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Groups > comp.os.linux.advocacy > #365289 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2016-08-12 19:31 -0700 |
| Last post | 2016-08-13 13:11 -0400 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 123 — 14 participants |
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Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-12 19:31 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-12 19:39 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-13 02:51 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-12 20:22 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Takuya Saitoh <taka0038@gmail.com> - 2016-08-12 23:36 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2016-08-13 06:42 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-13 08:57 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-13 07:28 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2016-08-15 09:37 -0500
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 10:45 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-15 16:35 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-16 00:17 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-16 04:36 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-16 22:15 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-17 15:49 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-17 13:56 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-17 18:15 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-18 08:40 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-18 15:54 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-18 12:55 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-17 12:26 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-16 22:14 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-17 07:49 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-17 15:45 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-17 14:05 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-17 18:16 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-17 18:19 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-17 21:58 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-18 08:39 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-18 12:57 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Steve Carroll <fretwizzer@gmail.com> - 2016-08-18 13:47 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-18 16:48 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-18 21:31 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-18 16:59 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-18 23:18 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-19 13:30 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-19 18:25 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-19 23:33 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-19 19:50 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-20 00:03 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-20 12:56 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-20 12:54 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-17 12:36 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-17 12:35 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-17 20:15 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-17 21:59 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-17 20:22 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-17 22:06 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-17 12:33 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 17:05 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 13:08 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 10:22 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 13:53 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-16 00:09 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-16 08:36 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 19:28 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 12:59 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice kubuntuking@gmail.com - 2016-08-15 14:50 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-16 22:17 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 17:55 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2016-08-16 03:47 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 21:02 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice William Poaster <wp@dev.null> - 2016-08-16 13:55 +0100
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-16 00:07 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Steve Carroll <fretwizzer@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 10:39 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 14:00 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Steve Carroll <fretwizzer@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 12:22 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 17:54 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 14:34 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 15:42 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 15:50 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 17:14 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 17:44 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 17:54 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 18:04 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-16 01:18 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 18:22 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-16 22:19 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-17 15:58 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-17 09:16 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-17 12:36 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 18:28 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 18:38 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 19:08 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 19:11 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 19:24 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 19:28 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 19:35 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> - 2016-08-16 02:43 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 19:58 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 18:51 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 16:09 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 17:16 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 17:34 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 22:43 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 19:59 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Tattoo Vampire <sitting@this.computer> - 2016-08-15 21:27 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 18:30 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 22:47 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 19:49 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 22:54 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 19:56 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 23:01 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 20:05 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice ronb <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2016-08-16 03:49 +0000
