Groups > comp.mobile.android > #62687 > unrolled thread

Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage anyway?

Started by	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
First post	2019-07-18 17:26 +0000
Last post	2019-07-20 23:06 +0100
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#62687 — Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage anyway?

From	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
Date	2019-07-18 17:26 +0000
Subject	Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage anyway?
Message-ID	<qgqa3p$db1$1@news.mixmin.net>

This question came up as a tangent to "cheap Android phones", which, by
their nature, don't offer much by way of internal storage.
o  Looking for cheap Android phone..... 
<https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/8-5aI_lSpHU>

A key question that arises from that discussion is:
Q: Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage anyway?

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#62699

From	lonelydad <lonelydad58@gmail.com>
Date	2019-07-19 00:29 +0000
Message-ID	<XnsAA90C638424EAlonelydad58gmailcom@69.16.179.29>
In reply to	#62687

"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net> wrote in
news:qgqa3p$db1$1@news.mixmin.net: 

> This question came up as a tangent to "cheap Android phones", which,
> by their nature, don't offer much by way of internal storage.
> o  Looking for cheap Android phone..... 
> <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/8-5aI_lSpH
> U> 
> 
> A key question that arises from that discussion is:
> Q: Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage
> anyway? 
> 

Basically, they want you to get set up with their free space, so that when 
you realize you need more, you will be more likely to just rent it from 
them than shop around for the best deal.

More than likelyl, they also get some consideration from their service host 
for the number of different users they have.

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#62702

From	Flasherly <Flasherly@live.com>
Date	2019-07-19 05:08 -0400
Message-ID	<0ov2jehm6dgnttdk74updfsldmesvfi1qs@4ax.com>
In reply to	#62699

On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 00:29:08 GMT, lonelydad <lonelydad58@gmail.com>
wrote:

>> Q: Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage
>> anyway? 

With Microsoft, it was getting its ass kicked, didn't like it, over
*Droid operating systems:  They then needed new and profitable
branches, after effectively telling Windows' users that they wouldn't
be holding their hands anymore, that Windows 10 was a secondary
consideration their answer, and solution, to the cloud: Like the
*Droids, Windows 10 is marketing you after you non-implicitly agree,
pay to buy the OS, on Microsoft licensing terms.  And they did well
enough through branching into cloud services as a venture strategy.

If you're going to the trouble to store, encrypting personal data
exclusively on your own personal computer, then you're everything
about what cloud storage is not.  You're not a free source or about
helping others to study and make money off you. 

You speak in clear and concise terms subservient to cloud linguistics
and you'll be understood, which is what normal, take life should be
provided and engineered for -- what you may take for granted.  Click
you fingers, and that's just what cloud services want to hear: An
Amazon Alexis voice logic branch response, operating from cloud
services, finely tuned for automation, will provide the correctly
reinforcement patterns you expect and want to hear.  Speak loud and
clear with confidence, knowing your every wish will be granted from
the most of all possible options. Anything you want will be then
delivered to your doorstep by legions of low-paid workers, running
their own vehicles for Walmart or a local Amazon warehouse, after or
in all hours, before anybody else, now, in a private helicopter, from
an AI mechanism driving in bike lanes, least to exclude improvements
of a socially responsible way to replace any hassle of human
contingent or contact;- eventually they'll be fired en masse.

Clouds are about making your money talk in only one acceptable way,
while anything less, along with the rest of the bullshit, walks. It's
really all about you and you come first.

Hope that helps.

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#62723

From	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
Date	2019-07-20 16:18 +0000
Message-ID	<qgvesi$775$1@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#62699

On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 00:29:08 GMT, lonelydad wrote:

> Basically, they want you to get set up with their free space, so that when 
> you realize you need more, you will be more likely to just rent it from 
> them than shop around for the best deal.
> 
> More than likelyl, they also get some consideration from their service host 
> for the number of different users they have.

Hi lonelydad,

Your adult on-topic response is well appreciated, as the trolls are really
flying on this thread (since they have no on-topic value to add).

I think you're correct as I don't see them making much money off anything
else (although Google is big on meta data).

They likely make their money just like a grocery store makes money on "two
for one" sales, where they hope you'll buy more.

So far, yours is the only conclusion that passes logical scrutiny; but
let's await logical responses from others before we conclude that's how the
free cloud storage outfits make their money.

