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Groups > comp.lang.javascript > #17308 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2012-11-19 13:00 -0800 |
| Last post | 2012-12-23 19:13 +0000 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 226 — 28 participants |
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Maintainer of the FAQ Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> - 2012-11-19 13:00 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-11-19 13:34 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ RobG <rgqld@iinet.net.au> - 2012-11-20 01:25 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-11-20 13:39 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> - 2012-11-20 11:24 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-21 19:19 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-11-22 14:09 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-20 19:50 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-11-20 19:56 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-11-21 11:24 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-22 23:34 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-11-23 11:07 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-24 18:30 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ jim.ley@gmail.com - 2012-11-22 03:06 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> - 2012-11-22 07:15 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Martin Leese <please@see.Web.for.e-mail.INVALID> - 2012-11-22 08:48 -0700
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-23 20:00 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-11-24 10:36 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-25 19:16 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-11-26 10:18 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-11-26 12:50 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-11-30 14:23 -0500
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-01 09:24 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-12-01 08:45 -0500
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-01 16:17 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-12 19:30 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-01 18:50 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-02 19:25 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-02 21:31 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> - 2012-12-05 03:48 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-05 12:55 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-05 14:52 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-06 06:16 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-12-05 16:56 -0500
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-06 00:20 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-05 14:47 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-06 07:11 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 08:37 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 17:50 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 08:57 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 18:32 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 10:34 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-07 11:05 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-07 07:21 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-11 09:01 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-12 19:37 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-12-07 11:24 -0500
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-11 09:00 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-07 20:54 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-08 03:42 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 02:53 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-09 16:43 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-07 11:16 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-08 18:45 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-06 10:40 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-06 15:16 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 08:48 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-06 18:31 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-06 23:06 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 16:24 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-08 18:06 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 01:29 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-05 22:24 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-05 23:36 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 00:35 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-07 10:45 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 16:01 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-07 21:00 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-08 10:17 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 01:12 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 23:22 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 04:46 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-08 15:56 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-08 09:00 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 17:54 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 20:53 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 11:02 +0100
Functions in JavaScript vs. mathematics & the name "JavaScript" "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-08 23:31 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Mike Duffy <Use_guestbook_page@website.in.sig> - 2012-12-09 02:02 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-08 23:12 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-09 16:44 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Wally W. <ww84wa@aim.com> - 2012-12-10 01:30 -0500
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-08 16:04 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-08 08:37 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 21:34 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 21:49 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-09 11:05 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-06 03:24 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 16:09 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-06 15:23 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 17:44 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-07 15:03 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 09:05 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-06 18:59 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-06 19:24 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 19:26 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 14:11 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-07 03:07 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 18:36 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-07 04:11 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 20:26 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-07 20:40 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-07 01:58 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-07 14:32 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-07 07:22 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 11:19 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-07 21:11 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-07 16:19 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-08 18:33 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-08 22:14 -0800
FAQ source format (was: Maintainer of the FAQ) Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 13:56 +0100
Re: FAQ source format Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-09 08:09 -0800
Re: FAQ source format Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 19:12 -0800
Re: FAQ source format Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-10 20:49 +0000
Re: FAQ source format (was: Maintainer of the FAQ) Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 18:59 -0800
Re: FAQ source format Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-09 20:13 -0800
Re: FAQ source format Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 20:50 -0800
Re: FAQ source format (was: Maintainer of the FAQ) Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-10 20:41 +0000
