Groups | Search | Server Info | Keyboard shortcuts | Login | Register [http] [https] [nntp] [nntps]

Groups > comp.lang.javascript > #17758

Re: Maintainer of the FAQ

Followups directed to: comp.lang.javascript

Show all headers | View raw

Scott Sauyet wrote:

> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>> I also think that a FAQ of a Usenet newsgroup should not be discussed on
>> the Web, like on GitHub.
> 
> I agree with this.  I was proposing GitHub not as a replacement for
> discussion on the group but as an adjunct to it, and as an easy way
> for multiple people to work on the same set of documents.  My thought
> was that a post to the group might explain that the poster has several
> proposed changes to FAQ entry #XYZ, detail those proposed changes, and
> then mention a GitHub commit to the poster's copy of the repository
> for people interested in making further changes to this version.  If
> the poster also mentions a pull request to the main branch, she or he
> would be asking permission of the group to update the official FAQ.

This will be slow, if even feasible.  Look at this thread.  Can you tell how 
long, if measurable, it is going to take for a change to be agreed on and 
implemented?  Who exactly is "the group"?

>> [This may be not obvious to those who have learned of
>> comp.lang.javascript only via Google Groups, but know that this
>> newsgroup, and Usenet, is _not_ located on the Web nor has it much to
>> do with the Internet.  It is only mirrored there, for example by
>> Google.  See also <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Usenet>.]
> 
> ACK, except for "nor has it much to do with the Internet."  The
> internet certainly encompasses Usenet.

You are mistaken.  Please read the referenced Wikipedia article, among other 
material on this topic, more carefully.

>> IMHO, instead of rewriting the FAQ from scratch it is better to follow an
>> iterative approach here: make the best use of what we already have and
>> improve that step by step.  What we already have is XML data.  I have
>> been developing Web sites using an XML-based content management system
>> (Weblication) for the last two years, so I know well what is possible
>> with XML data.
> 
> Interesting.  I agree entirely with this: "make the best use of what
> we already have and improve that step by step."  And then I begin to
> disagree.  I think what we have is a collection of questions and
> answers on topics of importance to comp.lang.javascript.  The fact
> that they are represented at the moment in XML is to me quite
> unimportant.  Although I haven't done so in several years, I also have
> maintained large amounts of data in XML-based systems, often with
> great success.  I'm arguing that it's not really appropriate here.

AIUI, extracting the question-answer pairs one by one into a directory 
structure containing Markdown documents comes closer to creating data than 
reusing data.

>> An often overlooked advantage of XML is that – by contrast e. g. to
>> Markdown – it is not strictly a text format; it is a
>> platform-independent, *structured* *data* format (that also accounts for
>> its often rightfully disliked verbosity).  The advantage of such a data
>> format, if used properly, is that presentation of data is virtually
>> independent of the stored data.
> 
> Actually, XML was more intended, in my understanding, as a document
> markup language, and the use of it as a structured data format was
> more of an afterthought.  While the advantage you suggest is real for
> some applications, I can't help but wonder if it's actually a
> disadvantage in this case.

You may want to read <http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XML> pp. to clarify that 
misconception as well.

>> The FAQ parser already makes use of that by generating the table of
>> contents from the headings of the sections; probably so does the
>> section-posting script (which I have not found yet).  But those do not
>> really make use of the versatility and platform-independence of XML,
>> which probably also accounts for the formatting problems observed with
>> the regularly posted plain-text versions of FAQ sections.  Also the XML
>> source of the FAQ is not written as readable as it could be, which
>> contributes to the impression of some people that an XML-based FAQ would
>> not be easy to maintain.
> 
> There is one more reason that I, for one, don't like the idea of the
> XML-based FAQ:  I really don't like the all-in-one nature of it.

That is not a necessity.  The Web (XHTML) documents of that CMS were 
composed out of several XML documents, some with more textual, others with 
more data-like content.

> I believe that smaller documents are easier to edit, to maintain, 

ACK

> and to share.

NAK

> While we could of course break the FAQ into multiple separate
> XML documents, if we're going to break it up, then it's an appropriate
> time to reconsider the format.

I do not think so.  What is needed is a *structured* data format, so that 
the TOC writes itself, for example.

