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plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut

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  plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Avoid9Pdf@gmail.com - 2013-04-02 14:36 +0000
    Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2013-04-02 15:12 +0000
      Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Avoid9Pdf@gmail.com - 2013-04-03 05:35 +0000
        Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2013-04-03 12:04 +0000
          Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Unknown <dog@gmail.com> - 2013-04-03 17:56 +0000
            Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2013-04-03 18:11 +0000
            Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2013-04-03 20:28 +0000
              Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2013-04-03 23:27 -0400
                Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2013-04-03 21:35 -0700
                  Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Jerry Peters <jerry@example.invalid> - 2013-04-04 20:15 +0000
                Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Walter Bushell <proto@panix.com> - 2013-04-04 08:36 -0400
                  Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2013-04-04 13:59 +0000
                    Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Unknown <dog@gmail.com> - 2013-04-05 07:53 +0000
                      Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2013-04-05 15:50 +0000
                        Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2013-04-05 09:17 -0700
                        Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi Unknown <dog@gmail.com> - 2013-04-05 18:38 +0000
                          Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2013-04-05 19:57 +0100
                            Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi "Nick B." <nick@replytoisnot.invalid> - 2013-04-05 22:12 +0000
                          Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2013-04-05 21:24 +0000
    Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2013-04-02 13:43 -0400
      Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Avoid9Pdf@gmail.com - 2013-04-03 05:35 +0000
        Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2013-04-02 23:02 -0700
          Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Unknown <dog@gmail.com> - 2013-04-04 06:41 +0000
            Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> - 2013-04-04 11:53 +0000
              Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Bobbie Sellers <bliss-sf4ever@dslextreme.com> - 2013-04-04 08:20 -0700
              Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> - 2013-04-04 11:08 -0500
                Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2013-04-04 09:45 -0700
                  Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2013-04-04 13:43 -0400
                  Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> - 2013-04-04 14:43 -0500
                    Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2013-04-04 13:43 -0700
                      Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut JEDIDIAH <jedi@nomad.mishnet> - 2013-04-04 16:28 -0500
                        Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> - 2013-04-04 16:03 -0700
                        Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2013-04-04 21:15 -0400
        Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Dave Higton <dave@davehigton.me.uk> - 2013-04-03 21:23 +0100
          Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Unknown <dog@gmail.com> - 2013-04-04 08:57 +0000
            Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2013-04-04 22:34 +0100
              Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2013-04-04 21:17 -0400
                Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Hils <hils@saynotospam.net> - 2013-04-06 13:17 +0100
                  Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Nick Odell <gurzhfvp.jbexfubc@ntlworld.com.invalid> - 2013-04-06 14:01 +0100
                    Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Hils <hils@saynotospam.net> - 2013-04-06 15:42 +0100
                    Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2013-04-06 15:31 +0000
                      Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2013-04-06 11:51 -0400
                        Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2013-04-06 17:08 +0100
                          Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Folderol <folderol@ukfsn.org> - 2013-04-06 17:27 +0100
                          Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Aragorn <stryder@telenet.be.invalid> - 2013-04-06 18:28 +0200
                            Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2013-04-06 19:54 +0100
                        Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2013-04-06 17:07 +0000
                          Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Hils <hils@saynotospam.net> - 2013-04-06 18:54 +0100
                    Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Chris Baird <abuse@brushtail.apana.org.au> - 2013-04-07 06:10 +1000
                      Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Folderol <folderol@ukfsn.org> - 2013-04-06 22:11 +0100
                        Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Chris Baird <abuse@brushtail.apana.org.au> - 2013-04-07 18:01 +1000
                      Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> - 2013-04-06 20:23 -0400
                        Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Unknown <dog@gmail.com> - 2013-04-07 16:42 +0000
              Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Unknown <dog@gmail.com> - 2013-04-05 06:18 +0000
            Re: plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut Paul <paul@pcserviceselectronics.co.uk> - 2013-04-05 13:38 +0100

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#1662 — plip: StdOut > ttyS0 & ttyS1 > StdOut

The rPi credit-card-sized ARMbased computer which is
already widely distributed, has no facilites to drive VGA.

