShell.org> - 2013-10-24 22:07 -0400
        Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Barry Margolin <barmar@alum.mit.edu> - 2013-10-24 13:27 -0400
          Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Wes Groleau <Groleau+news@FreeShell.org> - 2013-10-24 22:09 -0400
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Sandman <mr@sandman.net> - 2013-10-24 05:38 +0000
    Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Robert Peirce <bob@peirce-family.com> - 2013-10-24 15:44 -0400
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? Lloyd  E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> - 2013-10-24 14:51 -0500
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? snipe@spambin.fsnet.co.uk (Sn!pe) - 2013-10-24 22:25 +0100
      Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? AV3 <arvimide@earthlink.net> - 2013-10-24 21:12 -0400
    Re: Thunderbird or Unison for usenet? jamiekg@wizardling.geek.nz (Jamie Kahn Genet) - 2013-10-25 10:15 +1300

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#18693 — Thunderbird or Unison for usenet?

So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made, 
MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question about what 
software we should use now...

I am currently trying out thunderbird, and I think it's a better 
candidate than Unison even though Unison does look better, but is a more 
rudimentary reader. Thunderbird shares some keyboard settings with MTNW 
for instance.

Both lack *severly* in the filtering department, and frankly, I think 
Panic is more likely to respond to user feedback in that area.

Both have an AIO window scheme, where all "views" can be contained 
within one window. Thunderbird handles this much better by having a read 
pane to the right of the list, with Unison only having it below.

Whichever you choose, the question of synchronization comes up. I use 
MT-NW on my work Mac and my laptop. I use dropbox to synchronize the 
.newsrc file which works seemlessly. MTNW also supports storing the 
.newsrc file on a FTP server for sharing.

Neither Unison or Thunderbird have sharing built in, so do anyone know 
what files to sync (via dropbox, for example) for either to remain in 
sync - I mean syncing filter settings, account settings and group 
subscriptions and read status of those groups?

What is your current plan?

-- 
Sandman[.net]

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#18694

In message <bcprluF2oa2U1@mid.individual.net> 
  Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:
> So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made, 
> MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question about what 
> software we should use now...

The best options for newsreaders have always been the command line
programs. The best of these, IMO. is slrn (which is trivially installed
via mac ports) because of it's extensive scoring system which can be
made to do almost anything, including backflips.

I have slrn setup so that when I post, it uses BBEdit. I store its
config files and newsrc file on Dropbox for syncing across machines (and
platforms, except for iOS).

in .slrnrc:

set editor_command "bbedit -w --resume +%d '%s'"

This will not work with the App Store version of BBEdit.

> I am currently trying out thunderbird, and I think it's a better 
> candidate than Unison even though Unison does look better, but is a more 
> rudimentary reader. Thunderbird shares some keyboard settings with MTNW 
> for instance.

Unison is very limited, ThunderThunderBird is simply broken. I don't
think either is a good choice, but were I forced to choose one of those,
I'd probably go with the more features but broken ThunderBird.

> Both lack *severly* in the filtering department, and frankly, I think 
> Panic is more likely to respond to user feedback in that area.

Yes, but they haven't so far. Maybe if they get a flurry of emails right
now that Mavericks is new they will take a loot at their pathetic and
sad filtering abilities.

> Neither Unison or Thunderbird have sharing built in, so do anyone know 
> what files to sync (via dropbox, for example) for either to remain in 
> sync - I mean syncing filter settings, account settings and group 
> subscriptions and read status of those groups?

This seemed impossible in ThunderBird when I last tried it, it would not
even respect hard links because it destroyed the files and then
recreated them, breaking links. To be fair, this was ages ago.

-- 
"Last night - you were unhinged. You were like some desperate, howling
demon. You frightened me. - Do it again!"

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#18696

In article <slrnl6fk6a.27r3.g.kreme@jaka.local>,
 Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> In message <bcprluF2oa2U1@mid.individual.net> 
>   Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:
> > So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made, 
> > MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question about what 
> > software we should use now...
> 
> The best options for newsreaders have always been the command line
> programs.

Complete cock.

-- 
Tim

"That excessive bail ought not to be required, nor excessive fines imposed,
nor cruel and unusual punishments inflicted"  --  Bill of Rights 1689

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#18700

In article <timstreater-0DF0C2.15092323102013@news.individual.net>,
 Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> wrote:

> In article <slrnl6fk6a.27r3.g.kreme@jaka.local>,
>  Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:
> 
> > In message <bcprluF2oa2U1@mid.individual.net> 
> >   Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:
> > > So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made, 
> > > MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question about what 
> > > software we should use now...
> > 
> > The best options for newsreaders have always been the command line
> > programs.
> 
> Complete cock.

