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Groups > comp.os.linux.misc > #93793 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2026-10-16 03:26 +0000 |
| Last post | 2026-10-18 10:59 +0000 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 870 — 49 participants |
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Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 03:26 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 00:00 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 04:33 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 21:53 -0700
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 01:31 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 06:08 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:39 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:49 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:53 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 05:26 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:29 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:31 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:16 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-16 19:42 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:44 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:55 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:20 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:20 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:09 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 12:54 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:15 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:05 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 14:54 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 16:46 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 16:57 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 19:01 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:11 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 14:48 -0700
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Harold Stevens <wookie@bookworm.localdomain> - 2026-10-17 08:26 -0500
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 15:01 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 12:19 -0700
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 22:11 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:52 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 11:30 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 09:48 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 12:12 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-19 13:04 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 14:40 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:54 +0100
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-18 04:32 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-18 13:30 +0200
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Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:32 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:21 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-17 04:04 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:24 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:27 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:20 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 01:13 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 02:32 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-17 18:33 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-18 03:04 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-18 11:41 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI John Bokma <contact@johnbokma.com> - 2026-10-18 12:45 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 16:05 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-19 17:25 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-19 20:19 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 19:24 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 22:16 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-17 22:53 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 06:02 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Peyton" <peyton@solacium.us> - 2026-10-15 23:26 -0700
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-16 06:42 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-16 07:41 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 06:39 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 04:22 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:54 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:19 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-17 08:40 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-17 09:52 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-17 20:47 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-17 23:29 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Anton Antimo <anton@safunu.org> - 2026-10-19 17:18 -0300
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Helmut Waitzmann <nn.throttle@erine.email> - 2026-10-21 00:54 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-23 18:50 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-23 23:59 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-24 11:53 +0200
Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2026-10-24 12:10 +0000
Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-24 18:53 +0200
Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 00:28 -0400
Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-26 06:20 +0100
Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 03:38 -0400
Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 05:01 +0100
Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-27 12:24 -0400
[OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-28 01:12 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-28 05:26 -0400
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-28 19:33 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-29 00:19 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-10-29 12:27 -0400
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 03:40 -0400
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:24 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-30 23:10 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-31 04:14 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:40 +0100
Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-31 10:49 +0000
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-31 13:11 +0000
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:53 +0100
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:56 +0100
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-31 22:41 +0000
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:31 +0100
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-11-07 16:07 +0000
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-11-01 20:50 +0000
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-01 19:40 +0000
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-02 23:27 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-31 14:11 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 16:57 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 19:56 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 22:11 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 04:18 -0500
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-01 17:22 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:59 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-01 17:50 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) FF <fflud@linux.rocks> - 2026-11-01 18:09 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-02 23:32 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-03 00:26 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:57 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-03 02:17 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:49 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 22:22 -0500
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:24 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 04:49 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:28 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 08:36 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-01 22:29 +0000
Internal navigation in the online manual (was: Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously)) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-01 01:08 +0000
Re: Internal navigation in the online manual "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 13:03 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Andreas Eder <a_eder_muc@web.de> - 2026-11-01 10:58 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-01 22:27 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:57 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 13:07 +0100
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-01 22:32 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-02 23:35 +0100
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-02 23:22 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 03:02 +0100
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:50 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:28 +0100
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:14 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 21:18 -0500
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 08:40 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:31 +0100
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 18:32 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 19:51 +0100
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-01 19:40 +0000
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-11-01 16:49 -0800
Re: man pages (was Re: [OT] Punch card times) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 11:31 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Josef Möllers <josef@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-28 17:01 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-28 17:50 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-28 18:18 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David LaRue <huey.dll@tampabay.rr.com> - 2026-10-28 23:28 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-29 00:11 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-29 00:46 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-28 22:36 -0400
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-10-29 09:13 -0700
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-29 18:13 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 04:00 -0400
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-29 17:37 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Kaz Kylheku <046-301-5902@kylheku.com> - 2026-10-29 20:01 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-29 21:18 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-29 21:40 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-29 23:58 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Christian Weisgerber <naddy@mips.inka.de> - 2026-10-30 15:14 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 00:09 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-30 04:33 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-30 11:10 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-30 17:52 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-10-30 17:14 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:25 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-30 18:26 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-10-30 19:25 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-30 20:12 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) jayjwa <jayjwa@atr2.ath.cx.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:07 -0400
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:38 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 04:30 -0500
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-01 10:16 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-01 19:13 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-02 09:35 -0800
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 20:27 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-02 13:50 -0800
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 20:42 -0500
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:42 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-03 16:38 +0800
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 08:40 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-03 07:29 -0700
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-04 02:02 +0800
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 19:45 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 18:17 -0500
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-11-01 16:45 -0800
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-01 21:00 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-02 02:16 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 04:48 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 14:13 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 06:47 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:02 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 19:48 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Kaz Kylheku <046-301-5902@kylheku.com> - 2026-11-03 23:57 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:48 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-05 09:51 -0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-05 19:11 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-05 12:12 -0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 15:50 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:19 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-05 22:24 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:57 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 17:18 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 23:17 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-05 19:37 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 21:54 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-06 20:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-06 04:24 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 23:31 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-06 05:03 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 16:04 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-06 08:46 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-06 07:41 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-06 14:30 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-06 20:53 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-07 06:13 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-07 01:12 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-06 00:38 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-06 00:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-05 13:19 -0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:29 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-05 13:57 -0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 17:15 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Ames <commodorejohn@gmail.com> - 2026-11-05 14:29 -0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-05 22:42 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-06 00:59 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-06 20:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-06 22:29 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:21 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-02 16:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 20:10 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-02 17:10 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 20:25 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 03:56 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:03 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 13:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 19:56 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-03 16:42 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-03 19:40 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Kerr-Mudd, John" <admin@127.0.0.1> - 2026-11-04 19:48 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 01:28 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-02 09:41 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 11:22 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:11 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 13:57 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-03 00:20 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:45 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-03 11:49 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 13:02 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 13:26 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-03 07:35 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 18:06 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 21:52 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:48 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:45 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 21:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 14:29 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 14:28 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-03 22:15 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-03 22:47 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-03 23:18 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 03:12 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-04 08:26 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 01:20 +0000
[OT] Fujitsu Horizon (was: Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:19 +0000
Re: [OT] Fujitsu Horizon Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-05 09:50 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 09:09 -0700
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:30 -0500
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 03:57 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-04 16:57 +0800
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-05 04:48 +0800
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-06 06:38 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:27 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 09:11 -0700
