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Groups > comp.os.linux.misc > #70357 > unrolled thread

Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use

Started byLawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
First post2025-08-05 08:14 +0000
Last post2025-08-23 05:43 +0000
Articles 20 on this page of 113 — 24 participants

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Contents

  Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-05 08:14 +0000
    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-08-05 11:22 +0200
      Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Marco Moock <mm@dorfdsl.de> - 2025-08-05 11:34 +0200
    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use jayjwa <jayjwa@atr2.ath.cx.invalid> - 2025-08-05 11:30 -0400
      Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-05 19:56 +0100
        Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-06 01:06 +0000
      Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use John McCue <jmclnx@gmail.com.invalid> - 2025-08-06 01:32 +0000
        Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-06 04:20 +0000
          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2025-08-06 01:33 -0400
            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-06 09:31 +0100
              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-06 08:56 +0000
                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-06 10:35 +0100
                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-06 11:38 +0100
                    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-07 00:06 +0000
                      Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-11 11:50 +0100
                        Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-11 22:02 +0000
                          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-12 08:39 +0100
                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-08-12 10:49 +0200
                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-12 10:54 +0100
                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2025-08-12 18:47 +0000
                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-12 23:36 +0000
                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-12 12:08 +0200
                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-08-12 19:35 +0000
                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-12 23:07 +0000
                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-13 09:47 +0100
                                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-14 00:41 +0000
                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-19 12:35 +0200
                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-19 12:18 +0100
                                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-08-19 15:16 +0200
                                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-20 01:02 +0000
                                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-27 06:56 +0100
                                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-28 00:50 +0000
                                    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-28 09:40 +0100
                                      Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-29 00:56 +0000
                                        Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2025-08-29 08:10 -0700
                                          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-29 19:16 +0100
                                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2025-08-30 16:59 +0300
                                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-08-30 18:45 +0100
                                                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2025-08-31 21:24 +0300
                                                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> - 2025-09-01 17:02 +0100
                                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-31 03:25 +0000
                                          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-30 06:34 +0000
                                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-30 08:39 +0100
                                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-30 08:45 +0100
                                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Harold Stevens <wookie@trixie.localdomain> - 2025-08-30 05:37 -0500
                                                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2025-09-02 09:59 -0700
                                                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Harold Stevens <wookie@aspen.localdomain> - 2025-09-02 12:59 -0500
                                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-30 17:48 +0100
                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-20 01:01 +0000
                                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-20 12:52 +0200
                                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-20 22:36 +0000
                                    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-21 11:44 +0200
                                      Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-21 11:34 +0100
                                        Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-21 14:36 +0200
                                          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-21 14:27 +0100
                                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-21 21:37 +0200
                                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-22 10:33 +0100
                                                Manuals [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-22 12:39 +0200
                                          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-22 01:12 +0000
                                      Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-22 01:06 +0000
                                        Documentation [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-22 12:26 +0200
                                          Re: Documentation [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-23 23:13 +0000
                                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2025-08-20 07:47 -0700
                                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-20 22:37 +0000
                              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-08-20 19:25 +0000
                                tldr [WAS: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-21 12:04 +0200
                                  Re: tldr [WAS: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-08-23 12:40 +0000
                                    Re: tldr [WAS: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-24 00:40 +0200
                                    Re: tldr [WAS: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-23 23:15 +0000
                                      Re: tldr [WAS: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2025-08-24 11:22 +0000
                                        Re: tldr [WAS: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-24 22:18 +0000
                            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Anssi Saari <anssi.saari@usenet.mail.kapsi.fi> - 2025-08-21 12:40 +0300
                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-06 14:21 +0100
                    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-06 16:24 +0100
              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-06 10:12 +0100
            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Anssi Saari <anssi.saari@usenet.mail.kapsi.fi> - 2025-08-07 11:43 +0300
          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use John McCue <jmclnx@gmail.com.invalid> - 2025-08-06 11:55 +0000
        Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-08-06 07:40 +0200
          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-06 06:31 +0000
            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-08-06 11:06 +0200
              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-06 14:25 +0100
                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-08-06 17:11 +0200
                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-06 23:59 +0000
                    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-08-07 08:37 +0200
                      Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-07 06:52 +0000
                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Rich <rich@example.invalid> - 2025-08-18 16:49 +0000
        Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-06 12:46 +0200
          Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-06 23:56 +0000
            Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-19 12:41 +0200
              Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-20 01:07 +0000
                Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-20 09:48 +0100
                  Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-20 11:13 +0100
                    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-20 22:40 +0000
                    Re: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2025-08-21 00:27 +0000
                  ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-20 13:04 +0200
                    Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-20 12:30 +0100
                    Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-20 22:44 +0000
                      Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-21 12:15 +0200
                        Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-22 01:18 +0000
                          Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-22 12:45 +0200
                            Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-22 19:37 +0100
                              Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2025-08-22 22:32 +0200
                                Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-22 21:56 +0100
                                  Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-23 00:28 +0000
                                    Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-08-23 05:51 +0000
                                      Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2025-08-23 11:23 +0100
                                        Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-23 23:12 +0000
                                          Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] candycanearter07 <candycanearter07@candycanearter07.nomail.afraid> - 2025-08-29 19:40 +0000
                                            Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-08-30 05:59 +0000
                                          Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-30 06:36 +0000
                                          Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Marc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us> - 2025-08-30 10:36 +0200
                                            Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-08-31 01:25 +0000
                                Re: ISP router [Was: Yes, You Need A Firewall On Linux - Here’s Why And Which To Use] rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-08-23 05:43 +0000

