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OOPHP online tutorials

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  OOPHP online tutorials Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-24 21:03 +0100
    Re: OOPHP online tutorials bramante <bramante@yopmail.com> - 2015-06-24 23:37 +0200
    Re: OOPHP online tutorials Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2015-06-24 23:21 -0400
      Re: OOPHP online tutorials Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-25 09:12 +0100
        Re: OOPHP online tutorials Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2015-06-25 11:15 +0200
          Re: OOPHP online tutorials Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-25 12:01 +0100
        Re: OOPHP online tutorials Jerry Stuckle <jstucklex@attglobal.net> - 2015-06-25 08:09 -0400
          Re: OOPHP online tutorials Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-25 13:33 +0100
    Re: OOPHP online tutorials Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2015-06-25 11:08 +0200
      Re: OOPHP online tutorials Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-25 11:12 +0100
        Re: OOPHP online tutorials Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2015-06-25 14:02 +0200
          Re: OOPHP online tutorials Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-25 13:20 +0100
            Re: OOPHP online tutorials "Christoph M. Becker" <cmbecker69@arcor.de> - 2015-06-25 14:51 +0200
              Re: OOPHP online tutorials Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-25 13:56 +0100
            Re: OOPHP online tutorials Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2015-06-25 15:39 +0200
              Re: OOPHP online tutorials Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-25 14:54 +0100

#15507 — OOPHP online tutorials

Frequently I find myself writing *almost* the same PHP code for a number 
of tasks, but with tiny differences. For example:

User: create, retrieve, amend, delete
Group: create, retrieve, amend, delete
UserPermission: create, retrieve, amend, delete
GroupPermission: create, retrieve, amend, delete
DiaryEntry: create, retrieve, amend, delete
EmbeddedImage: create, retrieve, amend, delete

and so on. At present, I'm more or less doing copy-paste-edit, which I 
can't help but notice is a terrible way to do things, and it strikes me 
that an object-oriented approach would be more efficient.

I don't particularly want to get locked into any one framework, because 
I can't guarantee that that framework will be installable on whatever 
server will be managing the site, but "vanilla" OO PHP seems to me to be 
the way to go.

Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on 
the Web?

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#15508

Il 24/06/2015 22:03, Richard Heathfield ha scritto:
> Frequently I find myself writing *almost* the same PHP code for a number
> of tasks, but with tiny differences. For example:
>
> User: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> Group: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> UserPermission: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> GroupPermission: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> DiaryEntry: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> EmbeddedImage: create, retrieve, amend, delete
>
> and so on. At present, I'm more or less doing copy-paste-edit, which I
> can't help but notice is a terrible way to do things, and it strikes me
> that an object-oriented approach would be more efficient.
>
> I don't particularly want to get locked into any one framework, because
> I can't guarantee that that framework will be installable on whatever
> server will be managing the site, but "vanilla" OO PHP seems to me to be
> the way to go.
>
> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
> the Web?
>

create a class and extend it and override the method that you have 
necessary.

you can create a class name USER

with methods that are common for all your other object

and after extend it

"group extend user"

and ovveride or create method that are particural for this object.

for example
the class USER can have a "create" method that call the private general 
method for insert the data into db, you can extend the base class to 
GROUP where you can ovveride only the "create" method and not write any 
code for the insert data into db.

for do this you should abstract the concept of your object.

Bye

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#15511

On 6/24/2015 4:03 PM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> Frequently I find myself writing *almost* the same PHP code for a number
> of tasks, but with tiny differences. For example:
> 
> User: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> Group: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> UserPermission: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> GroupPermission: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> DiaryEntry: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> EmbeddedImage: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> 
> and so on. At present, I'm more or less doing copy-paste-edit, which I
> can't help but notice is a terrible way to do things, and it strikes me
> that an object-oriented approach would be more efficient.
> 
> I don't particularly want to get locked into any one framework, because
> I can't guarantee that that framework will be installable on whatever
> server will be managing the site, but "vanilla" OO PHP seems to me to be
> the way to go.
> 
> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
> the Web?
> 

I would give you some excellent advice about what to do (I taught OO for
12 years to corporate employees on three continents and have been doing
it for almost 30 years in a number of languages, including PHP since it
started trying to implement OO).  But you've already shown you wouldn't
appreciate such advice, so I'm not going to bother.