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#62701

From	"Cybe R. Wizard" <cybe_r_wizard@WizardsTower.invalid>
Date	2019-07-18 20:41 -0500
Message-ID	<20190718204142.4ddcae03@WizardsTower>
In reply to	#62687

On Thu, 18 Jul 2019 17:26:18 -0000 (UTC)
"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net> wrote:

> This question came up as a tangent to "cheap Android phones", which,
> by their nature, don't offer much by way of internal storage.
> o  Looking for cheap Android phone..... 
> <https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.mobile.android/8-5aI_lSpHU>
> 
> A key question that arises from that discussion is:
> Q: Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage
> anyway?

???  Seriously?

Because they get free access to your data, of course.
Additionally, they might get government funds to make constitutional
guarantees of privacy moot.  After all, almost all of these companies
will knuckle under to any warrant offered up and besides, if you give
your data away there's no guarantees remaining that are valid..

-- 
Cybe R. Wizard

There is no cloud; there's only other peoples' computers.

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#62705

From	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
Date	2019-07-19 18:54 +0000
Message-ID	<qgt3ls$6ac$1@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#62701

On Thu, 18 Jul 2019 20:41:42 -0500, Cybe R. Wizard wrote:

> Because they get free access to your data, of course.

Yes, they get your data - but how do they BENEFIT from getting it?

Who are "they" anyway?

Googling....this is from 2015 so it may be dated...
o The 25 Most Valuable Cloud Computing Companies Are Worth Way More Than You'd Think
<https://www.businessinsider.com/25-most-valuable-cloud-companies-2015-1>

Oh oh ... when they say "cloud services", they mean other things, e.g., 
#1: Salesforce 36 billion, It offers cloud-based customer relationship
management and marketing software.

#2: LinkedIn: 28 billion, LinkedIn is a social network for business
professionals that offers cloud-based recruiting software.

#3: Workday: $15 billion, Workday offers cloud-based human resources and
finance software.
etc.

Changing that Google search a bit, we get:
o The Best Free Cloud Storage Services for Backup in 2019
<https://www.lifewire.com/free-cloud-storage-1356638>

SIDENOTE: Sometimes I wonder if they don't just CHANGE the title every
year, from
o The Best Free Cloud Storage Services for Backup in 2017
o The Best Free Cloud Storage Services for Backup in 2018
o The Best Free Cloud Storage Services for Backup in 2019
etc.

Anyway, they list as the top five:
1: Mega <https://mega.nz/>
2: pCloud <https://www.pcloud.com/>
3: MediaFire <https://www.mediafire.com/upgrade/>
4: DropBox <https://www.dropbox.com/individual/plans-comparison>
5: Box <https://account.box.com>

Hmmmm.... I'm surprised that Apple, Google, and Microsoft aren't there.
Looking forward...we FINALLY get to the big boys...
6: FlipDrive <https://www.flipdrive.com/site/pricing>
7: GoogleDrive <https://www.google.com/drive/>
8: OneDrive <https://onedrive.live.com/about/en-us/plans/>
9: YandexDisk <https://disk.yandex.com/>
10: Sync <https://www.sync.com/>

So that accounts for three of the four big boys, but where's Apple?
11: JumpShare <https://jumpshare.com/pricing>
12: MyDrive <https://www.mydrive.ch/>
13: Amazon Drive <https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/home>
14: TencentCloud <https://www.weiyun.com/>
15: Degoo <https://degoo.com/>

Hmmmmmm.... we have Amazon, DropBox, Microsoft, Google, but still no Apple.

Why would Apple not be represented in the top cloud storage solutions?
??: Apple iCloud <https://www.apple.com/icloud/>

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#62706

From	William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca>
Date	2019-07-19 20:40 +0000
Message-ID	<qgt9sn$hgt$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#62705

On 2019-07-19, Arlen G. Holder <arlingholder@nospam.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 18 Jul 2019 20:41:42 -0500, Cybe R. Wizard wrote:
>
>> Because they get free access to your data, of course.
>
> Yes, they get your data - but how do they BENEFIT from getting it?

They sell it to whomever. Advertisers kwho want to know all about you.
Political parties who want to tailor their lies to your prejudices.
Governments who want to know what you think and do.

>
> Who are "they" anyway?

YOu were the one that asked. 

