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Groups > comp.lang.forth > #53228 > unrolled thread

Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set

Started byNathan Schulzke <nschulzke@gmail.com>
First post2016-12-09 09:25 -0800
Last post2017-01-07 15:37 +0000
Articles 20 on this page of 171 — 22 participants

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  Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Nathan Schulzke <nschulzke@gmail.com> - 2016-12-09 09:25 -0800
    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Nathan Schulzke <nschulzke@gmail.com> - 2016-12-09 09:30 -0800
      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set trans <transfire@gmail.com> - 2016-12-09 10:23 -0800
        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Nathan Schulzke <nschulzke@gmail.com> - 2016-12-09 16:37 -0800
          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-12-09 17:01 -0800
            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Nathan Schulzke <nschulzke@gmail.com> - 2016-12-10 09:07 -0800
            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem> - 2017-01-01 21:40 -0500
              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-01-01 21:06 -1000
                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-01-03 17:22 -0800
                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Lars Brinkhoff <lars.spam@nocrew.org> - 2017-01-04 10:09 +0100
                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set john <anon@example.com> - 2017-01-04 11:59 +0000
                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-04 10:56 -0800
                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-04 23:58 +0100
                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-01-04 20:06 -0800
                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-05 04:12 -0600
                              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-05 12:43 +0100
                                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-05 16:38 +0000
                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-05 19:17 +0100
                                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-05 18:26 +0000
                                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-06 01:56 +0100
                                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-07 15:53 +0000
                                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-07 18:20 +0100
                                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-08 16:33 +0000
                                              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-08 20:02 +0100
                                                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-09 17:53 +0000
                                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-09 20:22 +0100
                                              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-09 08:04 -0800
                                                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-09 17:04 +0000
                                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-09 20:22 +0100
                                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-10 01:41 +0100
                                                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-09 22:16 -0800
                                                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-10 09:44 +0000
                                                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-10 15:19 +0100
                                                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-10 15:24 +0000
                                                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-10 15:35 +0000
                                                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-10 22:12 +0100
                                                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-10 22:42 +0000
                                                              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-11 00:23 +0100
                                                                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-10 23:35 +0000
                                                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-10 23:38 -0800
                                                                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-11 10:32 +0000
                                                                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-11 12:52 +0100
                                                                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-11 13:23 +0000
                                                                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-11 06:08 -0800
                                                                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-11 14:39 +0000
                                                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set franck.bensusan@gmail.com - 2017-01-11 23:00 -0800
                                                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-12 13:55 +0000
                                                              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-12 14:06 +0000
                                                                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set franck.bensusan@gmail.com - 2017-01-13 06:29 -0800
                                                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-13 14:52 +0000
                                                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-14 12:23 +0000
                                                              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-12 15:47 +0100
                                                                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-12 15:09 +0000
                                                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-12 20:23 +0100
                                                                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-12 21:21 +0000
                                                                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-13 03:45 +0100
                                                                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-13 02:55 -0600
                                                                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-13 14:29 +0000
                                                                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Bernd Linsel <bl1@gmx.com> - 2017-01-13 16:11 +0100
                                                                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-13 17:26 +0100
                                                                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-13 17:27 +0100
                                                                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-13 17:01 +0000
                                                                            nt=xt? (was: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-14 15:35 +0000
                                                                              Re: nt=xt? (was: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set) stephen@mpeforth.com - 2017-01-14 13:58 -0800
                                                                                Re: nt=xt? (was: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set) hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-14 14:52 -0800
                                                                                Re: nt=xt? (was: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-15 14:00 +0000
                                                                                  Re: nt=xt? (was: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set) albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-15 16:51 +0100
                                                                                    Re: nt=xt? (was: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-15 16:04 +0000
                                                                                  Re: nt=xt? (was: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set) hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-15 13:47 -0800
                                                                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-14 12:39 +0000
                                                                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Matthias Trute <matthias.trute@gmail.com> - 2017-01-12 22:14 -0800
                                                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-14 13:45 +0000
                                                              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set franck.bensusan@gmail.com - 2017-01-14 08:51 -0800
                                                                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-14 09:23 -0800
                                                                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-14 18:02 +0000
                                                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set franck.bensusan@gmail.com - 2017-01-09 23:42 -0800
                                                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-10 09:36 +0000
                                                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set franck.bensusan@gmail.com - 2017-01-10 03:55 -0800
