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Groups > comp.os.linux.advocacy > #689026 > unrolled thread
| Started by | CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2025-04-16 08:55 -0400 |
| Last post | 2025-04-17 05:02 -0400 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 95 — 17 participants |
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Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-16 08:55 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-04-17 03:06 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-17 08:48 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> - 2025-04-17 14:04 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-17 10:14 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-04-18 05:36 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> - 2025-04-18 09:23 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2025-04-18 09:35 +0000
Wayland (was: Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates) vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2025-04-18 09:57 +0000
Re: Wayland % <pursent100@gmail.com> - 2025-04-18 06:21 -0700
Re: Wayland Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-18 12:10 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Farley Flud <fsquared@fsquared.linux> - 2025-04-18 10:51 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-18 12:08 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Farley Flud <ff@linux.rocks> - 2025-04-19 10:24 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates % <pursent100@gmail.com> - 2025-04-18 06:20 -0700
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-18 10:11 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-18 20:57 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Farley Flud <ff@linux.rocks> - 2025-04-19 10:01 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-18 07:24 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-18 20:51 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-19 07:46 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-21 05:01 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-21 08:00 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-21 22:10 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-04-21 05:48 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-18 20:48 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-19 07:45 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-21 05:00 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-21 07:59 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-21 20:12 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-21 21:00 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-21 22:08 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-22 00:58 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2025-04-22 01:05 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-21 21:16 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-22 06:11 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-22 07:51 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-22 08:58 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-22 18:23 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-22 15:03 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-23 03:45 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-23 05:15 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-22 06:09 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-22 08:53 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-22 18:40 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-23 05:20 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-23 09:09 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-24 12:45 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-21 21:06 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-22 06:13 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-22 08:54 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-04-21 05:46 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Farley Flud <fsquared@fsquared.linux> - 2025-04-21 10:46 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2025-04-21 12:35 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-21 20:54 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates % <pursent100@gmail.com> - 2025-04-18 06:19 -0700
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> - 2025-04-18 09:21 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-18 20:46 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-19 07:43 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-21 04:47 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2025-04-23 02:33 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-23 03:48 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2025-04-23 04:07 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates % <pursent100@gmail.com> - 2025-04-23 07:02 -0700
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> - 2025-04-23 05:22 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> - 2025-04-23 07:21 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates % <pursent100@gmail.com> - 2025-04-23 07:03 -0700
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates % <pursent100@gmail.com> - 2025-04-23 07:01 -0700
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-24 08:42 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates wasbit <wasbit@REMOVEhotmail.com> - 2025-04-18 09:36 +0100
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-18 18:07 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> - 2025-04-19 21:56 +1000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> - 2025-04-19 09:15 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2025-04-21 01:46 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-21 02:22 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2025-04-23 02:29 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-23 03:58 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates pothead <pothead@snakebite.com> - 2025-04-23 04:11 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-23 07:36 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates chrisv <chrisv@nospam.invalid> - 2025-04-23 18:16 -0500
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-24 00:14 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> - 2025-04-21 19:40 +1000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Farley Flud <fsquared@fsquared.linux> - 2025-04-21 10:41 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Mark Lloyd <not.email@all.invalid> - 2025-04-21 16:09 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates % <pursent100@gmail.com> - 2025-04-21 12:22 -0700
