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Groups > comp.os.linux.misc > #93793 > unrolled thread

Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI

Started byLeroy H <lh@somewhere.net>
First post2026-10-16 03:26 +0000
Last post2026-10-18 10:59 +0000
Articles 20 on this page of 513 — 35 participants

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Contents

  Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 03:26 +0000
    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 00:00 -0400
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 04:33 +0000
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 21:53 -0700
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 01:31 -0400
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 06:08 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:39 -0400
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:49 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:53 +0000
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 05:26 -0400
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:29 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:31 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:16 +0000
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-16 19:42 -0400
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:44 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:55 +0100
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:20 +0000
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:20 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:09 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 12:54 +0100
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:15 +0000
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:05 +0100
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 14:54 +0000
                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 16:46 +0100
                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 16:57 +0000
                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 19:01 +0000
                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:11 +0100
                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 14:48 -0700
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Harold Stevens <wookie@bookworm.localdomain> - 2026-10-17 08:26 -0500
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 15:01 +0100
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 12:19 -0700
                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 22:11 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:52 +0000
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:30 +0100
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:48 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:12 +0100
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 13:04 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 14:40 +0100
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:17 +0200
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 02:30 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:54 +0100
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 19:56 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:00 +0100
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 04:32 -0400
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:30 +0200
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:13 +0100
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 14:19 +0200
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:38 +0100
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 15:10 +0200
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 14:58 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 16:04 +0200
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 15:33 +0200
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 14:23 +0000
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 20:37 +0100
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-19 03:03 +0000
                                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:02 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:40 +0000
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-23 18:43 +0000
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 20:11 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 21:53 +0200
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 13:00 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 15:12 +0200
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 13:26 +0000
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 15:35 +0200
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 14:04 +0000
                                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 16:24 +0200
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 14:50 +0100
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:37 +0000
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:04 +0100
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 16:17 +0100
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-19 17:33 +0200
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 17:26 +0100
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 20:19 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 09:39 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 05:58 -0400
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:55 +0100
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:43 +0100
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:36 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:03 +0100
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 12:39 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-23 18:31 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-24 00:17 -0400
                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:19 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 03:48 +0000
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 02:20 +0000
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:58 -0700
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 03:33 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 09:06 -0700
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 19:04 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-17 06:37 -0400
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:59 +0100
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:20 +0200
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:50 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:48 +0100
                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 15:09 -0700
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-20 09:16 +0100
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-20 13:37 +0000
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 09:13 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:56 +0100
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-21 14:23 +0000
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 19:14 +0000
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:22 +0100
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-22 17:04 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 10:54 -0700
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:07 +0100
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 14:02 +0000
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 15:17 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 20:06 +0000
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:26 +0100
                                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-22 17:07 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 11:49 -0700
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 15:09 -0700
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:08 +0100
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-22 10:37 -0700
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 19:29 +0100
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 09:13 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 10:04 -0700
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 20:16 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-22 02:04 +0000
                                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-20 10:51 +0200
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-20 14:18 +0100
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 19:04 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:15 +0100
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-21 17:33 +0000
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-20 21:20 +0200
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 02:42 +0000
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-21 10:16 +0100
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-20 18:26 +0000
                                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-20 11:46 -0700
                                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 01:57 +0000
                                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-21 09:01 -0700
                                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 20:14 +0000
                                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:27 +0100
                                                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-22 17:23 +0000
                                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-20 19:33 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:25 +0200
                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-20 02:48 +0100
                              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-20 18:15 +0000
                                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 19:04 +0000
                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-20 21:27 +0200
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                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-20 23:18 +0000
                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 01:33 +0000
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-21 03:22 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 01:25 +0000
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                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-24 00:47 -0400
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                                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-21 19:06 +0000
                                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-22 08:09 +0100
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                                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-22 13:48 +0200
                                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-23 07:08 -0400
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          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 23:16 -0700
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 07:45 +0000
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                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 23:43 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:31 +0200
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 05:00 -0400
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 03:56 +0000
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                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-19 03:22 +0000
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                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 21:58 +0200
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-18 20:07 +0000
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-18 21:41 +0000
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                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:27 +0100
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                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 04:15 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:41 -0400
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:00 +0100
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:57 +0100
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:26 +0100
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:42 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:56 +0100
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:14 +0000
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 13:07 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:20 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:26 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:32 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:21 +0100
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 04:04 +0000
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:24 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:27 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:20 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 01:13 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 02:32 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 03:04 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:41 +0100
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 12:45 +0200
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 16:05 +0100
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 17:25 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-19 20:19 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:24 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:16 +0100