>
> Googling....this is from 2015 so it may be dated...
> o The 25 Most Valuable Cloud Computing Companies Are Worth Way More Than You'd Think
><https://www.businessinsider.com/25-most-valuable-cloud-companies-2015-1>
>
> Oh oh ... when they say "cloud services", they mean other things, e.g., 
> #1: Salesforce 36 billion, It offers cloud-based customer relationship
> management and marketing software.
>
> #2: LinkedIn: 28 billion, LinkedIn is a social network for business
> professionals that offers cloud-based recruiting software.
>
> #3: Workday: $15 billion, Workday offers cloud-based human resources and
> finance software.
> etc.
>
> Changing that Google search a bit, we get:
> o The Best Free Cloud Storage Services for Backup in 2019
><https://www.lifewire.com/free-cloud-storage-1356638>
>
> SIDENOTE: Sometimes I wonder if they don't just CHANGE the title every
> year, from
> o The Best Free Cloud Storage Services for Backup in 2017
> o The Best Free Cloud Storage Services for Backup in 2018
> o The Best Free Cloud Storage Services for Backup in 2019
> etc.
>
> Anyway, they list as the top five:
> 1: Mega <https://mega.nz/>
> 2: pCloud <https://www.pcloud.com/>
> 3: MediaFire <https://www.mediafire.com/upgrade/>
> 4: DropBox <https://www.dropbox.com/individual/plans-comparison>
> 5: Box <https://account.box.com>
>
> Hmmmm.... I'm surprised that Apple, Google, and Microsoft aren't there.
> Looking forward...we FINALLY get to the big boys...
> 6: FlipDrive <https://www.flipdrive.com/site/pricing>
> 7: GoogleDrive <https://www.google.com/drive/>
> 8: OneDrive <https://onedrive.live.com/about/en-us/plans/>
> 9: YandexDisk <https://disk.yandex.com/>
> 10: Sync <https://www.sync.com/>
>
> So that accounts for three of the four big boys, but where's Apple?
> 11: JumpShare <https://jumpshare.com/pricing>
> 12: MyDrive <https://www.mydrive.ch/>
> 13: Amazon Drive <https://www.amazon.com/clouddrive/home>
> 14: TencentCloud <https://www.weiyun.com/>
> 15: Degoo <https://degoo.com/>
>
> Hmmmmmm.... we have Amazon, DropBox, Microsoft, Google, but still no Apple.
>
> Why would Apple not be represented in the top cloud storage solutions?
> ??: Apple iCloud <https://www.apple.com/icloud/>

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#62707

From	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
Date	2019-07-19 23:57 +0000
Message-ID	<qgtldv$4a0$1@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#62706

On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 20:40:55 -0000 (UTC), William Unruh wrote:

>> Yes, they get your data - but how do they BENEFIT from getting it?
> 
> They sell it to whomever. Advertisers kwho want to know all about you.
> Political parties who want to tailor their lies to your prejudices.
> Governments who want to know what you think and do.

Is that really true William Unruh that they "sell your data"?

I think, as I recall, you're a professor of physics, as I recall, but I
might be wrong.

If you are, that means you can certainly follow complex equations.
Each term in a complex equation has specific meaning - which is important.

When you say they "sell your data", do you mean 'data' or 'meta data'?

The reason I ask is that they're quite different where, I don't think they
actually sell your data outright (except under subpoena), do they?

> > Who are "they" anyway?
> YOu were the one that asked. 

I don't put ANY of my data on the cloud if I can help it.
So I'm asking about the OTHERS who DO put their data on the cloud - which
ones they use.

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#62709

From	123456789 <12345@12345.com>
Date	2019-07-19 18:26 -0700
Message-ID	<almarsoft.6653519413841860428@news.aioe.org>
In reply to	#62707

"Arlen G. Holder" wrote:

> I don't put ANY of my data on the cloud if I can help it.

But of course you CAN'T help it.

If you go to the doctor, use a credit card, pay taxes, etc,
your very personal data is already in the cloud...

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#62724

From	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
Date	2019-07-20 16:44 +0000
Message-ID	<qgvgci$9r0$1@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#62709

On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 18:26:41 -0700, 123456789 wrote:

> If you go to the doctor, use a credit card, pay taxes, etc,
> your very personal data is already in the cloud...

Hi 123456789,

Yours is an interesting and yet perfectly valid response to the question,
where I think we have a problem of definitions varying (and conflicting).
<https://i.postimg.cc/6Q9VZrMf/storage.jpg>

1. When I say cloud, I only mean "consumer cloud data storage".
2. However, when I googled, up came "B2B cloud services".
3. And your post seems to mean "any data storage on someone's server".
4. While others seem to infer that "cloud" === Internet, to them.