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-21 19:38 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Char Jackson <none@none.invalid> - 2025-04-22 14:47 -0500
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-23 04:02 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> - 2025-04-23 08:38 -0400
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-21 19:32 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Daniel70 <daniel47@eternal-september.org> - 2025-04-22 19:58 +1000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> - 2025-04-21 05:43 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates rbowman <bowman@montana.com> - 2025-04-21 19:25 +0000
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates % <pursent100@gmail.com> - 2025-04-21 12:33 -0700
Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates Paul <nospam@needed.invalid> - 2025-04-17 05:02 -0400
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| From | CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-16 08:55 -0400 |
| Subject | Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates |
| Message-ID | <PMNLP.313528$j2D.45166@fx09.iad> |
At what point do we finally give up? <https://www.bleepingcomputer.com/news/microsoft/microsoft-warns-of-blue-screen-crashes-caused-by-april-updates/> Microsoft warned customers this week that their systems might crash with a blue screen error caused by a secure kernel fatal error after installing Windows updates released since March. According to advisory updates for the KB5055523 April cumulative update and the KB5053656 March preview update, this known issue affects devices running Windows 11, version 24H2. Those affected will see their PCs crash after installing these updates and restarting their devices. "After installing this update and restarting your device, you might encounter a blue screen exception with error code 0x18B indicating a SECURE_KERNEL_ERROR," Microsoft said. Until a fix is rolled out through Windows Update, Microsoft resolved this issue via Known Issue Rollback (KIR), a feature that reverses buggy non-security updates delivered via Windows Update. This fix will propagate automatically to all home, non-managed enterprise devices, and business devices not managed by IT departments over the next 24 hours. To expedite the rollout, Microsoft advises affected users to restart their devices, which ensures the fix is applied faster. After installation, you can find the Group Policy under Computer Configuration > Administrative Templates. To deploy it on affected endpoints, you must go to the Local Computer Policy or the Domain policy on the domain controller using the Group Policy Editor to choose the Windows version you want to target. "You will need to install and configure the Group Policy for your version of Windows to resolve this issue. You will also need to restart your device(s) to apply the group policy setting," Microsoft added. Windows admins can find additional guidance on deploying KIR Group Policies on the Microsoft support website. Earlier this week, Microsoft released emergency Windows updates to address an issue affecting local audit logon policies in Active Directory Group Policy and warned admins that Windows Server 2025 domain controllers might become inaccessible after restarts, causing services and apps to fail. Today, Redmond also started deploying a fix for an issue causing some Windows devices to be offered Windows 11 upgrades despite Intune policies blocking them. -- God be with you, CrudeSausage LibreOffice supporter John 14:6
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| From | Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-17 03:06 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <vtpr7k$3o0aj$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #689026 |
On Wed, 16 Apr 2025 08:55:12 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: > At what point do we finally give up? When the people start to see through those vendors’ multi-million-dollar marketing campaigns telling everybody how wonderful they are. In other words, never.
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| From | CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-17 08:48 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <gM6MP.1648942$SZca.1283685@fx13.iad> |
| In reply to | #689059 |
On 2025-04-16 23:06, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: > On Wed, 16 Apr 2025 08:55:12 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: > >> At what point do we finally give up? > > When the people start to see through those vendors’ multi-million-dollar > marketing campaigns telling everybody how wonderful they are. > > In other words, never. I would blame the ignorance of the common user much more than any marketing campaign. You'd be surprised at how oblivious most people are to the operating system they're using. Heck, this complete disregard of the operating system is part of what made it easy for me to "sell" the idea of using Linux to people who owned HP laptops which had tremendous problems with Windows or to teachers who simply want to be able to use their computers rather than constantly be locked out of them. As long as the operating system manages to get the job done, they don't care if it's Linux or Windows. My dad is one such person. He actually much preferred Mint to Windows when I installed it on a cheap laptop I got him, but he's fine with Windows on the Intel NUC he eventually replaced that machine with. Until it bugs out, there is no reason to switch over. -- God be with you, CrudeSausage LibreOffice supporter John 14:6
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| From | Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-17 14:04 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrn10022jr.38ck.rotflol2@geidiprime.bvh> |
| In reply to | #689077 |
