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Groups > comp.os.linux.misc > #93793 > unrolled thread

Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI

Started byLeroy H <lh@somewhere.net>
First post2026-10-16 03:26 +0000
Last post2026-10-18 10:59 +0000
Articles 20 on this page of 735 — 47 participants

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Contents

  Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 03:26 +0000
    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 00:00 -0400
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 04:33 +0000
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 21:53 -0700
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 01:31 -0400
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 06:08 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:39 -0400
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:49 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:53 +0000
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 05:26 -0400
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:29 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:31 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:16 +0000
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-16 19:42 -0400
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:44 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:55 +0100
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:20 +0000
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:20 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:09 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 12:54 +0100
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:15 +0000
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:05 +0100
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 14:54 +0000
                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 16:46 +0100
                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 16:57 +0000
                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 19:01 +0000
                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:11 +0100
                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 14:48 -0700
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Harold Stevens <wookie@bookworm.localdomain> - 2026-10-17 08:26 -0500
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 15:01 +0100
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 12:19 -0700
                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 22:11 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:52 +0000
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:30 +0100
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:48 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:12 +0100
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 13:04 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 14:40 +0100
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:17 +0200
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 02:30 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:54 +0100
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 19:56 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:00 +0100
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 04:32 -0400
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:30 +0200
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:13 +0100
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 14:19 +0200
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:38 +0100
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 15:10 +0200
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 14:58 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 16:04 +0200
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 15:33 +0200
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 14:23 +0000
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 20:37 +0100
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-19 03:03 +0000
                                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:02 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:40 +0000
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-23 18:43 +0000
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 20:11 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 21:53 +0200
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 13:00 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 15:12 +0200
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 13:26 +0000
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 15:35 +0200
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 14:04 +0000
                                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 16:24 +0200
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 14:50 +0100
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:37 +0000
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:04 +0100
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 16:17 +0100
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-19 17:33 +0200
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 17:26 +0100
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 20:19 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 09:39 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 05:58 -0400
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:55 +0100
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:43 +0100
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:36 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:03 +0100
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 12:39 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-23 18:31 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-24 00:17 -0400
                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:19 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 03:48 +0000
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 02:20 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:58 -0700
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 03:33 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 09:06 -0700
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 19:04 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-17 06:37 -0400
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:59 +0100
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:20 +0200
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:50 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:48 +0100
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 15:09 -0700
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-20 09:16 +0100
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-20 13:37 +0000
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 09:13 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:56 +0100
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-21 14:23 +0000
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 19:14 +0000
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:22 +0100
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-22 17:04 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 10:54 -0700
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:07 +0100
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 14:02 +0000
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 15:17 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 20:06 +0000
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:26 +0100
                                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-22 17:07 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 11:49 -0700
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 15:09 -0700
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:08 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-22 10:37 -0700
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 19:29 +0100
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                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 10:04 -0700
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 20:16 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-22 02:04 +0000
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                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-20 14:18 +0100
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 19:04 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:15 +0100
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-21 17:33 +0000
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-20 21:20 +0200
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 02:42 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:16 +0100
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-20 18:26 +0000
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 11:46 -0700
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 01:57 +0000
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 09:01 -0700
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 20:14 +0000
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:27 +0100
                                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-22 17:23 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-20 19:33 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:25 +0200
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                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-20 18:15 +0000
                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 19:04 +0000
                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-20 21:27 +0200
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                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 23:18 +0000
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 01:33 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-21 03:22 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 01:25 +0000
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                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 19:06 +0000
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          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 23:16 -0700
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 07:45 +0000
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                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:31 +0200
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 05:00 -0400
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                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 21:58 +0200
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 20:07 +0000
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-18 21:41 +0000
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                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:27 +0100
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                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 04:15 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:41 -0400
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:00 +0100
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:57 +0100
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:26 +0100
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:42 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:56 +0100
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:14 +0000
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 13:07 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:20 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:26 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:32 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:21 +0100
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 04:04 +0000
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:24 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:27 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:20 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 01:13 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 02:32 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 03:04 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:41 +0100
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 12:45 +0200
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 16:05 +0100
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 17:25 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-19 20:19 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:24 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:16 +0100
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:53 +0200
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 06:02 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 23:26 -0700
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 06:42 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 07:41 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 06:39 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:22 -0400
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:54 +0100
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:19 +0100
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:40 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:52 +0100
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 20:47 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-17 23:29 +0200
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Anton Antimo <anton@safunu.org> - 2026-10-19 17:18 -0300
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Helmut Waitzmann <nn.throttle@erine.email> - 2026-10-21 00:54 +0200
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-23 18:50 +0200
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-23 23:59 -0400
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-24 11:53 +0200
                      Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2026-10-24 12:10 +0000
                        Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-24 18:53 +0200
                          Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 00:28 -0400
                            Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-26 06:20 +0100
                              Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 03:38 -0400
                                Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 05:01 +0100
                                  Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-27 12:24 -0400
                                    [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-28 01:12 +0100
                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-28 05:26 -0400
                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-28 19:33 +0000
                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-29 00:19 +0000
                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-29 12:27 -0400
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 03:40 -0400
                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:24 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-30 23:10 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-31 04:14 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:40 +0100
                                                    Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-31 10:49 +0000
                                                      Re: Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-31 13:11 +0000
                                                        Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:53 +0100
                                                      Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:56 +0100
                                                        Re: Internal navigation in the online manual Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-31 22:41 +0000
                                                          Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:31 +0100
                                                        Re: Internal navigation in the online manual Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-11-01 20:50 +0000
                                                      Re: Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-01 19:40 +0000
                                                        Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-02 23:27 +0100
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-31 14:11 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 16:57 +0100
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:56 +0100
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 22:11 +0100
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 04:18 -0500
                                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-01 17:22 +0100
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:59 +0100
                                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-01 17:50 +0100
                                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) FF <fflud@linux.rocks> - 2026-11-01 18:09 +0000
                                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-02 23:32 +0100
                                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-03 00:26 +0100
                                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:57 +0100
                                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-03 02:17 +0000
                                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:49 +0000
                                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 22:22 -0500
                                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:24 +0100
                                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 04:49 +0000
                                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:28 +0100
                                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 08:36 +0000
                                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-01 22:29 +0000
                                                        Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-01 01:08 +0000
                                                          Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 13:03 +0100
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2026-11-01 10:58 +0100
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-01 22:27 +0000
                                                    Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:57 +0000
                                                      Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 13:07 +0100
                                                        Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-01 22:32 +0000
                                                          Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-02 23:35 +0100
                                                            Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-02 23:22 +0000
                                                              Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 03:02 +0100
                                                                Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:50 +0000
                                                                  Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:28 +0100
                                                                    Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:14 +0000
                                                              Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 21:18 -0500
                                                            Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 08:40 +0000
                                                              Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:31 +0100
                                                                Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 18:32 +0000
                                                                  Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 19:51 +0100
                                                      Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-01 19:40 +0000
                                                      Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-11-01 16:49 -0800
                                                        Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 11:31 +0000