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-06 06:40 +0000
Re: [OT] Mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-04 10:43 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:54 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-04 19:59 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 19:04 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 03:34 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-05 06:27 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Richard Kettlewell <invalid@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:48 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:02 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:01 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-06 15:45 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 11:32 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:29 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:40 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 19:02 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-05 15:02 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-05 19:18 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:00 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:57 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 23:04 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-05 19:15 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 03:23 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-04 10:53 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:47 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-04 22:22 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:09 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-05 00:14 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 01:18 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-05 12:27 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:12 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-05 22:22 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-05 15:59 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-06 06:35 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-06 23:09 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 11:45 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-07 07:37 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-07 22:49 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-07 14:54 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-07 13:31 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-08 02:56 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-07 20:03 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 21:53 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-08 01:23 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-08 05:12 -0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-11-08 14:31 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-08 21:29 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-08 18:52 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:25 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 19:45 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-05 03:33 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:05 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-03 00:08 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 21:12 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 15:13 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:27 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 21:37 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:01 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:18 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:09 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:02 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:54 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-03 23:02 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:58 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-07 16:04 -1000
NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-08 05:59 -0800
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-08 08:11 -1000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-08 21:31 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-08 13:45 -0800
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-08 12:21 -1000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-08 23:51 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-08 20:33 -0700
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-08 22:59 -0500
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-09 07:32 -1000
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-09 21:20 +0000
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-09 22:07 -0500
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Alexander Schreiber <als@usenet.thangorodrim.de> - 2026-11-10 10:37 +0100
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Pancho <Pancho.Jones@protonmail.com> - 2026-11-10 12:22 +0000
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-10 15:14 +0000
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-10 07:35 -0700
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-10 18:36 +0000
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-10 07:29 -1000
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-10 07:55 -1000
Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-10 18:36 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-10 07:09 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-10 07:27 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Alexander Schreiber <als@usenet.thangorodrim.de> - 2026-11-10 10:50 +0100
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-10 07:37 -0700
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-10 15:18 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-10 10:45 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-10 15:16 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-10 18:36 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-09 04:42 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-09 10:01 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-09 11:08 +0000
Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-09 15:59 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-08 08:32 -1000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-08 21:32 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> - 2026-11-08 11:55 -1000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-08 21:49 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-04 15:34 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:08 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:36 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-05 00:13 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 20:58 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:42 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:49 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 02:53 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 04:44 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 07:15 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:27 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:41 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-04 10:58 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:19 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-05 00:19 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 01:24 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:52 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 09:28 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:25 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:53 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 21:57 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:44 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:05 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:27 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 09:20 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:52 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 21:50 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-05 08:59 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-04 15:36 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 02:42 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:43 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 21:35 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 07:32 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2026-11-04 11:32 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 18:52 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 19:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-05 05:02 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-05 18:43 -0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-06 06:44 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-06 08:51 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-06 21:10 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 11:34 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-06 20:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-07 02:32 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Kaz Kylheku <046-301-5902@kylheku.com> - 2026-11-06 21:29 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-06 04:34 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-06 20:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Kaz Kylheku <046-301-5902@kylheku.com> - 2026-11-06 21:31 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-07 01:22 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-07 05:00 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-07 04:12 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-07 05:39 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-07 04:50 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-07 00:35 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-07 22:41 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-07 19:56 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 11:39 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-07 22:48 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-08 01:29 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-08 04:29 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-07 11:37 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-07 06:25 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 22:53 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 07:15 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-03 19:28 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-03 23:07 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:41 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:01 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-03 23:41 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-04 01:13 +0000
Re: [OT] scientific mainframes, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 03:04 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-04 09:03 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 01:27 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:50 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-03 14:31 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Jeroen Belleman <jeroen@nospam.please> - 2026-11-03 19:16 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-03 07:31 -0700
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-04 02:13 +0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> - 2026-11-03 05:28 -0800
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 22:00 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Robert Riches <spamtrap42@jacob21819.net> - 2026-11-04 05:10 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-04 00:28 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-04 11:34 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-04 15:42 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-03 23:04 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 23:05 -0500
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 04:15 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-04 00:14 -0500
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 18:24 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-04 06:21 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-04 07:10 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-04 07:00 -0500
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-04 18:28 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2026-11-04 16:50 -0500
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-05 19:57 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-05 21:57 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-05 21:57 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> - 2026-11-05 16:01 -0700
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-05 23:06 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-06 02:50 +0000
Re: [OT] what's a mini, Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2026-11-04 16:44 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-03 15:18 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 02:59 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-02 22:29 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 03:16 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-11-03 22:23 -0500
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-11-04 19:18 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2026-11-02 16:51 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 11:13 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-11-02 19:41 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2026-11-02 17:01 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-03 12:36 +0100
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Thomas Koenig <tkoenig@netcologne.de> - 2026-11-03 07:10 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-11-03 20:35 +0000
Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2026-11-03 21:11 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 10:52 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2026-11-02 15:35 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 10:47 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Johann 'Myrkraverk' Oskarsson <johann@myrkraverk.invalid> - 2026-11-02 20:16 +0800
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-11-02 13:58 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:49 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 16:42 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 20:08 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-31 21:20 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-11-01 12:19 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-31 18:42 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-31 11:57 +0100
Re: [OT] Punch card times rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2026-10-31 18:53 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-31 21:48 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-29 23:48 +0000
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 04:27 -0400
Re: [OT] Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-30 03:58 -0400
Re: Taking Speedy too seriously (Was: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI) c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 00:57 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2026-10-24 13:41 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI "Carlos E.R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> - 2026-10-24 21:31 +0200
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2026-10-24 22:36 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-25 23:49 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-26 06:04 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 03:15 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 04:42 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Nuno Silva <nunojsilva@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-24 12:06 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-25 23:59 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-26 06:41 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-26 03:50 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 02:44 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Keith Thompson <Keith.S.Thompson+u@gmail.com> - 2026-10-26 15:16 -0700
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Janis Papanagnou <janis_papanagnou+ng@hotmail.com> - 2026-10-27 02:26 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 05:29 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 10:07 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 09:28 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:26 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 10:56 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 12:40 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:46 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 13:39 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:48 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 09:16 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 08:51 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 11:04 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 11:13 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 13:03 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Tapiro Ubriaco <interwebs.dude@gmail.com> - 2026-10-16 12:26 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2026-10-16 15:21 +0100
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-16 15:07 +0000
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> - 2026-10-16 21:26 -0400
Re: Back To CS Basics. Fuck AI Leroy H <lh@somewhere.net> - 2026-10-17 01:55 +0000
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Page 26 of 44 — ← Prev page 1 … 24 25 [26] 27 28 … 44 Next page →
| From | "Carlos E. R." <robin_listas@es.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-03 23:01 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <nkv3t9FeeegU13@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #95038 |
On 2026-11-03 22:37, Scott Lurndal wrote:
> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes:
>> On 03/11/2026 15:13, Scott Lurndal wrote:
>>> Actually, the numbers decline every year. The vast majority are
>>> legacy installations (particularly for the Burroughs/Univac/Unisys
>>> mainframes) and there are very few, if any, new customers adopting
>>> mainframes of any flavor.
