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Julian Noble Scientific Forth

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  Julian Noble  Scientific Forth johnloomishall@gmail.com - 2016-02-18 11:02 -0800
    Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth "C.  G.  Montgomery" <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> - 2016-02-18 18:04 -0500
      Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-02-18 20:52 -0800
        Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth "C.  G.  Montgomery" <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> - 2016-02-20 17:30 -0500
          Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-02-20 14:58 -0800
          Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth jg <josefg@gmail.com> - 2016-02-21 14:33 -0800
            Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-02-21 14:39 -0800
            Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth "C.  G.  Montgomery" <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> - 2016-02-22 20:37 -0500
            Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2016-02-24 22:06 +0000
              Re: Julian Noble Scientific Forth Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2016-02-24 23:38 +0000
              Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth jg <josefg@gmail.com> - 2016-03-27 22:17 -0700
                Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth jg <josefg@gmail.com> - 2016-04-16 12:58 -0700
        Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2016-02-24 00:28 -0800
      Re: Julian Noble  Scientific Forth Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-02-20 16:32 -0800

#45605 — Julian Noble Scientific Forth

Hello Everyone,

I recall that there was an effort to arrange to make Noble's book available, but I haven't been able to find out if and where it can be obtained.  The paperback is at Amazon for over $900.00!!!

Thanks for any info,

John

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#45611

johnloomishall@gmail.com johnloomishall@gmail.com wrote:

> 
> I recall that there was an effort to arrange to make Noble's book
> available, but I haven't been able to find out if and where it can be
> obtained.  The paperback is at Amazon for over $900.00!!!
> 

To the best of my knowledge, at the present time:

The copyright owner (Mrs. Harriet Noble, Julian's widow) has granted 
permission for a digitized version of the book to be made publicly 
available on the internet.

At least one digitized version of the book exists.  There may well be 
more.

No digitized version has been made available on a publicly available site.

My own opinion is that it would be a benefit to the Forth community if a 
copy could be chosen and placed on a site that is likely to persist into 
the foreseeable future.
[Of course that might cause the Amazon price to crash. ;-) ]

regards to all   cgm

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#45614

"C.  G.  Montgomery" <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> writes:
> My own opinion is that it would be a benefit to the Forth community if a 
> copy could be chosen and placed on a site that is likely to persist into 
> the foreseeable future.

archive.org and forth.org are both obvious places for it, and I'm sure
lots of us (including me) would be happy to supply hosting as well.

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#45644

Paul Rubin no.email@nospam.invalid wrote:

> "C.  G.  Montgomery" <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> writes:
>> My own opinion is that it would be a benefit to the Forth community if
>> a copy could be chosen and placed on a site that is likely to persist
>> into the foreseeable future.
> 
> archive.org and forth.org are both obvious places for it, and I'm sure
> lots of us (including me) would be happy to supply hosting as well.

Excellent!

Now a nice step would be for someone who has a digitized version to offer 
it for posting publicly.

regards to all   cgm

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#45646

"C.  G.  Montgomery" <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> writes:
> Now a nice step would be for someone who has a digitized version to offer 
> it for posting publicly.

Peter Knaggs reviewed it here, so maybe he has a copy:

   http://www.rigwit.co.uk/papers/review.html

I believe he's in the UK but if someone can get a copy to me, I can
arrange to scan and upload and return it.

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#45662

On Saturday, February 20, 2016 at 2:30:59 PM UTC-8, C.  G.  Montgomery wrote:
> Paul Rubin no.email@nospam.invalid wrote:
> 
> > "C.  G.  Montgomery" <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> writes:
> >> My own opinion is that it would be a benefit to the Forth community if
> >> a copy could be chosen and placed on a site that is likely to persist
> >> into the foreseeable future.
> > 
> > archive.org and forth.org are both obvious places for it, and I'm sure
> > lots of us (including me) would be happy to supply hosting as well.
> 
> Excellent!
> 
> Now a nice step would be for someone who has a digitized version to offer 
> it for posting publicly.
> 
> regards to all   cgm

Hey cgm,

Work has been getting in the way. I wasn't quite sure how to kick off the project, i.e. hosting and call to action. I converted all of the chapters from pdf to text files. Tesseract did a wonderful job converting everything. Of course there are errors, but that comes with the territory.

I have marked up a few chapters in basic LaTeX, the project would need someone with actual LaTeX skills for the true typesetting.

