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Docs/Word Processing in Console ?

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  Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Luis Denera <luisdenera@invalid.net> - 2012-01-28 04:33 +0000
    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? rouben@shady.(none) (Rouben Rostamian) - 2012-01-28 07:41 +0000
    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2012-01-28 10:38 +0000
      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Norbert Möndjen <n.moendjen@vodafone.de> - 2012-01-28 13:01 +0100
        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2012-01-28 16:00 +0000
    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-01-28 06:07 -0600
      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2012-01-28 12:17 +0000
        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> - 2012-01-28 19:13 +0100
        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-01-28 22:28 -0600
          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2012-01-29 05:03 +0000
          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-01-29 07:06 -0500
            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-01-29 07:35 -0600
              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-01-30 12:46 -0500
                Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-01-30 12:32 -0600
                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-01-30 19:02 +0000
                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-01-30 15:23 -0500
                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-01-30 22:39 +0000
                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-01-30 14:03 -0500
                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Peter Köhlmann <peter-koehlmann@t-online.de> - 2012-01-30 20:31 +0100
                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-01-30 14:22 -0600
                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2012-01-30 20:02 +0000
                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-01-30 14:31 -0600
                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2012-01-30 20:48 +0000
                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Grant Edwards <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2012-01-30 20:48 +0000
                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Sam <sam@email-scan.com> - 2012-01-30 18:10 -0600
                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-01-31 10:18 +0000
                        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-01-31 10:53 +0000
                          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-01-31 16:15 -0500
                            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Paul Bartlett <bartlett@panix.com> - 2012-01-31 17:20 -0500
                            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-01-31 17:27 -0600
                            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Laurent Claessens <moky.math@gmail.com> - 2012-02-01 09:41 +0100
                              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Feranija <feranija@mouse-potato.com> - 2012-02-01 01:53 -0800
                                Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-01 11:14 +0000
                                Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Laurent Claessens <moky.math@gmail.com> - 2012-02-01 15:11 +0100
                          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-01 09:20 +0000
                            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-02-01 09:49 +0000
                              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-01 10:58 +0000
                                Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-02-01 12:48 +0000
                                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-01 13:59 +0000
                          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Anonymous Remailer (austria)" <mixmaster@remailer.privacy.at> - 2012-02-05 16:52 +0000
                            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-02-05 11:04 -0600
                              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-05 20:23 +0000
                                Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Heller <heller@deepsoft.com> - 2012-02-05 17:09 -0600
                                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-05 23:40 +0000
                                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-02-06 08:41 +0000
                                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-06 10:34 +0000
                                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2012-02-06 10:48 +0000
                                        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-02-06 11:04 +0000
                                          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-06 12:25 +0000
                                            Docs/Word Processing in Console - but should be changed to "Who's is bigger?" gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2012-02-06 14:47 +0000
                                              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - but should be changed to "Who's is bigger?" Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-06 15:34 +0000
                                                Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - but should be changed to "Who's is bigger?" gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2012-02-06 16:30 +0000
                                                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - but should be changed to "Who's is bigger?" J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2012-02-06 16:50 +0000
                                                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - but should be changed to "Who's is bigger?" - is now "sig wars" gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2012-02-06 17:01 +0000
                                                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - but should be changed to "Who's is bigger?" - is now "sig wars" The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2012-02-06 17:34 +0000
                                                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - but should be changed to "Who's is bigger?" Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-06 18:30 +0000
                                                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - Now: Just tryin' to help, ma'am... gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2012-02-06 22:49 +0000
                                                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - Now: Just tryin' to help, ma'am... Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> - 2012-02-07 01:58 +0100
                                                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - Now: Just tryin' to help, ma'am... Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-07 11:20 +0000
                                                        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console - Now: Just tryin' to help, ma'am... gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2012-02-07 12:17 +0000
                                          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Anonymous Remailer (austria)" <mixmaster@remailer.privacy.at> - 2012-02-06 14:15 +0000
                              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Anonymous Remailer (austria)" <mixmaster@remailer.privacy.at> - 2012-02-06 11:16 +0000
                                Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-02-06 11:29 +0000
                                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Anonymous Remailer (austria)" <mixmaster@remailer.privacy.at> - 2012-02-06 12:45 +0000
                                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-02-06 15:02 +0000
                                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-02-06 13:08 +0000
                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2012-01-31 01:05 +0000
                  Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> - 2012-01-31 03:25 +0100
                    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Chick Tower <c.tower@deadspam.com> - 2012-02-01 04:09 +0100
                      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2012-02-01 05:54 +0000
    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? DenverD <DenverD@invalid.dk> - 2012-01-28 22:48 +0100
    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? JeffM <jeffm_@email.com> - 2012-01-28 18:23 -0800
    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-01-28 18:36 +0000
    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? pH <pureheart@pacbell.net> - 2012-02-01 09:18 -0800
      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? notbob <notbob@nothome.com> - 2012-02-01 20:35 +0000
        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-02-01 17:24 -0500
          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? notbob <notbob@nothome.com> - 2012-02-01 23:17 +0000
            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? "Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-02-01 20:42 -0500
              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Krzysztof Mitko <fakemail@krzysztof.at.eml.dot.cc> - 2012-02-02 08:01 +0000
              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Richard Kettlewell <rjk@greenend.org.uk> - 2012-02-02 09:02 +0000
          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2012-02-02 04:29 +0000
      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2012-02-01 15:24 -0500
      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Feranija <feranija@mouse-potato.com> - 2012-02-04 13:20 -0800
        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Aaron W. Hsu <arcfide@sacrideo.us> - 2012-02-04 18:03 -0600
    Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? danca <ynnadrebyc@tiscalinet.it> - 2012-02-01 19:54 +0100
      Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2012-02-01 15:17 -0500
        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2012-02-01 20:58 +0000
          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> - 2012-02-01 22:21 +0100
        Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Feranija <feranija@mouse-potato.com> - 2012-02-01 13:18 -0800
          Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> - 2012-02-01 22:27 +0100
            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? danca <ynnadrebyc@tiscalinet.it> - 2012-02-02 00:58 +0100
              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> - 2012-02-02 02:58 +0100
            Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2012-02-02 01:08 +0000
              Re: Docs/Word Processing in Console ? Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> - 2012-02-02 02:59 +0100