Re: FAQ source format (was: Maintainer of the FAQ) Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-10 18:09 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-09 07:06 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 19:12 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-09 20:11 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-10 20:32 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-10 17:53 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-12 21:07 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Wally W. <ww84wa@aim.com> - 2012-12-12 21:52 -0500
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-13 16:05 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 00:40 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-13 08:09 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 00:40 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-15 11:02 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-16 17:58 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-17 11:22 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-17 10:40 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-17 20:05 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 00:31 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Osmo Saarikumpu <osmo@weppipakki.com> - 2012-12-18 10:18 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-18 13:38 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 14:59 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-18 16:33 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-18 09:26 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-18 23:09 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 23:47 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-18 15:21 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-18 16:32 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-18 08:11 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-19 18:26 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-20 06:55 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-21 15:46 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-21 06:59 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-21 08:27 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-21 19:12 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-21 15:30 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-21 08:24 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-21 19:09 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-21 20:21 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-22 08:58 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-14 08:01 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Adam Silver <adambsilver@gmail.com> - 2012-12-14 00:28 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 23:25 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 00:39 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-16 00:23 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-15 15:00 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Osmo Saarikumpu <osmo@weppipakki.com> - 2012-12-16 17:14 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-17 18:33 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-16 17:32 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-16 17:24 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-18 17:15 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-19 18:57 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Osmo Saarikumpu <osmo@weppipakki.com> - 2012-12-27 23:03 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-28 11:14 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-28 09:12 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-08 18:24 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-07 10:11 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-13 09:25 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-14 07:26 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-13 21:45 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-07 21:06 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 02:45 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-08 13:30 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-09 17:00 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-08 10:14 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-05 09:03 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-05 18:39 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-05 11:56 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-05 12:30 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-06 08:54 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-05 23:38 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-12-13 14:18 -0500
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 00:09 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-16 01:54 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-17 18:32 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-18 07:06 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 17:54 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-18 11:38 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-18 12:50 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 23:23 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-18 19:46 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-19 18:10 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-19 11:31 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-19 22:54 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-19 16:36 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-05 22:49 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-06 23:21 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-06 15:08 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 01:01 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Adam Silver <adambsilver@gmail.com> - 2012-12-06 07:40 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-06 23:51 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 02:19 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-08 03:57 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 03:06 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-08 09:34 +0100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 13:36 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-22 16:19 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-22 08:59 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-23 13:38 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-23 10:49 +0200
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-23 16:58 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1252@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-24 21:03 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-27 09:33 -0800
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1252@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-28 21:33 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-28 11:16 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-28 09:08 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-28 22:01 +1100
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-28 11:26 +0000
Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-23 19:13 +0000
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| From | Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-09 16:44 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <ZoggBKL1$LxQFwiZ@invalid.uk.co.demon.merlyn.invalid> |
| In reply to | #17593 |
In comp.lang.javascript message <8192572.z9YG5XmbkK@PointedEars.de>,
Sat, 8 Dec 2012 04:46:41, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de>
posted:
>
>PointedEars
Thank you for that proof of your futility.
--
(c) John Stockton, nr London UK. ???@merlyn.demon.co.uk Turnpike v6.05 MIME.
Web <URL:http://www.merlyn.demon.co.uk/> - FAQish topics, acronyms, & links.
Check boilerplate spelling -- error is a public sign of incompetence.
Never fully trust an article from a poster who gives no full real name.
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Wally W. <ww84wa@aim.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-10 01:30 -0500 |
| Message-ID | <e00bc85h4lompcai5kbl37saiek5qc29vs@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #17593 |
On Sat, 08 Dec 2012 04:46:41 +0100, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >The term “javascript” (or “Javascript”) is a misnomer, invented by people >(or a single person) who do not know better or do not care about using ... The term "sunrise" is a misnomer, invented by people who (or a single person) do not know better or do not care about using proper astronomical concepts that have been known for centuries.