                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Josef Möllers <josef@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-28 17:01 +0100
                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-28 17:50 +0100
                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-28 18:18 +0000
                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David LaRue <huey.dll@tampabay.rr.com> - 2026-10-28 23:28 +0000
                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-29 00:11 +0000
                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-29 00:46 +0000
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-28 22:36 -0400
                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-29 09:13 -0700
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-29 18:13 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 04:00 -0400
                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-29 17:37 +0000
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Kaz Kylheku <046-301-5902@kylheku.com> - 2026-10-29 20:01 +0000
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-29 21:18 +0100
                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-29 21:40 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-29 23:58 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-30 15:14 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 00:09 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-30 04:33 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-30 11:10 +0000
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-30 17:52 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-10-30 17:14 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:25 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-30 18:26 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:25 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-30 20:12 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) jayjwa <jayjwa@atr2.ath.cx.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:07 -0400
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:38 +0000
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 04:30 -0500
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-01 10:16 +0000
                                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-01 19:13 +0000
                                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-02 09:35 -0800
                                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 20:27 +0000
                                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-02 13:50 -0800
                                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 20:42 -0500
                                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:42 +0000
                                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-03 16:38 +0800
                                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 08:40 +0000
                                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-03 07:29 -0700
                                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-04 02:02 +0800
                                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 19:45 +0100
                                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 18:17 -0500
                                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-11-01 16:45 -0800
                                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 21:00 -0500
                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-02 02:16 +0000
                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 04:48 +0000
                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 14:13 +0800
                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 06:47 +0000
                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:02 +0800
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 19:48 +0000
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Kaz Kylheku <046-301-5902@kylheku.com> - 2026-11-03 23:57 +0000
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:48 -0500
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:21 +0000
                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-02 16:51 +0000
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 20:10 +0000
                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-02 17:10 +0000
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 20:25 -0500
                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 03:56 -0500
                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:03 +0800
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 13:51 +0000
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 19:56 +0000
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-03 16:42 +0800
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-03 19:40 +0000
                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2026-11-04 19:48 +0000
                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 01:28 -0500
                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-02 09:41 +0100
                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 11:22 +0000
                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:11 +0800
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 13:57 +0000
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-03 00:20 +0100
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:45 +0100
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-03 11:49 +0000
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 13:02 +0100
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 13:26 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-03 07:35 -0700
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 18:06 +0100
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 21:52 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:48 -0700
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:45 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 21:51 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 14:29 +0000
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 14:28 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-03 22:15 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-03 22:47 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-03 23:18 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 03:12 +0000
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-04 08:26 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 01:20 +0000
                                                                                            [OT] Fujitsu Horizon (was: Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:19 +0000
                                                                                              Re: [OT] Fujitsu Horizon Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-05 09:50 +0000
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 09:09 -0700
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:30 -0500
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 03:57 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-04 16:57 +0800
                                                                                              Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
                                                                                                Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-05 04:48 +0800
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:27 +0000
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 09:11 -0700
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-04 10:43 +0100
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:54 -0700
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-04 19:59 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 19:04 -0700
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 03:34 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-05 06:27 +0000
                                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:48 +0000
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:29 +0000
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:40 -0700
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 19:02 -0700
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 03:23 +0100
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-04 10:53 +0100
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:47 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-04 22:22 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-05 00:14 +0100
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 01:18 +0000
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:25 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 19:45 +0100
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-05 03:33 +0800
                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-03 00:08 +0100
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 21:12 -0500
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 15:13 +0000
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:27 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 21:37 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:01 +0100
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:18 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:09 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:51 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:02 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:54 -0500
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-03 23:02 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:58 -0500
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-04 15:34 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:08 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:36 -0700
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-05 00:13 +0800
                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:42 +0000
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:49 +0000
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:53 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 04:44 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 07:15 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:27 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:41 +0000
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-04 10:58 +0100
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:19 +0000
                                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
                                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-05 00:19 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 01:24 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:52 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 09:28 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:25 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:53 +0000
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 21:57 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:44 +0000
                                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:05 +0000
                                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:27 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 09:20 -0700
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:52 -0700
                                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:50 +0000
                                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:59 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-04 15:36 +0000
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 02:42 +0100
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:43 -0700
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 21:35 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:32 -0700
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-11-04 11:32 -0500
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 18:52 +0100
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
                                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-05 05:02 +0800
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 22:53 -0500
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 07:15 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-03 19:28 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-03 23:07 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:41 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:01 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:41 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-04 01:13 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] scientific mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 03:04 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 09:03 -0700
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 01:27 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:50 +0100
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 14:31 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2026-11-03 19:16 +0100
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-03 07:31 -0700
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-04 02:13 +0800
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-03 05:28 -0800
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:00 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-04 05:10 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-04 00:28 -0500
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:34 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-04 15:42 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-03 23:04 +0000
                                                                                    Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 23:05 -0500
                                                                                      Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 04:15 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-04 00:14 -0500
                                                                                          Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 18:24 +0000
                                                                                        Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 06:21 +0000
                                                                                          Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 07:10 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-04 07:00 -0500
                                                                                              Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 18:28 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking  Speedy too seriously) Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2026-11-04 16:50 -0500
                                                                                        Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking  Speedy too seriously) Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2026-11-04 16:44 -0500
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 15:18 +0000
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 02:59 +0100
                                                                              Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 22:29 -0500
                                                                                Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 03:16 +0100
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:23 -0500
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 19:18 +0100
                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-02 16:51 +0000
                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 11:13 +0000
                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 19:41 +0000
                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-02 17:01 +0000
                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:36 +0100
                                                                    Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-03 07:10 +0000
                                                                      Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:35 +0000
                                                                        Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-11-03 21:11 +0000
                                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 10:52 +0000
                                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-02 15:35 +0000
                                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 10:47 +0000
                                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:16 +0800
                                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 13:58 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:49 +0100
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 16:42 +0100
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 20:08 +0100
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 21:20 +0100
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:19 +0100
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-31 18:42 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:57 +0100
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-31 18:53 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:48 +0000
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-29 23:48 +0000
                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 04:27 -0400
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 03:58 -0400
                        Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 00:57 -0400
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-24 13:41 +0000
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                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-25 23:49 -0400
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                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-26 06:41 +0100
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                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-19 08:01 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-19 20:05 +0000
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-20 09:16 +0100
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 12:12 +0100
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 02:42 -0400
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-18 08:53 +0000
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 05:06 -0400
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:32 +0000
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 12:20 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:22 +0000
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-19 02:19 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-19 08:20 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-16 19:36 -0400
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-16 19:35 -0400
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:18 +0100
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-17 06:32 -0400
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:55 +0100
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 12:12 +0000
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 13:43 +0100
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 20:37 +0000
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 09:07 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-17 13:30 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 13:09 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 20:08 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 12:04 +0100
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nick Charles <none@none.none> - 2026-10-16 23:19 +0000
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 02:29 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-17 01:54 -0400
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:58 +0000
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:25 +0100
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "De ongekruisigde ds." <ongekruisigde-ds@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 10:59 +0000