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#4157

Richard Kettlewell <...@greenend.org.uk> [RK]:
RK> combined with the fact that there is simply no good reason for
RK> using base64 in text newsgroups.

This is _not_ a fact. Please don't confuse one's opinion (obviously
stemming from ignorance) with facts.

As I wrote earlier, others, regularly posting 8-bit messages to other
newsgroups, _need_ to encode those messages, if they want them to
survive across different 7-bit only systems and devices. And there is
no way telling their newsreader to use base64 for one newsgroup and
not using it for another. So there is some good reason for using
base64 in text newsgroups. Perhaps not in your part of the world, but
there still is.

I hate it/find it obtrusive as much as you do, but it's
sometimes a necessary evil. We no longer live in a 7-bit/ASCII
internet world. Expect more of the same with applications not
supporting international domain names (xn--XXXXXXX)...

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#4147

Robert Heller <hel...@deepsoft.com> [RH]:
RH> Even so, it is still a few odd characters.  *I* can live with that.
RH> Getting a blob of 'hex' (base64) is not readable.  My newsreader can
RH> 'deal' with UTF-8 characters (well it displays hex codes, since I
RH> don't happen to have all of the various fonts needed to display
RH> the exotic characters).

You might be able to live with that, but others, regularly posting
8-bit messages to other newsgroups, _need_ to encode those messages, if
they want them to survive across different systems and devices.

To make matters worse some people use the same application for e-mail
and usenet and that application might not differentiate between e-mail
and usenet messages as far as content encoding is concerned. Oops.

I guess it's a problem with newsreader settings (or lack thereof). One
should be able to define *per newsgroup* whether she wants her
messages to be encoded and according to which protocol.

Until such a configuration option arrives and the majority of posters
configure their newsreader accordingly, please do yourself a favour
and let your newsreader know about base64 encoding. Denial will
not make the problem go away...

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#4148

"Anonymous Remailer (austria)" <mixmaster@remailer.privacy.at> writes:
> Robert Heller <hel...@deepsoft.com> [RH]:
> RH> Even so, it is still a few odd characters.  *I* can live with that.
> RH> Getting a blob of 'hex' (base64) is not readable.  My newsreader can
> RH> 'deal' with UTF-8 characters (well it displays hex codes, since I
> RH> don't happen to have all of the various fonts needed to display
> RH> the exotic characters).
>
> You might be able to live with that, but others, regularly posting
> 8-bit messages to other newsgroups, _need_ to encode those messages, if
> they want them to survive across different systems and devices.

