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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #34159 > unrolled thread

Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi

Started byrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
First post2014-10-26 12:02 -0400
Last post2014-10-28 14:06 -0500
Articles 20 on this page of 130 — 29 participants

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  Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 12:02 -0400
    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-26 16:11 +0000
      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 12:20 -0400
        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 12:44 -0400
          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-26 17:09 +0000
            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 14:45 -0400
              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk (Andrew Gabriel) - 2014-10-26 18:57 +0000
                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 15:14 -0400
                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-26 19:47 +0000
                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 16:10 -0400
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-27 08:43 +0000
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 17:31 -0400
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-28 14:18 +0000
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 17:15 -0400
                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-26 13:24 -0700
                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 16:48 -0400
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Raymond Wiker <rwiker@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 22:12 +0100
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 17:20 -0400
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-26 14:39 -0700
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 17:46 -0400
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-26 15:11 -0700
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 18:25 -0400
                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-26 15:58 -0700
                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-27 09:20 +0000
                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi josv@planet.nl - 2014-10-29 07:02 -0700
                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2014-10-30 11:20 +0100
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-27 08:56 +0000
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-27 10:14 +0000
                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-27 08:48 +0000
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 17:35 -0400
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-28 14:24 +0000
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Alan Adams <alan@adamshome.org.uk> - 2014-10-28 15:52 +0000
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 12:49 -0400
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Ray <ray@invalid.com> - 2014-10-28 17:22 +0000
                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 17:02 -0400
                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2014-10-27 10:07 +0100
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-27 09:22 +0000
                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-10-27 11:30 +0000
                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 17:37 -0400
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-10-28 12:41 +0000
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 12:51 -0400
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-10-28 18:44 +0000
                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-10-27 11:49 +0000
                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 17:51 -0400
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-10-27 20:31 -1000
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 03:01 -0400
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-10-27 21:14 -1000
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 03:45 -0400
                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-10-27 22:14 -1000
                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 14:09 -0400
                                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Mel Wilson <mwilson@the-wire.com> - 2014-10-28 21:50 +0000
                                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi "Ivan D. Reid" <Ivan.Reid@ivan.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-10-29 00:01 +0000
                                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 20:50 -0400
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi "Ivan D. Reid" <Ivan.Reid@ivan.fsnet.co.uk> - 2014-10-29 01:20 +0000
                                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-10-29 00:58 +0000
                                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-28 18:04 -0700
                                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-29 01:40 -0400
                                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-10-29 12:41 +0000
                                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Theo Markettos <theom+news@chiark.greenend.org.uk> - 2014-11-16 15:34 +0000
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi "Rod Pemberton" <buzzoff@nonamewhichexists.cmm> - 2014-11-16 12:01 -0500
                                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi The Natural Philosopher <tnp@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-16 17:22 +0000
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> - 2014-11-16 17:06 +0000
                                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-11-16 18:27 +0000
                                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-11-16 19:19 +0000
                                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-11-16 20:11 +0000
                                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-11-17 11:56 +0000
                                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-11-17 13:42 +0000
                                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-11-17 10:14 -0800
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-11-16 17:25 +0000
                                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Rob Morley <nospam@ntlworld.com> - 2014-11-16 17:40 +0000
                                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-11-16 19:12 +0000
                                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Alan Adams <alan@adamshome.org.uk> - 2014-11-16 19:50 +0000
                                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-11-16 21:22 +0000
                                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-11-16 17:38 -0500
                                                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-11-17 00:12 +0000
                                                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Michael J. Mahon <mjmahon@aol.com> - 2014-11-16 19:53 -0600
                                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2014-11-17 01:00 +0100
                                                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Alan Adams <alan@adamshome.org.uk> - 2014-11-17 12:03 +0000
                                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2014-11-18 20:03 +0000
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi druck <news@druck.org.uk> - 2014-11-16 18:20 +0000
                                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-29 11:53 +0000
                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi humptydumpty <ouatubi@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 06:52 -0700
              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-26 12:02 -0700
                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 15:18 -0400
              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-26 20:24 +0000
                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 17:09 -0400
                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-26 22:05 +0000
                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 20:27 -0400
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-26 17:45 -0700
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 21:09 -0400
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-26 18:22 -0700
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 23:20 -0400
                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-26 20:53 -0700
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk (Andrew Gabriel) - 2014-10-27 10:23 +0000
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-27 13:36 -0700
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk (Andrew Gabriel) - 2014-10-27 22:23 +0000
                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-27 09:43 +0000
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-27 10:26 +0000
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-10-27 13:15 +0000
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-27 14:12 +0000
                              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-10-27 15:34 +0000
                                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 18:31 -0400
                                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-27 15:50 -0700
                                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 19:26 -0400
                                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-27 16:37 -0700
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 20:17 -0400
                                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-10-27 17:24 -0700
                                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 03:10 -0400
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-28 08:11 +0000
                                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Dennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com> - 2014-10-28 09:13 -0400
                                    Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-28 08:11 +0000
                                      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 04:14 -0400
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Gordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net> - 2014-10-28 08:15 +0000
                                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi "A. Dumas" <alexandre@dumas.fr.invalid> - 2014-10-28 10:22 +0100
                                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 15:53 -0400
                                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 17:10 -0400
                        Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 18:23 -0400
                          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> - 2014-11-15 23:09 +0100
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Martin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid> - 2014-11-16 00:35 +0000
                            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-16 00:06 -0500
          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-10-26 19:36 +0000
            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-26 16:24 -0400
          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Hannu Vuolasaho <vuokkosetae@gmail.com> - 2014-10-27 23:48 +0200
          Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi josv@planet.nl - 2014-10-28 05:27 -0700
            Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 16:02 -0400
              Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2014-10-28 22:57 +0100
                Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 19:54 -0400
                  Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-10-28 20:01 -0400
      Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi "A. Dumas" <alexandre@dumas.fr.invalid> - 2014-10-27 04:10 +0100
    QUESTIONS and ANSWERS pass in the dark  ;< - was [ Re: Installing gForth on the Raspberry Pi ] Richard Owlett <rowlett@cloud85.net> - 2014-10-28 14:06 -0500