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#95112 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromPeter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com>
Date2026-11-04 09:09 -0700
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cflc3$qkur$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95068
On 11/3/26 20:12, John Levine wrote:
> According to Pancho  <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com>:
>>> Only up to a point. Making the read part of databases run in parallel
>>> is easy. Making the write part is not.
>>>
>>> If you have $100 in your bank account, and two $75 debit transactions
>>> arrive at the same time, if the result is anything other than that one
>>> succeeded and the other failed*, your bank has a problem.  The reason they
>>> need very fast very large databases is that updates have to be serialized
>>> and there's no way to make them faster than the underlying system.  Same
>>> for airlines allocating seats and any other database reflecting a real world
>>> application where there's a finite amount of something to be parcelled out.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> * - yes I know about overdrafts, this is an example
>>
>> Erm, yep, sequential transactions on my account, but why does everyone
>> else's account need to be on the same database/compute server as my
>> account? If A and B are doing a transaction, that has nothing to do with
>> me, it can be done in parallel.
> 
> Sure, but you're not going to put every account on a different disk. Real
> transactions are more complicated than that -- when they take the $75 out of my
> account they have to credit it somewhere else, and that debit/credit pair has to
> be atomic, both work or both fail.
> 
> Banks are conservative but they are not stupid. There's a lot of stuff they can
> push out onto cheap micro based servers, but there's a certain amount of key
> business logic that Absolutely Has To Work.
> 
Banking is a simplistic application anyhow. Most applications need to 
update multiple records in a database atomically.