Given this confusion, I think I should henceforth not use the word "cloud"
alone, since it means at least four completely different things to people,
apparently.

For _this_ thread, when I use the word "cloud", I mean only the specific
type of *consumer oriented* personal data storage solutions offered by the
big three (or maybe the big five or half dozen):
o Google One vs. Dropbox, OneDrive, Box, Amazon, and iCloud in 2018
<https://www.cloudfuze.com/google-one-vs-dropbox-onedrive-box-amazon-and-icloud-in-2018/>

*CONSUMER CLOUD PROVIDERS* <https://i.postimg.cc/6Q9VZrMf/storage.jpg>
1. GoogleDrive aka GoogleOne (15GB)
2. Box (10GB)
3. AmazonDrive (5GB)
4. OneDrive (5GB)
5. iCloud (5GB)
6. DropBox (2GB)

As described in these "cloud storage" references I just skimmed:
o The best cloud storage provider: Dropbox, Google Drive, OneDrive & iCloud Drive compared
<https://www.techly.com.au/2019/02/18/best-cloud-storage-provider-dropbox-google-drive-onedrive-icloud-drive-compared/>

o OneDrive, Dropbox, Google Drive and Box: Which cloud storage service is right for you?
<https://www.cnet.com/how-to/onedrive-dropbox-google-drive-and-box-which-cloud-storage-service-is-right-for-you/>

o Cloud storage: How secure are Dropbox, OneDrive, Google Drive and iCloud?
<https://www.alphr.com/apple/1000326/cloud-storage-how-secure-are-dropbox-onedrive-google-drive-and-icloud>

o Best of The Big Three: Dropbox vs Google Drive vs Onedrive
<https://www.cloudwards.net/dropbox-vs-google-drive-vs-onedrive/>

o DROPBOX VS GOOGLE DRIVE VS ONEDRIVE VS ICLOUD VS AMAZON DRIVE
<https://5best.cloud/dropbox-vs-google-drive-vs-onedrive-vs-icloud-vs-amazon-drive/>

In summary, how do _they_ make their money by offering consumers a small
amount of free persponal data storage for _home_ Windows, Linux, iOS,
Android, and Mac users? <https://i.postimg.cc/6Q9VZrMf/storage.jpg>

Do they make their money mostly on what lonelydad described as upgrades for
consumers who need _more_ storage than what they provid for free?

If so, what rationale do people use for renting their data for the rest of
their lives, versus just storing the data on inexpensive removable drives
stored in a safe place?

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#62725

From	123456789 <12345@12345.com>
Date	2019-07-20 10:45 -0700
Message-ID	<qgvk0g$u62$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#62724

Arlen G. Holder wrote:
> 123456789 wrote:

>>> I don't put ANY of my data on the cloud if I can help
>>> it.

>> If you go to the doctor, use a credit card, pay taxes,
>>  etc, your very personal data is already in the 
>> cloud...

> When I say cloud, I only mean "consumer cloud data 
> storage"

It apparently makes you feel better to ignore those many
business/government servers containing your most personal
information. IMO you may have your head in the cloud (pun
intended).

It seems that every day I read something about another
government/business server (tax, doctor, credit card, etc.)
being hacked. Not to mention all the employees who have
access and can use your info nefariously.

So while I may be vulnerable using a consumer cloud service
(even though I encrypt and am only one account among
hundreds of millions-what are the chances...), my point
is that you are perhaps already as much (or more) vulnerable
than me using my (consumer) cloud account.

And since you use only in-home backup your data may also be
vulnerable to natural or criminal causes...

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#62729

From	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
Date	2019-07-20 20:55 +0000
Message-ID	<qgvv37$3te$1@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#62725

On Sat, 20 Jul 2019 10:45:50 -0700, 123456789 wrote:

> It apparently makes you feel better to ignore those many
> business/government servers containing your most personal
> information. IMO you may have your head in the cloud (pun
> intended).

Hi 123456789,
WTF?
Just because _this_ thread is about personal cloud services, doesn't mean
it makes me feel better to not talk about completely different topics.

It just means I'm trying to stay on topic.
There are PLENTY of other topics suggesting we store NOTHING on the net
o  More reasons to store NOTHING on the Internet: Facebook exposes hundreds of millions of user login/passwords IN CLEARTEXT since 2012! 
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/xLludXWVYgQ/bWjJxIPuAwAJ>

> It seems that every day I read something about another
> government/business server (tax, doctor, credit card, etc.)
> being hacked. Not to mention all the employees who have
> access and can use your info nefariously.