I would like to see the release being completed similar to the "Thinking Forth" release. I am worried about screwing everything up.

Very open to suggestions.

Cheers,

jg

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#45663

jg <josefg@gmail.com> writes:
> Work has been getting in the way. I wasn't quite sure how to kick off
> the project, i.e. hosting and call to action. I converted all of the
> chapters from pdf to text files. Tesseract did a wonderful job
> converting everything. Of course there are errors, but that comes with
> the territory.

Oh this is nice--do you have pdfs available?  I had been corresponding
with Charles about doing a new scan of a paper copy, if we couldn't get
to one that was already scanned.

> I would like to see the release being completed similar to the
> "Thinking Forth" release. I am worried about screwing everything up.

That sounds great!

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#45684

jg josefg@gmail.com wrote:

> ...
> Work has been getting in the way. I wasn't quite sure how to kick off
> the project, i.e. hosting and call to action. I converted all of the
> chapters from pdf to text files. Tesseract did a wonderful job
> converting everything. Of course there are errors, but that comes with
> the territory.
> 
> I have marked up a few chapters in basic LaTeX, the project would need
> someone with actual LaTeX skills for the true typesetting.
> 
> I would like to see the release being completed similar to the "Thinking
> Forth" release. I am worried about screwing everything up.
> 
> Very open to suggestions.
> 
> Cheers,
> 
> jg

A pdf file is probably enough to satisfy most people interested in the 
book.  A version in text format would be very nice to have, but not 
essential.

Paul Rubin has found that the Hathi Trust, https://www.hathitrust.org/? , 
seems to have a copy to which they restrict access because of copyright 
concerns.  It's possible that with the clarification of Mrs. Noble's 
intentions it might be made available.  I believe this will be explored.

I have found that LyX (FOSS:  http://www.lyx.org  ; there is a Debian 
package) is very handy for someone who wants to display math without 
having to learn LaTeX.  (LaTeX is one of the languages I can usually read 
without too much trouble but can't write worth a darn.)

I am looking into the matter of the floppy disk which was included with 
the book.  Just what is on that floppy, and whether it would be useful to 
readers of the book, isn't yet clear.

Progress is being made!

regards to all   cgm

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#45694

Am Sun, 21 Feb 2016 14:33:50 -0800 schrieb jg:
> Work has been getting in the way. I wasn't quite sure how to kick off
> the project, i.e. hosting and call to action. I converted all of the
> chapters from pdf to text files. Tesseract did a wonderful job
> converting everything. Of course there are errors, but that comes with
> the territory.
> 
> I have marked up a few chapters in basic LaTeX, the project would need
> someone with actual LaTeX skills for the true typesetting.
> 
> I would like to see the release being completed similar to the "Thinking
> Forth" release. I am worried about screwing everything up.
> 
> Very open to suggestions.

I suggest, you create a github repository where you put all the text 
files (and your basic LaTeX markup), and then post the location here, and 
invite the people who want to join the effort.  I'm pretty sure the 
people who worked on Thinking Forth will offer help (including me ;-).

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#45695 — Re: Julian Noble Scientific Forth

Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> writes:

>Am Sun, 21 Feb 2016 14:33:50 -0800 schrieb jg:
>> Work has been getting in the way. I wasn't quite sure how to kick off
>> the project, i.e. hosting and call to action. I converted all of the
>> chapters from pdf to text files. Tesseract did a wonderful job
>> converting everything. Of course there are errors, but that comes with
>> the territory.
>>
>> I have marked up a few chapters in basic LaTeX, the project would need
>> someone with actual LaTeX skills for the true typesetting.
>>
>> I would like to see the release being completed similar to the "Thinking
>> Forth" release. I am worried about screwing everything up.
>>
>> Very open to suggestions.

>I suggest, you create a github repository where you put all the text
>files (and your basic LaTeX markup), and then post the location here, and
>invite the people who want to join the effort.  I'm pretty sure the
>people who worked on Thinking Forth will offer help (including me ;-).

And me.