It has however a GPIO port [?IEE488].
A driver for RS232 would be easy to drive the GPIO port.
I think plip is even simpler, and there's linux info for it.

Would it be viable to:- 
  
  connect the rPi's port to a PC's RS232-port,
  rPi redirect StdOut to ttyS0,
  PC redirect ttyS0 to StdOut ?

This would allow one Terminal of the LinuxPC to show
the rPi's output -- hopefully.

I've got a crossover-cable RS232 to RS232.
Could I test the concept on a PC which has 2 RS232 ports,
with one port simulating the rPi?

== TIA.

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#1663 — Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Tuesday, April 2nd, 2013, 14:36:59 +0000, Chris Glur observed:

> The rPi credit-card-sized ARMbased computer which is
> already widely distributed, has no facilites to drive VGA.

And how were you able to get one of these in a failed state
where you imply that it is near impossible to buy a Linux
oriented magazine?

Was your raspberry Pi delivered by Elephant Express,

  <http://trainweb.ORG/carl/Anaheim/F_2523.jpg>

or more appropriately Tiger Express?  (Get it -- pi, tiger?)

>   connect the rPi's port to a PC's RS232-port

Yes using a null modem cable.

>   rPi redirect StdOut to ttyS0,

No need to do any of this nonsense.

You boot the kernel on the rPi telling it to send its virtual
console output to the serial port.

You then run minicom or equivalent on your PC to get a "terminal"
to connect to the output of the rPi.

There are basic instructions at

<https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/serial-console.txt>

but obviously if you are using grub, you will have to modify
the grub configuration rather than the old lilo configuration
mentioned in this HOW TO document.

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#1666 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

In article <kjesgt$tki$1@dont-email.me>, J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> wrote: 

> On Tuesday, April 2nd, 2013, 14:36:59 +0000, Chris Glur observed:
> 
> > The rPi credit-card-sized ARMbased computer which is
> > already widely distributed, has no facilites to drive VGA.
> 
> And how were you able to get one of these in a failed state
> where you imply that it is near impossible to buy a Linux
> oriented magazine?
> 
Someone imported 2 for me, with his, and is still trying to get a
refund on the faulty 42% import duty; and now my ex says there's
been a mail strike for 4 weeks - she expects mail from Scandinavia.
And what about the legislation [Court rules] where 'times' assume
a working postal system.
Of course you can still get COKE in Haiti, and probably even KFC,
but I don't 'do', FB, twitter, magazines, cartoons ...
> 
> >   connect the rPi's port to a PC's RS232-port
> 
> Yes using a null modem cable.
> 
> >   rPi redirect StdOut to ttyS0,
> 
> No need to do any of this nonsense.
> 
> You boot the kernel on the rPi telling it to send its virtual
> console output to the serial port.

How? I'd edit the SD-card from the SD-reader under the PC.
> 
> You then run minicom or equivalent on your PC to get a "terminal"
> to connect to the output of the rPi.
> 
OK, that's better.

> There are basic instructions at
> 
> <https://www.kernel.org/doc/Documentation/serial-console.txt>
> 
OK, I'll check it.

> but obviously if you are using grub, you will have to modify
> the grub configuration rather than the old lilo configuration
> mentioned in this HOW TO document.

That sounds bad. I don't want to involve grub and especially 
not LILO.

== Thanks.

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#1670 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Wednesday, April 3rd, 2013, at 05:35:29h +0000, Chris Glur wrote:

> Of course you can still get COKE in Haiti, and probably even KFC,

Have you emigrated to Haiti now?  ;)

> but I don't 'do', FB, twitter, magazines, cartoons ...

Nobody is trying to persuade you to do FB or join the Twitterati.

But even the AWB have an FB page!

> How? I'd edit the SD-card from the SD-reader under the PC.

Rather than go that route, why do you not telnet in to the
the running rPi or if you have a monitor or TV with HDMI input
then use that as a temporary display?  Or maybe you do not
have keyboard and mouse connected to the rPi?

> That sounds bad. I don't want to involve grub and especially 
> not LILO.

Well thinking about it, my mistake in mentioning that since neither
are probably involved because it is an "embedded" Arm type system.