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#70877

FromLawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2025-08-12 23:36 +0000
Message-ID<107gj5m$3jnlt$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70850
On Tue, 12 Aug 2025 10:54:57 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

> Life is too short to read the whole manual cover to cover.

It helps to learn to speed-read. That man page has about 24,000 words in 
it, and as I said, it only took a few minutes to find the info I needed.

Start by learning how to read without your lips moving.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#70851

From"Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2025-08-12 12:08 +0200
Message-ID<mg0i51Fi0gkU1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#70838
On 2025-08-12 09:39, Mike Scott wrote:
> On 11/08/2025 23:02, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> I don’t know. I’m just able to read documentation. I thought that was a
>> skill that was so commonplace among folks who work with computers for a
>> living that you could take it for granted, but apparently not.
> 
> The horror is manuals written by the code-writer. They describe in 
> intimate detail each and every function; but not how it all hooks up. In 
> this case, I'd not even seen the nft man page, because I'd been 
> searching for the wrong terms, hadn't got there because I'd got drowned 
> in a morass of ipfilter and similar stuff, now apparently out-of-date; 
> and gave it up as a bad job.
> 
> What's wrong with a couple of clear examples, plus the detail to expand 
> on them?
> 

man pages are often terrible, with some exceptions. A list of options 
and command is not a proper manual. At least a few examples are needed. 
Instructions on how to achieve goals.

-- 
Cheers,
        Carlos E.R.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#70863

Fromrbowman <bowman@montana.com>
Date2025-08-12 19:35 +0000
Message-ID<mg1jcqFnvhpU8@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#70838
On Tue, 12 Aug 2025 08:39:44 +0100, Mike Scott wrote:

> On 11/08/2025 23:02, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> I don’t know. I’m just able to read documentation. I thought that was a
>> skill that was so commonplace among folks who work with computers for a
>> living that you could take it for granted, but apparently not.
> 
> The horror is manuals written by the code-writer. They describe in
> intimate detail each and every function; but not how it all hooks up. In
> this case, I'd not even seen the nft man page, because I'd been
> searching for the wrong terms, hadn't got there because I'd got drowned
> in a morass of ipfilter and similar stuff, now apparently out-of-date;
> and gave it up as a bad job.
> 
> What's wrong with a couple of clear examples, plus the detail to expand
> on them?