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| From | John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-08 16:04 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <w5+GZ7K5T2wQFw+q@J.A830F0FF37FB96852AD08924D9443D28E23ED5CD> |
| In reply to | #17578 |
On Fri, 7 Dec 2012 at 23:22:52, in comp.lang.javascript, Cezary Tomczyk wrote: <snip> >Personally I think that we should use one name everywhere - I like >"JavaScript". <snip> If you use 'JavaScript' you have a problem. You would be able to say 'JScript' for Microsoft's product and 'ActionScript' for Adobe's product, but you would have to say 'Mozilla's JavaScript, I mean the one in Firefox' for the Mozilla/Firefox product. John -- John Harris
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| From | Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-08 08:37 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <IaKdnVTsG8dM8V7NnZ2dnUVZ_qKdnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #17600 |
On 12/8/2012 8:04 AM, John G Harris wrote: > On Fri, 7 Dec 2012 at 23:22:52, in comp.lang.javascript, Cezary Tomczyk > wrote: > > <snip> >> Personally I think that we should use one name everywhere - I like >> "JavaScript". > <snip> > > If you use 'JavaScript' you have a problem. You would be able to say > 'JScript' for Microsoft's product and 'ActionScript' for Adobe's > product, but you would have to say 'Mozilla's JavaScript, I mean the one > in Firefox' for the Mozilla/Firefox product. Even if we used "JScript" it would have to be qualified in many cases to distinguish the capabilities of different versions of IE. I suggest being consistent. Use unqualified "JavaScript" when talking about common features. Use "XXX JavaScript" to restrict a statement to a particular platform or group of platforms. "XXX" can be as specific as necessary - "IE" for anything that is true about all versions of Internet Explorer, "IE9" for features that are first supported in version 9, etc. I realize that JavaScript is a trademark, and that should be acknowledged in the FAQ, but it is widely used in similar writings, apparently without problems. For example, see the Wikipedia article https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/JavaScript. I searched on amazon.com for "ECMAScript". The second item did have the title "What's New in ECMAScript 5". However, most of the first screenful of results used "JavaScript" in the book title. The general convention seems to be to use "JavaScript" to refer to the language in general, and ECMAScript when talking about that particular standardization effort. If the objective is to write a FAQ people can understand, we have to use the term most books and other writings use, the term readers will be used to. That is clearly "JavaScript". Patricia
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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-08 21:34 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <15226427.ycHT9A6HPX@PointedEars.de> |
| In reply to | #17602 |
Patricia Shanahan wrote:
> On 12/8/2012 8:04 AM, John G Harris wrote:
> > If you use 'JavaScript' you have a problem. You would be able to say
> > 'JScript' for Microsoft's product and 'ActionScript' for Adobe's
> > product, but you would have to say 'Mozilla's JavaScript, I mean the one
> > in Firefox' for the Mozilla/Firefox product.
>
> […]
> I searched on amazon.com for "ECMAScript". The second item did have the
> title "What's New in ECMAScript 5". However, most of the first screenful
> of results used "JavaScript" in the book title. The general convention
> seems to be to use "JavaScript" to refer to the language in general, and
> ECMAScript when talking about that particular standardization effort.
>
> If the objective is to write a FAQ people can understand, we have to use
> the term most books and other writings use, the term readers will be
> used to. That is clearly "JavaScript".
Your logic is flawed. Two wrongs make no right. The FAQ should not promote
misconceptions of incompetent people (or people who were forced by their
publishers to change the title, which is essentially the same).
PointedEars
--
realism: HTML 4.01 Strict
evangelism: XHTML 1.0 Strict
madness: XHTML 1.1 as application/xhtml+xml
-- Bjoern Hoehrmann
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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-08 21:49 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <2627690.c6jmhtmzg9@PointedEars.de> |
| In reply to | #17602 |
Patricia Shanahan wrote: > On 12/8/2012 8:04 AM, John G Harris wrote: >> On Fri, 7 Dec 2012 at 23:22:52, in comp.lang.javascript, Cezary Tomczyk >> wrote: >> >> <snip> >>> Personally I think that we should use one name everywhere - I like >>> "JavaScript". >> <snip> >> >> If you use 'JavaScript' you have a problem. You would be able to say >> 'JScript' for Microsoft's product and 'ActionScript' for Adobe's >> product, but you would have to say 'Mozilla's JavaScript, I mean the one >> in Firefox' for the Mozilla/Firefox product. > > Even if we used "JScript" it would have to be qualified in many cases to > distinguish the capabilities of different versions of IE. Correct. There are different JScript versions as there are versions of IE/MSHTML, WSH and ASP (.NET) to support them. [1] The reader should become acquainted with that fact, or they will never be able to write scripts that work in different versions of IE/MSHTML, WSH or ASP (.NET). A problem occurs with JScript 9.0 and 9.1, though, because Microsoft in their infinite wisdom[tm] have decided for the new version of the MSDN Library to document that language version misleadingly as “Microsoft implementation of JavaScript”, while it is nowhere near the capabilities of (Mozilla) JavaScript [2]. Also, ScriptEngine() still correctly returns "JScript" [3], completing the confusion to beginners. PointedEars ___________ [1] <http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/hbxc2t98(VS.85).aspx> [2] <http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/d1et7k7c(VS.94).aspx> [3] <http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/efy5bay1(VS.94).aspx> -- Use any version of Microsoft Frontpage to create your site. (This won't prevent people from viewing your source, but no one will want to steal it.) -- from <http://www.vortex-webdesign.com/help/hidesource.htm> (404-comp.)
