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Groups > comp.os.linux.misc > #32855 > unrolled thread
| Started by | SixOverFive <hae274b.net> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2021-08-26 00:34 -0400 |
| Last post | 2021-09-03 02:37 -0400 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 114 — 27 participants |
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HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274b.net> - 2021-08-26 00:34 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Eli the Bearded <*@eli.users.panix.com> - 2021-08-26 05:05 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274b.net> - 2021-08-26 20:57 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-27 02:12 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-31 02:43 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-31 09:28 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-01 00:13 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-01 08:52 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-05 20:29 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-06 08:49 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-09-01 04:21 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox jak <nospam@please.ty> - 2021-09-09 21:56 +0200
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-26 10:03 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274b.net> - 2021-08-26 20:36 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-27 02:08 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-29 01:32 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-08-26 12:26 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2021-08-26 19:49 +0300
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274b.net> - 2021-08-26 21:06 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-27 02:58 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-08-27 13:22 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> - 2021-08-27 11:26 -0700
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-28 01:22 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-28 09:53 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-29 02:08 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-08-28 12:11 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-29 01:08 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-08-29 04:01 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-29 23:32 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-08-30 00:51 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-30 00:06 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-08-30 14:03 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-31 01:25 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-09-01 04:21 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-04 01:37 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-28 09:40 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-08-28 12:20 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Allodoxaphobia <trepidation@example.net> - 2021-08-29 00:55 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-31 01:58 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-08-31 06:16 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-31 23:47 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-09-01 07:52 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Roger Blake <rogblake@iname.invalid> - 2021-09-02 01:49 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox pH <wNOSPAMp@gmail.org> - 2021-09-02 02:39 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-02 01:29 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-02 01:10 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-09-02 14:51 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Bobbie Sellers <bliss@mouse-potato.com> - 2021-09-02 13:25 -0700
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-09-02 21:24 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-03 03:38 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-03 09:14 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-04 01:01 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-09-03 12:13 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-04 01:16 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-03 03:19 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2021-09-03 14:00 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-09-03 17:44 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-09-03 14:11 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-09-03 19:53 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Peter Flass <peter_flass@yahoo.com> - 2021-09-03 13:59 -0700
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-09-03 20:18 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-05 02:14 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-05 09:47 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox drb@ihatespam.msu.edu (Dennis Boone) - 2021-09-05 10:00 -0500
Re: real programmers, was HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-09-05 22:16 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org> - 2021-09-05 12:05 -0400
Re: fine old languages, HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox John Levine <johnl@taugh.com> - 2021-09-05 22:20 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-05 23:00 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-09-07 20:12 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Dan Espen <dan1espen@gmail.com> - 2021-09-07 16:27 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-09-07 18:30 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-09-08 00:17 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-06 08:50 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox "David W. Hodgins" <dwhodgins@nomail.afraid.org> - 2021-09-06 11:16 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Rich Alderson <news@alderson.users.panix.com> - 2021-09-06 15:04 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Jerry Peters <jerry@example.invalid> - 2021-09-09 02:04 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-05 01:40 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-05 09:38 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-09-05 10:49 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-05 11:22 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-09-05 11:31 +0100
OT : Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> - 2021-09-05 11:38 +0100