You are going to have to find out how to change the kernel boot command
line parameters and save them to the system's bootloader.

A simple web search (do you know how to use your favorite web search engine?)
reveals that changing the boot command line parameters is remarkably simple --

     <http://www.raspberrypi.ORG/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=36028&p=323262>

I would suggest that posting to your questions about rPi on that forum
will lead to more informed and more timely responses than from those of
us who do not have an rPi.

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#1671 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Wed, 03 Apr 2013 12:04:43 +0000, J G Miller wrote:

==> To display the rPi's output on a terminal of a linux PC.

> On Wednesday, April 3rd, 2013, at 05:35:29h +0000, Chris Glur wrote:
> ......
>> How? I'd edit the SD-card from the SD-reader under the PC.
> 
> Rather than go that route, why do you not telnet in to the the running
> rPi or if you have a monitor or TV with HDMI input then use that as a
> temporary display?  Or maybe you do not have keyboard and mouse
> connected to the rPi?
> 
I've never understood 'telnet into a PC'. But imagine that the sPi would 
then need to be running telnet too. My idea of redirecting the rPi's
StdOut to its limited hardware pins, seems the most primitive/simple.
I hope to use eg. a <serial mouse's cord> to connect to the PC
which would display the rPi's output, possibly via minicom as you 
suggested.  Or plip may be even simpler than RS232.  The work should be 
moved from the rPi to the displaying PC.

>> That sounds bad. I don't want to involve grub and especially not LILO.
> 
> Well thinking about it, my mistake in mentioning that since neither are
> probably involved because it is an "embedded" Arm type system.
> 
> You are going to have to find out how to change the kernel boot command
> line parameters and save them to the system's bootloader.
> 
> A simple web search (do you know how to use your favorite web search
> engine?) reveals that changing the boot command line parameters is
> remarkably simple --
> 
>      <http://www.raspberrypi.ORG/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?t=36028&p=323262>
> 
I'll check that.

> I would suggest that posting to your questions about rPi on that forum
> will lead to more informed and more timely responses than from those of
> us who do not have an rPi.

Perhaps I could write a 1-line shell to to redirect rPi's output, and 
just blindly call it after rPi has assumed to have booted.

Already I have done blind-flying: I modified the fat32-init-file to move 
the display over a bit, and then it was too small to read. But I managed 
to restore it, without a readable display.

===================
Now that rPi is on a adult's forum, perhaps I can get some answers:
 Where's the spec for the GPIO pin-out?
 What are the other 2 apparent 'micro-ribbon-connectors'?
 Is it viable to display rPi's output via the one USBport, on a running
  linux PC's terminal?  Ie. the PC would read the rPi's USBport, and     
   display the text.

== TIA.

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#1672 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

In article <kjhqh7$f3g$1@dont-email.me>, Unknown  <dog@gmail.com> wrote:

>Now that rPi is on a adult's forum, perhaps I can get some answers:
> Where's the spec for the GPIO pin-out?
> What are the other 2 apparent 'micro-ribbon-connectors'?
> Is it viable to display rPi's output via the one USBport, on a running
>  linux PC's terminal?  Ie. the PC would read the rPi's USBport, and     
>   display the text.

What? Seriously? All this information has been available for over a
year now.

Spec for the GPIO pin-out:

http://wiringpi.com/pins/

(amongst other places)

The other 2 connectors - one's camera in (camera available "real soon now",
ones video out (I forget the TLAs for them) Don't expect the video out
port to be working in the near future - use compost & HDMI for now.

You can use the Pi's USB ports with serial adapters, but the on-board UART
by default has the console text output and a getty running on it to login.
(3.3v serial @ 115200 baud - many adapters available now)

-Gordon

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#1674 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Wednesday, April 3rd, 2013, at 17:56:57h +0000, Chris Glur wrote:

> I've never understood 'telnet into a PC'. But imagine that the sPi would 
> then need to be running telnet too.

Well if it is not running telnetd, it will be rather difficult --
I was assuming it was or that you would check to find out, but a
quick web search reveals that often telnetd is available.