They do not need to use base64.  8bit works fine in news.  Even if it
didn't, QP would be fine.

-- 
http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

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#4152

Richard Kettlewell <...@greenend.org.uk> [RK]:
RK> They do not need to use base64.  8bit works fine in news.  Even if
RK> it didn't, QP would be fine.

Some UUCP implementations (still used around the developing world)
as well as some newsgroup gateway and archiving systems are not 8-bit
clean. Even regular 7-bit ASCII characters such as tabs and trailing
spaces seem to vanish (or appear out of the blue) as a news posting
moves from system to system. Feel free to test it for yourself.

QP encoding is fine if most of the content can be written using the
printable ASCII characters. Otherwise it is very inefficient compared
to base64 encoding. Besides, in some people's head QP encoding carries
a certain western world bias, which makes it a less attractive option
in some circles/cultures.

I don't claim that either is better or desirable in news postings.
They are just a necessary evil.

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#4159

"Anonymous Remailer (austria)" <mixmaster@remailer.privacy.at> writes:
> Richard Kettlewell <...@greenend.org.uk> [RK]:

>> They do not need to use base64.  8bit works fine in news.  Even if
>> it didn't, QP would be fine.
>
> Some UUCP implementations (still used around the developing world)
> as well as some newsgroup gateway and archiving systems are not 8-bit
> clean. Even regular 7-bit ASCII characters such as tabs and trailing
> spaces seem to vanish (or appear out of the blue) as a news posting
> moves from system to system. Feel free to test it for yourself.

That would be an argument for avoiding CTE: 8bit.  It’s an argument that
was lost years ago, however; Usenet is full of 8-bit data (and the
current specification recognizes this).

> QP encoding is fine if most of the content can be written using the
> printable ASCII characters. Otherwise it is very inefficient compared
> to base64 encoding. Besides, in some people's head QP encoding carries
> a certain western world bias, which makes it a less attractive option
> in some circles/cultures.

That’s not an argument that base64 is _required_, just that some people
don’t like the alternatives.

-- 
http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

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#4153

Richard Kettlewell wrote:

> They do not need to use base64.  8bit works fine in news.  Even if it
> didn't, QP would be fine.

If a newsclient complies with standards passed over a decade ago, base64 
will work just fine, as will any Unicode encoding.  This has been the case 
for over a decade.

I don't believe it is reasonable to complain that everyone should be forced 
to live in the past just because a single user insists in using software 
whose development ceased over a decade ago or is rather poor.


Rui Maciel

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#4032

J G Miller wrote:
> On Monday, January 30th, 2012, at 12:32:03h -0600, Robert Heller wrote:
> 
>> This is an *English* newsgroup.
> 
> I guess that means all the Irish, Scottish, Welsh etc
> will not be allowed to post then.

great idea.

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#4034

On Monday 30 January 2012 19:32, Robert Heller conveyed the following to 
comp.os.linux.misc...

> At Mon, 30 Jan 2012 12:46:34 -0500 "Aaron W. Hsu"
> <arcfide@sacrideo.us> wrote:
> 
>> On Sun, 29 Jan 2012 08:35:24 -0500, Robert Heller
>> <heller@deepsoft.com> wrote:
>> 
>> > Huh?  What is with the base64 encoding?
>> 
>> Probably the Unicode. I have Unicode in my mails.
> 
> Why? This is an *English* newsgroup.

Such a narrow-minded vision.  Another US American who thinks that there 
are no other people on planet earth in possession of computer technology 
other than those who live in the United States of America.

Just for the record, it is not an "English" newsgroup.  It is an 
international newsgroup, although English does appear to be the de facto 
standard language here.

And as a last FIY, virtually _everyone_ is using unicode these days - at 
the very least the UTF-8 variant - unless they're on Microsoft Windows.  
There is /no/ valid reason anymore /not/ to be using unicode.

-- 
= Aragorn =
(registered GNU/Linux user #223157)

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#4053

On 2012-01-31, Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> wrote:
> There is /no/ valid reason anymore /not/ to be using unicode.

