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Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day

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  Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-07-31 13:47 +0200
    Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Andy Burns <usenet.feb2014@adslpipe.co.uk> - 2014-07-31 19:30 +0100
    Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day "Dirk T. Verbeek" <dverbeek@xs4all.nl> - 2014-08-01 07:02 -0300
    Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Shadow <Sh@dow.br> - 2014-08-01 10:33 -0300
    Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-08-02 16:25 +0100
      Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-08-03 23:19 +0200
        Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> - 2014-08-04 01:07 +0100
          Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-08-04 13:38 +0200
        Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Andy Burns <usenet.feb2014@adslpipe.co.uk> - 2014-08-04 07:29 +0100
          Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> - 2014-08-04 13:51 +0200
        Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-08-04 12:06 +0000
        Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day "Dirk T. Verbeek" <dverbeek@xs4all.nl> - 2014-08-04 14:12 +0200
        Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day Aragorn <thorongil@telenet.be.invalid> - 2014-08-04 14:36 +0200
      Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the   engines running 24 hours a day Sylvia Else <sylvia@not.at.this.address> - 2014-08-07 23:10 +1000

#4198 — Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day

The practice of leaving car engines running is known as runlock. It
allows the police vehicles to keep the computer booted up to allow the
control centre to know the exact location at any time of the vehicle, and
to tell them where to go. When the engine is switched off it takes about
seven minutes to boot up the computer.

Ms Honeyman, 53, a rock musician, said: "Almost every time we walk past
the police station there is an unattended police vehicle with its engine
running. Sometimes there are as many as four police vehicles left
unattended with their engines running for periods of an hour and a half,
throughout the day, so in effect there is always a police vehicle belting
out diesel fumes 24/7 unnecessarily.

"Our neighbours in the flats next door to the police station cannot let
their baby out on the balcony because of the harmful effects of diesel
fumes and we cannot sit in our front yard because of the fumes. I had
cancer last year, of course it's impossible to blame police car pollution,
but it does make one wonder."

<http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/man-arrested-after-complaining-about-stench-from-police-cars-left-with-their-engines-on-9634586.html>


-- 
BitLocker tip: At boot time, Windows assumes you have a US keyboard.
You do know how to enter your BitLocker password on one of those, don't you?

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#4199

Paul Sture wrote:

> The practice of leaving car engines running is known as runlock. It
> allows the police vehicles to keep the computer booted up to allow the
> control centre to know the exact location at any time of the vehicle, and
> to tell them where to go.

Fire engines have the same type of on-board computer, they have a second 
battery for it (and the radios and CCTV) and an "umbilical" so it can be 
kept charged from the mains when it's not out and about (when it charges 
from the engine) ...

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#4201

Op 31/07/14 om 08:47 schreef Paul Sture:
> The practice of leaving car engines running is known as runlock. It
> allows the police vehicles to keep the computer booted up to allow the
> control centre to know the exact location at any time of the vehicle, and
> to tell them where to go. When the engine is switched off it takes about
> seven minutes to boot up the computer.
>
> Ms Honeyman, 53, a rock musician, said: "Almost every time we walk past
> the police station there is an unattended police vehicle with its engine
> running. Sometimes there are as many as four police vehicles left
> unattended with their engines running for periods of an hour and a half,
> throughout the day, so in effect there is always a police vehicle belting
> out diesel fumes 24/7 unnecessarily.
>
> "Our neighbours in the flats next door to the police station cannot let
> their baby out on the balcony because of the harmful effects of diesel
> fumes and we cannot sit in our front yard because of the fumes. I had
> cancer last year, of course it's impossible to blame police car pollution,
> but it does make one wonder."
>
> <http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/man-arrested-after-complaining-about-stench-from-police-cars-left-with-their-engines-on-9634586.html>
>
>
Another word for this type of tech; laziness.

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#4203

On Thu, 31 Jul 2014 13:47:46 +0200, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch>
wrote:

>The practice of leaving car engines running is known as runlock. It
>allows the police vehicles to keep the computer booted up to allow the
>control centre to know the exact location at any time of the vehicle, and
>to tell them where to go. When the engine is switched off it takes about
>seven minutes to boot up the computer.

	Why don't they just issue cellphones ?
	They do exactly the same thing. And don't need booting.
	It's not as if the police would steal the phones. Oh, I see.
	;)
	[]'s
>
>Ms Honeyman, 53, a rock musician, said: "Almost every time we walk past
>the police station there is an unattended police vehicle with its engine
>running. Sometimes there are as many as four police vehicles left
>unattended with their engines running for periods of an hour and a half,
>throughout the day, so in effect there is always a police vehicle belting
>out diesel fumes 24/7 unnecessarily.

