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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #42901 > unrolled thread

Stoked

Started byChris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com>
First post2015-10-28 09:04 -0700
Last post2015-12-12 18:52 -0800
Articles 20 on this page of 174 — 27 participants

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Contents

  Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 09:04 -0700
    Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 09:18 -0700
      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 12:35 -0400
        Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 09:54 -0700
          Re: Stoked lehs <skydda.barnen@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 10:35 -0700
          Re: Stoked Jason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com> - 2015-10-28 11:21 -0700
          Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 14:24 -0400
            Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 13:12 -0700
              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 16:31 -0400
            Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 14:55 -0700
              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 01:36 -0400
            Re: Stoked Alfred Singlestone <vitonis@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 06:01 -0700
              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 13:22 -0400
            Re: Stoked Marcos Cruz <use_the_contact_page@programandala.net> - 2015-11-07 17:50 +0000
              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-07 13:04 -0500
                Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-07 10:19 -0800
                  Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-07 08:29 -1000
                    Re: Stoked hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-11-07 13:28 -0800
                    Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-07 13:33 -0800
                      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-07 16:40 -0500
                        Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-07 14:25 -0800
                          Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-07 18:03 -0500
                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-07 15:22 -0800
                              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 01:13 -0500
                                Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-07 22:35 -0800
                                  Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 01:58 -0500
                                    Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-07 23:17 -0800
                                      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 02:49 -0500
                                        Re: Stoked Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 00:06 -0800
                                        Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 01:40 -0800
                                          Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 15:18 -0500
                                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 13:31 -0800
                                              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 17:19 -0500
                                                Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-11 20:49 -0800
                                                  Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 00:57 -0500
                                                    Re: Stoked hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-11-11 22:24 -0800
                                                    Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-11 23:34 -0800
                                                      Re: Stoked Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 00:03 -0800
                                                        Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-12 19:37 -0800
                                                      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 15:24 -0500
                                                        Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-12 13:18 -0800
                                                          Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-12 16:40 -0500
                                                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-12 20:59 -0800
                                                              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-13 01:50 -0500
                                                                Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-12 23:11 -0800
                                                          Re: Stoked forthisit@gmail.com - 2015-11-12 13:47 -0800
                                                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-12 16:27 -0800
                                                          Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-12 12:18 -1000
                                                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-13 00:28 -0800
                                                    Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-11 22:37 -1000
                                                      Re: Stoked hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-11-12 23:37 -0800
                                              Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-09 14:19 +0000
                                                Re: Stoked Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-11-23 07:47 +0100
                                                  Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-23 11:27 +0000
                                                    Re: Stoked Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-11-23 13:43 +0100
                                            Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-08 12:49 -1000
                                              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 19:20 -0500
                                      Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-07 23:44 -1000
                                  Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-08 18:23 +0000
                                    Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 10:32 -0800
                                      Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-08 18:45 +0000
                                        Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 10:53 -0800
                                          Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-08 21:25 +0000
                                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 14:09 -0800
                                            Re: Stoked "Rod Pemberton" <boo@fasdfrewar.cdm> - 2015-11-09 05:32 -0500
                                              Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-09 14:58 +0000
                                          Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 23:42 -0500
                                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 21:11 -0800
                                      Re: Stoked Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-11-15 12:50 +0100
                                Re: Stoked Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2015-11-07 23:56 -0800
                                  Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 03:24 -0500
                                    Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 01:31 -0800
                                      Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-07 23:57 -1000
                                        Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 02:18 -0800
                                          Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-08 08:33 -1000
                                          Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-09 00:07 -0500
                                      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-08 23:49 -0500
                                        Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 21:06 -0800
                                          Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-09 00:20 -0500
                                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-08 22:51 -0800