I find unicode too pedestrian for my tastes.  I use multicode.
-- 
                                 Chick Tower

For e-mail:  colm DOT sent DOT towerboy AT xoxy DOT net

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#4057

On 2012-02-01, Chick Tower <c.tower@deadspam.com> wrote:
> On 2012-01-31, Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> wrote:
>> There is /no/ valid reason anymore /not/ to be using unicode.
>
> I find unicode too pedestrian for my tastes.  I use multicode.

Thumbs up.  :-)

-- 
Robert Riches
spamtrap42@jacob21819.net
(Yes, that is one of my email addresses.)

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#3982

On 01/28/2012 05:33 AM, Luis Denera wrote:
> is there any office suite available for linux console as it was
> years ago WP-DOS v1.0-5.1

this is probably not the answer you wish:

-if there is a command line 'office suite' which runs in DOS like the 
old days i am not aware of it (have you checked sourceforge?)

-i _loved_ WP5.1 in DOS and always thought WP5 and 6 running in Windows 
3.1 was a GIANT step backwards....that said, if you still have the 
program disk it _might_ worthwhile to load up DOSEMU 
<http://www.dosemu.org/> and see if you can get a working install

-if you have the program disk for (say) Lotus 1-2-3, you could do the 
same (try it) and it was a very nice spread sheet

-there was a rudimentary database program, but i do not remember the 
name...hmmm, was it dBase...ah, and Clipper

-as far as i recall no one had yet invented a "presentation program"

-OH! i remember there was a suite of programs named "Enable" had a word 
processor, spreadsheet and some other stuff....maybe a 
calendar/appointment book....contact list etc

no, i don't know where you could get any of the program disks or if they 
would actually work in DOSEMU..

-- 
DenverD

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#3984

Luis Denera wrote:
>is there any office suite available for linux console
>as it was years ago WP-DOS v1.0-5.1, or older MultiMate ?
>
Neither of the items you named are suites.  Right?
Both are word processors only.  Right?
A terminal-based suite?  None I know of.
The lightest (GUI) thing I know of is SIAG Office.

Until he hung up his keyboard recently,
this guy's blog was the Mecca where console fans interacted.
http://kmandla.wordpress.com/
http://kmandla.wordpress.com/software/

>I know [of] "sc" or "slsc" spreadsheet application,
>but just a spreadsheet isn't enough.
>
Of those of which I am aware, there are these:
http://google.com/search?q=site:kmandla.wordpress.com+WordGrinder
http://google.com/search?q=site:kmandla.wordpress.com+teapot+spreadsheet

>Or, are there any standalone office application,
>documents and word processing applications, faxing printing,
>piecharts, financial and similar ?
>
His database of CLI apps:
http://kmandla.wikispaces.com/

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#3997

Luis Denera wrote:

> Please, is there any office suite available for linux console as it was
> years ago WP-DOS v1.0-5.1, or older MultiMate ?
> 
> I know for "sc" or "slsc" spreadsheet application, but just a spreadsheet
> isn't enough. Or, are there any standalone office application, documents
> and word processing applications, faxing printing, piecharts, financial
> and similar ?
> 
> It does not necessarily need to be freeware nor opensource. Thank you.

That really depends on what you actually want to do.  Spreadsheets tend to 
be abused by employing them in uses where they are less than adequate.

Regarding producing documents, nothing beats LaTeX.  Still up to this day 
and after decades of development, Microsoft Word and other word processing 
software still lags behind good old LaTeX, with no sign of ever coming close 
to it.


Rui Maciel

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#4067

On Jan 27, 8:33 pm, Luis Denera <luisden...@invalid.net> wrote:
> Please, is there any office suite available for linux console as it was
> years ago WP-DOS v1.0-5.1, or older MultiMate ?
>
> I know for "sc" or "slsc" spreadsheet application, but just a spreadsheet
> isn't enough. Or, are there any standalone office application, documents
> and word processing applications, faxing printing, piecharts, financial and
> similar ?
>
> It does not necessarily need to be freeware nor opensource. Thank you.

Well, I always liked WordStar over Word Perfect.

You could use the 'jstar' variant of  the 'Joe' text editing package,
ispell for your spelling checker and then efax to send your faxes.
You already have the spreadsheet.

Printing by good old 'ps' or whatever.

Maybe there are ncurses based programs for the charts others can
suggest.