Depends on your perspective, of course.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

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#18699

In article <slrnl6fk6a.27r3.g.kreme@jaka.local>,
 Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> In message <bcprluF2oa2U1@mid.individual.net> 
>   Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:
> > So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made, 
> > MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question about what 
> > software we should use now...
> 
> The best options for newsreaders have always been the command line
> programs. The best of these, IMO. is slrn (which is trivially installed
> via mac ports) because of it's extensive scoring system which can be
> made to do almost anything, including backflips.
> 
> I have slrn setup so that when I post, it uses BBEdit. I store its
> config files and newsrc file on Dropbox for syncing across machines (and
> platforms, except for iOS).
> 
> in .slrnrc:
> 
> set editor_command "bbedit -w --resume +%d '%s'"
> 
> This will not work with the App Store version of BBEdit.

That's probably the route I'll go.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#18701

On 2013-10-23 15:36, Lewis wrote:

> > So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made,
> > MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question
> > about what software we should use now...
 >
> The best options for newsreaders have always been the command line
> programs. The best of these, IMO. is slrn (which is trivially
> installed via mac ports) because of it's extensive scoring system
> which can be made to do almost anything, including backflips.

I've used slrn (and tin) from time to time, and always miss the ability 
to click URL's, which is the single largest problem I have with slrn.

> I have slrn setup so that when I post, it uses BBEdit. I store its
> config files and newsrc file on Dropbox for syncing across machines
> (and platforms, except for iOS).
>
> in .slrnrc:
>
> set editor_command "bbedit -w --resume +%d '%s'"
>
> This will not work with the App Store version of BBEdit.

Why? I mean, I *LOVE* BBEdit, but why not use a command line editor?

Either way, if I was to use slrn/tin I would do so on a remote server, 
SSH'ing in to it to launch slrn, so BBEdit wouldn't be a choice then - 
unless there is a compelling reason to use BBEdit, that is.

Please tell me more about this BB workflow



-- 
Sandman[.net]

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#18704

In article <5267EFBB.9060203@mrsandman.mid.individual.net>,
 Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:

> if I was to use slrn/tin I would do so on a remote server, 
> SSH'ing in to it to launch slrn

That's how I'd do it as well. Simpler that way.

-- 
Send responses to the relevant news group rather than email to me.
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my very hungry SPAM
filter. Due to Google's refusal to prevent spammers from posting
messages through their servers, I often ignore posts from Google
Groups. Use a real news client if you want me to see your posts.

JR

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]

#18735

In message <5267EFBB.9060203@mrsandman.mid.individual.net> 
  Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:
> On 2013-10-23 15:36, Lewis wrote:

>> set editor_command "bbedit -w --resume +%d '%s'"

> Why? I mean, I *LOVE* BBEdit, but why not use a command line editor?

Because BBEdit is better than vim and vim is better than MacVim and
MacVIm is better than everything else.

> Either way, if I was to use slrn/tin I would do so on a remote server, 
> SSH'ing in to it to launch slrn, so BBEdit wouldn't be a choice then - 
> unless there is a compelling reason to use BBEdit, that is.

I run slrn locally.

> Please tell me more about this BB workflow

I hit 'r' to reply, BBEdit opens with the post, I make my post and trim
the extra crap (sometimes) and then close the window. BBEdit asks to
save, I hit enter, and then slrn comes back and confirms the posting.
It's the same workflow as vim.



-- 
I think it would be fun to run a newspaper.

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#18752

In article <slrnl6h34j.r6q.g.kreme@mbp55.local>, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

> >> set editor_command "bbedit -w --resume +%d '%s'"
> 
> > Why? I mean, I *LOVE* BBEdit, but why not use a command line editor?
> 
>  Because BBEdit is better than vim and vim is better than MacVim and
>  MacVIm is better than everything else.

Haha, talk about circular reasoning :)

Anyway, I use BBEdit for programming, and I see your posts are hard 
wrapped. But as far as I know you can't set BBEdit to hardwrap edit from 
the command line, and I don't want to hardwrap it as a general rule. How do 
you manage this?

Using pico/nano, I just use this:

	set editor_command "pico +8,1 -r 75"

To make it hardwrap to 75 columns.

> > Either way, if I was to use slrn/tin I would do so on a remote server, 
> > SSH'ing in to it to launch slrn, so BBEdit wouldn't be a choice then - 
> > unless there is a compelling reason to use BBEdit, that is.
> 
>  I run slrn locally.

Yes :)
 
> > Please tell me more about this BB workflow
> 
>  I hit 'r' to reply, BBEdit opens with the post, I make my post and trim
>  the extra crap (sometimes) and then close the window. BBEdit asks to
>  save, I hit enter, and then slrn comes back and confirms the posting.
>  It's the same workflow as vim.

Right, still curious about the wrapping... 


