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Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition

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Scott Sauyet wrote:

> Andrew wrote:
>> Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn wrote:
>>> Scott Sauyet wrote:
>>>> Andrew wrote:
>>>>> Is there an online reference of reasonable quality, similar to the
>>>>> documentation for Python? (I'm guessing no, but would like to be
>>>>> wrong)
>>>>
>>>> I don't really know the Python documentation, but there is definitely
>>>> not one definitive source of API documentation,
>>>
>>> The reason of which is that, AFAIK by contrast to Python, there is no
>>> ´Javascript¡.  I am still amazed how some people can still manage to
>>> ignore that basic fact.
>>
>> I was aware of the distinction, but given that "Javascript" is in both
>> the name of the group and the name of the book I was inquiring about,
>> being pedantic about it seemed like it would distract from the question I
>> wanted to ask.
> 
> Thomas is well-known here for extremely pedantic answers.  That he
> also has a lot of useful knowledge only partly compensates for his
> anti-social behavior.

That is a luser attitude.  There is nothing pedantic or anti-social about 
telling people the truth.  There *really* is no “Javascript” as there is 
Python, that is

1. There is no programming language of that name, and

2. the language commonly subsumed (by newcomers) under that name actually is
   *several* *different* languages, implementations of a common language
   Specification, ECMAScript.

It is important to know and accept that fact if you want to get serious with 
these language*s*.  Unlike Python, if you want to get serious, you do not 
learn “Javascript” once and for all; you better learn JavaScript, JScript, 
V8 JavaScript, Opera ECMAScript, and KDE JavaScript, among others.  And then 
you better learn the environment-dependent APIs that can be used with those 
languages, like the several DOM APIs. because it is only the host 
environment that enables these programming languages to be useful.  All of 
those are on-topic here.

If you can't stand the heat, stay out of the kitchen.

>>> Links to reference material other than books can be found in the FAQs
>>> for this newsgroup. [2]  In fact, books are the resources that are the
>>> least recommended there for good reasons.
>>
>> The (apparently wrong) impression I got from the FAQ was that the online
>> resources listed were all either specifications, bare references, or
>> individual-implementation-specific information. What I wanted was a
>> language guide aimed at experienced programmers new to ECMAScript, and
>> looking to program in a manner that would work cross-browser without
>> unnatural acts.
>>
>> Nothing listed appeared to suit, and I assumed if there was something
>> suitable out there it would be listed; hence I looked to books instead.
>> If you're updating the FAQ, it may be worth being more descriptive in the
>> resource section.

Or you may want to read it again, after you accepted the fact that there is 
no “Javascript”  For the references that I mentioned are there.

It is a pity that the original FAQ chose to use the “javascript” misnomer 
almost arbitrarily.  Your not finding the relevant references is yet another 
indication to me that the term should be replaced in the new FAQ, and the  
situation explained, as the current term is more confusing to beginners than 
helpful.
 
> There are in my opinion more books worth consideration than there were
> a few years ago.  As well as the two mentioned in the FAQ (Flanagan's
> _The Definitive Guide_ and Crockford's _The Good Parts_), I would also
> recommend, with some caveats:
> 
>     JavaScript Patterns, by Stoyen Stefanov

_Stoyan_, I think.

>     Test-Driven JavaScript, by Christian Johansen
>     High Performance JavaScript, by Nicholas Zakas
> 
> and, with very few caveats:
> 
>     Eloquent JavaScript, by Marijn Haverbeke
>     Effective JavaScript, by David Herman

But on which *grounds* do you recommend these books?  If they are actually 
worth recommending, if you can *convince* me/us that they are good and can 
say why (or why not), I shall add them to the FAQ for comp.lang.javascript 
(with a *specific* caveat, if necessary).

>>> _______
>>> [1] <http://PointedEars.de/es-matrix>
>>> [2] <http://PointedEars.de/faq> contains a maintained, currently only
>>> slightly modified version of <http://jibbering.com/f;the latter
>>> is not maintained since 2010.  See the changelog for details.
>>
>> Just FYI, neither of those links works for me. I can ping the site and
>> nmap claims the appropriate ports are open, but attempts from a couple of
>> different browsers in a couple of different locations all hang on Waiting
>> for pointedears.de.
> 
> I don't know what's up with Thomas' site.

It was working when I posted that and it is working now (uncached) without 
my intervention.  It may not have worked for reasons currently unknown to me 
while I was out for the day.  On the other hand, there could also be yet 
another Google Groups bug.

> But the link to the cljs faq was simply mistyped:
> 
>     <http://jibbering.com/faq/>

That is not a link, but a URI, and the cljs FAQ still is outdated; otherwise 
ACK.  However, by contrast that site is known here for being offline 
frequently (much more often than my site) which is another reason for my the 
fork.

-- 
PointedEars

Twitter: @PointedEars2
Please do not Cc: me. / Bitte keine Kopien per E-Mail.

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Thread

Javascript: TDG 6th edition Andrew <andrew@invalid.invalid> - 2013-05-06 07:53 -0400
  Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2013-05-06 06:46 -0700
    Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-05-06 18:10 +0200
      Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Andrew <andrew@invalid.invalid> - 2013-05-07 07:42 -0400
        Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2013-05-07 05:54 -0700
          Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-05-07 19:48 +0200
            Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2013-05-07 12:53 -0700
              Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-05-07 22:48 +0200
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2013-05-07 14:02 -0700
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-05-08 10:11 +0200
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2013-05-09 08:33 -0700
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-05-09 16:54 +0100
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2013-05-09 13:02 -0700
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-05-09 22:38 +0100
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Dr J R Stockton <reply1300@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2013-05-10 20:03 +0100
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition MC <news@aisus.com> - 2013-05-17 11:04 -0500
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2013-05-18 13:09 +1000
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-05-18 10:40 +0200
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition John Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2013-05-18 10:16 +0100
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Andrew Poulos <ap_prog@hotmail.com> - 2013-05-18 20:14 +1000
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition MC <news@aisus.com> - 2013-05-18 10:11 -0500
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Dr J R Stockton <reply1300@merlyn.demon.co.uk.invalid> - 2013-05-20 19:58 +0100
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Tim Streater <timstreater@greenbee.net> - 2013-05-07 22:03 +0100
            Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2013-05-07 13:02 -0700
              Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-05-07 22:50 +0200
                Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Scott Sauyet <scott.sauyet@gmail.com> - 2013-05-07 14:03 -0700
            Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition John Harris <niam@jghnorth.org.uk.invalid> - 2013-05-07 21:39 +0100
            Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Cezary Tomczyk <cezary.tomczyk@gmail.com> - 2013-05-08 00:10 -0700
              Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-05-08 09:51 +0200
            Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Luuk <luuk@invalid.lan> - 2013-05-09 23:36 +0200
          Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition MC <news@aisus.com> - 2013-05-17 08:59 -0500
      Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Joao Rodrigues <groups_jr-1@yahoo.com.br> - 2013-05-21 00:50 -0300
        Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Thomas 'PointedEars' Lahn <PointedEars@web.de> - 2013-05-21 12:50 +0200
    Re: Javascript: TDG 6th edition Andrew <andrew@invalid.invalid> - 2013-05-07 07:25 -0400

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