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Groups > comp.os.linux.misc > #90165 > unrolled thread

/dev/tcp

Started byEli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com>
First post2026-08-19 21:20 +0000
Last post2026-08-29 18:15 +0100
Articles 20 on this page of 590 — 29 participants

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Contents

  /dev/tcp Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2026-08-19 21:20 +0000
    Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-19 23:53 +0100
    Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-19 23:42 +0000
      Re: /dev/tcp Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2026-08-20 00:59 +0000
        Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-20 03:59 +0000
          Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-20 10:10 +0100
          Re: /dev/tcp Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2026-08-20 18:15 +0000
            Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-20 23:30 +0000
              Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-21 01:18 +0100
              Re: /dev/tcp Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam2616@zugschl.us> - 2026-08-21 09:52 +0200
                Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-21 08:12 +0000
                  Re: /dev/tcp Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam2616@zugschl.us> - 2026-08-21 11:16 +0200
                    Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-21 22:57 +0000
                      Re: /dev/tcp Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam2616@zugschl.us> - 2026-08-22 06:17 +0200
                        Re: /dev/tcp David De La Harpe Golden <david@harpegolden.net> - 2026-08-30 17:56 +0100
                Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-21 21:50 -0400
                Re: /dev/tcp Anssi Saari <anssi.saari@usenet.mail.kapsi.fi> - 2026-08-24 17:42 +0300
                  Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-24 23:53 +0000
                  Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 02:27 -0400
              Re: /dev/tcp vallor <vallor@vallor.earth> - 2026-08-23 00:56 +0000
                Re: /dev/tcp Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-23 04:01 +0000
                  Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-23 03:37 -0400
                    Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-23 13:50 +0200
                      Re: /dev/tcp vallor <vallor@vallor.earth> - 2026-08-23 22:28 +0000
                        Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-24 09:35 +0200
                          Overwriting with random data (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-24 11:10 +0100
                            Re: Overwriting with random data "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-24 20:34 +0200
                              Re: Overwriting with random data Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-24 20:57 +0100
                                Re: Overwriting with random data "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-24 22:26 +0200
                                  Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 02:39 -0400
                                    Re: Overwriting with random data Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 08:45 +0100
                                      Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 21:39 -0400
                                        Re: Overwriting with random data Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-08-26 18:08 +0000
                                      Re: Overwriting with random data Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-28 00:49 +0000
                                        Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-28 00:59 -0400
                                          Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 12:19 +0100
                                    Re: Overwriting with random data "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-25 11:36 +0200
                                      Re: Overwriting with random data Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 15:19 +0100
                                        Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 03:33 -0400
                                          Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-26 09:18 +0100
                                            Re: Overwriting with random data rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-26 17:34 +0000
                                              Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 01:52 -0400
                                                Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-27 12:11 +0100
                                                  Re: Overwriting with random data Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-28 01:00 +0000
                                                  Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 22:16 -0400
                                                    Re: Overwriting with random data Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 08:32 +0100
                                                      Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-28 03:34 -0400
                                                        Re: Overwriting with random data Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-08-28 11:37 +0100
                                                          Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 12:44 +0100
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-08-28 13:25 +0100
                                                              Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 15:27 +0100
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-28 19:30 +0000
                                                          Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-29 00:59 -0400
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-29 01:57 -0400
                                                              Re: Overwriting with random data rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-29 20:42 +0000
                                                        Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 12:33 +0100
                                                          Re: Overwriting with random data rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-28 19:50 +0000
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-29 10:11 +0100
                                                          Re: Overwriting with random data Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-08-29 05:25 +0000
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-29 02:12 -0400
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-29 10:15 +0100
                                                              Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-29 21:56 -0400
                                                    Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 12:29 +0100
                                                      Re: Overwriting with random data Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-08-28 13:43 +0100
                                                      Re: Overwriting with random data Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-28 20:15 +0000
                                                        Re: Overwriting with random data Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-08-28 21:59 +0000
                                                          Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-29 02:09 -0400
                                                          Re: Overwriting with random data Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-08-29 08:59 +0100
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-29 09:25 +0000
                                                              Re: Overwriting with random data Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-08-29 11:19 +0100
                                                                Re: Overwriting with random data rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-29 20:45 +0000
                                                                Re: Overwriting with random data Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-29 22:38 +0000
                                                                Re: Overwriting with random data Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-09-02 19:33 +0000
                                                                  Re: Overwriting with random data Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-09-02 20:21 +0000
                                                                    Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-02 22:22 -0400
                                                                      Re: Overwriting with random data Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-09-03 02:53 +0000
                                                                        Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-02 23:28 -0400
                                                                      Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-03 11:51 +0100
                                                                  Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-02 23:09 -0400
                                                                    Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-03 11:52 +0100
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-08-29 15:10 +0000
                                                              Re: Overwriting with random data Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-08-30 08:58 +0100
                                                                Re: Overwriting with random data Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-30 23:45 +0000
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-29 21:47 -0400
                                                          Re: Overwriting with random data Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-29 13:56 +0100
                                                          Re: Overwriting with random data Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-08-29 14:17 +0000
                                                            Re: Overwriting with random data Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-08-29 16:02 +0000
                                                              Re: Overwriting with random data "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-29 22:12 +0200
                                                                Re: Overwriting with random data Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-08-29 21:04 +0000
                                                              Re: Overwriting with random data Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-09-05 09:32 +0000
                                                                Re: Overwriting with random data Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-05 13:49 +0100
                                                                  Re: Overwriting with random data Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2026-09-20 15:54 +0200
                                          Re: Overwriting with random data Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-28 00:58 +0000
                                            Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 12:23 +0100
                                      Re: Overwriting with random data Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-28 00:53 +0000
                                    Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 12:12 +0100
                                      Re: Overwriting with random data c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 00:09 -0400
                                        Re: Overwriting with random data The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-26 08:52 +0100
                                          Re: Overwriting with random data Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-28 01:02 +0000
                                    Re: Overwriting with random data Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-28 00:48 +0000
                          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 00:37 -0400
                      Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-24 00:31 -0400
                        Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-24 09:45 +0200
                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-23 12:52 +0100
                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-23 12:50 +0100
    Re: /dev/tcp Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-20 13:50 +0000
      Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-20 13:02 -0400
        Re: /dev/tcp Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2026-08-20 18:26 +0000
          Re: /dev/tcp Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-08-29 13:48 +0000
            Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-29 22:44 +0000
              Re: /dev/tcp Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-08-29 23:05 +0000
                Re: /dev/tcp vallor <vallor@vallor.earth> - 2026-08-30 00:58 +0000
                  Re: /dev/tcp Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-08-30 04:12 +0000
                  Re: /dev/tcp Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-08-30 09:25 +0000
                    Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-30 11:00 +0100
                    Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-30 23:54 +0000
                    Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-31 09:34 +0100
                      Re: /dev/tcp Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-09-05 09:08 +0000
                        Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-05 10:25 +0100
                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-05 19:19 +0100
                            Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-05 22:38 +0000
                              Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-05 21:40 -0400
                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-06 09:16 +0100
                            Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-05 21:38 -0400
                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-06 09:19 +0100
                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-06 18:54 +0000
                                  Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-06 23:27 -0400
                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-07 11:54 +0100
                                Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-07 03:52 +0000
                                  Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-07 00:12 -0400
                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-07 12:00 +0100
                                      Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-07 19:34 +0000
                                        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-07 22:23 +0100
                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-08 05:45 +0000
                                        Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-07 22:24 +0100
                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-08 05:48 +0000
                                            Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-08 01:52 -0400
                                              Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-08 08:46 +0100
                                                [OT] /dev/economy (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-08 10:28 +0100
                                                  Re: [OT] /dev/economy The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-08 13:43 +0100
                                                  Re: [OT] /dev/economy (was: Re: /dev/tcp) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-08 18:32 +0000
                                                    Re: [OT] /dev/economy (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-09-08 20:38 +0000
                                                      Re: [OT] /dev/economy Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-09 00:48 +0100
                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-08 18:41 +0000
                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-09 00:52 +0100
                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-09 01:34 +0000
                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-09 09:28 +0100
                                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-09 09:26 +0100
                                                      Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-09 18:22 +0000
                                                        Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-09 23:37 -0400
                                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-10 04:46 +0000
                                                            Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-10 02:19 -0400
                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-10 18:25 +0000
                                                                Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-11 03:09 -0400
                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-11 10:20 +0100
                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-11 19:25 +0000
                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:36 +0100
                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-12 23:05 -0400
                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-13 07:14 +0000
                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 03:49 -0400
                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-13 21:51 +0000
                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 20:59 -0400
                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-14 04:33 +0000
                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-14 01:26 -0400
                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 10:49 +0100
                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-14 17:46 +0000
                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 19:07 +0100
                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-15 00:33 +0000
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 07:50 +0100
                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 09:56 +0100
                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-11 23:31 -0400
                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:43 +0100
                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-12 14:05 +0200
                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 17:40 +0100
                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-12 19:29 +0000
                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-11 19:21 +0000
                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-12 02:37 -0400
                                                        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-10 11:31 +0100
                                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-10 18:38 +0000
                                                            Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-11 00:26 +0100
                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-11 04:10 +0000