                                                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-10 13:40 +0000
                                                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set franck.bensusan@gmail.com - 2017-01-10 06:40 -0800
                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-05 12:45 +0100
                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Ilya Tarasov <ilya74.tarasov@gmail.com> - 2017-01-06 08:19 -0800
                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-06 17:57 +0100
                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set mhx@iae.nl - 2017-01-08 01:34 -0800
                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set john <anon@example.com> - 2017-01-08 17:08 +0000
              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-02 16:49 +0000
      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2016-12-09 14:52 -0800
      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2016-12-09 14:56 -0800
    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Brad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com> - 2016-12-23 13:13 -0800
    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-06 06:58 -0800
      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-06 09:32 -0600
        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-06 09:11 -0800
          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-06 12:41 -0600
            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-01-06 21:31 -1000
              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-07 13:28 -0800
                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Coos Haak <htrofhc@gmail.com> - 2017-01-07 23:00 +0100
                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-07 14:37 -0800
                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-08 00:06 +0100
                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-07 18:50 -0800
                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-08 14:28 +0100
                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-08 19:34 -0800
                        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-09 06:27 +0100
                          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-10 00:08 -0800
                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Alex <alex@rivadpm.com> - 2017-01-10 10:01 +0000
                            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-10 13:12 +0100
                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set stephen@mpeforth.com - 2017-01-08 07:23 -0800
                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-08 19:41 -0800
                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-09 17:41 +0000
                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set "Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com> - 2017-01-07 18:56 -1000
            TO implementation (was: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set) anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-07 14:02 +0000
              Re: TO implementation Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-07 10:51 -0600
                Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-08 15:27 +0000
                  Re: TO implementation Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-08 13:36 -0600
                    Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-09 18:20 +0000
                      Re: TO implementation Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-10 03:56 -0600
                        Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-15 15:15 +0000
                          Re: TO implementation Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-15 13:34 -0600
                            Re: TO implementation hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-15 14:04 -0800
                              Re: TO implementation stephen@mpeforth.com - 2017-01-15 14:24 -0800
                                Re: TO implementation hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-15 15:42 -0800
                                Re: TO implementation hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-15 15:56 -0800
                                  Re: TO implementation awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-16 14:25 +0100
                                    Re: TO implementation hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-16 11:30 -0800
                                      Re: TO implementation awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-17 02:00 +0100
                                        Re: TO implementation albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-17 12:59 +0100
                                          Re: TO implementation awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-17 14:38 +0100
                                          Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-17 15:47 +0000
                                            Re: TO implementation hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-17 10:24 -0800
                                      Re: TO implementation hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-16 17:02 -0800
                                        Re: TO implementation awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-17 06:00 +0100
                            Re: TO implementation Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem> - 2017-01-15 22:19 -0500
                              Re: TO implementation Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-16 08:57 -0600
                              Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-19 11:26 +0000
                                Re: TO implementation Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem> - 2017-01-19 20:49 -0500
                                  Re: TO implementation minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-20 00:27 -0800
                                    Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-20 12:20 +0000
                                      Re: TO implementation Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem> - 2017-01-26 22:42 -0500
                                        Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-27 08:33 +0000
                                      Re: TO implementation minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-27 03:59 -0800
                            Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-19 11:40 +0000
                              Re: TO implementation Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-19 05:55 -0600
                                Re: TO implementation anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-19 14:46 +0000
                                  Re: TO implementation Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-19 11:03 -0600
          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-06 20:22 +0100
            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Andrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid> - 2017-01-07 03:54 -0600
            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-07 13:51 +0000
              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-07 18:50 +0100
                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set mhx@iae.nl - 2017-01-08 02:05 -0800
      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-06 17:41 +0100
        Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set minforth@arcor.de - 2017-01-06 09:15 -0800
          Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-06 18:40 +0100
            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-06 20:25 +0100
              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-07 14:55 +0100
                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-07 18:55 +0100
                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-07 19:10 +0100
                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-08 01:25 +0100
                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-08 02:17 +0100
              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set mhx@iae.nl - 2017-01-08 01:53 -0800
                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-08 17:03 +0100
                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Coos Haak <htrofhc@gmail.com> - 2017-01-08 17:51 +0100
                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-08 18:30 +0100
                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> - 2017-01-08 10:51 -0800
                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-08 20:06 +0100
            Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-07 15:31 +0000
              Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-07 18:20 +0100
                Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-07 18:56 +0100
                  Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-07 19:10 +0100
                    Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set albert@cherry.spenarnc.xs4all.nl (Albert van der Horst) - 2017-01-08 01:26 +0100
                      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) - 2017-01-08 02:06 +0100
      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set hughaguilar96@gmail.com - 2017-01-06 17:23 -0800
      Re: Ideal Stack Machine Instruction Set anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl) - 2017-01-07 15:37 +0000

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#53754

Fromawegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel)
Date2017-01-05 12:45 +0100
Message-ID<1mzdq1i.1lyrbh01509rp4N%awegel@arcor.de>
In reply to#53746
Paul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid> wrote:

> awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) writes:
> > Is there a reason to use the hosts outer interpreter but sheer laziness?
> 
> I thought it was an important part of Forth's fiendish cleverness.