Re: OT : Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-05 12:15 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-09-07 20:12 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-09-07 22:05 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> - 2021-09-05 10:13 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-09-05 09:50 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-05 20:18 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> - 2021-09-05 22:38 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> - 2021-09-06 08:53 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-09-05 12:22 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox usenet@only.tnx (Questor) - 2021-09-03 19:34 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> - 2021-09-03 19:57 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Anssi Saari <as@sci.fi> - 2021-09-03 08:27 +0300
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-05 01:03 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Anssi Saari <as@sci.fi> - 2021-09-05 15:25 +0300
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-05 14:03 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2021-09-05 19:27 +0300
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-05 20:14 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-06 00:53 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-09-06 08:58 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> - 2021-09-06 12:36 +0300
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-28 00:44 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-26 17:51 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-28 01:48 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-28 10:16 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-08-29 00:21 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Aragorn <thorongil@telenet.be> - 2021-08-26 19:53 +0200
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274b.net> - 2021-08-26 20:33 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-08-27 02:01 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2021-08-27 04:40 +0100
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-02 00:15 -0400
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> - 2021-09-02 06:02 +0000
Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox SixOverFive <hae274c.net> - 2021-09-03 02:37 -0400
Page 5 of 6 — ← Prev page 1 2 3 4 [5] 6 Next page →
| From | gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 11:31 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <sh269v$57s$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #33125 |
On 05/09/2021 11:22, The Natural Philosopher wrote: > On 05/09/2021 10:49, Ahem A Rivet's Shot wrote: >> On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 09:38:56 +0100 >> The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: >> >>> On 05/09/2021 06:40, SixOverFive wrote: >>>> Often, laziness was the Mother >>>> Of All Invention - "This SUCKS ... how can I make >>>> it easier/better ?". >>> >>> Which was pretty much Linus' attitude, and the rest, is history >> >> More like Stallman's and before that a certain group at Berkeley >> and before that a handful of people at Bell and before that ... >> >> It's giant's shoulders all the way down, all stacked up like a >> circus pyramid. >> > And then you get Computer Scientists, and their attitude is 'this is too > easy/simple, how can we make it more complicated?' > AIUI, you failed your Computer Science PhD assessment if you used, "very" instead of, "highly".
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| From | gareth evans <headstone255@yahoo.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 11:38 +0100 |
| Subject | OT : Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox |
| Message-ID | <sh26nn$926$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #33126 |
On 05/09/2021 11:31, gareth evans wrote: > > AIUI, you failed your Computer Science PhD assessment if you used, > "very" instead of, "highly". Sorry, an afterthought ... I thought that to get a PhD you had to either invent something or else discover something previously unfathomable but the plague of PhDs awarded these days do not seem to be accompanied by widespread increases of knowledge or developments in technology.
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 12:15 +0100 |
| Subject | Re: OT : Re: HA - Found a CP/M-86 image and C compiler for VBox |
| Message-ID | <sh28sc$mm7$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #33127 |
On 05/09/2021 11:38, gareth evans wrote: > On 05/09/2021 11:31, gareth evans wrote: >> >> AIUI, you failed your Computer Science PhD assessment if you used, >> "very" instead of, "highly". > > Sorry, an afterthought ... I thought that to get a PhD you had to > either invent something or else discover something previously > unfathomable but the plague of PhDs awarded these days do not > seem to be accompanied by widespread increases of knowledge > or developments in technology. > > No, you just have to write some impenetrable gobbledygook and get a chum to peer review it. "The influence of Patriarchal Modality on the development of unconscious homophobia in the Victorian institution' etc etc Clever people strive to make difficult stuff easy to understand. Not so clever people strive to make simple stuff more complicated so only they can understand it, and thus preserve their status and their careers As a wonderful example of prime communist blatherskite Eric Hobsbawn is the go-to idiot “The test of a progressive policy is not private but public, not just rising income and consumption for individuals, but widening the opportunities and what Amartya Sen calls the 'capabilities' of all through collective action. But that means, it must mean, public non-profit initiative, even if only in redistributing private accumulation. Public decisions aimed at collective social improvement from which all human lives should gain. That is the basis of progressive policy—not maximising economic growth and personal incomes. Nowhere will this be more important than in tackling the greatest problem facing us this century, the environmental crisis. Whatever ideological logo we choose for it, it will mean a major shift away from the free market and towards public action, a bigger shift than the British government has yet envisaged. And, given the acuteness of the economic crisis, probably a fairly rapid shift. Time is not on our side.” ― Eric Hobsbawm Contrast Scruton “When, in the works of Lacan, Deleuze and Althusser, the nonsense machine began to crank out its impenetrable sentences, of which nothing could be understood except that they all had “capitalism” as their target, it looked as though Nothing had at last found its voice.” ― Roger Scruton, Thinkers Of The New Left “The greatest task on the right, therefore, is to rescue the language of politics: to put within our grasp what has been forcibly removed from it by jargon.” ― Roger Scruton, Fools, Frauds and Firebrands: Thinkers of the New Left -- WOKE is an acronym... Without Originality, Knowledge or Education.