We had a tech writer whose contribution to the documentation was pasting 
in the programmer's fix notes. That worked out great. It's sad she died 
young but at least we got a real tech writer after that. Her ongoing 
background task was translating the existing documents into English from 
Nerdese.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#70870

FromLawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2025-08-12 23:07 +0000
Message-ID<107ghgc$3j56j$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70838
On Tue, 12 Aug 2025 08:39:44 +0100, Mike Scott wrote:

> In this case, I'd not even seen the nft man page, because I'd been
> searching for the wrong terms, hadn't got there because I'd got
> drowned in a morass of ipfilter and similar stuff, now apparently
> out-of-date; and gave it up as a bad job.

You should know by now, that one of the first resorts when trying to find 
info on important Linux/BSD/*nix subsystems/APIs is to look for man pages.

I have the feeling you didn’t even bother doing a web search, because ...

> What's wrong with a couple of clear examples, plus the detail to expand
> on them?

I just tried doing a Google search for “nftables”, and guess what I 
found ...

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#70895

FromMike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid>
Date2025-08-13 09:47 +0100
Message-ID<107hjf4$3pv2v$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70870
On 13/08/2025 00:07, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
> I have the feeling you didn’t even bother doing a web search, because ...

Well, you'd better distrust your feelings then. Web searches are fine if 
you know relevant keywords.

Meanwhile, welcome to the block list. Possible the first ever.


-- 
Mike Scott
Harlow, England

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#70963

FromLawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2025-08-14 00:41 +0000
Message-ID<107jbb1$6imt$7@dont-email.me>
In reply to#70895
On Wed, 13 Aug 2025 09:47:32 +0100, Mike Scott wrote:

> On 13/08/2025 00:07, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>
>> I have the feeling you didn’t even bother doing a web search ...
>
> Well, you'd better distrust your feelings then. Web searches are
> fine if you know relevant keywords.

You mean, you didn’t try “nftables” as a search keyword? Because the
very first hit Google gave me for that was ...
<https://wiki.nftables.org/wiki-nftables/index.php/Main_Page>

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#71642

From"Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid>
Date2025-08-19 12:35 +0200
Message-ID<9l0enlx168.ln2@Telcontar.valinor>
In reply to#70838
On 2025-08-12 09:39, Mike Scott wrote:
> On 11/08/2025 23:02, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>> I don’t know. I’m just able to read documentation. I thought that was a
>> skill that was so commonplace among folks who work with computers for a
>> living that you could take it for granted, but apparently not.
> 
> The horror is manuals written by the code-writer. They describe in 
> intimate detail each and every function; but not how it all hooks up. In 
> this case, I'd not even seen the nft man page, because I'd been 
> searching for the wrong terms, hadn't got there because I'd got drowned 
> in a morass of ipfilter and similar stuff, now apparently out-of-date; 
> and gave it up as a bad job.
> 
> What's wrong with a couple of clear examples, plus the detail to expand 
> on them?
> 

+1

-- 
Cheers, Carlos.

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#71645

FromMike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid>
Date2025-08-19 12:18 +0100
Message-ID<1081mho$3mu3b$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#71642
On 19/08/2025 11:35, Carlos E.R. wrote:
> On 2025-08-12 09:39, Mike Scott wrote:
>> On 11/08/2025 23:02, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
>>> I don’t know. I’m just able to read documentation. I thought that was a
>>> skill that was so commonplace among folks who work with computers for a
>>> living that you could take it for granted, but apparently not.
>>
>> The horror is manuals written by the code-writer. They describe in 
>> intimate detail each and every function; but not how it all hooks up. 
>> In this case, I'd not even seen the nft man page, because I'd been 
>> searching for the wrong terms, hadn't got there because I'd got 
>> drowned in a morass of ipfilter and similar stuff, now apparently out- 
>> of-date; and gave it up as a bad job.
>>
>> What's wrong with a couple of clear examples, plus the detail to 
>> expand on them?
>>
> 
> +1
> 

Having been pointed at nftables as the right direction, I had a word 
with chatgpt asking for examples for my use case. I treat the answers 
with suspicion, but they seem clear and reasonable, and I'll take a good 
look when I've time.