Sure - i should have written "abuse".

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#53782

FromIlya Tarasov <ilya74.tarasov@gmail.com>
Date2017-01-06 08:19 -0800
Message-ID<412b61b0-c9d1-4c0a-af1e-af583edcccba@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53737
> > 3.) LITERAL is not vectored. A cross-compiler that uses the built-in
> > outer-interpreter is founded upon meta-compilation,
> 
> Using the hosts outer interpreter is better suited for meta-compiling
> than it is for cross-compiling, because when cross-compiling the target
> is different (maybe very different) from the host.
> 
> Is there a reason to use the hosts outer interpreter but sheer laziness?

With multiple vocabularies you can keep the most of host words and just recover needed. With some tricks, and, of course, vectored LITERAL it is possible to write a very small portion of code to retarget all to another system.

After each literal processed my Forth executes DISPATCH-NUMBER vector, which is empty in normal case. For cross-compilation, last pushed number can be moved as an argument to target memory image. Btw, no ONLY-ALSO is required for this, since vocabulary hierarchy is static.

This looks simple enough:

PROC :
  [ FORTH ]
  CREATE CODE^ , DOES> @ KF632-LIT
  [ KF632 ]
  cmdCALL
ENDPROC

PROC ;
  FROMR RETB
ENDPROC

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#53784

Fromawegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel)
Date2017-01-06 17:57 +0100
Message-ID<1mzfyic.riyzeo1f9qstvN%awegel@arcor.de>
In reply to#53782
Ilya Tarasov <ilya74.tarasov@gmail.com> wrote:

> > > 3.) LITERAL is not vectored. A cross-compiler that uses the built-in
> > > outer-interpreter is founded upon meta-compilation,
> > 
> > Using the hosts outer interpreter is better suited for meta-compiling
> > than it is for cross-compiling, because when cross-compiling the target
> > is different (maybe very different) from the host.
> > 
> > Is there a reason to use the hosts outer interpreter but sheer laziness?
> 
> With multiple vocabularies you can keep the most of host words and just
> recover needed. With some tricks, and, of course, vectored LITERAL it is
> possible to write a very small portion of code to retarget all to another
> system.

But the same is true when using your own outer interpreter (which is
just another small piece of code), with the additional benefit that you
don't need a system providing a vectored literal then.

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#53847

Frommhx@iae.nl
Date2017-01-08 01:34 -0800
Message-ID<301aeca5-4510-47f0-b1e8-6b73c1912d88@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53729
On Wednesday, January 4, 2017 at 12:58:25 PM UTC+1, john wrote:
> In article <867f6bjinx.fsf@molnjunk.nocrew.org>, lars.spam@nocrew.org says...
> > All the commonly dispenced advice for writing Forth programs is helpful,
> > but I only started to understand it after I became more comfortable with
> > Forth.
> > 
> 
> Once upon a time Arnold Palmer hit a hole in one.
> A bystander screamed in delight, "damn - that was lucky"
> Palmer turned to him and smiled, "You know what, it's a funny 
> thing but the more I practice the luckier I get."

That is a great quote. 

Let me pose a suggestive question. 
When your object is to write an Golf compiler in 
Forth, would you start by rewriting the innards of your 
Forth, or would you first try to become good at Golf?

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#53859

Fromjohn <anon@example.com>
Date2017-01-08 17:08 +0000
Message-ID<MPG.32dc82623c2c77b39896e6@news.virginmedia.com>
In reply to#53847
In article <301aeca5-4510-47f0-b1e8-6b73c1912d88@googlegroups.com>, 
mhx@iae.nl says...
> 
> Let me pose a suggestive question. 
> When your object is to write an Golf compiler in 
> Forth, would you start by rewriting the innards of your 
> Forth, or would you first try to become good at Golf?
> 
> 
> 

Well - if I understand your thrust correctly:
first I'd identify that the compiler needs wriiting in the first place
(that implies I already know more than a bit of golf)
Then I'd look for the management tools I need to define
the solution to whatever issues I've identified. And begin that.
Then I'd look for what staff are available and what their skills
are
then maybe - just maybe - I'd be ready to look at what programming
language or languages  might be useful to complete the task to 
my specification.

as things stand with my current project I'm trying to decide whether
to let jack have his head and do some preliminary work in forth
or to require the proof of concept work to be done in another environment  
entirely. 