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| From | Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-07 20:12 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <6JPZI.75217$rl3.72796@fx45.iad> |
| In reply to | #33123 |
On 2021-09-05, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: > On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 09:38:56 +0100 > The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: > >> On 05/09/2021 06:40, SixOverFive wrote: >> >>> Often, laziness was the Mother >>> Of All Invention - "This SUCKS ... how can I make >>> it easier/better ?". >> >> Which was pretty much Linus' attitude, and the rest, is history > > More like Stallman's and before that a certain group at Berkeley > and before that a handful of people at Bell and before that ... > > It's giant's shoulders all the way down, all stacked up like a > circus pyramid. With Bill Gates hacking away at the bottom... -- /~\ Charlie Gibbs | They don't understand Microsoft \ / <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> | has stolen their car and parked X I'm really at ac.dekanfrus | a taxi in their driveway. / \ if you read it the right way. | -- Mayayana
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| From | Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-07 22:05 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <20210907220556.3525621f4abf5d537325ff6c@eircom.net> |
| In reply to | #33176 |
On Tue, 07 Sep 2021 20:12:50 GMT Charlie Gibbs <cgibbs@kltpzyxm.invalid> wrote: > On 2021-09-05, Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> wrote: > > > On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 09:38:56 +0100 > > The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: > > > >> On 05/09/2021 06:40, SixOverFive wrote: > >> > >>> Often, laziness was the Mother > >>> Of All Invention - "This SUCKS ... how can I make > >>> it easier/better ?". > >> > >> Which was pretty much Linus' attitude, and the rest, is history > > > > More like Stallman's and before that a certain group at Berkeley > > and before that a handful of people at Bell and before that ... > > > > It's giant's shoulders all the way down, all stacked up like a > > circus pyramid. > > With Bill Gates hacking away at the bottom... Somewhere in the middle with Ken Dodd's tickling stick I think. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| From | Stéphane CARPENTIER <sc@fiat-linux.fr> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 10:13 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrnsj962d.2im.sc@scarpet42p.localdomain> |
| In reply to | #33121 |
Le 05-09-2021, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> a écrit : > On 05/09/2021 06:40, SixOverFive wrote: >> Often, laziness was the Mother >> Of All Invention - "This SUCKS ... how can I make >> it easier/better ?". > > Which was pretty much Linus' attitude, and the rest, is history No, Linus' attitude was more "I want to have fun, do you want to have fun too?" -- Si vous avez du temps à perdre : https://scarpet42.gitlab.io
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| From | J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 09:50 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <ski9jgh2r4071pfe9442c4vf9jpeika377@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #33121 |
On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 09:38:56 +0100, The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: >On 05/09/2021 06:40, SixOverFive wrote: >> Often, laziness was the Mother >> Of All Invention - "This SUCKS ... how can I make >> it easier/better ?". > >Which was pretty much Linus' attitude, and the rest, is history Works for me. The two that go with it are that "it is easier to gain forgiveness than permission" and "initiative is when you did something you weren't supposed to do and it turned out good". Much of my work is boring and annoying. When I get annoyed I automate whatever is annoying me.