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:53 +0200
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 06:02 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 23:26 -0700
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 06:42 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 07:41 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 06:39 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:22 -0400
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:54 +0100
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:19 +0100
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:40 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:52 +0100
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 20:47 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-17 23:29 +0200
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Anton Antimo <anton@safunu.org> - 2026-10-19 17:18 -0300
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Helmut Waitzmann <nn.throttle@erine.email> - 2026-10-21 00:54 +0200
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-23 18:50 +0200
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-23 23:59 -0400
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-24 11:53 +0200
                      Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2026-10-24 12:10 +0000
                        Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-24 18:53 +0200
                          Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 00:28 -0400
                            Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-26 06:20 +0100
                              Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 03:38 -0400
                                Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 05:01 +0100
                                  Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-27 12:24 -0400
                                    [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-28 01:12 +0100
                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-28 05:26 -0400
                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-28 19:33 +0000
                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-29 00:19 +0000
                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-29 12:27 -0400
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 03:40 -0400
                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:24 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-30 23:10 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-31 04:14 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:40 +0100
                                                    Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-31 10:49 +0000
                                                      Re: Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-31 13:11 +0000
                                                        Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:53 +0100
                                                      Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:56 +0100
                                                        Re: Internal navigation in the online manual Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-31 22:41 +0000
                                                          Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:31 +0100
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-31 14:11 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 16:57 +0100
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:56 +0100
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 22:11 +0100
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 04:18 -0500
                                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-01 17:22 +0100
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:59 +0100
                                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-01 17:50 +0100
                                                        Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-01 01:08 +0000
                                                          Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 13:03 +0100
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2026-11-01 10:58 +0100
                                                    Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:57 +0000
                                                      Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 13:07 +0100
                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Josef Möllers <josef@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-28 17:01 +0100
                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-28 17:50 +0100
                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-28 18:18 +0000
                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David LaRue <huey.dll@tampabay.rr.com> - 2026-10-28 23:28 +0000
                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-29 00:11 +0000
                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-29 00:46 +0000
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-28 22:36 -0400
                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-29 09:13 -0700
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-29 18:13 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 04:00 -0400
                                            Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-29 17:37 +0000
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Kaz Kylheku <046-301-5902@kylheku.com> - 2026-10-29 20:01 +0000
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-29 21:18 +0100
                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-29 21:40 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-29 23:58 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-30 15:14 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 00:09 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-30 04:33 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-30 11:10 +0000
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-30 17:52 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-10-30 17:14 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:25 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-30 18:26 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:25 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-30 20:12 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) jayjwa <jayjwa@atr2.ath.cx.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:07 -0400
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:38 +0000
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 04:30 -0500
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-01 10:16 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:49 +0100
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 16:42 +0100
                                                      Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 20:08 +0100
                                                        Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 21:20 +0100
                                                          Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:19 +0100
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-31 18:42 +0000
                                                  Re: [OT] Punch card times "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:57 +0100
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-31 18:53 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] Punch card times Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:48 +0000
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-29 23:48 +0000
                                                Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 04:27 -0400
                                              Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 03:58 -0400
                        Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 00:57 -0400
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-24 13:41 +0000
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-24 21:31 +0200
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-24 22:36 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-25 23:49 -0400
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-26 06:04 +0100
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 03:15 -0400
                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 04:42 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-24 12:06 +0100
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-25 23:59 -0400
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-26 06:41 +0100
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 03:50 -0400
                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 02:44 +0100
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-10-26 15:16 -0700
                            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 02:26 +0100
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 05:29 +0000
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:07 +0100
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:28 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:26 +0100
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 10:56 +0000
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 12:40 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:46 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 13:39 +0100
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:48 +0000
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:16 +0100
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:51 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:04 +0100
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:13 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 13:03 +0100
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:26 +0000
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:21 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 15:07 +0000
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 21:26 -0400
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-17 01:55 +0000
                          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-17 01:07 -0400
                        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:28 +0100
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:35 +0000
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:09 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-10-16 16:37 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:51 +0000
    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-16 11:44 -0400
      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 16:14 +0000
        Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Jan Panteltje <alien@comet.invalid> - 2026-10-16 17:10 +0000
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 17:56 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-16 18:10 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 18:32 +0000
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 21:52 +0000
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:19 +0000
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 02:28 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-17 01:52 -0400
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:37 -0700
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:11 +0100
          Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 21:50 +0000
            Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-16 19:39 -0400
              Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 09:43 +0000
                Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 15:02 +0100
                  Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 15:06 +0100
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 17:15 +0100
                      Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 19:55 +0000
                    Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
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#94809 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromRobert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net>
Date2026-10-30 17:14 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<slrn11e9k3o.n12.spamtrap42@one.localnet>
In reply to#94792
On 2026-10-30, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:
> On Fri, 30 Oct 2026 00:09:50 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>
>> I attended university from 1968 to 1971.  In the fall of 1968 they
>> converted from an IBM 7044 to a 360/67.  The 360 had a few 2260s, but I
>> wouldn't call them common and access was fairly restricted.
>
> The 360/67 was the start of something new for IBM -- timesharing. The 
> 360/30 maxxed out at 64K and became a satellite processor for some of the 
> later 360 machines. I wasn't too interested but a friend was and spoke of 
> the future with awe. He eventually dropped out and moved to Boston where 
> there was a lot more happening.
>
> My girlfriend started at SUNY Albany before transferring out of that zoo. 
> I can't remember what they had, CDC maybe, but definitely not IBM and her 
> programming course was in some language that I don't think survived 
> either. 

