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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #30977 > unrolled thread

MSP430-Stamp

Started byrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
First post2014-05-29 21:35 -0400
Last post2014-07-17 16:09 -0400
Articles 20 on this page of 190 — 24 participants

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  MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-29 21:35 -0400
    Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-29 19:09 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-29 19:13 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-29 23:00 -0400
          Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-29 20:25 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-29 20:23 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-29 22:15 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp HaveANiceDay <HaveANiceDay@NoSpam.invalid> - 2014-05-30 15:13 +0200
            Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-30 13:51 -0400
              Re: MSP430-Stamp HaveANiceDay <HaveANiceDay@NoSpam.invalid> - 2014-05-30 21:08 +0200
            Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-30 12:22 -0700
              Re: MSP430-Stamp HaveANiceDay <HaveANiceDay@NoSpam.invalid> - 2014-05-30 21:41 +0200
                Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-30 13:28 -0700
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-30 17:55 -0400
              Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-30 16:29 -0400
                Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-30 14:18 -0700
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-30 18:07 -0400
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-30 17:24 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-02 11:10 +0200
          Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-02 10:57 +0000
            Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-02 13:34 +0200
      Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-29 20:10 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-29 20:29 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-29 21:02 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp "Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm> - 2014-05-30 04:05 -0400
      Re: MSP430-Stamp HaveANiceDay <HaveANiceDay@NoSpam.invalid> - 2014-05-30 15:13 +0200
    Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-29 19:57 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-29 23:32 -0400
        Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-29 21:07 -0700
    Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-05-30 02:39 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-07-17 12:40 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 16:08 -0400
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-07-18 00:06 +0200
          Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-07-18 08:22 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-07-18 23:42 +0200
              Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 18:28 -0400
                Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-07-19 01:41 +0200
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-07-18 19:48 -0400
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-07-18 16:59 -0700
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-07-19 14:30 +0200
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp Gary Bergstrom <forthprgrmr@gmail.com> - 2014-07-19 08:23 -0700
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-07-21 10:42 +0200
    Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-05-30 03:03 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 07:47 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-31 11:36 -0400
          Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-31 09:34 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 10:09 -0700
              Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-31 10:52 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 01:28 -0400
              Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 22:41 -0700
                Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 02:00 -0400
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 23:07 -0700
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 03:13 -0400
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-01 07:15 -0700
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 12:33 -0400
                          Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-01 09:45 -0700
                            Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 13:10 -0400
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp HaveANiceDay <HaveANiceDay@NoSpam.invalid> - 2014-06-01 18:38 +0200
                          Re: MSP430-Stamp babruehl@gmail.com - 2014-06-01 11:40 -0700
              Re: MSP430-Stamp HaveANiceDay <HaveANiceDay@NoSpam.invalid> - 2014-06-01 11:13 +0200
                Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-01 09:50 +0000
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp HaveANiceDay <HaveANiceDay@NoSpam.invalid> - 2014-06-01 12:47 +0200
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-01 04:05 -0700
                Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 12:39 -0400
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-01 10:00 -0700
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp babruehl@gmail.com - 2014-06-01 11:45 -0700
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 14:57 -0400
              Re: MSP430-Stamp "VisualForth.com" <babruehl@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 12:01 -0700
                Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-01 15:12 -0400
    Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-05-30 03:12 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-30 14:02 -0400
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-05-31 03:33 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 07:19 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-05-31 12:01 -0400
          Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 09:15 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 13:51 -0700
              Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-05-31 14:20 -0700
                Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 14:51 -0700
                Re: MSP430-Stamp "VisualForth.com" <babruehl@gmail.com> - 2014-05-31 16:22 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-06-01 01:33 +0200
              Re: MSP430-Stamp "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-05-31 17:31 -1000
                Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 21:48 -0700
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-05-31 19:12 -1000
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 22:25 -0700
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-06-01 09:45 +0000
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-01 04:16 -0700
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-06-01 08:51 -1000
              Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-05-31 21:03 -0700
                Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-06-01 21:17 +0200
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-04 22:46 -0700
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-05 13:27 +0000
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-05 08:39 -0700
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-05 16:10 +0000
                          Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-05 11:10 -0700
                            Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-05 19:52 +0000
                            Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-06-05 23:25 +0200
                              Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-05 15:02 -0700