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-15 21:02 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2016-08-16 06:52 -0500
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Tattoo Vampire <sitting@this.computer> - 2016-08-16 07:07 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-15 22:45 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Tattoo Vampire <sitting@this.computer> - 2016-08-16 07:12 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-16 08:37 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> - 2016-08-16 22:24 -0600
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2016-08-15 12:17 -0500
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 14:30 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-16 00:08 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> - 2016-08-15 21:21 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-13 09:26 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-13 09:27 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> - 2016-08-13 09:42 -0400
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Steve Carroll <fretwizzer@gmail.com> - 2016-08-13 07:18 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Steve Carroll <fretwizzer@gmail.com> - 2016-08-13 07:07 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> - 2016-08-13 09:35 -0700
Re: Lithuania goes LibreOffice DFS <nospam@dfs.com> - 2016-08-13 13:11 -0400
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| From | Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-12 19:31 -0700 |
| Subject | Lithuania goes LibreOffice |
| Message-ID | <LKWdnVLrhfwMGzPKnZ2dnUU7-TfNnZ2d@giganews.com> |
Lithuania goes LibreOffice: The Lithuanian police have made the switch to LibreOffice and already have it up and running on over 8,000 workstations. Evidently the switch from MS Office went smoothly, with very little push back from the rank and file. “Once staff members realized the huge amounts of money we saved, they became open to change, and quickly adapted to using the LibreOffice word processor, spreadsheet, presentation application, its mathematics tool and database solution,” said Deputy Police Commissioner General D. Malaškevičius, who was in charge of the switch. This story isn’t over yet. They’ve also started testing workstations running Ubuntu and might do away with Windows altogether. -- Marek Novotny https://github.com/marek-novotny
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| From | Snit <usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-12 19:39 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <D3D3D670.792C0%usenet@gallopinginsanity.com> |
| In reply to | #365289 |
On 8/12/16, 7:31 PM, in article LKWdnVLrhfwMGzPKnZ2dnUU7-TfNnZ2d@giganews.com, "Marek Novotny" <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> wrote: > Lithuania goes LibreOffice: The Lithuanian police have made the > switch to LibreOffice and already have it up and running on over 8,000 > workstations. Evidently the switch from MS Office went smoothly, with > very little push back from the rank and file. > > "Once staff members realized the huge amounts of money we saved, they > became open to change, and quickly adapted to using the LibreOffice word > processor, spreadsheet, presentation application, its mathematics tool > and database solution," said Deputy Police Commissioner General D. > Malaškevičius, who was in charge of the switch. > > This story isn't over yet. They've also started testing workstations > running Ubuntu and might do away with Windows altogether. As with some other cities it would be interesting to hear from the users. I know things did not go as well as hoped in Munich... yet those running it painted a rosy picture. Still, there must be places where there needs coincide with what desktop Linux can offer. -- * OS X / Linux: What is a file? <http://youtu.be/_dMbXGLW9PI> * Mint MATE Trash, Panel, Menu: <http://youtu.be/C0y74FIf7uE> * Mint KDE working with folders: <http://youtu.be/7C9nvniOoE0> * Mint KDE creating files: <http://youtu.be/N7-fZJaJUv8> * Mint KDE help: <http://youtu.be/3ikizUd3sa8> * Mint KDE general navigation: <http://youtu.be/t9y14yZtQuI> * Mint KDE bugs or Easter eggs? <http://youtu.be/CU-whJQvtfA> * Easy on OS X / Hard on Linux: <http://youtu.be/D3BPWANQoIk> * OS / Word Processor Comparison: <http://youtu.be/w6Qcl-w7s5c>
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| From | "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-13 02:51 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <fhjadir83.gytr7@perch.invalid> |
| In reply to | #365289 |
Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> wrote: > Lithuania goes LibreOffice: The Lithuanian police have made the > switch to LibreOffice and already have it up and running on over 8,000 > workstations. Evidently the switch from MS Office went smoothly, with > very little push back from the rank and file. > > “Once staff members realized the huge amounts of money we saved, they > became open to change, and quickly adapted to using the LibreOffice word > processor, spreadsheet, presentation application, its mathematics tool > and database solution,” said Deputy Police Commissioner General D. > Malaškevičius, who was in charge of the switch. > > This story isn’t over yet. They’ve also started testing workstations > running Ubuntu and might do away with Windows altogether. > The choices: 1. MS Office. 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-12 20:22 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <XPOdnSAWpqDvDzPKnZ2dnUU7-VednZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #365293 |
On 2016-08-13, Octavian W. Lagrange <olagrang@perch.invalid> wrote: > Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> wrote: >> Lithuania goes LibreOffice: The Lithuanian police have made the >> switch to LibreOffice and already have it up and running on over 8,000 >> workstations. Evidently the switch from MS Office went smoothly, with >> very little push back from the rank and file. >> >> “Once staff members realized the huge amounts of money we saved, they >> became open to change, and quickly adapted to using the LibreOffice word >> processor, spreadsheet, presentation application, its mathematics tool >> and database solution,” said Deputy Police Commissioner General D. >> Malaškevičius, who was in charge of the switch. >> >> This story isn’t over yet. They’ve also started testing workstations >> running Ubuntu and might do away with Windows altogether. >> > > The choices: > 1. MS Office. > 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. +1 -- Marek Novotny https://github.com/marek-novotny
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| From | Takuya Saitoh <taka0038@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-12 23:36 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <cfddfea3-4a92-4ddd-b13c-dbdda314c391@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #365298 |
Want to be M$ and the Western World compatible? Go for the WPS Office!