                                                  Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-09 01:00 -0400
                                                Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-09 00:55 -0400
                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-08 09:32 +0100
                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-08 18:44 +0000
                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-08 21:05 +0100
                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-09 01:35 +0000
                                                      Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-09 03:47 -0400
                                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-09 18:18 +0000
                                                          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-09 23:22 -0400
                                                            Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-10 04:44 +0000
                                                              Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-10 02:13 -0400
                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-10 11:26 +0100
                                                            Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-10 19:07 +0200
                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-10 18:35 +0000
                                                                Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-11 03:24 -0400
                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-11 10:27 +0100
                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-11 19:07 +0000
                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-12 02:36 -0400
                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:26 +0100
                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-12 23:01 -0400
                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 09:52 +0100
                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:23 +0100
                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-12 19:22 +0000
                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-10 19:37 +0100
                                                                Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-10 20:58 +0200
                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-11 00:25 +0100
                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-11 11:32 +0200
                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-11 10:51 +0100
                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-11 12:03 +0200
                                                                          [OT] Middle East (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 00:43 +0100
                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-12 02:09 -0400
                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:26 +0100
                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 11:45 +0100
                                                                                [OT] Middle East (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 09:56 +0100
                                                                                  Re: [OT] Middle East The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 10:37 +0100
                                                                                    Re: [OT] Middle East rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-13 19:33 +0000
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Middle East The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 21:01 +0100
                                                                                      Re: [OT] Middle East "Rinaldi J. Montessi" <rinaldij@alien.free> - 2026-09-13 17:30 -0500
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Middle East c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 22:05 -0400
                                                                                          Re: [OT] Middle East rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-14 03:19 +0000
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Middle East c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 23:35 -0400
                                                                                            Re: [OT] Middle East The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 10:52 +0100
                                                                                        Re: [OT] Middle East rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-14 02:37 +0000
                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:47 +0100
                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-12 14:09 +0200
                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 17:41 +0100
                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-12 14:07 +0200
                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 17:45 +0100
                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:13 +0100
                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-12 19:05 +0000
                                                                  [OT] Middle East (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 10:01 +0100
                                                                    Re: [OT] Middle East The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 10:11 +0100
                                                                      Re: [OT] Middle East Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 10:40 +0100
                                                                        Re: [OT] Middle East The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 10:58 +0100
                                                                    Re: [OT] Middle East "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-13 14:08 +0200
                                                                      Re: [OT] Middle East The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 21:01 +0100
                                                                    Re: [OT] Middle East c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 20:48 -0400
                                                                      Re: [OT] Middle East Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 10:45 +0100
                                                                      Re: [OT] Middle East The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 10:59 +0100
                                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-11 04:12 +0000
                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-11 10:16 +0100
                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-11 19:13 +0000
                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:27 +0100
                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-12 19:42 +0000
                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 00:22 -0400
                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-13 07:51 +0100
                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-13 07:02 +0000
                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 09:31 +0100
                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-13 09:45 +0100
                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 10:21 +0100
                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 03:02 -0400
                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-13 08:39 +0100
                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 03:50 -0400
                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 10:13 +0100
                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 09:51 +0100
                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 09:44 +0100
                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-13 21:39 +0000
                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 09:31 +0100
                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-13 19:32 -0400
                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 10:54 +0100
                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-14 09:20 +0100
                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 11:06 +0100
                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-14 19:56 +0100
                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 20:07 +0100
                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-14 23:01 +0100
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-15 00:30 +0000
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 07:42 +0100
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-15 09:26 +0200
                                                                                              [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 10:18 +0100
                                                                                                Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-15 20:24 +0200
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 00:51 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 00:56 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-16 07:25 +0200
                                                                                                        Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:13 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:09 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 00:52 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-16 07:26 +0200
                                                                                                    Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:09 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 18:17 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:24 +0100
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 16:34 +0100
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-15 18:27 +0000
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-15 18:21 +0000
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-15 20:32 +0200
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 02:17 +0000
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 18:30 +0100
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 21:35 +0100
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 00:59 +0100
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-16 08:20 +0100
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:33 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-16 18:16 +0200
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 17:50 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-16 19:55 +0200
                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 01:10 +0100
                                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 02:30 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-16 23:19 -0400
                                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 12:44 +0100
                                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-17 20:19 +0200
                                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-17 23:27 +0000
                                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 02:54 +0000
                                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-18 01:14 -0400
                                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-18 08:29 +0100
                                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp Lane W <cactus_DAC@yahoo.com> - 2026-09-18 08:29 -0600
                                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-18 08:27 +0100
                                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 20:07 +0000
                                                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-19 11:24 +0100
                                                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-19 10:53 +0000
                                                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-19 13:35 +0100
                                                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-19 19:29 +0000
                                                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-20 10:29 +0100
                                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-19 22:01 +0200
                                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-19 23:41 -0400
                                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-20 10:34 +0100
                                                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-20 14:07 +0200
                                                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-20 17:40 +0000
                                                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-20 21:03 +0200
                                                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-21 13:21 +0100
                                                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-21 13:18 +0100
                                                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp Chris Abraham <chris@gerriscorp.com> - 2026-09-21 13:16 -0400
                                                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-21 23:13 +0100
                                                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-22 03:38 +0000
                                                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-22 06:49 +0100
                                                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-21 19:14 +0000
                                                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-21 23:31 +0100
                                                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-21 23:13 +0000
                                                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-22 04:22 +0000
                                                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-22 06:55 +0100
                                                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-22 03:51 +0000
                                                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-21 13:13 +0100
                                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-20 10:22 +0100
                                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-17 08:05 +0200
                                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 12:46 +0100
                                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 20:31 +0000
                                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 12:16 +0100
                                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 20:48 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 12:11 +0100
                                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 20:52 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 22:16 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:12 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-17 07:16 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 06:37 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 13:43 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 13:32 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-17 21:51 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 22:15 +0100
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 18:22 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:25 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 20:35 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 22:06 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 03:23 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-18 01:24 -0400
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 00:58 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:55 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 20:28 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-17 22:19 -0400
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-17 21:58 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 22:25 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-18 00:57 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 03:02 +0000
                                                                                                        [OT] Washington Treaty of 1949 (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-18 10:59 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 02:58 +0000
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-18 10:02 +0100
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-15 18:18 +0000
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-15 18:49 +0000
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-15 21:21 +0200
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 00:53 +0100
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 02:34 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-16 04:31 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 06:36 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-16 08:30 +0100
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 02:29 +0000
                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-14 17:43 +0000
                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 19:05 +0100
                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-14 19:50 +0100
                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-14 20:00 +0100
                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-09-14 23:05 +0100
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-15 00:18 +0000
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-15 01:52 -0400
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 07:48 +0100
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-15 17:30 +0000
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 00:43 +0100
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-16 00:37 -0400
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 06:33 +0000
                                                                                                    [OT] /dev/middle-east (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:37 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: [OT] /dev/middle-east The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:45 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:26 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 18:38 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:33 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:54 +0100
                                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 13:58 +0100
                                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-17 23:25 -0400
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-15 18:49 +0000
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 00:57 +0100
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 07:45 +0100
                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-14 21:03 -0400
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 07:58 +0100
                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-14 23:56 +0000
                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 02:00 +0100
                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-15 02:14 -0400
