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Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3??

From rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com>
Newsgroups comp.lang.forth
Subject Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3??
Date 2014-11-21 16:45 -0500
Organization A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID <m4obq2$flv$1@dont-email.me> (permalink)
References (8 earlier) <m4n2bg$5lr$1@dont-email.me> <m4n5rq$i16$1@dont-email.me> <m4n85c$qad$1@dont-email.me> <m4n9uk$12s$1@dont-email.me> <m4ngfs$rvo$1@dont-email.me>

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On 11/21/2014 8:59 AM, Syd Rumpo wrote:
> On 21/11/2014 12:07, rickman wrote:
>>
>> It doesn't need to be a tree, a linear chain would do just fine and is
>> handled very well by the GA144.  The delays would be analogous to an
>> adder time, a fixed interval plus a ripple.  In the adder there is a
>> time for the bit sums which all run in parallel and then the carry
>> ripples.  In the decomposed filter the time to perform the multiply is
>> significant and then the time to ripple the adds through all the cores
>> can be significant too.
>>
>> I am picturing a line of cores where each one handles one coefficient.
>> Data is initialized to zeros in each core.  On each clock a sample is
>> input to the first core which does the multiply and passes the partial
>> sum on to the next cell which only has to perform the next partial sum
>> and pass that result on until it reaches the end where it is a result.
>> The data sample is also passed on to the next core which performs it's
>> multiply and waits for the next partial sum.  Each core has passed on
>> its data sample to the next cell so all the multiplies have been done
>> ahead of time and only the first multiply and all the partial sums need
>> to be performed.  Yes, this is *exactly* like the timing for an adder.
>> No clock delay, just the N adds and communication time, should be around
>> 10 to 12 ns per coefficient.  For a 128 tap filter the ripple delay time
>> would be about 1.5 uS.  The fastest sample processing time would be on
>> the order of 100 ns or 10 MHz.  At least that is my $0.50 analysis.  You
>> can send me a check.  lol
>>
> So...
>
> Begin
>
> Read new data sample into core 1 and multiply by coefficient 1.
>
> Pass result to core 2, which adds in the result from its last multiply
> and passes this to core 3, etc, rippling through all the used cores
> adding in their results to produce a filter output sample.
>
> Then shift all data samples to the next core.
>
> Multiply all these shifted samples (not the first one) by their
> coefficients ahead of the next new data sample.
>
> Again

Yes, well stated.


> So the limiting factor for more than a small number of taps would be the
> ripple adder, rather than the step multiply.

Yes, again, very much like the timing of a ripple carry adder.  This 
suits the grid comms of the GA144 better than a tree arrangement which 
would have better delays.  Even so, I expect I could fashion a tree 
layout for 128 taps and certainly for 64 taps.  I'm not sure it would be 
tons faster since the input data still has to ripple through.  That is 
determined by the algorithm... but there may be a way to cheat that 
problem if you don't mind the code being different in the different cells.


> I think for $0.50 you're underselling yourself.

Possibly.  But supply and demand is in action.  At this time I might do 
some interesting work for free, lol.


> It's a shame that I didn't think of that (neither did GA) or it would
> have been a good solution - we needed 128 taps at 5MHz, maybe 64 taps
> would be enough.  An FPGA was used, which was very quick to do but no fun.

That's falling off a log for an FPGA... as long as you have the 
multipliers.  The FPGA would be physically larger and suck more power 
(depending on the device chosen) too.  I like the Lattice devices which 
have some true low power options.

How did you get your data into the FPGA, serial, parallel?

-- 

Rick

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when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? the_gavino_himself <visphatesjava@gmail.com> - 2014-11-19 11:33 -0800
  Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Jason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com> - 2014-11-19 17:04 -0800
  Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2014-11-20 09:30 -0800
    Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Jason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com> - 2014-11-20 10:34 -0800
      Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2014-11-20 13:21 -0800
        Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Jason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com> - 2014-11-20 13:27 -0800
          Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-20 20:56 -0500
            Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Jason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com> - 2014-11-20 18:43 -0800
              Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-20 23:45 -0500
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Syd Rumpo <usenet@nononono.co.uk> - 2014-11-21 09:58 +0000
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Mark Wills <markwills1970@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 02:10 -0800
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 06:08 -0500
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 05:57 -0500
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Syd Rumpo <usenet@nononono.co.uk> - 2014-11-21 11:37 +0000
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 07:07 -0500
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Syd Rumpo <usenet@nononono.co.uk> - 2014-11-21 13:59 +0000
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Jason Damisch <jasondamisch@yahoo.com> - 2014-11-21 10:46 -0800
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 16:45 -0500
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Syd Rumpo <usenet@nononono.co.uk> - 2014-11-22 11:39 +0000
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-22 12:38 -0500
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                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-22 17:55 -0500
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              Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-21 22:24 -0500
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? JUERGEN <epldfpga@aol.com> - 2014-11-22 01:06 -0800
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? "Rod Pemberton" <buzzoff@nonamewhichexists.cmm> - 2014-11-22 15:40 -0500
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                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? "Rod Pemberton" <buzzoff@nonamewhichexists.cmm> - 2014-11-22 15:36 -0500
                Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-22 18:05 -0500
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  Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? the_gavino_himself <visphatesjava@gmail.com> - 2014-11-29 09:14 -0800
    Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-29 20:38 -0500
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        Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? Howerd <howerdo@yahoo.co.uk> - 2014-11-30 06:55 -0800
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        Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-11-30 16:43 -0500
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            Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? rickman <gnuarm@gmail.com> - 2014-12-01 23:08 -0500
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            Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? the_gavino_himself <visphatesjava@gmail.com> - 2014-12-08 22:48 -0800
      Re: when greenarrays desktop pc? with firefox? vga? usb3?? the_gavino_himself <visphatesjava@gmail.com> - 2014-12-01 19:18 -0800
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