["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.] On 2025-04-17, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: > On 2025-04-16 23:06, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: >> On Wed, 16 Apr 2025 08:55:12 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: >> >>> At what point do we finally give up? >> >> When the people start to see through those vendors’ multi-million-dollar >> marketing campaigns telling everybody how wonderful they are. >> >> In other words, never. > > I would blame the ignorance of the common user much more than any > marketing campaign. You'd be surprised at how oblivious most people are > to the operating system they're using. Heck, this complete disregard of > the operating system is part of what made it easy for me to "sell" the > idea of using Linux to people who owned HP laptops which had tremendous > problems with Windows or to teachers who simply want to be able to use > their computers rather than constantly be locked out of them. As long as > the operating system manages to get the job done, they don't care if > it's Linux or Windows. My dad is one such person. He actually much > preferred Mint to Windows when I installed it on a cheap laptop I got > him, but he's fine with Windows on the Intel NUC he eventually replaced > that machine with. Until it bugs out, there is no reason to switch over. > Can confirm, at least in some cases. My wife needed a new laptop, but she wanted Apple. They're expensive, far more so when all you do is use a web-browser. So I said I'll take care of the laptop, I'll find one that is second hand, and will be supported for a long long time. (One of the bugbears she had about Apple was how the OS and software become obsolete and could not be upgraded). I put Linux, and there was a tiny bit of teething because it was different, but she's been using it for years successfully. She's has no idea about Linux, doesn't know she's running Fedora. Shes used my desktop machine, so had a little familiarity with it. But surprisingly, theres be no issues, and few questions, aside from "how do I copy files from the USB stick" and some desktop config. I think that people who know next to nothing, will find a switch to Linux easier, because they have so few ingraned workflows and expectations, and use the system at such a shallow level, that you could switch and they'll barely notice, as long as the desktop is roughly similar. It is more the intermediate users, who would be disrupted the most.
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| From | CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-17 10:14 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <z18MP.1648965$SZca.188541@fx13.iad> |
| In reply to | #689085 |
On 2025-04-17 10:04, Borax Man wrote: > ["Followup-To:" header set to comp.os.linux.advocacy.] > On 2025-04-17, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: >> On 2025-04-16 23:06, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote: >>> On Wed, 16 Apr 2025 08:55:12 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: >>> >>>> At what point do we finally give up? >>> >>> When the people start to see through those vendors’ multi-million-dollar >>> marketing campaigns telling everybody how wonderful they are. >>> >>> In other words, never. >> >> I would blame the ignorance of the common user much more than any >> marketing campaign. You'd be surprised at how oblivious most people are >> to the operating system they're using. Heck, this complete disregard of >> the operating system is part of what made it easy for me to "sell" the >> idea of using Linux to people who owned HP laptops which had tremendous >> problems with Windows or to teachers who simply want to be able to use >> their computers rather than constantly be locked out of them. As long as >> the operating system manages to get the job done, they don't care if >> it's Linux or Windows. My dad is one such person. He actually much >> preferred Mint to Windows when I installed it on a cheap laptop I got >> him, but he's fine with Windows on the Intel NUC he eventually replaced >> that machine with. Until it bugs out, there is no reason to switch over. >> > > Can confirm, at least in some cases. My wife needed a new laptop, but > she wanted Apple. They're expensive, far more so when all you do is use > a web-browser. So I said I'll take care of the laptop, I'll find one > that is second hand, and will be supported for a long long time. (One > of the bugbears she had about Apple was how the OS and software become > obsolete and could not be upgraded). I put Linux, and there was a tiny > bit of teething because it was different, but she's been using it for > years successfully. She's has no idea about Linux, doesn't know she's > running Fedora. Shes used my desktop machine, so had a little > familiarity with it. But surprisingly, theres be no issues, and few > questions, aside from "how do I copy files from the USB stick" and some > desktop config. That's part of why I didn't mind that my very low bid for this Apple laptop was successful, and that I needed to pursue the purchase. To an Apple user, this MacBook Air 2017 is obsolete and meant for little more than recycling. For me, it does everything I would need a laptop to do at work. With Linux, it stays out of the landfill and can continue to be used for another decade. Heck, I might use it until I retire. Unlike most other teachers, I am _aware_ that it uses Linux, but I am also aware that our work does not require this kind of hardware to be upgraded as often as our boards and manufacturers require us to. > I think that people who know next to nothing, will find a switch to > Linux easier, because they have so few ingraned workflows and > expectations, and use the system at such a shallow level, that you could > switch and they'll barely notice, as long as the desktop is roughly > similar. It is more the intermediate users, who would be disrupted the > most. The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating system in front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. -- God be with you, CrudeSausage LibreOffice supporter John 14:6
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| From | Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 05:36 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <vtsodk$2c76b$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #689089 |
On Thu, 17 Apr 2025 10:14:54 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: > The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who > were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so > stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that > much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating system in > front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or > Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. On Linux, “different GUIs” is not the same as “different operating systems”. Linux offers more variety of GUIs than all the rest of the computing world put together.
