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Editor for Forth

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  Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-10 17:07 -0500
    Re: Editor for Forth Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 15:47 -0700
      Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-10 18:52 -0500
    Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 19:06 -0400
      Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-10 19:05 -0500
        Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 20:42 -0400
          Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-10 19:59 -0500
            Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 21:11 -0400
    Re: Editor for Forth Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-10 17:36 -0700
      Re: Editor for Forth Mark C <mdcorbin@googlemail.com> - 2017-05-14 07:33 -0700
    Re: Editor for Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-10 20:39 -0700
      Re: Editor for Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2017-05-11 07:09 +0200
        Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 00:57 -0500
          Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 09:15 +0300
            Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 01:35 -0500
              Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 09:49 +0300
        Re: Editor for Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-10 23:42 -0700
          Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 01:53 -0500
            Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 09:59 +0300
            Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 04:32 -0400
              Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 05:52 -0500
                Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 14:07 +0300
                  Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 07:10 -0500
                Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 14:10 -0400
      Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 00:15 -0500
        Re: Editor for Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2017-05-11 07:53 +0200
          Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 01:20 -0500
        Re: Editor for Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-10 23:44 -0700
          Re: Editor for Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2017-05-11 08:57 +0200
        Re: Editor for Forth Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-11 04:34 -0500
          Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 06:29 -0500
            Re: Editor for Forth Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-11 07:05 -0500
            Re: Editor for Forth Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 08:05 -0700
              Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-12 19:34 -0500
                Re: Editor for Forth Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 18:21 -0700
                  Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-12 21:53 -0500
                    Re: Editor for Forth Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 23:37 -0700
                      Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-13 02:50 -0500
                        Re: Editor for Forth Joel Rees <joel.rees@gmail.com> - 2017-05-15 00:11 -0700
          Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 14:41 -0400
            Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 15:44 -0500
              Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 10:52 +0300
            Re: Editor for Forth Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-12 02:28 -0500
              Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 12:43 -0400
                Re: Editor for Forth Julian Fondren <julian.fondren@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 10:17 -0700
                  Re: Editor for Forth Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-05-13 04:39 -0500
      Re: Editor for Forth Jan Coombs <jenfhaomndgfwutc@murmic.plus.com> - 2017-05-11 08:33 +0100
    Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 07:09 +0300
      Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-11 00:22 -0500
        Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 08:35 +0300
        Re: Editor for Forth JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2017-05-11 00:46 -0700
          Re: Editor for Forth JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2017-05-11 00:50 -0700
    Re: Editor for Forth humptydumpty <ouatubi@gmail.com> - 2017-05-11 00:32 -0700
    Re: Editor for Forth stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2017-05-11 08:03 +0000
    Re: Editor for Forth Mark C <mdcorbin@googlemail.com> - 2017-05-12 04:50 -0700
      Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 12:54 -0400
        Re: Editor for Forth Mark C <mdcorbin@googlemail.com> - 2017-05-14 07:09 -0700
          Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-14 13:48 -0400
            Re: Editor for Forth Mark C <mdcorbin@googlemail.com> - 2017-05-14 11:10 -0700
          Re: Editor for Forth peter.m.falth@gmail.com - 2017-05-14 14:28 -0700
            Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-14 23:02 -0400
              Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-15 00:03 -0500
              Re: Editor for Forth peter.m.falth@gmail.com - 2017-05-15 13:33 -0700
    Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-12 19:35 -0500
      Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 21:16 -0400
      Re: Editor for Forth Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2017-05-12 22:53 -0700
        Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-13 02:51 -0400
          Re: Editor for Forth Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2017-05-13 00:02 -0700
            Re: Editor for Forth albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-05-13 13:36 +0200
        Re: Editor for Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2017-05-13 09:09 +0200
        Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-13 02:41 -0500
          Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-13 10:31 -0400
    Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-20 16:43 -0500
      Re: Editor for Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-20 15:32 -0700
        Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 18:57 -0400
          Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-20 18:16 -0500
            Re: Editor for Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-05-20 16:40 -0700
              Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-20 22:04 -0400
                Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 07:04 +0300
          Re: Editor for Forth anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-21 06:53 +0000
            Re: Editor for Forth Ron Aaron <rambamist@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 10:24 +0300
              Re: Editor for Forth anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-05-21 14:54 +0000
            Re: Editor for Forth albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-05-21 20:11 +0200
              Re: Editor for Forth rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2017-05-21 14:23 -0400
            Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-21 13:23 -0500
        Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-20 18:15 -0500
        Re: Editor for Forth Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> - 2017-05-20 18:33 -0500