                                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-14 20:59 -0400
                                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-15 07:56 +0100
                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-15 17:48 +0000
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 00:43 +0100
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 01:56 +0000
                                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-15 21:28 +0200
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 00:04 +0100
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-09-15 23:32 +0000
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 00:58 +0100
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 01:33 +0000
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:23 +0100
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-16 09:01 +0200
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:29 +0100
                                                                                          Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 01:20 +0000
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-16 09:03 +0200
                                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:21 +0100
                                                                                              Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-16 18:43 +0000
                                                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:38 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-17 17:44 +0000
                                                                                            [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-16 11:31 +0100
                                                                                              Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-16 20:35 +0200
                                                                                                Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 02:24 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-17 08:09 +0200
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 10:21 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:53 +0200
                                                                                                      Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:31 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 20:20 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 21:58 +0100
                                                                                                            Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 02:48 +0000
                                                                                                              Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-18 08:42 +0100
                                                                                                                Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 19:30 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 20:18 +0000
                                                                                                      Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 21:57 +0100
                                                                                                        Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 02:41 +0000
                                                                                                          Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-18 08:33 +0100
                                                                                                            Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 19:52 +0000
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:30 +0100
                                                                                                Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:26 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 11:47 +0100
                                                                                                    Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 13:52 +0100
                                                                                                  Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-17 20:16 +0000
                                                                                                    Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-17 21:54 +0100
                                                                                                      Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-18 02:45 +0000
                                                                                                        Re: [OT] Are Ceuta and Melilla actually part of the Schengen Area? The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-18 08:37 +0100
                                                                            Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-13 09:03 +0100
                                                                    Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-11 23:07 -0400
                                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-12 10:40 +0100
                                                                        Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-12 23:06 -0400
                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-09 09:29 +0100
                                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-09 18:20 +0000
                                                          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-09 23:26 -0400
                                                            Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-10 11:29 +0100
                                                              Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-11 00:58 -0400
                                                                Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-11 10:19 +0100
                                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-10 11:27 +0100
                                                  Re: /dev/tcp Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-09-09 04:25 +0000
                                                Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-09 00:43 -0400
                                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-09 09:31 +0100
                                                    Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-09 23:12 -0400
                                                      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-10 11:32 +0100
                                          Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-08 09:31 +0100
                                      Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-07 22:20 -0400
                                        Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-08 05:05 +0000
                                          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-08 01:51 -0400
                                        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-08 09:34 +0100
                                  Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-09-07 11:59 +0100
                                    Re: /dev/tcp rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-09-07 19:18 +0000
                        Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-09-05 21:35 -0400
                  Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-30 13:06 +0100
        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-21 13:54 +0100
          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-21 22:57 -0400
            Re: /dev/tcp "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-22 21:47 +0200
              The hammer is best (Was: /dev/tcp) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2026-08-22 23:50 +0000
                Re: The hammer is best (Was: /dev/tcp) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-23 04:28 -0400
                Re: The hammer is best Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-23 10:14 +0100
                  Re: The hammer is best "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-23 13:55 +0200
                    Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-23 13:16 +0100
                      Re: The hammer is best Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam2616@zugschl.us> - 2026-08-23 21:20 +0200
                        Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-24 02:18 -0400
                        Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-24 11:26 +0100
                          Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 02:06 -0400
                            Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 12:18 +0100
                              Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 00:51 -0400
                      Re: The hammer is best Joed Oakes <lost@noway.home.invalid> - 2026-08-23 19:42 -0400
                        Re: The hammer is best Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-23 23:56 +0000
                          Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-24 02:25 -0400
                        Re: The hammer is best rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-24 01:14 +0000
                        Re: The hammer is best "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-24 09:50 +0200
                          Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 00:56 -0400
                      Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-24 00:53 -0400
                        Re: The hammer is best rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-24 06:42 +0000
                          Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-24 23:34 -0400
                            Re: The hammer is best rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-25 04:08 +0000
                              Re: The hammer is best "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-25 11:29 +0200
                                Re: The hammer is best rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-25 18:52 +0000
                                  Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 04:19 -0400
                                    Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-26 09:29 +0100
                                      Re: The hammer is best rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-26 17:03 +0000
                                        Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-26 21:31 +0100
                                Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 22:18 -0400
                        Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-24 11:28 +0100
                          Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 02:07 -0400
                            Re: The hammer is best rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-25 06:39 +0000
                              Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 12:23 +0100
                                Re: The hammer is best Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-08-25 18:26 +0000
                                  Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 20:05 +0100
                                    Re: The hammer is best "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-25 21:43 +0200
                                      Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-26 08:35 +0100
                                    Re: The hammer is best Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-08-25 20:21 +0000
                                      Re: The hammer is best "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-25 23:14 +0200
                                Re: The hammer is best rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-25 19:08 +0000
                                  Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 04:38 -0400
                                    Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-26 10:22 +0100
                                      Re: The hammer is best rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-26 17:26 +0000
                                      Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 00:00 -0400
                                        Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 03:44 -0400
                                Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 01:49 -0400
                            Re: The hammer is best The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 12:20 +0100
                              Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 01:23 -0400
                  Re: The hammer is best c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-23 22:16 -0400
        Re: /dev/tcp Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-08-21 13:41 +0100
          Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-21 22:58 +0000
          Re: /dev/tcp c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-21 22:28 -0400
            ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-08-24 13:56 +0100
              Bash vs. ksh - Does it matter? And the 'vi' mode thing... (Was: ksh (was: /dev/tcp)) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2026-08-24 14:57 +0000
                Re: Bash vs. ksh - Does it matter? And the 'vi' mode thing... (Was: ksh Andy Burns <usenet@andyburns.uk> - 2026-08-30 13:26 +0100
                  Re: Bash vs. ksh - Does it matter? And the 'vi' mode thing... (Was: ksh Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-30 23:49 +0000
                  Re: Bash vs. ksh - Does it matter? And the 'vi' mode thing... (Was: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-31 01:35 -0400
              Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-24 21:08 +0000
                Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2026-08-24 21:28 +0000
                  Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-08-29 13:29 +0000
                    Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-29 22:41 +0000
                      Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-08-31 13:43 +0100
                Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-25 01:11 +0000
                Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-08-25 13:25 +0100
                  Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-25 21:58 +0000
                    Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Geoff Clare <geoff@clare.See-My-Signature.invalid> - 2026-08-26 13:34 +0100
                      Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-27 02:23 +0000
                        Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 03:40 -0400
                      Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 01:40 -0400
                  Re: ksh (was: /dev/tcp) Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-08-29 13:40 +0000
              Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 02:25 -0400
                Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-25 06:52 +0000
                  Re: ksh The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 12:27 +0100
                    Re: ksh Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-08-25 18:26 +0000
                      Re: ksh Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-25 22:03 +0000
                      Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 04:04 -0400
                        Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-26 18:00 +0000
                          Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 03:17 -0400
                            Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-27 15:22 +0000
                              Re: ksh The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-27 17:55 +0100
                                Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 23:14 -0400
                                  Re: ksh The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-28 12:48 +0100
                              Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-27 22:43 -0400
                                Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-28 04:17 +0000
                                  Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-28 03:18 -0400
                                    Re: ksh Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-08-28 15:54 +0000
                                    Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-28 20:40 +0000
                                      Re: ksh The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-29 10:14 +0100
                                        Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-29 21:12 +0000
                    Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 02:35 -0400
                      Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-26 18:17 +0000
                Re: ksh Marco Moock <mm@dorfdsl.de> - 2026-08-25 09:56 +0200
                  Re: ksh "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-25 11:24 +0200
                    Re: ksh Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam2616@zugschl.us> - 2026-08-25 20:36 +0200
                      Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-26 04:23 +0000
                        Re: ksh "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-26 10:04 +0200
                          Re: ksh Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-26 10:03 +0100
                    Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 21:50 -0400
                    Re: ksh Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-08-29 13:38 +0000
                      Re: ksh Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-29 22:42 +0000
                      Re: ksh "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-30 14:26 +0200
                  Re: ksh The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-25 12:27 +0100
                    Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-26 02:43 -0400
                  Re: ksh Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-25 22:01 +0000
                    Re: ksh "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-08-26 01:32 +0200
                  Re: ksh c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-08-25 21:46 -0400
                    Re: ksh rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-08-26 04:25 +0000
      Re: /dev/tcp Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2026-08-20 18:22 +0000
        Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-21 13:57 +0100
    Re: /dev/tcp Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-08-23 06:37 -0700
      Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-23 14:49 +0100
      Re: /dev/tcp The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-23 16:13 +0100
      Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-23 22:31 +0000
        Re: /dev/tcp Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-24 19:08 +0100
          Re: /dev/tcp David De La Harpe Golden <david@harpegolden.net> - 2026-08-29 00:52 +0100
            Re: /dev/tcp Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-08-29 04:14 +0000
              Re: /dev/tcp David De La Harpe Golden <david@harpegolden.net> - 2026-08-29 19:06 +0100
            [OT] Weather Underground (was: Re: /dev/tcp) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-08-29 08:58 +0100
              Re: [OT] Weather Underground David De La Harpe Golden <david@harpegolden.net> - 2026-08-29 18:15 +0100

