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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #29767 > unrolled thread
| Started by | Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| First post | 2014-04-22 03:02 -0700 |
| Last post | 2014-05-04 13:46 -0400 |
| Articles | 20 on this page of 123 — 32 participants |
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One for Elizabeth... Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-04-22 03:02 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-04-22 09:04 -1000
Re: One for Elizabeth... Jecel <jecel@merlintec.com> - 2014-04-23 15:37 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-04-24 01:20 +0200
Re: One for Elizabeth... anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-04-24 17:24 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm> - 2014-04-25 00:22 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-04-25 00:53 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-04-25 05:16 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-04-25 10:19 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2014-04-25 09:40 -0500
Re: One for Elizabeth... anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-04-25 15:01 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2014-04-25 10:57 -0500
Re: One for Elizabeth... anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-04-25 16:58 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... Paul E Bennett <Paul_E.Bennett@topmail.co.uk> - 2014-04-26 07:52 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-04-25 09:01 -1000
Re: One for Elizabeth... Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-05-06 01:17 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-05-06 01:16 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-04-23 22:12 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Shark8 <OneWingedShark@gmail.com> - 2014-04-24 11:02 -0600
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-04-24 19:21 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Shark8 <OneWingedShark@gmail.com> - 2014-04-24 21:52 -0600
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm> - 2014-04-25 00:27 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-04-24 20:24 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-04-24 19:40 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Shark8 <OneWingedShark@gmail.com> - 2014-04-24 21:57 -0600
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Bill Leary" <Bill_Leary@msn.com> - 2014-04-25 21:04 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... Elizabeth D Rather <erather@forth.com> - 2014-04-25 15:57 -1000
Re: One for Elizabeth... Steve Graham <jsgrahamus@yahoo.com> - 2014-04-26 11:49 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-04-26 10:30 -1000
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-04-27 17:55 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-04-28 11:33 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-04-28 20:53 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-04-29 07:46 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-04-28 21:57 -1000
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-01 20:59 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-05-02 07:46 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-02 20:31 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-05-03 08:26 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-03 19:33 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> - 2014-05-04 03:35 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-04 11:06 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> - 2014-05-05 01:11 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-05 20:45 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Rob Sciuk <rob@controlq.com> - 2014-05-06 12:53 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... Assad Ebrahim <assad.ebrahim@alum.swarthmore.edu> - 2014-05-07 09:59 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-07 12:12 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2014-05-08 02:05 +0200
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-10 23:01 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-05 20:58 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... AKK <akk@nospam.org> - 2014-05-06 07:16 +0200
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-05-05 20:52 -1000
Re: One for Elizabeth... Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> - 2014-05-06 01:17 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Alex McDonald" <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2014-05-06 11:13 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm> - 2014-05-06 07:12 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> - 2014-05-06 10:57 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-06 17:06 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> - 2014-05-06 07:52 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> - 2014-05-06 17:11 +0200
Re: One for Elizabeth... Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> - 2014-05-06 08:57 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-07 00:38 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-07 22:56 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> - 2014-05-08 04:10 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... thomas.worthington@london.ac.uk - 2014-05-08 04:42 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-08 11:17 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-07 00:31 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-07 00:23 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-07 02:29 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-07 13:39 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-08 01:26 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-08 04:11 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-08 08:34 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-08 11:04 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-08 17:28 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> - 2014-05-09 02:55 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-09 10:42 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-09 19:59 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-09 20:25 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> - 2014-05-11 05:24 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Julian Fondren <ayrnieu@gmail.com> - 2014-05-12 22:08 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-12 22:11 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-13 22:37 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm> - 2014-05-14 04:09 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... Stefan Mauerhofer <smauerhofer@androsoft.ch> - 2014-05-14 04:44 