As things stand I have arguaments for both. Sadly neither of which
would inform my golf swing.


-- 

john

=========================
http://johntech.co.uk

"Bleeding Edge Forum"
http://johntech.co.uk/forum/ 

=========================

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#53669

Fromanton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at (Anton Ertl)
Date2017-01-02 16:49 +0000
Message-ID<2017Jan2.174946@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at>
In reply to#53652
Rod Pemberton <NeedNotReplyHere@xrsevnneqk.cem> writes:
>On Fri, 9 Dec 2016 17:01:44 -0800 (PST)
>hughaguilar96@gmail.com wrote:
>
>> Why do you want to write a Forth system in C++ or C or any other
>> language?
>
>My take on that is:
>
>1) easier than assembly

Not really.

>2) code is portable

Yes, that was the main motivation for doing the Gforth engine in C.
However, in the meantime the number of general-purpose platforms has
dwindled, and this is no longer that important (and we have always
used assembly language for Gforth EC).

>3) code survives longer

True.

>4) compiler optimizations

Given what the C compiler people consider "optimizations" these days,
this is the main reason for staying away from C and C++.

>5) foreign function interfaces

C is pretty bad at this.  Note how long it took Gforth to get a
foreign function interface, how much effort it took, and what it
entails.

>6) powerful tool chain

Whatever may be powerful about the toolchain, it does not really help
much when developing a Forth system in my experience.

>7) more programmers

In our experience, not really.  There may be more C/C++ programmers,
but they don't volunteer for contributing to an existing Forth system:
Gforth (with more Forth code portion) still has the same people on
board that it had 24 years ago; PFE (more C code portion) had two
differnt maintainers and lost both of them.

- anton
-- 
M. Anton Ertl  http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/home.html
comp.lang.forth FAQs: http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/forth/faq/toc.html
     New standard: http://www.forth200x.org/forth200x.html
   EuroForth 2016: http://www.euroforth.org/ef16/

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#53233

Fromhughaguilar96@gmail.com
Date2016-12-09 14:52 -0800
Message-ID<65a2d0c6-b202-42eb-bd46-0b0a3fcd42f2@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53229
On Friday, December 9, 2016 at 10:30:29 AM UTC-7, Nathan Schulzke wrote:
> On Friday, December 9, 2016 at 10:25:21 AM UTC-7, Nathan Schulzke wrote:
> > Hey all,
> > 
> > As a personal educational project, I decided to build a simple VM (
> 
> I... don't know what happened there. Restarting.
> 
> I'm building a simple stack-based VM, and am currently working on the instruction set. Since I know that there've been several Forth machines that have been made, and you all have a lot of experience with Forth between you, I wanted to see what your thoughts were:
> 
> 1) What would your ideal Forth-friendly instruction set look like? Which opcodes would be absolutely necessary, and which would be nice?
> 2) What would the virtual hardware look like? My preliminary design has two stacks (parameter and return), and three registers (machine code PC and IR, and an IP for Forth). I'm building this with the idea of an indirect-threaded forth system, since that seems to be the easiest first step.
> 
> I don't have a ton of experience with ISAs or VMs, and almost none with stack machines, so any feedback is appreciated!
> 
> Thanks!

This is my design:
http://www.forth.org/Stundurd.txt

This is an old document with a couple of mistakes, but it is pretty close --- I will upload a new document soon.

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#53234

FromPaul Rubin <no.email@nospam.invalid>
Date2016-12-09 14:56 -0800
Message-ID<874m2c4sp5.fsf@nightsong.com>
In reply to#53229
Nathan Schulzke <nschulzke@gmail.com> writes:
> What would the virtual hardware look like? My preliminary design has
> two stacks (parameter and return), and three registers (machine code
> PC and IR, and an IP for Forth).

You might find this useful:

http://www.complang.tuwien.ac.at/anton/euroforth/ef08/papers/pelc.pdf

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#53510

FromBrad Eckert <hwfwguy@gmail.com>
Date2016-12-23 13:13 -0800
Message-ID<afa8a07e-7e13-4a3e-b12a-aa624a5cb7a6@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53228
On Friday, December 9, 2016 at 10:25:21 AM UTC-7, Nathan Schulzke wrote:
> Hey all,
> 
> As a personal educational project, I decided to build a simple VM (

Phillip Koopman's stack machines book is a good place to start.

Look Hans Bezemer's 4th, which is written in C:
https://thebeez.home.xs4all.nl/4tH/
He spent a lot of time polishing it.