Page 15 of 30 — ← Prev page 1 … 13 14 [15] 16 17 … 30  Next page →


#91621 — Re: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-17 11:24 +0100
SubjectRe: [OT] "Democracy" Exports of the United States
Message-ID<118gf4o$6m6t$5@dont-email.me>
In reply to#91582
On 16/09/2026 19:17, rbowman wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Sep 2026 11:09:24 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> 
>> On 16/09/2026 01:52, rbowman wrote:
>>> On Tue, 15 Sep 2026 20:24:39 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>>
>>>> No, just more recent. Venezuela is obvious that it is for money gain.
>>>> What is Cuba for? I don't really know. They were not a danger anymore.
>>>
>>> Cuba hasn't been a threat since the missile crisis. I was in high
>>> school at the time. They haven't even been successful in spreading
>>> communism.
>>
>> They did a first class job in S Africa.
> 
> Castro wasn't even born when the SA Communist Party got off the ground. I
> don't know how much proselytism the Cuban doctors and engineers do.

Then STFU.
When I was there the Cubans held court in Soweto every weekend.
State sponsored terrorists.  The lies they told have taken 40 years to 
unwind. Only now are black S Africans realising that the problem was 
never white people. Or lack of a vote. And that a black majority 
communist government does not put bread on the table, keep the lights on 
or guarantee a clean water supply.

Even if it has bought just enough education to make them realise this 
for a fact.


>  As far
> a Guevara, his adventures in Ghana and the Congo didn't go well either.
> The CIA helped out in Ghana but I think the Congo fell apart on its own.

I didn't mention the Congo. Or Ghana. Congo has always been a hell hole.
Ghana like many African countries adapted tribalism to a communist style 
dictatorship early on. I don't know what effect Cuba played.


-- 
"Women actually are capable of being far more than the feminists will 
let them."


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#91482

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-15 16:34 +0100
Message-ID<118bohv$2iekn$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#91467
On 15/09/2026 08:26, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2026-09-15 08:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 14/09/2026 23:01, Pancho wrote:
>>> On 9/14/26 20:07, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 14/09/2026 19:56, Pancho wrote:
>>>>> On 9/14/26 11:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> There is no such thing. Wanting peaceful co-operation with Russia 
>>>>>> is wanting peaceful co-operation with a rabid dog.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> We cooperated with the USA, and it attacked Venezuela and Iran, and 
>>>>> a whole host of countries before. We cooperate with many countries 
>>>>> that do naughty shit. Deep down, I really don't care about 
>>>>> Venezuela, or Iran, I want to continue doing business with the USA. 
>>>>> It isn't because I approve of the USA, it is because I think I will 
>>>>> be better off.
>>>>>
>>>>> I still don't have a clue why I should care about Ukraine.
>>>> Then don't. I know exactly why I care and so do many other people. 
>>>> If their reasons are not relevant to you then that's where its at.
>>>>
>>>
>>> I don't know what their reasons are?
>>>
>>>
>> Of course you don't. You really don't want to know either.
>> So we will leave you in peace
>>
>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> WE already tried that, and the invasion of Ukraine was the result
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lots of people wanted peaceful co-operation with Hitler, too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Ah, the Hitler analogy. But who is Hitler, Russia or NATO?
>>>>>
>>>> Russia. 100%.
>>>> And of course Iran.
>>>>
>>>
>>> But why? Russia does less invading than the USA. Iran hasn't invaded 
>>> anyone, Iran just appears to be a repeated victim.
>>>
>> Good grief.
>> Russia is constantly invading and controlling its neighbors - 
>> Chechnya, Georgia, Belarus Ukraine.
>> I don't recall USA invading anyone since Grenada...
> 
> No?
> 
> Venezuela (successfully). Cuba.
> 
> 
Didnt stay in either place though

-- 
I was brought up to believe that you should never give offence if you 
can avoid it; the new culture tells us you should always take offence if 
you can. There are now experts in the art of taking offence, indeed 
whole academic subjects, such as 'gender studies', devoted to it.

Sir Roger Scruton

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#91493

Fromrbowman <bowman@montana.com>
Date2026-09-15 18:27 +0000
Message-ID<ngth11F83ghU7@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#91482
On Tue, 15 Sep 2026 16:34:23 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> On 15/09/2026 08:26, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2026-09-15 08:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 14/09/2026 23:01, Pancho wrote:
>>>> On 9/14/26 20:07, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>> On 14/09/2026 19:56, Pancho wrote:
>>>>>> On 9/14/26 11:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There is no such thing. Wanting peaceful co-operation with Russia
>>>>>>> is wanting peaceful co-operation with a rabid dog.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> We cooperated with the USA, and it attacked Venezuela and Iran, and
>>>>>> a whole host of countries before. We cooperate with many countries
>>>>>> that do naughty shit. Deep down, I really don't care about
>>>>>> Venezuela, or Iran, I want to continue doing business with the USA.
>>>>>> It isn't because I approve of the USA, it is because I think I will
>>>>>> be better off.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I still don't have a clue why I should care about Ukraine.
>>>>> Then don't. I know exactly why I care and so do many other people.
>>>>> If their reasons are not relevant to you then that's where its at.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> I don't know what their reasons are?
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Of course you don't. You really don't want to know either. So we will
>>> leave you in peace
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>> WE already tried that, and the invasion of Ukraine was the result
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lots of people wanted peaceful co-operation with Hitler, too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ah, the Hitler analogy. But who is Hitler, Russia or NATO?
>>>>>>
>>>>> Russia. 100%.
>>>>> And of course Iran.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> But why? Russia does less invading than the USA. Iran hasn't invaded
>>>> anyone, Iran just appears to be a repeated victim.
>>>>
>>> Good grief.
>>> Russia is constantly invading and controlling its neighbors -
>>> Chechnya, Georgia, Belarus Ukraine.
>>> I don't recall USA invading anyone since Grenada...
>> 
>> No?
>> 
>> Venezuela (successfully). Cuba.
>> 
>> 
> Didnt stay in either place though

Ah, the 'no true Scotsman' argument. You have to stay after you've invaded 
to have it count. How long? Do Iraq and Afghanistan qualify?