I like to help those who want to help themselves.  I don't help trolls
or those who support trolls, especially when they don't take the time to
understand the entire history.

Maybe Pointed Head can give you some advice.  You seem to like him so much.

-- 
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
jstucklex@attglobal.net
==================

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#15513

On 25/06/15 04:21, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
> On 6/24/2015 4:03 PM, Richard Heathfield wrote:

<snip>

>> I don't particularly want to get locked into any one framework, because
>> I can't guarantee that that framework will be installable on whatever
>> server will be managing the site, but "vanilla" OO PHP seems to me to be
>> the way to go.
>>
>> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
>> the Web?
>
> I would give you some excellent advice about what to do

But, roughly translated, you don't know of any such tutorials. It was 
kind of you to reply, though. Thank you. Anyone else?

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#15515

Richard Heathfield wrote:

> On 25/06/15 04:21, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>> On 6/24/2015 4:03 PM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
>>> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
>>> the Web?
>>
>> I would give you some excellent advice about what to do
> 
> But, roughly translated, you don't know of any such tutorials.

That is your misinterpretation of what he wrote.

Also, I strongly recommend to you that, when you are quoting (and you 
should), you should always quote in a way that the original meaning of the 
text is preserved.  For example, it is inappropriate to cut a sentence or 
paragraph in the middle when that would change the meaning of the statement 
that the sentence or paragraph is making.  And if you think that omitting 
text is warranted, it is required to mark the omission by “[…]” or “[...]”.
One of the exceptions to this rule can be seen above.

-- 
PointedEars
Zend Certified PHP Engineer
Twitter: @PointedEars2
Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.

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#15517

On 25/06/15 10:15, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> Richard Heathfield wrote:
>
>> On 25/06/15 04:21, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>>> On 6/24/2015 4:03 PM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
>>>> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
>>>> the Web?
>>>
>>> I would give you some excellent advice about what to do
>>
>> But, roughly translated, you don't know of any such tutorials.
>
> That is your misinterpretation of what he wrote.

Yes, I must apologise to Jerry. It was a rather crude and inappropriate 
attempt at reverse psychology.

>
> Also, I strongly recommend to you that, when you are quoting (and you
> should), you should always quote in a way that the original meaning of the
> text is preserved.

That has always been my habit, but on this occasion I fell short (and 
yes, it was deliberate, and yes, it was wrong, and yes, I regret it).

<snip>

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#15519

On 6/25/2015 4:12 AM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> On 25/06/15 04:21, Jerry Stuckle wrote:
>> On 6/24/2015 4:03 PM, Richard Heathfield wrote:
> 
> <snip>
> 
>>> I don't particularly want to get locked into any one framework, because
>>> I can't guarantee that that framework will be installable on whatever
>>> server will be managing the site, but "vanilla" OO PHP seems to me to be
>>> the way to go.
>>>
>>> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
>>> the Web?
>>
>> I would give you some excellent advice about what to do
> 
> But, roughly translated, you don't know of any such tutorials. It was
> kind of you to reply, though. Thank you. Anyone else?
> 

Oh, I know of some very good tutorials.  And I know of even better ways
for you to get up to speed.  But they way you've acted, it's not worth
my time looking them up.

Just remember your action s have consequences, too.

-- 
==================
Remove the "x" from my email address
Jerry Stuckle
jstucklex@attglobal.net
==================

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#15521

On 25/06/15 13:09, Jerry Stuckle wrote:

<snip>

> Just remember your action s have consequences, too.