Of the security conscious will telnet in, su to root if needed,
and replace the telnetd with openssh and use keys instead of
passwords.

After all, you never know who may be snooping on your network,
maybe even former agents of BOSS, or today's NIA checking for
terrorist activity.

> Perhaps I could write a 1-line shell to to redirect rPi's output, and 
> just blindly call it after rPi has assumed to have booted.

You could.  But it is unlikely to work.

>  Is it viable

No!

> to display rPi's output via the one USBport, on a running
> linux PC's terminal?

How are you going to plug the USB cable from the rPI into the PC?

You have already been given information how to get the output
from the serial port, so what is preventing you from following
that advice?

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#1675 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Wed, 3 Apr 2013, J G Miller wrote:

> On Wednesday, April 3rd, 2013, at 17:56:57h +0000, Chris Glur wrote:
>
>> I've never understood 'telnet into a PC'. But imagine that the sPi would
>> then need to be running telnet too.
>
> Well if it is not running telnetd, it will be rather difficult --
> I was assuming it was or that you would check to find out, but a
> quick web search reveals that often telnetd is available.
>
There's a really important lesson here.

He came in with such a complicated "solution" that it completely 
misdirected me.  I'd forgotten about the ethernet connector (though to be 
fair, the cheaper Pi board doesn't have ethernet).  And since it is meant 
to be networked, surely the variant of Linux for this board can be 
telnetted into.

The misdirection was so strong that none of us have mentioned that there's 
a composite video output, a nice standard RCA phono jack, on the Pi board,
incase someone doesn't have a newer model that does HDMI or VDI.  So the 
board can output video to any old NTSC monitor (one might imagine PAL 
too?)  so long as it has a composite input jack.  That's not even 
necessary, the composite output could feed an RF modulator, just like in 
the old days, which then gets the signal into the tv set via its antenna 
jack.  Hence all the bases are covered.


    Michael

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#1678 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.hardware.]

On 2013-04-04, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:
> There's a really important lesson here.
>
> He came in with such a complicated "solution" that it completely 
> misdirected me.

The OP is trolling, and this is one of his strategies.  He posts a
completely ridiculous suggestion for a made-up problem, completely
disregards all the sensible advice he receives not to do it that way,
then complains that "linux doesn't work right" when he inevitably
doesn't get help for his original ridiculous suggestion.

I think the important lesson here is "ignore the OP".

--keith

-- 
kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
(try just my userid to email me)
AOLSFAQ=http://www.therockgarden.ca/aolsfaq.txt
see X- headers for PGP signature information

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#1689 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

In comp.os.linux.hardware Keith Keller <kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us> wrote:
> ["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.hardware.]
> 
> On 2013-04-04, Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:
>> There's a really important lesson here.
>>
>> He came in with such a complicated "solution" that it completely 
>> misdirected me.
> 
> The OP is trolling, and this is one of his strategies.  He posts a
> completely ridiculous suggestion for a made-up problem, completely
> disregards all the sensible advice he receives not to do it that way,
> then complains that "linux doesn't work right" when he inevitably
> doesn't get help for his original ridiculous suggestion.
> 
> I think the important lesson here is "ignore the OP".
> 
> --keith
> 

Not really trolling IMO, but he *likes* Rube Goldberg sulutions to
what are simple problems.  Also his time must not be of any value,
he's just spent weeks cadging another RG solution from people in
comp.unix.shell to send mail via SMTP to gmail. Seems stunnel was "too
complex" or something.
Now he's doing the same thing here. It'll go one as long as people
keep humoring him. 

	Jerry

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#1682 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

In article 
<alpine.LNX.2.02.1304032323120.32362@darkstar.example.org>,
 Michael Black <et472@ncf.ca> wrote:

> He came in with such a complicated "solution" that it completely 
> misdirected me.  I'd forgotten about the ethernet connector (though to be 
> fair, the cheaper Pi board doesn't have ethernet).  And since it is meant 
> to be networked, surely the variant of Linux for this board can be 
> telnetted into.