>>
>> "Global mainframe market size and IBM Z mainframe revenue trends
>> highlight a cyclical pattern dominated by multi-year refresh waves (such
>> as the z16 and z17 cycles):
>>
>> Global Mainframe Market Size:
>>
>> Valued at approximately $5.33 billion to $5.71 billion in 2025.
>> Projected to grow to $5.65 billion to $6.11 billion in 2026.
>> Forecasted to reach $7.54 billion to $10.53 billion by
>> 2031–2034, driven by a compound annual growth rate (CAGR) of roughly
>> 5.95% to 7.05%.
>>
>> IBM Z Mainframe Performance & Fluctuations:
>> Late 2025 (z17 Launch / Q4): IBM reported its strongest Q4
>> mainframe revenue in 20 years, with IBM Z sales surging 67%
>> year-over-year as enterprises adopted the z17 architecture.
>> Mid-2026 (Q2): IBM Z mainframe revenue experienced a short-term
>> 42% year-over-year decline in fiscal Q2 2026 due to delayed large
>> capital expenditure (capex) deals and client shifts toward
>> supply-constrained servers, though management noted these were deferred
>> purchases rather than lost contracts (with roughly one-third closing
>> shortly after the quarter)."
>>
>> So, as usual, the facts are not correctly represented by the resident
>> armchair experts
>
> Dig into a bit and you'll find that those are refreshes for existing
> customers, not new customers.
I don't expect new banks, either.
--
Cheers,
Carlos E.R.
ES🇪🇸, EU🇪🇺.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-03 22:18 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <11cdmjs$63m2$6@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95043 |
On Tue, 3 Nov 2026 23:01:13 +0100, Carlos E. R. wrote: > I don't expect new banks, either. New banks do keep coming along. <https://www.stuff.co.nz/money/361054511/rbnz-registers-revolut-nzs-first-digi-only-bank> Also, you think banks don’t use more modern tools, like Python? Yes, Python. <https://calpaterson.com/bank-python.html>
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-04 11:09 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <11cf3pj$k0n0$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95043 |
On 03/11/2026 22:01, Carlos E. R. wrote: >>> >>> So, as usual, the facts are not correctly represented by the resident >>> armchair experts >> >> Dig into a bit and you'll find that those are refreshes for existing >> customers, not new customers. > > I don't expect new banks, either. Exactly, though it would be nice to have one or two -- “when things get difficult you just have to lie” ― Jean Claud Jüncker
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | David Wade <g4ugm@dave.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-03 22:51 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <11cdohi$4hqr$3@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95038 |
On 03/11/2026 21:37, Scott Lurndal wrote: > The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> writes: >> On 03/11/2026 15:13, Scott Lurndal wrote: >>> Actually, the numbers decline every year. The vast majority are >>> legacy installations (particularly for the Burroughs/Univac/Unisys >>> mainframes) and there are very few, if any, new customers adopting >>> mainframes of any flavor. >> >> "Global mainframe market size and IBM Z mainframe revenue trends >> highlight a cyclical pattern dominated by multi-year refresh waves (such >> as the z16 and z17 cycles): >> >> Global Mainframe Market Size: >> >> Valued at approximately $5.33 billion to $5.71 billion in 2025. >> Projected to grow to $5.65 billion to $6.11 billion in 2026. >> Forecasted to reach $7.54 billion to $10.53 billion by >> 2031–2034, driven by a compound annual growth rate (CAGR) of roughly >> 5.95% to 7.05%. >> >> IBM Z Mainframe Performance & Fluctuations: >> Late 2025 (z17 Launch / Q4): IBM reported its strongest Q4 >> mainframe revenue in 20 years, with IBM Z sales surging 67% >> year-over-year as enterprises adopted the z17 architecture. >> Mid-2026 (Q2): IBM Z mainframe revenue experienced a short-term >> 42% year-over-year decline in fiscal Q2 2026 due to delayed large >> capital expenditure (capex) deals and client shifts toward >> supply-constrained servers, though management noted these were deferred >> purchases rather than lost contracts (with roughly one-third closing >> shortly after the quarter)." >> >> So, as usual, the facts are not correctly represented by the resident >> armchair experts > > Dig into a bit and you'll find that those are refreshes for existing > customers, not new customers. I think all this shows is that IBM is able to force expensive hardware refresh by ending support for old machines and old versions of software so if you need Payment Card Industry compliance you need supported software. I would say most users need PCI compliance so have no choice other than to upgrade or migrate and most feel migration will be more expensive and carry more risk... .. mind I seem to remember that the recent price rises in VMWare meant that migration from there to Linux on "Z" would be a cost effective move... Dave
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-03 23:02 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <11cdp62$7e97$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95050 |
On Tue, 3 Nov 2026 22:51:30 +0000, David Wade wrote: > I think all this shows is that IBM is able to force expensive > hardware refresh by ending support for old machines and old versions > of software so if you need Payment Card Industry compliance you need > supported software. I don’t think that’s true. I have hooked up various clients to various payment systems over the years, and there was never a need for any particular piece of proprietary software at our end. (Well, the very first time I looked at a payment system, over a quarter century ago, SSL/TLS had not yet become popular, and this bank required a connection via the proprietary “Firewall/1” package, which only ran on Windows NT/Server. But I never heard back about proceeding with that, and that kind of thing is ancient history now.) In fact, the last one I set up, the payment company offered example code for implementing their protocol in a range of languages. They had kept things quite simple, while being careful about security, all credit to them.