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| From | John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-09 11:05 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <zO5ad3I$BHxQFwld@J.A830F0FF37FB96852AD08924D9443D28E23ED5CD> |
| In reply to | #17608 |
On Sat, 8 Dec 2012 at 21:49:31, in comp.lang.javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: <snip> >A problem occurs with JScript 9.0 and 9.1, though, because Microsoft in >their infinite wisdom[tm] have decided for the new version of the MSDN >Library to document that language version misleadingly as “Microsoft >implementation of JavaScript”, <snip> By coincidence, it's in Microsoft's interests to have 'JavaScript' become a generic name, in the same way that 'hoover' keeps threatening to become one. Then no-one can refer to those rival open source people's product without writing an essay. John OT I remember seeing a car advertised as a "Toyota Land Cruiser jeep". -- John Harris
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| From | Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 03:24 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <k9ovj3$7ff$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #17484 |
Jukka K. Korpela wrote: > There are surely better forums for technical discussions about > JacaScript nowadays. The best that this group could do is to act as a > fairly friendly and open forum that welcomes newcomers. From this > standpoint, I can hardly imagine a worse choice for the FAQ maintainer. IMHO support in this newsgroup and maintaining the FAQ are not /too/ closely related. The FAQ should be a sober document; support should be friendly and kind. OTOH both shouldn't differ /too/ much. If the FAQ says (2.1): | The term "javascript" is used as a common name for all dialects of | ECMAScript. support answers shouldn't state: | There is no "javascript". IMHO that's extremly confusing for newcomers, who have read the FAQ (at least it was for me). Avoiding the term "javascript" and instead speaking of "JavaScript" when actually "ECMAScript" is meant is even more confusing and wrong. And when anybody wants to name the language Brendan Eich developed for Netscape Navigator as Mocha, LiveScript, JavaScript, which was later standardized as ECMAScript, in all its dialects and flavors, IMHO it seems to be quite appropriate to use an artificial name such as "javascript". Just *my* two cents about /some/ of the issues regarding the new maintainer of the FAQ. Definitely nothing that (dis)qualifies Thomas for this role. -- Christoph M. Becker
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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 16:09 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <2177393.4orgOXNLzl@PointedEars.de> |
| In reply to | #17512 |
Christoph Becker wrote:
> Jukka K. Korpela wrote:
>> There are surely better forums for technical discussions about
>> JacaScript nowadays. The best that this group could do is to act as a
>> fairly friendly and open forum that welcomes newcomers. From this
>> standpoint, I can hardly imagine a worse choice for the FAQ maintainer.
>
> IMHO support in this newsgroup and maintaining the FAQ are not /too/
> closely related. The FAQ should be a sober document; support should be
> friendly and kind.
Allow me clarify a few misconceptions you appear to have.
This is a Usenet discussion group, not a customer support forum. Those who
give answers here are volunteers, doing this in their free time, for free.
Which is why politeness here is (as usual) a good idea, but, as you can see
in many postings by several people, it is *optional*. For example, if
someone thinks that you are telling or doing nonsense, you will be told
upfront, in public, that what you are telling or doing *is* nonsense. You
will not be told that it would be “not quite right” in order to pamper your
oversensitive customer soul.
There is an old saying here: “Usenet is not a right.” You have no right to
receive a quick answer. You have no right to receive a polite answer. You
have no right to receive a correct answer. You have no right to receive an
answer that helps you. You have no right to receive an answer *at all*.
Good answers, and the *free time* invested by people to give them, are
*earned* by posting interesting, thought-provoking questions and ideas.