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#91491

Fromrbowman <bowman@montana.com>
Date2026-09-15 18:21 +0000
Message-ID<ngtgluF83ghU6@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#91467
On Tue, 15 Sep 2026 09:26:24 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> On 2026-09-15 08:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 14/09/2026 23:01, Pancho wrote:
>>> On 9/14/26 20:07, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 14/09/2026 19:56, Pancho wrote:
>>>>> On 9/14/26 11:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> There is no such thing. Wanting peaceful co-operation with Russia
>>>>>> is wanting peaceful co-operation with a rabid dog.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> We cooperated with the USA, and it attacked Venezuela and Iran, and
>>>>> a whole host of countries before. We cooperate with many countries
>>>>> that do naughty shit. Deep down, I really don't care about
>>>>> Venezuela, or Iran, I want to continue doing business with the USA.
>>>>> It isn't because I approve of the USA, it is because I think I will
>>>>> be better off.
>>>>>
>>>>> I still don't have a clue why I should care about Ukraine.
>>>> Then don't. I know exactly why I care and so do many other people. If
>>>> their reasons are not relevant to you then that's where its at.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> I don't know what their reasons are?
>>>
>>>
>> Of course you don't. You really don't want to know either.
>> So we will leave you in peace
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>>>>> WE already tried that, and the invasion of Ukraine was the result
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lots of people wanted peaceful co-operation with Hitler, too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>> Ah, the Hitler analogy. But who is Hitler, Russia or NATO?
>>>>>
>>>> Russia. 100%.
>>>> And of course Iran.
>>>>
>>>>
>>> But why? Russia does less invading than the USA. Iran hasn't invaded
>>> anyone, Iran just appears to be a repeated victim.
>>>
>> Good grief.
>> Russia is constantly invading and controlling its neighbors - Chechnya,
>> Georgia, Belarus Ukraine.
>> I don't recall USA invading anyone since Grenada...
> 
> No?
> 
> Venezuela (successfully). Cuba.

Venezuela hardly counts and the Bay of Pigs was an unsuccessful attempt at 
an invasion. In the western hemisphere the invasion of Panama worked out 
better. 

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#91494

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-09-15 20:32 +0200
Message-ID<ngth95F8ehrU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#91491
On 2026-09-15 20:21, rbowman wrote:
> On Tue, 15 Sep 2026 09:26:24 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2026-09-15 08:42, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 14/09/2026 23:01, Pancho wrote:
>>>> On 9/14/26 20:07, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>> On 14/09/2026 19:56, Pancho wrote:
>>>>>> On 9/14/26 11:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There is no such thing. Wanting peaceful co-operation with Russia
>>>>>>> is wanting peaceful co-operation with a rabid dog.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> We cooperated with the USA, and it attacked Venezuela and Iran, and
>>>>>> a whole host of countries before. We cooperate with many countries
>>>>>> that do naughty shit. Deep down, I really don't care about
>>>>>> Venezuela, or Iran, I want to continue doing business with the USA.
>>>>>> It isn't because I approve of the USA, it is because I think I will
>>>>>> be better off.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I still don't have a clue why I should care about Ukraine.
>>>>> Then don't. I know exactly why I care and so do many other people. If
>>>>> their reasons are not relevant to you then that's where its at.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> I don't know what their reasons are?
>>>>
>>>>
>>> Of course you don't. You really don't want to know either.
>>> So we will leave you in peace
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>> WE already tried that, and the invasion of Ukraine was the result
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lots of people wanted peaceful co-operation with Hitler, too.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ah, the Hitler analogy. But who is Hitler, Russia or NATO?
>>>>>>
>>>>> Russia. 100%.
>>>>> And of course Iran.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>> But why? Russia does less invading than the USA. Iran hasn't invaded
>>>> anyone, Iran just appears to be a repeated victim.
>>>>
>>> Good grief.
>>> Russia is constantly invading and controlling its neighbors - Chechnya,
>>> Georgia, Belarus Ukraine.
>>> I don't recall USA invading anyone since Grenada...
>>
>> No?
>>
>> Venezuela (successfully). Cuba.
> 
> Venezuela hardly counts and the Bay of Pigs was an unsuccessful attempt at
> an invasion. In the western hemisphere the invasion of Panama worked out
> better.

Not exactly an invasion, but the USA did acts of war against Venezuela, 
including the kidnap of the president. Then they succeeded in placing a 
puppet president, nothing more was needed.

Cuba... assault by famine. Like cities in medieval times. It has another 
name... but it is a war crime, of course.



-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#91526

Fromrbowman <bowman@montana.com>
Date2026-09-16 02:17 +0000
Message-ID<nguchnF83ghU17@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#91494
On Tue, 15 Sep 2026 20:32:05 +0200, Carlos E. R. wrote:

> Not exactly an invasion, but the USA did acts of war against Venezuela,
> including the kidnap of the president. Then they succeeded in placing a
> puppet president, nothing more was needed.

It's much easier finding a puppet rather than trying to run a 
dysfunctional country. Being a US puppet has its dangers as Diem found out 
when he was no longer needed. Sometimes the machinations are moe twisted 
than an obvious puppet.

https://www.britannica.com/topic/20th-century-international-
relations-2085155/Nicaragua-and-El-Salvador

The Iran-Contra affair was particularly confusing since the US was also 
providing Saddam Hussein with 'WMDs' as Iraq waged war on Iran. Reagan 
couldn't remember anything.

Novelists writing espionage thrillers have a hard time keeping ahead of 
the US government. Or maybe they're working for the government like the 
best and brightest of the British intellectuals worked for Wellington 
House cranking out propaganda during WWI. They came up with some classics 
like bayoneting babies and raping nuns. 

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#91487

FromRichard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-15 18:30 +0100
Message-ID<wwv33vaifs6.fsf@LkoBDZeT.terraraq.uk>
In reply to#91459
The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes:
> On 14/09/2026 23:01, Pancho wrote:
>> On 9/14/26 20:07, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 14/09/2026 19:56, Pancho wrote:
>>>> On 9/14/26 11:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>> WE already tried that, and the invasion of Ukraine was the result
>>>>>
>>>>> Lots of people wanted peaceful co-operation with Hitler, too.
>>>>
>>>> Ah, the Hitler analogy. But who is Hitler, Russia or NATO?

Bizarre that you have to ask. As you note below, Russia attacked
Ukraine.

>>> Russia. 100%.
>>> And of course Iran.
>>
>> But why? Russia does less invading than the USA. Iran hasn't invaded
>> anyone, Iran just appears to be a repeated victim.
> 
> Good grief.
> Russia is constantly invading and controlling its neighbors -
> Chechnya, Georgia, Belarus Ukraine.

At the end of WWII, Germany, Poland, Czechslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Bulgaria, part of Japan (AFAIK still under
Russian occupation).  Liberation from Germany was no liberation at all
when it was traded for Soviet control instead.  Subsequently East
Germany, Hungary and Czechoslovakia when they tried to break away, and
then Afghanistan, Georgia and Ukraine. Arguably Moldova, part of which
remains occupied. 16-17.

> I don't recall USA invading anyone since Grenada...

At the end of WWII, Germany. (And of course many other German-occupied
countries, but they then let them choose their own government: a real
liberation in other words.)  Subsequently Dominican Republic, Grenada,
Panama, Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia, Libya, Syria, Venezuela. Some of
these may be arguable depending exactly how we define ‘invasion’.  10
total.  Apologies if I’ve missed any (for either).

(Vietnam, Korea and Kuwait were all joining an existing conflict on one
side; whatever their merits I don’t think they belong in the same
category.)