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| From | c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-03 22:54 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <-vCcnZTRg-gPMXf3nZ2dnZfqn_qdnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #95051 |
On 11/3/26 18:02, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > On Tue, 3 Nov 2026 22:51:30 +0000, David Wade wrote: > >> I think all this shows is that IBM is able to force expensive >> hardware refresh by ending support for old machines and old versions >> of software so if you need Payment Card Industry compliance you need >> supported software. > > I don’t think that’s true. I have hooked up various clients to various > payment systems over the years, and there was never a need for any > particular piece of proprietary software at our end. IBM *tends* to Do It Right. Don't discount them. Yea, yea ... 'Dilbert' made fun of them, and not always for bad reasons, but the corp remains alive and well and profitable even to this day so it must be doing *something* right. IBM is 'diverse' - hardware/software/systems/ development/etc. A good recipe for long-term survival. Many baskets. A lot of 'other people's tech' pays royalties to IBM for the underlying real tech. KEEP the corp in my portfolio.
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| From | John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-03 23:02 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <11cdp6v$1qa8$3@gal.iecc.com> |
| In reply to | #95038 |
According to Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net>: >>So, as usual, the facts are not correctly represented by the resident >>armchair experts > >Dig into a bit and you'll find that those are refreshes for existing >customers, not new customers. IBM has two markets for z mainframes, the legacy S/360/370/390 market and high performance linux servers which they call LinuxONE. I agree they're not likely to have new legacy customers but I'd be surprised that they put all that effort into LinuxONE without expecting to get new customers out of it. They just announced that the next generation of z will have a partnership with ARM so the processors can run ARM64 code as well as the three legacy 360 modes. That tells me they're trying to get customers who already have the ARM code running in the cloud at AWS or Azure. -- Regards, John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
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| From | c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-03 22:58 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <nwGdnQ4H8bb7MHf3nZ2dnZfqn_SdnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #95052 |
On 11/3/26 18:02, John Levine wrote: > According to Scott Lurndal <slp53@pacbell.net>: >>> So, as usual, the facts are not correctly represented by the resident >>> armchair experts >> >> Dig into a bit and you'll find that those are refreshes for existing >> customers, not new customers. > > IBM has two markets for z mainframes, the legacy S/360/370/390 market > and high performance linux servers which they call LinuxONE. > > I agree they're not likely to have new legacy customers but I'd be surprised > that they put all that effort into LinuxONE without expecting to get new > customers out of it. Apparently DO have/gain many customers. > They just announced that the next generation of z will have a > partnership with ARM so the processors can run ARM64 code as well as > the three legacy 360 modes. That tells me they're trying to get > customers who already have the ARM code running in the cloud at AWS or > Azure. The 'mainframe' era is nearly over - to be replaced by cluster/distributed/AI. However IBM is already into all that, WILL make money. Many baskets ... How To Survive/Thrive. Hmmmm ... do remember when IBM was "typewriters" ...
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| From | Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-07 16:04 -1000 |
| Subject | Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times (was Re: Taking Speedy too seriously) |
| Message-ID | <875wy85ba3.fsf@localhost> |
| In reply to | #95076 |
c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> writes:
> The 'mainframe' era is nearly over - to be replaced
> by cluster/distributed/AI.
>
> However IBM is already into all that, WILL make money.
>
> Many baskets ... How To Survive/Thrive.
>
> Hmmmm ... do remember when IBM was "typewriters" ...
1988, Nick Donofrio approves HA/6000, originally for NYTimes to move
their newspaper system ("ATEX") off DEC VAXCluster to RS/6000 (running
project out at Los Gatos lab). I rename it HA/CMP
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_High_Availability_Cluster_Multiprocessing
when I start doing technical/scientific cluster scale-up with national
labs (LANL, LLNL, NCAR, etc) and commercial cluster scale-up with RDBMS
vendors (Oracle, Sybase, Ingres, Informix) with VAXCluster support in
same source base with UNIX (planning on using Hursley 9333 for mid-range
and full FCS for both technical and commercial scaleup). DB2 was still
all mainframe source, IBM non-mainframe "DB2" had yet to be developed.
IBM S/88 (relogo'ed Stratus) Product Administrator started taking us
around to their customers and also had me write a section for the
corporate continuous availability strategy document (it gets pulled when
both AS400/Rochester and mainframe/POK complain they couldn't meet
requirements). Had coined "disaster survivability" and "geographic
survivability" (as counter to disaster/recovery) when out marketing
HA/CMP.