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#34219

FromMartin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid>
Date2014-10-27 15:34 +0000
Message-ID<m2lomm$okc$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34218
On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 14:12:25 +0000, Gordon Henderson wrote:

> Not sure why you're telling me this - I've been programming in C on Unix
> and like systems for nearly 35 years now and am quite happy stuck in my
> ways.
>
Apologies, Gordon - I obviously misplaced my post within the thread. It 
was, of course, intended for Rickman, who seemed doubtful about writing 
Linux programs and/or C. Hopefully it will also be useful for anybody 
else in his position.

I would have found Kernighan&Pike very useful when I was in starting to 
write significant programs (or even simpler ones that weren't throwaways!
) but at that point even K&R hadn't been written, let alone UNIX. As it 
happens I'd already evolved a fairly similar style to that described in 
K&P, but even so I found it a useful read simply because it is extremely 
readable and offers a good description of how to write well-structured 
programs. 


-- 
martin@   | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org       |

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#34230

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-10-27 18:31 -0400
Message-ID<m2mh5b$34i$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34219
On 10/27/2014 11:34 AM, Martin Gregorie wrote:
> On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 14:12:25 +0000, Gordon Henderson wrote:
>
>> Not sure why you're telling me this - I've been programming in C on Unix
>> and like systems for nearly 35 years now and am quite happy stuck in my
>> ways.
>>
> Apologies, Gordon - I obviously misplaced my post within the thread. It
> was, of course, intended for Rickman, who seemed doubtful about writing
> Linux programs and/or C. Hopefully it will also be useful for anybody
> else in his position.

I'm not sure why you think I am "doubtful" about writing in C.  I am.. 
er, was... fairly experienced in C, but I have not used it in a decade 
or more and don't intend to use it if I don't have to... and I *don't* 
have to.  Don't get me wrong.  There is not much bad about C.  I just 
like the interactivity of Forth.  I find it much easier to get stuff 
working in Forth than to use a debugger in C.