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-05-14 05:05 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-14 20:53 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-15 01:08 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-18 22:23 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Whammo <sidciavic@gmail.com> - 2014-05-19 09:48 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-21 19:50 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm> - 2014-05-22 00:46 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm> - 2014-05-19 22:37 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-21 23:58 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-21 19:24 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-05-22 11:05 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-22 23:19 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-05-23 11:34 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-26 11:44 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-27 14:20 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-27 10:30 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-27 19:58 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-28 07:45 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2014-05-28 03:03 -0500
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-28 16:36 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-28 23:03 -0400
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-29 11:01 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-05-30 16:44 +0000
Re: One for Elizabeth... "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-05-29 08:25 -1000
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-21 23:32 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-26 11:15 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-27 19:42 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-27 20:23 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-28 09:14 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-28 16:25 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-29 20:47 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-29 20:28 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Gerry Jackson <gerry@jackson9000.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-05-30 22:24 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-30 21:49 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-05-29 23:40 +0200
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-29 19:47 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Paul E Bennett <Paul_E.Bennett@topmail.co.uk> - 2014-05-08 14:36 +0100
Re: One for Elizabeth... visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-08 10:46 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... hughaguilar96@yahoo.com - 2014-05-07 22:24 -0700
Re: One for Elizabeth... Rob Sciuk <rob@controlq.com> - 2014-05-04 13:46 -0400
Page 3 of 7 — ← Prev page 1 2 [3] 4 5 6 7 Next page →
| From | hughaguilar96@yahoo.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-04 11:06 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <08f880ce-af81-4b0a-aa2a-b68c2be7ed19@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30082 |
On Sunday, May 4, 2014 3:35:01 AM UTC-7, Laurent Laborde wrote: > Because who care if someone is wrong on the Intertube ? It matters because Elizabeth Rather and Stephen Pelc are on the Forth-200x committee, and were on the ANS-Forth committee. The general public sees them as being the face of Forth (not just ANS-Forth and Forth-200x). The result is that, when I tell people that I program in Forth, they will likely say: "Oh, you're an idiot --- you don't know how to write general-purpose data-structures, and so you have write everything from scratch every time." Or, more likely, they will not say anything because they want to be polite, but will just walk away thinking this in their heads. This is how Elizabeth Rather describes herself, and her sales pitch is widely believed: "Elizabeth Rather is the co-founder of FORTH, Inc. and is a leading expert in the Forth programming language. Elizabeth was a colleague of Chuck Moore back when he worked at NRAO in the early 1970s. During his development of Forth, she became the second ever Forth programmer. Since then, she has become a leading expert in the language and one of its main proponents. Elizabeth was the chair of the ANSI Technical Committee that produced the ANSI Standard for Forth (1994). She is an author of several books on Forth and gives regular training seminars on its usage."
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| From | Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-05 01:11 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <9ca02e36-be4e-48f7-b354-99d6548f715e@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30087 |
On Sunday, May 4, 2014 8:06:46 PM UTC+2, hughag...@yahoo.com wrote: > On Sunday, May 4, 2014 3:35:01 AM UTC-7, Laurent Laborde wrote: > > > Because who care if someone is wrong on the Intertube ? > > It matters because Elizabeth Rather and Stephen Pelc are on the Forth-200x committee, and were on the ANS-Forth committee. The general public sees them as being the face of Forth (not just ANS-Forth and Forth-200x). The result is that, when I tell people that I program in Forth, they will likely say: "Oh, you're an idiot --- you don't know how to write general-purpose data-structures, and so you have write everything from scratch every time." Or, more likely, they will not say anything because they want to be polite, but will just walk away thinking this in their heads. There is many many language out there and forth is an odd choice. I gave my opinion about forth and what could help to spread it in "enterprisy" environment and the answer was : "STFU NOOB!". So far, the problem i have with forth isn't the language, it's the peoples :) > This is how Elizabeth Rather describes herself, and her sales pitch is widely believed: > > "Elizabeth Rather is the co-founder of FORTH, Inc. and is a leading expert in the Forth programming language. Elizabeth was a colleague of Chuck Moore back when he worked at NRAO in the early 1970s. During his development of Forth, she became the second ever Forth programmer. Since then, she has become a leading expert in the language and one of its main proponents. Elizabeth was the chair of the ANSI Technical Committee that produced the ANSI Standard for Forth (1994). She is an author of several books on Forth and gives regular training seminars on its usage." Errr... and ?
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| From | hughaguilar96@yahoo.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-05 20:45 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <4c230165-ab1b-4140-8b78-55e87c911a09@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30107 |