One of the first HA/CMP customer installs was new Indian Reservation
Casino in Connecticut, was suppose to have week of testing before
opening ... but after 24hrs, they decided to open the doors (based on
projected revenue; at the time was largest in the US, still one of the
largest in the country)
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foxwoods_Resort_Casino#Debt_default
Early Jan92, there was HA/CMP meeting with Oracle CEO and IBM/AWD
executive Hester tells Ellison that we would have 16-system clusters by
mid92 and 128-system clusters by ye92. Mid-jan92, I update FSD on HA/CMP
work with national labs and FSD decides to go with HA/CMP for federal
supercomputers. By end of Jan, we are told that cluster scale-up is
being transferred to Kingston for announce as IBM Supercomputer (SP,
technical/scientific *ONLY*) and we aren't allowed to work with anything
that has more than four systems (we leave IBM a few months later). A
couple weeks later, 17feb1992, Computerworld news ... IBM establishes
laboratory to develop parallel systems (pg8)
https://archive.org/details/sim_computerworld_1992-02-17_26_7
Some speculation that HA/CMP would have eaten the mainframe in the
commercial market. 1993 industry benchmarks (number of program
iterations compared to the industry MIPS/BIPS reference platform):
ES/9000-982 : 8CPU 408MIPS, (51MIPS/CPU)
RS6000/990 (RIOS chipset) : 1-CPU: 126MIPS
Executive we had reported to, goes over to head up Somerset/AIM (Apple,
IBM, Motorola) to do single chip 801/RISC (Power/PC) and uses Motorola
88k bus/cache enabling SMP implementations.
In the mid-90s, the i86 chip makers then do hardware layer that
translates i86 instructions into RISC micro-ops for actual execution,
largely negating the performance difference with RISC platforms. 1999
industry benchmarks:
IBM PowerPC 440: 1,000MIPS
Intel Pentium3 2,054MIPS
Dec2000 (IBM mainframe) benchmark:
IBM z900 16CPU: 2.5BIPS, 156MIPS/CPU
Also 1988, IBM branch office asked if I could help LLNL (national lab)
standardize some serial stuff they were working with ... which quickly
becomes Fibre Channel Standard ("FCS", including some stuff I had done
in 1980; initially planning on using 1gbit transfer, full-duplex,
aggregate transfer 200mbytes/sec & 64-port non-blocking switches, with
high-end HA/CMP installations). POK mainframe eventually announces its
serial stuff (when it is already obsolete) as "ESCON" (initially
10mbytes/sec). Some POK engineers then become involved with FCS and
define a heavy weight protocol that radically cuts the native
throughput, eventually announced as FICON.
Latest public benchmark I've found is 2010 z196 "Peak I/O" getting 2M
IOPS using 104 FICON (20K IOPS/FICON). About the same time a native FCS
is announced for E5-2600 server blades getting over million IOPS (two
such FCS higher throughput than 104 FICON running over FCS). Note IBM
docs has SAPs (system assist processors that do actual I/O) CPU be kept
to 70% ... or 1.5M IOPS ... also no CKD DASD have been made for decades
(just simulated with industry standard fixed-block devices).
This "Evolution of the System z Channel" (SHARE 2011 presentation at
wayback machine)
https://web.archive.org/web/20170829213251/https://share.confex.com/share/117/webprogram/Handout/Session9931/9934pdhj%20v0.pdf
talks about after 2010 z196 "Peak I/O" benchmark and "zHPF" that
increased throughput from 20K IOPS/FICON to 52K IOPS/FICON then to 92K
IOPS/FICON (aka from 1/50th to almost 1/10th the native FCS announced in
2010).
--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
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| From | Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 05:59 -0800 |
| Subject | NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <11cpv8t$c3gs$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95340 |
On 11/7/2026 18:04, Lynn Wheeler wrote:
> 1988, Nick Donofrio approves HA/6000, originally for NYTimes to move
> their newspaper system ("ATEX") off DEC VAXCluster to RS/6000 (running
> project out at Los Gatos lab). I rename it HA/CMP
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_High_Availability_Cluster_Multiprocessing
> when I start doing technical/scientific cluster scale-up with national
> labs (LANL, LLNL, NCAR, etc) and commercial cluster scale-up with RDBMS
> vendors (Oracle, Sybase, Ingres, Informix) with VAXCluster support in
> same source base with UNIX (planning on using Hursley 9333 for mid-range
> and full FCS for both technical and commercial scaleup). DB2 was still
> all mainframe source, IBM non-mainframe "DB2" had yet to be developed.
Around 2001, my group had developed a T1-over-UDP-over-Ethernet bridge
to use in tandem with our wireless ethernet bridge product. After we
spun out from WiLan, and became Afar, we also marketed it separately.
Our largest sale was to NYT, to replace the dual T1 lines they had to
their (16?) regional printing plants, connected to the phototypesetters
in the print shops. At 42nd street they had a rack with 60(?) of our
boxes. While they wanted the two lines for each remote site to be on
separate boxes connected to separate IP networks, two lines to different
sites could share one of our units, which had two T1 jacks.
System worked well; I once got to visit the Old Lady shortly before they
moved down the street.
> IBM S/88 (relogo'ed Stratus) Product Administrator started taking us
> around to their customers and also had me write a section for the
> corporate continuous availability strategy document (it gets pulled when
> both AS400/Rochester and mainframe/POK complain they couldn't meet
> requirements). Had coined "disaster survivability" and "geographic
> survivability" (as counter to disaster/recovery) when out marketing
> HA/CMP.
I was curious about S/88, which I did not know about before. CoPilot
pulled together a nice synopsis, from which I learned that Stratus and
Tandem both had figured out how to do rolling upgrades in a non-stop
environment; I had thought that was an IBM mainframe invention.
I also learned that both Stratus and Tandem survive to this day, in a
fashion:
Tandem-> Compaq-> HP - is now HPE Non-Stop
Stratus-> Ascend-> Lucent -> spin-out Stratus Tech
building HA systems on Xeon processors.
Now called Penguin Solutions.
Many techies despise System/Z as an overpriced dinosaur with an
obsolete architechture. But I wonder if it is any less expensive to dip
the Intel processors in that magic sauce. I bet IBM has better scale to
their builds.