>> To those ends, I have replaced that hand-written XML parser with a much
>> less complex, equivalent¹ XSLT stylesheet, which it is used in a rather
>> short PHP script.  It was (and is going to be) an interesting exercise
>> for me.  The preliminary result of that can be seen here:
>>
>> <http://PointedEars.de/scripts/faq/cljs/>
> 
> This is well-done.  I had gone through a similar exercise before I
> started down my current path, found that it was certainly doable but
> not followed it through as far as you've done.
> 
> I'm assuming that you recognize that it's missing the chapter
> prefatory material from the current FAQ, for instance the beginning of
> <http://jibbering.com/faq/#dates>, "ISO 8601 defines date and time
> formats. Some benefits include...".

I did not.  Thanks.

> approach, but I can't quite see it now.  Of course if you're looking
> at altering the XML, you could certainly find a structure that would
> make this easier.

Eventually I will alter the markup.  For example, I do not see why the 
element type names and attribute names would need to be all-uppercase, 
making this harder than it needs to be.

> I don't know if you're worried about it at this stage, but there are
> still some validation errors in your HTML output.

I have noticed.  For example, a LIST element with TYPE attribute value "UL" 
was used that was not transformed into Valid HTML because there is no 
special XSL template for it; UL elements have been used elsewhere, so it may 
very well be that the LIST element type is obsolete.

>> Here is how I would like this to work for a start:
>>
>> - Glaringly obvious errors I will fix by myself.  (But you are welcome to
>> point them out to me anyway.  See below.)
> 
> Please, though, even when they're trivial, at least note the changes
> to the group.  They can be bundled together if they are not
> particularly important ("This week, the following minor fixes to the
> FAQ were made:...") but the group should still have a chance to note
> them in case someone thinks they were not actually errors.

To that end, I have included the “Change log” link and intend to post the 
URL to it in FAQ suggestion summaries.

>> - In order to keep the number of discussions in the newsgroup on this FAQ
>> to a minimum (like someone here said so aptly, “Let's discuss
>> JavaScript!”), I am going to
>>
>> * search the newsgroup for <FAQENTRY> sections, and past postings as
>> free time permits;
>>
>> * read follow-ups to FAQ postings;
>>
>> * welcome your suggestions for improvement via e-mail; to my Reply-To
>> address if possible, to my From address if the Reply-To address is not
>> feasible for you;
>>
>> * select a collection of suggestions for discussion in the newsgroup, on
>> a regular basis if possible.  I will hear your opinions, discuss those
>> suggestions (and only those) with you in public, and finally make an
>> informed decision based on those discussions.  (Because given the length
>> of and diversity in this thread already, I seriously doubt it will be
>> possible to do this in a reasonable way based on group consensus, let
>> alone a majority vote; AFAIK, previous maintainers also never operated
>> on such a basis.  Sorry.)
> 
> If the document is presenting one side of something controversial
> within the group, would you be open to also noting the diversity of
> opinion on the subject?

I am open to discussing suggestions as described above.  If they are 
actually controversial, then the follow-up will contain a good 
(counter-)argument why that is.

>> - There is the possibility, and it may become a necessity, to set up a
>> bugtracker for suggestions instead.  (Bugzilla would be my first choice
>> then, particularly because it is Perl-based and I do not know it as well
>> as I would like to.  Sometime in the future JSX is going to need a
>> bugtracker, too.)
> 
> If you do make the switch to git, pull requests can serve a somewhat
> similar role.  If you use GitHub, this can all be quite public, and
> have attached discussions similar to what you'd get in Bugzilla, but
> with a simpler way to actually apply the suggested changes.

I figured that.

>> - Although the copyright statement of the current FAQ is ambiguous to say
>> the least, as Patricia pointed out, I have no intention of infringing
>> copyright.  Those who would like their contributions to be removed from
>> that FAQ may request that.  However, the burden of proof lies with the
>> person requesting removal of content.
> 
> Would you be willing to assign copyright of the work you create in
> this context to the group

No, for one because …

> if we can come up with a less ambiguous statement?

… I seriously doubt that copyright can be *transferred* to a not well-
defined entity.

> I for one would feel much better contributing if the copyright were held
> by the group or if it were explicitly left in the public domain.

Something like the Creative Commons licenses appears to be more reasonable 
here (the CC Attribution-ShareAlike License is used by Wikipedia).