                                              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-09 02:22 -0500
                                            Re: Stoked Alfred Singlestone <vitonis@gmail.com> - 2015-11-10 04:32 -0800
                                              Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-10 13:48 +0000
                                                Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-10 16:17 -0500
                                                  Re: Stoked "Rod Pemberton" <boo@fasdfrewar.cdm> - 2015-11-10 17:26 -0500
                                          Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-08 21:50 -1000
                                          Re: Stoked stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2015-11-09 12:15 +0000
                                            Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-09 15:09 +0000
                                            Re: Stoked Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-11-24 09:47 +0100
                                              Re: Stoked stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2015-11-24 12:54 +0000
                                              Re: Stoked Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-11-24 15:03 +0100
                                                Emulating a 16-bit Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-11-25 13:18 +0100
                                                  Re: Emulating a 16-bit Forth Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-11-25 14:08 +0100
                                          Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-09 14:30 +0000
                                          Re: Stoked Bernd Linsel <bl1@gmx.com> - 2015-11-09 18:27 +0100
                                            Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-10 00:50 -0800
                                  Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-07 23:52 -1000
                            Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-07 23:16 -1000
                          Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-07 23:07 -1000
                          Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-08 17:58 +0000
                      Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-11-07 12:00 -1000
                  Re: Stoked Albert van der Horst <albert@spenarnc.xs4all.nl> - 2015-11-08 17:49 +0000
          Re: Stoked stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2015-10-28 23:24 +0000
            Re: Stoked Jason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com> - 2015-10-28 17:30 -0700
            Re: Stoked Waldek Hebisch <hebisch@antispam.uni.wroc.pl> - 2015-10-29 02:40 +0000
              Re: Stoked stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2015-10-29 10:11 +0000
            Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 21:07 -0700
              Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-28 21:16 -0700
              Re: Stoked franck.bensusan@gmail.com - 2015-10-29 01:35 -0700
              Re: Stoked stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2015-10-29 10:16 +0000
                Re: Stoked lehs <skydda.barnen@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 03:35 -0700
                  Re: Stoked lehs <skydda.barnen@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 03:48 -0700
            Re: Stoked mhx@iae.nl - 2015-10-29 11:31 -0700
              Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 12:01 -0700
                Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-29 12:26 -0700
              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 15:29 -0400
                Re: Stoked mhx@iae.nl - 2015-10-29 13:27 -0700
                  Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-29 16:48 -0400
                    Re: Stoked josv@planet.nl - 2015-10-29 14:58 -0700
                      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 01:36 -0400
                        Re: Stoked josv@planet.nl - 2015-10-30 04:34 -0700
                          Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 13:28 -0400
                            Re: Stoked josv@planet.nl - 2015-10-30 12:05 -0700
                              Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 15:32 -0400
                                Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-10-30 18:53 -1000
                                  Re: Stoked josv@planet.nl - 2015-11-01 04:28 -0800
                                  Re: Stoked hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-11-03 22:27 -0800
                    Re: Stoked mhx@iae.nl - 2015-10-29 16:47 -0700
                      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 01:33 -0400
                      Re: Stoked mhx@iae.nl - 2015-10-31 00:55 -0700
                  Re: Stoked stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2015-10-30 11:52 +0000
                Re: Stoked josv@planet.nl - 2015-10-29 14:49 -0700
                Re: Stoked stephen@mpeforth.com (Stephen Pelc) - 2015-10-30 11:50 +0000
      Re: Stoked Hans Bezemer <the.beez.speaks@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 18:39 +0100
        Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 11:11 -0700
          Re: Stoked Hans Bezemer <the.beez.speaks@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 20:01 +0100
          Re: Stoked hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-10-28 12:34 -0700
            Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 13:09 -0700
      Re: Stoked François <francois.ganza@wanadoo.fr> - 2015-10-28 15:25 -0700
        Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 21:01 -0700
          Re: Stoked "Rod Pemberton" <boo@fasdfrewar.cdm> - 2015-10-29 01:58 -0400
            Re: Stoked Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 23:34 -0700
          Re: Stoked Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2015-10-29 08:56 +0100
      Re: Stoked "Rod Pemberton" <boo@fasdfrewar.cdm> - 2015-10-28 18:41 -0400
        Re: Stoked josv@planet.nl - 2015-10-29 05:28 -0700
        Re: Stoked "Rod Pemberton" <boo@fasdfrewar.cdm> - 2015-12-12 11:25 -0500
          Re: Stoked "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2015-12-12 08:43 -1000
            Re: Stoked hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-12-16 13:45 -0800
              Re: Stoked hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2015-12-17 10:26 -0800
          Re: Stoked Rob Sciuk <rob@controlq.com> - 2015-12-13 23:29 -0500
            Re: Stoked Raimond Dragomir <raimond.dragomir@gmail.com> - 2015-12-13 22:31 -0800
      Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-28 15:52 -0700
        Re: Stoked anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2015-10-29 16:57 +0000
          Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-29 12:36 -0700
            Re: Stoked anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2015-10-31 14:57 +0000
              Re: Stoked Bernd Paysan <bernd.paysan@gmx.de> - 2015-10-31 20:25 +0100
          Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-11-03 20:39 -0800
      Re: Stoked Pablo Hugo Reda <pabloreda@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 16:27 -0700
      Re: Stoked Alfred Singlestone <vitonis@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 05:57 -0700
      Re: Stoked "HAA" <someone@microsoft.com> - 2015-11-02 13:15 +1100
        Re: Stoked François <francois.ganza@wanadoo.fr> - 2015-11-02 02:08 -0800
    Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-28 09:28 -0700
      Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 09:37 -0700
        Re: Stoked Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2015-10-28 10:28 -0700
    Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 10:52 -0700
      Re: Stoked anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2015-10-28 18:14 +0000
    Re: Stoked François <francois.ganza@wanadoo.fr> - 2015-10-28 15:20 -0700
      Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-28 21:16 -0700
    Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 12:13 -0700
      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-10-30 15:34 -0400
    Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-11-07 13:57 -0800
      Re: Stoked rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2015-11-07 17:19 -0500
    Re: Stoked François <francois.ganza@wanadoo.fr> - 2015-11-09 00:10 -0800
    Re: Stoked Chris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com> - 2015-12-12 18:52 -0800