--
Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California
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| From | Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 08:11 -1000 |
| Subject | Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <87se1bp50v.fsf@localhost> |
| In reply to | #95349 |
Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> writes: > Around 2001, my group had developed a T1-over-UDP-over-Ethernet bridge > to use in tandem with our wireless ethernet bridge product. After we > spun out from WiLan, and became Afar, we also marketed it > separately. Our largest sale was to NYT, to replace the dual T1 lines > they had to their (16?) regional printing plants, connected to the > phototypesetters in the print shops. At 42nd street they had a rack > with 60(?) of our boxes. While they wanted the two lines for each > remote site to be on separate boxes connected to separate IP networks, > two lines to different sites could share one of our units, which had > two T1 jacks. > > System worked well; I once got to visit the Old Lady shortly before > they moved down the street. early 80s, I got HSDT project, T1 and faster computer links (both terrestrial and satellite) and battles with SNA group (60s, IBM had 2701 supporting T1, 70s with SNA/VTAM and issues, links were capped at 56kbit ... and I had to mostly resort to non-IBM hardware). Mid-80s, communication group was also fighting off release of mainframe TCP/IP support and when that failed, they said that since they had corporate responsibility for everything that crossed datacenter walls, it had to be release through them. I then add RFC1044 and in some tuning tests at Cray Research between a Cray and 4341, got sustained 4341 channel throughput using only modest amount of 4341 CPU (something like 500 times improvement in bytes moved per instruction executed). HSDT also was working with NSF director and was suppose to get $20M to interconnect the NSF Supercomputer centers. NSF gave grant to Univ. Cal to build Berkeley supercomputer center and I was asked to give them talks on the interconnect. Turns out regents had san diego getting the next new bldg ... and it became the San Diego Supercomputer center instead. Then congress cuts the budget, some other things happened and eventually there was RFP released (in part based on what we already had running). NSF 28Mar1986 Preliminary Announcement: https://web.archive.org/web/20260311074443/https://www.garlic.com/~lynn/2002k.html#12 The OASC has initiated three programs: The Supercomputer Centers Program to provide Supercomputer cycles; the New Technologies Program to foster new supercomputer software and hardware developments; and the Networking Program to build a National Supercomputer Access Network - NSFnet. IBM internal politics was not allowing us to bid. The NSF director tried to help by writing the company a letter (3Apr1986, NSF Director to IBM Chief Scientist and IBM Senior VP and director of Research, copying IBM CEO) with support from other gov. agencies ... but that just made the internal politics worse (as did claims that what we already had operational was at least 5yrs ahead of the winning bid), as regional networks connect in, NSFnet becomes the NSFNET backbone, precursor to modern internet ... aka NCSA ... grant for new "supercomputer software" https://www.ncsa.illinois.edu/ -- virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
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| From | Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 21:31 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <11cqpn5$nfgo$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95349 |
On Sun, 8 Nov 2026 05:59:55 -0800, Lars Poulsen wrote: > ... from which I learned that Stratus and Tandem both had figured > out how to do rolling upgrades in a non-stop environment; I had > thought that was an IBM mainframe invention. The IBM mega-marketing machine strikes again. Or past tense, really; IBM no longer has that power. Microsoft inherited that mantle, but it, too, is losing its grip. > Many techies despise System/Z as an overpriced dinosaur with an > obsolete architechture. But I wonder if it is any less expensive to > dip the Intel processors in that magic sauce. I bet IBM has better > scale to their builds. There was a paper on how Google did it, published 10 or 20 years ago. At that point, they had a total complement of about 460,000 x86 servers. They would buy the cheapest component they could for every component but one: the power supply. With that kind of scale, who cares if 100 or 1000 machines are broken at any moment? The users certainly won’t notice. Mainframes stopped being relevant back in the 1980s; every further development since then has just been driven by customer inertia.
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| From | Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 13:45 -0800 |
| Subject | Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <11cqqh2$ntcu$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95358 |
On 11/8/2026 13:31, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > There was a paper on how Google did it, published 10 or 20 years ago. > At that point, they had a total complement of about 460,000 x86 > servers. They would buy the cheapest component they could for every > component but one: the power supply. > > With that kind of scale, who cares if 100 or 1000 machines are broken > at any moment? The users certainly won’t notice. The parallelism of a Google is a very different beast from the robust parallelism of a banking mainframe. Google needs a way to route an incoming connection to a random running server instance. It does not matter which one, and if the one that was picked has died, the first packet retry will get to a better one. That is very different from transactions that must execute exactly once. > Mainframes stopped being relevant back in the 1980s; every further > development since then has just been driven by customer inertia. If we define mainframes a large, very robust systems, they are still very relevant. Although it may be true that the major technology was in place before 1990 (non-stop cluster systems, transaction locking with completion/rollback and strategic redundancy). What you call customer inertia is also known as vendor lock-in. -- Lars Poulsen - an old geek in Santa Barbara, California
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| From | Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 12:21 -1000 |
| Subject | Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <87ik27arr6.fsf@localhost> |
| In reply to | #95360 |
Lars Poulsen <lars@beagle-ears.com> writes:
> If we define mainframes a large, very robust systems, they are still
> very relevant. Although it may be true that the major technology was
> in place before 1990 (non-stop cluster systems, transaction locking
> with completion/rollback and strategic redundancy). What you call
> customer inertia is also known as vendor lock-in.
trivia, after early 70s "Future System"
http://www.jfsowa.com/computer/memo125.htm
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_Future_Systems_project
https://people.computing.clemson.edu/~mark/fs.html
imploded, head of POK was convincing corporate to kill the VM370
product, shutdown the development group and transfer all the people to
POK for MVS/XA. Endicott eventually acquires VM370 responsibility (for
the mid-range), but has to recreate a development group from scratch. I
get asked to help with a 16-CPU 370 and we con the 3033 processor
engineers into helping in their spare time (a lot more interesting that
remapping 168 logic to 20% faster chips). Everybody thought it was great
until somebody tells the head of POK that it could be decades POK's
favorite son operating system ("MVS") had effective 16-CPU (MVS
documents were claiming that MVS 2-CPU support only had 1.2-1.5 times
the throughput of single CPU, because of high multiprocessor support
overhead, POK doesn't ship a 16-CPU system until after the turn of the
century). Head of POK then invites some of us to never visit POK again
and directs the 3033 processor engineers, "heads down and no
distractions".