                              Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-06 10:56 +0000
                            Correct Software and Specifications (was Re: MSP430-Stamp) Paul E Bennett <Paul_E.Bennett@topmail.co.uk> - 2014-06-09 09:59 +0100
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp mhx@iae.nl - 2014-06-05 14:30 -0700
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-06 10:59 +0000
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-06-05 15:57 +0200
                      Formal specifications etc. (was: MSP430-Stamp) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-06-05 15:34 +0000
                        Re: Formal specifications etc. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-05 11:48 -0700
                          Re: Formal specifications etc. anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2014-06-05 19:46 +0000
                        Re: Formal specifications etc. (was: MSP430-Stamp) Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-06-05 23:02 +0200
                          Re: Formal specifications etc. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-05 14:15 -0700
                            Re: Formal specifications etc. rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-05 17:33 -0400
                              Re: Formal specifications etc. Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-05 15:32 -0700
                            Re: Formal specifications etc. Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2014-06-06 04:00 -0500
                          Re: Formal specifications etc. (was: MSP430-Stamp) albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-06 11:05 +0000
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-05 11:01 -0700
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2014-06-06 01:09 +0200
                          Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-05 22:01 -0400
          Re: MSP430-Stamp stephenXXX@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2014-05-31 16:47 +0000
      Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-05-30 12:11 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-06 12:54 +0200
    Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-02 11:39 +0200
      Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-02 12:15 -0400
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-03 10:26 +0200
          Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-03 12:18 -0400
      Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-02 10:04 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-03 11:51 +0200
          Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-03 13:33 -0400
            Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-06 13:02 +0200
              Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-06 17:31 -0400
                Re: MSP430-Stamp "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-06-06 16:30 -1000
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-06 22:52 -0400
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-07 11:58 +0000
                Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-07 11:40 -0700
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-07 20:01 -0400
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-08 16:05 -0700
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-08 22:28 -0400
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp Gary Bergstrom <forthprgrmr@gmail.com> - 2014-06-08 20:36 -0700
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-08 21:38 -0700
                          Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 14:36 -0400
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 02:45 -0700
                          Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 03:18 -0700
                          Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 15:57 -0400
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-08 16:20 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-03 20:42 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-03 21:05 -0700
              Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-04 10:43 +0000
          Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-03 21:28 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp "VisualForth.com" <babruehl@gmail.com> - 2014-06-03 22:43 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-03 23:31 -0700
              Re: MSP430-Stamp "VisualForth.com" <babruehl@gmail.com> - 2014-06-04 04:13 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-03 01:41 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2014-06-03 01:51 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-03 16:19 +0100
            Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-03 09:14 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-03 13:19 -0400
              Re: MSP430-Stamp "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-06-03 07:43 -1000
                Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-03 20:56 -0700
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2014-06-04 10:51 +0000
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp VisualForth <babruehl@gmail.com> - 2014-06-04 04:06 -0700
    Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-06 21:26 -0400
      Re: MSP430-Stamp "VisualForth.com" <babruehl@gmail.com> - 2014-06-06 20:40 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-07 03:18 -0700
    Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-07 04:35 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-07 12:01 -0700
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 03:47 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp Mikael Nordman <oh2aun@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 09:28 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-11 07:35 -0700
              Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-11 10:43 -0700
                Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-11 15:52 -0700
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp Coos Haak <chforth@hccnet.nl> - 2014-06-12 02:06 +0200
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2014-06-11 15:13 -1000
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-12 02:16 -0700
              Re: MSP430-Stamp Mikael Nordman <oh2aun@gmail.com> - 2014-06-11 12:56 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 16:46 -0400
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 03:49 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-09 09:47 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp Rikard Lang <rikard.lang@gmail.com> - 2014-06-09 23:16 +0200
        Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-10 07:48 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-11 07:23 -0700
            Re: MSP430-Stamp David Schultz <abuse@127.0.0.1> - 2014-06-11 18:00 -0500
              Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-12 02:14 -0400
                Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-12 02:13 -0700
                  Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-12 13:04 -0400
                    Re: MSP430-Stamp David Schultz <abuse@127.0.0.1> - 2014-06-12 18:06 -0500
                      Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-12 19:29 -0400
                        Re: MSP430-Stamp David Schultz <abuse@127.0.0.1> - 2014-06-13 18:48 -0500
        Re: MSP430-Stamp Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-06-11 07:26 -0700
          Re: MSP430-Stamp visualforth@rocketmail.com - 2014-06-11 10:45 -0700
    Re: MSP430-Stamp JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2014-06-13 00:03 -0700
      Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-18 11:11 +0200
        Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-06-18 05:27 -0400
          Re: MSP430-Stamp Matthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de> - 2014-06-18 12:29 +0200
            Re: MSP430-Stamp rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-07-17 16:09 -0400