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#95071 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

Fromc186282 <c186282@nnada.net>
Date2026-11-03 22:30 -0500
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<MjWdndf8wrCcOnf3nZ2dnZfqn_adnZ2d@giganews.com>
In reply to#95056
On 11/3/26 18:18, Pancho wrote:
> On 11/3/26 22:47, John Levine wrote:
>> According to Pancho  <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com>:
>>>>>> I know at least one guy working on IBM mainframes, and he tells me
>>>>>> they are in high need of good assembler programmers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> They need high i/o with very large databases.
>>>>>> ...
>>
>>> Traditional banking transactions almost certainly could be parallelised,
>>> to quite a high degree, whether they were or not, I don't know. They are
>>> nowadays.
>>
>> Only up to a point. Making the read part of databases run in parallel
>> is easy. Making the write part is not.
>>
>> If you have $100 in your bank account, and two $75 debit transactions
>> arrive at the same time, if the result is anything other than that one
>> succeeded and the other failed*, your bank has a problem.  The reason 
>> they
>> need very fast very large databases is that updates have to be serialized
>> and there's no way to make them faster than the underlying system.  Same
>> for airlines allocating seats and any other database reflecting a real 
>> world
>> application where there's a finite amount of something to be parcelled 
>> out.
>>
>>
>>
>> * - yes I know about overdrafts, this is an example
> 
> Erm, yep, sequential transactions on my account, but why does everyone 
> else's account need to be on the same database/compute server as my 
> account? If A and B are doing a transaction, that has nothing to do with 
> me, it can be done in parallel.

   NOTICED - my principal bank - a LOT of transactions
   come up with a "pending" label. Might take DAYS. This
   is not some 3rd-tier bank either.

   Two or more larger credit/debit card charges, not
   sure HOW they 'compete' in that system. If too
   near each other one MIGHT get bumped. Problem !

   In short, even 'online/instant' banking may not
   be THAT instant.

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#95075 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromJohn Levine <johnl@taugh.com>
Date2026-11-04 03:57 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11ceafb$1kij$1@gal.iecc.com>
In reply to#95071
According to c186282  <c186282@nnada.net>:
>>> * - yes I know about overdrafts, this is an example
>> 
>> Erm, yep, sequential transactions on my account, but why does everyone 
>> else's account need to be on the same database/compute server as my 
>> account? If A and B are doing a transaction, that has nothing to do with 
>> me, it can be done in parallel.
>
>   NOTICED - my principal bank - a LOT of transactions
>   come up with a "pending" label. Might take DAYS. This
>   is not some 3rd-tier bank either.

That has nothing to do with your bank's database and everything to do
with the way that credit card charges work. First the charge is
approved for an approximate amount which is pretty quick, then the
actual charge is posted which can take anywhere from moments to days.
The amounts are often different, e.g., when you pump gas it approves
an amount big enough to cover the largest plausible fill-up, then when
you're done it posts the final amount. Or at a restaurant, it approves
the amount on the check, then posts that plus whatever tip you add. 

For historic reasons it's common to wait to post all of a day's
charges at the end of the day, or even later which is why they can sit
there pending for a while.