Speaking of space limitations in the 360 architecture:

Early in my career, 1985 IIRC, I was charged with running
full-chip switch-mode logic similation of the first 960 processor
and got to use an EDAC machine all by myself.  Normal IBM
machines at the time were limited to a 24-bit address space for a
given virtual machine under VM/CMS.  IBM had built a very small
handful of machines that supported a larger address space.  IBM
owed Intel some money at that time.  To pay that debt, IBM loaned
Intel an EDAC machine.  It was used for full-chip switch-mode
logic simulation of the 386.

Immediately after the 386 taped out and was finished with the
machine, I was tasked with running the full-chip logic similation
for the 960 chip.  Largely due to several rounds of microcode bug
fixes, our tapeout slipped beyond the date IBM had agreed to loan
Intel the machine.  For the remaining time we needed to use it, I
was told the rent was $150k/month.  I was the only user.  That
rent was well over an order of magnitude larger than my salary.
No pressure...

-- 
Robert Riches
spamtrap42@jacob21819.net
(Yes, that is one of my email addresses.)

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#94813 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromCharlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
Date2026-10-30 19:25 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<ga6FS.16032$WY1.4425@fx06.iad>
In reply to#94792
On 2026-10-30, rbowman <bowman@montana.com> wrote:

> On Fri, 30 Oct 2026 00:09:50 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:
>
>> I attended university from 1968 to 1971.  In the fall of 1968 they
>> converted from an IBM 7044 to a 360/67.  The 360 had a few 2260s, but I
>> wouldn't call them common and access was fairly restricted.
>
> The 360/67 was the start of something new for IBM -- timesharing. The 
> 360/30 maxxed out at 64K and became a satellite processor for some of the 
> later 360 machines. I wasn't too interested but a friend was and spoke of 
> the future with awe. He eventually dropped out and moved to Boston where 
> there was a lot more happening.

This machine didn't run an IBM operating system; it ran MTS, the
Michigan Terminal System.  It was far better at timesharing than
any IBM operating system.

> My girlfriend started at SUNY Albany before transferring out of that zoo. 
> I can't remember what they had, CDC maybe, but definitely not IBM and her 
> programming course was in some language that I don't think survived 
> either. 

One course when I was there hit you with a different language
every two weeks: Algol 60, Algol 68, Algol W, pl360 (the
misbegotten bastard child of Algol and assembly language),
LISP, UMIST, SNOBOL4...  Fortunately I dropped out before
I had to take that one.  I did a term project in assembly
language - my prof kept getting a pained expression as he
repeatedly asked me why I would do such a thing.

I left for a programming job in the Real World, writing
assembly language and RPG for a card-based system with
16K of memory.