On Monday, May 5, 2014 1:11:07 AM UTC-7, Laurent Laborde wrote: > On Sunday, May 4, 2014 8:06:46 PM UTC+2, hughag...@yahoo.com wrote: > > On Sunday, May 4, 2014 3:35:01 AM UTC-7, Laurent Laborde wrote: > > > > Because who care if someone is wrong on the Intertube ? > > > It matters because Elizabeth Rather and Stephen Pelc are on the Forth-200x committee, and were on the ANS-Forth committee. The general public sees them as being the face of Forth (not just ANS-Forth and Forth-200x). The result is that, when I tell people that I program in Forth, they will likely say: "Oh, you're an idiot --- you don't know how to write general-purpose data-structures, and so you have write everything from scratch every time." Or, more likely, they will not say anything because they want to be polite, but will just walk away thinking this in their heads. > > There is many many language out there and forth is an odd choice. What you and Rob Sciuk aren't getting, is that Forth programming is something that I'm proud of. I wrote MFX! For you guys, Forth is just an "odd choice" out of "many many languages" --- you think that I should just accept Elizabeth Rather as the leader and play nice. I can't accept a salesperson as my leader though, because that would require me to throw away what I take pride in doing, which is programming in Forth. I never signed up to join a cult, back in 1984 when I started programming in Forth. Now I really consider ANS-Forth to be a cult. Elizabeth Rather, with all of her bragging about having learned Forth directly from Charles Moore, is very similar to a cult leader bragging about "channeling" some great leader from the ancient past that nobody else has access to (like Moses, for example). This would make a lot more sense if Charles Moore were dead, but he never visits comp.lang.forth, so that is effectively the same thing. It is all baloney anyway; she has never written a Forth program in her life --- she really knows nothing about Forth programming. I was hugely offended by her statement about the data-structures in my novice package. She is trying to project her own incompetence on me --- actually, on the entire Forth community. Like I said, ANS-Forth is a cult --- it is all about loyalty to the leader --- but none of the members want to use any critical thinking on their leader's statements because they know that their leader isn't making any sense. This is why Pelc fizzled out and refused to say that he agreed with her critique of my data-structures --- he can't bring himself to publicly lie (drink the Kool-Aid) --- but, on the other hand, he can't bring himself to drop out of the cult either. > I gave my opinion about forth and what could help to spread it in "enterprisy" environment and the answer was : "STFU NOOB!". Bernd Payson was feeling pretty sensitive about the title of the thread: "Epic Fail." That is why he was rude to you. Also, your idea wasn't very good. We know about the JVM, so it was a bit presumptious of you to suggest it as if we hadn't heard of it before. I have criticized Payson heavily for writing Gforth in C --- I would have a field day with him if he targeted the JVM --- he isn't going to do that. What is going to happen with Gforth is that it will be rewritten to generate machine-code, which is what I would have suggested 20 years ago --- well, better late than never. Anyway, there is plenty of C/C++ code out there that wrappers can be written for, so there is no need to delve into the murky world of the Java ecosystem. > So far, the problem i have with forth isn't the language, it's the peoples :) Well, the whole Forth community is in turmoil because it has become increasingly obvious that ANS-Forth has been an "epic fail" --- they can't continue to pretend that ANS-Forth was a technical success --- now they have to either drop ANS-Forth or just admit that they are a cult. This dilemma is causing a lot of psychological anxiety, and so they tend to lash out at people outside of the cult such as you and I.
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| From | Rob Sciuk <rob@controlq.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 12:53 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <alpine.BSF.2.00.1405061248100.32983@yoko.controlq.com> |
| In reply to | #30114 |
On Mon, 5 May 2014, hughaguilar96@yahoo.com wrote: > What you and Rob Sciuk aren't getting, is that Forth programming is > something that I'm proud of. I wrote MFX! For you guys, Forth is just an > "odd choice" out of "many many languages" --- you think that I should > just accept Elizabeth Rather as the leader and play nice. I can't accept > a salesperson as my leader though, because that would require me to > throw away what I take pride in doing, which is programming in Forth. Hugh, If you have prodigious Forth skills, then act like a professional, ignore the slight (perceived or otherwise), and contribute in a positive manner to support the language you love, and encourage newbies to take it up. What you have done in the past has made you what you are. Others perceive you by your words. Make them useful and helpful, and just try and ignore those whom you perceive to be impediments. I look forward to Hugh Auilar being pointed to as a role model, and a source of knowledge rather than a source of negative energy. Cheers, Rob Sciuk.
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| From | Assad Ebrahim <assad.ebrahim@alum.swarthmore.edu> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-07 09:59 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <adtjm9p7m958iomheu3n1l9q74kff6p8qc@4ax.com> |
| In reply to | #30128 |
On Tue, 6 May 2014 12:53:30 -0400, Rob Sciuk <rob@controlq.com> wrote: >On Mon, 5 May 2014, hughaguilar96@yahoo.com wrote: > >> What you and Rob Sciuk aren't getting, is that Forth programming is >> something that I'm proud of. I wrote MFX! For you guys, Forth is just an >> "odd choice" out of "many many languages" --- you think that I should >> just accept Elizabeth Rather as the leader and play nice. I can't accept >> a salesperson as my leader though, because that would require me to >> throw away what I take pride in doing, which is programming in Forth. > >Hugh, > >If you have prodigious Forth skills, then act like a professional, ignore >the slight (perceived or otherwise), and contribute in a positive manner >to support the language you love, and encourage newbies to take it up. > >What you have done in the past has made you what you are. Others perceive >you by your words. Make them useful and helpful, and just try and ignore >those whom you perceive to be impediments. I look forward to Hugh Auilar >being pointed to as a role model, and a source of knowledge rather than a >source of negative energy. > >Cheers, >Rob Sciuk. I second Rob's suggestion. Assad