That has been so for more than a decade and it should continue to be so, for
that is how we can weed out the mistakes, and people can become better
developers than before they subscribed to the newsgroup. If you cannot deal
with that approach, please go elsewhere. Perhaps to those “better forums”
(which cannot be and actually are _not_ better in terms of *quality*, of
course).
IOW, should the subscribers of this newsgroup ever agree that it became a
customer support forum, I am gone. This is not a threat; it is a fact.
See also <http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html> (referred to
from the FAQ).
HTH
PointedEars
--
realism: HTML 4.01 Strict
evangelism: XHTML 1.0 Strict
madness: XHTML 1.1 as application/xhtml+xml
-- Bjoern Hoehrmann
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| From | John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 15:23 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <Qw7lqLF2hLwQFwql@J.A830F0FF37FB96852AD08924D9443D28E23ED5CD> |
| In reply to | #17514 |
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 at 16:09:20, in comp.lang.javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: <snip> >You have no right to receive a polite answer. <snip> **** off. John -- John Harris
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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 17:44 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <1782985.ZbPghN5Lpa@PointedEars.de> |
| In reply to | #17518 |
John G Harris wrote:
> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>
> <snip>
>>You have no right to receive a polite answer.
> <snip>
>
> **** off.
There could not be a better example for what I said. Thank you.
PointedEars
--
realism: HTML 4.01 Strict
evangelism: XHTML 1.0 Strict
madness: XHTML 1.1 as application/xhtml+xml
-- Bjoern Hoehrmann
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-07 15:03 +0000 |
| Message-ID | <3shegvE2UgwQFw$H@J.A830F0FF37FB96852AD08924D9443D28E23ED5CD> |
| In reply to | #17521 |
On Thu, 6 Dec 2012 at 17:44:53, in comp.lang.javascript, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >John G Harris wrote: > >> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> >> <snip> >>>You have no right to receive a polite answer. >> <snip> >> >> **** off. > >There could not be a better example for what I said. Thank you. You're welcome. John PS Apologies to John Stockton for spelling spin-off without a hyphen. -- John Harris
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| From | Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 09:05 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <soWdnXSHDusPTV3NnZ2dnUVZ_vqdnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #17514 |
On 12/6/2012 7:09 AM, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: ... > There is an old saying here: “Usenet is not a right.” You have no right to > receive a quick answer. You have no right to receive a polite answer. You > have no right to receive a correct answer. You have no right to receive an > answer that helps you. You have no right to receive an answer *at all*. > Good answers, and the *free time* invested by people to give them, are > *earned* by posting interesting, thought-provoking questions and ideas. ... I agree that a questioner has no right to an answer. I do think any human being, in any social interaction, including asking a question in a technical forum, has a right to common politeness. I have no problem with not answering a question. I do have a problem with people answering a question impolitely. Impolite answers to questions just weed out anyone who does not have enough self-confidence, and prior commitment to Usenet, to ignore impoliteness. Patricia
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| From | Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 18:59 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <k9qmc3$9hq$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #17514 |
Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> IMHO support in this newsgroup and maintaining the FAQ are not >> /too/ >>> closely related. The FAQ should be a sober document; support >>> should be friendly and kind. > Allow me clarify a few misconceptions you appear to have. > > [...] Thanks for the clarifications; they concur with my conception of a Usenet discussion group. And of course I don't want to turn this newsgroup into a support forum. > For example, if someone thinks that you are telling or doing > nonsense, you will be told upfront, in public, that what you are > telling or doing *is* nonsense. You will not be told that it would be > “not quite right” in order to pamper your oversensitive customer > soul. IMHO some kindness and politeness will never hurt.[1] Perhaps the one who's telling or doing nonsense today, would have been a valuable regular contributor to the newsgroup tomorrow, if he had not been scared away. > If you cannot deal with that approach, please go elsewhere. I can deal with this approach, so I will stay. > IOW, should the subscribers of this newsgroup ever agree that it > became a customer support forum, I am gone. That would be a great loss for this newsgroup. (in all honesty) > This is not a threat; it is a fact. Everytime *I* have added this to a statement, it was in fact meant as a threat. ;) [1] <http://www.catb.org/~esr/faqs/smart-questions.html#idp30009456> -- Christoph M. Becker