><http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/man-arrested-after-complaining-about-stench-from-police-cars-left-with-their-engines-on-9634586.html>
-- 
Don't be evil - Google 2004
We have a new policy  - Google 2012

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#4213

On 2014-07-31, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
> The practice of leaving car engines running is known as runlock. It
> allows the police vehicles to keep the computer booted up to allow the
> control centre to know the exact location at any time of the vehicle, and
> to tell them where to go. When the engine is switched off it takes about
> seven minutes to boot up the computer.
>
> Ms Honeyman, 53, a rock musician, said: "Almost every time we walk past
> the police station there is an unattended police vehicle with its engine
> running. Sometimes there are as many as four police vehicles left
> unattended with their engines running for periods of an hour and a half,
> throughout the day, so in effect there is always a police vehicle belting
> out diesel fumes 24/7 unnecessarily.
>
> "Our neighbours in the flats next door to the police station cannot let
> their baby out on the balcony because of the harmful effects of diesel
> fumes and we cannot sit in our front yard because of the fumes. I had
> cancer last year, of course it's impossible to blame police car pollution,
> but it does make one wonder."
>
> <http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/man-arrested-after-complaining-about-stench-from-police-cars-left-with-their-engines-on-9634586.html>

The Highway Code is dead against the practice:

,<https://www.gov.uk/general-rules-all-drivers-riders-103-to-158/control-of-the-vehicle-117-to-126>
| The Driver and the Environment
|
| 123
|
| You MUST NOT leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running
| or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is
| stationary on a public road. Generally, if the vehicle is stationary and
| is likely to remain so for more than a couple of minutes, you should
| apply the parking brake and switch off the engine to reduce emissions
| and noise pollution. However it is permissible to leave the engine
| running if the vehicle is stationary in traffic or for diagnosing
| faults.
|
| Law CUR regs 98 & 107
`----

But the Construction and Use Regulations have exceptions which seem to
exempt the police:

"where the machinery is required to be worked for a purpose other than
driving the vehicle"
<http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/regulation/98/made>

"being used for ambulance, fire brigade or police purposes"
<http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/regulation/107/made>

However, I'm sure it would save the cops money to fit either a
motor-caravan 'recreational' type battery for the computer, or a
beefed-up starter battery and alternator.

I think the regulations as they stand were meant to apply to emergency
kit such as lighting, radios, water-pumps, etc, or to refrigerated
lorries.

-- 
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
--  Whiskers 
-- ~~~~~~~~~~

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#4227

On 2014-08-02, Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:
> On 2014-07-31, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
>> The practice of leaving car engines running is known as runlock. It
>> allows the police vehicles to keep the computer booted up to allow the
>> control centre to know the exact location at any time of the vehicle, and
>> to tell them where to go. When the engine is switched off it takes about
>> seven minutes to boot up the computer.
>>
>> Ms Honeyman, 53, a rock musician, said: "Almost every time we walk past
>> the police station there is an unattended police vehicle with its engine
>> running. Sometimes there are as many as four police vehicles left
>> unattended with their engines running for periods of an hour and a half,
>> throughout the day, so in effect there is always a police vehicle belting
>> out diesel fumes 24/7 unnecessarily.
>>
>> "Our neighbours in the flats next door to the police station cannot let
>> their baby out on the balcony because of the harmful effects of diesel
>> fumes and we cannot sit in our front yard because of the fumes. I had
>> cancer last year, of course it's impossible to blame police car pollution,
>> but it does make one wonder."
>>
>> <http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/man-arrested-after-complaining-about-stench-from-police-cars-left-with-their-engines-on-9634586.html>
>
> The Highway Code is dead against the practice:
>
> ,<https://www.gov.uk/general-rules-all-drivers-riders-103-to-158/control-of-the-vehicle-117-to-126>
>| The Driver and the Environment
>|
>| 123
>|
>| You MUST NOT leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running
>| or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is
>| stationary on a public road. Generally, if the vehicle is stationary and
>| is likely to remain so for more than a couple of minutes, you should
>| apply the parking brake and switch off the engine to reduce emissions
>| and noise pollution. However it is permissible to leave the engine
>| running if the vehicle is stationary in traffic or for diagnosing
>| faults.
>|
>| Law CUR regs 98 & 107
> `----
>
> But the Construction and Use Regulations have exceptions which seem to
> exempt the police:
>
> "where the machinery is required to be worked for a purpose other than
> driving the vehicle"
><http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/regulation/98/made>
>
> "being used for ambulance, fire brigade or police purposes"
><http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/regulation/107/made>
>
> However, I'm sure it would save the cops money to fit either a
> motor-caravan 'recreational' type battery for the computer, or a
> beefed-up starter battery and alternator.
>
> I think the regulations as they stand were meant to apply to emergency
> kit such as lighting, radios, water-pumps, etc, or to refrigerated
> lorries.