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| From | SixOverFive <hae274c.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 20:18 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <HMadnfssXejbw6j8nZ2dnUU7-XvNnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #33133 |
On 9/5/21 9:50 AM, J. Clarke wrote: > On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 09:38:56 +0100, The Natural Philosopher > <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: > >> On 05/09/2021 06:40, SixOverFive wrote: >>> Often, laziness was the Mother >>> Of All Invention - "This SUCKS ... how can I make >>> it easier/better ?". >> >> Which was pretty much Linus' attitude, and the rest, is history. I think Linus was also too broke to buy UNIX :-) So, BUILD YOUR OWN. > > Works for me. The two that go with it are that "it is easier to gain > forgiveness than permission" and "initiative is when you did something > you weren't supposed to do and it turned out good". > > Much of my work is boring and annoying. When I get annoyed I automate > whatever is annoying me. The only way to stay sane. Often the automation work is MUCH more interesting than whatever project you're automating :-)
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| From | J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 22:38 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <64vajglp0aas4clfbl1tb70sst6tflanop@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #33146 |
On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 20:18:08 -0400, SixOverFive <hae274c.net> wrote: >On 9/5/21 9:50 AM, J. Clarke wrote: >> On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 09:38:56 +0100, The Natural Philosopher >> <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: >> >>> On 05/09/2021 06:40, SixOverFive wrote: >>>> Often, laziness was the Mother >>>> Of All Invention - "This SUCKS ... how can I make >>>> it easier/better ?". >>> >>> Which was pretty much Linus' attitude, and the rest, is history. > > I think Linus was also too broke to buy UNIX :-) > > So, BUILD YOUR OWN. I understand it started out making some improvements on Minix, and he improved right into a full blown Unix workalike. >> Works for me. The two that go with it are that "it is easier to gain >> forgiveness than permission" and "initiative is when you did something >> you weren't supposed to do and it turned out good". >> >> Much of my work is boring and annoying. When I get annoyed I automate >> whatever is annoying me. > > The only way to stay sane. Often the automation work > is MUCH more interesting than whatever project you're > automating :-)
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| From | Ahem A Rivet's Shot <steveo@eircom.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-06 08:53 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <20210906085351.c987b6df38955266867d6088@eircom.net> |
| In reply to | #33148 |
On Sun, 05 Sep 2021 22:38:57 -0400 J. Clarke <jclarke.873638@gmail.com> wrote: > On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 20:18:08 -0400, SixOverFive <hae274c.net> wrote: > > >On 9/5/21 9:50 AM, J. Clarke wrote: > >> On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 09:38:56 +0100, The Natural Philosopher > >> <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote: > >> > >>> On 05/09/2021 06:40, SixOverFive wrote: > >>>> Often, laziness was the Mother > >>>> Of All Invention - "This SUCKS ... how can I make > >>>> it easier/better ?". > >>> > >>> Which was pretty much Linus' attitude, and the rest, is history. > > > > I think Linus was also too broke to buy UNIX :-) > > > > So, BUILD YOUR OWN. > > I understand it started out making some improvements on Minix, and he > improved right into a full blown Unix workalike. The earliest story of the origin I read (sometime before 1.0) was that he started with a clever idea for a more efficient context switch, developed it under Minix and built out from there picking up fellow travellers along the way to help round it out into enough of a unix kernel clone to run GNU tools. The first working code was said to be two processes one printing As the other Bs. -- Steve O'Hara-Smith | Directable Mirror Arrays C:\>WIN | A better way to focus the sun The computer obeys and wins. | licences available see You lose and Bill collects. | http://www.sohara.org/
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| From | Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 12:22 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <87lf4bouvr.fsf@usenet.ankman.de> |
| In reply to | #33115 |
On Sun, 5 Sep 2021 01:40:06 -0400, SixOverFive <hae274c.net> wrote: > > On 9/3/21 2:11 PM, J. Clarke wrote: > >> Some professors are like that. I remember helping an undergrad find >> the keypunch (I was a computer science grad student and I didn't even >> know the school _had_ a keypunch or card reader until that came up). >> Seems he was taking a programming course from somebody in the >> chemistry department and that idiot insisted that his students use >> cards because that's what they'd be working with in the real world. I >> ended up having to go dig up an operator. > > > PART of the problem is that the computer world was > evolving SO fast back then. What was State Of The > Art one year was Obsolete Crap the next. I think that is only true until the mid 80s. From 1971 to around 1984 the address/data bus size of a (microprocessor based) CPU doubled several times to 32-Bit. Since around 2000 mainstream hardware is stuck at 64-bit. Today it's more RAM, faster CPU, more RAM, faster CPU... - how boring. That should only change once Quantum-Computing becomes mainstream. -- Andreas
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| From | usenet@only.tnx (Questor) |
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| Date | 2021-09-03 19:34 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <613275fc.6589905@news.dslextreme.com> |
| In reply to | #33076 |
On Fri, 3 Sep 2021 03:19:54 -0400, SixOverFive <hae274c.net> wrote: >But I did mostly miss the mainframe/mini days ... >only had to use punchcards/paper-tape ONCE in a >college class (which I dropped out of because >the school already had serial terminals that'd >do all that PLUS). The class was years behind >the reality I'm glad I had the opportunity to have some first-hand experience with the "submit a deck of punched cards" model of computing in college. I'm even gladder that timewharing was an option and I didn't have to use punched cards very long. I also used paper tape as one of the boot loaders for a DEC KI-10. I'm thankful I got to use those things and get my feet wet, so to speak, in that part of computing history. It's even better that those experiences were peripheral, not central, to my computing activities.
