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Groups > comp.lang.c > #63716 > unrolled thread

More useful memory functions

Started byjacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>
First post2015-06-21 16:20 +0200
Last post2015-06-22 03:25 -0500
Articles 20 on this page of 214 — 26 participants

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  More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-21 16:20 +0200
    Re: More useful memory functions Reinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com> - 2015-06-21 22:31 +0800
      Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-21 16:35 +0200
        Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 13:20 -0700
          Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-21 22:52 +0200
            Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 14:43 -0700
              Re: More useful memory functions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-06-21 17:50 -0400
                Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-22 00:21 +0200
                  Re: More useful memory functions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-06-21 18:39 -0400
                    Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-22 00:44 +0200
                      Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-21 16:00 -0700
                      Re: More useful memory functions raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-06-22 21:03 +0000
                        Re: More useful memory functions Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-06-22 18:47 -0500
                          Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-23 00:50 -0700
                            Re: More useful memory functions Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 20:19 +1200
                              Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-23 01:46 -0700
                                Re: More useful memory functions Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 21:07 +1200
                                  Re: More useful memory functions Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-23 10:22 +0100
                                    Re: More useful memory functions Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 21:27 +1200
                                    Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-23 08:30 -0700
                                      Re: More useful memory functions Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-23 16:43 +0100
                                  Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-23 02:36 -0700
                                    Re: More useful memory functions Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 21:54 +1200
                                      Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-23 05:38 -0700
                                        Re: More useful memory functions Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-24 09:03 +1200
                                          Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-23 17:20 -0700
                                            Re: More useful memory functions Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-24 01:36 +0100
                        Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-23 00:34 -0700
                      Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-23 09:55 +0200
                        Re: More useful memory functions glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-06-23 08:35 +0000
                          Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-23 11:32 +0200
                          Re: More useful memory functions raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-06-24 09:51 +0000
                  Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 17:03 -0700
                  Re: More useful memory functions gordonb.muhly@burditt.org (Gordon Burditt) - 2015-06-22 05:17 -0500
                    Re: More useful memory functions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-06-22 09:08 -0400
                      Re: Snipping attribution lines Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-06-23 22:20 +0200
                Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 16:57 -0700
                  Re: More useful memory functions glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-06-22 00:54 +0000
                    Re: More useful memory functions raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-06-22 12:35 +0000
                  Re: More useful memory functions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-06-21 21:10 -0400
                    Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 19:21 -0700
                      Re: More useful memory functions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-06-21 22:55 -0400
                        Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-22 13:41 -0500
                    Re: More useful memory functions glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-06-22 05:01 +0000
                      Re: More useful memory functions Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-06-22 01:48 -0500
                    Re: More useful memory functions Waldek Hebisch <hebisch@antispam.uni.wroc.pl> - 2015-06-23 00:06 +0000
                      Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-22 23:42 -0500
                        Re: More useful memory functions Waldek Hebisch <hebisch@antispam.uni.wroc.pl> - 2015-06-23 23:04 +0000
                          Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 22:28 -0500
                Re: More useful memory functions Nathan Wagner <nw@hydaspes.if.org> - 2015-06-23 13:23 +0000
                  Re: More useful memory functions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-06-23 09:53 -0400
              Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-22 08:34 +0200
                Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-22 10:38 +0200
                  Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-22 11:09 +0200
                    Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-22 07:47 -0700
                      Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-22 16:49 +0200
                        Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-22 17:43 +0200
                          Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-22 17:47 +0200
                            Re: More useful memory functions raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-06-22 20:42 +0000
                              Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-22 18:10 -0500
                            Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-23 10:52 +0200
                          Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-22 09:16 -0700
                            Re: More useful memory functions Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 09:38 +1200
                  Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-22 10:53 +0100
                    Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-22 11:56 -0500
                Re: More useful memory functions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-06-22 09:21 -0400
                Re: More useful memory functions Nathan Wagner <nw@hydaspes.if.org> - 2015-06-23 13:32 +0000
                  Re: More useful memory functions Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-06-23 22:37 -0500
              Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-23 11:07 +0100
                Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-23 13:40 +0200
                Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-23 13:56 +0100
                  Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-23 16:20 +0200
                    Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-23 15:44 +0100
                      Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-23 15:50 +0100
                      Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-23 16:57 +0200
                        Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 17:38 -0500
                  Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-23 07:49 -0700
                  Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-23 17:17 +0200
                    Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-23 18:34 +0100
                      Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-23 20:08 +0200
                        Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-23 20:42 +0100
    More useful memory functions asetofsymbols@gmail.com - 2015-06-21 07:43 -0700
    Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-21 17:25 +0200
      Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-21 10:06 -0700
        Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-21 21:46 +0200
          Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-21 14:26 -0700
        Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 13:17 -0700
          Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-21 22:55 +0200
            Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 14:45 -0700
            Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-21 15:14 -0700
            Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-22 09:44 -0500
      Re: More useful memory functions Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-21 19:18 +0100
        Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-21 23:42 +0200
        Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-22 00:33 +0200
          Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-22 08:42 +0200
            Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-22 08:23 -0500
      Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-21 21:45 +0200
      Re: More useful memory functions Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-07-11 10:56 -0700
    Re: More useful memory functions Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-06-21 18:35 +0200
      Re: More useful memory functions Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-21 21:39 +0100
      Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-22 00:39 +0200
        Re: More useful memory functions James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-06-21 18:41 -0400
          Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-22 00:47 +0200
        Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 17:08 -0700
          Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-21 17:12 -0700
            Re: More useful memory functions gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2015-06-22 00:58 +0000
      Re: More useful memory functions raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-06-22 21:02 +0000
        Re: More useful memory functions Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-06-23 20:56 +0200
          Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-23 21:17 +0200
            Re: More useful memory functions Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-06-23 21:58 +0200
              Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-23 22:06 +0200
                Re: More useful memory functions Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-23 21:21 +0100
                  Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-23 22:48 +0200
                Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-23 23:17 +0200
                  Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-23 23:25 +0200
                    Re: More useful memory functions Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-06-24 00:35 +0200
                    Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-24 00:39 +0200
                  Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-23 15:37 -0700
                Re: Microsoft C run-time Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-06-23 23:22 +0200
                  Re: Microsoft C run-time jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-23 23:27 +0200
              Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-23 13:42 -0700
                Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 19:00 -0500
              Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-24 01:52 +0100
                Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-23 22:25 -0500
                  Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-24 09:53 +0100
                    Re: More useful memory functions gwowen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2015-06-24 01:59 -0700
                    Re: More useful memory functions Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-24 11:05 +0100
                      Re: More useful memory functions Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-24 11:23 +0100
                        Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-24 07:55 -0500
                          Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-24 07:48 -0700
                            Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-24 10:47 -0500
                        Re: More useful memory functions raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2015-07-03 17:34 +0000
                          Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-07-05 05:27 -0700
                      Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-24 11:28 +0100
                        Re: More useful memory functions Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-24 11:50 +0100
                          Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-24 12:58 +0100
                            Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-24 14:20 +0200
                              Re: More useful memory functions jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> - 2015-06-24 14:27 +0200
                                Re: More useful memory functions Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> - 2015-06-24 13:38 +0100
                                  Re: More useful memory functions gwowen <gwowen@gmail.com> - 2015-06-24 08:16 -0700
                                Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-24 16:57 +0200
                              Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-24 13:47 +0100
                                Re: More useful memory functions Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-24 14:48 +0100
                                  Re: More useful memory functions Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-24 18:45 +0100
                                    Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-24 14:12 -0500
                                Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-24 17:12 +0200
                              Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-24 10:27 -0500
                            Re: More useful memory functions Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-24 14:41 +0100
                          Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-24 07:53 -0700
                            Re: More useful memory functions Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-24 16:17 +0100
                            Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-24 08:34 -0700
                              Re: More useful memory functions Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-07-10 18:48 -0700
                                Re: More useful memory functions Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-07-10 18:56 -0700
                                Re: More useful memory functions Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-07-10 20:53 -0700
                                  Re: More useful memory functions Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2015-07-11 13:52 -0700
                            Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-24 10:31 -0500
                    Re: More useful memory functions David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-24 14:15 +0200
                    Re: gcc FUD Noob <root@127.0.0.1> - 2015-06-25 09:57 +0200
                      Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-25 11:34 +0100
                        Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-25 13:11 +0200
                          Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-25 12:38 +0100
                            Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-25 16:13 +0200
                              Re: gcc FUD Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-25 09:49 -0700
                        Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-25 11:32 -0500
                          Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-25 18:37 +0100
                            Re: gcc FUD Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-25 19:56 +0100
                              Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-25 20:33 +0100
                                Re: gcc FUD Siri Cruz <chine.bleu@yahoo.com> - 2015-06-25 12:46 -0700
                                Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-26 13:08 +0200
                                  Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-26 13:22 +0100
                            Re: gcc FUD Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-25 11:57 -0700
                              Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-25 16:32 -0500
                                Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-25 23:11 +0100
                                  Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-25 20:09 -0500
                                    Re: gcc FUD "Morten W. Petersen" <morphex@gmail.com> - 2015-06-26 10:15 +0200
                                      Re: gcc FUD Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-26 01:54 -0700
                                        Re: gcc FUD "Morten W. Petersen" <morphex@gmail.com> - 2015-06-26 11:17 +0200
                                        Re: gcc FUD Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-26 13:36 +0100
                                          Re: gcc FUD "Morten W. Petersen" <morphex@gmail.com> - 2015-06-26 17:45 +0200
                                      Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-26 09:28 -0500
                                        Re: gcc FUD "Morten W. Petersen" <morphex@gmail.com> - 2015-06-26 17:48 +0200
                                          Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-26 11:30 -0500
                                            Re: gcc FUD "Morten W. Petersen" <morphex@gmail.com> - 2015-06-27 09:00 +0200
                                              Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-27 11:08 -0500
                                            Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-28 18:07 +0100
                                              Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-28 22:26 -0500
                                              Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-29 09:49 +0200
                                                Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-29 09:05 -0500
                                                  Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-29 16:54 +0200
                                                    Re: gcc FUD BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-29 12:39 -0500
                                Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-26 14:05 +0200
                                  Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-27 11:40 +0100
                                    Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-27 16:33 +0100
                                    Re: gcc FUD Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-06-27 12:24 -0700
                                    Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-27 22:37 +0200
                                      Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-27 22:31 +0100
                                        Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-28 00:47 +0200
                                          Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-28 11:28 +0100
                                            Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-28 14:00 +0200
                                              Re: gcc FUD Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-28 05:44 -0700
                                            Re: gcc FUD Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-28 13:47 +0100
                                              Re: gcc FUD Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-06-28 05:55 -0700
                                                Re: gcc FUD Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2015-06-28 18:42 +0100
                                          Re: gcc FUD "Morten W. Petersen" <morphex@gmail.com> - 2015-06-29 07:27 +0200
                                            Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-29 10:17 +0200
                                              Re: gcc FUD "Morten W. Petersen" <morphex@gmail.com> - 2015-06-29 11:05 +0200
                                                Re: gcc FUD David Brown <david.brown@hesbynett.no> - 2015-06-29 11:34 +0200
                                      Re: gcc FUD Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2015-06-28 02:14 -0500
                                    Re: gcc FUD Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-28 08:57 +1200
                              Re: gcc FUD Bartc <bc@freeuk.com> - 2015-06-26 10:18 +0100
                                Re: gcc FUD "Morten W. Petersen" <morphex@gmail.com> - 2015-06-26 11:26 +0200
                                Re: gcc FUD Paul <nospam@needed.com> - 2015-06-26 08:05 -0400
    Re: More useful memory functions BGB <cr88192@hotmail.com> - 2015-06-21 11:56 -0500
    Re: More useful memory functions Gordon Burditt <gordon@hammy.burditt.org> - 2015-06-22 03:25 -0500