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| From | rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-07 12:12 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <lkdm0t$b4f$3@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #30144 |
On 5/7/2014 4:59 AM, Assad Ebrahim wrote: > On Tue, 6 May 2014 12:53:30 -0400, Rob Sciuk <rob@controlq.com> wrote: > >> On Mon, 5 May 2014, hughaguilar96@yahoo.com wrote: >> >>> What you and Rob Sciuk aren't getting, is that Forth programming is >>> something that I'm proud of. I wrote MFX! For you guys, Forth is just an >>> "odd choice" out of "many many languages" --- you think that I should >>> just accept Elizabeth Rather as the leader and play nice. I can't accept >>> a salesperson as my leader though, because that would require me to >>> throw away what I take pride in doing, which is programming in Forth. >> >> Hugh, >> >> If you have prodigious Forth skills, then act like a professional, ignore >> the slight (perceived or otherwise), and contribute in a positive manner >> to support the language you love, and encourage newbies to take it up. >> >> What you have done in the past has made you what you are. Others perceive >> you by your words. Make them useful and helpful, and just try and ignore >> those whom you perceive to be impediments. I look forward to Hugh Auilar >> being pointed to as a role model, and a source of knowledge rather than a >> source of negative energy. >> >> Cheers, >> Rob Sciuk. > > I second Rob's suggestion. > > Assad Nothing anyone can write will have an impact on Hugh. I think his nature is pretty clear at this point. I don't know that he posts his rants out of a desire to stir the pot as a typical troll would do, or if he truly can't help himself. Either way, it is best to not respond to him at all. Anything you post is just more likely to result in yet another reply. It is a bit like exchanging messages with the Borg. Resistance is futile. -- Rick
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| From | Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-08 02:05 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <1la92lp8iu4rg$.q2va2gx9s3dd.dlg@40tude.net> |
| In reply to | #30153 |
Op Wed, 07 May 2014 12:12:14 -0400 schreef rickman: > On 5/7/2014 4:59 AM, Assad Ebrahim wrote: >> On Tue, 6 May 2014 12:53:30 -0400, Rob Sciuk <rob@controlq.com> wrote: >> >>> On Mon, 5 May 2014, hughaguilar96@yahoo.com wrote: >>> >>>> What you and Rob Sciuk aren't getting, is that Forth programming is >>>> something that I'm proud of. I wrote MFX! For you guys, Forth is just an >>>> "odd choice" out of "many many languages" --- you think that I should >>>> just accept Elizabeth Rather as the leader and play nice. I can't accept >>>> a salesperson as my leader though, because that would require me to >>>> throw away what I take pride in doing, which is programming in Forth. >>> >>> Hugh, >>> >>> If you have prodigious Forth skills, then act like a professional, ignore >>> the slight (perceived or otherwise), and contribute in a positive manner >>> to support the language you love, and encourage newbies to take it up. >>> >>> What you have done in the past has made you what you are. Others perceive >>> you by your words. Make them useful and helpful, and just try and ignore >>> those whom you perceive to be impediments. I look forward to Hugh Auilar >>> being pointed to as a role model, and a source of knowledge rather than a >>> source of negative energy. >>> >>> Cheers, >>> Rob Sciuk. >> >> I second Rob's suggestion. >> >> Assad > > Nothing anyone can write will have an impact on Hugh. I think his > nature is pretty clear at this point. I don't know that he posts his > rants out of a desire to stir the pot as a typical troll would do, or if > he truly can't help himself. Either way, it is best to not respond to > him at all. Anything you post is just more likely to result in yet > another reply. > > It is a bit like exchanging messages with the Borg. Resistance is futile. Come to think of it, one of them was named Hugh. Definitly no family: that one you could reason with. -- Coos CHForth, 16 bit DOS applications http://home.hccnet.nl/j.j.haak/forth.html
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| From | hughaguilar96@yahoo.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-10 23:01 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <e5a3e4d2-33e8-4fdc-ae8a-ca3fd4fb91b2@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30128 |
On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 9:53:30 AM UTC-7, Rob Sciuk wrote: > On Mon, 5 May 2014, hughaguilar96@yahoo.com wrote: > > > What you and Rob Sciuk aren't getting, is that Forth programming is > > something that I'm proud of. I wrote MFX! For you guys, Forth is just an > > "odd choice" out of "many many languages" --- you think that I should > > just accept Elizabeth Rather as the leader and play nice. I can't accept > > a salesperson as my leader though, because that would require me to > > throw away what I take pride in doing, which is programming in Forth. > Hugh, > > If you have prodigious Forth skills, then act like a professional, ignore > the slight (perceived or otherwise), and contribute in a positive manner > to support the language you love, and encourage newbies to take it up. How do I support Forth and encourage newbies to take it up? I want to contribute in a positive manner, but I don't know how. > What you have done in the past has made you what you are. Others perceive > you by your words. Make them useful and helpful, and just try and ignore > those whom you perceive to be impediments. I look forward to Hugh Auilar > being pointed to as a role model, and a source of knowledge rather than a > source of negative energy. What did I do in the past that brought all of this on? I can't be a "role model" without Elizabeth Rather's permission --- but she has never credited me with being a Forth programmer at all, going way back to 2009 when I wrote symtab that she says "sucks" and wrote the LC53 encryption-cracking program that Marcel Hendrix posted on comp.lang.forth with my name removed from the copyright notice. It is not possible to join a cult without the cult leader's permission, and the only way to get permission is to kiss the cult leader's ring like a vassal --- this is how all cults operate --- every long-timer on comp.lang.forth has done it except for me. You will drink the Kool-Aid too, if you expect to become a "positive contributor" here --- all you have to do is tell a lie in support of Elizabeth Rather, and the more blatant the better --- you could, for example, say that you agree with Elizabeth Rather's critique of the data-structures in my novice package (what Stephen Pelc balked at doing).