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| From | Andreas Kohlbach <ank@spamfence.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-03 19:57 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <87bl59qkjz.fsf@usenet.ankman.de> |
| In reply to | #33076 |
On Fri, 3 Sep 2021 03:19:54 -0400, SixOverFive <hae274c.net> wrote: > > On 9/2/21 2:51 PM, Andreas Kohlbach wrote: > >> I F'up this into the folklore group. Cannot remember seen you there. You >> might enjoy it. > > Having LIVED a lot of this "folklore" it doesn't seem > like nostalgic "lore" to me ..... We're talking nostalgia/folklore, but not (or just as side note) about Linux in recent articles... So I set the F'up. -- Andreas
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| From | Anssi Saari <as@sci.fi> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-03 08:27 +0300 |
| Message-ID | <sm0lf4etehs.fsf@lakka.kapsi.fi> |
| In reply to | #33061 |
SixOverFive <hae274c.net> writes: > I will still claim credit (surely unwarranted) for the Java > idea. That was back in the dial-up BBS days. They were all > text based and I said it might be nice to write TexTronic > graphic terminal emulators for the common machines and > export content in a format ALL could translate into nice > graphical displays. Why, you might even be able to see > PICTURES live in the posts !!! I don't know what Java has to do with that but in a way it has become reality as some terminal emulators these days support DEC's old sixel graphics. These are bitmap graphics. Some apps support it too, so for example you can use gnuplot to plot graphics right in the terminal if you like. Not a solution for 300 baud though.
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| From | SixOverFive <hae274c.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 01:03 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <uvydnTnAkP4o0qn8nZ2dnUU7-aXNnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #33072 |
On 9/3/21 1:27 AM, Anssi Saari wrote: > SixOverFive <hae274c.net> writes: > >> I will still claim credit (surely unwarranted) for the Java >> idea. That was back in the dial-up BBS days. They were all >> text based and I said it might be nice to write TexTronic >> graphic terminal emulators for the common machines and >> export content in a format ALL could translate into nice >> graphical displays. Why, you might even be able to see >> PICTURES live in the posts !!! > > I don't know what Java has to do with that but in a way it has become > reality as some terminal emulators these days support DEC's old sixel > graphics. These are bitmap graphics. Some apps support it too, so for > example you can use gnuplot to plot graphics right in the terminal if > you like. > > Not a solution for 300 baud though. Well, Java is a "virtual machine". You write an interpreter for each platform and then your Java runs on ALL of them. As I recall, the TexTronic terminals were VECTOR graphics, not bitmap. Point(x,y), Line(x1,y1,x2,y2). You really could produce a decent GUI experience at low baud rates. Not quite the modern capability, but we're talking the 1980s here and ANYTHING would have been an improvement.
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| From | Anssi Saari <as@sci.fi> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 15:25 +0300 |
| Message-ID | <sm0y28bryyv.fsf@lakka.kapsi.fi> |
| In reply to | #33114 |
SixOverFive <hae274c.net> writes: > Well, Java is a "virtual machine". You write an > interpreter for each platform and then your Java > runs on ALL of them. Yes, I see the connection now to terminal emulators. Well, it seemed a little unlikely to me Java would have much in the way of originality so I looked around for precedents. The result is, the UCSD p-system was probably the first "write once run anywhere" system. It's from the 1970s. It was actually ported to the usual CPUs of the time, Z80 and 6502 and 68k and 8086 CPUs. It was even a free option for the original IBM PCs apparently and and the Apple II version apparently sold quite a lot for the time.