I realise that. I'm comfortable with all that I've posted in this group, 
except for Message ID <mmgd39$61m$1@dont-email.me> for which I have 
already posted an apology.

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#15514

Richard Heathfield wrote:

> Frequently I find myself writing *almost* the same PHP code for a number
> of tasks, but with tiny differences. For example:
> 
> User: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> Group: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> UserPermission: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> GroupPermission: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> DiaryEntry: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> EmbeddedImage: create, retrieve, amend, delete
> 
> and so on. At present, I'm more or less doing copy-paste-edit, which I
> can't help but notice is a terrible way to do things, and it strikes me
> that an object-oriented approach would be more efficient.

It would be more efficient when writing the code, but not when executing the 
code.  You always pay for the generality of an approach by its reduced 
runtime efficiency and memory efficiency.  But it is worth it, literally.
 
> […]
> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
> the Web?

Yes.

<http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html>

-- 
PointedEars
Zend Certified PHP Engineer
Twitter: @PointedEars2
Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.

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#15516

On 25/06/15 10:08, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> Richard Heathfield wrote:
>
<snip>

>> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
>> the Web?
>
> Yes.
>
> <http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html>

Right. I didn't post what I'd already tried. Sorry about that. 
(Incidentally, I have just now been through ESR's entire document 
point-by-point, and that seems to be the only way that I fouled up.)

So here's what I found in the group's archives:

* http://www.w-p.dds.nl/tinyunit.htm (which doesn't meet my needs 
because it's too abstract and focused too much on one specific task, 
unit testing).
* http://php.net/OOP (OOP in PHP 4) and http://php.net/OOP5 (OOP in PHP 
5), neither of which meet my needs because they focus on syntax (which I 
accept I'll need to learn) without explaining how one would go about 
using OO PHP in a sensible way, which is at the heart of my requirement.

Those were, really honestly truly, the only apparently relevant 
suggestions I could find.

Here's what I found on the Web:

* 
http://code.tutsplus.com/tutorials/object-oriented-php-for-beginners--net-12762 
which, again, is syntax-based rather than oriented towards how to use 
OOP to shortcut the development process.

* 
http://www.killerphp.com/tutorials/object-oriented-php/downloads/oop_in_php_tutorial.pdf 
- again, this focuses on elementary syntax rather than on how to make 
OOP pay its way.

* http://www.tutorialspoint.com/php/php_object_oriented.htm - yet again, 
this focuses on elementary syntax, not on using OOP to cut down on 
repeated code.

I looked for the FAQ for this group, but couldn't find one. Is there one?

My question may not have been 100% smart, but I don't think it was 
exactly riddled with dumbness. I hope I have now demonstrated that I 
have at least tried to find my own answer. I'm beginning to suspect that 
the real answer is that there is no tutorial out there that meets my 
needs. I hope I'm wrong. Am I?

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#15518

Richard Heathfield wrote:

> On 25/06/15 10:08, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>> Richard Heathfield wrote:
>>> Are there any excellent but gentle introductions to OO PHP out there on
>>> the Web?
>> Yes.
>>
>> <http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html>
> 
> Right. I didn't post what I'd already tried. Sorry about that.
> (Incidentally, I have just now been through ESR's entire document
> point-by-point, and that seems to be the only way that I fouled up.)

<http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#prune>

Also:

  Talk is cheap. Show me the code.
    —Linus Torvalds

> So here's what I found in the group's archives:
> 
> * http://www.w-p.dds.nl/tinyunit.htm (which doesn't meet my needs
> because it's too abstract and focused too much on one specific task,
> unit testing).
> * http://php.net/OOP (OOP in PHP 4) and http://php.net/OOP5 (OOP in PHP
> 5), neither of which meet my needs because they focus on syntax (which I
> accept I'll need to learn) without explaining how one would go about
> using OO PHP in a sensible way, which is at the heart of my requirement.

You did not ask how to learn OOP, but OOP with PHP, and that chapter is 
precisely about that.  *Of course* it is tied to the syntax elements 
required to create objects with PHP.

