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Groups > comp.os.linux.misc > #93793 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2026-10-16 03:26 +0000 |
| Last post | 2026-10-18 10:59 +0000 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 217 — 22 participants |
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Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 03:26 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 00:00 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 04:33 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 21:53 -0700
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 01:31 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 06:08 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:39 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:49 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:53 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 05:26 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:29 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:31 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:16 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-16 19:42 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:44 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:55 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:20 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:20 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:09 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 12:54 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:15 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:05 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 14:54 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 16:46 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 16:57 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 19:01 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:11 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 14:48 -0700
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Harold Stevens <wookie@bookworm.localdomain> - 2026-10-17 08:26 -0500
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 15:01 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 22:11 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:52 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:30 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:17 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 02:30 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:54 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 04:32 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 09:39 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 05:58 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:55 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:43 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:19 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 03:48 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 02:20 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-17 06:37 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:59 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:20 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:50 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:48 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 20:15 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:36 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 14:57 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 23:16 -0700
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 18:27 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 23:43 +0000
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:27 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 04:15 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:41 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:00 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:57 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:26 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:56 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 13:07 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:26 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:32 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:21 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:16 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:53 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 06:02 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 23:26 -0700
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 06:42 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 07:41 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 06:39 +0000
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:54 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:19 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:40 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:52 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:07 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:28 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:26 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 12:40 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:46 +0000
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 20:08 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nick Charles <none@none.none> - 2026-10-16 23:19 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 02:29 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-17 01:54 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:58 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:25 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "De ongekruisigde ds." <ongekruisigde-ds@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 10:59 +0000
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 22:21 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <11au4hl$3k12p$17@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #93915 |
On 16/10/2026 20:32, rbowman wrote: > On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 13:07:22 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > >> There is very little difference. Only in degree. >> That why the English are the best engineers in the world. They can work >> a slide rule AND a torque wrench > > Even back in the '60s there were a number of Indian students. If you got > one as a lab partner you let them run the slide rule but never let them > touch a screwdriver. Typically they were upper middle class, very > intelligent, but they'd never taken stuff apart and put it back together > like most US kids who wound up in an engineering school. > Yes. I know that type. They are natural software people as you don't get your hands dirty. Don't get me started on the middle easterners though... -- "Nature does not give up the winter because people dislike the cold." ― Confucius
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-17 04:04 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <njgaf5Fit4rU35@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #93927 |
On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 22:21:57 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > On 16/10/2026 20:32, rbowman wrote: >> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 13:07:22 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote: >> >>> There is very little difference. Only in degree. >>> That why the English are the best engineers in the world. They can >>> work a slide rule AND a torque wrench >> >> Even back in the '60s there were a number of Indian students. If you >> got one as a lab partner you let them run the slide rule but never let >> them touch a screwdriver. Typically they were upper middle class, very >> intelligent, but they'd never taken stuff apart and put it back >> together like most US kids who wound up in an engineering school. >> > Yes. I know that type. They are natural software people as you don't get > your hands dirty. > Don't get me started on the middle easterners though... I've not had any exposure to them other than the people on the food trucks. We did bid on a Saudi contract. When they did the site visit I had to take down my flying pig mobile lest it offend them. Even better it was a take off on Harley 'hogs' so the pig had a leather jacket and motorcycle goggles. Back when I was working with FORTH there were some contracts available at the King Fucknut airport in Riyadh. Hard pass. There isn't enough money.
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-17 09:24 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <11avbcf$59n$9@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #93967 |
On 17/10/2026 05:04, rbowman wrote: > On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 22:21:57 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > >> Don't get me started on the middle easterners though... > > I've not had any exposure to them other than the people on the food > trucks. We did bid on a Saudi contract. When they did the site visit I had > to take down my flying pig mobile lest it offend them. Even better it was > a take off on Harley 'hogs' so the pig had a leather jacket and motorcycle > goggles. > We were selling radar and weapons systems to them back in the 1960s. The intelligent ones expected someone one else to do the hands on work, and the less intelligent ones were all for putting their trust is kismet rather than the instruction manual. 'point ion general direction and spray ten clips, and Allah will select the targets' is sometimes a good strategy, just not very often > Back when I was working with FORTH there were some contracts available at > the King Fucknut airport in Riyadh. Hard pass. There isn't enough money. > Yeah. here in the horse racing capital of the world, we have some mighty fine gold plated residences. And immaculate pastures and stables But you seldom see any of them, Very private -- New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in someone else's pocket.