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| From | Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 09:23 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrn10046g5.4fb.rotflol2@geidiprime.bvh> |
| In reply to | #689140 |
On 2025-04-18, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote: > On Thu, 17 Apr 2025 10:14:54 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: > >> The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who >> were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so >> stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that >> much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating system in >> front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or >> Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. > > On Linux, “different GUIs” is not the same as “different operating > systems”. Linux offers more variety of GUIs than all the rest of the > computing world put together. Wont the obsolence of X11 put and end to that? Many Desktop Environments and Window Managers won't work at all on Wayland, from what I understand.
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| From | vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 09:35 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <m6ekmeFk2hbU3@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #689150 |
On Fri, 18 Apr 2025 09:23:17 -0000 (UTC), Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> wrote in <slrn10046g5.4fb.rotflol2@geidiprime.bvh>: > On 2025-04-18, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote: >> On Thu, 17 Apr 2025 10:14:54 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: >> >>> The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who >>> were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so >>> stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that >>> much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating system in >>> front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or >>> Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. >> >> On Linux, “different GUIs” is not the same as “different operating >> systems”. Linux offers more variety of GUIs than all the rest of the >> computing world put together. > > Wont the obsolence of X11 put and end to that? Many Desktop > Environments and Window Managers won't work at all on Wayland, from what > I understand. "They'll get my xfce desktop when they pry it from my cold, dead fingers..." Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. -- -v System76 Thelio Mega v1.1 x86_64 NVIDIA RTX 3090 Ti OS: Linux 6.14.2 Release: Mint 22.1 Mem: 258G "Madness takes its toll. Please have exact change."
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| From | vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 09:57 +0000 |
| Subject | Wayland (was: Re: Microsoft warns of blue screen crashes caused by April updates) |
| Message-ID | <m6elvrFk2hbU4@mid.individual.net> |
| In reply to | #689151 |
On 18 Apr 2025 09:35:11 GMT, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote in <m6ekmeFk2hbU3@mid.individual.net>: > "They'll get my xfce desktop when they pry it from my cold, dead fingers..." > > Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, > I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. Note commentary (and Wayland attitude) at following discussion: https://www.reddit.com/r/xfce/comments/10609bg/wayland/ One comment: ] For many Linux users, Wayland in its current state does not solve any ] problem or offer any particular benefit sufficient to justify replacing ] X11 with it. This is especially true of those who prefer to stick with ] stable conventions rather than prematurely adopt novel solutions, who ] account for a large proportion of the XFCE userbase and its development ] community. -- -v System76 Thelio Mega v1.1 x86_64 NVIDIA RTX 3090 Ti OS: Linux 6.14.2 Release: Mint 22.1 Mem: 258G "Anything not nailed down is a cat toy."