>> I can understand security concerns that caused Russia to attack
>> Ukraine.
>
> There were no 'security concerns' any more than hitler had 'security
> concerns;' about the Sudetenland

Quite.

>> I can't understand the security concerns that caused the USA to
>> attack Iran.
> 
> Well fair enough. It seems to have been solely to raise oil prices for
> his insider trading chums.

I don’t think it’s even that clever TBH, I think he thought it’d be a
quick win.

>> It isn't just Trump, or just the USA. Europe has shown itself to be
>> unreliable too. The use of sanctions, of using the financial system
>> as a weapon, was always short-sighted. The rest of the world just
>> now sees the USA and Europe financial system as unreliable,
>> something to be avoided. Who would trust them when they seize
>> assets, and use denial of access to financial systems as a weapon.
>
> You wanted international law, sanctions are it, Now you don't want
> it. Make up your mind

Historically USA and Europe have used sanctions etc when things they
care about are threatened. Hardly surprising, if you hurt us then you
don’t get to play with our toys, why would anyone expect it to be
otherwise?

To some extent the global influence of Western sanctions was already
coming to a close, as China builds parallel systems, but China already
throws its weight around in exactly the same way: if you upset China
then you’ll find your supply of something important gets cut off.

-- 
https://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

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#91502

FromRichard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-15 21:35 +0100
Message-ID<wwv7bkms16h.fsf@LkoBDZeT.terraraq.uk>
In reply to#91487
Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> writes:
> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes:
>> On 14/09/2026 23:01, Pancho wrote:
>>> But why? Russia does less invading than the USA. Iran hasn't invaded
>>> anyone, Iran just appears to be a repeated victim.
>> 
>> Good grief.
>> Russia is constantly invading and controlling its neighbors -
>> Chechnya, Georgia, Belarus Ukraine.
>
> At the end of WWII, Germany, Poland, Czechslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
> Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Bulgaria, part of Japan (AFAIK still under
> Russian occupation).  Liberation from Germany was no liberation at all
> when it was traded for Soviet control instead.  Subsequently East
> Germany, Hungary and Czechoslovakia when they tried to break away, and
> then Afghanistan, Georgia and Ukraine. Arguably Moldova, part of which
> remains occupied. 16-17.
>
>> I don't recall USA invading anyone since Grenada...
>
> At the end of WWII, Germany.

And Japan. Duh.

> (And of course many other German-occupied countries, but they then let
> them choose their own government: a real liberation in other words.)
> Subsequently Dominican Republic, Grenada, Panama, Iraq, Afghanistan,
> Somalia, Libya, Syria, Venezuela. Some of these may be arguable
> depending exactly how we define ‘invasion’.  10 total.  Apologies if
> I’ve missed any (for either).

(So 11. Still lagging well behind Russian invasions AFAICT.)

-- 
https://www.greenend.org.uk/rjk/

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#91513

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-16 00:59 +0100
Message-ID<118cm4i$2t1q9$9@dont-email.me>
In reply to#91502
On 15/09/2026 21:35, Richard Kettlewell wrote:
>>> I don't recall USA invading anyone *since Grenada*...
>> At the end of WWII, Germany.
> And Japan. Duh.
Both of those preceded Grenada

-- 
"I am inclined to tell the truth and dislike people who lie consistently.
This makes me unfit for the company of people of a Left persuasion, and 
all women"

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#91551

FromPancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com>
Date2026-09-16 08:20 +0100
Message-ID<118dfv5$5j4$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#91487
On 9/15/26 18:30, Richard Kettlewell wrote:
> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes:
>> On 14/09/2026 23:01, Pancho wrote:
>>> On 9/14/26 20:07, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 14/09/2026 19:56, Pancho wrote:
>>>>> On 9/14/26 11:06, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>>>> WE already tried that, and the invasion of Ukraine was the result
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lots of people wanted peaceful co-operation with Hitler, too.
>>>>>
>>>>> Ah, the Hitler analogy. But who is Hitler, Russia or NATO?
> 
> Bizarre that you have to ask. As you note below, Russia attacked
> Ukraine.
> 

The USA has attacked many countries, a quick google gives that the USA 
has attacked 10 countries the century. I don't know why you tell me 
stuff I know, but ignore USA aggression (NATO is dominated by the USA).

>>>> Russia. 100%.
>>>> And of course Iran.
>>>
>>> But why? Russia does less invading than the USA. Iran hasn't invaded
>>> anyone, Iran just appears to be a repeated victim.
>>
>> Good grief.
>> Russia is constantly invading and controlling its neighbors -
>> Chechnya, Georgia, Belarus Ukraine.
> 
> At the end of WWII,

FFS, this is like an Israel debate where someone pipes up God gave 
Israel to the Jews in Moses' era. But as you raised it, I would point 
out Russia lost 20 million in WW2, Putin's brother was killed.


> Germany, Poland, Czechslovakia, Hungary, Romania,
> Estonia, Lithuania, Latvia, Bulgaria, part of Japan (AFAIK still under
> Russian occupation).  Liberation from Germany was no liberation at all
> when it was traded for Soviet control instead.  Subsequently East
> Germany, Hungary and Czechoslovakia when they tried to break away, and
> then Afghanistan, Georgia and Ukraine. Arguably Moldova, part of which
> remains occupied. 16-17.
> 
>> I don't recall USA invading anyone since Grenada...
> 
> At the end of WWII, Germany. (And of course many other German-occupied
> countries, but they then let them choose their own government: a real
> liberation in other words.)  Subsequently Dominican Republic, Grenada,
> Panama, Iraq, Afghanistan, Somalia, Libya, Syria, Venezuela. Some of
> these may be arguable depending exactly how we define ‘invasion’.  10
> total.  Apologies if I’ve missed any (for either).
> 
> (Vietnam, Korea and Kuwait were all joining an existing conflict on one
> side; whatever their merits I don’t think they belong in the same
> category.)
> 

The civil war in Ukraine was an ongoing conflict.


>>> I can understand security concerns that caused Russia to attack
>>> Ukraine.
>>
>> There were no 'security concerns' any more than hitler had 'security
>> concerns;' about the Sudetenland
> 
> Quite.
>

Of course there were security concerns. All countries have security 
concerns. Access to warm water ports has always been a Russian concern. 
Having unfriendly troops and missiles stationed on your border is 
clearly a concern.

The specifics of this case are that since 1992 the USA has used its 
military and economic hegemony to unreasonably coerce other countries. 
Remember, prior to 2022, the USA put sanctions on Nord Stream 2, what 
business was it of theirs?


>>> I can't understand the security concerns that caused the USA to
>>> attack Iran.
>>
>> Well fair enough. It seems to have been solely to raise oil prices for
>> his insider trading chums.
> 
> I don’t think it’s even that clever TBH, I think he thought it’d be a
> quick win.
> 

Or perhaps to support Israel? The point isn't why they did it, but that 
it is the type of thing that they do. It shows why countries need to 
defend themselves against US interference. Iran has demonstrated 
cost-effective military spending. As opposed to the massive spending on 
aggressive weapons and vanity projects proposed by our own leaders.

>>> It isn't just Trump, or just the USA. Europe has shown itself to be
>>> unreliable too. The use of sanctions, of using the financial system
>>> as a weapon, was always short-sighted. The rest of the world just
>>> now sees the USA and Europe financial system as unreliable,
>>> something to be avoided. Who would trust them when they seize
>>> assets, and use denial of access to financial systems as a weapon.
>>
>> You wanted international law, sanctions are it, Now you don't want
>> it. Make up your mind
> 
> Historically USA and Europe have used sanctions etc when things they
> care about are threatened. Hardly surprising, if you hurt us then you
> don’t get to play with our toys, why would anyone expect it to be
> otherwise?
>

There are two points. Firstly we should limit sanctions because they 
damage us, as with Russian gas. Secondly these "sanctions" are not just 
about playing with our toys, they are about stopping third parties trade 
with each other. For instance the USA threatens countries that trade 
with Russia. They attack merchant ships between third parties, because 
of purely US "sanctions" (not UN sanctions). They also did it with Iran 
and Syria, is it surprising Iran got the message?