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 19:27 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <njfc4qFit4rU24@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #93849 |
On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 11:14:28 -0000 (UTC), Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 10:56:15 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>
>>> Ah: you reduced the problem to a known one with known complexity in
>>> order to derive an upper bound! :o)
>>
>> Typical CS remark
>>
>> No, we safely pulled a motor out of a forklift truck.
>>
>> The guy doing it was a great guy, Trained as a diesel fitter. Proper
>> engineer of the old school sort.
>
> Mh, this reminds me that I will never wrap my head around the fact that
> English uses the same word ("engineer") for a person who works with a
> slide rule and a pencil and a person who works with a wrench.
No, an engineer is the guy who drives the train.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfCthmyq-Ig
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 22:20 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <11au4en$3k12p$16@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #93913 |
On 16/10/2026 20:27, rbowman wrote:
> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 11:14:28 -0000 (UTC), Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 10:56:15 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> Ah: you reduced the problem to a known one with known complexity in
>>>> order to derive an upper bound! :o)
>>>
>>> Typical CS remark
>>>
>>> No, we safely pulled a motor out of a forklift truck.
>>>
>>> The guy doing it was a great guy, Trained as a diesel fitter. Proper
>>> engineer of the old school sort.
>>
>> Mh, this reminds me that I will never wrap my head around the fact that
>> English uses the same word ("engineer") for a person who works with a
>> slide rule and a pencil and a person who works with a wrench.
>
> No, an engineer is the guy who drives the train.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfCthmyq-Ig
>
Etymology of "Engineer"
Latin Root (ingenium): Derived from the Latin word ingenium,
meaning innate quality, natural talent, or clever invention (literally
"that which is inborn").
Old French (engigneor): Evolved into Old French as engigneor or
engignier, originally denoting a builder of military siege engines (like
catapults and trebuchets) as well as a schemer or trickster.
Middle English (enginour): Appeared in the mid-14th century as
enginour, meaning a constructor of military engines.
Semantic Broadening: By the 15th century, it shifted to mean a
general designer or inventor. By the 17th–19th centuries during the
Industrial Revolution, it expanded from military machinery to civil
public works (bridges, roads, canals) and mechanical systems
Nowhere is it the guy who drives a train. Except in third world nations
who cant spik Inglish ;-)
Only in some strange lexical world is it someone who uses 'applied
science' to do anything.
Since engineers predate scientists
--
Microsoft : the best reason to go to Linux that ever existed.
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| From | Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-17 01:13 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <11auej2$3nk2l$3@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #93913 |
On 2026-10-16, rbowman wrote:
> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 11:14:28 -0000 (UTC), Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 10:56:15 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>
>>
>>>> Ah: you reduced the problem to a known one with known complexity in
>>>> order to derive an upper bound! :o)
>>>
>>> Typical CS remark
>>>
>>> No, we safely pulled a motor out of a forklift truck.
>>>
>>> The guy doing it was a great guy, Trained as a diesel fitter. Proper
>>> engineer of the old school sort.
>>
>> Mh, this reminds me that I will never wrap my head around the fact that
>> English uses the same word ("engineer") for a person who works with a
>> slide rule and a pencil and a person who works with a wrench.
>
> No, an engineer is the guy who drives the train.
This. And also a person who is controlling a bunch of the flight systems
in some aircraft models, like the right side of this photo:
<http://www.saveconcordegroup.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/G-BOAC1.jpg>
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfCthmyq-Ig
>
--
Nuno Silva
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| From | Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-17 02:32 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <11aumns$3r5cq$4@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #93849 |
On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 11:14:28 -0000 (UTC), Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
> Mh, this reminds me that I will never wrap my head around the fact
> that English uses the same word ("engineer") for a person who works
> with a slide rule and a pencil and a person who works with a wrench.