In Switzerland and possibly Germany it is illegal to leave your car running
when not needed and it is common practice to switch off at red traffic
lights.  The owners handbook for my 1997 Audi documented an extra which
started the engine when you depressed the clutch to ease the process, though
I've never come across a car which actually has this feature fitted.

Besides all that, in 1973 got a caution for leaving a car unattended with
the ignition switched on.  After all these years I don't remember the
wording of the offence but it might have covered leaving the keys in the
ignition with the engine off.

-- 
The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese.
The early mouse is now a late mouse of course.

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#4228

On 2014-08-03, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
> On 2014-08-02, Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:
>> On 2014-07-31, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:

[...]

> In Switzerland and possibly Germany it is illegal to leave your car
> running when not needed and it is common practice to switch off at red
> traffic lights.  The owners handbook for my 1997 Audi documented an
> extra which started the engine when you depressed the clutch to ease
> the process, though I've never come across a car which actually has
> this feature fitted.

It's an option on several models; I think Citroën may have been the
first maker to offer it.  I don't know how well it works in practice;
I'd be worried about causing annoyance by not moving off promptly enough
for the idiot behind, or of flattening the battery in a long stop-go
traffic jam.

> Besides all that, in 1973 got a caution for leaving a car unattended
> with the ignition switched on.  After all these years I don't remember
> the wording of the offence but it might have covered leaving the keys
> in the ignition with the engine off.

Could be quite dangerous if the fuel pump is electric.

-- 
-- ^^^^^^^^^^
--  Whiskers 
-- ~~~~~~~~~~

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#4234

On 2014-08-04, Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:
> On 2014-08-03, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
>> On 2014-08-02, Whiskers <catwheezel@operamail.com> wrote:
>>> On 2014-07-31, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
>
> [...]
>
>> In Switzerland and possibly Germany it is illegal to leave your car
>> running when not needed and it is common practice to switch off at red
>> traffic lights.  The owners handbook for my 1997 Audi documented an
>> extra which started the engine when you depressed the clutch to ease
>> the process, though I've never come across a car which actually has
>> this feature fitted.
>
> It's an option on several models; I think Citroën may have been the
> first maker to offer it.  I don't know how well it works in practice;
> I'd be worried about causing annoyance by not moving off promptly enough
> for the idiot behind, or of flattening the battery in a long stop-go
> traffic jam.

Moving off promptly isn't a problem when everyone is doing it.  I can't
see that working in France though.  My experience of Paris driving is that
everyone in the queue is watching for the light to change and as soon
as it goes green (or more precisely the other lights turn red, if they can
be seen) everyone moves off en masse.

>> Besides all that, in 1973 got a caution for leaving a car unattended
>> with the ignition switched on.  After all these years I don't remember
>> the wording of the offence but it might have covered leaving the keys
>> in the ignition with the engine off.
>
> Could be quite dangerous if the fuel pump is electric.

Yes, the pressure of fuel pumps for injection engines is surprisingly high.

I've a feeling the offence was to do with the concept of the driver being
in control of the car; you ain't if someone can just drive it off.   It's
a basic deterrent against opportunistic theft - the example the copper
gave me was of someone popping into a newsagents and leaving the car
running.

-- 
The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese.
The early mouse is now a late mouse of course.

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#4230

Paul Sture wrote:

> In Switzerland and possibly Germany it is illegal to leave your car running
> when not needed and it is common practice to switch off at red traffic
> lights.  The owners handbook for my 1997 Audi documented an extra which
> started the engine when you depressed the clutch to ease the process, though
> I've never come across a car which actually has this feature fitted.

A couple of loan cars I've had when mine's been in for service have had 
it, not the sort of thing you get used to in a day.  I think it's done 
to improve the "paper" fuel consumption figures for tax purposes, at the 
expense of starter-motor wear and tear.

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#4235

On 2014-08-04, Andy Burns <usenet.feb2014@adslpipe.co.uk> wrote:
> Paul Sture wrote:
>
>> In Switzerland and possibly Germany it is illegal to leave your car running
>> when not needed and it is common practice to switch off at red traffic
>> lights.  The owners handbook for my 1997 Audi documented an extra which
>> started the engine when you depressed the clutch to ease the process, though
>> I've never come across a car which actually has this feature fitted.
>
> A couple of loan cars I've had when mine's been in for service have had 
> it, not the sort of thing you get used to in a day.  I think it's done 
> to improve the "paper" fuel consumption figures for tax purposes, at the 
> expense of starter-motor wear and tear.

Ah yes, no doubt used for the "urban cycle" quoted in consumption figures.
They probably have to ensure that a certain percentage of cars with the
feature are sold to make those figures valid, so demo cars get it. :-)

-- 
The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese.
The early mouse is now a late mouse of course.