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#59072

On 5/11/2017 3:32 AM, rickman wrote:
> On 5/11/2017 2:53 AM, Cecil Bayona wrote:
>> On 5/11/2017 1:42 AM, Paul Rubin wrote:
>>> Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> writes:
>>>>> It doesn't print listings with line numbers
>>>> What's the use case?
>>>
>>> Cecil said he wanted that feature.  I can't remember the last time I
>>> personally printed a listing.
>>>
>> I print a copy every once in a while and put it in a project binder,
>> line numbers makes it easier to find particular code I'm looking for,
>> its not a deal breaker not having it but it makes life easier.
> 
> What's a binder?  ;)
> 
Its called documentation something that a lot of programmers are 
allergic to.

-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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#59073

On 11/05/2017 13:52, Cecil Bayona wrote:
> On 5/11/2017 3:32 AM, rickman wrote:

>> What's a binder?  ;)
>>
> Its called documentation something that a lot of programmers are
> allergic to.

To be honest, I far prefer documentation built-in (as in 8th's "help"
and "apropros" words) or in a PDF or other electronic format I can
search easily.

I used to have bookshelves full of printed documentation.  Left 'em all
behind, and don't regret it.

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#59079

On 5/11/2017 6:07 AM, Ron Aaron wrote:
> 
> 
> On 11/05/2017 13:52, Cecil Bayona wrote:
>> On 5/11/2017 3:32 AM, rickman wrote:
> 
>>> What's a binder?  ;)
>>>
>> Its called documentation something that a lot of programmers are
>> allergic to.
> 
> To be honest, I far prefer documentation built-in (as in 8th's "help"
> and "apropros" words) or in a PDF or other electronic format I can
> search easily.
> 
> I used to have bookshelves full of printed documentation.  Left 'em all
> behind, and don't regret it.
> 
I like sitting without my PC looking at the code and writing in future 
changes and notes, I've also had some projects from long ago where I 
lost all the code on the PCs over time but I still have the binder with 
printouts, reasoning behind what I did and a 3.5" floppy with the 
software. I don't even have a PC with a 3.5" floppy but I could set one 
up in 10 minutes.

I even have several PCs that have M0 DVD drives that can burn 1000 year 
archives but I don't use them, the media was too expensive.

I guess eventually I need to be all digital but I been burned in the 
past from just simple things like forgetting about the last backup of a 
project being on a HD that was formatted so it was all gone except for 
the binders to save the day.
-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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#59091

On 5/11/2017 6:52 AM, Cecil Bayona wrote:
> On 5/11/2017 3:32 AM, rickman wrote:
>> On 5/11/2017 2:53 AM, Cecil Bayona wrote:
>>> On 5/11/2017 1:42 AM, Paul Rubin wrote:
>>>> Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> writes:
>>>>>> It doesn't print listings with line numbers
>>>>> What's the use case?
>>>>
>>>> Cecil said he wanted that feature.  I can't remember the last time I
>>>> personally printed a listing.
>>>>
>>> I print a copy every once in a while and put it in a project binder,
>>> line numbers makes it easier to find particular code I'm looking for,
>>> its not a deal breaker not having it but it makes life easier.
>>
>> What's a binder?  ;)
>>
> Its called documentation something that a lot of programmers are
> allergic to.

I produce documentation all the time.  But what do I need to bind it to?