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  In this world there are
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  two kinds of people:
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |  from incomplete data.

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#94811 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromLeroy H <lh@somewhere.net>
Date2026-10-30 18:26 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<18e361f191ae2cbb$1317$3179723$802601b3@news.usenetexpress.com>
In reply to#94786
On Thu, 29 Oct 2026 21:40:04 -0000 (UTC), Christian Weisgerber wrote:

> On 2026-10-29, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
> 
>>> For those of us too young: When exactly did terminals become common
>>> on university campuses?  Please be more specific than "the 1980s".
>>

There were only PCs when I was there, but my school also had access
to time sharing with the mainframes of the Michigan Terminal System,
or MTS:

<https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michigan_Terminal_System>

On an early morning (about 2 am) job run, I literally brought the
mainframe to its knees while simultaneously burning up the entire
annual department time-sharing budget, via an extensive numerical
simulation involving 500x500 matrix calculations.

From that experience I learned a valuable computer science lesson
that is not found in the standard textbooks: the most powerful
digital computers are DAMNED SLOW AND IMPOTENT.

I ended up doing the simulation on a desktop PC using almost
4 WEEKS of runtime.

My current desktop is probably a lot more powerful than those
mainframes but most tasks of interest are still largely untouchable.

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#94814 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromCharlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
Date2026-10-30 19:25 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<ha6FS.16033$WY1.2182@fx06.iad>
In reply to#94811
On 2026-10-30, Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> wrote:

> On an early morning (about 2 am) job run, I literally brought the
> mainframe to its knees while simultaneously burning up the entire
> annual department time-sharing budget, via an extensive numerical
> simulation involving 500x500 matrix calculations.
>
> From that experience I learned a valuable computer science lesson
> that is not found in the standard textbooks: the most powerful
> digital computers are DAMNED SLOW AND IMPOTENT.

I wouldn't call that a computer science lesson; many CS weenies
assume that computers are infinitely powerful, and start whining when
confronted with systems in the real world.  I had a confrontation
with a guy like that when trying to determine why a COBOL program
was running like molasses through a pinhole in January.  One reason
was that this genius had declared all subscripts as COMP-3 (packed
decimal) rather than binary.  Just changing those declarations alone
knocked 30% off the execution time.  I wish I could have had more
time to work on that program; I bet I could have really sped it up.
I calculated that the nested PERFORM VARYING loop that cleared a
3-dimensional array would have taken 25 minutes of the estimated
50-hour run time, due to a combination of those decimal subscripts
and subroutine calling overhead.  (The CPU did about 130 KIPS.)

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  In this world there are
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  two kinds of people:
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |  from incomplete data.

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#94815 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromLeroy H <lh@somewhere.net>
Date2026-10-30 20:12 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<18e367c1df8453cf$117$2902356$802601b3@news.usenetexpress.com>
In reply to#94814
On Fri, 30 Oct 2026 19:25:01 GMT, Charlie Gibbs wrote:

>>
>> From that experience I learned a valuable computer science lesson
>> that is not found in the standard textbooks: the most powerful
>> digital computers are DAMNED SLOW AND IMPOTENT.
> 
> I wouldn't call that a computer science lesson; many CS weenies
> assume that computers are infinitely powerful, and start whining when
> confronted with systems in the real world.  I had a confrontation
> with a guy like that when trying to determine why a COBOL program
> was running like molasses through a pinhole in January.  One reason
> was that this genius had declared all subscripts as COMP-3 (packed
> decimal) rather than binary.  Just changing those declarations alone
> knocked 30% off the execution time.  I wish I could have had more
> time to work on that program; I bet I could have really sped it up.
> I calculated that the nested PERFORM VARYING loop that cleared a
> 3-dimensional array would have taken 25 minutes of the estimated
> 50-hour run time, due to a combination of those decimal subscripts
> and subroutine calling overhead.  (The CPU did about 130 KIPS.)
>

Optimization can only go so far.  That's why supercomputers are being
continually developed.

But yes, software optimization is quite important and very much can be
said about it, but most users will not ever need to be aware.  Modern
hardware can handle most routine computing tasks very efficiently.
It is only fringe activities, such as video encoding or scientific
calculations, that require massive hardware power.