About the same time, Endicott talks me into helping with ECPS for the
138/148 (also used with 4331/4341), identify highest executed 6kbytes of
VM370 kernel execution for re-implementing directly in machine microcode
(at 10:1 performance increase, mid-range 370s were avg. 10 native
instructions for every 370 instruction). Archived post with initial
analysis, 6kbytes accounted for 79.55% of kernel execution:
https://web.archive.org/web/20260416141952/https://www.garlic.com/~lynn/94.html#21
After being invited to never visit POK again, I transfer out to IBM San
Jose Research on the west coast and worked with Jim Gray and Vera Watson
on the original SQL/relational RDBMS, System/R. After Jim Gray left IBM
SJR for Tandem (fall1980), he did studies of system availability and
outages. He was finding that hardware was becoming much more reliable
and outages were shifting to environmental (floods, earthquakes, storms,
etc) and people mistakes, needing redundant systems at geographically
separated distances.
https://courses.cs.duke.edu/spring11/cps210/papers/Gray_computers_stop.pdf
https://web.archive.org/web/20260219063547/https://www.garlic.com/~lynn/grayft84.pdf
As Jim was leaving, he was foisting off stuff on me including BofA;
Research had System/R joint study with BofA and they ordered 60 VM4341s
for System/R. Some amount of resistance from STL, IMS and next great
DBMS "EAGLE". Was able to do tech transfer to Endicott (under the radar
while company was pre-occupied with "EAGLE") for SQL/DS. Then when
"EAGLE" implodes there was request how fast could System/R be ported to
MVS, eventually released as "DB2" (originally for decision support
only).
Also when 1st transfer to west coast, I got to wander around silicon
valley datacenters (and consolidated HONE was just up the road),
including disk bldg14/engineering and bldg15/product test across the
street. They had been doing 7/24, prescheduled stand-alone testing and
mentioned that recently they had tried MVS, but it had 15min MTBF (in
that environment, requiring manual re-ipl). I offer to rewrite I/O
Supervisor, making it bullet proof and never fail allowing any amount of
ondemand, concurrent testing (greatly improving productivity). I then do
an internal research report "I/O Reliability Enhancement" and happen to
mention MVS 15min MTBF, bringing down the wrath of the MVS organization
on my head.
Bldg15 gets the 1st engineering 3033 outside POK 3033 processor
engineering (trivia: after 3033s started shipping, 3033 processor
engineers start on trout/3090). Testing was only percent or two of CPU,
so we scrounge up a 3830 controller and 3330 string and setup our own
private online service. Summer 1978, bldg15 also gets engineering
E5/4341 (year before 1st customer ship). Jan1979, branch office hears
about it and cons me into doing (CDC6600 Fortran) benchmark for national
lab that was looking at getting 70 VM4341s for compute farm (sort of
leading edge of the coming cluster supercomputer tsunami). Spring 1979,
some USAFDC (in the Pentagon) wanted to come by to talk to me about 20
VM4341 systems, visit kept being delayed, by the time they came by (six
months later), it had grown from 20 to 210. Also saw large corporations
ordering hundreds of VM4341s at a time for installing out in
departmental areas (sort of the leading edge of the coming distributed
computing tsunami). VM4341s also contributed to HONE system popping up
all over the world (and inside IBM, departmental conference rooms
becomes scarce, so many converted to VM4341 rooms).
--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
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| From | Lawrence D’Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 23:51 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <11cr1ub$q796$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95360 |
On Sun, 8 Nov 2026 13:45:03 -0800, Lars Poulsen wrote: > On 11/8/2026 13:31, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: >> >> There was a paper on how Google did it, published 10 or 20 years >> ago. At that point, they had a total complement of about 460,000 >> x86 servers. They would buy the cheapest component they could for >> every component but one: the power supply. >> >> With that kind of scale, who cares if 100 or 1000 machines are >> broken at any moment? The users certainly won’t notice. > > The parallelism of a Google is a very different beast from the > robust parallelism of a banking mainframe. Mainframes have never been that “robust”. You’ve mentioned elsewhere learning about Stratus and Tandem, who took robustness to a new level back in the 1980s, beyond anything the mainframe world could match. Think of that kind of redundancy multiplied tenfold, a hundredfold, a thousandfold, all built on open-source technologies: that’s the kind of world we live in today. > That is very different from transactions that must execute exactly > once. That technology is pretty commonplace nowadays <https://kafka.apache.org/44/getting-started/introduction/>. >> Mainframes stopped being relevant back in the 1980s; every further >> development since then has just been driven by customer inertia. > > If we define mainframes a large, very robust systems, they are still > very relevant. That’s kind of a circular definition though, isn’t it. I’ll stick with the traditional definition: one which maximized I/O bandwidth over minimizing latency, batch operation efficiency over interactive responsiveness. That was very much IBM’s core business, and the obsolescence of that market directly correlates with IBM dwindling to a shadow of its former self.