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#53779

Fromminforth@arcor.de
Date2017-01-06 06:58 -0800
Message-ID<0dc5f2c0-8e05-4e5a-8c1e-cf08da4eec98@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53228
Am Freitag, 6. Januar 2017 01:56:20 UTC+1 schrieb Alexander Wegel:
> Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> wrote:
> 
> > awegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel) writes:
> > >Anton Ertl <anton@mips.complang.tuwien.ac.at> wrote:
> > >
> > >> the following rules
> > >> out a text interpreter as a standard program more clearly:
> > >> 
> > >> |4.1.2 Ambiguous conditions
> > >> |
> > >> |attempting to obtain the execution token, (e.g., with 6.1.0070 ',
> > >> |6.1.1550 FIND, etc. of a definition with undefined interpretation
> > >> |semantics;
> > >
> > >I think FIND differs from ' and ['] in that it isn't limited to words
> > >with interpretation semantics
> > 
> > Yes, in practice it works that way;
> > the extreme case is a cmForth-like
> > system where IF and ";" are only FINDable in compile state; there FIND
> > will return 0 in interpretation state, and the user-defined text
> > interpreter will report "IF undefined" or somesuch, but that will be
> > pretty much the same as the behaviour of the system-defined text
> > interpreter.
> 
> I had such a system too (ansified pocketforth derivative).
> 
> > Anyway, the normative text of Forth-94/2012 makes this ambiguous, so
> > by the text of the standard a standard program must not FIND the
> > system's IF (not even in compile state).
> 
> I think the rationale behind these restrictions becomes clear in
> D.6.7 Immediacy, where there is an explanation why ' and ['] are not
> permitted with compiling words:
> They don't return immediacy information, just a bare execution token.
> (FIND which doesn't have that shortcoming isn't ruled out there.)
> 
> The good thing is: I'm not attempting to "obtain an execution token",
> but to "obtain an execution-token + immediacy-flag pair", so the
> paragraph in 4.1.2 doesn't apply. It even makes sense this way ;D
> 
> BTW: Find is ruled out in 4.1.2 in a rather generic list (starting with
> E.g., ending with etc.) while there are only ~4 candidate words in the
> whole standard (' ['] FIND SEARCH-WORDLIST) - it might be normative, but
> seems a bit huh-hasty or imprecise to me.
> 
> Alex W.

It's the same old story ad nauseam, to repair Forth's traditional compiler directives. And it is getting worse with each invention of new overloadings of TO. Already TO is overloaded 4 times: singles, doubles, floats and locals. Overloading cries for boxed values and OO, but....

What should FIND TO return then? Forbidding it is a very poor excuse IMO.

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#53780

FromAndrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid>
Date2017-01-06 09:32 -0600
Message-ID<pu6dnTavH7M4JfLFnZ2dnUU7-SvNnZ2d@supernews.com>
In reply to#53779
minforth@arcor.de wrote:
> 
> It's the same old story ad nauseam, to repair Forth's traditional
> compiler directives. And it is getting worse with each invention of
> new overloadings of TO. Already TO is overloaded 4 times: singles,
> doubles, floats and locals. Overloading cries for boxed values and
> OO, but....
> 
> What should FIND TO return then? Forbidding it is a very poor excuse
> IMO.

TO could be implemented with no special compilation semantics at all.

The original implementation set a flag which was read and cleared by
the next child of VALUE.  Today's optimizing compilers are quite
capable of turning that into a simple stored, so there's no reason for
TO to be overloaded at all: it's just a word.

Andrew.

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#53785

Fromminforth@arcor.de
Date2017-01-06 09:11 -0800
Message-ID<a14a63ff-378c-4440-9fa3-b8c9862251b0@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53780
Am Freitag, 6. Januar 2017 16:32:59 UTC+1 schrieb Andrew Haley:
> minforth@arcor.de wrote:
> > 
> > It's the same old story ad nauseam, to repair Forth's traditional
> > compiler directives. And it is getting worse with each invention of
> > new overloadings of TO. Already TO is overloaded 4 times: singles,
> > doubles, floats and locals. Overloading cries for boxed values and
> > OO, but....
> > 
> > What should FIND TO return then? Forbidding it is a very poor excuse
> > IMO.
> 
> TO could be implemented with no special compilation semantics at all.
> 
> The original implementation set a flag which was read and cleared by
> the next child of VALUE.  Today's optimizing compilers are quite
> capable of turning that into a simple stored, so there's no reason for
> TO to be overloaded at all: it's just a word.
> 
> Andrew.

How so ??
It must be some IMMEDIATE version then, and NOT state-smart!