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| From | Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 19:24 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <k9qnqq$dr9$1@speranza.aioe.org> |
| In reply to | #17527 |
My apologies for not having properly quoted the beginning of my former post. It should have read: Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: > > Christoph Becker wrote: > >> Jukka K. Korpela wrote: >>> There are surely better forums for technical discussions about >>> JacaScript nowadays. The best that this group could do is to act as a >>> fairly friendly and open forum that welcomes newcomers. From this >>> standpoint, I can hardly imagine a worse choice for the FAQ maintainer. >> >> IMHO support in this newsgroup and maintaining the FAQ are not /too/ >> closely related. The FAQ should be a sober document; support should be >> friendly and kind. > > Allow me clarify a few misconceptions you appear to have. -- Christoph M. Becker
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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 19:26 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <1446010.IrhOTgHkso@PointedEars.de> |
| In reply to | #17527 |
Christoph Becker wrote:
> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>> IMHO support in this newsgroup and maintaining the FAQ are not
>>> /too/
>>>> closely related. The FAQ should be a sober document; support
>>>> should be friendly and kind.
>> Allow me clarify a few misconceptions you appear to have.
>>
>> [...]
>
> Thanks for the clarifications; they concur with my conception of a
> Usenet discussion group. And of course I don't want to turn this
> newsgroup into a support forum.
Good.
>> For example, if someone thinks that you are telling or doing
>> nonsense, you will be told upfront, in public, that what you are
>> telling or doing *is* nonsense. You will not be told that it would be
>> “not quite right” in order to pamper your oversensitive customer
>> soul.
>
> IMHO some kindness and politeness will never hurt.[1]
AISB.
> Perhaps the one who's telling or doing nonsense today, would have been a
> valuable regular contributor to the newsgroup tomorrow, if he had not been
> scared away.
In my experience, those who are scared away by being told the truth, usually
because they have delusions of entitlement, are not going to be valuable
regular contributors.
PointedEars
--
realism: HTML 4.01 Strict
evangelism: XHTML 1.0 Strict
madness: XHTML 1.1 as application/xhtml+xml
-- Bjoern Hoehrmann
[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]
| From | Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 14:11 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <TIydnSu3dcDahVzNnZ2dnUVZ_qmdnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #17529 |
On 12/6/2012 10:26 AM, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: > Christoph Becker wrote: ... >> Perhaps the one who's telling or doing nonsense today, would have been a >> valuable regular contributor to the newsgroup tomorrow, if he had not been >> scared away. > > In my experience, those who are scared away by being told the truth, usually > because they have delusions of entitlement, are not going to be valuable > regular contributors. Obviously, anyone who gets scared away is not going to be a contributor in the future. We will never know whether a given individual would have become a valuable regular contributor given more encouraging treatment. I do realize that expecting friendly and welcoming treatment on Usenet these days is indeed a delusion. I just think that Usenet would be both more active and more enjoyable if that changed. Patricia
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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-07 03:07 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <2458355.mBAsdCNDOn@PointedEars.de> |
| In reply to | #17537 |
Patricia Shanahan wrote: > On 12/6/2012 10:26 AM, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> Christoph Becker wrote: >>> Perhaps the one who's telling or doing nonsense today, would have been a >>> valuable regular contributor to the newsgroup tomorrow, if he had not >>> been scared away. >> >> In my experience, those who are scared away by being told the truth, >> usually because they have delusions of entitlement, are not going to be >> valuable regular contributors. > > Obviously, anyone who gets scared away is not going to be a contributor > in the future. We will never know whether a given individual would have > become a valuable regular contributor given more encouraging treatment. No, my point and observation is that a person who is not asking their question in a smart way and will be scared of by comments as to that is just a hit-and-run luser who has no intention of becoming a regular contributor in the first place. And it is only those who are sometimes met with what seems like hostility because of the way they ask their question (if they even ask for, and not simply *demand* a solution). > I do realize that expecting friendly and welcoming treatment on Usenet > these days is indeed a delusion. I just think that Usenet would be both > more active and more enjoyable