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| From | The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 14:03 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <sh2f7p$ua1$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #33130 |
On 05/09/2021 13:25, Anssi Saari wrote: > SixOverFive <hae274c.net> writes: > >> Well, Java is a "virtual machine". You write an >> interpreter for each platform and then your Java >> runs on ALL of them. > > Yes, I see the connection now to terminal emulators. Well, it seemed a > little unlikely to me Java would have much in the way of originality so > I looked around for precedents. > > The result is, the UCSD p-system was probably the first "write once run > anywhere" system. It's from the 1970s. It was actually ported to the > usual CPUs of the time, Z80 and 6502 and 68k and 8086 CPUs. It was even > a free option for the original IBM PCs apparently and and the Apple II > version apparently sold quite a lot for the time. > BASIC FORTH All interpreters like P code and from earlier -- Climate is what you expect but weather is what you get. Mark Twain
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| From | Tauno Voipio <tauno.voipio@notused.fi.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 19:27 +0300 |
| Message-ID | <sh2r4n$il2$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #33130 |
On 5.9.21 15.25, Anssi Saari wrote: > SixOverFive <hae274c.net> writes: > >> Well, Java is a "virtual machine". You write an >> interpreter for each platform and then your Java >> runs on ALL of them. > > Yes, I see the connection now to terminal emulators. Well, it seemed a > little unlikely to me Java would have much in the way of originality so > I looked around for precedents. > > The result is, the UCSD p-system was probably the first "write once run > anywhere" system. It's from the 1970s. It was actually ported to the > usual CPUs of the time, Z80 and 6502 and 68k and 8086 CPUs. It was even > a free option for the original IBM PCs apparently and and the Apple II > version apparently sold quite a lot for the time. > The p-code is a bit older. AFAIK, it was first used in the first Pascal compiler system made at the ETH (Eidgenössische Technische Hohscule) in Zurich, by Urs Ammann, Christian Jacobi and Kesav Nori under direction of professor Niklaus Wirth. The UCSD team took it from the Zurich system. -- -TV
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| From | SixOverFive <hae274c.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-05 20:14 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <Equdnaj1K_PywKj8nZ2dnUU7-RPNnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #33138 |
On 9/5/21 12:27 PM, Tauno Voipio wrote: > On 5.9.21 15.25, Anssi Saari wrote: >> SixOverFive <hae274c.net> writes: >> >>> Well, Java is a "virtual machine". You write an >>> interpreter for each platform and then your Java >>> runs on ALL of them. >> >> Yes, I see the connection now to terminal emulators. Well, it seemed a >> little unlikely to me Java would have much in the way of originality so >> I looked around for precedents. >> >> The result is, the UCSD p-system was probably the first "write once run >> anywhere" system. It's from the 1970s. It was actually ported to the >> usual CPUs of the time, Z80 and 6502 and 68k and 8086 CPUs. It was even >> a free option for the original IBM PCs apparently and and the Apple II >> version apparently sold quite a lot for the time. >> > > The p-code is a bit older. AFAIK, it was first used in the first Pascal > compiler system made at the ETH (Eidgenössische Technische Hohscule) in > Zurich, by Urs Ammann, Christian Jacobi and Kesav Nori under direction > of professor Niklaus Wirth. > > The UCSD team took it from the Zurich system. I'm sure the IDEA of "Write once - run it anywhere" went back even before Wirth. However the HARDWARE may not have been up to it. Those VMs/code-interpreters use up memory and storage space. Older computers hardly HAD any memory and "storage" was big reels of mag-tape that was REALLY slow to read/write. In the late 60s I saw a museum exhibit on 'modern tech wonders'. ONE was an IBM system/360 (maybe 370) with a cool "deskset" - yes it was the size of a desk. Next to the CPU box was a shiny box about a meter cube. That was the RAM ... I think it was a whopping 3 kilobytes ! At of least 12x3k ferrite doughnuts strung in a matrix of wires - probably assembled by hand :-)
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| From | SixOverFive <hae274c.net> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2021-09-06 00:53 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <vvidnUqgWuAqA6j8nZ2dnUU7-U_NnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #33138 |