-- 
Regards,
John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

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#95087 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromJohann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid>
Date2026-11-04 16:57 +0800
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<FrCGS.24757$Sdo6.3537@fx07.ams4>
In reply to#95075
On 11/4/2026 11:57 AM, John Levine wrote:
> According to c186282  <c186282@nnada.net>:
>>>> * - yes I know about overdrafts, this is an example
>>>
>>> Erm, yep, sequential transactions on my account, but why does everyone
>>> else's account need to be on the same database/compute server as my
>>> account? If A and B are doing a transaction, that has nothing to do with
>>> me, it can be done in parallel.
>>
>>    NOTICED - my principal bank - a LOT of transactions
>>    come up with a "pending" label. Might take DAYS. This
>>    is not some 3rd-tier bank either.
> 
> That has nothing to do with your bank's database and everything to do
> with the way that credit card charges work. First the charge is
> approved for an approximate amount which is pretty quick, then the
> actual charge is posted which can take anywhere from moments to days.
> The amounts are often different, e.g., when you pump gas it approves
> an amount big enough to cover the largest plausible fill-up, then when
> you're done it posts the final amount. Or at a restaurant, it approves
> the amount on the check, then posts that plus whatever tip you add.
> 
> For historic reasons it's common to wait to post all of a day's
> charges at the end of the day, or even later which is why they can sit
> there pending for a while.
> 

I believe most credit card transactions [1] are batch processed during
night time.  For instance, Wise marks transactions as "pending" until
the nightly batch process has run through; based on unscientific obser-
vations.

So they'll take the money out of my balance immediately, but probably
not deposit it on the other end -- whatever that means for Wise -- until
the nightly batch job.  Which can fail -- I guess.  And sometimes things
are even weirder.  By casual observation, if I pay some subscriptions in
advance, they'll still withdraw the monthly amount, /then/ discover the
balance was already in plus, and refund it.

That's the website payment processing system, though; not my bank.

And add in the fact that I can at any moment re-number my card [2] so it
is anybody's guess whether a pending transaction with that card number
will go through or not.

And that's not touching upon the weirdness that is Microsoft's payment
processing system, which can accept my card number, verify it with the
zero dollar transaction -- and /then/ -- decide I'm in some fraud cate-
gory and refuse to make the actual transaction.  I suspect the billing
address and geoIP didn't match, but my bank doesn't care so why does
Microsoft?

And if you think the fruit vendor is better, you can rest easy, because
at one time they refused to update my card number.  Actually refused.
After reaching the /right/ support person, that person could not help
figure out why the website told me the card number had been updated, but
then the TV application always tried to use the old card number.

I gave up, and haven't given the fruit vendor a card number since.

And what does that have to do with mainframes?  Not much, I'm sad to say
I have never worked with payment processing systems at the batch pro-
cessing level, and don't know which of these shenanigans happen there,
or if much of this happens at the front end -- namely the web payment
processing before it reaches the mainframe.

All I can say is that payment processing is complex, and it's getting
more complex by the minute.  Right now, someone is brainstorming some
method to reduce fraud, or try to make a part of it just a little more
reliable.


Thank you for coming to my payment processing rant in alt.folklore.com-
puters.

[1] Full disclosure, I don't have a credit card, so my experience is
exclusively based on debit cards for the past fifteen or more years.

[2] Even the physical card, the card number changes, but I can still
keep using it; I'll just have to read the number from the app or web-
site.
-- 
Johann | email: invalid -> com | http://www.myrkraverk.com/blog/
I'm not from the Internet, I just work there. | via Easynews.com
https://bsky.app/profile/myrkraverk.bsky.social | for ( ;; ) _:;
Federated at https://fed.brid.gy/bsky/myrkraverk.bsky.social

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#95126 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromCharlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
Date2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<61MGS.199927$MmU5.181858@fx44.iad>
In reply to#95087
On 2026-11-04, Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> wrote:

> And if you think the fruit vendor is better, you can rest easy, because
> at one time they refused to update my card number.  Actually refused.
> After reaching the /right/ support person, that person could not help
> figure out why the website told me the card number had been updated, but
> then the TV application always tried to use the old card number.

Ah, you've been around the mulberry bush with Netflix too, I presume.
We recently found we couldn't log in to Netflix because they didn't
like our card number - and quoted the last four digits and date of
a card that expired seven years ago.  I wonder how they had managed
to bill us the previous month.

I called their customer support line, and the droid became downright
belligerent, claiming that it wasn't their fault but our bank's.
I wound up hanging up on him, and we cancelled our Netflix account.

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  In this world there are
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  two kinds of people:
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |  from incomplete data.

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#95132 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromJohann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid>
Date2026-11-05 04:48 +0800
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<SSMGS.20810$1WK1.20140@fx14.ams4>
In reply to#95126
On 11/5/2026 3:51 AM, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
> On 2026-11-04, Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> wrote:
> 
>> And if you think the fruit vendor is better, you can rest easy, because
>> at one time they refused to update my card number.  Actually refused.
>> After reaching the /right/ support person, that person could not help
>> figure out why the website told me the card number had been updated, but
>> then the TV application always tried to use the old card number.
> 
> Ah, you've been around the mulberry bush with Netflix too, I presume.
> We recently found we couldn't log in to Netflix because they didn't
> like our card number - and quoted the last four digits and date of
> a card that expired seven years ago.  I wonder how they had managed
> to bill us the previous month.
> 
> I called their customer support line, and the droid became downright
> belligerent, claiming that it wasn't their fault but our bank's.
> I wound up hanging up on him, and we cancelled our Netflix account.
> 

I have not had that experience with Netflix to my recollection, but I
have /scolded/ customer service representatives when they try to gas-
light me about my card being at fault, when I can clearly see the zero
dollar verification, and then /nothing/ in my bank statement.