The original meaning of “engine” referred to any kind of device or
contraption. The slide rule itself was a calculation engine.
If it helps, the word has the same root as “ingenuity”.
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| From | Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <ccPAS.187044$iS_f.90305@fx06.iad> |
| In reply to | #93958 |
On 2026-10-17, Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 11:14:28 -0000 (UTC), Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
>
>> Mh, this reminds me that I will never wrap my head around the fact
>> that English uses the same word ("engineer") for a person who works
>> with a slide rule and a pencil and a person who works with a wrench.
>
> The original meaning of “engine” referred to any kind of device or
> contraption. The slide rule itself was a calculation engine.
And now we have search engines...
> If it helps, the word has the same root as “ingenuity”.
--
/~\ Charlie Gibbs | In this world there are
\ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | two kinds of people:
X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | 1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \ if you read it the right way. | from incomplete data.
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-18 03:04 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <njirakFei39U23@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #94056 |
On Sat, 17 Oct 2026 18:33:44 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
> On 2026-10-17, Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 11:14:28 -0000 (UTC), Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
>>
>>> Mh, this reminds me that I will never wrap my head around the fact
>>> that English uses the same word ("engineer") for a person who works
>>> with a slide rule and a pencil and a person who works with a wrench.
>>
>> The original meaning of “engine” referred to any kind of device or
>> contraption. The slide rule itself was a calculation engine.
>
> And now we have search engines...
And the V8 engine... I read a couple of days ago that Dahl, the creator
of Node.js, has moved on to a new scheme based on the Cloudflare model.
https://thenewstack.io/cloudflare-acquires-deno-ryan-dahl/
He said his attempt to fix node with deno failed because of the industry
demand that it be compatible with node. Sometimes you can get away with
breaking changes, sometimes not.
bun was another attempt but Anthropic bought it and appears to be making
it a dispenser of Claude AI slop. Think I'll stick with Node and Express.
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-18 11:41 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <11b27p2$11pis$3@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #94056 |
On 17/10/2026 19:33, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
> On 2026-10-17, Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 11:14:28 -0000 (UTC), Tapiro Ubriaco wrote:
>>
>>> Mh, this reminds me that I will never wrap my head around the fact
>>> that English uses the same word ("engineer") for a person who works
>>> with a slide rule and a pencil and a person who works with a wrench.
>>
>> The original meaning of “engine” referred to any kind of device or
>> contraption. The slide rule itself was a calculation engine.
>
> And now we have search engines...
>
>> If it helps, the word has the same root as “ingenuity”.
>
Yes to all that. It was originally the art of making mechanisms.
Primarily for war.
US corrupted it to mean 'driver' or 'machine controller'
Europe corrupted it to mean 'man with a technical degree' - especially a
second class SCIENTIST.
In the UK it's always been a man who makes stuff that hasn't been made
before. Otherwise its a technician or a mechanic
--
The lifetime of any political organisation is about three years before
its been subverted by the people it tried to warn you about.
Anon.
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| From | John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-18 12:45 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <11b27vf$124l8$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #94136 |
On 18/10/2026 12:41, The Natural Philosopher wrote: [engineer] > Europe corrupted it to mean 'man with a technical degree' - especially a > second class SCIENTIST. At least in the Netherlands we (used to?) have ing, what you call a second class SCIENTIST, and ir which is a first class SCIENTISTS. -- Static tumblelog generator: https://github.com/john-bokma/tumblelog/ Available as Python or Perl. Example tumblelog: https://plurrrr.com/
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 19:24 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <njfc03Fit4rU23@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #93813 |
On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 09:26:10 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > The lads were preparing to lift the engine out of IIRC a fork lift truck > using a chain hoist strapped to a wooden beam or rather insubstantial > proportions. I stopped them : > "We ought to calculate if that beam can take it" > "Don't worry, it can" > "How do you know" > "Because we used it to pull a bigger motor out last week when you > weren't looking" The first company I worked for chose to assemble the larger machines on the 3rd floor and fabricate small parts on the 1st floor for unknown reasons. They finally built a machine that wouldn't fit into the elevator. Like many old mills, there was a door that opened to the outside. One weekend the managers rigged a boom and tried to lower the machine with a hoist. The boom failed. Come Monday the grunts got to repair the damage. Moral: don't let the director of engineering, an EE, do CE calculations.