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#31149

FromMatthias Koch <matthias.koch@hot.uni-hannover.de>
Date2014-06-02 13:34 +0200
Message-ID<lmhnjn$lnt$1@newsserver.rrzn.uni-hannover.de>
In reply to#31148
>> https://github.com/simpleavr/boot430
> 
> Can you elaborate what this accomplishes in a practical sense?
> 
> Suppose I've a binary file with a Forth. Can this boot43 get the
> Forth into  Launchpad over the supplied cable? Or is some extra
> soldering required? The Launchpad has built-in 3.3 v supply.
> Why does the boot43 show a schematic of a 3.3v supply?
> If bit-banging is programmed on the MSP430, surely there must
> be already a Forth there, so it can't be used to get the Forth
> in there.

Dear Albert,

Boot430 is a USB bootloader binary by Chris Chung that is flashed in a traditional way before and then allows to flash a binary image in the space left over direct bit-banged USB connection. No Launchpad involved. USB gives 3.3V signals, but 5V raw power, so a voltage regulator is needed. Look at it in action, that will give you an idea:

http://programmablehardware.blogspot.de/2013/11/homebrew-msp430-development-board.html

Note that this involves no terminal, as the USB specifications don't allow CDC-ACM class over low-speed links.

Matthias

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#30985

Fromvisualforth@rocketmail.com
Date2014-05-29 20:10 -0700
Message-ID<fb2606e7-4446-4b4f-b67d-5f608175c07c@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#30979
On Thursday, May 29, 2014 10:09:58 PM UTC-4, Paul Rubin wrote:
 
> I agree I'm not sure of the point of this compared to the Launchpad
> board, if a PCB is involved.

The difference is that this MSP430 stamp has much less parts than TI's LaunchPad, it shows that it is possible to start with a minimum of parts.

> I still like the idea of a solderless kit.  Just a few chips, wires, and
> other parts in a bag, with instructions about where to plug everything
> ("connect 3 inch yellow wire from slot 23A to slot 17B") into a
> solderless breadboard (sold separately).  That immediately makes the
> hardware more hackable: just rewire stuff as you feel like it.  No
> add-on boards, just plug more stuff into the same breadboard.  The
> breadboards run $5-10 depending on size but you can use them for all
> sorts of things.

That sounds now like a really good idea. May be this is a starting point. 
It only needs an article with pictures, including a source where to buy a MSP430 for 4 EURO/4$ or how to get Forth loaded into the MSP430.
Even if a blinking LED isn't so exiting anymore, this could be the first programming example - or a "breathing LED", one of Michael's demos.

> This also makes it possible to use the 40 pin processor with 32k of
> program memory, if they put the DIP version in production.  With luck
> they'll also do that for the closely related part with 56k of flash and
> 4k of ram, which should be able to run a pretty nice system.  

That could be a 'follow up' then.

> I don't know if that's enough to run a traditional standalone Forth 
> with a block editor though.