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#4236

In article <5kl2bb-m8n2.ln1@news.chingola.ch>,
Paul Sture  <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:

>In Switzerland and possibly Germany it is illegal to leave your car running
>when not needed and it is common practice to switch off at red traffic
>lights.  The owners handbook for my 1997 Audi documented an extra which
>started the engine when you depressed the clutch to ease the process, though
>I've never come across a car which actually has this feature fitted.

My wifes (BMW) Mini has this feature. Once the engine has warmed up
(takes ~10 minutes of driving or so), then pull up to a junction, put
the gearstick in neutral, handbrake on, lift the clutch and the engine
will cut-out. It starts again when you depress the clutch.

It was a bit odd at first, but you soon get used to it.

Gordon

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#4237

Op 03/08/14 om 23:19 schreef Paul Sture:
>   The owners handbook for my 1997 Audi documented an extra which
> started the engine when you depressed the clutch to ease the process, though
> I've never come across a car which actually has this feature fitted.

Such a start/stop system is on modern cars quite common.
It does involve some extra engineering like a heavier duty starter motor 
and battery.

The moment the car is stopped and out of gear with your foot on the 
brake the engine will stop.
The moment you depress the clutch the engine wills tart again.
If you have the AC on or the engine is too cold the system will not shut 
down the engine, if the engine gets cold while waiting the engine fires 
also up.
It takes a few cycles to get used to but then it's very easy.

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#4238

On Sunday 03 August 2014 23:19, Paul Sture conveyed the following to 
comp.misc...

> In Switzerland and possibly Germany it is illegal to leave your car
> running when not needed and it is common practice to switch off at red
> traffic lights.  The owners handbook for my 1997 Audi documented an
> extra which started the engine when you depressed the clutch to ease
> the process, though I've never come across a car which actually has
> this feature fitted.

It's called a start/stop systems, and many of today's European cars are 
already fitted with that as standard equipment.  My brother's 4-stroke 
125 cc Honda motorbike also already has that.

> Besides all that, in 1973 got a caution for leaving a car unattended
> with the ignition switched on.  After all these years I don't remember
> the wording of the offence but it might have covered leaving the keys
> in the ignition with the engine off.

Yes, that is correct.  It is considered "promiscuous behavior" towards 
potential car thieves.

-- 
= Aragorn =

         http://www.linuxcounter.net - registrant #223157

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#4270 — Re: Policecar computer takes 7 minutes to boot, so they leave the engines running 24 hours a day

On 3/08/2014 1:25 AM, Whiskers wrote:
> On 2014-07-31, Paul Sture <nospam@sture.ch> wrote:
>> The practice of leaving car engines running is known as runlock. It
>> allows the police vehicles to keep the computer booted up to allow the
>> control centre to know the exact location at any time of the vehicle, and
>> to tell them where to go. When the engine is switched off it takes about
>> seven minutes to boot up the computer.
>>
>> Ms Honeyman, 53, a rock musician, said: "Almost every time we walk past
>> the police station there is an unattended police vehicle with its engine
>> running. Sometimes there are as many as four police vehicles left
>> unattended with their engines running for periods of an hour and a half,
>> throughout the day, so in effect there is always a police vehicle belting
>> out diesel fumes 24/7 unnecessarily.
>>
>> "Our neighbours in the flats next door to the police station cannot let
>> their baby out on the balcony because of the harmful effects of diesel
>> fumes and we cannot sit in our front yard because of the fumes. I had
>> cancer last year, of course it's impossible to blame police car pollution,
>> but it does make one wonder."
>>
>> <http://www.standard.co.uk/news/london/man-arrested-after-complaining-about-stench-from-police-cars-left-with-their-engines-on-9634586.html>
>
> The Highway Code is dead against the practice:
>
> ,<https://www.gov.uk/general-rules-all-drivers-riders-103-to-158/control-of-the-vehicle-117-to-126>
> | The Driver and the Environment
> |
> | 123
> |
> | You MUST NOT leave a parked vehicle unattended with the engine running
> | or leave a vehicle engine running unnecessarily while that vehicle is
> | stationary on a public road. Generally, if the vehicle is stationary and
> | is likely to remain so for more than a couple of minutes, you should
> | apply the parking brake and switch off the engine to reduce emissions
> | and noise pollution. However it is permissible to leave the engine
> | running if the vehicle is stationary in traffic or for diagnosing
> | faults.
> |
> | Law CUR regs 98 & 107
> `----
>
> But the Construction and Use Regulations have exceptions which seem to
> exempt the police:
>
> "where the machinery is required to be worked for a purpose other than
> driving the vehicle"
> <http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/regulation/98/made>
>
> "being used for ambulance, fire brigade or police purposes"
> <http://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1986/1078/regulation/107/made>
>

Be an interesting question whether the car is being "used" in this context.

Sylvia.

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