-- 

Rick C

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#59030

On 5/10/2017 10:39 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> writes:
>> Which programmers editor would be recommended for use with Forth?
> 
> Forth-mode in Emacs works fine for me.  Actually I think there are a few
> different ones to choose from, but I just use the default one.  I use it
> with gforth, no idea about VFX or Swift.  It does most of the stuff you
> mention.  It has syntax highlighting and color, but not autocomplete
> unless you count the regular Emacs autocomplete Meta-/ etc.  I prefer
> that to annoying popups that appear without my asking for them.  It
> doesn't print listings with line numbers but "pr" (Linux formatted
> printing utility) can do that.  All of this is free.  If you're using
> the usual Microsoft OS, try a reverse defenestration (throwing Windows
> out of your computer) before proceeding.
> 

But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select the 
functions like Vin? One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language 
that I'm not familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard 
use.

I been using Visual Studio Code Editor for Go and Python and it's OK but 
a file describing the language specifics is not available for Forth but 
one could create one. It's available for Windows, Linux, and MacOs, 
worse case that will be the choice and its a graphical editor so not as 
many keys to have to memorize.

-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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#59034

Cecil Bayona wrote:
> But isn't [Emacs] a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
> the functions like [Vim]?

Yes!  What's not to like?

I hear Emacs has a GUI too.  I never use it.

> One programs it in Lisp

I dare say most Emacs users never touch Lisp.

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#59038

On 5/11/2017 12:53 AM, Lars Brinkhoff wrote:
> Cecil Bayona wrote:
>> But isn't [Emacs] a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
>> the functions like [Vim]?
> 
> Yes!  What's not to like?
> 
> I hear Emacs has a GUI too.  I never use it.
> 

I guess graphical display but using multi-key commands like Vin, just 
more stuff to memorize and right now I'm adding several languages to my head

A couple of years ago I took some networking classes that included 
programming and Linux usage, the teacher recommended the use of Vim I 
tried it for a while and it was OK but then I switched to using the Kate 
Editor and was a very happy camper as I was so used to Window editors 
that I and the rest of the class struggled with Vim until I switched to 
Kate. So I will need to investigate Kate in more depth.

I would assume as a given that if I end up throwing Windows out the 
window I will need to learn Emacs, and Vim basics.

Sometimes I feel like my head is going to explode, I was forced to 
retire due to health issues but lately I'm far more busy than when I 
used to work.

>> One programs it in Lisp
> 
> I dare say most Emacs users never touch Lisp.
> 


-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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#59042

Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> writes:
> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not familiar
> with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.

You'd use Lisp for writing Emacs extensions, but you don't need it for
ordinary editing.

I just noticed http://emacs.sexy which actually looks like a good site.

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#59046

Paul Rubin wrote:
> I just noticed http://emacs.sexy which actually looks like a good site.

Quick!  Make Forth sexy too!

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#59067

Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
> 
> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
> the functions like Vin?

Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
These days I think they're enabled by default.

> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.

You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.

Andrew.

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#59075

On 5/11/2017 4:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
>>
>> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
>> the functions like Vin?
> 
> Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
> point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
> These days I think they're enabled by default.
> 
>> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
>> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.
> 
> You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.
> 
> Andrew.
> 

True but is there decent Forth support available? If not I would have to 
add it hence Lisp becomes an issue.

For Linux and MacOs then there is quite a selection but they tend to be 
poor on the Windows side due to basically being Linux software with a 
dummy shell to pretend that Linux is present. Emacs, Vin, Kate, and 
SciTE those four being the top contenders so far plus their variants. So 
I will make sure they are installed on a machine with Linux and try them 
out over the next few days.

-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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#59077

Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
> On 5/11/2017 4:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
>> Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
>>> the functions like Vin?
>> 
>> Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
>> point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
>> These days I think they're enabled by default.
>> 
>>> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
>>> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.
>> 
>> You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.
> 
> True but is there decent Forth support available?

Yes, of course.  It's part of the GForth distribution.

> For Linux and MacOs then there is quite a selection but they tend to
> be poor on the Windows side due to basically being Linux software
> with a dummy shell to pretend that Linux is present. Emacs, Vin,
> Kate, and SciTE those four being the top contenders so far plus
> their variants. So I will make sure they are installed on a machine
> with Linux and try them out over the next few days.

You don't need Linux/UNIX to use Emacs, but it's a little better-
integrated with the operating system if you do.