To get a block editor running, a Forth extension can be used on a FLASH or EEPROM memory. I have done this some years ago, compiling into an EEPROM and directly running Forth words from there. Only Forth can do this!

> At the other end of the size scale from the 40dip is this:
> http://www.wired.com/2013/02/freescales-tiny-arm-chip/

TI makes such a chip, too, IIRC.

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#30990

FromPaul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Date2014-05-29 20:29 -0700
Message-ID<7x1tvcrlk5.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>
In reply to#30985
visualforth@rocketmail.com writes:
>> I still like the idea of a solderless kit. ...
> That sounds now like a really good idea. May be this is a starting
> point.  It only needs an article with pictures, including a source
> where to buy a MSP430 for 4 EURO/4$ or how to get Forth loaded into
> the MSP430.  

Well with the MSP430G2553, a Launchpad could program the part, but it
would be nice to have a source of preprogrmamed parts.

> To get a block editor running, a Forth extension can be used on a
> FLASH or EEPROM memory.

Yes, the idea is to use the on-chip flash.  If the TI Value Line chips
don't have enough flash or ram (I think you want 2k of ram for block
buffers at minimum) then there are larger 430's and of course ARM parts
that can do this.


>> http://www.wired.com/2013/02/freescales-tiny-arm-chip/
> TI makes such a chip, too, IIRC.

I don't think they have anything that tiny.  Kinetis even has a KL03
that's slightly smaller.  But, I think making PCB's with such small
traces needs special equipment not found at normal PCB shops.

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#30996

Fromvisualforth@rocketmail.com
Date2014-05-29 21:02 -0700
Message-ID<de84d142-4ee3-4640-bb25-d52ee3d517d0@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#30990
On Thursday, May 29, 2014 11:29:30 PM UTC-4, Paul Rubin wrote:
> visualforth.com writes:
> >> I still like the idea of a solderless kit. ...
> > That sounds now like a really good idea. May be this is a starting
> > point.  It only needs an article with pictures, including a source
> > where to buy a MSP430 for 4 EURO/4$ or how to get Forth loaded into
> > the MSP430.  
> 
> Well with the MSP430G2553, a Launchpad could program the part, but it
> would be nice to have a source of preprogrammed parts.

Of course it would be!

> > To get a block editor running, a Forth extension can be used on a
> > FLASH or EEPROM memory.

> Yes, the idea is to use the on-chip flash.  

No, it is not. An external 8 pin 8MB SPI Flash is just 0.50$.

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#31009

From"Rod Pemberton" <dont_use_email@xnothavet.cqm>
Date2014-05-30 04:05 -0400
Message-ID<op.xgnx3gpm6zenlw@localhost>
In reply to#30979
On Thu, 29 May 2014 22:09:58 -0400, Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>  
wrote:
> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:

>> I honestly can't think how any board, even as a kit, could be sold for
>> $4. But I just want to hear the basis for the feature set of the
>> board.
>
> MSP430G2553 PDIP = $1.00 (1k qty per ti.com)
> FTDI cable = $1.00?
> PCB = 50 cents, it's small 2-sided through-hole board with big traces,
>   i.e. cheap
> 2 leds @ $.10 each
> A few other parts, hmm not sure.  $0.50?
>

In bulk, they're probably much cheaper than that.  E.g., the cheapest
bulk LED Mouser offers is $0.028 USD ($0.0206 EUR) in lots of 5000.
So what?  You've got enough for a long, long time...

When I worked for a small electronics manufacturing firm in the mid 90's,
the PCB was usually one of the more expensive components of any product,
unless it was single- or double-sided board.  Those were really cheap,
usually using some type of fiberboard instead of phenolic or fiberglass.
When I say fiberboard, I mean "fiberboard".  It was just like fiberboard,
 from the hardware store, maybe a bit like particle board, except very
thin and very fine pressed wood/paper particles.  These boards would
even get soggy and bend like paper or wood when fluxed by the wave
soldering machine.  The traces would come off too, if you overheated
them with a soldering iron.  I'd swear they were pressed on.  Hey, I
said cheap ...