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| From | Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-13 06:42 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <nomtvr$kl4$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #365298 |
Marek Novotny wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties: > On 2016-08-13, Octavian W. Lagrange <olagrang@perch.invalid> wrote: >> Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> wrote: >>> Lithuania goes LibreOffice: The Lithuanian police have made the >>> switch to LibreOffice and already have it up and running on over 8,000 >>> workstations. Evidently the switch from MS Office went smoothly, with >>> very little push back from the rank and file. >>> >>> “Once staff members realized the huge amounts of money we saved, they >>> became open to change, and quickly adapted to using the LibreOffice word >>> processor, spreadsheet, presentation application, its mathematics tool >>> and database solution,” said Deputy Police Commissioner General D. >>> Malaškevičius, who was in charge of the switch. >>> >>> This story isn’t over yet. They’ve also started testing workstations >>> running Ubuntu and might do away with Windows altogether. >> >> The choices: >> 1. MS Office. >> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. > > +1 A recent new hire in our programming group was surprise that we paid the premium to get Visual Studio... "so expensive!". I was, like, tell me about it. But there's no way of shifting "the customer" over to MingW. Is becoming moot anyway as we move to Java. By the way, I'm not impressed by *any* of the IDEs... Visual Studio, Eclipse, Netbeans. Sure, they have a lot of "features", but the conveniences come at the cost of slow speed, instability, and extremely convoluted initial setup. And then they become a crutch. Give me vim and the GNU toolset any day. -- Why is it that we rejoice at a birth and grieve at a funeral? It is because we are not the person involved. -- Mark Twain, "Pudd'nhead Wilson's Calendar"
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| From | flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-13 08:57 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <1ejbnng401a75$.ufgnaivo39z0.dlg@40tude.net> |
| In reply to | #365310 |
On Sat, 13 Aug 2016 06:42:47 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom wrote: > Marek Novotny wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties: > >> On 2016-08-13, Octavian W. Lagrange <olagrang@perch.invalid> wrote: >>> Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> wrote: >>>> Lithuania goes LibreOffice: The Lithuanian police have made the >>>> switch to LibreOffice and already have it up and running on over 8,000 >>>> workstations. Evidently the switch from MS Office went smoothly, with >>>> very little push back from the rank and file. >>>> >>>> “Once staff members realized the huge amounts of money we saved, they >>>> became open to change, and quickly adapted to using the LibreOffice word >>>> processor, spreadsheet, presentation application, its mathematics tool >>>> and database solution,” said Deputy Police Commissioner General D. >>>> Malaškevičius, who was in charge of the switch. >>>> >>>> This story isn’t over yet. They’ve also started testing workstations >>>> running Ubuntu and might do away with Windows altogether. >>> >>> The choices: >>> 1. MS Office. >>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. >> >> +1 > > A recent new hire in our programming group was surprise that we > paid the premium to get Visual Studio... "so expensive!". I was, like, > tell me about it. But there's no way of shifting "the customer" over > to MingW. Is becoming moot anyway as we move to Java. > > By the way, I'm not impressed by *any* of the IDEs... Visual Studio, > Eclipse, Netbeans. Sure, they have a lot of "features", but the > conveniences come at the cost of slow speed, instability, and extremely > convoluted initial setup. And then they become a crutch. > > Give me vim and the GNU toolset any day. Is that something you overheard one of the programmers say? -- flatfish+++ Often imitated. Never duplicated.