(I'd given up on chatgpt ages ago, when it made Noddy mistakes on 
trivial code examples. Looks like things have improved since then.)

Thanks all for helpful answers.

-- 
Mike Scott
Harlow, England

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#71661

FromMarc Haber <mh+usenetspam1118@zugschl.us>
Date2025-08-19 15:16 +0200
Message-ID<1081tfb$27uo$1@news1.tnib.de>
In reply to#71645
Mike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid> wrote:
>(I'd given up on chatgpt ages ago, when it made Noddy mistakes on 
>trivial code examples. Looks like things have improved since then.)

It still does make noddy mistakes. I recently asked it for a regexp
that will cover all integers between 0 and 2^32-1, it didn't even get
the parenthesis matched right.

Greetings
Marc
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Marc Haber         |   " Questions are the         | Mailadresse im Header
Rhein-Neckar, DE   |     Beginning of Wisdom "     | 
Nordisch by Nature | Lt. Worf, TNG "Rightful Heir" | Fon: *49 6224 1600402

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#71698

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2025-08-20 01:02 +0000
Message-ID<10836qt$1m96$12@dont-email.me>
In reply to#71661
On Tue, 19 Aug 2025 15:16:26 +0200, Marc Haber wrote:

> It still does make noddy mistakes.

In other news, a survey reports that, the less confidence developers have 
in AI, the more they use it.

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#72373

FromMike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid>
Date2025-08-27 06:56 +0100
Message-ID<108m6mu$fe1a$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#71645
On 19/08/2025 12:18, Mike Scott wrote:
> Having been pointed at nftables as the right direction, I had a word 
> with chatgpt asking for examples for my use case. I treat the answers 
> with suspicion, but they seem clear and reasonable, and I'll take a good 
> look when I've time.
> 
> (I'd given up on chatgpt ages ago, when it made Noddy mistakes on 
> trivial code examples. Looks like things have improved since then.)
> 
> Thanks all for helpful answers.

Sorry for following up my own message, but.....

I tried the chatgpt-generated nft config file yesterday. Interesting.

It had a grossw syntactical error in it. I flagged this up to chatgpt, 
which apologised (!) and gave a slightly modified version. Same problem. 
I flagged it up again: it went away for almost 3 minutes, chuntering 
about checking things and "thinking". It came back with a decidedly 
modified version that had correct syntax.

I told it to explain its error, and it said it had got muddled between 
nft and sh script syntax. Hmm.

Anyway, the upshot is that I seem to have been right about nft's 
limitations compared to pf. It's concept of "set" (analogous to pf' 
"table" looks to have a huge issue.

pf allows, for example
pfctl -t inboundblock -T replace -f /etc/firewall/inboundblock
which is an atomic operation. AFAICT, with nft you have to operate 
element-by-element, and cannot load a set from a file of wanted 
elements, nor clear nor replace the contents as a group.

Is this correct?



-- 
Mike Scott
Harlow, England

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#72447

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2025-08-28 00:50 +0000
Message-ID<108o94p$10pj9$8@dont-email.me>
In reply to#72373
On Wed, 27 Aug 2025 06:56:46 +0100, Mike Scott wrote:

> pf allows, for example
> pfctl -t inboundblock -T replace -f /etc/firewall/inboundblock
> which is an atomic operation.

The docs say

    nft -f «file»

is an atomic operation. You might have known that if you’d read them.