One hardware problem that needs to be fixed above all else is memory
speed.  Currently, all RAM is just another storage layer.  The CPU
does not directly process RAM data, but only data that has been transferred
from RAM to cache memory -- and only first order cache at that.  This
ridiculous situation can seriously degrade performance if the programmer
is not continually vigilant.

I would claim that this "cache problem" is the most critical of all. 
The company that could produce cheap RAM memory on par with cache speeds
would make $trillions overnight.

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#94849 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

Fromjayjwa <jayjwa@atr2.ath.cx.invalid>
Date2026-10-31 11:07 -0400
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<87tsm1aoxo.fsf@atr2.ath.cx>
In reply to#94811
Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> writes:

> There were only PCs when I was there, but my school also had access
> to time sharing with the mainframes of the Michigan Terminal System,
> or MTS:
>
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michigan_Terminal_System>
You can run this under SDL Hercules. I have a D6 system. Unfortunately,
there's not much installed in the way of software, it doesn't have any
languages I really know, and it couldn't do networking last I checked
(the SDL Hercules project w/MTS - the real machine could or so I
heard). Still, it's fun and gives me a reason to dust off the x3270.

https://try-mts.com/why-try-mts/
https://sdl-hercules-390.github.io/html/

It has this thing where, after a day or two, it wants to dump its stats
to "tape" and you have to do a dance with it, only it does not want to
take its tape, like a kid does not want to eat lima beans.

00049 MTS  *DWB: MOUNT NEW CMDSTAT TAPE RING IN WITH RACK  M002 FOR INITIALIZAT

This is what it looks like if/when you win:
00049 MTS SYS.:  F (1 9TP) M002 on 9TP, ring IN, 'CMDSTAT' ********************
OK M002 T90A

The DEC systems are more fun, have better docs, and much more software.

> My current desktop is probably a lot more powerful than those
> mainframes but most tasks of interest are still largely untouchable.
Absolutely. A smartphone is.

-- 
PGP Key ID: 781C A3E2 C6ED 70A6 B356  7AF5 B510 542E D460 5CAE
       "The Internet should always be the Wild West!"

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#94867 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2026-10-31 21:38 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11c5n4b$1f300$4@dont-email.me>
In reply to#94849
On Sat, 31 Oct 2026 11:07:47 -0400, jayjwa wrote:

> The DEC systems are more fun, have better docs, and much more
> software.

If you look at all the vintage docs collected at Bitsavers, out of
(currently) about 660GB in total, over 40% is from DEC. Number 2 is
IBM, but the DEC collection is bigger by nearly 3:1.

Number 3 is CDC, at about a quarter of the size of the IBM collection.

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#94879 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

Fromc186282 <c186282@nnada.net>
Date2026-11-01 04:30 -0500
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<K2idnW7KxZMmm3r3nZ2dnZfqnPSdnZ2d@giganews.com>
In reply to#94867
On 10/31/26 17:38, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
> On Sat, 31 Oct 2026 11:07:47 -0400, jayjwa wrote:
> 
>> The DEC systems are more fun, have better docs, and much more
>> software.
> 
> If you look at all the vintage docs collected at Bitsavers, out of
> (currently) about 660GB in total, over 40% is from DEC. Number 2 is
> IBM, but the DEC collection is bigger by nearly 3:1.
> 
> Number 3 is CDC, at about a quarter of the size of the IBM collection.

   The DEC boxes were GREAT !

   Not entirely sure why they went out of biz - likely
   idiot management. Daddy builds it, Junior TRASHES it.

   Still wish someone would modernize VMS - it was a
   fantastic/powerful system with a ton of prescient
   modern features - could do international internet
   before there WAS an internet.

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#94882 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromThomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de>
Date2026-11-01 10:16 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11c73he$1s1nv$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#94879
c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> schrieb:
> On 10/31/26 17:38, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
>> On Sat, 31 Oct 2026 11:07:47 -0400, jayjwa wrote:
>> 
>>> The DEC systems are more fun, have better docs, and much more
>>> software.
>> 
>> If you look at all the vintage docs collected at Bitsavers, out of
>> (currently) about 660GB in total, over 40% is from DEC. Number 2 is
>> IBM, but the DEC collection is bigger by nearly 3:1.
>> 
>> Number 3 is CDC, at about a quarter of the size of the IBM collection.
>
>    The DEC boxes were GREAT !
>
>    Not entirely sure why they went out of biz - likely
>    idiot management. Daddy builds it, Junior TRASHES it.