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| From | Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-05 20:58 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <7xfvknd0d1.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com> |
| In reply to | #30107 |
Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> writes: > There is many many language out there and forth is an odd choice. > I gave my opinion about forth and what could help to spread it in > "enterprisy" environment and the answer was : "STFU NOOB!". > So far, the problem i have with forth isn't the language, it's the > peoples :) If you think of a Forth as a domain-specific language for hardware control, that has been pressed into service for some other applications with varying degrees of success, maybe it will make more sense to you. The whole philosophy of Forth revolves around using minimal hardware resources, including machinery and culture that gets people to "redefine the problem" to suppress unnecessary features. Saying "Forth" and "JVM" in the same sentence probably gets quite a few Forthers tied in knots. The JVM isn't that relevant to most programming projects either. It's heavily used in certain environments but not others.
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| From | AKK <akk@nospam.org> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 07:16 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <53687049$0$6611$9b4e6d93@newsspool4.arcor-online.net> |
| In reply to | #30115 |
Am 06.05.2014 05:58, schrieb Paul Rubin: > Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> writes: >> There is many many language out there and forth is an odd choice. >> I gave my opinion about forth and what could help to spread it in >> "enterprisy" environment and the answer was : "STFU NOOB!". >> So far, the problem i have with forth isn't the language, it's the >> peoples :) > > If you think of a Forth as a domain-specific language for hardware > control, that has been pressed into service for some other applications > with varying degrees of success, maybe it will make more sense to you. > > The whole philosophy of Forth revolves around using minimal hardware > resources, including machinery and culture that gets people to "redefine > the problem" to suppress unnecessary features. Saying "Forth" and "JVM" > in the same sentence probably gets quite a few Forthers tied in knots. > The JVM isn't that relevant to most programming projects either. It's > heavily used in certain environments but not others. > True. Can't explain it better. Nevertheless "it's the peoples". Although Forth is an excellent tool for excellent programmers for some small applications, it is stupid to use it when you have to rely on "average John Doe service engineers", and require them to learn and understand Forth before they can do their job.
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| From | "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-05 20:52 -1000 |
| Message-ID | <6a6dnddkxrw3G_XOnZ2dnUVZ_h-dnZ2d@supernews.com> |
| In reply to | #30116 |
On 5/5/14 7:16 PM, AKK wrote: > Am 06.05.2014 05:58, schrieb Paul Rubin: ... >> The whole philosophy of Forth revolves around using minimal hardware >> resources, including machinery and culture that gets people to "redefine >> the problem" to suppress unnecessary features. Saying "Forth" and "JVM" >> in the same sentence probably gets quite a few Forthers tied in knots. >> The JVM isn't that relevant to most programming projects either. It's >> heavily used in certain environments but not others. >> > > True. Can't explain it better. > > Nevertheless "it's the peoples". Although Forth is an excellent tool for > excellent programmers for some small applications, it is stupid to use > it when you have to rely on "average John Doe service engineers", and > require them to learn and understand Forth before they can do their job. Yes, I agree, although it has also proven to be an excellent tool for excellent programmers in some large applications. It's a tool for a "Marine Corps" (which, at least in the US, implies a fairly elite, small team of very highly trained and motivated people, who are expected to undertake difficult challenges over a short time frame) as opposed to an Army (large mass of people of all skill levels, many "average Joes" who can take and hold a position). Both kinds of projects exist. Personally, I have always preferred the first kind. Cheers, Elizabeth -- ================================================== Elizabeth D. Rather (US & Canada) 800-55-FORTH FORTH Inc. +1 310.999.6784 5959 West Century Blvd. Suite 700 Los Angeles, CA 90045 http://www.forth.com "Forth-based products and Services for real-time applications since 1973." ==================================================
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| From | Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 01:17 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <10551686-0d95-4cf9-b999-d1169e272753@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30118 |
On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 8:52:25 AM UTC+2, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote: > > Yes, I agree, although it has also proven to be an excellent tool for > excellent programmers in some large applications. > > It's a tool for a "Marine Corps" (which, at least in the US, implies a > fairly elite, small team of very highly trained and motivated people, > who are expected to undertake difficult challenges over a short time > frame) as opposed to an Army (large mass of people of all skill levels, > many "average Joes" who can take and hold a position). Both kinds of > projects exist. Personally, I have always preferred the first kind. Humpf. It's ... too easy to be elitist :) I didn't use my VT100 since many years, but i still use vi because it's incredibly efficient and on every servers. However i'm not using ed. According to what you and AKK said, forth will die with you. Why would i still want to learn forth then ? :) I'm not nostalgic of the "good old time", sorry ^^ -- Ker2x
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| From | "Alex McDonald" <blog@rivadpm.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 11:13 +0100 |
| Message-ID | <lkackg$gt6$1@dont-email.me> |
| In reply to | #30121 |
on 06/05/2014 09:18:00, Laurent Laborde wrote: > On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 8:52:25 AM UTC+2, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote: >> >> Yes, I agree, although it has also proven to be an excellent tool for >> excellent programmers in some large applications. >> >> It's a tool for a "Marine Corps" (which, at least in the US, implies a >> fairly elite, small team of very highly trained and motivated people, >> who are expected to undertake difficult challenges over a short time >> frame) as opposed to an Army (large mass of people of all skill levels, >> many "average Joes" who can take and hold a position). Both kinds of >> projects exist. Personally, I have always preferred the first kind. > > Humpf. It's ... too easy to be elitist :) > I didn't use my VT100 since many years, but i still use vi because > it's incredibly efficient and on every servers. However i'm not using > ed. Oooo, how cool are you! You've used a VT100 and vi! Presumably you got certificates? > > According to what you and AKK said, forth will die with you. > Why would i still want to learn forth then ? :) > I'm not nostalgic of the "good old time", sorry ^^ > Then why are you even mixing it up in this far flung outpost of superannuated dried up prunes? Isn't there a hipster graphics card party at the end of your street? PS Please take Aguilar & Pemberton with you. "Rather Ruined My Life" Aguilar with his deranged ranting and dribbling, and "The Pope of C" Pemberton and his desperate need for someone to kiss his ring every five minutes, and you with your low rise trousers with your teraflops hanging out; you're all disturbing our Forthish catnaps.