Groetjes Albert
-- 
Albert van der Horst, UTRECHT,THE NETHERLANDS
Economic growth -- being exponential -- ultimately falters.
albert@spe&ar&c.xs4all.nl &=n http://home.hccnet.nl/a.w.m.van.der.horst

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#46243

On Wednesday, February 24, 2016 at 2:09:44 PM UTC-8, Bernd Paysan wrote:
> Am Sun, 21 Feb 2016 14:33:50 -0800 schrieb jg:
> > Work has been getting in the way. I wasn't quite sure how to kick off
> > the project, i.e. hosting and call to action. I converted all of the
> > chapters from pdf to text files. Tesseract did a wonderful job
> > converting everything. Of course there are errors, but that comes with
> > the territory.
> > 
> > I have marked up a few chapters in basic LaTeX, the project would need
> > someone with actual LaTeX skills for the true typesetting.
> > 
> > I would like to see the release being completed similar to the "Thinking
> > Forth" release. I am worried about screwing everything up.
> > 
> > Very open to suggestions.
> 
> I suggest, you create a github repository where you put all the text 
> files (and your basic LaTeX markup), and then post the location here, and 
> invite the people who want to join the effort.  I'm pretty sure the 
> people who worked on Thinking Forth will offer help (including me ;-).

I'm currently preparing the github repository. My target is Wednesday to post the location here. There will be a loose wiki guide to working on the initial formatting. I see the 1.0 release as a relatively exact replica of Scientific Forth. The license would be a Creative Commons Attribution, Share-alike, NonCommercial; this is the same as the Thinking Forth project.

Cheers, jg

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#46674

On Sunday, March 27, 2016 at 10:17:21 PM UTC-7, jg wrote:
> On Wednesday, February 24, 2016 at 2:09:44 PM UTC-8, Bernd Paysan wrote:
> > Am Sun, 21 Feb 2016 14:33:50 -0800 schrieb jg:
> > > Work has been getting in the way. I wasn't quite sure how to kick off
> > > the project, i.e. hosting and call to action. I converted all of the
> > > chapters from pdf to text files. Tesseract did a wonderful job
> > > converting everything. Of course there are errors, but that comes with
> > > the territory.
> > > 
> > > I have marked up a few chapters in basic LaTeX, the project would need
> > > someone with actual LaTeX skills for the true typesetting.
> > > 
> > > I would like to see the release being completed similar to the "Thinking
> > > Forth" release. I am worried about screwing everything up.
> > > 
> > > Very open to suggestions.
> > 
> > I suggest, you create a github repository where you put all the text 
> > files (and your basic LaTeX markup), and then post the location here, and 
> > invite the people who want to join the effort.  I'm pretty sure the 
> > people who worked on Thinking Forth will offer help (including me ;-).
> 
> I'm currently preparing the github repository. My target is Wednesday to post the location here. There will be a loose wiki guide to working on the initial formatting. I see the 1.0 release as a relatively exact replica of Scientific Forth. The license would be a Creative Commons Attribution, Share-alike, NonCommercial; this is the same as the Thinking Forth project.
> 
> Cheers, jg

Apologies for my tardiness.

Here is the url for the github: https://github.com/Josefg/Scientific_FORTH

Each chapter is a separate folder with the pdf and the text file. Some chapters have been split into multiple sections because of length. As an example, Chapter 1 has been lightly formatted in LaTeX. There's no defined document class yet, and thus I'd suggest not heavily marking up a chapter until that's defined.

Collaborators are more than welcome.

Questions and comments?

Cheers,
jg

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#45693

On Friday, 19 February 2016 04:52:31 UTC, Paul Rubin  wrote:
> "C.  G.  Montgomery" <> writes:
> > My own opinion is that it would be a benefit to the Forth community if a 
> > copy could be chosen and placed on a site that is likely to persist into 
> > the foreseeable future.
> 
> archive.org and forth.org are both obvious places for it, and I'm sure
> lots of us (including me) would be happy to supply hosting as well.

If you want, you can put it on forthfiles.net - I own the domain.
That's *exactly* what forthfiles.net is for. Archiving of landmark
Forth documentation that is getting hard to find.

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#45647

"C.  G.  Montgomery" <cgm@physics.utoledo.edu> writes:
> The copyright owner (Mrs. Harriet Noble, Julian's widow) has granted 
> permission for a digitized version of the book to be made publicly 
> available on the internet.

I just emailed you at your g4com address about confirming the permission.

> At least one digitized version of the book exists.

The one that I know of is

  http://catalog.hathitrust.org/api/volumes/oclc/27061416.html

> No digitized version has been made available on a publicly available site.

I may be able to make some progress with this.  There is apparently a
5.25" floppy disc included with the book, and of course it would be
great to have the contents of that as well.

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