Yup. I post them as separate threads when I find them, for example...
 o  Yet more proof Apple doesn't test software sufficiently (this time not only from Facebook but also from Expedia, Hollister and Hotels.com) 
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/8HfdPOQVNVk/dtPTyTltCgAJ>

> So while I may be vulnerable using a consumer cloud service
> (even though I encrypt and am only one account among
> hundreds of millions-what are the chances...), my point
> is that you are perhaps already as much (or more) vulnerable
> than me using my (consumer) cloud account.

We've covered, in detail, the lack of PRIVACY on ANY platform:
o  What is the factual truth about PRIVACY differences or similarities between the Android & iOS mobile phone ecosystems? 
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/MiZixhidmOs/GKOcH9eUAAAJ>

> And since you use only in-home backup your data may also be
> vulnerable to natural or criminal causes...

We've covered that topic, in gory detail, in the past also:
o  Do people of reasonable technical ability store their private data on the Internet (if so, for what gain?) 
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/E0TkTd-zLuk/fF1RRv51AwAJ>

The difference is that THIS THREAD is asking a simple question:
Q: How do the big six make their money on personal cloud storage?
 <https://i.postimg.cc/6Q9VZrMf/storage.jpg>
1. GoogleDrive aka GoogleOne (15GB)
2. Box (10GB)
3. AmazonDrive (5GB)
4. OneDrive (5GB)
5. iCloud (5GB)
6. DropBox (2GB)

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#62710

From	"Cybe R. Wizard" <cybe_r_wizard@WizardsTower.invalid>
Date	2019-07-19 20:27 -0500
Message-ID	<20190719202733.7e8bbfe4@WizardsTower>
In reply to	#62707

On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 23:57:52 -0000 (UTC)
"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net> wrote:

> On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 20:40:55 -0000 (UTC), William Unruh wrote:
> 
> >> Yes, they get your data - but how do they BENEFIT from getting
> >> it?  
> > 
> > They sell it to whomever. Advertisers kwho want to know all about
> > you. Political parties who want to tailor their lies to your
> > prejudices. Governments who want to know what you think and do.  
> 
> Is that really true William Unruh that they "sell your data"?
> 
> I think, as I recall, you're a professor of physics, as I recall, but
> I might be wrong.
> 
> If you are, that means you can certainly follow complex equations.
> Each term in a complex equation has specific meaning - which is
> important.
> 
> When you say they "sell your data", do you mean 'data' or 'meta data'?
> 
> The reason I ask is that they're quite different where, I don't think
> they actually sell your data outright (except under subpoena), do
> they?
> 
> > > Who are "they" anyway?  
> > YOu were the one that asked.   
> 
> I don't put ANY of my data on the cloud if I can help it.
> So I'm asking about the OTHERS who DO put their data on the cloud -
> which ones they use.

I assume that you know that what you said there was not in the least
akin to the question you originally asked.

In Message-ID: <qgqa3p$db1$1@news.mixmin.net> you asked:
------------
"Q: Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage
anyway?"
------------

Shift goalposts much?  What do you /REALLY/ want to know?

-- 
Cybe R. Wizard

Beliefs are the diluting ice cubes in the chilled chardonnay of
experience.
 	Zorg

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#62734

From	Jolly Roger <jollyroger@pobox.com>
Date	2019-07-20 23:54 +0000
Message-ID	<gphntgFt3raU4@mid.individual.net>
In reply to	#62710

On 2019-07-20, Cybe R. Wizard <cybe_r_wizard@WizardsTower.invalid> wrote:
>
> I assume that you know that what you said there was not in the least
> akin to the question you originally asked.
>
> In Message-ID: <qgqa3p$db1$1@news.mixmin.net> you asked:
> ------------
> "Q: Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage
> anyway?"
> ------------
>
> Shift goalposts much?  What do you /REALLY/ want to know?

He's trolling. It's what he does.

-- 
E-mail sent to this address may be devoured by my ravenous SPAM filter.
I often ignore posts from Google. Use a real news client instead.