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 22:16 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <11au47v$3k12p$15@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #93912 |
On 16/10/2026 20:24, rbowman wrote: > On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 09:26:10 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > >> The lads were preparing to lift the engine out of IIRC a fork lift truck >> using a chain hoist strapped to a wooden beam or rather insubstantial >> proportions. I stopped them : >> "We ought to calculate if that beam can take it" >> "Don't worry, it can" >> "How do you know" >> "Because we used it to pull a bigger motor out last week when you >> weren't looking" > > The first company I worked for chose to assemble the larger machines on > the 3rd floor and fabricate small parts on the 1st floor for unknown > reasons. They finally built a machine that wouldn't fit into the elevator. > Like many old mills, there was a door that opened to the outside. > > One weekend the managers rigged a boom and tried to lower the machine with > a hoist. The boom failed. Come Monday the grunts got to repair the damage. > Moral: don't let the director of engineering, an EE, do CE calculations. LOL Fist engine I lifted out we used a 5 ton block and tackle designed for yacht use. Whole car was less than 2 tons Engine got stuck but we kept on heaving. Now that block may have nee able to withstand 5 tons, but it was bent to buggery just with under two. Floor beams are not specified for the load they can carry without breaking, they are specified for the load they can carry without the floor looking like a saucer. Aircraft wings are specified for the load they can stand without buckling, They bend all over the shop in flight -- "What do you think about Gay Marriage?" "I don't." "Don't what?" "Think about Gay Marriage."
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| From | "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-17 22:53 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <vr3dqmxr17.ln2@Telcontar.valinor> |
| In reply to | #93912 |
On 2026-10-16 21:24, rbowman wrote: > On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 09:26:10 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > >> The lads were preparing to lift the engine out of IIRC a fork lift truck >> using a chain hoist strapped to a wooden beam or rather insubstantial >> proportions. I stopped them : >> "We ought to calculate if that beam can take it" >> "Don't worry, it can" >> "How do you know" >> "Because we used it to pull a bigger motor out last week when you >> weren't looking" > > The first company I worked for chose to assemble the larger machines on > the 3rd floor and fabricate small parts on the 1st floor for unknown > reasons. They finally built a machine that wouldn't fit into the elevator. > Like many old mills, there was a door that opened to the outside. > > One weekend the managers rigged a boom and tried to lower the machine with > a hoist. The boom failed. Come Monday the grunts got to repair the damage. > Moral: don't let the director of engineering, an EE, do CE calculations. In Spain, the Telefónica exchanges were built like that. Maybe three levels, each one very tall (allowing to have cables under a false floor and also above the tall racks). Each level had a huge door to the outside, with iron beams above to attach pulleys. And two removable rails. I never saw one of those working. Now they are almost empty, using VoIP machinery that I have not seen. -- Cheers, Carlos. ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;
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| From | Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 06:02 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <11asel3$31l32$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #93798 |
On Thu, 15 Oct 2026 21:53:57 -0700, Peyton wrote: > I one time worked with a colleague who did not understand why a C# > binary executable was running significantly faster than a Python > script. Tell me again, why does C♯ exist? Beyond being some kind of corporate vanity project started by Bill Gates after Sun gave him a good hiding over his attempts to hijack Java?