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| From | Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-13 07:28 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <btOdnUTM64gQszLKnZ2dnUU7-aPNnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #365310 |
On 2016-08-13, Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> wrote: > Marek Novotny wrote this copyrighted missive and expects royalties: > >> On 2016-08-13, Octavian W. Lagrange <olagrang@perch.invalid> wrote: >>> Marek Novotny <marek.novotny@marspolar.com> wrote: >>>> Lithuania goes LibreOffice: The Lithuanian police have made the >>>> switch to LibreOffice and already have it up and running on over 8,000 >>>> workstations. Evidently the switch from MS Office went smoothly, with >>>> very little push back from the rank and file. >>>> >>>> “Once staff members realized the huge amounts of money we saved, they >>>> became open to change, and quickly adapted to using the LibreOffice word >>>> processor, spreadsheet, presentation application, its mathematics tool >>>> and database solution,” said Deputy Police Commissioner General D. >>>> Malaškevičius, who was in charge of the switch. >>>> >>>> This story isn’t over yet. They’ve also started testing workstations >>>> running Ubuntu and might do away with Windows altogether. >>> >>> The choices: >>> 1. MS Office. >>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. >> >> +1 > > A recent new hire in our programming group was surprise that we > paid the premium to get Visual Studio... "so expensive!". I was, like, > tell me about it. But there's no way of shifting "the customer" over > to MingW. Is becoming moot anyway as we move to Java. > > By the way, I'm not impressed by *any* of the IDEs... Visual Studio, > Eclipse, Netbeans. Sure, they have a lot of "features", but the > conveniences come at the cost of slow speed, instability, and extremely > convoluted initial setup. And then they become a crutch. > > Give me vim and the GNU toolset any day. I recently started to subscribe to JetBrains CLion. The personal license is about $89 annually. They have Ruby as well as others. Clion like it sounds is C/C++ IDE. You download it and try it free for 30 days. A programming Podcast I like mentioned it and so I thought I'd give it a go. I have to say I am surprised how well my Vim setup works so far. // part of my .vimrc " setup quickfix autocmd to launch after make autocmd QuickFixCmdPost [^l]* nested cwindow autocmd QuickFixCmdPost l* nested lwindow Not sure how you have your setup. I wrote a simple shell script so that I can easily start a C project. It names the first source file, creates a generic make file and so from within vim I just type make and it is already set to compile that first source file. As I get more into make I'll likely automate that further but for now it works just fine. Any error I make when running :make from vim gives me the code, error description and list right in the editor. It's almost exactly like an IDE and it runs lightning fast. So yeah, I'm in agreement. Vim continues to impress. I have ddd the GUI front end to gdb, but I'd rather see some vim integration. And I really have not started cracking gdb. Part of the reason to try out other IDEs is for their integrated debugger in a nice IDE. eclipse didn't do it for me either. JetBrains CLion is cross platform. And to test that I have it installed on Red Hat, Mint, OSX and Winblows10. For Windows I am using MinGW. So far so good. -- Marek Novotny https://github.com/marek-novotny
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| From | chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-15 09:37 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <3kk3rbh67cctrm5js8nkhbqaajfqegd15r@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #365298 |
> "owl" wrote: >> >> The choices: >> 1. MS Office. >> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. It's really quite stunning that, in these times, more places are not dumping MSO to save money. Windows I can understand can be difficult for an organization to leave. But MSO? Just dump it! -- "Oh, look: a claim from chrisv that there's only 500 supercomputers in the world." - lying asshole "-hh", lying shamelessly
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| From | flatfish+++ <flatfish4real@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-15 10:45 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <1vbuptzpg9ipo$.1dard5g2t1ssd.dlg@40tude.net> |
| In reply to | #365489 |
On Mon, 15 Aug 2016 09:37:37 -0500, chrisv wrote: >> "owl" wrote: >>> >>> The choices: >>> 1. MS Office. >>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. > > It's really quite stunning that, in these times, more places are not > dumping MSO to save money. If FOSS/Linux were a superior desktop system places would be leaving MSO. Linux/FOSS is not superior overall as a desktop. > Windows I can understand can be difficult for an organization to > leave. But MSO? Just dump it! If LibreOffice was superior or even close to being as good as MSO places would be leaving MSO. They are not. Improve your applications and stop whining. -- flatfish+++ Often imitated. Never duplicated.