JR

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#62711

From	William Unruh <unruh@invalid.ca>
Date	2019-07-20 07:47 +0000
Message-ID	<qgugue$s7o$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to	#62707

On 2019-07-19, Arlen G. Holder <arlingholder@nospam.net> wrote:
> On Fri, 19 Jul 2019 20:40:55 -0000 (UTC), William Unruh wrote:
>
>>> Yes, they get your data - but how do they BENEFIT from getting it?
>> 
>> They sell it to whomever. Advertisers kwho want to know all about you.
>> Political parties who want to tailor their lies to your prejudices.
>> Governments who want to know what you think and do.
>
> Is that really true William Unruh that they "sell your data"?
>
> I think, as I recall, you're a professor of physics, as I recall, but I
> might be wrong.
>
> If you are, that means you can certainly follow complex equations.
> Each term in a complex equation has specific meaning - which is important.
>
> When you say they "sell your data", do you mean 'data' or 'meta data'?
>
> The reason I ask is that they're quite different where, I don't think they
> actually sell your data outright (except under subpoena), do they?
>
>> > Who are "they" anyway?
>> YOu were the one that asked. 
>
> I don't put ANY of my data on the cloud if I can help it.
> So I'm asking about the OTHERS who DO put their data on the cloud - which
> ones they use.

No, you asked why some companies give away free cloud access. 
You did NOT ask what others do.
Read their license which they force you to sign if you use their
services. Then decide if you actually believe that they follow that,
when there is absolutely no way in which you can test whether they
follow the terms they claim to follow. 

Look at Accuweather now, which forces you to sign an agreement that they
can sell your information to advertisers in order to use their services.
At least they ar honest. I am not at all sure that many of the other
companies are honest. 

If you are going to use cloud services, use encryption on all materials
you store there.

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#62717

From	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
Date	2019-07-20 14:37 +0000
Message-ID	<qgv8v1$t4h$1@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#62711

On Sat, 20 Jul 2019 07:47:26 -0000 (UTC), William Unruh wrote:

> No, you asked why some companies give away free cloud access. 
> You did NOT ask what others do.

When I said "cloud storage", I had meant the storage that "they" (Apple,
Google, Microsoft, DropBox) give away for free (and then charge for larger
amounts) to personal users.

Since I have Apple & Android & Microsoft products, I see them (Apple,
Google, Microsoft) offering me that "free" cloud storage, which I never
take them up on (since I store my personal data on my personal storage
devices).
o What are some key common databases you often SHARE between your desktop & mobile devices?
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ovnHGVriYsI/0frYPkC3AQAJ>

They don't make money off of me, that I know of, at least not purposefully,
although I admit I use Google Gmail which _does_ make money off of me I'm
sure. 

For Android, I simply back up to the desktop (sometimes via the external sd
slot). For Apple, I don't use the utterly puny (worthless IMHO), 5GB iCloud
that Apple provides (which wouldn't fit even one twenty-fifth of a single
full data backup) and I turn off all the OneDrive requests from Microsoft,
(as backing up a desktop to external storage is about as simple as it
gets). 

Personally, I can't imagine _why_ people put their private files into cloud
storage - but the companies sure do push them on us - so they must be
making money somehow by offering that "free" cloud storage:
o Microsoft (15GB free, nominally)
o Google (15GB free, nominally)
o Apple (5GB free, nominally)
o DropBox (2GB free, nominally)
<https://www.lapopmag.com/articles/cloud-storage-comparison>

> Read their license which they force you to sign if you use their
> services. Then decide if you actually believe that they follow that,
> when there is absolutely no way in which you can test whether they
> follow the terms they claim to follow. 

Everyone says that bullshit, Bill - but it's not practical for a bunch of
reasons, all of which you and everyone else already knows.
o The license terms are often many pages long
o They're filled to the brim with legalese
o Any one sentence in that legalese can be interpreted to be your 1st born
o And, as you noted, you have to believe them (which we know they lie)

> Look at Accuweather now, which forces you to sign an agreement that they
> can sell your information to advertisers in order to use their services.
> At least they ar honest. I am not at all sure that many of the other
> companies are honest. 

These four companies are certainly making money on your "free" data.
o Microsoft
o Google
o Apple
o DropBox

The question is how.

> If you are going to use cloud services, use encryption on all materials
> you store there.