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| From | % <pursent100@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 06:21 -0700 |
| Subject | Re: Wayland |
| Message-ID | <PYudnWXfIcVAzJ_1nZ2dnZfqn_qdnZ2d@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #689152 |
vallor wrote: > On 18 Apr 2025 09:35:11 GMT, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote in > <m6ekmeFk2hbU3@mid.individual.net>: > >> "They'll get my xfce desktop when they pry it from my cold, dead > fingers..." >> >> Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, >> I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. > > Note commentary (and Wayland attitude) at following discussion: > > https://www.reddit.com/r/xfce/comments/10609bg/wayland/ > > One comment: > > ] For many Linux users, Wayland in its current state does not solve any > ] problem or offer any particular benefit sufficient to justify replacing > ] X11 with it. This is especially true of those who prefer to stick with > ] stable conventions rather than prematurely adopt novel solutions, who > ] account for a large proportion of the XFCE userbase and its development > ] community. > and more comlaints
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| From | Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 12:10 -0400 |
| Subject | Re: Wayland |
| Message-ID | <vttth6$3a9i8$2@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #689166 |
% wrote this post while blinking in Morse code: > vallor wrote: >> On 18 Apr 2025 09:35:11 GMT, vallor <vallor@cultnix.org> wrote in >> <m6ekmeFk2hbU3@mid.individual.net>: >> >>> "They'll get my xfce desktop when they pry it from my cold, dead >> fingers..." >>> >>> Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, >>> I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. >> >> Note commentary (and Wayland attitude) at following discussion: >> >> https://www.reddit.com/r/xfce/comments/10609bg/wayland/ >> >> One comment: >> >> ] For many Linux users, Wayland in its current state does not solve any >> ] problem or offer any particular benefit sufficient to justify replacing >> ] X11 with it. This is especially true of those who prefer to stick with >> ] stable conventions rather than prematurely adopt novel solutions, who >> ] account for a large proportion of the XFCE userbase and its development >> ] community. >> > and more comlaints Stop complaining, %. -- It turned out that the worm exploited three or four different holes in the system. From this, and the fact that we were able to capture and examine some of the source code, we realized that we were dealing with someone very sharp, probably not someone here on campus. -- Dr. Richard LeBlanc, associate professor of ICS, in Georgia Tech's campus newspaper after the Internet worm.
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| From | Farley Flud <fsquared@fsquared.linux> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 10:51 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <1837641f2fe84e75$90361$5831$802601b3@news.usenetexpress.com> |
| In reply to | #689151 |
On Fri, 18 Apr 2025 09:35:11 +0000, vallor wrote: > > Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, > I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. > From what I have read (I don't use that Wayland junk) a major problem is that X does not support multiple monitors with differing resolutions whereas Wayland does. However, in X multiple monitors are handled through an extension called "Xinerama," and I wonder if Xinerama could be fixed to correct the problem. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinerama -- Hail Linux! Hail FOSS! Hail Stallman!
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| From | Chris Ahlstrom <OFeem1987@teleworm.us> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 12:08 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <vtttea$3a9i8$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #689156 |
Farley Flud wrote this post while blinking in Morse code: > On Fri, 18 Apr 2025 09:35:11 +0000, vallor wrote: > >> Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, >> I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. > > From what I have read (I don't use that Wayland junk) a major problem > is that X does not support multiple monitors with differing resolutions > whereas Wayland does. > > However, in X multiple monitors are handled through an extension called > "Xinerama," and I wonder if Xinerama could be fixed to correct the problem. I've been using multiple monitors with differing resolutions via Xinerama for many years. At present, though, I have two identical monitors hooked to this mini PC. Just used arandr to reduce the resolution of them, it works. > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xinerama -- Yow! I just went below the poverty line!
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| From | Farley Flud <ff@linux.rocks> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-19 10:24 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <pan$24455$42356273$5a89508a$aa8ae17e@linux.rocks> |
| In reply to | #689178 |
On Fri, 18 Apr 2025 12:08:42 -0400, Chris Ahlstrom wrote: > > I've been using multiple monitors with differing resolutions via > Xinerama for many years. At present, though, I have two identical > monitors hooked to this mini PC. > It must have been something other than differing resolutions. I believe the issue issue is multiple monitors with variable refresh rate (VRR). Supposedly Wayland handles this better than X. -- Systemd: solving all the problems that you never knew you had.
