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About safe and unsafe languages..

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  About safe and unsafe languages.. aminer68@gmail.com - 2020-01-19 14:54 -0800
    Re: About safe and unsafe languages.. Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2020-01-19 23:22 -0800
      Re: About safe and unsafe languages.. Wisdom90 <d@d.d> - 2020-01-20 04:48 -0500
        Re: About safe and unsafe languages.. Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2020-01-20 02:11 -0800
          Re: About safe and unsafe languages.. Wisdom90 <d@d.d> - 2020-01-20 08:07 -0500
          Re: About safe and unsafe languages.. aminer68@gmail.com - 2020-01-20 05:20 -0800

#10518 — About safe and unsafe languages..

Hello,


As you have noticed i have just posted previously about 
safe languages like ADA and unsafe languages like C and C++, 
now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages:

About safe and unsafe languages..

We use the term safe to refer to languages that automatically
perform runtime checks to prevent programs from violating the 
bounds of allocated memory. Safe languages must provide two 
properties to ensure that programs respect allocation bounds: 
memory safety and type safety.

Memory safety is the real goal, it means that the program 
will not read or write data outside the bounds of allocated 
regions. To achieve memory safety, a language must also enforce
type safety so that it can keep track of the memory allocation
bounds. Without type safety, any arbitrary value could be used
as a reference into memory.

Beyond the possibility of buffer overflow, unsafe languages, 
such as C and C++, value compile-time optimization and concise 
expression over safety and comprehensibility, which are key 
features of safe languages. This difference in priorities is 
evidenced by the fact that most unsafe languages allow programs
to directly access low-level system resources, including memory.
In contrast, safe languages must explicitly control the ways 
programs are allowed to access resources, to prevent violations
of the properties that they guarantee.

Fundamental to the trade-off between safe and unsafe languages
is the concept of trust. Unsafe languages implicitly trust the 
programmer, while safe languages explicitly limit the operations
that they allow in exchange for the capability to prevent programs
from making potentially damaging mistakes. The result is that 
unsafe languages are more powerful with respect to the operations 
that can be performed, while safe languages provide greater reusable
functionality with built-in protections that often make programmers
more efficient. Another side-effect of a small set of low-level 
operations is that complex problems can typically be solved more 
concisely in unsafe languages, which is often seen as another 
advantage over safe languages.

Many of the distinctions that often accompany the difference
between safe and unsafe languages are technically unnecessary.
It is possible to implement a safe language that provides a 
small instruction set and low-level access to nonmemory 
resources, such as the network and filesystem. However, 
because the additional record keeping and checks required 
to make a language safe degrade the performance of compile-time
optimization strategies, memory-safe languages have typically
been deemed unacceptable for certain types of programs. 

Recently, security concerns have prompted limited reconsideration
of these tradeoffs. Safe languages designed with performance and
flexibility in mind have been created in academic circles and 
have been shown to effectively prevent buffer overflow 
vulnerabilities, albeit at a performance cost. The section on 
safe C dialects gives an overview of two of the more complete
implementations.


Thank you,
Amine Moulay Ramdane.

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#10522

On Monday, 20 January 2020 00:54:08 UTC+2, amin...@gmail.com  wrote:
> Hello,
> 
> 
> As you have noticed i have just posted previously about 
> safe languages like ADA and unsafe languages like C and C++, 
> now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages:
> 
> About safe and unsafe languages..

snip copy paste text from:
"Secure Programming with Static Analysis" by Brian Chess and Jacob West.

When you do copy from book then also tell readers what book it was.
Otherwise people think that you try to look smart by plagiarizing
texts (that you maybe did not even understand) from other people's
works.

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#10523

On 1/20/2020 2:22 AM, Öö Tiib wrote:
> On Monday, 20 January 2020 00:54:08 UTC+2, amin...@gmail.com  wrote:
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>> As you have noticed i have just posted previously about
>> safe languages like ADA and unsafe languages like C and C++,
>> now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages:
>>
>> About safe and unsafe languages..
> 
> snip copy paste text from:
> "Secure Programming with Static Analysis" by Brian Chess and Jacob West.
> 
> When you do copy from book then also tell readers what book it was.
> Otherwise people think that you try to look smart by plagiarizing
> texts (that you maybe did not even understand) from other people's
> works.
> 

Hello,


Yes I bought this book of "Secure Programming with Static Analysis"
and i posted this tiny part of it about safe and unsafe languages.


Thank you,
Amine Moulay Ramdane.