PHP uses class-based inheritance.  I find the chapter in the PHP manual 
rather instructive, and would have referred you to it; but I had learned OOP 
(with Turbo Pascal, Object Pascal in Delphi, and Microsoft Visual C++) 
before I learned PHP (3), and have also used several other OOPLs since then.

> Here's what I found on the Web:
> 
> *
> http://code.tutsplus.com/tutorials/object-oriented-php-for-beginners--net-12762
> which, again, is syntax-based rather than oriented towards how to use
> OOP to shortcut the development process.

Not a bad start.
 
> *
> http://www.killerphp.com/tutorials/object-oriented-php/downloads/oop_in_php_tutorial.pdf
> - again, this focuses on elementary syntax rather than on how to make
> OOP pay its way.

Appears to be well written, although class names should begin with a capital 
letter (“Person”, not “person”), and camel-case is more common in PHP for 
method names and formal parameters (“setName”, not “set_name”).  And avoid 
“==” in favor of “===”.

> * http://www.tutorialspoint.com/php/php_object_oriented.htm - yet again,
> this focuses on elementary syntax,

NAK.

> not on using OOP to cut down on repeated code.

ISTM you are actually asking for “OOP 101”.  Sorry, this newsgroup is not 
it.

> I looked for the FAQ for this group, but couldn't find one. Is there one?

I do not know (I know that <news:de.comp.lang.php> has one).  What exactly 
have you searched for?

> My question may not have been 100% smart, but I don't think it was
> exactly riddled with dumbness. I hope I have now demonstrated that I
> have at least tried to find my own answer. I'm beginning to suspect that
> the real answer is that there is no tutorial out there that meets my
> needs. I hope I'm wrong. Am I?

Mu.

-- 
PointedEars
Zend Certified PHP Engineer
Twitter: @PointedEars2
Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.

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#15520

On 25/06/15 13:02, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> Richard Heathfield wrote:
>
<prune>
>
>> So here's what I found in the group's archives:
>>
>> * http://www.w-p.dds.nl/tinyunit.htm (which doesn't meet my needs
>> because it's too abstract and focused too much on one specific task,
>> unit testing).
>> * http://php.net/OOP (OOP in PHP 4) and http://php.net/OOP5 (OOP in PHP
>> 5), neither of which meet my needs because they focus on syntax (which I
>> accept I'll need to learn) without explaining how one would go about
>> using OO PHP in a sensible way, which is at the heart of my requirement.
>
> You did not ask how to learn OOP, but OOP with PHP, and that chapter is
> precisely about that.  *Of course* it is tied to the syntax elements
> required to create objects with PHP.

Yes, *of course* it is, but the syntax is relatively trivial, and there 
is no shortage of tutorials explaining the syntax. As I tried to explain 
from the very first, what I'm looking for is some kind of guide to 
*using* OOP to reduce the amount of copy-paste-edit programming I'm 
having to do.

<snip>

> ISTM you are actually asking for “OOP 101”.  Sorry, this newsgroup is not
> it.

I'm aware that this newsgroup isn't it, but I was hoping someone in this 
newsgroup might know where it is.

>> I looked for the FAQ for this group, but couldn't find one. Is there one?
>
> I do not know (I know that <news:de.comp.lang.php> has one).  What exactly
> have you searched for?

Because I was looking for the FAQ for comp.lang.php, I searched using 
the following two search terms: faq comp.lang.php

The hits I got were:

https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/comp.lang.php (the Google Groups 
front end to this newsgroup, so not an FAQ)

http://www.justskins.com/forums/wiki-like-faq-for-172071.html (a 
discussion, over ten years old, about how nice it would be if there were 
an FAQ for this group)

http://php.net/support.php (which recommends this group, but doesn't 
cite an FAQ for this group)

http://faqfclphp.free.fr/ (but I don't speak French)

at which point I felt I'd reached diminishing returns.