-- 
Sandman[.net]

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#18753

In message <slrnl6hd7e.4n7.mr@irc.sandman.net> 
  Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:
> In article <slrnl6h34j.r6q.g.kreme@mbp55.local>, Lewis <g.kreme@gmail.com.dontsendmecopies> wrote:

>> >> set editor_command "bbedit -w --resume +%d '%s'"
>> 
>> > Why? I mean, I *LOVE* BBEdit, but why not use a command line editor?
>> 
>>  Because BBEdit is better than vim and vim is better than MacVim and
>>  MacVIm is better than everything else.

> Haha, talk about circular reasoning :)

>Anyway, I use BBEdit for programming, and I see your posts are hard
>wrapped. But as far as I know you can't set BBEdit to hardwrap edit
>from the command line, and I don't want to hardwrap it as a general
>rule. How do you manage this?

Command-Option-'

> Using pico/nano, I just use this:

> 	set editor_command "pico +8,1 -r 75"

Yes, that is one advantage of using an editor other than BBEdit.

>> > Please tell me more about this BB workflow
>> 
>>  I hit 'r' to reply, BBEdit opens with the post, I make my post and trim
>>  the extra crap (sometimes) and then close the window. BBEdit asks to
>>  save, I hit enter, and then slrn comes back and confirms the posting.
>>  It's the same workflow as vim.

> Right, still curious about the wrapping... 




-- 
And she was looking at herself
And things were looking like a movie
She had a pleasant elevation
She's moving out in all directions

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#18771

On Wed, 23 Oct 2013 17:48:11 +0200, Sandman wrote:
>  I've used slrn (and tin) from time to time, and always miss the ability 
>  to click URL's, which is the single largest problem I have with slrn.

a ctrl-click is not an option for you?

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#18783

In article <slrnl6ip0p.1ch0.t-usenet@ID-685.user.individual.de>, Martin Τrautmann <t-usenet@gmx.net> wrote:

> >  I've used slrn (and tin) from time to time, and always miss the ability 
> >  to click URL's, which is the single largest problem I have with slrn.
> 
>  a ctrl-click is not an option for you?

Yeah, it appears that the Terminal app in OSX handles URL's pretty ok. 
Problem solved!

-- 
Sandman[.net]

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#18784

In message <slrnl6ip0p.1ch0.t-usenet@ID-685.user.individual.de> 
  Martin Τrautmann <t-usenet@gmx.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 23 Oct 2013 17:48:11 +0200, Sandman wrote:
>>  I've used slrn (and tin) from time to time, and always miss the ability 
>>  to click URL's, which is the single largest problem I have with slrn.

> a ctrl-click is not an option for you?

That just brings up the contextual menu.

Command-double click is what you want.

-- 
"Oh damn", said Maladict.

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#18695

Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:

> So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made, 
> MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question about what
> software we should use now...

[...]

> What is your current plan?

Personally, I'm going to continue using MacSOUP. 
IMO it's by far the best newsreader for text Usenet.

-- 
^Ï^.      Sn!pe      <snipe@notforspam.fsnet.co.uk> 
 
My pet rock Gordon just is. 
 

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#18702

On 2013-10-23 15:57, Sn!pe wrote:

>> What is your current plan?
 >
> Personally, I'm going to continue using MacSOUP. IMO it's by far the
> best newsreader for text Usenet.

Right, thanks. I used to look in to that a decade ago and it was ugly 
and cumbersome as hell. I'll look in to it again.

How do you sync settings between machines?

-- 
Sandman[.net]

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#18706

On 10/23/13, 10:49 AM, Sandman wrote:
> On 2013-10-23 15:57, Sn!pe wrote:
>
>>> What is your current plan?
>  >
>> Personally, I'm going to continue using MacSOUP. IMO it's by far the
>> best newsreader for text Usenet.
>
> Right, thanks. I used to look in to that a decade ago and it was ugly
> and cumbersome as hell. I'll look in to it again.
>
> How do you sync settings between machines?
>
I just looked at a screen shot of MacSoup.  Still ugly as hell!

-- 
Lloyd

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#18712

Sandman <mr@sandman.net> wrote:

> On 2013-10-23 15:57, Sn!pe wrote:

[MacSOUP text-only newsreader]

> Right, thanks. I used to look in to that a decade ago and it was ugly
> and cumbersome as hell. I'll look in to it again.
> 
> How do you sync settings between machines?

That's beyond my competence to answer but the author, Stefan Haller, 
has been very helpful to me in the past; I'm think that it can 
be done. There's a link to his email on the MacSOUP web site:-
<http://www.haller-berlin.de/macsoup/index.html> 

Also, there are clueful people in news.software.readers. Put [MacSOUP]
in your Subject: line to gain their attention.

MacSOUP is actively maintained and there is a fully-functional
evaluation version available for free download, I suggest that you 
try it.  