> I still like the idea of a solderless kit.

Why?  I haven't worked in electronics in a decade, but it's still very
easy to solder up a bunch of components, if you can solder.  Of course,
Youtube videos can help novices with that.  The only thing they need
to do is take a break after soldering a few pins, when soldering in
chips with lots of pins, so they don't overheat the chip, or give them
a socket.


Rod Pemberton

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#31027

FromHaveANiceDay <HaveANiceDay@NoSpam.invalid>
Date2014-05-30 15:13 +0200
Message-ID<lma065$5c7$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#30979
Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
> > I honestly can't think how any board, even as a kit, could be sold for
> > $4. But I just want to hear the basis for the feature set of the
> > board.
> 
> MSP430G2553 PDIP = $1.00 (1k qty per ti.com)
> FTDI cable = $1.00?
> PCB = 50 cents, it's small 2-sided through-hole board with big traces,
>   i.e. cheap
> 2 leds @ $.10 each
> A few other parts, hmm not sure.  $0.50?
> 
> Especially if you read $4 as 4 euros (original meaning of 4e4th) there
> is easily enough margin to make this doable, at least on a non-profit
> basis.
> 
> I agree I'm not sure of the point of this compared to the Launchpad
> board, if a PCB is involved.
> 
> I still like the idea of a solderless kit.  Just a few chips, wires, and
> other parts in a bag, with instructions about where to plug everything
> ("connect 3 inch yellow wire from slot 23A to slot 17B") into a
> solderless breadboard (sold separately).  That immediately makes the
> hardware more hackable: just rewire stuff as you feel like it.  No
> add-on boards, just plug more stuff into the same breadboard.  The
> breadboards run $5-10 depending on size but you can use them for all
> sorts of things.
> 
> This also makes it possible to use the 40 pin processor with 32k of
> program memory, if they put the DIP version in production.  With luck
> they'll also do that for the closely related part with 56k of flash and
> 4k of ram, which should be able to run a pretty nice system.  I don't
> know if that's enough to run a traditional standalone Forth with a block
> editor though.

Hey, my fig-forth on the 6502-Atari800 run on less than 32kB (think about 24, but don't remember exactly) with a nice full-screen(!!) Blockeditor, assembler and disk-and-cassette-interface included..., and later, in the '80ties, then static CMOS-RAM became available, it even used the RAM "under" the Monitor-and-Basic-Rom as "disk"....(I simply soldered it together with a tiny backup-battery+diode on top of the ROM and used a spare gate and another diode for /CE)

56kB should leave at least 30kB for programming, especially because the native msp430-code is quite compact and as "disk" you can use a serial eeprom. (But, for standalone-use, how would you provide a suitable display? And if attached to a PC what do you want a on-the-target-block-editor for?)

Have a nice day!

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#30983

Fromvisualforth@rocketmail.com
Date2014-05-29 19:57 -0700
Message-ID<68b954bc-80e7-4030-9941-239f38526b3d@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#30977
On Thursday, May 29, 2014 9:35:13 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:

> Perhaps Dirk can explain a bit what the purpose of this board is and why 
> each of the features is important, especially the $4 price tag.  I 
> honestly can't think how any board, even as a kit, could be sold for $4. 
>   But I just want to hear the basis for the feature set of the board.

Juergen had the idea, and it took a while until I got familiar with it.
Thing is, that you only need the MSP430, a capacitor, a resistor, and a power supply to have a working system, if the MSP430 is loaded with Forth.

The features are to show what can be done with this minimum of parts.

I think the 4 is obvious, stands for 4th - 4 EURO originally, that's where 4 EURO 4th came from, mutating to 4E4th where E stands for education.

The pricing of 4$ or 4 EURO is a marketing gag, of course, the next board could be 16$. It's not a must, not a condition.