Page 1 of 9  [1] 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9  Next page →


#42901 — Stoked

FromChris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 09:04 -0700
SubjectStoked
Message-ID<d8be4416-4e14-49f8-b54f-54665bd7639a@googlegroups.com>
I now have my own working Forth that I wrote in x86 assembler. The EXE is 17k and I built it with 8MB of memory for the code and dictionary. If I assume that a typical word uses 64 bytes, then that gives me room for 130,000 words, give or take. And it very easy to increase that space if need be.

Sorry to be a bother, but I'm excited about this and want to share it with someone, and I feel like you folks would understand best.

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#42902

FromChris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 09:18 -0700
Message-ID<ba0d541b-dec8-466b-b5a2-9752323f574d@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#42901
It is not very fast though ...

: test begin ?dup if 1 - else exit then again ;

10000000 test \ about 6 seconds for 10 million iterations

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#42904

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 12:35 -0400
Message-ID<n0qtc8$9ta$2@dont-email.me>
In reply to#42902
On 10/28/2015 12:18 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
> It is not very fast though ...
>
> : test begin ?dup if 1 - else exit then again ;
>
> 10000000 test \ about 6 seconds for 10 million iterations

So, are you ready to use someone else's forth, like gforth or Win32Forth?

-- 

Rick

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#42907

FromChris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 09:54 -0700
Message-ID<284a0c81-1d04-406d-a84b-39d4617375f3@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#42904
On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 12:35:25 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
> On 10/28/2015 12:18 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
> > It is not very fast though ...
> >
> > : test begin ?dup if 1 - else exit then again ;
> >
> > 10 000 000 test \ about 6 seconds for 10 million iterations
> 
> So, are you ready to use someone else's forth, like gforth or Win32Forth?
> 
> -- 
> 
> Rick
I misspoke about the performance. It is 6 seconds for 100 million iterations, not 10 million.

And while 6 seconds for about a billion instructions may be slow compared to other implementations, I think it is plenty fast enough for what I am using it for at the moment.

I don't know how this compares to other implementations, but if they are not a whole lot faster than mine, then there is something seriously wrong with them. After all, this is my first pass at this, my x86 assembler programming is very rusty after being away from it for 20 years, and I have only devoted a few hours a day on this for a couple of weeks.

Switching to someone else's Forth at this point would be for quitters. I'm not a quitter. I'm just starting.