IANAL.

> […]
> In any case, thanks for your work.  This is a great contribution!

No problem.


PointedEars
-- 
Prototype.js was written by people who don't know javascript for people
who don't know javascript. People who don't know javascript are not
  -- Richard Cornford, cljs, <f806at$ail$1$8300dec7@news.demon.co.uk>

Back to comp.lang.javascript | Previous | Next — Previous in thread | Next in thread | Find similar | Unroll thread

Thread

Maintainer of the FAQ Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> - 2012-11-19 13:00 -0800
  Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-11-19 13:34 -0800
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ RobG <rgqld@iinet.net.au> - 2012-11-20 01:25 -0800
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-11-20 13:39 +0100
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> - 2012-11-20 11:24 -0800
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-21 19:19 +0000
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-11-22 14:09 +1100
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-20 19:50 +0000
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-11-20 19:56 -0800
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-11-21 11:24 +0100
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-22 23:34 +0000
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-11-23 11:07 -0800
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-24 18:30 +0000
  Re: Maintainer of the FAQ jim.ley@gmail.com - 2012-11-22 03:06 -0800
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> - 2012-11-22 07:15 -0800
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Martin Leese <please@see.Web.for.e-mail.INVALID> - 2012-11-22 08:48 -0700
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-23 20:00 +0000
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-11-24 10:36 +0100
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1247@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-11-25 19:16 +0000
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-11-26 10:18 +0000
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-11-26 12:50 +0200
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-11-30 14:23 -0500
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-01 09:24 +0000
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-12-01 08:45 -0500
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-01 16:17 +0200
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-12 19:30 -0800
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-01 18:50 +0100
  Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-02 19:25 +0100
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-02 21:31 +0100
  Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Asen Bozhilov <asen.bozhilov@gmail.com> - 2012-12-05 03:48 -0800
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-05 12:55 +0100
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-05 14:52 +0200
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-06 06:16 +1100
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-12-05 16:56 -0500
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-06 00:20 +0200
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-05 14:47 -0800
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-06 07:11 -0800
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 08:37 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 17:50 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 08:57 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 18:32 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 10:34 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-07 11:05 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-07 07:21 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-11 09:01 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-12 19:37 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-12-07 11:24 -0500
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-11 09:00 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-07 20:54 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-08 03:42 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 02:53 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-09 16:43 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-07 11:16 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-08 18:45 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-06 10:40 -0800
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-06 15:16 +0000
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 08:48 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-06 18:31 +0000
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-06 23:06 +0000
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 16:24 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-08 18:06 +0000
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 01:29 +0100
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-05 22:24 +0000
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-05 23:36 +0100
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 00:35 +0100
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-07 10:45 +1100
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 16:01 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-07 21:00 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-08 10:17 +0000
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 01:12 +0100
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 23:22 +0100
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 04:46 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-08 15:56 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-08 09:00 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 17:54 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 20:53 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 11:02 +0100
                Functions in JavaScript vs. mathematics & the name "JavaScript" "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-08 23:31 +0200
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Mike Duffy <Use_guestbook_page@website.in.sig> - 2012-12-09 02:02 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-08 23:12 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-09 16:44 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Wally W. <ww84wa@aim.com> - 2012-12-10 01:30 -0500
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-08 16:04 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-08 08:37 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 21:34 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 21:49 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-09 11:05 +0000
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-06 03:24 +0100
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 16:09 +0100
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-06 15:23 +0000
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 17:44 +0100
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-07 15:03 +0000
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 09:05 -0800
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-06 18:59 +0100
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-06 19:24 +0100
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-06 19:26 +0100
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 14:11 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-07 03:07 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 18:36 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-07 04:11 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-06 20:26 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-07 20:40 +1100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-07 01:58 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-07 14:32 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-07 07:22 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 11:19 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-07 21:11 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-07 16:19 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-08 18:33 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-08 22:14 -0800
                FAQ source format (was: Maintainer of the FAQ) Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 13:56 +0100
                Re: FAQ source format Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-09 08:09 -0800
                Re: FAQ source format Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 19:12 -0800
                Re: FAQ source format Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-10 20:49 +0000