Hehheh... I've said that many times, where I suggest to the Apple users
that they should encrypt their files using any free multi-level encryption
such as those afforded by Veracrypt/Truecrypt containers - where nospam
constantly brazen claims (wrongly so) that Apple already provides
Veracrypt-style encrypted file containers natively (which is just dead
wrong on his part).

o Does the iTunes app store have any free disk encryption container software?
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/tYfHGdpTBAAJ>

o Do people of reasonable technical ability store their private data on the Internet (if so, for what gain?)
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/E0TkTd-zLuk/q8-pjDRsBAAJ>

Personally, I avoid those "free" cloud services.

Worse, I feel only lazy people use them.
o Do people of reasonable technical ability store their private data on the Internet (if so, for what gain?)
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/E0TkTd-zLuk/fF1RRv51AwAJ>

Even my CALENDAR is stored locally.
o Does a free offline non-Internet calendar app exist for iOS that imports/exports ICS text files?
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/OzUOmgJLmZs/Xzx9DMxnFAAJ>

So are my passwords stored locally.
o Do you have a working cross-platform PASSWD database for Windows, Linux, Mac, iOS, & Android on your home LAN?
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/5Z15v7xP8so/nhvO3FXDDQAJ>

And I've since ditched my main Google Gmail account for non-Google ones.
o Let's document the best known current free REPLACEMENTS for Google "mail" account - so all benefit from our efforts
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ZWYX6lCW0ck/lYYneXXkBAAJ>

In summary, I strive to keep my personal data off the cloud, but most
people, it seems, rampantly store their personal data on the cloud.

I'm simply asking the very basic question here of how they (Apple, Google,
Microsoft, DropBox) make money by giving you that "free" cloud storage for
your personal data.

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#62718

From	nospam <nospam@nospam.invalid>
Date	2019-07-20 11:02 -0400
Message-ID	<200720191102341593%nospam@nospam.invalid>
In reply to	#62717

In article <qgv8v1$t4h$1@news.mixmin.net>, Arlen G. Holder
<arlingholder@nospam.net> wrote:

> > If you are going to use cloud services, use encryption on all materials
> > you store there.
> 
> Hehheh... I've said that many times, where I suggest to the Apple users
> that they should encrypt their files using any free multi-level encryption
> such as those afforded by Veracrypt/Truecrypt containers - where nospam
> constantly brazen claims (wrongly so) that Apple already provides
> Veracrypt-style encrypted file containers natively (which is just dead
> wrong on his part).

once again, you are lying.

i *never* said apple provides veracrypt-style containers.

other companies do not provide that either, including google.

what i said was that everything on ios devices is fully encrypted, as
is everything in icloud for that matter, which is *much* better than
what you propose.

not only that, but the usb port on ios devices is disabled while the
device is locked (other than for charging), making it impossible to
even access the encrypted data at all. 

the only option is to take it apart and forensically examine the memory
chips, except that everything is encrypted, so that won't get very far.

that is *not* the case with android.

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#62722

From	"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net>
Date	2019-07-20 16:13 +0000
Message-ID	<qgvej0$6lp$1@news.mixmin.net>
In reply to	#62718

On Sat, 20 Jul 2019 11:02:34 -0400, nospam wrote:

> i *never* said apple provides veracrypt-style containers.

Hi nospam,

*Please act like an _adult_ for once*
o Children like you, nospam, are the epitome of what's bad about Usenet.
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/59PJn5R9BAAJ>

On a large list such as this, I'm not dropping to your level of silly
childish fifth-grade games you and that other petty child Cybe(R) Wizard
_always_ play (as does Dan Purgert & Rudy Wieser, Char Jackson, Jolly
Roger, BK, Lewis, et al.). 
o Does the iTunes app store have any free disk encryption container software?
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/tYfHGdpTBAAJ>

You're all children who can't ever add any on-topic value so you play your
silly petty fifth-grade childish games ad infinitum. You play your silly
"goal post" games where you weasel every which way, given you're the
PERFECT epitome (as is Cybe(R) Wizard) of the canonical Usenet trolls.

*I REFERENCE my facts nospam - while you simply _fabricate_ everything*.