[toc] | [prev] | [next] | [standalone]


#42912

Fromlehs <skydda.barnen@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 10:35 -0700
Message-ID<4dff4206-8bd3-4c91-b0fa-ab9747b5f5b1@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#42907
Den onsdag 28 oktober 2015 kl. 17:54:20 UTC+1 skrev Chris Curl:
> On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 12:35:25 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
> > On 10/28/2015 12:18 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
> > > It is not very fast though ...
> > >
> > > : test begin ?dup if 1 - else exit then again ;
> > >
> > > 10 000 000 test \ about 6 seconds for 10 million iterations
> > 
> > So, are you ready to use someone else's forth, like gforth or Win32Forth?
> > 
> > -- 
> > 
> > Rick
> I misspoke about the performance. It is 6 seconds for 100 million iterations, not 10 million.
> 
> And while 6 seconds for about a billion instructions may be slow compared to other implementations, I think it is plenty fast enough for what I am using it for at the moment.
> 
> I don't know how this compares to other implementations, but if they are not a whole lot faster than mine, then there is something seriously wrong with them. After all, this is my first pass at this, my x86 assembler programming is very rusty after being away from it for 20 years, and I have only devoted a few hours a day on this for a couple of weeks.
> 
> Switching to someone else's Forth at this point would be for quitters. I'm not a quitter. I'm just starting.

64 bit GForth 100000000 test 0,9 seconds
32 bit SP-Forth 1/3 seconds

But SP-Forth runs an optimized code and seems to work as a high level macro assembler.

Would it be possible to invoke something like that in your Forth? That is, when loading the compiler traverse the code and compile the machine code with corrected jump-addresses...?

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#42917

FromJason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com>
Date2015-10-28 11:21 -0700
Message-ID<03bf290b-fae5-4d24-81eb-51dc28dc71bb@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#42907
On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 9:54:20 AM UTC-7, Chris Curl wrote:

> Switching to someone else's Forth at this point would be for quitters. 
> I'm not a quitter. I'm just starting.

Writing your own Forth is for real men.  Wussies use other people's Forth.
You are The Man!

Jason

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#42918

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 14:24 -0400
Message-ID<n0r3oc$5aa$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#42907
On 10/28/2015 12:54 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 12:35:25 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
>> On 10/28/2015 12:18 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
>>> It is not very fast though ...
>>>
>>> : test begin ?dup if 1 - else exit then again ;
>>>
>>> 10 000 000 test \ about 6 seconds for 10 million iterations
>>
>> So, are you ready to use someone else's forth, like gforth or Win32Forth?
>>
>> --
>>
>> Rick
> I misspoke about the performance. It is 6 seconds for 100 million iterations, not 10 million.
>
> And while 6 seconds for about a billion instructions may be slow compared to other implementations, I think it is plenty fast enough for what I am using it for at the moment.
>
> I don't know how this compares to other implementations, but if they are not a whole lot faster than mine, then there is something seriously wrong with them. After all, this is my first pass at this, my x86 assembler programming is very rusty after being away from it for 20 years, and I have only devoted a few hours a day on this for a couple of weeks.
>
> Switching to someone else's Forth at this point would be for quitters. I'm not a quitter. I'm just starting.

Ok, enjoy.  At some point I expect you may get tired of reinventing the 
wheel.  Why not try working on something new instead of jumping on the 
"I want to write my own forth" bandwagon.

There is a Mecrisp for embedded targets that could use lots of work in 
porting to new targets and developing code to control the peripherals on 
the many devices it does run on.

I'm working to port it to the Microsemi SoC CPU/FPGA device.

-- 

Rick

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#42928

FromChris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 13:12 -0700
Message-ID<04be31b1-c9bb-45f2-9ccb-d1624ac4a63e@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#42918
On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 2:24:18 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
>
> Ok, enjoy.  At some point I expect you may get tired of reinventing the 
> wheel.  Why not try working on something new instead of jumping on the 
> "I want to write my own forth" bandwagon.
> 
> There is a Mecrisp for embedded targets that could use lots of work in 
> porting to new targets and developing code to control the peripherals on 
> the many devices it does run on.
> 
> I'm working to port it to the Microsemi SoC CPU/FPGA device.
> 
> -- 
> 
> Rick
That could be interesting. Where can I get more info about this need?