Andrew.

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#59122

On Thursday, May 11, 2017 at 8:29:19 PM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
> On 5/11/2017 4:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> > Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
> >> the functions like Vin?
> > 
> > Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
> > point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
> > These days I think they're enabled by default.
> > 
> >> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
> >> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.
> > 
> > You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.
> > 
> > Andrew.
> > 
> 
> True but is there decent Forth support available? If not I would have to 
> add it hence Lisp becomes an issue.
> 
> For Linux and MacOs then there is quite a selection but they tend to be 
> poor on the Windows side due to basically being Linux software with a 
> dummy shell to pretend that Linux is present. Emacs, Vin, Kate, and 
> SciTE those four being the top contenders so far plus their variants. So 
> I will make sure they are installed on a machine with Linux and try them 
> out over the next few days.

Have you tried gedit? 

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#59137

On 5/12/2017 10:05 AM, Joel Rees wrote:
> On Thursday, May 11, 2017 at 8:29:19 PM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
>> On 5/11/2017 4:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
>>> Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
>>>> the functions like Vin?
>>>
>>> Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
>>> point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
>>> These days I think they're enabled by default.
>>>
>>>> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
>>>> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.
>>>
>>> You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.
>>>
>>> Andrew.
>>>
>>
>> True but is there decent Forth support available? If not I would have to
>> add it hence Lisp becomes an issue.
>>
>> For Linux and MacOs then there is quite a selection but they tend to be
>> poor on the Windows side due to basically being Linux software with a
>> dummy shell to pretend that Linux is present. Emacs, Vin, Kate, and
>> SciTE those four being the top contenders so far plus their variants. So
>> I will make sure they are installed on a machine with Linux and try them
>> out over the next few days.
> 
> Have you tried gedit?
> 
Nope, I took a quick look at their site and I don't think it meets some 
of my must have requirements. But I will look into it over the next few 
days.

-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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#59142

On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 9:34:49 AM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
> On 5/12/2017 10:05 AM, Joel Rees wrote:
> > On Thursday, May 11, 2017 at 8:29:19 PM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
> >> On 5/11/2017 4:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> >>> Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
> >>>> the functions like Vin?
> >>>
> >>> Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
> >>> point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
> >>> These days I think they're enabled by default.
> >>>
> >>>> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
> >>>> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.
> >>>
> >>> You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.
> >>>
> >>> Andrew.
> >>>
> >>
> >> True but is there decent Forth support available? If not I would have to
> >> add it hence Lisp becomes an issue.
> >>
> >> For Linux and MacOs then there is quite a selection but they tend to be
> >> poor on the Windows side due to basically being Linux software with a
> >> dummy shell to pretend that Linux is present. Emacs, Vin, Kate, and
> >> SciTE those four being the top contenders so far plus their variants. So
> >> I will make sure they are installed on a machine with Linux and try them
> >> out over the next few days.
> > 
> > Have you tried gedit?
> > 
> Nope, I took a quick look at their site and I don't think it meets some 
> of my must have requirements. But I will look into it over the next few 
> days.

I personally prefer gedit to Kate, but that doesn't say one thing or 
another. 

I don't think it will be a great loss to install it, enable the 
extensions, and try it out.