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| From | % <pursent100@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 06:20 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <PYudnWrfIcUvzJ_1nZ2dnZfqn_oAAAAA@giganews.com> |
| In reply to | #689151 |
vallor wrote: > On Fri, 18 Apr 2025 09:23:17 -0000 (UTC), Borax Man <rotflol2@hotmail.com> > wrote in <slrn10046g5.4fb.rotflol2@geidiprime.bvh>: > >> On 2025-04-18, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote: >>> On Thu, 17 Apr 2025 10:14:54 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: >>> >>>> The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who >>>> were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so >>>> stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that >>>> much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating system in >>>> front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or >>>> Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. >>> >>> On Linux, “different GUIs” is not the same as “different operating >>> systems”. Linux offers more variety of GUIs than all the rest of the >>> computing world put together. >> >> Wont the obsolence of X11 put and end to that? Many Desktop >> Environments and Window Managers won't work at all on Wayland, from what >> I understand. > > "They'll get my xfce desktop when they pry it from my cold, dead fingers..." > > Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, > I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. > more complaints
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| From | CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 10:11 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <W3tMP.331322$j2D.9005@fx09.iad> |
| In reply to | #689165 |
On 4/18/25 09:20, % wrote: > vallor wrote: >> On Fri, 18 Apr 2025 09:23:17 -0000 (UTC), Borax Man >> <rotflol2@hotmail.com> >> wrote in <slrn10046g5.4fb.rotflol2@geidiprime.bvh>: >> >>> On 2025-04-18, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote: >>>> On Thu, 17 Apr 2025 10:14:54 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: >>>> >>>>> The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who >>>>> were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so >>>>> stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that >>>>> much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating >>>>> system in >>>>> front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or >>>>> Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. >>>> >>>> On Linux, “different GUIs” is not the same as “different operating >>>> systems”. Linux offers more variety of GUIs than all the rest of the >>>> computing world put together. >>> >>> Wont the obsolence of X11 put and end to that? Many Desktop >>> Environments and Window Managers won't work at all on Wayland, from what >>> I understand. >> >> "They'll get my xfce desktop when they pry it from my cold, dead >> fingers..." >> >> Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, >> I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. >> > more complaints Here's one way Wayland is better: full support of touchpad gestures. -- God be with you, CrudeSausage LibreOffice supporter John 14:6
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| From | RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 20:57 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrn1005f5h.2s2m.ronb02NOSPAM@3020m.home> |
| In reply to | #689175 |
On 2025-04-18, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: > On 4/18/25 09:20, % wrote: >> vallor wrote: >>> On Fri, 18 Apr 2025 09:23:17 -0000 (UTC), Borax Man >>> <rotflol2@hotmail.com> >>> wrote in <slrn10046g5.4fb.rotflol2@geidiprime.bvh>: >>> >>>> On 2025-04-18, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote: >>>>> On Thu, 17 Apr 2025 10:14:54 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: >>>>> >>>>>> The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who >>>>>> were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so >>>>>> stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that >>>>>> much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating >>>>>> system in >>>>>> front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or >>>>>> Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. >>>>> >>>>> On Linux, “different GUIs” is not the same as “different operating >>>>> systems”. Linux offers more variety of GUIs than all the rest of the >>>>> computing world put together. >>>> >>>> Wont the obsolence of X11 put and end to that? Many Desktop >>>> Environments and Window Managers won't work at all on Wayland, from what >>>> I understand. >>> >>> "They'll get my xfce desktop when they pry it from my cold, dead >>> fingers..." >>> >>> Seriously though, X11 continues to be viable and works well. So far, >>> I haven't seen anyone articulate why Wayland would be better. >>> >> more complaints > > Here's one way Wayland is better: full support of touchpad gestures. Not something that I use. I use the touchpad to move the cursor and scroll. I turn off the "tap to click" and disable the touchpad while typing. If I'm going to be using a laptop for an extended time, I'll bring a mouse. I realize that I'm probably in the minority but I like things simple. -- “Evil is not able to create anything new, it can only distort and destroy what has been invented or made by the forces of good.” —J.R.R. Tolkien
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| From | Farley Flud <ff@linux.rocks> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-19 10:01 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <pan$3be26$8425f5c8$d90f201a$137cde07@linux.rocks> |
| In reply to | #689175 |
On Fri, 18 Apr 2025 10:11:02 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: > > Here's one way Wayland is better: full support of touchpad gestures. > Guess again, retard. X has libstroke: http://fr2.rpmfind.net/linux/RPM/opensuse/tumbleweed/x86_64/libstroke0-0.5.1-236.4.x86_64.html Libstroke supports mouse/touchpad gestures within the software that chooses to use it. FVWM formerly did use it but it was dropped in FVWM3 due to very low demand. I think gestures are a silly idea. However libstroke will not support YOU because GNU/Linux does not support idiots. Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha! -- Systemd: solving all the problems that you never knew you had.