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| From | "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 07:12 -0400 |
| Message-ID | <op.xffqqud76zenlw@localhost> |
| In reply to | #30122 |
On Tue, 06 May 2014 06:13:38 -0400, Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> wrote: > PS Please take Aguilar & Pemberton with you. "Rather Ruined My Life" > Aguilar with his deranged ranting and dribbling, and "The Pope of C" > Pemberton and his desperate need for someone to kiss his ring every five > minutes, and you with your low rise trousers with your teraflops hanging > out; you're all disturbing our Forthish catnaps. That from "I'm always wrong but argue to the death anyway and simply won't stop arguing despite the giantic mountain of evidence that I'm always wrong because I want the last word" McDonald duck? Quack, quack, qUUAck, quack, ... Except for the one thread, which you were involved in just as heavily, I've hardly posted anything lately. Of course, you've not been posting anything on-topic or Forth related for quite a few years now. So, take an extra long catnap. Nobody is asking for your help as it is and you haven't been offering it to those who do. So, mobody will even notice you're gone. That's the only reason you've been posting anyway, right? Attention, perhaps loneliness, depression ... You're like clockwork. As soon as it gets quiet in here, except for Hugh, who everyone is hoping he wears himself out eventually, Bam! There's Alex insulting someone. Stirring the pot, like a needy bitch. Rod Pemberton
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| From | Alex McDonald <blog@rivadpm.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 10:57 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <71a26cd2-7d2f-408f-9654-aa22fed0cb34@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30123 |
On Tuesday, 6 May 2014 12:12:20 UTC+1, Rod Pemberton wrote: > On Tue, 06 May 2014 06:13:38 -0400, Alex McDonald <blog@> wrote: > > > > > PS Please take Aguilar & Pemberton with you. "Rather Ruined My Life" > > Aguilar with his deranged ranting and dribbling, and "The Pope of C" > > Pemberton and his desperate need for someone to kiss his ring every five > > minutes, and you with your low rise trousers with your teraflops hanging > > out; you're all disturbing our Forthish catnaps. > > That from "I'm always wrong but argue to the death anyway and simply won't > stop arguing despite the giantic mountain of evidence that I'm always wrong > because I want the last word" McDonald duck? Quack, quack, qUUAck, quack, > ... > > Except for the one thread, which you were involved in just as heavily, > I've hardly posted anything lately. Of course, you've not been posting > anything on-topic or Forth related for quite a few years now. So, take > an extra long catnap. Nobody is asking for your help as it is and you > haven't been offering it to those who do. So, mobody will even notice > you're > gone. That's the only reason you've been posting anyway, right? > Attention, > perhaps loneliness, depression ... You're like clockwork. As soon as > it gets quiet in here, except for Hugh, who everyone is hoping he wears > himself out eventually, Bam! There's Alex insulting someone. Stirring > the pot, like a needy bitch. > > Rod Pemberton I've posted less and less over the years for a number of reasons. Here are a few. 1. The participants. There are a number of very high quality posters here. I've been an admirer of a many here, and was fortunate enough to meet some of them in person at Euroforth 2006. (And goodness, that was 8 years ago.) In the intervening years on clf, many of them have fallen silent. A few died; Wil Baden (aka Neil Bawd) and Julian Noble. I regret their passing even though I didn't know them; they were courteous and knowledgable. I'm a big fan of Elizabeth Rather, Anton Ertl and Stephen Pelc, all of whom were incredibly helpful when I was setting out to learn & discover Forth. Some I haven't yet met; Bernd Paysan, Marcel Hendrix and Andrew Haley to name a few. I've a great deal of time for all of them and more. They are unfailingly polite and interesting, something I aspire to but often fail to achieve. (I think I make up for it in other ways.) 2. The content. Usenet is a funny place. It attracts some seriously deranged individuals. There are a number of posters here that I have little time for, and bottom of my personal pile are the Aguilar's of this world. His presence here will be remembered for his twisted, sadistic and frenzied attacks on Elizabeth Rather. I have no doubt that he is not ill in the clinical sense of the word. He is however an extreme sociopath and narcissist, with a dash of repulsive. Actually, even that doesn't cover it, since he also seems to have it in for those who don't share his dick swinging "ugh ugh where's my club" sexuality. 3. Then there's the people who post here with their "Forth is dead, long live [insert language of choice]" and "Here are five things I found while googling that I'll pretend I [a] experienced directly [b] used in anger [c] got involved in [d] have a clue about [e] ran a project that used them [f] no really, I do have a clue about [g] any other horseshit that I can think of". 