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#30991

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-05-29 23:32 -0400
Message-ID<lm8u4e$pcb$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#30983
On 5/29/2014 10:57 PM, visualforth@rocketmail.com wrote:
> On Thursday, May 29, 2014 9:35:13 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
>
>> Perhaps Dirk can explain a bit what the purpose of this board is and why
>> each of the features is important, especially the $4 price tag.  I
>> honestly can't think how any board, even as a kit, could be sold for $4.
>>    But I just want to hear the basis for the feature set of the board.
>
> Juergen had the idea, and it took a while until I got familiar with it.
> Thing is, that you only need the MSP430, a capacitor, a resistor, and a power supply to have a working system, if the MSP430 is loaded with Forth.
>
> The features are to show what can be done with this minimum of parts.

Ok, that is a bit more clear.  How does the MCU get loaded with Forth? 
That can be done by TI or a distributor for a price.  I think I was once 
quoted $0.50 per piece for programming of an FPGA at time of sale.  To 
do it ourselves would be a very time consuming if any quantity of these 
were sold, plus before selling the first one a fixture would need to be 
made.  To program a DIP is not such a big deal, but getting it in and 
out of a socket is a bit of work.


> I think the 4 is obvious, stands for 4th - 4 EURO originally, that's where 4 EURO 4th came from, mutating to 4E4th where E stands for education.
>
> The pricing of 4$ or 4 EURO is a marketing gag, of course, the next board could be 16$. It's not a must, not a condition.

Oh, of course... duh!  That is a very interesting idea.  Very much like 
the MSP430 board TI sold for $4.30 ($9.99 now).  Why not just have a 
forth for those and let TI make the hardware?  How does designing an 
even more basic board improve on that?  Is it just a matter of hitting 
that price point?

-- 

Rick

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#30997

Fromvisualforth@rocketmail.com
Date2014-05-29 21:07 -0700
Message-ID<690f8a88-3940-421e-b04f-5e797c1e490c@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#30991
On Thursday, May 29, 2014 11:32:24 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
> How does the MCU get loaded with Forth? 
> That can be done by TI or a distributor for a price.  I think I was once 
> quoted $0.50 per piece for programming of an FPGA at time of sale.  To 
> do it ourselves would be a very time consuming if any quantity of these 
> were sold, plus before selling the first one a fixture would need to be 
> made.  To program a DIP is not such a big deal, but getting it in and 
> out of a socket is a bit of work.

I use ZIP-Sockets, but I prefer this idea. Let's TI or a distributor do it.

> Why not just have a 
> forth for those and let TI make the hardware?  

Great idea!
Does anybody have connections to TI or a distributor?

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#31016

FromMark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com>
Date2014-05-30 02:39 -0700
Message-ID<224e97cf-5b73-43cf-aeb4-31231c778a18@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#30977
It can't. It was a loss-leader to promote the chip.

MSP430 for $4.30. Geddit?

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#32451

Fromvisualforth@rocketmail.com
Date2014-07-17 12:40 -0700
Message-ID<4947fd72-9334-46cd-91cd-6c21f5e7fa67@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#31016
On Friday, May 30, 2014 5:39:54 AM UTC-4, Mark Wills wrote:
> It can't. It was a loss-leader to promote the chip.
> 
> 
> 
> MSP430 for $4.30. Geddit?

Mikael Gorbachev once said "Who is coming too late, will be punished by life..."

Now the stamp is out there - noForth, noMSP, but 33 Euros: The Arduino Nano.

http://store.arduino.cc/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=77

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#32455

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-07-17 16:08 -0400
Message-ID<lq9ag0$g9b$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#32451
On 7/17/2014 3:40 PM, visualforth@rocketmail.com wrote:
> On Friday, May 30, 2014 5:39:54 AM UTC-4, Mark Wills wrote:
>> It can't. It was a loss-leader to promote the chip.
>>
>>
>>
>> MSP430 for $4.30. Geddit?
>
> Mikael Gorbachev once said "Who is coming too late, will be punished by life..."
>
> Now the stamp is out there - noForth, noMSP, but 33 Euros: The Arduino Nano.
>
> http://store.arduino.cc/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=77

I don't get it.  Why should we be interested in this board?  Isn't it 
just another minimal MCU board.