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#42929

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 16:31 -0400
Message-ID<n0rb6d$4jk$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#42928
On 10/28/2015 4:12 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 2:24:18 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
>>
>> Ok, enjoy.  At some point I expect you may get tired of reinventing the
>> wheel.  Why not try working on something new instead of jumping on the
>> "I want to write my own forth" bandwagon.
>>
>> There is a Mecrisp for embedded targets that could use lots of work in
>> porting to new targets and developing code to control the peripherals on
>> the many devices it does run on.
>>
>> I'm working to port it to the Microsemi SoC CPU/FPGA device.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Rick
> That could be interesting. Where can I get more info about this need?

http://bfy.tw/2WCf

-- 

Rick

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#42930

FromChris Curl <ccurl609@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-28 14:55 -0700
Message-ID<ff9b70f9-6073-43aa-86dd-d6e2612cd7db@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#42918
On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 2:24:18 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
> ...
> There is a Mecrisp for embedded targets that could use lots of work in 
> porting to new targets and developing code to control the peripherals on 
> the many devices it does run on.
> 
> I'm working to port it to the Microsemi SoC CPU/FPGA device.
> 
> -- 
> 
> Rick
Your LMGTFY google search for mecrisp returns about 13,500 pages. 
Do you expect me to wade through those pages to find where someone talks 
about needing help porting to new targets, just so I am NOT implementing my 
own Forth on x86? That is not happening. Forget that I asked for more 
information about the "lots of work" you mentioned.

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#42948

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-29 01:36 -0400
Message-ID<n0sb5j$g7$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#42930
On 10/28/2015 5:55 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 2:24:18 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
>> ...
>> There is a Mecrisp for embedded targets that could use lots of work in
>> porting to new targets and developing code to control the peripherals on
>> the many devices it does run on.
>>
>> I'm working to port it to the Microsemi SoC CPU/FPGA device.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Rick
> Your LMGTFY google search for mecrisp returns about 13,500 pages.
> Do you expect me to wade through those pages to find where someone talks
> about needing help porting to new targets, just so I am NOT implementing my
> own Forth on x86? That is not happening. Forget that I asked for more
> information about the "lots of work" you mentioned.

I believe the first hit in that search was to the Mecrisp page.  I'm not 
sure what you are looking for other than that.  You can contact the 
author and he would be happy to discuss the issue with you.

I'm just surprised that you are so unwilling to do any leg work on your 
own.

-- 

Rick

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#42998

FromAlfred Singlestone <vitonis@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-30 06:01 -0700
Message-ID<e3366adc-207e-402d-9dcd-83be9e9b1e23@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#42918
On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 2:24:18 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
> On 10/28/2015 12:54 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
> > On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 12:35:25 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
> >> On 10/28/2015 12:18 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
> >>> It is not very fast though ...
> >>>
> >>> : test begin ?dup if 1 - else exit then again ;
> >>>
> >>> 10 000 000 test \ about 6 seconds for 10 million iterations
> >>
> >> So, are you ready to use someone else's forth, like gforth or Win32Forth?
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Rick
> > I misspoke about the performance. It is 6 seconds for 100 million iterations, not 10 million.
> >
> > And while 6 seconds for about a billion instructions may be slow compared to other implementations, I think it is plenty fast enough for what I am using it for at the moment.
> >
> > I don't know how this compares to other implementations, but if they are not a whole lot faster than mine, then there is something seriously wrong with them. After all, this is my first pass at this, my x86 assembler programming is very rusty after being away from it for 20 years, and I have only devoted a few hours a day on this for a couple of weeks.
> >
> > Switching to someone else's Forth at this point would be for quitters. I'm not a quitter. I'm just starting.
> 
> Ok, enjoy.  At some point I expect you may get tired of reinventing the 
> wheel.  Why not try working on something new instead of jumping on the 
> "I want to write my own forth" bandwagon.
> 
> There is a Mecrisp for embedded targets that could use lots of work in 
> porting to new targets and developing code to control the peripherals on 
> the many devices it does run on.
> 
> I'm working to port it to the Microsemi SoC CPU/FPGA device.
> 
> -- 
> 
> Rick

If such a bandwagon exists, it is tiny and not densely peopled. I know. I'm on it.