Pureheart
Aptos, CA

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#4070

On 2012-02-01, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:

> Joe is fine as a text editor, there's also Pico that came with Pine, and=20

Izzat what keeps dumping that annoying =20 at the end of almost every
line?

nb


-- 
Fight internet CENSORSHIP - Fight SOPA-PIPA
Contact your congressman and/or representative, now!
http://projects.propublica.org/sopa/
vi --the heart of evil!

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#4076

On Wed, 01 Feb 2012 15:35:20 -0500, notbob <notbob@nothome.com> wrote:

> Izzat what keeps dumping that annoying =20 at the end of almost every
> line?

That's your newsreader's failure to properly handle the formatting of the  
message. Those are used as line enders in mail messages that use MIME with  
quoted-printable.

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#4077

On 2012-02-01, Aaron W. Hsu <arcfide@sacrideo.us> wrote:

> That's your newsreader's failure to properly handle the formatting of the  
> message. Those are used as line enders in mail messages that use MIME with  
> quoted-printable.

No doubt due to the fact usenet is not a mail protocol and MIME is an
unacceptable format for newsgroups.  My newsreader client has failed
nothing and works precisely as intended for nntp.

nb

-- 
Fight internet CENSORSHIP - Fight SOPA-PIPA
Contact your congressman and/or representative, now!
http://projects.propublica.org/sopa/
vi --the heart of evil!

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#4080

On Wed, 01 Feb 2012 18:17:47 -0500, notbob <notbob@nothome.com> wrote:

> No doubt due to the fact usenet is not a mail protocol and MIME is an
> unacceptable format for newsgroups.  My newsreader client has failed
> nothing and works precisely as intended for nntp.

This has nothing to do with MIME, the quoted printable encoding is not  
restricted to MIME, IIRC. How would you suggest the transmission of data  
that uses more than 7-bit characters? Usenet is not and should not be  
ASCII only.

First someone complains about base64, and suggests quoted printable  
instead, and now someone says that quoted printable is unacceptable, what  
should we use instead?

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#4084

["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.misc.]
Aaron W. Hsu wrote:
> On Wed, 01 Feb 2012 18:17:47 -0500, notbob <notbob@nothome.com> wrote:
>
>> No doubt due to the fact usenet is not a mail protocol and MIME is an
>> unacceptable format for newsgroups.  My newsreader client has failed
>> nothing and works precisely as intended for nntp.
>
> This has nothing to do with MIME, the quoted printable encoding is not  
> restricted to MIME, IIRC. How would you suggest the transmission of data  
> that uses more than 7-bit characters? Usenet is not and should not be  
> ASCII only.
>
> First someone complains about base64, and suggests quoted printable  
> instead, and now someone says that quoted printable is unacceptable, what  
> should we use instead?

8-bit UTF-8 or ISO-8859-something, at least that's what some non-english
hierarchies require.

-- 
Z pozdrowieniami,
Krzysztof Mitko

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#4085

"Aaron W. Hsu" <arcfide@sacrideo.us> writes:
> notbob <notbob@nothome.com> wrote:

>> No doubt due to the fact usenet is not a mail protocol and MIME is an
>> unacceptable format for newsgroups.  My newsreader client has failed
>> nothing and works precisely as intended for nntp.
>
> This has nothing to do with MIME, the quoted printable encoding is not
> restricted to MIME, IIRC.

QP is indeed part of MIME, although it’s wrong to say that MIME is not
suitable for news, since MIME headers are precisely how news articles
indicate their character and transfer encodings.

> How would you suggest the transmission of data that uses more than
> 7-bit characters? Usenet is not and should not be ASCII only.
>
> First someone complains about base64, and suggests quoted printable
> instead, and now someone says that quoted printable is unacceptable,
> what  should we use instead?

You should use 8bit.  As I think has been said several times now.

 * The MIME readers will just work.
 * The non-MIME readers that happen to be using the same charset will
   just work too.
 * The non-MIME readers that happen to be using some other charset
   will have nonsense for non-ASCII characters but otherwise be fine.

base64 works for MIME readers but the non-MIME readers just see a pile
of impenetrable hex.

quoted-printable works for MIME readers but non-MIME readers tend to see
lots of extra =20 junk even for plain old ASCII characters.

-- 
http://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

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