Their customer service spiel is not at all willing to admit their pay-
ment processing service can possibly be at fault.  They /will/ gaslight
you that your card is somehow out of balance or expired, or something.

Full disclosure: I'm not sure if I had that experience with Netflix.

And for some reason, the "big merchants" -- I believe last time for me
was Microsoft -- are able to continue to bill expired card numbers.  I
don't know how they get away with it.  Then, of course, Microsoft re-
fused to update the card number.  The customer service was of no help.

That was several years ago, with a subscription I sort of happily "un-
subscribed" because they didn't want it anyway.  My previous gripe was
more recent.


Thank you for coming to my extended payment processing rant here in alt.
folklore.computers!
-- 
Johann | email: invalid -> com | http://www.myrkraverk.com/blog/
I'm not from the Internet, I just work there. | via Easynews.com
https://bsky.app/profile/myrkraverk.bsky.social | for ( ;; ) _:;
Federated at https://fed.brid.gy/bsky/myrkraverk.bsky.social

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#95155 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromNuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-11-05 08:27 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11chell$1cvin$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95075
On 2026-11-04, John Levine wrote:

> According to c186282  <c186282@nnada.net>:
>>>> * - yes I know about overdrafts, this is an example
>>> 
>>> Erm, yep, sequential transactions on my account, but why does everyone 
>>> else's account need to be on the same database/compute server as my 
>>> account? If A and B are doing a transaction, that has nothing to do with 
>>> me, it can be done in parallel.
>>
>>   NOTICED - my principal bank - a LOT of transactions
>>   come up with a "pending" label. Might take DAYS. This
>>   is not some 3rd-tier bank either.
>
> That has nothing to do with your bank's database and everything to do
> with the way that credit card charges work. First the charge is
> approved for an approximate amount which is pretty quick, then the
> actual charge is posted which can take anywhere from moments to days.
> The amounts are often different, e.g., when you pump gas it approves
> an amount big enough to cover the largest plausible fill-up, then when
> you're done it posts the final amount. Or at a restaurant, it approves
> the amount on the check, then posts that plus whatever tip you add.

Possibly all off-line cards and not just credit cards? Although I've
also seen purportedly on-line cards behave in similar ways. Or maybe
it's the *initial* approval that may be deferred for off-line cards?

> For historic reasons it's common to wait to post all of a day's
> charges at the end of the day, or even later which is why they can sit
> there pending for a while.

-- 
Nuno Silva

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#95113 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromPeter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com>
Date2026-11-04 09:11 -0700
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cflge$qkur$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95071
On 11/3/26 20:30, c186282 wrote:
> On 11/3/26 18:18, Pancho wrote:
>> On 11/3/26 22:47, John Levine wrote:
>>> According to Pancho  <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com>:
>>>>>>> I know at least one guy working on IBM mainframes, and he tells me
>>>>>>> they are in high need of good assembler programmers.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> They need high i/o with very large databases.
>>>>>>> ...
>>>
>>>> Traditional banking transactions almost certainly could be 
>>>> parallelised,
>>>> to quite a high degree, whether they were or not, I don't know. They 
>>>> are
>>>> nowadays.
>>>
>>> Only up to a point. Making the read part of databases run in parallel
>>> is easy. Making the write part is not.
>>>
>>> If you have $100 in your bank account, and two $75 debit transactions
>>> arrive at the same time, if the result is anything other than that one
>>> succeeded and the other failed*, your bank has a problem.  The reason 
>>> they
>>> need very fast very large databases is that updates have to be 
>>> serialized
>>> and there's no way to make them faster than the underlying system.  Same
>>> for airlines allocating seats and any other database reflecting a 
>>> real world
>>> application where there's a finite amount of something to be 
>>> parcelled out.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> * - yes I know about overdrafts, this is an example
>>
>> Erm, yep, sequential transactions on my account, but why does everyone 
>> else's account need to be on the same database/compute server as my 
>> account? If A and B are doing a transaction, that has nothing to do 
>> with me, it can be done in parallel.
> 
>    NOTICED - my principal bank - a LOT of transactions
>    come up with a "pending" label. Might take DAYS. This
>    is not some 3rd-tier bank either.
> 
>    Two or more larger credit/debit card charges, not
>    sure HOW they 'compete' in that system. If too
>    near each other one MIGHT get bumped. Problem !
> 
>    In short, even 'online/instant' banking may not
>    be THAT instant.