There do exist adaptors that take ethernet in and use a USB 
connection. $5.31 at Monoprice when I bought one.

-- 
Gambling with Other People's Money is the meth of the fiscal industry. 
 me -- in the spirit of Karl and Groucho Marx 

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#1683 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Thursday, April 4th, 2013, at 08:36:02h -0400,
Walter Bushell wrote:

> $5.31 at Monoprice when I bought one.

But there are no Monoprice stores out on the veldt.  ;)

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#1698 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Thu, 04 Apr 2013 13:59:21 +0000, J G Miller wrote:

> On Thursday, April 4th, 2013, at 08:36:02h -0400, Walter Bushell wrote:
> 
>> $5.31 at Monoprice when I bought one.
> 
> But there are no Monoprice stores out on the veldt.  ;)

That's what I meant about these FB/twitter-kiddies living in California
next to a Walmart and watching Operah [have they still got that?] who
think all problems can be solved by buying some ding-dong!

I wrongly imagined connecting 3 lines of an old ser-mouse-cable to
rPi header-pins. But now I've REdiscovered that RS232 has 12V, which is
incompatible with rPi. Since par-port is even older, apparently the
ample docos of rPi oficinados doesn't consider that.
Perhaps I should specifically write a thread:
 Can rPi drive PC bidirectional par-port?

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#1702 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Friday, April 5th, 2013, at 07:53:28h +0000, Chris Glur chided:

> That's what I meant about these FB/twitter-kiddies living in California
> next to a Walmart

So you do not live next to a Massmart (51% owned by Walmart) then?  ;)

         <http://www.massmart.co.ZA/>

Incidentally, if it is not considered too impertinent a question,
how close are your nearest neighbors?

> and watching Operah [have they still got that?]

Operatic Oprah left daytime TV and started her own cable TV station "OWN"

      "Oprah Winfrey Network is here and we can't wait to entertain,
       inform and inspire people to live their best lives."

with a tasteful theme in the "color purple"  [get it?]  at

             <http://www.oprah.COM/own>

> who think all problems can be solved by buying some ding-dong!

Just buy the recipe and then you can make your own, or rather get your
house boy/maid to do it for you.

   <http://www.ebay.COM/itm/HOSTESS-DING-DONG-RECIPE-MAKES-36-AUTHENTIC-/330857683512?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item4d08a79a38>

>  Can rPi drive PC bidirectional par-port?

Because you want to connect a bidirectional parallel port printer?

It would appear that you still have not learnt how to use a browser
and an internet search engine (eg DuckDuckGo.com) or are just too
lazy to do the research yourself being used to having the houseboy/maid
doing everything for you?

From <http://www.raspberrypi.ORG/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=7221>

QUOTE

  Gert van Loo » Fri Jun 01, 2012 8:30 pm

  It is simple to change the GPIO pins to behave like a parallel
  printer port. It can do *full bi-directional* data transfer

  (So you can write data as well as read it back. )

UNQUOTE

With such a name, "Gert van Loo", he may well be able to communicate
with you in Afrikaans or at least in standard Nederlands, if you
need further assistance on this topic.

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#1703 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

[Newsgroups: line fixed to reduce trolling]

On 2013-04-05, J G Miller <miller@yoyo.ORG> wrote:
>
> Incidentally, if it is not considered too impertinent a question,
> how close are your nearest neighbors?

If you believe the OP his nearest neighbor is in the next cell over!

--keith

-- 
kkeller-usenet@wombat.san-francisco.ca.us
(try just my userid to email me)
AOLSFAQ=http://www.therockgarden.ca/aolsfaq.txt
see X- headers for PGP signature information

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#1704 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Fri, 05 Apr 2013 15:50:31 +0000, J G Miller wrote:

> On Friday, April 5th, 2013, at 07:53:28h +0000, Chris Glur chided:
> 
> 
> Incidentally, if it is not considered too impertinent a question, how
> close are your nearest neighbors?
> ....
Often 10m. You've heard about people coming back from the war, who
can't discuss any thing: because the 'home people' can't have a
valid context to ask any questions. They can't know that they
don't know. If you were in Calcutta your nearest neighbour would be 
10mm. but you still couldn't get a BigMac. Or did you read that here
they are made of donkey meat.