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#72482

FromMike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid>
Date2025-08-28 09:40 +0100
Message-ID<108p4m2$173fr$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#72447
On 28/08/2025 01:50, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Aug 2025 06:56:46 +0100, Mike Scott wrote:
> 
>> pf allows, for example
>> pfctl -t inboundblock -T replace -f /etc/firewall/inboundblock
>> which is an atomic operation.
> 
> The docs say
> 
>      nft -f «file»
> 
> is an atomic operation. You might have known that if you’d read them.

 > man nft |grep atomic
troff:<standard input>:1317: warning [p 10, 4.7i, div '3tbd9,1', 0.3i]: 
cannot break line
troff:<standard input>:6498: warning [p 27, 0.3i, div '3tbd10,0', 0.2i]: 
cannot break line
<standard input>:6352: warning: table wider than line length minus 
indentation
troff:<standard input>:8857: warning [p 32, 0.3i, div '3tbd1,1', 0.3i]: 
cannot break line


To be fair, the online wiki does give the answer. Which raises the 
issue, again, of documentation standards. When important matters are 
absent from at least some key docs, then what? There's more to life than 
grubbing around on the net hoping to hit the right combination of keywords.

Again, I asked chatgpt about this (hindsight is so good), and it came up 
with helpful information.

-- 
Mike Scott
Harlow, England

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#72566

FromLawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid>
Date2025-08-29 00:56 +0000
Message-ID<108qtsm$1n18s$5@dont-email.me>
In reply to#72482
On Thu, 28 Aug 2025 09:40:34 +0100, Mike Scott wrote:

> To be fair, the online wiki does give the answer. Which raises the
> issue, again, of documentation standards. When important matters are
> absent from at least some key docs, then what?

Weren’t you one of those complaining that bare reference material wasn’t 
enough? That you wanted tutorial examples and how-tos and all that? Then 
when I mention that it all that is available, you now find a new reason to 
complain?

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#72641

FromJohn Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com>
Date2025-08-29 08:10 -0700
Message-ID<20250829081008.00004d8a@gmail.com>
In reply to#72566
On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 00:56:54 -0000 (UTC)
Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:

> > To be fair, the online wiki does give the answer. Which raises the
> > issue, again, of documentation standards. When important matters are
> > absent from at least some key docs, then what?  
> 
> Weren’t you one of those complaining that bare reference material
> wasn’t enough? That you wanted tutorial examples and how-tos and all
> that? Then when I mention that it all that is available, you now find
> a new reason to complain?

Again, when important information for *core networking tools* is only
found on the Web, it hardly takes a great sage to discern the problem.

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#72656

FromMike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid>
Date2025-08-29 19:16 +0100
Message-ID<108sqqi$25aq9$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#72641
On 29/08/2025 16:10, John Ames wrote:
> On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 00:56:54 -0000 (UTC)
> Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
> 
>>> To be fair, the online wiki does give the answer. Which raises the
>>> issue, again, of documentation standards. When important matters are
>>> absent from at least some key docs, then what?
>>
>> Weren’t you one of those complaining that bare reference material
>> wasn’t enough? That you wanted tutorial examples and how-tos and all
>> that? Then when I mention that it all that is available, you now find
>> a new reason to complain?
> 
> Again, when important information for *core networking tools* is only
> found on the Web, it hardly takes a great sage to discern the problem.
> 

The problem is that it is /not/ all available. I'm quite stumped about 
one particular issue for which there seem no references at all that I 
can find: and believe me, I have looked.

Ironically, chatgpt has been a help. It makes so many errors that 
sorting them out has been quite educational.

Oh - the problem in hand. No doubt it's easy when you know: single 
interface, allow all lan traffic, block wan inbound to port 22, redirect 
wan inbound on port 12345 to 22 and pass. Block wan inbound otherwise. 
If anyone has a config snippet to do this, I'd be very grateful.