> To some extent the global influence of Western sanctions was already
> coming to a close, as China builds parallel systems, but China already
> throws its weight around in exactly the same way: if you upset China
> then you’ll find your supply of something important gets cut off.
> 

China's actions seem more responsive. I haven't seen China threaten 
trade between third parties.

One of the main consequences of our proxy war with Russia is that we 
have handed Russia to China on a plate.

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#91563

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-16 11:33 +0100
Message-ID<118dr9u$39eq9$8@dont-email.me>
In reply to#91551
On 16/09/2026 08:20, Pancho wrote:
> The USA has attacked many countries, a quick google gives that the USA 
> has attacked 10 countries the century. I don't know why you tell me 
> stuff I know, but ignore USA aggression (NATO is dominated by the USA).

No, it isn't. Donald Trump has withdrawn his support and not one NATO 
country has stepped up to support him in the Gulf

Restructuring NATO against an unreliable, deceitful ally turned enemy is 
what is happening now.

Donald Trump shrieked that NATO must do its fair share.,

Now we/they are, and the net result is that the USA has lost nearly all 
its influence.,

Eben a child of 3 could have worked that out. Just not Trump.

-- 
Any fool can believe in principles -  and most of them do!


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#91574

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-09-16 18:16 +0200
Message-ID<ngvtm9F9b65U13@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#91563
On 2026-09-16 12:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 16/09/2026 08:20, Pancho wrote:
>> The USA has attacked many countries, a quick google gives that the USA 
>> has attacked 10 countries the century. I don't know why you tell me 
>> stuff I know, but ignore USA aggression (NATO is dominated by the USA).
> 
> No, it isn't. Donald Trump has withdrawn his support and not one NATO 
> country has stepped up to support him in the Gulf

He did not ask properly. He demanded, like an emperor, in a war of 
aggression, without meeting first to agree on things. Not something the 
treaty covers, really.

> 
> Restructuring NATO against an unreliable, deceitful ally turned enemy is 
> what is happening now.
> 
> Donald Trump shrieked that NATO must do its fair share.,
> 
> Now we/they are, and the net result is that the USA has lost nearly all 
> its influence.,
> 
> Eben a child of 3 could have worked that out. Just not Trump.
> 


-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.
        ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#91575

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-16 17:50 +0100
Message-ID<118ehdd$3igts$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#91574
On 16/09/2026 17:16, Carlos E. R. wrote:
> On 2026-09-16 12:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 16/09/2026 08:20, Pancho wrote:
>>> The USA has attacked many countries, a quick google gives that the 
>>> USA has attacked 10 countries the century. I don't know why you tell 
>>> me stuff I know, but ignore USA aggression (NATO is dominated by the 
>>> USA).
>>
>> No, it isn't. Donald Trump has withdrawn his support and not one NATO 
>> country has stepped up to support him in the Gulf
> 
> He did not ask properly. He demanded, like an emperor, in a war of 
> aggression, without meeting first to agree on things. Not something the 
> treaty covers, really.
> 
That doesn't contradict or indeed add anything to the point


> 

-- 
The higher up the mountainside
The greener grows the grass.
The higher up the monkey climbs
The more he shows his arse.

Traditional

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#91579

From"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-09-16 19:55 +0200
Message-ID<5p1rnmxu3s.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to#91575
On 2026-09-16 18:50, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 16/09/2026 17:16, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>> On 2026-09-16 12:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>> On 16/09/2026 08:20, Pancho wrote:
>>>> The USA has attacked many countries, a quick google gives that the 
>>>> USA has attacked 10 countries the century. I don't know why you tell 
>>>> me stuff I know, but ignore USA aggression (NATO is dominated by the 
>>>> USA).
>>>
>>> No, it isn't. Donald Trump has withdrawn his support and not one NATO 
>>> country has stepped up to support him in the Gulf
>>
>> He did not ask properly. He demanded, like an emperor, in a war of 
>> aggression, without meeting first to agree on things. Not something 
>> the treaty covers, really.
>>
> That doesn't contradict or indeed add anything to the point

It explains why no one in the NATO stepped up to support him in the Gulf.

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;

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#91590

FromNuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-17 01:10 +0100
Message-ID<118fb5e$3rcaa$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#91579
On 2026-09-16, Carlos E.R. wrote:

> On 2026-09-16 18:50, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>> On 16/09/2026 17:16, Carlos E. R. wrote:
>>> On 2026-09-16 12:33, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>>>> On 16/09/2026 08:20, Pancho wrote:
>>>>> The USA has attacked many countries, a quick google gives that
>>>>> the USA has attacked 10 countries the century. I don't know why
>>>>> you tell me stuff I know, but ignore USA aggression (NATO is
>>>>> dominated by the USA).
>>>>
>>>> No, it isn't. Donald Trump has withdrawn his support and not one
>>>> NATO country has stepped up to support him in the Gulf
>>>
>>> He did not ask properly. He demanded, like an emperor, in a war of
>>> aggression, without meeting first to agree on things. Not something
>>> the treaty covers, really.
>>>
>> That doesn't contradict or indeed add anything to the point
>
> It explains why no one in the NATO stepped up to support him in the Gulf.

This is the crux of it, really. It's blatant, silly nonsense. He seems
to be under a misconception that the Washington Treaty is something
else, and is surrounded by yes people who don't bother pointing that out
to him.

It doesn't matter how much he asks or how he asks, he ain't getting it
via NATO, the only way is perhaps if he pulls something like George
W. Bush did and rounds up a few other people to foolishly get in a war
or even mislead to get in a war.

-- 
Nuno Silva

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#91599

Fromrbowman <bowman@montana.com>
Date2026-09-17 02:30 +0000
Message-ID<nh11mrF83ghU35@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#91590
On Thu, 17 Sep 2026 01:10:21 +0100, Nuno Silva wrote:

> It doesn't matter how much he asks or how he asks, he ain't getting it
> via NATO, the only way is perhaps if he pulls something like George W.
> Bush did and rounds up a few other people to foolishly get in a war or
> even mislead to get in a war.

I think the only candidate might be Britain but

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDfAdHBtK_Q

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#91600

Fromc186282 <c186282@nnada.net>
Date2026-09-16 23:19 -0400
Message-ID<_4OdnQ_HEs1bwTb3nZ2dnZfqn_qdnZ2d@giganews.com>
In reply to#91599
On 9/16/26 22:30, rbowman wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Sep 2026 01:10:21 +0100, Nuno Silva wrote:
> 
>> It doesn't matter how much he asks or how he asks, he ain't getting it
>> via NATO, the only way is perhaps if he pulls something like George W.
>> Bush did and rounds up a few other people to foolishly get in a war or
>> even mislead to get in a war.
> 
> I think the only candidate might be Britain but
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDfAdHBtK_Q

   By all reports, the Brits couldn't shoot their
   way out of a wet paper bag these days. Between
   the welfare state and mass expenditures on
   their beloved 'immigrants' .........

   When the USSR caved in, many just assumed Russia
   and friends would never be a problem again, ever.
   They then slashed their mil stuff to the bone
   and concentrated on 'popular'/bribery spending
   for political reasons. As typical, for political
   reasons, they now can't take that money BACK.
   "Free Stuff" given can NEVER be withdrawn.

   Alas the Brits ain't getting much for their 'free'
   pounds either .....

   Just a few years, even if Vlad/Xi do nothing, the
   UK will become a de-facto "failed state".