>>  Can rPi drive PC bidirectional par-port?
> 
> Because you want to connect a bidirectional parallel port printer?
> 
No. Writing rPi's stdOut to a PC's ser-port has problems for voltage
incompatibility. Whereas rPi's 3.3V should drive TTL. And whereas
par-port is originally intended as OUTPUT only, newer ones do input,
although often only 5-bits wide.
> 
> From <http://www.raspberrypi.ORG/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=7221>

Thanks, I'll check that now.

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#1705 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On 05/04/13 19:38, Unknown wrote:
> On Fri, 05 Apr 2013 15:50:31 +0000, J G Miller wrote:
>
>> On Friday, April 5th, 2013, at 07:53:28h +0000, Chris Glur chided:
>>
>>
>> Incidentally, if it is not considered too impertinent a question, how
>> close are your nearest neighbors?
>> ....
> Often 10m. You've heard about people coming back from the war, who
> can't discuss any thing: because the 'home people' can't have a
> valid context to ask any questions. They can't know that they
> don't know. If you were in Calcutta your nearest neighbour would be
> 10mm. but you still couldn't get a BigMac. Or did you read that here
> they are made of donkey meat.
>
>>>   Can rPi drive PC bidirectional par-port?
>>
>> Because you want to connect a bidirectional parallel port printer?
>>
> No. Writing rPi's stdOut to a PC's ser-port has problems for voltage
> incompatibility. Whereas rPi's 3.3V should drive TTL. And whereas
> par-port is originally intended as OUTPUT only, newer ones do input,
> although often only 5-bits wide.

parallel ports always did input: you need it for device status.

they just were not BIDIRECTIONAL nor always 8 bits wide input wise.


>>
>>  From <http://www.raspberrypi.ORG/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=7221>
>
> Thanks, I'll check that now.
>


-- 
Ineptocracy

(in-ep-toc’-ra-cy) – a system of government where the least capable to 
lead are elected by the least capable of producing, and where the 
members of society least likely to sustain themselves or succeed, are 
rewarded with goods and services paid for by the confiscated wealth of a 
diminishing number of producers.

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#1707 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

In comp.sys.raspberry-pi The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> On 05/04/13 19:38, Unknown wrote:
>> On Fri, 05 Apr 2013 15:50:31 +0000, J G Miller wrote:
>>
>>> On Friday, April 5th, 2013, at 07:53:28h +0000, Chris Glur chided:
>>>
>>>
>>> Incidentally, if it is not considered too impertinent a question, how
>>> close are your nearest neighbors?
>>> ....
>> Often 10m. You've heard about people coming back from the war, who
>> can't discuss any thing: because the 'home people' can't have a
>> valid context to ask any questions. They can't know that they
>> don't know. If you were in Calcutta your nearest neighbour would be
>> 10mm. but you still couldn't get a BigMac. Or did you read that here
>> they are made of donkey meat.
>>
>>>>   Can rPi drive PC bidirectional par-port?
>>>
>>> Because you want to connect a bidirectional parallel port printer?
>>>
>> No. Writing rPi's stdOut to a PC's ser-port has problems for voltage
>> incompatibility. Whereas rPi's 3.3V should drive TTL. And whereas
>> par-port is originally intended as OUTPUT only, newer ones do input,
>> although often only 5-bits wide.
> 
> parallel ports always did input: you need it for device status.
> 
> they just were not BIDIRECTIONAL nor always 8 bits wide input wise.

There are old parallel port filter transfer utilities such as Laplink.
D-link used to make an ethernet adaptor that plugged into a parallel
port too... 

> 
>>>
>>>  From <http://www.raspberrypi.ORG/phpBB3/viewtopic.php?f=44&t=7221>
>>
>> Thanks, I'll check that now.
>>
> 
> 

-- 
Nick B.

