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Groups > comp.mobile.ipad > #58739

Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac

From Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Newsgroups misc.phone.mobile.iphone, comp.mobile.ipad, alt.internet.wireless
Subject Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac
Date 2016-09-17 07:46 +0000
Organization People for the Ethical Treatment of Pirates
Message-ID <e44amcFmc8sU8@mid.individual.net> (permalink)
References (10 earlier) <nr81t2$1p9a$3@gioia.aioe.org> <e3ph0hF4unfU9@mid.individual.net> <nrhcm4$1tbi$1@gioia.aioe.org> <e433b5Fdpk5U2@mid.individual.net> <nric5i$182j$1@gioia.aioe.org>

Cross-posted to 3 groups.

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On 2016-09-17, Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> wrote:
>
> I agree with you that, for morons

Insults are the last refuge of the intellectual coward.

> It's useless for someone who is intelligent.

It has absolutely nothing to do with intelligence or skill level, and
everything to do with security - something you clearly don't understand.

> So, for morons - it works fine.

It works fine for anyone. You're trolling, and it's lame.
  
>> • Since configuration of Apple routers does not use or require a user
>> name or password, the standard brute force attacks that work for most
>> other routers on the market *cannot* work for Apple routers. As
>> anyone knows, routers are constantly hit with such attacks once they
>> are connected to the internet.
>
> I can look at my router logs and see thousands upon thousands of these
> login requests. 
>
> But that doesn't change what we both agree upon, which is that for
> *intelligent* people, they'd be changing the username and password
> anyway.

And the security vulnerability associated with the brute force attack
vector you admit exists on other routers with web-based configuration
does not exist on Apple routers since there is no user name and password
combo that even exists. You don't ever set a user name on Apple routers
since configuration doesn't authenticate against a local user account on
the router. That attack vector therefore does not exist on Apple's
routers. tl;dr: no brute force attacks for Apple routers. It's got
nothing to do with the intelligence of the person using the router -
unless you consider that an intelligent person would recognize that
Apple's offering is more secure by design.

> So, it's only more secure "for morons" (which this all-Apple household
> is).
>
>> • The Apple router configuration interface is *not* based on the
>> typical open source web server setup that most routers on the market
>> use. As such, standard attacks that try to exploit vulnerabilities in
>> open source web servers used in most routers *cannot* work against
>> Apple routers.
>
> You don't understand a thing about proprietary software
> vulnerabilities.

Of course I do - I've been developing software all my life and am paid
handsomely to do it for a living. You don't know what I understand.

> All your statement means is that you move from open-source
> vulnerabilities to security-by-obscurity proprietary-software
> vulnerabilities.

Even if we ignore the fact that there is no user name (default or set by
the user) on Apple's routers to brute force attack, in this particular
case, since more brute force attacks you admit show up in your logs are
designed to exploit those open source web browsers in other web browser,
obscurity is a good thing because it means those attacks cannot work.
It's good you are starting to realize Apple's router is more secure by
design.

>> Apple's routers are easier to configure than most routers because:
>> 
>> • Rather than configuring Apple routers with clunky web pages served
>> by an open source web server on the router, you use a bone fide
>> macOS, iOS, or Windows application that is written explicitly for the
>> purpose of configuring Apple routers. Anyone who knows anything knows
>> that native applications give you a must more simple, robust, and
>> feature-rich user experience than the typical clunky web-based
>> configuration pages offered by most web browser.
>
> Well, as a user of those wondrous "bona fide MacOS, iOS, or Windows"
> applications from Apple (e.g., bonjour, Quicktime, iTunes, etc.),
> you've got to be kidding.

Nope, I'm serious.

> Geezus. You really do think an Apple app is *better* than an
> open-source app such as Firefox.

No, I said native apps were better than a web-based router configuration
page. Firefox happens to be a native app on macOS as well as on Linux.
Try harder to focus. iAnd try not to introduce red herrings like this in
the future, please. But since you mention it, I can easily list some
Apple applications that are *much* more functional that anything
available on Linux. Photoshop vs GIMP comes to mind. Most of the things
Linux excels at (mostly servers and so on) run on macOS as well though.
Not that this has anything to do with native versus web apps.

> Apple apps suck when compared, one on one, to open-source similar apps

Red herring. See above.

>> • For instance, rather than using a web browser and typing in the
>> router address to view a web page on the router and log in with
>> default user name and password, you simply open the native
>> application and it automatically discovers the router on the network
>> and connects to it, prompting you to set the administration password. 
>
> Again, what you're saying is that, for morons

Insults are the last refuge of the intellectual coward.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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Thread

Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-12 01:34 +0000
  Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-11 21:45 -0400
    Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac AL <noemail@invalid.com> - 2016-09-11 20:17 -0700
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-12 20:11 +0000
    Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-12 20:11 +0000
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 16:26 -0400
        Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-12 21:14 +0000
          Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 17:44 -0400
            Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 00:22 +0000
              Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 20:34 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 03:32 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 23:38 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 04:05 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-13 00:14 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 04:50 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-13 01:07 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:13 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-13 01:18 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:26 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 05:19 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 04:51 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 04:39 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:13 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 05:26 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-16 18:12 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-17 05:28 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-16 20:36 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-17 03:13 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-17 17:02 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-17 07:13 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-17 10:08 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-17 03:10 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-17 15:17 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-16 20:34 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-17 10:38 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-17 03:13 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-17 17:10 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-17 07:26 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-17 07:25 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-17 20:02 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-17 17:31 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-18 06:05 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-17 20:42 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-18 07:46 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-17 03:09 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-17 15:10 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-17 07:46 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-17 20:04 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-16 18:12 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-13 15:29 +1000
          Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-13 10:10 +1000
            Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 03:32 +0000
              Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 23:38 -0400
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-13 07:07 +1000
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-12 21:35 +0000
        Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac ElfinArc <elfinarc6@gmail.com> - 2016-09-12 16:44 -0500
        Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 00:21 +0000
          Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 00:48 +0000
            Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 20:50 -0400
              Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 02:07 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 04:05 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac "Rod Speed" <rod.speed.aaa@gmail.com> - 2016-09-13 15:20 +1000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:26 +0000
              Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 04:50 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 05:11 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:26 +0000
            Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 03:32 +0000
              Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 04:33 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:13 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-13 01:18 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:26 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 05:24 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:29 +0000
  Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-12 02:25 +0000
    Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-12 20:38 +0000
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 16:41 -0400
        Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 00:22 +0000
          Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 20:34 -0400
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-12 21:02 +0000
  Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac David Taylor <david-taylor@blueyonder.co.uk.invalid> - 2016-09-12 09:47 +0100
    Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-12 05:25 -0400
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-12 21:14 +0000
  Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Wade Garrett <wade@cooler.net> - 2016-09-12 09:00 -0400
    Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 00:22 +0000
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 03:31 +0000
      Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 04:49 +0000
        Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 05:08 +0000
          Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:26 +0000
            Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 05:30 +0000
              Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 05:42 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-13 01:49 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 06:10 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-13 02:19 -0400
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-14 04:41 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 05:51 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 06:10 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com> - 2016-09-13 06:14 +0000
                Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-14 04:40 +0000
            Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid> - 2016-09-13 01:49 -0400
              Re: Scanning for WiFI like inSSIDer on iOS & Macbook Pro & iMac Horace Algier <horatio@horatio.net> - 2016-09-13 06:10 +0000

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