<snip>

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#15522

Richard Heathfield wrote:

> On 25/06/15 13:02, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>
>> ISTM you are actually asking for “OOP 101”.  Sorry, this newsgroup is not
>> it.
> 
> I'm aware that this newsgroup isn't it, but I was hoping someone in this
> newsgroup might know where it is.

I just found <https://github.com/marcelgsantos/learning-oop-in-php>.

HTH

-- 
Christoph M. Becker

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#15523

On 25/06/15 13:51, Christoph M. Becker wrote:
> Richard Heathfield wrote:
>
>> On 25/06/15 13:02, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>
>>> ISTM you are actually asking for “OOP 101”.  Sorry, this newsgroup is not
>>> it.
>>
>> I'm aware that this newsgroup isn't it, but I was hoping someone in this
>> newsgroup might know where it is.
>
> I just found <https://github.com/marcelgsantos/learning-oop-in-php>.
>
> HTH


Thank you, Christoph. That page looks like a veritable treasure trove. 
It will take some time to work through it to find out whether it has 
what I need (and it seems inconceivable that it doesn't!) but even if it 
doesn't it still likes like I will learn an immense amount from it so, 
one way or the other, I am very grateful to you for pointing it out to me.

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#15524

Richard Heathfield wrote:

> On 25/06/15 13:02, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>
> <prune>

There was a hint in there.

> […] As I tried to explain from the very first, what I'm looking for is 
> some kind of guide to *using* OOP to reduce the amount of copy-paste-edit 
> programming I'm having to do.

And as I pointed out, at least one of the tutorials that you have found is 
providing that, and that you have not been reading carefully enough.

>> ISTM you are actually asking for “OOP 101”.  Sorry, this newsgroup is not
>> it.
> 
> I'm aware that this newsgroup isn't it, but I was hoping someone in this
> newsgroup might know where it is.

All over the Nets.  However, PHP is probably not the best language to learn 
OOP from the ground up.  Today I would recommend Python for that instead.

>>> I looked for the FAQ for this group, but couldn't find one. Is there
>>> one?
>> I do not know (I know that <news:de.comp.lang.php> has one).  What
>> exactly have you searched for?
> 
> Because I was looking for the FAQ for comp.lang.php, I searched using
> the following two search terms: faq comp.lang.php

OK.  When in doubt, put the search terms in double-quotes as appropriate.
 
> The hits I got were:
> 
> [irrelevant hits]
> 
> http://www.justskins.com/forums/wiki-like-faq-for-172071.html (a
> discussion, over ten years old, about how nice it would be if there were
> an FAQ for this group)

| […] Though we have sites like www.php-faq.com (by Matthew Schroebel), […]

It is down now, but it is in the Internet Archive.  The most recently 
archived version does not appear to have a section on OO PHP, though.

> […]
> http://faqfclphp.free.fr/ (but I don't speak French)

You can still try a machine translation (Google Translate & friends).  

Likewise with the FAQ of the German-speaking PHP newsgroup.  And German is 
my native language, so I could tell you if the machine translation into 
English is correct.

Just do not play stupid, OK?

-- 
PointedEars
Zend Certified PHP Engineer
Twitter: @PointedEars2
Please do not cc me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.

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#15526

On 25/06/15 14:39, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
> Richard Heathfield wrote:
>
>> On 25/06/15 13:02, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>
>> <prune>
>
> There was a hint in there.

It escaped me. My apologies for that.

>
>> […] As I tried to explain from the very first, what I'm looking for is
>> some kind of guide to *using* OOP to reduce the amount of copy-paste-edit
>> programming I'm having to do.
>
> And as I pointed out, at least one of the tutorials that you have found is
> providing that, and that you have not been reading carefully enough.

I'll take a closer look.

<rest of article read, but snipped because I have no comment to make on it>

> Just do not play stupid, OK?

Oh, I'm not *playing* stupid, I assure you. :-)

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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