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#53788

FromAndrew Haley <andrew29@littlepinkcloud.invalid>
Date2017-01-06 12:41 -0600
Message-ID<l9CdnZs5fb9vefLFnZ2dnUU7-LGdnZ2d@supernews.com>
In reply to#53785
minforth@arcor.de wrote:
> Am Freitag, 6. Januar 2017 16:32:59 UTC+1 schrieb Andrew Haley:
>> minforth@arcor.de wrote:
>> > 
>> > It's the same old story ad nauseam, to repair Forth's traditional
>> > compiler directives. And it is getting worse with each invention of
>> > new overloadings of TO. Already TO is overloaded 4 times: singles,
>> > doubles, floats and locals. Overloading cries for boxed values and
>> > OO, but....
>> > 
>> > What should FIND TO return then? Forbidding it is a very poor excuse
>> > IMO.
>> 
>> TO could be implemented with no special compilation semantics at all.
>> 
>> The original implementation set a flag which was read and cleared by
>> the next child of VALUE.  Today's optimizing compilers are quite
>> capable of turning that into a simple stored, so there's no reason for
>> TO to be overloaded at all: it's just a word.
> 
> How so ??
> It must be some IMMEDIATE version then, and NOT state-smart!

An optimizing compiler can know exactly what TO does, and do the right
thing accordingly.  TO does not need to be IMMEDIATE or have any
special compilation semantics.

Andrew.

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#53801

From"Elizabeth D. Rather" <erather@forth.com>
Date2017-01-06 21:31 -1000
Message-ID<9LqdnTVLw9H1BO3FnZ2dnUU7-WfNnZ2d@supernews.com>
In reply to#53788
On 1/6/17 8:41 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> minforth@arcor.de wrote:
>> Am Freitag, 6. Januar 2017 16:32:59 UTC+1 schrieb Andrew Haley:
>>> minforth@arcor.de wrote:
>>>>
>>>> It's the same old story ad nauseam, to repair Forth's traditional
>>>> compiler directives. And it is getting worse with each invention of
>>>> new overloadings of TO. Already TO is overloaded 4 times: singles,
>>>> doubles, floats and locals. Overloading cries for boxed values and
>>>> OO, but....
>>>>
>>>> What should FIND TO return then? Forbidding it is a very poor excuse
>>>> IMO.
>>>
>>> TO could be implemented with no special compilation semantics at all.
>>>
>>> The original implementation set a flag which was read and cleared by
>>> the next child of VALUE.  Today's optimizing compilers are quite
>>> capable of turning that into a simple stored, so there's no reason for
>>> TO to be overloaded at all: it's just a word.
>>
>> How so ??
>> It must be some IMMEDIATE version then, and NOT state-smart!

You can, for instance, compile a normal reference to TO followed by a 
normal reference to the target VALUE. In executing, TO would know how to 
find the parameter field of the target and store into it, then advance 
the address interpreter (or its equivalent) over the target. No 
immediacy anywhere.

> An optimizing compiler can know exactly what TO does, and do the right
> thing accordingly.  TO does not need to be IMMEDIATE or have any
> special compilation semantics.
>
> Andrew.
>


-- 
Elizabeth R. Conklin
FORTH, Inc.
6080 Center Drive, Suite 600
Los Angeles, CA  90045
USA

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#53824

Fromhughaguilar96@gmail.com
Date2017-01-07 13:28 -0800
Message-ID<1a59eff3-aa36-4889-a9f2-c887c13fc8c3@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53801
On Saturday, January 7, 2017 at 12:31:57 AM UTC-7, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote:
> On 1/6/17 8:41 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> > minforth@arcor.de wrote:
> >> Am Freitag, 6. Januar 2017 16:32:59 UTC+1 schrieb Andrew Haley:
> >>> minforth@arcor.de wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> It's the same old story ad nauseam, to repair Forth's traditional
> >>>> compiler directives. And it is getting worse with each invention of
> >>>> new overloadings of TO. Already TO is overloaded 4 times: singles,
> >>>> doubles, floats and locals. Overloading cries for boxed values and
> >>>> OO, but....
> >>>>
> >>>> What should FIND TO return then? Forbidding it is a very poor excuse
> >>>> IMO.
> >>>
> >>> TO could be implemented with no special compilation semantics at all.
> >>>
> >>> The original implementation set a flag which was read and cleared by
> >>> the next child of VALUE.  Today's optimizing compilers are quite
> >>> capable of turning that into a simple stored, so there's no reason for
> >>> TO to be overloaded at all: it's just a word.
> >>
> >> How so ??
> >> It must be some IMMEDIATE version then, and NOT state-smart!
> 
> You can, for instance, compile a normal reference to TO followed by a 
> normal reference to the target VALUE. In executing, TO would know how to 
> find the parameter field of the target and store into it, then advance 
> the address interpreter (or its equivalent) over the target. No 
> immediacy anywhere.