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| From | CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 07:24 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <YDqMP.737726$3pn5.159447@fx44.iad> |
| In reply to | #689150 |
On 4/18/25 05:23, Borax Man wrote: > On 2025-04-18, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote: >> On Thu, 17 Apr 2025 10:14:54 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: >> >>> The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who >>> were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so >>> stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that >>> much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating system in >>> front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or >>> Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. >> >> On Linux, “different GUIs” is not the same as “different operating >> systems”. Linux offers more variety of GUIs than all the rest of the >> computing world put together. > > Wont the obsolence of X11 put and end to that? Many Desktop > Environments and Window Managers won't work at all on Wayland, from what > I understand. Only Gnome and KDE seem to fully support Wayland. For everything else, it's experimental. That's part of why I'm not using Linux Mint at the moment. Cinnamon isn't scheduled to use Wayland until the 23.x releases which means that if you have a laptop and enjoy using gestures, you won't be getting full support there. -- God be with you, CrudeSausage LibreOffice supporter John 14:6
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| From | RonB <ronb02NOSPAM@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2025-04-18 20:51 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <slrn1005eqd.2s2m.ronb02NOSPAM@3020m.home> |
| In reply to | #689159 |
On 2025-04-18, CrudeSausage <crude@sausa.ge> wrote: > On 4/18/25 05:23, Borax Man wrote: >> On 2025-04-18, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <ldo@nz.invalid> wrote: >>> On Thu, 17 Apr 2025 10:14:54 -0400, CrudeSausage wrote: >>> >>>> The desktops being roughly similar is only a necessity for users who >>>> were already old when they learned MacOS or Windows and did so >>>> stubbornly. Considering how difficult it was for them to adopt that >>>> much, you wouldn't want to put an entirely different operating system in >>>> front of them. For anyone else, a switch from Windows to Gnome or >>>> Cinnamon shouldn't be such a chore. >>> >>> On Linux, “different GUIs” is not the same as “different operating >>> systems”. Linux offers more variety of GUIs than all the rest of the >>> computing world put together. >> >> Wont the obsolence of X11 put and end to that? Many Desktop >> Environments and Window Managers won't work at all on Wayland, from what >> I understand. > > Only Gnome and KDE seem to fully support Wayland. For everything else, > it's experimental. That's part of why I'm not using Linux Mint at the > moment. Cinnamon isn't scheduled to use Wayland until the 23.x releases > which means that if you have a laptop and enjoy using gestures, you > won't be getting full support there. I'm in no hurry for Wayland. If Linux Mint makes Wayland the default, I hope I'll still be able to revert to X11 with a one line change in the configuration. -- “Evil is not able to create anything new, it can only distort and destroy what has been invented or made by the forces of good.” —J.R.R. Tolkien
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