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#10524

On Monday, 20 January 2020 11:48:49 UTC+2, Wisdom90  wrote:
> On 1/20/2020 2:22 AM, Öö Tiib wrote:
> > On Monday, 20 January 2020 00:54:08 UTC+2, amin...@gmail.com  wrote:
> >> Hello,
> >>
> >>
> >> As you have noticed i have just posted previously about
> >> safe languages like ADA and unsafe languages like C and C++,
> >> now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages:
> >>
> >> About safe and unsafe languages..
> > 
> > snip copy paste text from:
> > "Secure Programming with Static Analysis" by Brian Chess and Jacob West.
> > 
> > When you do copy from book then also tell readers what book it was.
> > Otherwise people think that you try to look smart by plagiarizing
> > texts (that you maybe did not even understand) from other people's
> > works.
> > 
> 
> Hello,
> 
> 
> Yes I bought this book of "Secure Programming with Static Analysis"
> and i posted this tiny part of it about safe and unsafe languages.
> 
> 
> Thank you,
> Amine Moulay Ramdane.

What I meant was that you should not write that:

    now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages

You should write that:

    Brian Chess and Jacob West write in "Secure Programming with
    Static Analysis" about safe and unsafe languages

Otherwise it seems that you try to hide that these are ideas
of Brian Chess and Jacob West and instead try to leave
impression that these are your own ideas. It is unfair
towards them. Always give credit to people whose words
you use.

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#10525

On 1/20/2020 5:11 AM, Öö Tiib wrote:
> On Monday, 20 January 2020 11:48:49 UTC+2, Wisdom90  wrote:
>> On 1/20/2020 2:22 AM, Öö Tiib wrote:
>>> On Monday, 20 January 2020 00:54:08 UTC+2, amin...@gmail.com  wrote:
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> As you have noticed i have just posted previously about
>>>> safe languages like ADA and unsafe languages like C and C++,
>>>> now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages:
>>>>
>>>> About safe and unsafe languages..
>>>
>>> snip copy paste text from:
>>> "Secure Programming with Static Analysis" by Brian Chess and Jacob West.
>>>
>>> When you do copy from book then also tell readers what book it was.
>>> Otherwise people think that you try to look smart by plagiarizing
>>> texts (that you maybe did not even understand) from other people's
>>> works.
>>>
>>
>> Hello,
>>
>>
>> Yes I bought this book of "Secure Programming with Static Analysis"
>> and i posted this tiny part of it about safe and unsafe languages.
>>
>>
>> Thank you,
>> Amine Moulay Ramdane.
> 
> What I meant was that you should not write that:
> 
>      now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages
> 
> You should write that:
> 
>      Brian Chess and Jacob West write in "Secure Programming with
>      Static Analysis" about safe and unsafe languages
> 
> Otherwise it seems that you try to hide that these are ideas
> of Brian Chess and Jacob West and instead try to leave
> impression that these are your own ideas. It is unfair
> towards them. Always give credit to people whose words
> you use.
> 


Sorry about that, that's what i will do the next time.


Thank you,
Amine Moulay Ramdane.

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#10526

On Monday, January 20, 2020 at 5:11:47 AM UTC-5, Öö Tiib wrote:
> On Monday, 20 January 2020 11:48:49 UTC+2, Wisdom90  wrote:
> > On 1/20/2020 2:22 AM, Öö Tiib wrote:
> > > On Monday, 20 January 2020 00:54:08 UTC+2, amin...@gmail.com  wrote:
> > >> Hello,
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> As you have noticed i have just posted previously about
> > >> safe languages like ADA and unsafe languages like C and C++,
> > >> now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages:
> > >>
> > >> About safe and unsafe languages..
> > > 
> > > snip copy paste text from:
> > > "Secure Programming with Static Analysis" by Brian Chess and Jacob West.
> > > 
> > > When you do copy from book then also tell readers what book it was.
> > > Otherwise people think that you try to look smart by plagiarizing
> > > texts (that you maybe did not even understand) from other people's
> > > works.
> > > 
> > 
> > Hello,
> > 
> > 
> > Yes I bought this book of "Secure Programming with Static Analysis"
> > and i posted this tiny part of it about safe and unsafe languages.
> > 
> > 
> > Thank you,
> > Amine Moulay Ramdane.
> 
> What I meant was that you should not write that:
> 
>     now i will write more about safe and unsafe languages
> 
> You should write that:
> 
>     Brian Chess and Jacob West write in "Secure Programming with
>     Static Analysis" about safe and unsafe languages
> 
> Otherwise it seems that you try to hide that these are ideas
> of Brian Chess and Jacob West and instead try to leave
> impression that these are your own ideas. It is unfair
> towards them. Always give credit to people whose words
> you use.

Sorry about that, that's what i will do the next time.


Thank you,
Amine Moulay Ramdane.

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