-- 
Mike Scott
Harlow, England

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#72757

FromTauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid>
Date2025-08-30 16:59 +0300
Message-ID<108v04h$2koah$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#72656
On 29.8.2025 21.16, Mike Scott wrote:
> On 29/08/2025 16:10, John Ames wrote:
>> On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 00:56:54 -0000 (UTC)
>> Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>>> To be fair, the online wiki does give the answer. Which raises the
>>>> issue, again, of documentation standards. When important matters are
>>>> absent from at least some key docs, then what?
>>>
>>> Weren’t you one of those complaining that bare reference material
>>> wasn’t enough? That you wanted tutorial examples and how-tos and all
>>> that? Then when I mention that it all that is available, you now find
>>> a new reason to complain?
>>
>> Again, when important information for *core networking tools* is only
>> found on the Web, it hardly takes a great sage to discern the problem.
>>
> 
> The problem is that it is /not/ all available. I'm quite stumped about 
> one particular issue for which there seem no references at all that I 
> can find: and believe me, I have looked.
> 
> Ironically, chatgpt has been a help. It makes so many errors that 
> sorting them out has been quite educational.
> 
> Oh - the problem in hand. No doubt it's easy when you know: single 
> interface, allow all lan traffic, block wan inbound to port 22, redirect 
> wan inbound on port 12345 to 22 and pass. Block wan inbound otherwise. 
> If anyone has a config snippet to do this, I'd be very grateful.
> 
> 

Mike,

The tool you need is called nftables, with a command line
interface program called nft.

Google for nftables documentation, read and understand it, the
response is there with examples. It is difficult to provide a
good snippet without your networking details.

You could also configure the ssh daemon with a secondary port
of 12345, just pass it, to avoid the port translation step.

-- 

-TV

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#72766

FromMike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid>
Date2025-08-30 18:45 +0100
Message-ID<108vdc2$2ohi5$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#72757
On 30/08/2025 14:59, Tauno Voipio wrote:
> On 29.8.2025 21.16, Mike Scott wrote:
>> On 29/08/2025 16:10, John Ames wrote:
>>> On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 00:56:54 -0000 (UTC)
>>> Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> To be fair, the online wiki does give the answer. Which raises the
>>>>> issue, again, of documentation standards. When important matters are
>>>>> absent from at least some key docs, then what?
>>>>
>>>> Weren’t you one of those complaining that bare reference material
>>>> wasn’t enough? That you wanted tutorial examples and how-tos and all
>>>> that? Then when I mention that it all that is available, you now find
>>>> a new reason to complain?
>>>
>>> Again, when important information for *core networking tools* is only
>>> found on the Web, it hardly takes a great sage to discern the problem.
>>>
>>
>> The problem is that it is /not/ all available. I'm quite stumped about 
>> one particular issue for which there seem no references at all that I 
>> can find: and believe me, I have looked.
>>
>> Ironically, chatgpt has been a help. It makes so many errors that 
>> sorting them out has been quite educational.
>>
>> Oh - the problem in hand. No doubt it's easy when you know: single 
>> interface, allow all lan traffic, block wan inbound to port 22, 
>> redirect wan inbound on port 12345 to 22 and pass. Block wan inbound 
>> otherwise. If anyone has a config snippet to do this, I'd be very 
>> grateful.
>>
>>
> 
> Mike,
> 
> The tool you need is called nftables, with a command line
> interface program called nft.
> 
> Google for nftables documentation, read and understand it, the
> response is there with examples. It is difficult to provide a
> good snippet without your networking details.
> 
> You could also configure the ssh daemon with a secondary port
> of 12345, just pass it, to avoid the port translation step.
> 

We're going in circles here.... there's an issue with lack of decent 
docs (and examples) for nft - it seems that port blocking occurs after 
the redirection, with unhappy consequences, and I find no usable 
information suggesting any other possibility.

I have running on freebsd, and am trying to move to linux, a server that 
ignores port 22 from the net at large, but accepts (similar to) 12345, 
just to provide an extra layer of obfuscation to wannabe attackers.

It's a 2-line doddle on freebsd's pf firewall; I can't for the life of 
me work out the nftables equivalent, and begin to wonder if indeed it 
can be done.