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#1706 — Re: Kernel console output on the serial port for headless rPi

On Friday, April 5th, 2013 18:38:36 +0000, Chris Glur explained:

> On Fri, 05 Apr 2013 15:50:31 +0000, J G Miller wrote:
> 
>> Incidentally, if it is not considered too impertinent a question, how
>> close are your nearest neighbors?
>> ....
> Often 10m. 

Often?  The residences move?  Mobile homes?  You live on a trailer park?  ;)

Previously one could be forgiven for thinking that you lived on a homestead
in the middle of nowhere where the next habitation was maybe 10 - 20 km away.

> You've heard about people coming back from the war, who can't discuss
> any thing: because the 'home people' can't have a valid context to
> ask any questions.

Yes because unlike tourists, they do not bring any holiday snapshots
that everybody can talk about, and also to avoid arrest, singing
"Kill the Boer" can only be done in appropriate circumstances.

> They can't know that they don't know.

    "There are known knowns.
     These are things we know that we know.
     There are known unknowns.
     That is to say, there are things that we know we don't know.
     But there are also unknown unknowns.
     There are things we don't know we don't know."

     -- Donald Henry Rumsfeld, 13th Secretary of Defense,
        on  February 12th, 2002

> If you were in Calcutta your nearest neighbour would be 
> 10mm. but you still couldn't get a BigMac.

Hmm,  <https://secure.flickr.COM/photos/85296574@N00/572516321/>

> Or did you read that here they are made of donkey meat.

Does it taste better than horse?

  <http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-202_162-57571350/south-africa-buffalo-and-donkey-found-in-beef-products/>

  <http://www.businessweek.com/news/2013-02-27/south-africa-starts-probe-into-mislabeled-donkey-buffalo-meat>

QUOTE

  About 68 percent of 139 samples of meat taken from South African supermarkets
  and butcheries in the middle of last year contained unlabeled traces of donkey,
  goat or water buffalo, a study by the University of Stellenbosch found this week."

UNQUOTE

Apparently lion is a popular form of meat in Illinois.

  <http://www.npr.ORG/blogs/thesalt/2013/03/25/175296454/why-illinois-is-roaring-mad-about-lion-meat>

-- 

   "Of all the white groups that are in South Africa, it is only the Afrikaners
    that are truly South Africans in the true sense of the word."

    -- polygamist Jacob Gedleyihlekisa Zuma

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#1665

On Tue, 2 Apr 2013, Avoid9Pdf@gmail.com wrote:

> The rPi credit-card-sized ARMbased computer which is
> already widely distributed, has no facilites to drive VGA.
>
Take note that comp.sys.raspberry-pi has been approved, the creation 
message has probably gone out by now.

The Pi doesn't drive a VGA because it's intended to be used with current 
tv sets, which definitely have hdmi.  It's a modern day equivalent of the 
Commodore 64, hook up to the tv set and play with it to learn programming.

That said, the HDMI port has the signals for DVI, you just need an adapter 
that takes the subset of signals and puts it on a DVI connector.  And most 
of the LCD monitors I'm finding here waiting for the garbage trucks have 
DVI (no sign of hdmi yet) connectors.  So not having VGA doesnt' seem too 
limiting.


> It has however a GPIO port [?IEE488].
> A driver for RS232 would be easy to drive the GPIO port.
> I think plip is even simpler, and there's linux info for it.
>
If it's doing conversion to serial in software, then that may slow things 
down.  THey need specific timing, which then locks out other multitasking, 
unless things have changed from the days of Microware OS-9.  That may or 
may not be an issue.

> Would it be viable to:- >
>  connect the rPi's port to a PC's RS232-port,
>  rPi redirect StdOut to ttyS0,
>  PC redirect ttyS0 to StdOut ?
>
You set up a console that is using the RS232 port rather than  the built 
in console.  This is easy since long before Linux came along, Unix often 
operated this way.  Inittab is where this is done.


    Michael



  > This would allow one Terminal of the LinuxPC to show
> the rPi's output -- hopefully.
>
> I've got a crossover-cable RS232 to RS232.
> Could I test the concept on a PC which has 2 RS232 ports,
> with one port simulating the rPi?
>
> == TIA.
>
>
>
>
>
>

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