4. Lastly there's sad old boring me. Way back when I was rewriting Win32Forth and we went from Zimmer's final 4.2 to 6.x, it was fun and easy because I had huge amounts of bandwidth. I enjoyed the too and fro with the other Win32Forth developers; Jos vd Ven, Dirk Busch, George Hubert. I spent 9 months or so with no full time work. I posted here like crazy, and over at the Win32Forth group too. I wrote serious chunks of code. It was great fun. Latterly, I've been very busy with work and addressing some big issues in my private life. Making time for hobbies has been secondary to that. So I've taken limited pleasure in that period from prodding pond life. But believe it or not, you're right; it's time to stop it and start posting better quality stuff. Thanks for the reminder that there's more to clf than you, Hugh and the odd drive-by wingnut.
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| From | hughaguilar96@yahoo.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 17:06 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <661b91c1-f3e1-44fa-9e69-669675a31672@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30130 |
On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 10:57:37 AM UTC-7, Alex McDonald wrote: > I'm a big fan of Elizabeth Rather, Anton Ertl and Stephen > Pelc... Forth-200x is a cult. It is all about loyalty and sucking up. I gave Pelc a super-easy opportunity to be a winner. All that he had to do was say: yes, he agrees with Elizabeth Rather's critique of the data structures in my novice package. I poured the glass of Kool-Aid for him and handed it to him --- but he passed up the opportunity! Alex McDonald never passes up an opportunity to drink the Kool-Aid. Alex will tell a lie on any day that ends in a 'y'. Consider this thread: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/comp.lang.forth/gUJ_0U2LkLU%5B1-25-false%5D Here is a quote in which every sentence is a lie: On Sunday, February 16, 2014 2:48:34 AM UTC-7, Alex McDonald wrote: > on 16/02/2014 03:34:16, wrote: > You and I have had a long discussion about the poor quality of the > implementation of popular sorts you wrote in your novice package, where > you have serious misunderstandings of how pointers work. You and others > have had discussions about how you didn't invented a tree you called a > "symtab", because it was well understood years before you dropped off the > teat; and how you encouraged novices to use it inappropriately because > its performane sucked. > > I would advise caution before using your code. The problem with Stephen Pelc is that he thinks that he is too good to lie. He is fine with other members of the cult lying, but he doesn't want to do it himself --- he thinks that he is better than them. Because of this, the cult will fail --- he can't expect other members to lie, when he is not willing to lie --- that doesn't inspire much loyalty! Elizabeth Rather lies all of the time. She tells stories about hob-nobbing with Barrack Obama, having 50,000 customers, working for NASA, etc., all of which are untrue. On the Forth-200x mailing list she said that my MFX was a failure and that I got fired from Testra because of this, all of which was untrue (an obvious lie, as nobody at Testra is talking to her, so there is no way for her to know any of this). Anybody who associates with a liar such as Elizabeth Rather, will eventually have to lie --- Pelc can't rely forever on people such as Alex to do the lying while he himself remains mum and aloof --- if he is going to continue to be a member of the cult, he is going to have to eventually drink the Kool-Aid and tell a lie. ANS-Forth was an "epic fail." It is inevitable that ANS-Forth will eventually die out, as there just won't be any new volunteers to join the cult. My goal is to ensure that Forth doesn't die out with ANS-Forth. The only way to do this, is to have a Forth standard that makes a clean break from ANS-Forth. So far, Forth-200x has been dominated by Elizabeth Rather who demands that Forth-200x be fully compatible with ANS-Forth. This ensures that Forth-200x will be another epic fail. Either another standard has to be developed that is not compatible to ANS-Forth, or Forth-200x has to kick out Forth Inc. and abandon ANS-Forth compatibility. One way or the other though, there has to be a new Forth standard that is not ANS-Forth compatible in order for Forth to survive. For a while there will be two Forth standards --- there will be ANS-Forth, the Elizabeth Rather cult --- and there will be the new Forth standard. Eventually ANS-Forth will fizzle out, and the new Forth standard will remain. During the period when both standards coexist, people like Pelc will support both standards, having one compiler for each. People like Alex will only support ANS-Forth, and people like myself will only support the new standard. As I said, the goal is that Forth will survive the inevitable death of ANS-Forth --- it would be a real pity if Forth were to die out just because ANS-Forth was a failure --- Forth is a concept with a lot of good ideas in it. I care about Forth! I don't care about ANS-Forth --- although I wrote my novice package entirely in ANS-Forth, I am willing to drop ANS-Forth