                Re: FAQ source format (was: Maintainer of the FAQ) Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 18:59 -0800
                Re: FAQ source format Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-09 20:13 -0800
                Re: FAQ source format Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 20:50 -0800
                Re: FAQ source format (was: Maintainer of the FAQ) Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-10 20:41 +0000
                Re: FAQ source format (was: Maintainer of the FAQ) Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-10 18:09 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-09 07:06 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-09 19:12 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-09 20:11 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-10 20:32 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-10 17:53 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-12 21:07 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Wally W. <ww84wa@aim.com> - 2012-12-12 21:52 -0500
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-13 16:05 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 00:40 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-13 08:09 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 00:40 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-15 11:02 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-16 17:58 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-17 11:22 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-17 10:40 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-17 20:05 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 00:31 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Osmo Saarikumpu <osmo@weppipakki.com> - 2012-12-18 10:18 +0200
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-18 13:38 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 14:59 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-18 16:33 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-18 09:26 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-18 23:09 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 23:47 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-18 15:21 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-18 16:32 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-18 08:11 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-19 18:26 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-20 06:55 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-21 15:46 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-21 06:59 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-21 08:27 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-21 19:12 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-21 15:30 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-21 08:24 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-21 19:09 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-21 20:21 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-22 08:58 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-14 08:01 +1100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Adam Silver <adambsilver@gmail.com> - 2012-12-14 00:28 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 23:25 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 00:39 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-16 00:23 +1100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-15 15:00 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Osmo Saarikumpu <osmo@weppipakki.com> - 2012-12-16 17:14 +0200
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-17 18:33 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-16 17:32 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-16 17:24 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-18 17:15 +1100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-19 18:57 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Osmo Saarikumpu <osmo@weppipakki.com> - 2012-12-27 23:03 +0200
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-28 11:14 +1100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-28 09:12 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-08 18:24 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-07 10:11 +0000
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-13 09:25 -0800
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-14 07:26 +1100
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Evertjan." <exxjxw.hannivoort@inter.nl.net> - 2012-12-13 21:45 +0100
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-07 21:06 +0000
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-08 02:45 +0100
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-08 13:30 +1100
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-09 17:00 +0000
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2012-12-08 10:14 +0000
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-05 09:03 -0800
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-05 18:39 +0100
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-05 11:56 -0800
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-05 12:30 -0800
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2012-12-06 08:54 +1100
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-05 23:38 +0100
              Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Matt McDonald <matt@fortybelow.ca> - 2012-12-13 14:18 -0500
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1250@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-15 00:09 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-16 01:54 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-17 18:32 +0000
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-18 07:06 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 17:54 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-18 11:38 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-18 12:50 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-18 23:23 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-18 19:46 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-19 18:10 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-19 11:31 -0800
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-19 22:54 +0100
                Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-19 16:36 +0100
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2012-12-05 22:49 +0100
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-06 23:21 +0000
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-06 15:08 +0000
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Stefan Weiss <krewecherl@gmail.com> - 2012-12-07 01:01 +0100
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Adam Silver <adambsilver@gmail.com> - 2012-12-06 07:40 -0800
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1249@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-06 23:51 +0000
  Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 02:19 +0000
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Christoph Becker <cmbecker69@gmx.de> - 2012-12-08 03:57 +0100
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 03:06 +0000
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2012-12-08 09:34 +0100
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Good Guy <hello.world@example.com> - 2012-12-08 13:36 +0000
  Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-22 16:19 +1100
    Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Patricia Shanahan <pats@acm.org> - 2012-12-22 08:59 -0800
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-23 13:38 +1100
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ "Jukka K. Korpela" <jkorpela@cs.tut.fi> - 2012-12-23 10:49 +0200
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Gene Wirchenko <genew@telus.net> - 2012-12-23 16:58 -0800
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1252@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-24 21:03 +0000
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2012-12-27 09:33 -0800
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1252@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-28 21:33 +0000
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-28 11:16 +1100
        Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-28 09:08 +0000
          Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Jeff North <jnorthau@yahoo.com.au> - 2012-12-28 22:01 +1100
            Re: Maintainer of the FAQ John G Harris <john@nospam.demon.co.uk> - 2012-12-28 11:26 +0000
      Re: Maintainer of the FAQ Dr J R Stockton <reply1251@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2012-12-23 19:13 +0000

csiph-web