--
Joel Rees

Randomly ranting:
http://reiisi.blogspot.com

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#59144

On 5/12/2017 8:21 PM, Joel Rees wrote:
> On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 9:34:49 AM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
>> On 5/12/2017 10:05 AM, Joel Rees wrote:
>>> On Thursday, May 11, 2017 at 8:29:19 PM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
>>>> On 5/11/2017 4:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
>>>>> Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
>>>>>> the functions like Vin?
>>>>>
>>>>> Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
>>>>> point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
>>>>> These days I think they're enabled by default.
>>>>>
>>>>>> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
>>>>>> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.
>>>>>
>>>>> You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.
>>>>>
>>>>> Andrew.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> True but is there decent Forth support available? If not I would have to
>>>> add it hence Lisp becomes an issue.
>>>>
>>>> For Linux and MacOs then there is quite a selection but they tend to be
>>>> poor on the Windows side due to basically being Linux software with a
>>>> dummy shell to pretend that Linux is present. Emacs, Vin, Kate, and
>>>> SciTE those four being the top contenders so far plus their variants. So
>>>> I will make sure they are installed on a machine with Linux and try them
>>>> out over the next few days.
>>>
>>> Have you tried gedit?
>>>
>> Nope, I took a quick look at their site and I don't think it meets some
>> of my must have requirements. But I will look into it over the next few
>> days.
> 
> I personally prefer gedit to Kate, but that doesn't say one thing or
> another.
> 
> I don't think it will be a great loss to install it, enable the
> extensions, and try it out.
> 
> --
> Joel Rees
> 
> Randomly ranting:
> http://reiisi.blogspot.com
> 
I installed QEdit in Windows for a quick check and it doesn't have menu 
or any way that is obvious to activate a particular language, more 
reading will be needed.

Did you look at my list of must haves?

-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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#59151

On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 11:53:14 AM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
> On 5/12/2017 8:21 PM, Joel Rees wrote:
> > On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 9:34:49 AM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
> >> On 5/12/2017 10:05 AM, Joel Rees wrote:
> >>> On Thursday, May 11, 2017 at 8:29:19 PM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
> >>>> On 5/11/2017 4:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> >>>>> Cecil Bayona <> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
> >>>>>> the functions like Vin?
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
> >>>>> point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
> >>>>> These days I think they're enabled by default.
> >>>>>
> >>>>>> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
> >>>>>> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Andrew.
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> True but is there decent Forth support available? If not I would have to
> >>>> add it hence Lisp becomes an issue.
> >>>>
> >>>> For Linux and MacOs then there is quite a selection but they tend to be
> >>>> poor on the Windows side due to basically being Linux software with a
> >>>> dummy shell to pretend that Linux is present. Emacs, Vin, Kate, and
> >>>> SciTE those four being the top contenders so far plus their variants. So
> >>>> I will make sure they are installed on a machine with Linux and try them
> >>>> out over the next few days.
> >>>
> >>> Have you tried gedit?
> >>>
> >> Nope, I took a quick look at their site and I don't think it meets some
> >> of my must have requirements. But I will look into it over the next few
> >> days.
> > 
> > I personally prefer gedit to Kate, but that doesn't say one thing or
> > another.
> > 
> > I don't think it will be a great loss to install it, enable the
> > extensions, and try it out.
> > 
> > --
> > Joel Rees
> > 
> I installed QEdit in Windows for a quick check and it doesn't have menu 
> or any way that is obvious to activate a particular language, more 
> reading will be needed.

QEdit? That's a blast from the past. Several different editors, even. 8-*

Gedit. 

From the gnome project:

https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Gedit

Make sure you scroll down in that page or you'll miss all the 
information you're looking for.

* Edit menu => settings, plugins tab

Pick the plugins you want to enable.

* Tools menu => manage external tools.

That makes the plug-ins it's shipped with available. 

Auto-completion and some of the other stuff you want is 3rd party, and 
I don't remember where they document how to get and load those, but 
it's there on the site somewhere.

https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Gedit/Plugins
https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Gedit/PluginsLists
https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Gedit/ThirdPartyPlugins_v3.14

> Did you look at my list of must haves?

:-/

--
Joel Rees

Trying to reinvent the industry all by myself:
http://defining-computers.blogspot.jp/