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| From | Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 07:52 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <6e56f0ca-0c12-431b-a71f-14dac1180a55@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30122 |
On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 12:13:38 PM UTC+2, Alex McDonald wrote: > on 06/05/2014 09:18:00, Laurent Laborde wrote: > > > Humpf. It's ... too easy to be elitist :) > > I didn't use my VT100 since many years, but i still use vi because > > it's incredibly efficient and on every servers. However i'm not using > > ed. > > Oooo, how cool are you! You've used a VT100 and vi! Presumably you got > certificates? And your sarcasm is a sign of epic misunderstanding... (or cheap trolling ?) > > According to what you and AKK said, forth will die with you. > > Why would i still want to learn forth then ? :) > > I'm not nostalgic of the "good old time", sorry ^^ > > Then why are you even mixing it up in this far flung outpost of > superannuated dried up prunes? Isn't there a hipster graphics card party > at the end of your street? You misunderstood and now you ask my why i do something i'm not doing :D I don't think there is any pride in using a VT***. -- Ker2x
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| From | Melzzzzz <mel@zzzzz.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 17:11 +0200 |
| Message-ID | <lkau2m$jvb$1@news.albasani.net> |
| In reply to | #30122 |
On 5/6/14, 12:13 PM, Alex McDonald wrote: > on 06/05/2014 09:18:00, Laurent Laborde wrote: >> On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 8:52:25 AM UTC+2, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote: >>> >>> Yes, I agree, although it has also proven to be an excellent tool for >>> excellent programmers in some large applications. >>> >>> It's a tool for a "Marine Corps" (which, at least in the US, implies a >>> fairly elite, small team of very highly trained and motivated people, >>> who are expected to undertake difficult challenges over a short time >>> frame) as opposed to an Army (large mass of people of all skill levels, >>> many "average Joes" who can take and hold a position). Both kinds of >>> projects exist. Personally, I have always preferred the first kind. >> >> Humpf. It's ... too easy to be elitist :) >> I didn't use my VT100 since many years, but i still use vi because >> it's incredibly efficient and on every servers. However i'm not using >> ed. > > Oooo, how cool are you! You've used a VT100 and vi! Presumably you got > certificates? In 90s vt100 compatible terminals were still used on Unix workstations. I hate vi! editor that beeps and corrupts you files. Once I lost one source code file that I typed because damn thing encrypted my file by accident ;)
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| From | Laurent Laborde <kerdezixe@gmail.com> |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-06 08:57 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <6bb321fa-70e1-4ea5-9f44-280979fe83e6@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30125 |
On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 5:11:17 PM UTC+2, Melzzzzz wrote: > On 5/6/14, 12:13 PM, Alex McDonald wrote: > > on 06/05/2014 09:18:00, Laurent Laborde wrote: > >> On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 8:52:25 AM UTC+2, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote: > > > >> Humpf. It's ... too easy to be elitist :) > > >> I didn't use my VT100 since many years, but i still use vi because > >> it's incredibly efficient and on every servers. However i'm not using > >> ed. > > > Oooo, how cool are you! You've used a VT100 and vi! Presumably you got > > certificates? > > In 90s vt100 compatible terminals were still used on Unix workstations. > I hate vi! editor that beeps and corrupts you files. > Once I lost one source code file that I typed because damn thing > encrypted my file by accident ;) That's why i still have one, but i got bored of collecting old computer. I have a nice collection of Sun, Apollo (pre&post HP, with domainOS and HP-UX). And a huuuuuge ControlData Cyber 910 (which is a SGI pre-irix (irix don't run on 68k cpu)) About vi, well, i don't know any sysadmin that doesn't use it :) -- Ker2x
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| From | visualforth@rocketmail.com |
|---|---|
| Date | 2014-05-07 00:38 -0700 |
| Message-ID | <acb07a9f-7df8-4c6d-a7ab-3032d5018779@googlegroups.com> |
| In reply to | #30125 |
On Tuesday, May 6, 2014 11:11:17 AM UTC-4, Melzzzzz wrote: > > In 90s vt100 compatible terminals were still used on Unix workstations. > I hate vi! editor that beeps and corrupts you files. > Once I lost one source code file that I typed because damn thing > encrypted my file by accident ;) It's a pity, really! If your terminal would have been programmed in Forth you may have been able to fix it. The 4E4th-IDE (google for it) has a built in feature that you never ever will loose a file or anything you typed in - decades ago and in the early days of Internet I have lost files, a lot of work - just because a connection was disrupted. That's why this never should happen again.
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