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| From | "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-15 16:35 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <fhjsdie983.ah@perch.invalid> |
| In reply to | #365489 |
chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote: >> "owl" wrote: >>> >>> The choices: >>> 1. MS Office. >>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. > > It's really quite stunning that, in these times, more places are not > dumping MSO to save money. > > Windows I can understand can be difficult for an organization to > leave. But MSO? Just dump it! > MS Office is just plain dangerous. https://vid.me/WtqO
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| From | DFS <nospam@dfs.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-16 00:17 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <nou458$r0t$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #365505 |
On 8/15/2016 12:35 PM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: > chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote: >>> "owl" wrote: >>>> >>>> The choices: >>>> 1. MS Office. >>>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. >> >> It's really quite stunning that, in these times, more places are not >> dumping MSO to save money. >> >> Windows I can understand can be difficult for an organization to >> leave. But MSO? Just dump it! >> > > MS Office is just plain dangerous. > https://vid.me/WtqO More dangerous than the massively, supremely, stupendously idiotic Donald Trump? <quote> In a GOP debate, Trump was asked which leg of the nuclear triad was most important to him and how he would prioritise funding – to the submarines, bombers or missiles. In a rambling answer that was so incoherent it sent shock waves across the globe Trump managed to say something that made sense. He warned viewers of the dangerous possibility of "having some maniac, having some madman go out and get a nuclear weapon," and said "that's in my opinion, that is the single biggest problem that our country faces right now." </quote> http://www.smh.com.au/comment/memo-donald-trump-the-very-point-of-nuclear-weapons-is-that-they-are-never-used-20160812-gqqysb.html
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| From | "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-16 04:36 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <fhjxcod83.auhr@perch.invalid> |
| In reply to | #365602 |
DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote: > On 8/15/2016 12:35 PM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: >> chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote: >>>> "owl" wrote: >>>>> >>>>> The choices: >>>>> 1. MS Office. >>>>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. >>> >>> It's really quite stunning that, in these times, more places are not >>> dumping MSO to save money. >>> >>> Windows I can understand can be difficult for an organization to >>> leave. But MSO? Just dump it! >>> >> >> MS Office is just plain dangerous. >> https://vid.me/WtqO > > > More dangerous than the massively, supremely, stupendously idiotic > Donald Trump? > > > > <quote> > In a GOP debate, Trump was asked which leg of the nuclear triad was most > important to him and how he would prioritise funding – to the > submarines, bombers or missiles. In a rambling answer that was so > incoherent it sent shock waves across the globe Trump managed to say > something that made sense. > > He warned viewers of the dangerous possibility of "having some maniac, > having some madman go out and get a nuclear weapon," and said "that's in > my opinion, that is the single biggest problem that our country faces > right now." > </quote> > > http://www.smh.com.au/comment/memo-donald-trump-the-very-point-of-nuclear-weapons-is-that-they-are-never-used-20160812-gqqysb.html > Those morons apparently haven't been paying attention for the last 70 years. The US has always reserved the right to launch a first strike. The point of nuclear weapons is not that they will never be used, but that they *will* be used if you fuck with us. http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702304620304575166263632513790 <quote> Updated April 6, 2010 12:01 a.m. ET WASHINGTON—The Obama administration will release a new national nuclear-weapons strategy Tuesday that makes only modest changes to U.S. nuclear forces, leaving intact the longstanding U.S. threat to use nuclear weapons first, even against non-nuclear nations. </quote>
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| From | GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-16 22:15 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <np0od5$okc$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #365604 |
On 08/15/16 22:36, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: > DFS<nospam@dfs.com> wrote: >> On 8/15/2016 12:35 PM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: >>> chrisv<chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote: >>>>> "owl" wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> The choices: >>>>>> 1. MS Office. >>>>>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. >>>> >>>> It's really quite stunning that, in these times, more places are not >>>> dumping MSO to save money. >>>> >>>> Windows I can understand can be difficult for an organization to >>>> leave. But MSO? Just dump it! >>>> >>> >>> MS Office is just plain dangerous. >>> https://vid.me/WtqO >> >> >> More dangerous than the massively, supremely, stupendously idiotic >> Donald Trump? >> >> >> >> <quote> >> In a GOP debate, Trump was asked which leg of the nuclear triad was most >> important to him and how he would prioritise funding – to the >> submarines, bombers or missiles. In a rambling answer that was so >> incoherent it sent shock waves across the globe Trump managed to say >> something that made sense. >> >> He warned viewers of the dangerous possibility of "having some maniac, >> having some madman go out and get a nuclear weapon," and said "that's in >> my opinion, that is the single biggest problem that our country faces >> right now." >> </quote> >> >> http://www.smh.com.au/comment/memo-donald-trump-the-very-point-of-nuclear-weapons-is-that-they-are-never-used-20160812-gqqysb.html >> > > Those morons apparently haven't been paying attention for the last > 70 years. The US has always reserved the right to launch a first > strike. The point of nuclear weapons is not that they will never > be used, but that they *will* be used if you fuck with us. > > http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702304620304575166263632513790 > <quote> > Updated April 6, 2010 12:01 a.m. ET > WASHINGTON—The Obama administration will release a new national > nuclear-weapons strategy Tuesday that makes only modest changes to > U.S. nuclear forces, leaving intact the longstanding U.S. threat to use > nuclear weapons first, even against non-nuclear nations. > </quote> > Funny that Obama had already ordered a first strike last year, but the Navy refused to do it. Glad the Navy refused and stayed very sane over it, compared to that dark WallNut.