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#59159

On 5/13/2017 1:37 AM, Joel Rees wrote:
> On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 11:53:14 AM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
>> On 5/12/2017 8:21 PM, Joel Rees wrote:
>>> On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 9:34:49 AM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
>>>> On 5/12/2017 10:05 AM, Joel Rees wrote:
>>>>> On Thursday, May 11, 2017 at 8:29:19 PM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
>>>>>> On 5/11/2017 4:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
>>>>>>> Cecil Bayona <> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
>>>>>>>> the functions like Vin?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
>>>>>>> point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
>>>>>>> These days I think they're enabled by default.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> One programs it in Lisp, an interesting language that I'm not
>>>>>>>> familiar with so a big learning curve there beside keyboard use.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You don't have program Emacs to use it.  Most users probably don't.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Andrew.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> True but is there decent Forth support available? If not I would have to
>>>>>> add it hence Lisp becomes an issue.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For Linux and MacOs then there is quite a selection but they tend to be
>>>>>> poor on the Windows side due to basically being Linux software with a
>>>>>> dummy shell to pretend that Linux is present. Emacs, Vin, Kate, and
>>>>>> SciTE those four being the top contenders so far plus their variants. So
>>>>>> I will make sure they are installed on a machine with Linux and try them
>>>>>> out over the next few days.
>>>>>
>>>>> Have you tried gedit?
>>>>>
>>>> Nope, I took a quick look at their site and I don't think it meets some
>>>> of my must have requirements. But I will look into it over the next few
>>>> days.
>>>
>>> I personally prefer gedit to Kate, but that doesn't say one thing or
>>> another.
>>>
>>> I don't think it will be a great loss to install it, enable the
>>> extensions, and try it out.
>>>
>>> --
>>> Joel Rees
>>>
>> I installed QEdit in Windows for a quick check and it doesn't have menu
>> or any way that is obvious to activate a particular language, more
>> reading will be needed.
> 
> QEdit? That's a blast from the past. Several different editors, even. 8-*
> 
> Gedit.
> 
>  From the gnome project:
> 
> https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Gedit
> 
> Make sure you scroll down in that page or you'll miss all the
> information you're looking for.
> 
> * Edit menu => settings, plugins tab
> 
> Pick the plugins you want to enable.
> 
> * Tools menu => manage external tools.
> 
> That makes the plug-ins it's shipped with available.
> 
> Auto-completion and some of the other stuff you want is 3rd party, and
> I don't remember where they document how to get and load those, but
> it's there on the site somewhere.
> 
> https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Gedit/Plugins
> https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Gedit/PluginsLists
> https://wiki.gnome.org/Apps/Gedit/ThirdPartyPlugins_v3.14
> 
>> Did you look at my list of must haves?
> 
> :-/
> 
> --
> Joel Rees
> 
> Trying to reinvent the industry all by myself:
> http://defining-computers.blogspot.jp/
> 
QEdit? sorry I meant GEdit, I used QEdit for a long time, an easy to use 
editor small and fast for DOS.

I installed the Windows version of GEdit and no Tools Menu but I found 
an entry for plugins, I'll try the Linux version tomorrow.

-- 
Cecil - k5nwa

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#59266

On Saturday, May 13, 2017 at 4:50:22 PM UTC+9, Cecil - k5nwa wrote:
> On 5/13/2017 1:37 AM, Joel Rees wrote:
> [...]
> QEdit? sorry I meant GEdit, I used QEdit for a long time, an easy to use 
> editor small and fast for DOS.

Yeah. Blast from the past.

> I installed the Windows version of GEdit and no Tools Menu but I found 
> an entry for plugins, I'll try the Linux version tomorrow.

My memory is that you have to enable them in the preferences menu first.

They are there.

--
Joel Rees

random ranting:
http://reiisi.blogspot.com

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#59092

On 5/11/2017 5:34 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> Cecil Bayona <cbayona@cbayona.com> wrote:
>>
>> But isn't eMacs a keyboard based editor with multi-keys to select
>> the functions like Vin?
>
> Surely all editors are keyboard based?  I don't really understand the
> point you're making.  If you want menus in Emacs you can turn them on.
> These days I think they're enabled by default.

Do you really not understand what he means?  Old school editors do 
everything through many and varied multi-finger key presses.  In the 
case of emacs the modifier names are system independent so they aren't 
convenient for anyone.  Hard to visualize and hard to learn.

The only menu used often in GUI apps is the right click menu instantly 
available and flexible with context.  Until you have used multi-finger 
keystrokes some thousands of times and they become ingrained toolbars 
are much more convenient.  So it's all about the learning curve.

-- 

Rick C

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