Daddy built it, daddy trashed it (Ken Olsen, he was responsible
for both).

If you are interested, you could look up "DEC is Dead, Long Live
DEC", an excellent book.

>    Still wish someone would modernize VMS - it was a
>    fantastic/powerful system with a ton of prescient
>    modern features - could do international internet
>    before there WAS an internet.

Somebody is trying to do so (see https://vmssoftware.com/) but
that particular train has left the station a long time ago.

-- 
This USENET posting was made without artificial intelligence,
artificial impertinence, artificial arrogance, artificial stupidity,
artificial flavorings or artificial colorants.

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#94836 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-10-31 11:49 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<nklvdeFas32U3@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#94786
On 2026-10-29 22:40, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> On 2026-10-29, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:
> 
>>> For those of us too young: When exactly did terminals become common
>>> on university campuses?  Please be more specific than "the 1980s".
>>
>> Depends on the country and the uni. Even depends on the department.
> 
> I'm asking for personal recollections.  When did it happen for you?
> I've been wondering for some time, and this seems like the perfect
> opportunity to ask, given that people have reminisced about their
> punch card days.
> 
> And yes, I expect computer science got terminals earlier than
> engineering.
> 
>> I think I saw it in 1983, but there were departments that had terminals
>> earlier.
> 
> That's one data point, thanks.


I was forced by the system to take first year of engineering at the 
university in my province. All engineering had the same first year. Once 
we (if!) we passed, we could actually choose what college to continue 
in. So, when I arrived to Madrid for my second year (I think that was in 
the 83), a friend told me that the computer building that was shared by 
all in the campus had switched from cards to terminals, and that I had 
just missed it.

And he described me the nightmare that first/second year students had to 
suffer to get their stack of cards punched and executed. Could take days.

(I think that the school in which he did the first year had some 
computer thing in the Maths course, but I don't remember well what he 
told me)

-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

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#94851 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromJanis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com>
Date2026-10-31 16:42 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11c529k$nak9$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#94836
On 2026-10-31 11:49, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> [...] So, when I arrived to Madrid for my second year (I think that was in 
> the 83), a friend told me that the computer building that was shared by 
> all in the campus had switched from cards to terminals, and that I had 
> just missed it.
> 
> And he described me the nightmare that first/second year students had to 
> suffer to get their stack of cards punched and executed. Could take days.

Strong words. And absurd time scales. They certainly don't match my
observations. All of us did our punch cards based coding often just
during the pauses between the lectures; the basic code maybe in an
hour, the fixes - usually just one or two iterations needed - done
during the "cum tempore" 10 minutes. But most programming in those
early beginner courses also wasn't too voluminous, to be fair.

What certainly was painful was the (for obvious reasons) inherent
non-existence of a <Del> or <Backspace> key on the punch devices.
(They had a useful "Copy" key (<Dup>?), though.)[*]

BTW, a "nightmare" I considered the keyboards that came with the
VT100 series of terminals! (My fingers still ache if I only think
back of these days!) Luckily these times passed fast.

Janis, now back at his Model-M keyboard clone

[*] IIRC, they looked like (or may even have been) these devices:
https://mimmsmuseum.org/wp-content/uploads/2020/07/Punchcard-708x1024.jpg
(For those who couldn't imagine what we dinosaurs are talking about.) :-)
Still amazing seeing images of these devices again after all those
many decades.

> [...]

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#94861 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-10-31 20:08 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<nkmsliFftpsU8@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#94851
On 2026-10-31 16:42, Janis Papanagnou wrote:
> On 2026-10-31 11:49, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> [...] So, when I arrived to Madrid for my second year (I think that 
>> was in the 83), a friend told me that the computer building that was 
>> shared by all in the campus had switched from cards to terminals, and 
>> that I had just missed it.
>>
>> And he described me the nightmare that first/second year students had 
>> to suffer to get their stack of cards punched and executed. Could take 
>> days.
> 
> Strong words. And absurd time scales. They certainly don't match my
> observations. All of us did our punch cards based coding often just
> during the pauses between the lectures; the basic code maybe in an
> hour, the fixes - usually just one or two iterations needed - done
> during the "cum tempore" 10 minutes. But most programming in those
> early beginner courses also wasn't too voluminous, to be fair.
> 
> What certainly was painful was the (for obvious reasons) inherent
> non-existence of a <Del> or <Backspace> key on the punch devices.
> (They had a useful "Copy" key (<Dup>?), though.)[*]

I don't remember if my friend punched his own code, or had it punched. 
Would depend on how many punch machines they had for lowly students.