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| From | "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-17 15:49 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <hgjcs84g.kai@perch.invalid> |
| In reply to | #365719 |
GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> wrote: > On 08/15/16 22:36, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: >> DFS<nospam@dfs.com> wrote: >>> On 8/15/2016 12:35 PM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: >>>> chrisv<chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote: >>>>>> "owl" wrote: >>>>>>> >>>>>>> The choices: >>>>>>> 1. MS Office. >>>>>>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. >>>>> >>>>> It's really quite stunning that, in these times, more places are not >>>>> dumping MSO to save money. >>>>> >>>>> Windows I can understand can be difficult for an organization to >>>>> leave. But MSO? Just dump it! >>>>> >>>> >>>> MS Office is just plain dangerous. >>>> https://vid.me/WtqO >>> >>> >>> More dangerous than the massively, supremely, stupendously idiotic >>> Donald Trump? >>> >>> >>> >>> <quote> >>> In a GOP debate, Trump was asked which leg of the nuclear triad was most >>> important to him and how he would prioritise funding – to the >>> submarines, bombers or missiles. In a rambling answer that was so >>> incoherent it sent shock waves across the globe Trump managed to say >>> something that made sense. >>> >>> He warned viewers of the dangerous possibility of "having some maniac, >>> having some madman go out and get a nuclear weapon," and said "that's in >>> my opinion, that is the single biggest problem that our country faces >>> right now." >>> </quote> >>> >>> http://www.smh.com.au/comment/memo-donald-trump-the-very-point-of-nuclear-weapons-is-that-they-are-never-used-20160812-gqqysb.html >>> >> >> Those morons apparently haven't been paying attention for the last >> 70 years. The US has always reserved the right to launch a first >> strike. The point of nuclear weapons is not that they will never >> be used, but that they *will* be used if you fuck with us. >> >> http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702304620304575166263632513790 >> <quote> >> Updated April 6, 2010 12:01 a.m. ET >> WASHINGTON—The Obama administration will release a new national >> nuclear-weapons strategy Tuesday that makes only modest changes to >> U.S. nuclear forces, leaving intact the longstanding U.S. threat to use >> nuclear weapons first, even against non-nuclear nations. >> </quote> >> > > Funny that Obama had already ordered a first strike last year, but the > Navy refused to do it. Glad the Navy refused and stayed very sane over > it, compared to that dark WallNut. > Yeah, he wanted to false-flag nuke South Carolina. I've gone to Myrtle Beach all my life. We can't have that. Go Navy.
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| From | DFS <nospam@dfs.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-17 13:56 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <np28h9$auc$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #365604 |
On 8/16/2016 12:36 AM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: > DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote: >> On 8/15/2016 12:35 PM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: >>> chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> wrote: >>>>> "owl" wrote: >>>>>> >>>>>> The choices: >>>>>> 1. MS Office. >>>>>> 2. LibreOffice, guns, body armor. >>>> >>>> It's really quite stunning that, in these times, more places are not >>>> dumping MSO to save money. >>>> >>>> Windows I can understand can be difficult for an organization to >>>> leave. But MSO? Just dump it! >>>> >>> >>> MS Office is just plain dangerous. >>> https://vid.me/WtqO >> >> >> More dangerous than the massively, supremely, stupendously idiotic >> Donald Trump? >> >> >> >> <quote> >> In a GOP debate, Trump was asked which leg of the nuclear triad was most >> important to him and how he would prioritise funding – to the >> submarines, bombers or missiles. In a rambling answer that was so >> incoherent it sent shock waves across the globe Trump managed to say >> something that made sense. >> >> He warned viewers of the dangerous possibility of "having some maniac, >> having some madman go out and get a nuclear weapon," and said "that's in >> my opinion, that is the single biggest problem that our country faces >> right now." >> </quote> >> >> http://www.smh.com.au/comment/memo-donald-trump-the-very-point-of-nuclear-weapons-is-that-they-are-never-used-20160812-gqqysb.html >> > > Those morons apparently haven't been paying attention for the last > 70 years. The US has always reserved the right to launch a first > strike. The point of nuclear weapons