-- 

Rick

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#32460

FromBernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de>
Date2014-07-18 00:06 +0200
Message-ID<lq9hdf$d8q$1@online.de>
In reply to#32451
visualforth@rocketmail.com wrote:

> On Friday, May 30, 2014 5:39:54 AM UTC-4, Mark Wills wrote:
>> It can't. It was a loss-leader to promote the chip.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> MSP430 for $4.30. Geddit?
> 
> Mikael Gorbachev once said "Who is coming too late, will be punished by
> life..."
> 
> Now the stamp is out there - noForth, noMSP, but 33 Euros: The Arduino
> Nano.
> 
> 
http://store.arduino.cc/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=77

Way cheaper ($4) and quite likely soon with Forth:

http://www.cypress.com/?rID=92146

-- 
Bernd Paysan
"If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
http://bernd-paysan.de/

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#32472

Fromvisualforth@rocketmail.com
Date2014-07-18 08:22 -0700
Message-ID<57617f8f-aedd-479d-bb70-10652bb1d0ad@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#32460
On Thursday, July 17, 2014 6:06:39 PM UTC-4, Bernd Paysan wrote:
> visualforth.com wrote:
> 
> 
> 
> > On Friday, May 30, 2014 5:39:54 AM UTC-4, Mark Wills wrote:
> 
> >> It can't. It was a loss-leader to promote the chip.
> 
> >> 
> 
> >> 
> 
> >> 
> 
> >> MSP430 for $4.30. Geddit?
> 
> > 
> 
> > Mikael Gorbachev once said "Who is coming too late, will be punished by
> 
> > life..."
> 
> > 
> 
> > Now the stamp is out there - noForth, noMSP, but 33 Euros: The Arduino
> 
> > Nano.
> 
> > 
> 
> > 
> 
> http://store.arduino.cc/index.php?main_page=product_info&cPath=11&products_id=77
> 
> 
> 
> Way cheaper ($4) and quite likely soon with Forth:
> 
> 
> 
> http://www.cypress.com/?rID=92146
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> 
> Bernd Paysan
> 
> "If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
> 
> http://bernd-paysan.de/

Thanks for your reminder, Bernd! 4$ just fits for 4th!
Are you working on a Forth for this PSoC?

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#32475

FromBernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de>
Date2014-07-18 23:42 +0200
Message-ID<lqc4cu$kk9$1@online.de>
In reply to#32472
visualforth@rocketmail.com wrote:
> Thanks for your reminder, Bernd! 4$ just fits for 4th!
> Are you working on a Forth for this PSoC?

I've just started discussing that with Matthias Koch, since mecrisp-
Stellaris shouldn't be too difficult to get to run on this PSoC.

-- 
Bernd Paysan
"If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
http://bernd-paysan.de/

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#32476

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-07-18 18:28 -0400
Message-ID<lqc72o$kic$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#32475
On 7/18/2014 5:42 PM, Bernd Paysan wrote:
> visualforth@rocketmail.com wrote:
>> Thanks for your reminder, Bernd! 4$ just fits for 4th!
>> Are you working on a Forth for this PSoC?
>
> I've just started discussing that with Matthias Koch, since mecrisp-
> Stellaris shouldn't be too difficult to get to run on this PSoC.

I just received my PSoC boards and will be looking into this.  If you 
are going to work on it either we should work together or maybe just one 
of us do it.  No point in duplicating the effort.