> I would have found Kernighan&Pike very useful when I was in starting to
> write significant programs (or even simpler ones that weren't throwaways!
> ) but at that point even K&R hadn't been written, let alone UNIX. As it
> happens I'd already evolved a fairly similar style to that described in
> K&P, but even so I found it a useful read simply because it is extremely
> readable and offers a good description of how to write well-structured
> programs.

My copy of K&R is sitting in my bookcase along with a couple of other C 
books and a small collection of VHDL books.  My two Forth books are 
laying on my desk next to my work area...

-- 

Rick

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#34231

FromPaul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Date2014-10-27 15:50 -0700
Message-ID<7xa94hyvo8.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>
In reply to#34230
rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
> I just like the interactivity of Forth.  I find it much easier to get
> stuff working in Forth than to use a debugger in C.

Since you're talking about raspberry pi's, this seems like a good chance
to try Python.

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#34232

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-10-27 19:26 -0400
Message-ID<m2mkbh$d18$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34231
On 10/27/2014 6:50 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
>> I just like the interactivity of Forth.  I find it much easier to get
>> stuff working in Forth than to use a debugger in C.
>
> Since you're talking about raspberry pi's, this seems like a good chance
> to try Python.

Yes, that thought occurred to me last night, but I already have code in 
Forth for my app.  I will try Python another time.

Btw, is that why it is the Raspberry 'Pi' as in 'Py'thon?

-- 

Rick

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#34233

FromPaul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Date2014-10-27 16:37 -0700
Message-ID<7xd29dythe.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>
In reply to#34232
rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
> Btw, is that why it is the Raspberry 'Pi' as in 'Py'thon?

I kinda doubt it ;-).

You should also look at the Beaglebone Black by the way.

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#34234

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-10-27 20:17 -0400
Message-ID<m2mnbf$ll9$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34233
On 10/27/2014 7:37 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
>> Btw, is that why it is the Raspberry 'Pi' as in 'Py'thon?
>
> I kinda doubt it ;-).
>
> You should also look at the Beaglebone Black by the way.

Why?

-- 

Rick

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#34235

FromPaul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Date2014-10-27 17:24 -0700
Message-ID<7xfve9t50u.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>
In reply to#34234
rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
>> You should also look at the Beaglebone Black by the way.
> Why?

Well it's a comparable board in the same space, but more technically
oriented, has some different capabilities, worth looking into if you're
into these things.  You might like its realtime coprocessors, for
example.

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#34238

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-10-28 03:10 -0400
Message-ID<m2nfi2$b61$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34235
On 10/27/2014 8:24 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
>>> You should also look at the Beaglebone Black by the way.
>> Why?
>
> Well it's a comparable board in the same space, but more technically
> oriented, has some different capabilities, worth looking into if you're
> into these things.  You might like its realtime coprocessors, for
> example.

I'm only looking at the rPi because I was given one.  Since it has most 
of the capabilities of a PC I figure it would be nicer to use in the lab 
than a PC, mostly because it is so much smaller.  I also have been 
considering rolling an add on board for the rPi but so far have not 
figured out what it would be.  So this is a learning experience.

The BBB is interesting, but support is through a Google group and the 
market is *soooo* much smaller.  The rPi really rolled over top of it 
and all the other SBC Linux units out there.  They've sold 3.8 million 
so far.  For 99% of the things I would do with a Linux SBC there is no 
difference so I will use the one with better support.

-- 

Rick

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#34242

FromGordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net>
Date2014-10-28 08:11 +0000
Message-ID<m2nj3r$kav$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34233
In article <7xd29dythe.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>,
Paul Rubin  <no.email@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
>> Btw, is that why it is the Raspberry 'Pi' as in 'Py'thon?
>
>I kinda doubt it ;-).

It really is. The foundation love Python.