is not that they will never > be used, but that they *will* be used if you fuck with us. > > http://www.wsj.com/articles/SB10001424052702304620304575166263632513790 > <quote> > Updated April 6, 2010 12:01 a.m. ET > WASHINGTON—The Obama administration will release a new national > nuclear-weapons strategy Tuesday that makes only modest changes to > U.S. nuclear forces, leaving intact the longstanding U.S. threat to use > nuclear weapons first, even against non-nuclear nations. > </quote> Some more Trump idiocy: http://www.nbcnews.com/politics/2016-election/his-words-19-notable-thoughts-donald-trump-n630446 The guy's a lunatic and an embarrassment to the United States - definitely not fit to serve as President. I agree more with his "policies" (in quotes because most of it is made up on the spot - then later changed) than with Clinton's, but neither of them will get my vote. Have you seen him and Hannity babbling about Clinton having a seizure or stroke, and being in ill health? How ridiculous can grown men get? His lies and dodges about his tax returns should be enough for most people to disqualify him. 100 to 1 his tax filings prove he's just lying, that he's not as wealthy or successful as he claims. <quote> In his 92-page financial disclosure to the Federal Election Commission (F.E.C.) in July 2015 and in a second, 104-page disclosure last May, in both of which he calls himself “President of the United States of America” (Hillary humbly calls herself “Candidate for President”), he lists at least $1.5 billion in hard assets. Of this, a minimum of $787 million is in hotels and real estate such as Trump Tower, in Manhattan. There are also 16 golf-related businesses valued at more than $550 million, aircraft worth at least $58 million, $6 million in vineyards, and $4.3 million in entertainment ventures. These are lower-bound numbers: categories include “over $50 million,” with no upper limit. (The main purpose of these disclosures isn’t to build a full picture of a candidate’s finances but to identify conflicts of interest.) Trump claimed to me that his net worth is “much more than $10 billion…. I don’t know how much more.” A Trump press release in July 2015 also claimed his net worth was “in excess of TEN BILLION DOLLARS,” though Fortune in May estimated it at $3.9 billion, and Bloomberg News reckoned it at $2.9 billion last July. (Michael Bloomberg, by comparison, is worth $45 billion, according to Forbes.) </quote> http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/the-great-trump-tax-mysteries Clinton lies, too, but nothing like Trump. Vote your conscience is all I have to say. I'll be writing-in another name, probably a Republican, definitely not a Dem.
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| From | "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-17 18:15 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <fjgua93.yg33@perch.invalid> |
| In reply to | #365792 |
DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote: > http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/the-great-trump-tax-mysteries > Vanity Fair? Might as well quote Huffington Post. > > Clinton lies, too, but nothing like Trump. > > Vote your conscience is all I have to say. That's profound, Lyin' Ted. I'll be writing-in another > name, probably a Republican, definitely not a Dem. > Anyone who would normally vote Republican, but who now chooses to vote for someone other than Hillary's opponent, simply because that opponent is Trump, is effectively voting for Hillary. "Do the math," Lyin Ted. Given 10 Republicans, 10 Democrats: Hillary 10 Trump 10 vs Hillary 10 Trump 9 RomneyPlant 1
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| From | DFS <nospam@dfs.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-18 08:40 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <np4abu$8u6$3@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #365796 |
On 8/17/2016 2:15 PM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote:
> DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote:
>
>> http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/the-great-trump-tax-mysteries
>>
>
> Vanity Fair? Might as well quote Huffington Post.
No problem. Either one can expose his ridiculous lies as well as the other.
>> Clinton lies, too, but nothing like Trump.
>>
>> Vote your conscience is all I have to say.
>
> That's profound, Lyin' Ted.
Try it - you'll feel profoundly better.
>> I'll be writing-in another
>> name, probably a Republican, definitely not a Dem.
>>
>
> Anyone who would normally vote Republican, but who now chooses to vote
> for someone other than Hillary's opponent, simply because that opponent
> is Trump, is effectively voting for Hillary.
> "Do the math," Lyin Ted.
Get real.