She is not making any sense at all. TO can't find the parameter field of the target and store into it. What???

> > An optimizing compiler can know exactly what TO does, and do the right
> > thing accordingly.  TO does not need to be IMMEDIATE or have any
> > special compilation semantics.

The only way for this to work, is for TO to set a global variable at run-time and then to have the VALUE word test this global variable and, if it is set do a store and if it is not set do a fetch, and then clear the global variable.

This is very bad design --- a whole slew of state-sensitive words --- the "Forth Way" is supposed to eschew context-sensitive words and quasi-syntax.

Just get rid of TO and value altogether like I do in Straight Forth --- that is why it is called "Straight Forth" --- it is straight-forward, getting rid of ANS-Forth's goofy attempts at a C-like syntax.

Elizabeth Rather introduced TO into ANS-Forth to appease the recalcitrant C programmers --- I remember when a "Forth Dimensions" article in the 1980s introduced TO as a way to set CONSTANT words to new values, and I thought that it was a bad idea then too --- just discard this nonsense!

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#53826

FromCoos Haak <htrofhc@gmail.com>
Date2017-01-07 23:00 +0100
Message-ID<bskt9dpnpgl1.1patfmnl5wgju.dlg@40tude.net>
In reply to#53824
Op Sat, 7 Jan 2017 13:28:15 -0800 (PST) schreef hughaguilar96@gmail.com:

> 
> She is not making any sense at all. TO can't find the parameter field of the target and store into it. What???
> 

My TO generates code that writes into the paramater field of the target.
So your premise (as always) is false.

groet Coos

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#53827

Fromhughaguilar96@gmail.com
Date2017-01-07 14:37 -0800
Message-ID<a16c8b34-0597-4261-af94-26fe824ae420@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53826
On Saturday, January 7, 2017 at 3:01:07 PM UTC-7, Coos Haak wrote:
> Op Sat, 7 Jan 2017 13:28:15 -0800 (PST) schreef hughaguilar96@gmail.com:
> 
> > 
> > She is not making any sense at all. TO can't find the parameter field of the target and store into it. What???
> > 
> 
> My TO generates code that writes into the paramater field of the target.
> So your premise (as always) is false.
> 
> groet Coos

You are such a brown-noser!

This is what she said:

On Saturday, January 7, 2017 at 12:31:57 AM UTC-7, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote:
> You can, for instance, compile a normal reference to TO followed by a 
> normal reference to the target VALUE. In executing, TO would know how to 
> find the parameter field of the target and store into it, then advance 
> the address interpreter (or its equivalent) over the target. No 
> immediacy anywhere.

Notice the part where she said: "No immediacy anywhere."

TO is typically immediate (or fake-immediate like in VFX where it appears to be non-immediate but is special-cased by COMPILE, so that it executes at compile-time like an immediate word). If TO and the VALUE word are both ordinary non-immediate words (what she means when she says: "compile a normal reference to TO followed by a normal reference to the target VALUE") then you have to use the method that I described in which a global variable is set by TO and then checked by the VALUE word so it knows whether to fetch or store.

All of you ANS-Forth cult members are so quick to defend your "leading expert" --- you don't take two seconds to think about what you are saying --- none of you are making any sense whatsoever!

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#53829

Fromawegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel)
Date2017-01-08 00:06 +0100
Message-ID<1mziar9.7na3lsqmv3xnN%awegel@arcor.de>
In reply to#53824
<hughaguilar96@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Saturday, January 7, 2017 at 12:31:57 AM UTC-7, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote:
> > On 1/6/17 8:41 AM, Andrew Haley wrote:
> > > minforth@arcor.de wrote:
> > >> Am Freitag, 6. Januar 2017 16:32:59 UTC+1 schrieb Andrew Haley:
> > >>> minforth@arcor.de wrote:
> > >>>>
> > >>>> It's the same old story ad nauseam, to repair Forth's traditional
> > >>>> compiler directives. And it is getting worse with each invention of
> > >>>> new overloadings of TO. Already TO is overloaded 4 times: singles,
> > >>>> doubles, floats and locals. Overloading cries for boxed values and
> > >>>> OO, but....
> > >>>>
> > >>>> What should FIND TO return then? Forbidding it is a very poor excuse
> > >>>> IMO.
> > >>>
> > >>> TO could be implemented with no special compilation semantics at all.
> > >>>
> > >>> The original implementation set a flag which was read and cleared by
> > >>> the next child of VALUE.  Today's optimizing compilers are quite
> > >>> capable of turning that into a simple stored, so there's no reason for
> > >>> TO to be overloaded at all: it's just a word.
> > >>
> > >> How so ??
> > >> It must be some IMMEDIATE version then, and NOT state-smart!
> > 
> > You can, for instance, compile a normal reference to TO followed by a
> > normal reference to the target VALUE. In executing, TO would know how to
> > find the parameter field of the target and store into it, then advance
> > the address interpreter (or its equivalent) over the target. No 
> > immediacy anywhere.
> 
> She is not making any sense at all. TO can't find the parameter field of the
> target and store into it. What???