Gordon

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#34249

FromDennis Lee Bieber <wlfraed@ix.netcom.com>
Date2014-10-28 09:13 -0400
Message-ID<kg5v4ahcbhfl3dn0l2dua2m1fh0uq2bl0i@4ax.com>
In reply to#34232
On Mon, 27 Oct 2014 19:26:19 -0400, rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> declaimed
the following:


>
>Yes, that thought occurred to me last night, but I already have code in 
>Forth for my app.  I will try Python another time.
>
>Btw, is that why it is the Raspberry 'Pi' as in 'Py'thon?

	From what I've read, YES... The intent was a small Linux teaching
computer with Python as the primary programming language. True, being
Linux, pretty much anything is available.

	The BeagleBone Black is similar, but the primary programming language
was Javascript using a Javascript interpreter accessed via a web browser.
-- 
	Wulfraed                 Dennis Lee Bieber         AF6VN
    wlfraed@ix.netcom.com    HTTP://wlfraed.home.netcom.com/

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#34241

FromGordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net>
Date2014-10-28 08:11 +0000
Message-ID<m2nj2s$kav$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34231
In article <7xa94hyvo8.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>,
Paul Rubin  <no.email@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
>> I just like the interactivity of Forth.  I find it much easier to get
>> stuff working in Forth than to use a debugger in C.
>
>Since you're talking about raspberry pi's, this seems like a good chance
>to try Python.

Or..

Since you're talking about a Linux computer, this seems like a good
chance to try one of the 1000's of other languages avalable for it.

The Pi Foundation like Python and yes, the "Pi" in the name does refer to
Python, but it's just another Linux system at the end of the day. Python
is just one more language you can use with Linux. There are at least
three different Forths avalable for it. And Cobol, Ada, brainfuck and
who knows what else.. (even BASIC)

I'd suggest not picking a language because it's popular, but picking
one you know how to use - and it seems Forth in this case is just what
the OP wants.

Gordon

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#34244

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-10-28 04:14 -0400
Message-ID<m2nj9o$l56$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34241
On 10/28/2014 4:11 AM, Gordon Henderson wrote:
> In article <7xa94hyvo8.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>,
> Paul Rubin  <no.email@nospam.invalid> wrote:
>> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
>>> I just like the interactivity of Forth.  I find it much easier to get
>>> stuff working in Forth than to use a debugger in C.
>>
>> Since you're talking about raspberry pi's, this seems like a good chance
>> to try Python.
>
> Or..
>
> Since you're talking about a Linux computer, this seems like a good
> chance to try one of the 1000's of other languages avalable for it.
>
> The Pi Foundation like Python and yes, the "Pi" in the name does refer to
> Python, but it's just another Linux system at the end of the day. Python
> is just one more language you can use with Linux. There are at least
> three different Forths avalable for it. And Cobol, Ada, brainfuck and
> who knows what else.. (even BASIC)

What are the other two Forths?  Not that I would likely use one, but I'm 
curious.  gForth runs on the PC as well and I am expecting to have one 
program that I can run on both platforms.


> I'd suggest not picking a language because it's popular, but picking
> one you know how to use - and it seems Forth in this case is just what
> the OP wants.

Yeah.  I like your approach.  :)

-- 

Rick

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#34245

FromGordon Henderson <gordon+usenet@drogon.net>
Date2014-10-28 08:15 +0000
Message-ID<m2njbs$kav$3@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34244
In article <m2nj9o$l56$2@dont-email.me>, rickman  <gnuarm@gmail.com> wrote:

>What are the other two Forths?  Not that I would likely use one, but I'm 
>curious.  gForth runs on the PC as well and I am expecting to have one 
>program that I can run on both platforms.

yforth and the stand-alone one mentioned by someone else earlier. I'm sure
there are others too.

Gordon

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#34246

From"A. Dumas" <alexandre@dumas.fr.invalid>
Date2014-10-28 10:22 +0100
Message-ID<544f605e$0$2905$e4fe514c@news2.news.xs4all.nl>
In reply to#34244
On 28/10/2014 09:14, rickman wrote:
> On 10/28/2014 4:11 AM, Gordon Henderson wrote:
>> There are at least
>> three different Forths avalable for it.
>
> What are the other two Forths?  Not that I would likely use one, but I'm
> curious.