Anyone voting for Trump is effectively voting for brain chemical
imbalance, brazen lying and dishonesty, hypocrisy, ignorance of the
world, contradictory statements made day after day after day, unlimited
but unwarranted egomania, obfuscation, deflection, dismissal,
childishness, etc.
He's a trainwreck, and even he knows it.
* “We’re gonna watch Pennsylvania. Go down to certain areas and watch
and study and make sure other people don’t come in and vote five
times. The only way we can lose, in my opinion – and I really mean
this, Pennsylvania – is if cheating goes on. I really believe it.”
* "No, I meant he's the founder of ISIS, I do.
* "She's the devil."
> Given 10 Republicans, 10 Democrats:
>
> Hillary 10
> Trump 10
>
> vs
>
> Hillary 10
> Trump 9
> RomneyPlant 1
You have to live with yourself if that dimwit gets elected.
I already made the mistake of voting for him in the primary - I won't do
it again.
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| From | "Octavian W. Lagrange" <olagrang@perch.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-18 15:54 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <sgjds93.ajgue@perch.invalid> |
| In reply to | #365891 |
DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote: > On 8/17/2016 2:15 PM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: > >> DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote: >> >>> http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/the-great-trump-tax-mysteries >>> >> >> Vanity Fair? Might as well quote Huffington Post. > > > No problem. Either one can expose his ridiculous lies as well as the other. > > What lies? > >>> Clinton lies, too, but nothing like Trump. >>> >>> Vote your conscience is all I have to say. >> >> That's profound, Lyin' Ted. > > > Try it - you'll feel profoundly better. > > There is no way I would feel better with Hillary Clinton making three Supreme Court appointments. > >>> I'll be writing-in another >>> name, probably a Republican, definitely not a Dem. >>> >> >> Anyone who would normally vote Republican, but who now chooses to vote >> for someone other than Hillary's opponent, simply because that opponent >> is Trump, is effectively voting for Hillary. >> "Do the math," Lyin Ted. > > > Get real. > > Anyone voting for Trump is effectively voting for brain chemical > imbalance, brazen lying and dishonesty, hypocrisy, ignorance of the > world, contradictory statements made day after day after day, unlimited > but unwarranted egomania, obfuscation, deflection, dismissal, > childishness, etc. > > He's a trainwreck, and even he knows it. > > * “We’re gonna watch Pennsylvania. Go down to certain areas and watch > and study and make sure other people don’t come in and vote five > times. The only way we can lose, in my opinion – and I really mean > this, Pennsylvania – is if cheating goes on. I really believe it.” > > * "No, I meant he's the founder of ISIS, I do. > > * "She's the devil." > > He says those things to poke Hillary and Obama and float that message. Damn, you are dense. > >> Given 10 Republicans, 10 Democrats: >> >> Hillary 10 >> Trump 10 >> >> vs >> >> Hillary 10 >> Trump 9 >> RomneyPlant 1 > > > You have to live with yourself if that dimwit gets elected. > > I already made the mistake of voting for him in the primary - I won't do > it again. > So you are going to make that unbelievably stupid mistake of helping Hillary get elected.
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| From | GreyCloud <mist@cumulus.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2016-08-18 12:55 -0600 |
| Message-ID | <np50ar$ud6$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #365891 |
On 08/18/16 06:40, DFS wrote: > On 8/17/2016 2:15 PM, Octavian W. Lagrange wrote: > >> DFS <nospam@dfs.com> wrote: >> >>> http://www.vanityfair.com/news/2016/06/the-great-trump-tax-mysteries >>> >> >> Vanity Fair? Might as well quote Huffington Post. > > > No problem. Either one can expose his ridiculous lies as well as the other. > What lies can you say about Trump? How about the clinton lies? Like when Comey of the FBI said one thing under oath and hillary says just the opposite. Comey called her basically a liar and also very careless with classified data. > Get real. > > Anyone voting for Trump is effectively voting for brain chemical > imbalance, brazen lying and dishonesty, hypocrisy, ignorance of the > world, contradictory statements made day after day after day, unlimited > but unwarranted egomania, obfuscation, deflection, dismissal, > childishness, etc. > > He's a trainwreck, and even he knows it. > You gotta be kidding. Right now the secret service is going thru three hospitals for hillary's neurosurgery that is needed.
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