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#43001

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2015-10-30 13:22 -0400
Message-ID<n108tf$rjb$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#42998
On 10/30/2015 9:01 AM, Alfred Singlestone wrote:
> On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 2:24:18 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
>> On 10/28/2015 12:54 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
>>> On Wednesday, October 28, 2015 at 12:35:25 PM UTC-4, rickman wrote:
>>>> On 10/28/2015 12:18 PM, Chris Curl wrote:
>>>>> It is not very fast though ...
>>>>>
>>>>> : test begin ?dup if 1 - else exit then again ;
>>>>>
>>>>> 10 000 000 test \ about 6 seconds for 10 million iterations
>>>>
>>>> So, are you ready to use someone else's forth, like gforth or Win32Forth?
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Rick
>>> I misspoke about the performance. It is 6 seconds for 100 million iterations, not 10 million.
>>>
>>> And while 6 seconds for about a billion instructions may be slow compared to other implementations, I think it is plenty fast enough for what I am using it for at the moment.
>>>
>>> I don't know how this compares to other implementations, but if they are not a whole lot faster than mine, then there is something seriously wrong with them. After all, this is my first pass at this, my x86 assembler programming is very rusty after being away from it for 20 years, and I have only devoted a few hours a day on this for a couple of weeks.
>>>
>>> Switching to someone else's Forth at this point would be for quitters. I'm not a quitter. I'm just starting.
>>
>> Ok, enjoy.  At some point I expect you may get tired of reinventing the
>> wheel.  Why not try working on something new instead of jumping on the
>> "I want to write my own forth" bandwagon.
>>
>> There is a Mecrisp for embedded targets that could use lots of work in
>> porting to new targets and developing code to control the peripherals on
>> the many devices it does run on.
>>
>> I'm working to port it to the Microsemi SoC CPU/FPGA device.
>>
>> --
>>
>> Rick
>
> If such a bandwagon exists, it is tiny and not densely peopled. I know. I'm on it.

I understand why people want to write a forth.  I did the same thing 
some years ago in rolling my own stack processor.  But I learned from 
that exercise that it can be a *lot* of work with little to show.  But 
many people aren't doing this to produce anything useful.  They are 
doing it purely for the fun, which I get, I just don't share.

I prefer to work on things that I think will be utilized.  If that 
utilization is just myself, that's ok too, but better if it can be used 
by others.  Mecrisp is gaining some ground.  I see more and more mention 
of it in various sources.  Personally I think Matthias is taking a bit 
of a left turn by pursuing the fully open source FPGA CPU development 
chain, but that's just my personal interest.  I don't see FPGA CPUs 
gaining much ground in general.  I can see then used in special apps 
however, so at some point I may dig in and work with that stuff myself.

In the meantime I need to get my Microsemi board up and running.  :)

-- 

Rick

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#43312

FromMarcos Cruz <use_the_contact_page@programandala.net>
Date2015-11-07 17:50 +0000
Message-ID<n1ldkh$1nd$1@speranza.aioe.org>
In reply to#42918
En/Je/On 2015-10-28, rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> escribió/skribis/wrote:

> Ok, enjoy.  At some point I expect you may get tired of reinventing the 
> wheel.  Why not try working on something new instead of jumping on the 
> "I want to write my own forth" bandwagon.

Because writing a Forth is a good learning experience on Forth?  Because
it's an intellectual challenge/pleasure?  Because it's fun?  Because
sometimes Forth systems available for your specific platform are not
good/practical/powerful/simple/complex/modern/small/big/fast/(non-)standard
enough for certain application(s)/game(s)/tool(s) you want/need to write?

Beside, writing your own Forth is compatible with writing programs in
Forth -- in any Forth, even in your own Forth :)

-- 
Marcos Cruz
http://programandala.net

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#43314

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2015-11-07 13:04 -0500
Message-ID<n1lebj$efb$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#43312
On 11/7/2015 12:50 PM, Marcos Cruz wrote:
> En/Je/On 2015-10-28, rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> escribió/skribis/wrote:
>
>> Ok, enjoy.  At some point I expect you may get tired of reinventing the
>> wheel.  Why not try working on something new instead of jumping on the
>> "I want to write my own forth" bandwagon.
>
> Because writing a Forth is a good learning experience on Forth?  Because
> it's an intellectual challenge/pleasure?  Because it's fun?  Because
> sometimes Forth systems available for your specific platform are not
> good/practical/powerful/simple/complex/modern/small/big/fast/(non-)standard
> enough for certain application(s)/game(s)/tool(s) you want/need to write?
>
> Beside, writing your own Forth is compatible with writing programs in
> Forth -- in any Forth, even in your own Forth :)

You couldn't have explained my thinking any better.  Writing your own 
forth is not very different from writing applications in forth.  The 
difference is that when you write your own forth, that is what you have, 
a starting point to write applications.  When you write applications you 
have gone beyond just writing your own forth.