To see what is available in the standard software repositories: 
"apt-cache search forth | grep -i forth" (include grep to weed out 
things which are merely related).

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#34259

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-10-28 15:53 -0400
Message-ID<m2os98$j0b$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34246
On 10/28/2014 5:22 AM, A. Dumas wrote:
> On 28/10/2014 09:14, rickman wrote:
>> On 10/28/2014 4:11 AM, Gordon Henderson wrote:
>>> There are at least
>>> three different Forths avalable for it.
>>
>> What are the other two Forths?  Not that I would likely use one, but I'm
>> curious.
>
> To see what is available in the standard software repositories:
> "apt-cache search forth | grep -i forth" (include grep to weed out
> things which are merely related).

Clearly I need to learn more about using Linux.  That is no small part 
of the reason why I am using the rPi.  But it seems every time I try 
something new I feel like I hit a brick wall.  I just installed Xemacs 
on the pi and when I run it I feel like I need to go back to basics.  It 
is so different from any other editor I've ever seen that I am totally 
stumped on getting started with it.  Fortunately it has a lot of 
materials.   :)

I will try your command, thanks.  Another learning experience.

-- 

Rick

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#34262

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-10-28 17:10 -0400
Message-ID<m2p0oo$5gr$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34246
On 10/28/2014 5:22 AM, A. Dumas wrote:
> On 28/10/2014 09:14, rickman wrote:
>> On 10/28/2014 4:11 AM, Gordon Henderson wrote:
>>> There are at least
>>> three different Forths avalable for it.
>>
>> What are the other two Forths?  Not that I would likely use one, but I'm
>> curious.
>
> To see what is available in the standard software repositories:
> "apt-cache search forth | grep -i forth" (include grep to weed out
> things which are merely related).

This command only turned up gForth and yForth.  I'm happy with gForth so 
far.

I brought my laptop to the workbench where the Pi is and it is pretty 
clear that I need to do the remote login thing.  Trying to use two 
keyboards and two mice will likely drive me insane... or more insane. 
It will also get around the lack of a pipe character with my Dell keyboard.

-- 

Rick

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#34229

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-10-27 18:23 -0400
Message-ID<m2mgmc$1ho$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34209
On 10/27/2014 5:43 AM, Albert van der Horst wrote:
> In article <m2k3hn$5lv$1@dont-email.me>, rickman  <gnuarm@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> The windows I/O is just read-file, but it returns a length which can be
>> zero.  Comkey? asks for 1 byte so the char is saved and the routine
>> returns if it was found or not.  When Comkey is called it calls Comkey?
>> to make sure a char is in the buffer than returns the char from the
>> buffer.  Sounds like I can do the same thing.  I just need to find the
>> file I/O calls.  But the serial port needs to be set up.  One reference
>> said to do that outside of the app.
>
> (I've some recent experience, trying to write a terminal server
> for single board computers like the MPS430).

What is a terminal *server*?


> You didn't notice but returning with a count of zero is not smart
> but stupid.
> Suppose you have a 300 baud line and a 4 Ghz machine. Then you're effectively
> polling and hanging up the machine. It is stupid not to wait at least
> the time that is needed for a single character to arrive, 30 mS.
> So we have to play with time outs of the order of one character
> timing, which is milliseconds. Writing a serial line is full of those
> real time issues.
> Windows nt followed to an extent the VMS philosophy which is
> 1. set out a read, return immediately
> 2. If the read finishes *as configured* (this means x characters,
> or a time out, or a ^D, or a ^J or and ASCII null, or a combination
> of those) it sets and event flag.
> 3. You can have your program wait, on any combination of event flags,
> so you can keep track of several simultaneous read and write operations.
>
> This is generally considered superior to the Unix approach with the
> select mechanism, but ...
> (In the 80's I heard, Unix is good for development, VMS is good for
> real time. )
> MSDOS documentation, implementation and integration with the rest
> of the OS is lacking in many respects. (Did I say MSDOS, I mean MS windows.)
>
> There are no hard specifications, now how is one supposed to write a
> driver for USB serial with those specs?
>
> This also answers the question, why threads in Linux?
> You really need them for time outs alone.