-- 

Rick

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#32481

FromBernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de>
Date2014-07-19 01:41 +0200
Message-ID<lqcbbi$iou$2@online.de>
In reply to#32476
rickman wrote:

> On 7/18/2014 5:42 PM, Bernd Paysan wrote:
>> visualforth@rocketmail.com wrote:
>>> Thanks for your reminder, Bernd! 4$ just fits for 4th!
>>> Are you working on a Forth for this PSoC?
>>
>> I've just started discussing that with Matthias Koch, since mecrisp-
>> Stellaris shouldn't be too difficult to get to run on this PSoC.
> 
> I just received my PSoC boards and will be looking into this.  If you
> are going to work on it either we should work together or maybe just one
> of us do it.  No point in duplicating the effort.

You have a head start, since you have already boards.  That means: go ahead!  
If you get stuck, I'll help you.

-- 
Bernd Paysan
"If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
http://bernd-paysan.de/

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#32482

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2014-07-18 19:48 -0400
Message-ID<lqcbns$e8c$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#32481
On 7/18/2014 7:41 PM, Bernd Paysan wrote:
> rickman wrote:
>
>> On 7/18/2014 5:42 PM, Bernd Paysan wrote:
>>> visualforth@rocketmail.com wrote:
>>>> Thanks for your reminder, Bernd! 4$ just fits for 4th!
>>>> Are you working on a Forth for this PSoC?
>>>
>>> I've just started discussing that with Matthias Koch, since mecrisp-
>>> Stellaris shouldn't be too difficult to get to run on this PSoC.
>>
>> I just received my PSoC boards and will be looking into this.  If you
>> are going to work on it either we should work together or maybe just one
>> of us do it.  No point in duplicating the effort.
>
> You have a head start, since you have already boards.  That means: go ahead!
> If you get stuck, I'll help you.
>

Ok, sounds good.  Actually I had planned to do some leg work before the 
boards arrived, but that never happened.  I have one of the TI boards 
that is already supported and planned to spend some time learning that. 
  I might still.  Better to start with something working, no?  The way 
Mathias talked all that really needs to be done is to modify the Flash 
interface code for the unique size blocks.  He seems to think they are 
an odd size for compiling directly to flash.  At least I think it was 
Mathias... lol.  I'm not good with names, especially when there are no 
faces.  Here's mine so you can remember me more easily...  :)

-- 

Rick

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#32483

FromPaul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Date2014-07-18 16:59 -0700
Message-ID<7xiomu9q11.fsf@ruckus.brouhaha.com>
In reply to#32482
rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
> Ok, sounds good.  Actually I had planned to do some leg work before
> the boards arrived, but that never happened.  I have one of the TI
> boards that is already supported and planned to spend some time
> learning that.

I also have a couple of those boards (TI Stellaris Launchpad,
predecessor of the current and slightly improved Tiva version).
If you need one of them I can lend or donate it.

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#32488

FromBernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de>
Date2014-07-19 14:30 +0200
Message-ID<lqdod3$l6$1@online.de>
In reply to#32482
rickman wrote:
> Ok, sounds good.  Actually I had planned to do some leg work before the
> boards arrived, but that never happened.  I have one of the TI boards
> that is already supported and planned to spend some time learning that.
>   I might still.  Better to start with something working, no?  The way
> Mathias talked all that really needs to be done is to modify the Flash
> interface code for the unique size blocks.  He seems to think they are
> an odd size for compiling directly to flash.

Yes, Cypress moves the Flash programming behind some system calls, instead 
of giving direct access to the flash write instruction.  Typically, you can 
erase a block of flash (erase means all bits set to 1), and write words 
(toggle bits from 1 to 0).  For in-flash programming, this is very handy, 
because you can treat flash as a write-once memory.  With the write-a-block 
at a time model from Cypress, you can't do that.  You write into the shadow 
memory, and you probably can't read from that memory, unless you make sure 
it's flushed out.  That's difficult, because in Forth, a word becomes 
visible after it's defined, and words are typically smaller than 128 bytes.

A possible way around is to look at the ROM which implements the flash 
writing, and if possible use those instructions directly, instead of using 
the syscall interface.

-- 
Bernd Paysan
"If you want it done right, you have to do it yourself"
http://bernd-paysan.de/

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