I suppose opening multiple ssh listener ports is another solution 
(thanks), but the original problem should - surely - be solvable: it 
also pops up for other services but which won't necessarily have the 
workaround.



-- 
Mike Scott
Harlow, England

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#72837

FromTauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid>
Date2025-08-31 21:24 +0300
Message-ID<109241p$3cnp8$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#72766
On 30.8.2025 20.45, Mike Scott wrote:
> On 30/08/2025 14:59, Tauno Voipio wrote:
>> On 29.8.2025 21.16, Mike Scott wrote:
>>> On 29/08/2025 16:10, John Ames wrote:
>>>> On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 00:56:54 -0000 (UTC)
>>>> Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> To be fair, the online wiki does give the answer. Which raises the
>>>>>> issue, again, of documentation standards. When important matters are
>>>>>> absent from at least some key docs, then what?
>>>>>
>>>>> Weren’t you one of those complaining that bare reference material
>>>>> wasn’t enough? That you wanted tutorial examples and how-tos and all
>>>>> that? Then when I mention that it all that is available, you now find
>>>>> a new reason to complain?
>>>>
>>>> Again, when important information for *core networking tools* is only
>>>> found on the Web, it hardly takes a great sage to discern the problem.
>>>>
>>>
>>> The problem is that it is /not/ all available. I'm quite stumped 
>>> about one particular issue for which there seem no references at all 
>>> that I can find: and believe me, I have looked.
>>>
>>> Ironically, chatgpt has been a help. It makes so many errors that 
>>> sorting them out has been quite educational.
>>>
>>> Oh - the problem in hand. No doubt it's easy when you know: single 
>>> interface, allow all lan traffic, block wan inbound to port 22, 
>>> redirect wan inbound on port 12345 to 22 and pass. Block wan inbound 
>>> otherwise. If anyone has a config snippet to do this, I'd be very 
>>> grateful.
>>>
>>>
>>
>> Mike,
>>
>> The tool you need is called nftables, with a command line
>> interface program called nft.
>>
>> Google for nftables documentation, read and understand it, the
>> response is there with examples. It is difficult to provide a
>> good snippet without your networking details.
>>
>> You could also configure the ssh daemon with a secondary port
>> of 12345, just pass it, to avoid the port translation step.
>>
> 
> We're going in circles here.... there's an issue with lack of decent 
> docs (and examples) for nft - it seems that port blocking occurs after 
> the redirection, with unhappy consequences, and I find no usable 
> information suggesting any other possibility.
> 
> I have running on freebsd, and am trying to move to linux, a server that 
> ignores port 22 from the net at large, but accepts (similar to) 12345, 
> just to provide an extra layer of obfuscation to wannabe attackers.
> 
> It's a 2-line doddle on freebsd's pf firewall; I can't for the life of 
> me work out the nftables equivalent, and begin to wonder if indeed it 
> can be done.
> 
> I suppose opening multiple ssh listener ports is another solution 
> (thanks), but the original problem should - surely - be solvable: it 
> also pops up for other services but which won't necessarily have the 
> workaround.


I'm writing this just on a network, where the Linux router is having
a ruleset resembling what you ask for.

Please look at 
<https://wiki.nftables.org/wiki-nftables/index.php/Netfilter_hooks>

The nftables pages contain the information you need.

You need to block the inbound TCP port 22 coming from the external
interface. The correct place is in the ip nat table, PREROUTING chain.