I find it hard to picture a situation where you would be better off 
writing your own forth rather than modifying/extending one of the many 
excellent forths out there.  I guess I'm just not so big on redoing the 
work that others have done, especially when they are so much better at 
it.  To each his own.

-- 

Rick

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#43316

FromPaul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Date2015-11-07 10:19 -0800
Message-ID<87egg1wu31.fsf@nightsong.com>
In reply to#43314
rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
> I find it hard to picture a situation where you would be better off
> writing your own forth rather than modifying/extending one of the many
> excellent forths out there.

That is not always possible or practical, if the features you want
aren't in any existing Forth and have to be baked in from the beginning,
rather than added on.

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#43319

From"Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com>
Date2015-11-07 08:29 -1000
Message-ID<ZcidnVC92b6A3qPLnZ2dnUU7-KWdnZ2d@supernews.com>
In reply to#43316
On 11/7/15 8:19 AM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
>> I find it hard to picture a situation where you would be better off
>> writing your own forth rather than modifying/extending one of the many
>> excellent forths out there.
>
> That is not always possible or practical, if the features you want
> aren't in any existing Forth and have to be baked in from the beginning,
> rather than added on.
>

Such as?

Cheers,
Elizabeth

-- 
==================================================
Elizabeth D. Rather   (US & Canada)   800-55-FORTH
FORTH Inc.                         +1 310.999.6784
5959 West Century Blvd. Suite 700
Los Angeles, CA 90045
http://www.forth.com

"Forth-based products and Services for real-time
applications since 1973."
==================================================

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#43323

Fromhughaguilar96@gmail.com
Date2015-11-07 13:28 -0800
Message-ID<98e0122a-be88-4d6f-9d00-6aa97216f526@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#43319
On Saturday, November 7, 2015 at 11:29:50 AM UTC-7, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote:
> On 11/7/15 8:19 AM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> > rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> writes:
> >> I find it hard to picture a situation where you would be better off
> >> writing your own forth rather than modifying/extending one of the many
> >> excellent forths out there.
> >
> > That is not always possible or practical, if the features you want
> > aren't in any existing Forth and have to be baked in from the beginning,
> > rather than added on.
> >
> 
> Such as?

Quotations.

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#43324

FromPaul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Date2015-11-07 13:33 -0800
Message-ID<87a8qpwl3x.fsf@nightsong.com>
In reply to#43319
"Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> writes:
>> if the features you want aren't in any existing Forth and have to be
>> baked in from the beginning, rather than added on.
> Such as?

Each of these exists in at least one Forth, but I don't know of any
Forth that combines all of them:

    1. Being written entirely in Forth with no external dependencies,
    instead of booting from assembler.

    2. Being able to choose the cell size at build time, or maybe even
    run time.

    3. Separating the compiler and interpreter/VM such as for a tethered
    system.

    4. All FOSS.

    5. Multitasker with async i/o behind the scenes, and memory
    isolation between tasks.

Maybe something like this could re-use parts of existing Forths but the
differences would be deep enough that it wouldn't really be "adding on".

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#43325

Fromrickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Date2015-11-07 16:40 -0500
Message-ID<n1lqve$1fh$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#43324
On 11/7/2015 4:33 PM, Paul Rubin wrote:
> "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> writes:
>>> if the features you want aren't in any existing Forth and have to be
>>> baked in from the beginning, rather than added on.
>> Such as?
>
> Each of these exists in at least one Forth, but I don't know of any
> Forth that combines all of them:
>
>      1. Being written entirely in Forth with no external dependencies,
>      instead of booting from assembler.
>
>      2. Being able to choose the cell size at build time, or maybe even
>      run time.
>
>      3. Separating the compiler and interpreter/VM such as for a tethered
>      system.
>
>      4. All FOSS.
>
>      5. Multitasker with async i/o behind the scenes, and memory
>      isolation between tasks.
>
> Maybe something like this could re-use parts of existing Forths but the
> differences would be deep enough that it wouldn't really be "adding on".

I didn't say it couldn't happen, I said it was hard to imagine.  For me, 
at least, this is still hard to imagine.

I'm not at all clear on item 2.  Can you explain that a bit more?  How 
would this be useful much less important?

I also don't see how you can achieve item 1 if you are going to support 
multiple CPUs.  Can you explain that?

-- 

Rick

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