I remember his saying that he had to submit his stack of cards to a 
clerk, then given a paper slip to collect the results another day.

...

-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

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#94863 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromJanis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com>
Date2026-10-31 21:20 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11c5ij7$nak9$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#94861
On 2026-10-31 20:08, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> 
> I don't remember if my friend punched his own code, or had it punched. 
> Would depend on how many punch machines they had for lowly students.

We had a "row" of such machines available. Don't recall to have
ever waited for a free place (or the waiting time was negligible).

> 
> I remember his saying that he had to submit his stack of cards to a 
> clerk, then given a paper slip to collect the results another day.

The way it was done in our place was technically similar but did
not require that much time.

The batch cards reader was in an accessible are, you could just
put the cards either directly in the reader device or in a queue
on a nearby desk where an operator did that job then. The reader
was constantly fed with cards by the operators since the queue
was also regularly filled by all the students; hardly more delay
than, maybe, 15 minutes. The printouts were quickly created with
the batch processing by super-fast chain printers, so were also
available in short term. Some delay was due to the fanfold paper
needed to be physically separated (by the jobs or user IDs) to be
associated to the different users. The output landed sorted in a
special shelf where we could fetch them. The whole batch process,
from the punch cards delivery to getting the printout results in
(typically less than) an hour.

A peculiarity of the physical separation of the printouts was the
application of a nice trick; the printing logic for the front page
of the job printed some text (X-es?) across the paper-perforation
so that the individual jobs could quickly be detected visually if
you looked at the paper stack from the side.

Janis

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#94884 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-11-01 12:19 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<nkolhmFp0edU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#94863
On 2026-10-31 21:20, Janis Papanagnou wrote:
> On 2026-10-31 20:08, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>
>> I don't remember if my friend punched his own code, or had it punched. 
>> Would depend on how many punch machines they had for lowly students.
> 
> We had a "row" of such machines available. Don't recall to have
> ever waited for a free place (or the waiting time was negligible).
> 
>>
>> I remember his saying that he had to submit his stack of cards to a 
>> clerk, then given a paper slip to collect the results another day.
> 
> The way it was done in our place was technically similar but did
> not require that much time.
> 
> The batch cards reader was in an accessible are, you could just
> put the cards either directly in the reader device or in a queue
> on a nearby desk where an operator did that job then. The reader
> was constantly fed with cards by the operators since the queue
> was also regularly filled by all the students; hardly more delay
> than, maybe, 15 minutes. The printouts were quickly created with
> the batch processing by super-fast chain printers, so were also
> available in short term. Some delay was due to the fanfold paper
> needed to be physically separated (by the jobs or user IDs) to be
> associated to the different users. The output landed sorted in a
> special shelf where we could fetch them. The whole batch process,
> from the punch cards delivery to getting the printout results in
> (typically less than) an hour.
> 
> A peculiarity of the physical separation of the printouts was the
> application of a nice trick; the printing logic for the front page
> of the job printed some text (X-es?) across the paper-perforation
> so that the individual jobs could quickly be detected visually if
> you looked at the paper stack from the side.

Ah! This part I knew nothing about, but makes sense.


-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

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#94856 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

Fromrbowman <bowman@montana.com>
Date2026-10-31 18:42 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<nkmr4qFftq4U1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#94836
On Sat, 31 Oct 2026 11:49:18 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> I was forced by the system to take first year of engineering at the
> university in my province. All engineering had the same first year. Once
> we (if!) we passed, we could actually choose what college to continue
> in.

At mine the first two years were the same for everyone. It provided the 
basics needed for specialization. 

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#94838 — Re: [OT] Punch card times

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-10-31 11:57 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times
Message-ID<nklvsjFas33U5@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#94786
On 2026-10-29 22:40, Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> On 2026-10-29, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:


>> I think I saw it in 1983, but there were departments that had terminals
>> earlier.
> 
> That's one data point, thanks.