Non-portable, but possible when integral part of a system:

: valiu create , does> @ ;
: tu r> dup cell+ >r @ >body ! ;

This surely doesn't work when interpreting, but at least the compiled
version does make some sense.

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#53839

Fromhughaguilar96@gmail.com
Date2017-01-07 18:50 -0800
Message-ID<e9e5fa66-b585-47e0-8098-12f4f173bf4a@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#53829
On Saturday, January 7, 2017 at 4:06:16 PM UTC-7, Alexander Wegel wrote:
> <hughaguilar96@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Saturday, January 7, 2017 at 12:31:57 AM UTC-7, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote:
> > > You can, for instance, compile a normal reference to TO followed by a
> > > normal reference to the target VALUE. In executing, TO would know how to
> > > find the parameter field of the target and store into it, then advance
> > > the address interpreter (or its equivalent) over the target. No 
> > > immediacy anywhere.
> > 
> > She is not making any sense at all. TO can't find the parameter field of the
> > target and store into it. What???
> 
> Non-portable, but possible when integral part of a system:
> 
> : valiu create , does> @ ;
> : tu r> dup cell+ >r @ >body ! ;
> 
> This surely doesn't work when interpreting, but at least the compiled
> version does make some sense.

Those kinds of tricks, that assumed a threaded system and directly accessed the compiled code, were common in the 1980s with figForth etc. --- Forth-83 largely outlawed these tricks, but they were still done in F83 etc. in which the user wasn't planning on porting his code to any other system and hence felt okay about using carnal knowledge --- no serious standard supports tricks that involve carnal knowledge of the implementation.

It seems humorous to me the lengths that the ANS-Forth cult members will go to in supporting Elizabeth Rather's idiotic pronouncements --- she just makes that stuff up, with little or no thought, and without any understanding of how Forth works --- then the cult members contort themselves trying to prove that what she said was actually wise, or at least possible, rather than the pile of horse-shit that it appears to be.

Most likely, Elizabeth Rather doesn't know the difference between immediate and non-immediate words --- this is why ANS-Forth doesn't specify the standard words as being immediate or non-immediate, but leaves this as "implementation defined" which is another word for "ambiguous" --- the result is bizarre implementations such as VFX in which words such as IF are non-immediate but are special-cased by COMPILE, to execute at compile-time like immediate words.

Most C enthusiasts know more about Forth than Elizabeth Rather does --- if they have written even one Forth function, then they have written infinitely more Forth code that she has --- they aren't going to volunteer to learn Forth when they already know more about Forth than the "leading expert" on Forth.

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#53852

Fromawegel@arcor.de (Alexander Wegel)
Date2017-01-08 14:28 +0100
Message-ID<1mzjdkc.pxeg6w5h00nyN%awegel@arcor.de>
In reply to#53839
<hughaguilar96@gmail.com> wrote:

> On Saturday, January 7, 2017 at 4:06:16 PM UTC-7, Alexander Wegel wrote:
> > <hughaguilar96@gmail.com> wrote:
> > > On Sat., January 7, 2017 at 12:31:57 AM UTC-7, Elizabeth D. Rather wrote:
> > > > You can, for instance, compile a normal reference to TO followed by a
> > > > normal reference to the target VALUE. In executing, TO would know how to
> > > > find the parameter field of the target and store into it, then advance
> > > > the address interpreter (or its equivalent) over the target. No
> > > > immediacy anywhere.
> > > 
> > > She is not making any sense at all. TO can't find the parameter field of
> > > the target and store into it. What???
> > 
> > Non-portable, but possible when integral part of a system:
> > 
> > : valiu create , does> @ ;
> > : tu r> dup cell+ >r @ >body ! ;
> > 
> > This surely doesn't work when interpreting, but at least the compiled
> > version does make some sense.
> 
> Those kinds of tricks, that assumed a threaded system and directly accessed
> the compiled code, were common in the 1980s with figForth etc.

So, which Hugh should we believe: The Hugh who wrote that she's not
making any sense at all, or the Hugh that knew this has been done?

Pfff!

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