-- 

-TV

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#72934

FromMike Scott <usenet.16@scottsonline.org.uk.invalid>
Date2025-09-01 17:02 +0100
Message-ID<1094g30$3uuca$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#72837
On 31/08/2025 19:24, Tauno Voipio wrote:
> On 30.8.2025 20.45, Mike Scott wrote:
>> On 30/08/2025 14:59, Tauno Voipio wrote:
>>> On 29.8.2025 21.16, Mike Scott wrote:
>>>> On 29/08/2025 16:10, John Ames wrote:
>>>>> On Fri, 29 Aug 2025 00:56:54 -0000 (UTC)
>>>>> Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>>> To be fair, the online wiki does give the answer. Which raises the
>>>>>>> issue, again, of documentation standards. When important matters are
>>>>>>> absent from at least some key docs, then what?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Weren’t you one of those complaining that bare reference material
>>>>>> wasn’t enough? That you wanted tutorial examples and how-tos and all
>>>>>> that? Then when I mention that it all that is available, you now find
>>>>>> a new reason to complain?
>>>>>
>>>>> Again, when important information for *core networking tools* is only
>>>>> found on the Web, it hardly takes a great sage to discern the problem.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> The problem is that it is /not/ all available. I'm quite stumped 
>>>> about one particular issue for which there seem no references at all 
>>>> that I can find: and believe me, I have looked.
>>>>
>>>> Ironically, chatgpt has been a help. It makes so many errors that 
>>>> sorting them out has been quite educational.
>>>>
>>>> Oh - the problem in hand. No doubt it's easy when you know: single 
>>>> interface, allow all lan traffic, block wan inbound to port 22, 
>>>> redirect wan inbound on port 12345 to 22 and pass. Block wan inbound 
>>>> otherwise. If anyone has a config snippet to do this, I'd be very 
>>>> grateful.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> Mike,
>>>
>>> The tool you need is called nftables, with a command line
>>> interface program called nft.
>>>
>>> Google for nftables documentation, read and understand it, the
>>> response is there with examples. It is difficult to provide a
>>> good snippet without your networking details.
>>>
>>> You could also configure the ssh daemon with a secondary port
>>> of 12345, just pass it, to avoid the port translation step.
>>>
>>
>> We're going in circles here.... there's an issue with lack of decent 
>> docs (and examples) for nft - it seems that port blocking occurs after 
>> the redirection, with unhappy consequences, and I find no usable 
>> information suggesting any other possibility.
>>
>> I have running on freebsd, and am trying to move to linux, a server 
>> that ignores port 22 from the net at large, but accepts (similar to) 
>> 12345, just to provide an extra layer of obfuscation to wannabe 
>> attackers.
>>
>> It's a 2-line doddle on freebsd's pf firewall; I can't for the life of 
>> me work out the nftables equivalent, and begin to wonder if indeed it 
>> can be done.
>>
>> I suppose opening multiple ssh listener ports is another solution 
>> (thanks), but the original problem should - surely - be solvable: it 
>> also pops up for other services but which won't necessarily have the 
>> workaround.
> 
> 
> I'm writing this just on a network, where the Linux router is having
> a ruleset resembling what you ask for.
> 
> Please look at <https://wiki.nftables.org/wiki-nftables/index.php/ 
> Netfilter_hooks>
> 
> The nftables pages contain the information you need.
> 
> You need to block the inbound TCP port 22 coming from the external
> interface. The correct place is in the ip nat table, PREROUTING chain.
> 

Thank you for the reply. I can't say that the page you offer is 
particularly enlightening.

However, after grubbing around yet more and with trial and error I have 
a way of doing it:

table inet filter {

chain input {
......
            # Reject direct SSH (port 22) from WAN
             tcp dport 21022  drop
             tcp dport 22 accept
...
}
}

table inet nat {
     chain prerouting {
         type nat hook prerouting priority -100;

         # DNAT: Redirect WAN port 12345 to local port 22, WAN port 22 
to graveyard
        tcp dport 12345 ip saddr != 192.168.0.0/24 dnat ip to :22
        tcp dport 22 ip saddr != 192.168.0.0/24 dnat ip to :21022
     }
}


The solution involves the seemingly undocumented use of "!=" in this 
context. (It seems to mean "is contained in" but IMBW. If anyone knows 
where this is described, I'd be grateful. Or if it's wrong!)




-- 
Mike Scott
Harlow, England

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