FWIW MacSOUP is by far my favourite newsreader and I've tried many
'readers (including Thunderbird and Unison) on MacOS X, Linux and
Windows during 18 years on Usenet. YMMV. 

Disclaimer: I have no connection with Stefan other than as a satisfied
customer.

-- 
^Ï^.      Sn!pe      <snipe@notforspam.fsnet.co.uk> 
 
My pet rock Gordon just is. 
 

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#18697

Sandman wrote:
> So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made,
> MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question about what
> software we should use now...
> 
> I am currently trying out thunderbird, and I think it's a better
> candidate than Unison even though Unison does look better, but is a more
> rudimentary reader. Thunderbird shares some keyboard settings with MTNW
> for instance.
> 
> Both lack *severly* in the filtering department, and frankly, I think
> Panic is more likely to respond to user feedback in that area.
> 
> Both have an AIO window scheme, where all "views" can be contained
> within one window. Thunderbird handles this much better by having a read
> pane to the right of the list, with Unison only having it below.
> 
> Whichever you choose, the question of synchronization comes up. I use
> MT-NW on my work Mac and my laptop. I use dropbox to synchronize the
> .newsrc file which works seemlessly. MTNW also supports storing the
> .newsrc file on a FTP server for sharing.
> 
> Neither Unison or Thunderbird have sharing built in, so do anyone know
> what files to sync (via dropbox, for example) for either to remain in
> sync - I mean syncing filter settings, account settings and group
> subscriptions and read status of those groups?
> 
> What is your current plan?
> 

I love Unison's interface, but it sucks for posting text articles.  It
formats everything flowed and has no ability to automatically wrap lines
appropriately.  There are bugs in its Message-ID generation, where if
the server doesn't offer a suggestion it forms a Message-ID that is not
compliant.  It's filtering capabilities are not that bad IMO, but I
don't ever see the need for filtering, but that is just my own Usenet
experience.

I use Thunderbird/Postbox for posting text articles now.  I wish I could
combine the Unison interface since it is slightly more intuitive and
built around newsgroups and not e-mail.  All else aside Thunderbird
makes a solid Usenet client for the modern Mac.

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#18711

On 2013-10-23 11:53:37 +0000, Sandman said:

> So, being abandoned by the best usenet software ever made, 
> MT-NewsWatcher, I among many of you are stuck in the question about 
> what software we should use now...
> 
> I am currently trying out thunderbird, and I think it's a better 
> candidate than Unison even though Unison does look better, but is a 
> more rudimentary reader. Thunderbird shares some keyboard settings with 
> MTNW for instance.
> 
> Both lack *severly* in the filtering department, and frankly, I think 
> Panic is more likely to respond to user feedback in that area.
> 
> Both have an AIO window scheme, where all "views" can be contained 
> within one window. Thunderbird handles this much better by having a 
> read pane to the right of the list, with Unison only having it below.
> 
> Whichever you choose, the question of synchronization comes up. I use 
> MT-NW on my work Mac and my laptop. I use dropbox to synchronize the 
> .newsrc file which works seemlessly. MTNW also supports storing the 
> .newsrc file on a FTP server for sharing.
> 
> Neither Unison or Thunderbird have sharing built in, so do anyone know 
> what files to sync (via dropbox, for example) for either to remain in 
> sync - I mean syncing filter settings, account settings and group 
> subscriptions and read status of those groups?
> 
> What is your current plan?

Since this morning and playing around some more with newsreaders, I've 
decided that I like Unison enough to buy it.  So I did.  Simple and 
easy enough and all I do is text usenet, no binaries.  Works quite well.

Tried to like Thunderbird, but couldn't.  I kept getting 'expired post' 
errors off and on and that required a close and restart every time.  
Same server, same groups with Unison arene't doing that.  That error 
was the final straw.  I didn't like T-bird much when I tried it a long 
time ago and still don't.

Unison seems to be good enough for my uses.

BTW, tried Hogwasher but it won't get the groups list, always popping 
up an 'internal error' message.

-- 
Lloyd

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#18716

On 2013-10-23, Lloyd E Parsons <lloydp21@live.com> wrote:

>> What is your current plan?
>
> Since this morning and playing around some more with newsreaders, I've 
> decided that I like Unison enough to buy it.  So I did.  Simple and 
> easy enough and all I do is text usenet, no binaries.  Works quite well.

Unison is a good enough program for the casual usenet poster, but it lacks many features for the advanced user. I, for one, need to filter my own messages, plus replies to my messages, plus threads I've participated in - for starters.

I wrote a post on my site about what Panic can do to improve Unison:

http://mac.sandman.net/pages/thoughts/2013-10-23/Switching_To_Unison

The UI stuff is pretty ok in Thunderbird, but the UI is *nicer* in Unison. The UI in MTNW was rudimentary, but very functional. 



-- 
Sandman[.net]

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