I can't say I follow your reasoning.  I don't see how bit rate has 
anything to do with the issue.  If a read is requested and there is no 
data in the read buffer, the routine returns indicating it read no data. 
  If there is data in the buffer it returns the data and the lesser 
count of data in the buffer and the amount requested.  Actually, this is 
the same as the no data case where it returns the data in the buffer 
which is none and returns the size which is zero.  In all cases it 
returns immediately.  If the program wishes to wait for data it just 
sits in a loop checking for new data and hopefully wasting time by 
calling a wait routine rather than tying up CPU with a spin loop.

Where exactly is the problem?

-- 

Rick

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#34426

FromNomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com>
Date2014-11-15 23:09 +0100
Message-ID<3feb5e79507dcd7c6224d1a1f7f2fc33@dizum.com>
In reply to#34229
rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> wrote:

> On 10/27/2014 5:43 AM, Albert van der Horst wrote:
> >
> > (I've some recent experience, trying to write a terminal server
> > for single board computers like the MPS430).
> 
> What is a terminal *server*?

A networked server with access to multiple serial consoles. Either to 
provide network access to machine consoles or to give client terminals a 
logon screen and some basic commands to connect to other computers over the 
network.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terminal_server

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#34428

FromMartin Gregorie <martin@address-in-sig.invalid>
Date2014-11-16 00:35 +0000
Message-ID<m48rfv$33p$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34426
On Sat, 15 Nov 2014 23:09:31 +0100, Nomen Nescio wrote:

> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> wrote:
> 
>> On 10/27/2014 5:43 AM, Albert van der Horst wrote:
>> >
>> > (I've some recent experience, trying to write a terminal server for
>> > single board computers like the MPS430).
>> 
>> What is a terminal *server*?
> 
> A networked server with access to multiple serial consoles. Either to
> provide network access to machine consoles or to give client terminals a
> logon screen and some basic commands to connect to other computers over
> the network.
> 
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terminal_server

There are easier, and possibly cheaper ways of doing that with COTS kit, 
such as fitting a Lantronix Xport or a DS203 to each of the devices you 
want to connect to your LAN :  

http://gridconnect.com/network-components/xport.html

http://microcontrollershop.com/product_info.php?
cPath=98_284&products_id=1459

Cheaper, because there's no programming and no messing round with 
handling multiple RS232 ports on a common server shared between several 
devices wanting network access: connect one end of the module to the UART 
in the thing you want to talk to, plug your LAN into its RJ45 socket and 
configure it. I said LAN because I wouldn't connect anything like this 
without making sure there is a firewall between it and the Internet: 
AFAICT, while most of these devices support telnet connections, none 
support SSH or any other encrypted protocol.


-- 
martin@   | Martin Gregorie
gregorie. | Essex, UK
org       |

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#34430

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-11-16 00:06 -0500
Message-ID<m49bct$be6$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#34426
On 11/15/2014 5:09 PM, Nomen Nescio wrote:
> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> On 10/27/2014 5:43 AM, Albert van der Horst wrote:
>>>
>>> (I've some recent experience, trying to write a terminal server
>>> for single board computers like the MPS430).
>>
>> What is a terminal *server*?
>
> A networked server with access to multiple serial consoles. Either to
> provide network access to machine consoles or to give client terminals a
> logon screen and some basic commands to connect to other computers over the
> network.
>
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terminal_server

Oh, I've worked on similar equipment.  Juniper networks calls it Circuit 
to Packet (CTP) and has a line of products that do that.  In fact, I 
build a daughter card that replaces their serial port interface with a 
dual audio and digital interface with the smarts to do special 
interfaces like IRIG-B and time stamped digital data.  They have never 
called it a "terminal server" though.

I had the impression that Albert was talking about software to run *on* 
the MSP430, but maybe not.

-- 

Rick

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