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| From | "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-15 23:26 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <87a4oe40v3.fsf@solcaium.us> |
| In reply to | #93802 |
Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> writes: > On Thu, 15 Oct 2026 21:53:57 -0700, Peyton wrote: > >> I one time worked with a colleague who did not understand why a C# >> binary executable was running significantly faster than a Python >> script. > > Tell me again, why does C♯ exist? Beyond being some kind of corporate > vanity project started by Bill Gates after Sun gave him a good hiding > over his attempts to hijack Java? Something like that. Java got popular, and Microsoft didn't have control over it. Microsoft feared that if Java got big enough they could bend them over. So Microsoft created their own implementation of Java, Sun sued so they created C#. --
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| From | rbowman <bowman@montana.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 06:42 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <njdvb5Fit4rU14@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #93805 |
On Thu, 15 Oct 2026 23:26:40 -0700, Peyton wrote: > Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> writes: > >> On Thu, 15 Oct 2026 21:53:57 -0700, Peyton wrote: >> >>> I one time worked with a colleague who did not understand why a C# >>> binary executable was running significantly faster than a Python >>> script. >> >> Tell me again, why does C♯ exist? Beyond being some kind of corporate >> vanity project started by Bill Gates after Sun gave him a good hiding >> over his attempts to hijack Java? > > Something like that. Java got popular, and Microsoft didn't have control > over it. Microsoft feared that if Java got big enough they could bend > them over. So Microsoft created their own implementation of Java, Sun > sued so they created C#. Visual J++ was superior when it came to coding in the Microsoft ecosystem. As you say, Sun sued so the short lived J# was created, followed by C#. C# is an improvement on Java, which is slow and bloated. It's telling that back in the day IBM's skunkworks created the jikes Java compiler which was much faster than javac.
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| From | Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 07:41 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <11askeu$33cuk$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #93805 |
On Thu, 15 Oct 2026 23:26:40 -0700, Peyton wrote: > Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> writes: > >> On Thu, 15 Oct 2026 21:53:57 -0700, Peyton wrote: >> >>> I one time worked with a colleague who did not understand why a C# >>> binary executable was running significantly faster than a Python >>> script. >> >> Tell me again, why does C♯ exist? Beyond being some kind of >> corporate vanity project started by Bill Gates after Sun gave him a >> good hiding over his attempts to hijack Java? > > Something like that. Java got popular, and Microsoft didn't have > control over it. Microsoft feared that if Java got big enough they > could bend them over. So Microsoft created their own implementation > of Java, Sun sued so they created C#. Here’s another fun thing. Microsoft has been offering Python API access to Excel users -- and it wants to charge extra for that. Guess it figures the users are too dumb to figure out they can bypass Microsoft, and Excel, and make use of Python for free. You think they could get away with doing that with C♯? Somehow I don’t think so ...
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| From | Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 06:39 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <18deef3d76b2b714$10949$2836843$802601b3@news.usenetexpress.com> |
| In reply to | #93802 |
On Fri, 16 Oct 2026 06:02:11 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > > Tell me again, why does C♯ exist? Beyond being some kind of corporate > vanity project started by Bill Gates after Sun gave him a good hiding > over his attempts to hijack Java? > C# is the most abominable concoction to ever emerge from the human mind but it, like the failed XPS and WMV formats, represents Microsoft's intention to dominate all of computing. Unfortunately, in this case they succeeded. C# is the dominant choice for most corporate computing projects and consequently it has sucked in hordes of C# code monkeys that are falsely labeled as "programmers." But this thread is about Decimal Floating Point (DFP). DFP is the preferred format for all calculations. However, only IBM Power processors contain the hardware to implement DFP. All other systems must use software DFP routines. GNU/Linux needs DFP libraries but, as indicated, these are no longer being maintained. Most "programmers" will only respond with blank stares and gaping mouths.
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| From | c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-10-16 04:22 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <YIucnXGZp-ogQ0z3nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #93802 |
On 10/16/26 02:02, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > On Thu, 15 Oct 2026 21:53:57 -0700, Peyton wrote: > >> I one time worked with a colleague who did not understand why a C# >> binary executable was running significantly faster than a Python >> script. > > Tell me again, why does C♯ exist? Beyond being some kind of corporate > vanity project started by Bill Gates after Sun gave him a good hiding > over his attempts to hijack Java? There is NO really good reason for C++ Yea, yea, it's "object" - but in C you don't REALLY need that.
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