The proof you said it (many times) is in the very thread I referenced,
where even the other Apple lovers told you to STFU since you were clearly
playing your Apple Apologist games of fabricating wholly imaginary iOS
functionality that you KNOW doesn't exist (it never did).
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/3QpeWWlrBAAJ>
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/L2I6ZIx0BAAJ>
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/4Z_AnaV1BAAJ>
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/8mFN-qF6BAAJ>
 <>

Here's where others told you to stop claiming imaginary Apple functionality:
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/JC6IPep3BAAJ>
<https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/ACvkdg_zvDI/tZcIJq55BAAJ>

This is the proof, and I'm NOT responding to any more of the childish
drivel from the likes of you and the other well-known children on this ng.
o The real question is Why do Apple Apologists _hate_ facts about Apple products?
 <https://groups.google.com/d/msg/misc.phone.mobile.iphone/boEv7_ePPQ0/ck2VBgaaCgAJ>

-- 
This is my one and only post in this thread to the childish petty posters
such as Cybe(R) Wizard and nospam and Dan Purgert and Wolf K and Char
Jackson, and Frank Slootweg, et al.

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#62726

From	"Cybe R. Wizard" <cybe_r_wizard@WizardsTower.invalid>
Date	2019-07-20 13:21 -0500
Message-ID	<20190720132146.2b90d39a@WizardsTower>
In reply to	#62722

On Sat, 20 Jul 2019 16:13:21 -0000 (UTC)
"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net> wrote:

> You play your silly
> "goal post" games where you weasel every which way, given you're the
> PERFECT epitome (as is Cybe(R) Wizard) of the canonical Usenet trolls.
> 
> *I REFERENCE my facts nospam - while you simply _fabricate_
> everything*.

Why, then, do you completely refuse to reference this "fact" of yours:

Arelene Holdout said:
----------
"I have likely written over ten thousand tutorials, where at my last
company, I wrote over five thousand alone. On the Internet, I don't know
how many I have, but if you assume that I write one a day sometimes,
and at least one a week, I have many thousands "
----------

Shut me up about it merely by showing that searchable list or tutorials.
Hell, just show the list.  

The instant that you show a viable list of TEN THOUSAND tutorials that
YOU have written I will shut up about it FOREVER, I guarantee and
promise. 

***Be a man*** or 'fess up to being a liar, otherwise.

Failing to do either, you are just and only a liar.  ...and not much of
a man, either.

Seriously, I've known several actual writers who produce copious
amounts of for-profit text and each and every one keeps a list of, not
only publications, all their written material.  Aren't you a
serious writer?  Where's your list?

C'mon, an honest man would either pony up that list gladly or accept
and admit to being a liar and having no list or any idea as to the
number written.

Which will it be, or are you also duplicitous and conniving?

My bet is on your being and exposing yourself to be a duplicitous and
conniving liar by once again NOT showing that linked list.

A lie of omission is just as much a lie as one of commission.

-- 
Cybe R. Wizard

"Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that
there is no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy with the proof."
	J. K. Galbraith

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#62730

From	Boris T. <bt@lsd.invalid>
Date	2019-07-20 16:00 -0500
Message-ID	<prv6jedobuf50ffoaqb223amla4k3lip3h@4ax.com>
In reply to	#62726

On Sat, 20 Jul 2019 13:21:46 -0500, "Cybe R. Wizard"
<cybe_r_wizard@WizardsTower.invalid> wrote:

>On Sat, 20 Jul 2019 16:13:21 -0000 (UTC)
>"Arlen G. Holder" <arlingholder@nospam.net> wrote:
>
>> You play your silly
>> "goal post" games where you weasel every which way, given you're the
>> PERFECT epitome (as is Cybe(R) Wizard) of the canonical Usenet trolls.
>> 
>> *I REFERENCE my facts nospam - while you simply _fabricate_
>> everything*.
>
>Why, then, do you completely refuse to reference this "fact" of yours:
>
>Arelene Holdout said:
>----------
>"I have likely written over ten thousand tutorials, where at my last
>company, I wrote over five thousand alone. On the Internet, I don't know
>how many I have, but if you assume that I write one a day sometimes,
>and at least one a week, I have many thousands "
>----------
>
>Shut me up about it merely by showing that searchable list or tutorials.
>Hell, just show the list.  
>
>The instant that you show a viable list of TEN THOUSAND tutorials that
>YOU have written I will shut up about it FOREVER, I guarantee and
>promise.

You're aiming too low. Surely it's up above 11,000 by now, after all
these months. Maybe even 12,000. After all, he claimed to be cranking
them out at a furious pace.

-- 
Townsend

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csiph-web

Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage anyway?

Contents

#62687 — Why do the big marketing organizations offer free cloud storage anyway?

#62699

#62702

#62723

#62701

#62705

#62706

#62707

#62709

#62724

#62725

#62729

#62710

#62734

#62711

#62717

#62718

#62722

#62726

#62730