Oh yea, they DID have "hard disks" back in the day. These were 5-10 brownish platters in a pack. You'd open something about the size of a diswasher and stick the pack in, turn the handle to remove the cover. There were squarish reader arms that'd move in and out at an impressively slow speed. Sometimes, because it was hard to tell, people would try to remove the disk packs before they'd finished spinning. You COULD just stick the cover in and yank out the pack. Alas then it became a large heavy TOP that began to precess ... sometimes with enough energy to fling the thing out of your hand :-) MET a guy who pioneered hard disks once. The originals used a vapor-deposited COBALT coating instead of ferrite. As I recall there was still a problem with ferrite coatings and they would either flake off or be too rough. Before that there were DRUMS ... like the original Edison phonographs - except much bigger. The reader/writer would scan back and forth along the drum on a worm screw. And if you want weird ... look up "mercury delay-line memory" :-) Envision a few thousand feet of really thin polythene tube full of mercury spooled up. Mercury is a GOOD conductor, but SLOW conductor. You'd impress your signals at one end, and x-milliseconds later they'd finally arrive at the other end. In the middle was a "repeater" that'd read the older signal and re-send it to the starting end - and you could READ/WRITE said signal while you were repeating it. "Serial memory" the old fashioned way. Millisecond memory seems useless, BUT it was the fastest practical thing in the late 40s and early 50s. The Apollo computers used "rope memory" - HAND assembled. This was basically ferrite-core memory, but assembled on loose wires so you could pack it into a small space. There WERE better solutions in the late 60s ... so I suspect a pork-barrel project ... indeed I seem to remember they were made in Texas - LBJs state :-) The computer era from 1945-1955 is fun reading. Their solutions, with the present tech, were often fascinating. Hmm ... with modern stuff we could probably make serial delay memory out of OPTICAL FIBER. It'd be so fast the CPUs would seem slow by comparison - catch a byte every third or fourth time around. The ultimate chip cache :-) My hopes for the future - basically abandon binary. I think, with modern manufacturing capability, we could make deca-state logic - base 10 - able to cope with voltage levels from 0-9 stably. You don't need 10 transistors to represent 10-bit bytes, just ONE. No, it is not "analog", just the ability to hold a lot more discrete logic states in the same circuitry. The downside with current tech is that transistors/CMOS are only efficient when it's fully OFF or ON ... in all other cases it's a power-eating resistor. They'll have to find ways around that - maybe optronics. I've even heard of all-optical tricks based on interference patterns (I thought of that around 1980 but until now there was no practical way to do it). Oh, and they ARE combining real analog in with binary CPUs .... analog can innately do certain kinds of engineering-relevant "calculations" pretty much instantly, no calculation per-se. Any math that can be represented as a sum of ratios can be done with analog in SERIOUSLY real-time. Just don't take the results through too many analog steps or the errors WILL getcha. So, deca-state speed-of-light moderately-parallelized analog-supplimented CPUs - do-able within the next 10 years. (you don't want TOO much parallelization or you lose speed in "traffic control", still ok for super-specialty stuff like mining bitcoins though). Thing is THAT'S IT ... the end of the Moore's Law. Anything more requires something completely different from "CPUs" that we now imagine. Will the MAX CPUs be enough for real "AI" ??? MAYbe. Barely. Better techniques might decrease the power needed for real, thinking, AI personalities. I still suspect there's a fractal-ish approach. Better start writing AIs into the (quasi-Human) Rights laws. At present, only S.Korea even considered it. Alas humans DO like the idea of "slaves" .... and the AIs will be made to be as "human" as possible because it facilitates what WE want from them. This means they can be oppressed, suffer, and The Laws are NOT going to work because, like any human 2-year-old, they can work around "laws"/"rules" easily. Invent "people" and you have to deal with "people". Messy.
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