I have one recollection of maybe 1983 or 84, visiting the microwave 
department, which was designing the aerial complex of a new frigate. 
They had a model to scale in an anechoic chamber; they had to scale the 
frequencies up to match the ship model. And they had an Apple-II (or was 
it I?) doing some long calculations. The display was off, the teacher 
was in the back, and he asked us near the machine to turn the display on 
to see the simulation. None of us knew how to do that. He had to come to 
the front, grumbling about how come we did not know where the switch was.

Well, none of us had the money to buy an Apple II! And the IBM PC was 
still a year or two away.

-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

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#94858 — Re: [OT] Punch card times

Fromrbowman <bowman@montana.com>
Date2026-10-31 18:53 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times
Message-ID<nkmrq0Fftq4U2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#94838
On Sat, 31 Oct 2026 11:57:23 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> I have one recollection of maybe 1983 or 84, visiting the microwave
> department, which was designing the aerial complex of a new frigate.
> They had a model to scale in an anechoic chamber; they had to scale the
> frequencies up to match the ship model. And they had an Apple-II (or was
> it I?) doing some long calculations. The display was off, the teacher
> was in the back, and he asked us near the machine to turn the display on
> to see the simulation. None of us knew how to do that. He had to come to
> the front, grumbling about how come we did not know where the switch
> was.
> 
> Well, none of us had the money to buy an Apple II! And the IBM PC was
> still a year or two away.

The company I worked for wasn't big on pending money but for some reason 
they had a firm come it to teach us pair programming. The presenter 
arrived with Macs for the hands on experience. There were probably 60 
people attending, none of whom had ever used a Mac. The programmers from 
my area grabbed the snacks and ghosted. 

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#94868 — Re: [OT] Punch card times

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2026-10-31 21:48 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times
Message-ID<11c5nml$1f300$5@dont-email.me>
In reply to#94838
On Sat, 31 Oct 2026 11:57:23 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> I have one recollection of maybe 1983 or 84, visiting the microwave
> department, which was designing the aerial complex of a new frigate.
> They had a model to scale in an anechoic chamber; they had to scale
> the frequencies up to match the ship model. And they had an Apple-II
> (or was it I?) doing some long calculations.

In about 1987 or so, all the 🇳🇿 universities were members of the Apple
University Consortium. We decided to put together a report on what
people were doing with their respective Apple Mac gear. To try to get
a fresh perspective on things, each University sent a person to report
on another one. I got sent to Auckland.

At the Architecture department, I found a guy using a Macintosh II to
collect data on the acoustic characteristics of architectural models.
As you say, to get the numbers to come out proportionally right, he
had to scale down the wavelengths to match the scale of the model,
which meant scaling up the frequencies. And the old IBM PC (AT?) bus
of the time simply didn’t have the bandwidth to cope with those high
frequencies; but the 32-bit NuBus inside the Mac II could.

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#94788 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2026-10-29 23:48 +0000
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<11c0m0m$3q5il$7@dont-email.me>
In reply to#94778
On Thu, 29 Oct 2026 17:37:23 -0000 (UTC), Christian Weisgerber wrote:

> For those of us too young: When exactly did terminals become common
> on university campuses?  Please be more specific than "the 1980s".

How about “the 1970s”?

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#94801 — Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)

Fromc186282 <c186282@nnada.net>
Date2026-10-30 04:27 -0400
SubjectRe: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)
Message-ID<6cqcnXMuGul9yXn3nZ2dnZfqnPudnZ2d@giganews.com>
In reply to#94788
On 10/29/26 19:48, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
> On Thu, 29 Oct 2026 17:37:23 -0000 (UTC), Christian Weisgerber wrote:
> 
>> For those of us too young: When exactly did terminals become common
>> on university campuses?  Please be more specific than "the 1980s".
> 
> How about “the 1970s”?

   Fair enough. As said, depends on WHERE.

   Where I was, first saw like a dozen 'public
   access' terminals in 1978.

   But you had to be 'authorized' - and for
   minor users it was just access to a few
   little databases.

   Even the 'big iron' (usually medium-iron) of
   the day couldn't handle TOO much stuff.

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