if that changed. You are missing the point. I have been using and contributing to Usenet for 12 years now, and I think I have come to know this place very well from own experience and from what was passed on by friendly, knowledgable people who are even longer here. The delusion actually is that Usenet has ever been different, and that it needs to change now. It has not, and it should not. Instead, it is the majority of the generation who has grown up without Usenet who have changed for the worse; who have acquired a customer mentality that makes them believe they do not need to make *any* effort in order to solve their problem. And *that* is the cause of them being treated unfriendly (if at all), because they are doing this at the expense of (the free time of) everybody else. Hit-and-run lusers with delusions of grandeur and entitlement. I have no problem seeing them leave. HTH PointedEars -- Sometimes, what you learn is wrong. If those wrong ideas are close to the root of the knowledge tree you build on a particular subject, pruning the bad branches can sometimes cause the whole tree to collapse. -- Mike Duffy in cljs, <news:Xns9FB6521286DB8invalidcom@94.75.214.39>
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| From | Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-06 18:36 -0800 |
| Message-ID | <9r2dnZSB8rCJy1zNnZ2dnUVZ_tmdnZ2d@earthlink.com> |
| In reply to | #17550 |
On 12/6/2012 6:07 PM, Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: ... > You are missing the point. I have been using and contributing to Usenet for > 12 years now, and I think I have come to know this place very well from own > experience and from what was passed on by friendly, knowledgable people who > are even longer here. The delusion actually is that Usenet has ever been > different, and that it needs to change now. It has not, and it should not. I don't know what it was like before about 1983, when I got access. I've been a more-or-less continuous participant since then. I until about the last decade I don't think I ever felt really uncomfortable reading responses to questions from obvious newbies. An under researched question could always be handled by politely suggesting possible research actions. I think there was a big difference in the 1980's relative to now. Most participants worked in a relatively small set of technically-orientated businesses, universities, and the like. That meant we had a much higher probability of meeting or having mutual acquaintances. Patricia
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| From | Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2012-12-07 04:11 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <43735093.ohA7tYpd2c@PointedEars.de> |
| In reply to | #17551 |
Patricia Shanahan wrote: > Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote: >> You are missing the point. I have been using and contributing to Usenet >> for 12 years now, and I think I have come to know this place very well >> from own experience and from what was passed on by friendly, knowledgable >> people who >> are even longer here. The delusion actually is that Usenet has ever been >> different, and that it needs to change now. It has not, and it should >> not. > > I don't know what it was like before about 1983, when I got access. > I've been a more-or-less continuous participant since then. > > I until about the last decade I don't think I ever felt really > uncomfortable reading responses to questions from obvious newbies. An > under researched question could always be handled by politely suggesting > possible research actions. Which is still being done. But you cannot recommend a possible research action to a person who is obviously not willing to do any research. (Let's be on-topic for a minute ;-)) The FAQ is for people who are willing to do that, either because they know that it is expected that you check a newsgroup's FAQ before you post or because they are pointed to it in a posting. Therefore, that FAQ needs to be current and easily readable. I know that the former is not the case, and you have confirmed my suspicion that the latter is not the case, too. Which is why I applied for the job more than two weeks ago and offered optional hosting of it on my server to increase uptime, following the OP by Asen the day before. So – what exactly are we waiting for now? If the assumption is correct that we do need a FAQ, why is it still not maintained? > I think there was a big difference in the 1980's relative to now. Most > participants worked in a relatively small set of technically-orientated > businesses, universities, and the like. That meant we had a much higher > probability of meeting or having mutual acquaintances. Very probable. Usenet has grown into mainstream through the Web (Google Groups, through DejaNews, to be precise) – which accounts for the change in expectation from questioners – and is currently shrinking because the mainstream has shifted to the Web. PointedEars -- > If you get a bunch of authors […] that state the same "best practices" > in any programming language, then you can bet who is wrong or right... Not with javascript. Nonsense propagates like wildfire in this field. -- Richard Cornford, comp.lang.javascript, 2011-11-14
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