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| From | Peter Flass <Peter@Iron-Spring.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 20:33 -0700 |
| Subject | Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <11creup$trgi$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #95363 |
On 11/8/26 16:51, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: > On Sun, 8 Nov 2026 13:45:03 -0800, Lars Poulsen wrote: > >> On 11/8/2026 13:31, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: >>> >>> There was a paper on how Google did it, published 10 or 20 years >>> ago. At that point, they had a total complement of about 460,000 >>> x86 servers. They would buy the cheapest component they could for >>> every component but one: the power supply. >>> >>> With that kind of scale, who cares if 100 or 1000 machines are >>> broken at any moment? The users certainly won’t notice. >> >> The parallelism of a Google is a very different beast from the >> robust parallelism of a banking mainframe. > > Mainframes have never been that “robust”. You’ve mentioned elsewhere > learning about Stratus and Tandem, who took robustness to a new level > back in the 1980s, beyond anything the mainframe world could match. > Think of that kind of redundancy multiplied tenfold, a hundredfold, a > thousandfold, all built on open-source technologies: that’s the kind > of world we live in today. > Mainframes typically achieve an uptime percentage between 99.999% (five nines) and 99.9999999% (nine nines)
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| From | c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-08 22:59 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <mdednVFy4dK82Gz3nZ2dnZfqnPidnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #95374 |
On 11/8/26 22:33, Peter Flass wrote: > On 11/8/26 16:51, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: >> On Sun, 8 Nov 2026 13:45:03 -0800, Lars Poulsen wrote: >> >>> On 11/8/2026 13:31, Lawrence D’Oliveiro wrote: >>>> >>>> There was a paper on how Google did it, published 10 or 20 years >>>> ago. At that point, they had a total complement of about 460,000 >>>> x86 servers. They would buy the cheapest component they could for >>>> every component but one: the power supply. >>>> >>>> With that kind of scale, who cares if 100 or 1000 machines are >>>> broken at any moment? The users certainly won’t notice. >>> >>> The parallelism of a Google is a very different beast from the >>> robust parallelism of a banking mainframe. >> >> Mainframes have never been that “robust”. You’ve mentioned elsewhere >> learning about Stratus and Tandem, who took robustness to a new level >> back in the 1980s, beyond anything the mainframe world could match. >> Think of that kind of redundancy multiplied tenfold, a hundredfold, a >> thousandfold, all built on open-source technologies: that’s the kind >> of world we live in today. >> > > Mainframes typically achieve an uptime percentage between 99.999% (five > nines) and 99.9999999% (nine nines) They ARE very very very good ! Noted in this group though - I/O arch diffs between mainframes and minis. Will someone try to elaborate ? Started off on a "mini" - PDP-11 - with a PDP-8 kinda in the background (but wasn't really allowed to use it for anything). This I/O diff, didn't NOTICE it, but was likely there. Long-after insights would be interesting.
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| From | Lynn Wheeler <lynn@garlic.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-09 07:32 -1000 |
| Subject | Re: NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <87y0b1oqqu.fsf@localhost> |
| In reply to | #95377 |
c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> writes:
> Noted in this group though - I/O arch diffs between
> mainframes and minis.
previously posted, 1988, ibm branch office asked me if I could help LLNL
with standardization of some serial stuff they had been working with,
which quickly becomes fibre-channel standard ("FCS", including some
stuff I had done in the 80s, initially 1gbit transfer, full-duplex,
aggregate 200mbytes/sec).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fibre_Channel
then IBM releases some serial stuff they had been working with for
nearly a decade (when it is already obsolete) as ESCON (initially
10mbytes/sec). Then some IBM engineers get involved with FCS and define
a heavy-weight protocol that radically reduced native throughput
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FICON
Latest public benchmark I've found is 2010 z196 "Peak I/O" getting 2M
IOPS using 104 FICON (20K IOPS/FICON). About the same time a native FCS
is announced for E5-2600 server blades getting over million IOPS (two
such FCS higher throughput than 104 FICON running over FCS). Note IBM
docs has SAPs (system assist processors that now do the actual I/O) CPU
be kept to 70% ... or 1.5M IOPS ... also no CKD DASD have been made for
decades (just simulated with industry standard fixed-block devices).
This "Evolution of the System z Channel" (SHARE 2011 presentation at
wayback machine)
https://web.archive.org/web/20170829213251/https://share.confex.com/share/117/webprogram/Handout/Session9931/9934pdhj%20v0.pdf
talks about after 2010 z196 "Peak I/O" benchmark and "zHPF" that
increased throughput from 20K IOPS/FICON to 52K IOPS/FICON then to 92K
IOPS/FICON (aka from 1/50th to almost 1/10th the native FCS announced in
2010).
--
virtualization experience starting Jan1968, online at home since Mar1970
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| From | John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-09 21:20 +0000 |
| Subject | Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <11ctde2$2ibp$1@gal.iecc.com> |
| In reply to | #95377 |
According to c186282 <c186282@nnada.net>: > Noted in this group though - I/O arch diffs between > mainframes and minis. > > Will someone try to elaborate ? The classic difference is that mainframes have channels, so the processor sets up a bunch of work for the channel to do, the channel goes off and does it independently of the CPU. Minis had much less complex I/O controllers so they do more detailed stuff. An example I gave a few messages back was for a card reader. A mainframe starts a channel program, it reads in a card or maybe seveal cards, and reports back with an interrupt. On a mini there was an I/O operation to start the card reader, an interrupt for each column and an I/O to read it, and then something at the end to stop the reader or go to the next card. But that was 40 or 50 years ago. These days even cheap generic disk controllers do more than channels did in the 1960s, e.g., keep a queue of requests and schedule them to minimize delay, and handle spare block replacement for bad blocks. Modern mainframes have extremely capable channels but the distinction is more about reliability and things like hardware and software upgrades in place without rebooting. -- Regards, John Levine, johnl@taugh.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
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| From | c186282 <c186282@nnada.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2026-11-09 22:07 -0500 |
| Subject | Re: what's a mainframe, NYT and Stratus (Re: [OT] Dead DEC Punch card times) |
| Message-ID | <5O-dnQvUAMIEF2_3nZ2dnZfqn_SdnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #95393 |
On 11/9/26 16:20, John Levine wrote: > According to c186282 <c186282@nnada.net>: >> Noted in this group though - I/O arch diffs between >> mainframes and minis. >> >> Will someone try to elaborate ? > > The classic difference is that mainframes have channels, so the > processor sets up a bunch of work for the channel to do, the channel > goes off and does it independently of the CPU. Minis had much less > complex I/O controllers so they do more detailed stuff. An example I > gave a few messages back was for a card reader. A mainframe starts a > channel program, it reads in a card or maybe seveal cards, and reports > back with an interrupt. On a mini there was an I/O operation to start > the card reader, an interrupt for each column and an I/O to read it, > and then something at the end to stop the reader or go to the next > card. > > But that was 40 or 50 years ago. These days even cheap generic disk > controllers do more than channels did in the 1960s, e.g., keep a queue > of requests and schedule them to minimize delay, and handle spare block > replacement for bad blocks. > > Modern mainframes have extremely capable channels but the distinction is > more about reliability and things like hardware and software upgrades in > place without rebooting. Ok ... so 'mainframes' as you saw them were more 'directors' for distributed processing rather than THE processor.
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