Some of this is communication between banks, and some is your bank 
milking the float for as long as is legally allowed.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#95088 — Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-11-04 10:43 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<nl0d2rFn18kU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#95049
On 2026-11-03 23:47, John Levine wrote:
> According to Pancho  <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com>:
>>>>> I know at least one guy working on IBM mainframes, and he tells me
>>>>> they are in high need of good assembler programmers.
>>>>>
>>>>> They need high i/o with very large databases.
>>>>> ...
> 
>> Traditional banking transactions almost certainly could be parallelised,
>> to quite a high degree, whether they were or not, I don't know. They are
>> nowadays.
> 
> Only up to a point. Making the read part of databases run in parallel
> is easy. Making the write part is not.
> 
> If you have $100 in your bank account, and two $75 debit transactions
> arrive at the same time, if the result is anything other than that one
> succeeded and the other failed*, your bank has a problem.  The reason they
> need very fast very large databases is that updates have to be serialized
> and there's no way to make them faster than the underlying system.  Same
> for airlines allocating seats and any other database reflecting a real world
> application where there's a finite amount of something to be parcelled out.

I suppose the first transaction arriving blocks the record. Even if both 
arrives the same microsecond, only one gets the lock.

> 
> 
> 
> * - yes I know about overdrafts, this is an example


-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

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#95107 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromPeter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com>
Date2026-11-04 07:54 -0700
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cfgvl$p4ch$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95046
On 11/3/26 15:15, Pancho wrote:
> 
> If you want heavy usage, I would guess bank risk calcs, weather calcs, 
> lots of science applications, running on compute grids, (or whatever the 
> modern word is), blow this mainframe high i/o away.

I think back in the day the quants preferred Sun.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#95130 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromPancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com>
Date2026-11-04 19:59 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cg2qo$1hhhm$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95107
On 11/4/26 14:54, Peter Flass wrote:
> On 11/3/26 15:15, Pancho wrote:
>>
>> If you want heavy usage, I would guess bank risk calcs, weather calcs, 
>> lots of science applications, running on compute grids, (or whatever 
>> the modern word is), blow this mainframe high i/o away.
> 
> I think back in the day the quants preferred Sun.
> 

Not really,-quants used Excel on PCs. Lotus123 ran on Sun, but it was 
second rate. I think prior to Windows NT some IT departments gambled on 
Sun, which had a proper OS, rather than PCs, but it quickly became 
obvious it was a poor choice.

There was also a buzz about RISC cpus replacing x86, which to be fair 
now seems to be happening, just 35 years late.

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#95150 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromPeter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com>
Date2026-11-04 19:04 -0700
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cgo76$178cd$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95130
On 11/4/26 12:59, Pancho wrote:
> On 11/4/26 14:54, Peter Flass wrote:
>> On 11/3/26 15:15, Pancho wrote:
>>>
>>> If you want heavy usage, I would guess bank risk calcs, weather 
>>> calcs, lots of science applications, running on compute grids, (or 
>>> whatever the modern word is), blow this mainframe high i/o away.
>>
>> I think back in the day the quants preferred Sun.
>>
> 
> Not really,-quants used Excel on PCs. Lotus123 ran on Sun, but it was 
> second rate. I think prior to Windows NT some IT departments gambled on 
> Sun, which had a proper OS, rather than PCs, but it quickly became 
> obvious it was a poor choice.
> 
> There was also a buzz about RISC cpus replacing x86, which to be fair 
> now seems to be happening, just 35 years late.

x86 is RISC under the hood. Too bad programmers can't get at it and have 
to deal with the cr*p instruction set.

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#95151 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2026-11-05 03:34 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cgtfb$18jub$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95150
On Wed, 4 Nov 2026 19:04:22 -0700, Peter Flass wrote:

> x86 is RISC under the hood.

That’s nonsense. That’s Intel/AMD PR talking.

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#95153 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

Fromrbowman <bowman@montana.com>
Date2026-11-05 06:27 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<nl2lu6F2rmsU22@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#95151
On Thu, 5 Nov 2026 03:34:03 -0000 (UTC), Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:

> On Wed, 4 Nov 2026 19:04:22 -0700, Peter Flass wrote:
> 
>> x86 is RISC under the hood.
> 
> That’s nonsense. That’s Intel/AMD PR talking.

What do you call micro-operations?

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#95156 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromRichard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-11-05 08:48 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<wwvh5hvpssu.fsf@LkoBDZeT.terraraq.uk>
In reply to#95153
rbowman <bowman@montana.com> writes:
> Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
>> On Wed, 4 Nov 2026 19:04:22 -0700, Peter Flass wrote:
>>> x86 is RISC under the hood.
>> 
>> That’s nonsense. That’s Intel/AMD PR talking.
>
> What do you call micro-operations?