   Then all the Islamists will take over (kind of HAVE
   already it seems). The real/'original' Brits ...
   kinda shit out of luck. Try evacuating to Canada, but
   it's not much of an improvement.

   Of course there's barely any such thing as a 'real
   Brit' ... I'd nominate the island for "most invaded"
   status going back 5000+ years. Nearest to 'real Brit'
   are the Welsh.

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#91634

FromThe Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid>
Date2026-09-17 12:44 +0100
Message-ID<118gjri$6m6t$15@dont-email.me>
In reply to#91600
On 17/09/2026 04:19, c186282 wrote:
> On 9/16/26 22:30, rbowman wrote:
>> On Thu, 17 Sep 2026 01:10:21 +0100, Nuno Silva wrote:
>>
>>> It doesn't matter how much he asks or how he asks, he ain't getting it
>>> via NATO, the only way is perhaps if he pulls something like George W.
>>> Bush did and rounds up a few other people to foolishly get in a war or
>>> even mislead to get in a war.
>>
>> I think the only candidate might be Britain but
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDfAdHBtK_Q
> 
>    By all reports, the Brits couldn't shoot their
>    way out of a wet paper bag these days. Between
>    the welfare state and mass expenditures on
>    their beloved 'immigrants' .........
> 
The core is there. But its very small.
BUT who do you think taught Ukraine how to fight?

If all we have is a training unit and a philosophy, well that's not 
nothing, either.

And it's all very well having expensive showy kit and thousands of 
soldiers, but if it all can't do fuck all when faced with 10,000 $500 
drones run by 1000 troops in hardened bunkers miles from the action, 
well it isn't worth having at all.


>    When the USSR caved in, many just assumed Russia
>    and friends would never be a problem again, ever.
>    They then slashed their mil stuff to the bone
>    and concentrated on 'popular'/bribery spending
>    for political reasons. As typical, for political
>    reasons, they now can't take that money BACK.
>    "Free Stuff" given can NEVER be withdrawn.
> 
Well there is some truth in that, to be sure. But faced with today's 
situation, the mood is changing.

With oil and gas prices double what they were before Trumps latest 
adventure, which were already high because of Ukraine, clearly cost 
benefit analysis says that supporting Ukraine, especially with seized 
Russian interest on assets, is profitable.

"Gross Domestic Product (GDP): The UK's nominal GDP is around $3.3 to 
$3.4 trillion, ranking it among the world's top economies, whereas 
Russia's nominal GDP sits around $2.1 to $2.2 trillion.

GDP Per Capita: The UK has a significantly higher standard of living and 
output per person (roughly $45,000+), compared to Russia's per capita 
figures which are much lower (around $15,000).

Structure: The UK economy is heavily service-oriented (finance, tech, 
professional services), while Russia's economy relies heavily on natural 
resources, particularly oil, gas, and mining"

And that is just the UK. Toss in Germany, Poland, France, and its 
already overwhelming odds. And then toss in the people who are REALLY 
seruious about Russia - the Baltic states, Latvia, Lithuania, Estonia, 
and across the water Sweden, and add the other land border with Russia 
of Finland, and you have an array of reasonably large and healthy 
economies that know that a bit of money spend on the right kit. and the 
rapid conversion of a generations raised on 'call of duty' 'GTA' and 
other stuff to become remote drone operators, who are currently sitting 
in their mums basements onb sovcial securitry, is a viable strategy


>    Alas the Brits ain't getting much for their 'free'
>    pounds either .....
> 
>    Just a few years, even if Vlad/Xi do nothing, the
>    UK will become a de-facto "failed state".
> 
It is fashionable to say that. The figures do not bear you out however

>    Then all the Islamists will take over (kind of HAVE
>    already it seems). The real/'original' Brits ...
>    kinda shit out of luck. Try evacuating to Canada, but
>    it's not much of an improvement.
> 
Again, you only tread what the media present you with. The tide is 
turning against Islamism and the political parties that have allowed it 
to fester.


>    Of course there's barely any such thing as a 'real
>    Brit' ... I'd nominate the island for "most invaded"
>    status going back 5000+ years. Nearest to 'real Brit'
>    are the Welsh.
> 
That of course is our strength, but what you fail to understand is that 
the island and its geography forms people that arrive.  And they arrive 
mainly because they find that culture agreeable.

So many Americans online who move and say that the freedom from fear, 
fear of medical bills, fear of their kids being shot in drive-bys or in 
their classrooms, and the peace of a nation that is not simply oriented 
towards money and work, but in which lifestyle and culture plays a huge 
part, and they find themselves part of a historical process that 
stretches back 10,000 years...and they get maybe 21 days of guaranteed 
paid holidays to explore...and more years of life expectancy due to 
living on real food and doing some walking as a part of their daily life...

...is worth giving up a MAGA hat and some totally unjustified cultural 
arrogance for..

Even the Afro Carribeans who came over post 1945, and the Indians who 
fled Idi Amin's Africa, are now as British AF. As are the ex 
commonwealth and EU immigrants practically running the NHS.

There is only one group of people who are trying not to become British 
but to take Britain over and ruin it, and we all know who they are and 
who is behind them. And the signs are that since the politicians are 
unwilling, the people themselves at grass roots level are going to do 
something about it.

Britain is its history and its geography, its institutions and its way 
of life. Not the ethnicity or 'racial purity' of its people. We leave 
that to less advanced cultures to work out


-- 
“when things get difficult you just have to lie”

― Jean Claud Jüncker

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#91654

From"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2026-09-17 20:19 +0200
Message-ID<0jntnmx4tq.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to#91634
On 2026-09-17 13:44, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
> On 17/09/2026 04:19, c186282 wrote:
>> On 9/16/26 22:30, rbowman wrote:
>>> On Thu, 17 Sep 2026 01:10:21 +0100, Nuno Silva wrote:
>>>
>>>> It doesn't matter how much he asks or how he asks, he ain't getting it
>>>> via NATO, the only way is perhaps if he pulls something like George W.
>>>> Bush did and rounds up a few other people to foolishly get in a war or
>>>> even mislead to get in a war.
>>>
>>> I think the only candidate might be Britain but
>>>
>>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UDfAdHBtK_Q
>>
>>    By all reports, the Brits couldn't shoot their
>>    way out of a wet paper bag these days. Between
>>    the welfare state and mass expenditures on
>>    their beloved 'immigrants' .........
>>
> The core is there. But its very small.
> BUT who do you think taught Ukraine how to fight?

They fought very well in WWII. The Russians should know it is a very bad 
idea to fight them, specially in cities.


-- 
Cheers, Carlos.
ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺;

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#91687

FromCharlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>
Date2026-09-17 23:27 +0000
Message-ID<nH_qS.33439$eHD8.22080@fx38.iad>
In reply to#91654
On 2026-09-17, Carlos E.R. <robin_listas@es.invalid> wrote:

> On 2026-09-17 13:44, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
>
>> On 17/09/2026 04:19, c186282 wrote:
>>
>>>    By all reports, the Brits couldn't shoot their
>>>    way out of a wet paper bag these days. Between
>>>    the welfare state and mass expenditures on
>>>    their beloved 'immigrants' .........
>>
>> The core is there. But its very small.
>> BUT who do you think taught Ukraine how to fight?
>
> They fought very well in WWII. The Russians should know it is a very bad 
> idea to fight them, specially in cities.

But the Russians are not fighting them in cities.  Not yet, anyway.
So far they're content to fire rockets from afar.  Maybe Putin thinks
he can soften up Kyiv and then invade.  The plan isn't going too well...

-- 
/~\  Charlie Gibbs                  |  In this world there are
\ /  <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid>      |  two kinds of people:
 X   I'm really at ac.dekanfrus     |  1. Those who can extrapolate
/ \  if you read it the right way.  |  from incomplete data.

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