RISC refers to the instruction set (the I and the S), which in x86 is
not “reduced” by any reasonable definition.

Microcode is an implementation strategy, not a fact about the
instruction set architecture.

‘RISC under the hood’ is conceptually incoherent.

-- 
https://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

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#95033 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2026-11-03 20:29 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cdg7h$46jl$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95005
On Tue, 3 Nov 2026 12:45:09 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> I know at least one guy working on IBM mainframes, and he tells me
> they are in high need of good assembler programmers.
>
> They need high i/o with very large databases.

Something not quite right there. Hand-coded assembly language only
makes sense for minimizing CPU usage. If you’re doing lots of I/O,
then the CPU is not the bottleneck, so trying to hand-tune assembly
code is a waste of time.

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#95103 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromPeter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com>
Date2026-11-04 07:40 -0700
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cfg4e$or8q$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95033
On 11/3/26 13:29, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
> On Tue, 3 Nov 2026 12:45:09 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> 
>> I know at least one guy working on IBM mainframes, and he tells me
>> they are in high need of good assembler programmers.
>>
>> They need high i/o with very large databases.
> 
> Something not quite right there. Hand-coded assembly language only
> makes sense for minimizing CPU usage. If you’re doing lots of I/O,
> then the CPU is not the bottleneck, so trying to hand-tune assembly
> code is a waste of time.

I kind of agree. As a former assembler programmer - at one time it was 
my first language - I'd like it to be true (although I'm out of the job 
market), but I can't see it.  These days most HLL code is more optimized 
than a lot of assembler. A good assembler programmer would not make a 
lot of these optimizations due to lack of readability.

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#95127 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromCharlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
Date2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<71MGS.199928$MmU5.168803@fx44.iad>
In reply to#95103
On 2026-11-04, Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> wrote:

> On 11/3/26 13:29, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 3 Nov 2026 12:45:09 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> 
>>> I know at least one guy working on IBM mainframes, and he tells me
>>> they are in high need of good assembler programmers.
>>>
>>> They need high i/o with very large databases.
>> 
>> Something not quite right there. Hand-coded assembly language only
>> makes sense for minimizing CPU usage. If you’re doing lots of I/O,
>> then the CPU is not the bottleneck, so trying to hand-tune assembly
>> code is a waste of time.
>
> I kind of agree. As a former assembler programmer - at one time it was 
> my first language - I'd like it to be true (although I'm out of the job 
> market), but I can't see it.  These days most HLL code is more optimized 
> than a lot of assembler. A good assembler programmer would not make a 
> lot of these optimizations due to lack of readability.

A mediocre assembly language programmer would not let lack of
readability stand in the way.  And once you get into self-modifying
code there are all sorts of horrible things you can do.

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  In this world there are
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  two kinds of people:
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |  from incomplete data.

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#95149 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromPeter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com>
Date2026-11-04 19:02 -0700
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11cgo33$178cd$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95127
On 11/4/26 12:51, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
> On 2026-11-04, Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 11/3/26 13:29, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 3 Nov 2026 12:45:09 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>
>>>> I know at least one guy working on IBM mainframes, and he tells me
>>>> they are in high need of good assembler programmers.
>>>>
>>>> They need high i/o with very large databases.
>>>
>>> Something not quite right there. Hand-coded assembly language only
>>> makes sense for minimizing CPU usage. If you’re doing lots of I/O,
>>> then the CPU is not the bottleneck, so trying to hand-tune assembly
>>> code is a waste of time.
>>
>> I kind of agree. As a former assembler programmer - at one time it was
>> my first language - I'd like it to be true (although I'm out of the job
>> market), but I can't see it.  These days most HLL code is more optimized
>> than a lot of assembler. A good assembler programmer would not make a
>> lot of these optimizations due to lack of readability.
> 
> A mediocre assembly language programmer would not let lack of
> readability stand in the way.  And once you get into self-modifying
> code there are all sorts of horrible things you can do.
> 

1. "standard" things like converting a branch to a nop or back. I know 
1401 Autocoder people used to do horrible things like using part of an 
instruction as a constant.
2. You can do anything as long as you comment it. I once had a sequence 
to test-store-conditional branch, for some reason I don't recall, bit I 
tagged it with comments saying "these three instructions must be kept 
together".

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#95066 — Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromJanis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com>
Date2026-11-04 03:23 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11ce4vn$85p2$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#95005
On 2026-11-03 12:45, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> 
> I know at least one guy working on IBM mainframes, and he tells me they 
> are in high need of good assembler programmers.

Wow! - I'd have thought that assembler programmers should
meanwhile be at "best" a niche, and systems programming
with "C" (or similar).

But, yes. It was now for long a problem getting staff for
legacy things. Those companies who are too inert to adapt
[to the technical evolution] will pay, suffer, or demise.

Janis

> [...]

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