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#63716 — More useful memory functions

Fromjacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>
Date2015-06-21 16:20 +0200
SubjectMore useful memory functions
Message-ID<mm6h4c$mqb$1@dont-email.me>
After adding recalloc, I thought I would add other functions I always 
wanted to have.

size_t msize(void *ptr);

Returns the size of the given block. If the pointer is NULL or is not a 
memory block allocated with malloc/realloc/recalloc (size_t)-1 is returned.

int memcheck(void *ptr);

Checks that the block pointed to by ptr is valid. If ptr is NULL, the 
whole memory system will be checked for corruption. This can take a 
while in slow systems or systems with a lot of memory.

If the function fails and you are in a debugger, the debugger will be 
called and you can examine the program when the corruption is detected.

[toc] | [next] | [standalone]


#63717

FromReinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com>
Date2015-06-21 22:31 +0800
Message-ID<mm6hp7$p7o$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#63716
jacobnavia wrote:

> After adding recalloc, I thought I would add other functions I always
> wanted to have.
> 
> size_t msize(void *ptr);
> 
> Returns the size of the given block. If the pointer is NULL or is not a
> memory block allocated with malloc/realloc/recalloc (size_t)-1 is
> returned.
> 
> int memcheck(void *ptr);
> 
> Checks that the block pointed to by ptr is valid. If ptr is NULL, the
> whole memory system will be checked for corruption. This can take a
> while in slow systems or systems with a lot of memory.
> 
> If the function fails and you are in a debugger, the debugger will be
> called and you can examine the program when the corruption is detected.

Congratulations,
This is the 9 billionth re-invention of the wheel.

The first such things I remember was in the mid eighties of the last century 
by Walter Bright - and he was not the first.

-- 
Reinhardt

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#63718

Fromjacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>
Date2015-06-21 16:35 +0200
Message-ID<mm6i0g$p1v$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#63717
Le 21/06/2015 16:31, Reinhardt Behm a écrit :
> This is the 9 billionth re-invention of the wheel.

Yes. Wheels *ARE* useful.

Do not be afraid of reinventing wheels. Reinvent them rather than not 
use them!

What I would like to stress here is that the C standard, with all its 
new stuff like "generics", etc, did NOT seem to have discovered this wheels!

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#63747

FromKeith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org>
Date2015-06-21 13:20 -0700
Message-ID<lnwpyweru7.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org>
In reply to#63718
jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> writes:
> Le 21/06/2015 16:31, Reinhardt Behm a écrit :
>> This is the 9 billionth re-invention of the wheel.
> Yes. Wheels *ARE* useful.
>
> Do not be afraid of reinventing wheels. Reinvent them rather than not 
> use them!
>
> What I would like to stress here is that the C standard, with all its 
> new stuff like "generics", etc, did NOT seem to have discovered this wheels!

I don't think it's a matter of not discovering them.  Rather, adding
these features to the standard would impose a burden on implementers.
For example, there is no portable way to determine whether a given
pointer value is valid or not.  Some implementations might have a
non-portable way to do so; others might not.  I suspect the authors of
the standard just made a deliberate tradeoff.

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org  <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Working, but not speaking, for JetHead Development, Inc.
"We must do something.  This is something.  Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"

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#63752

Fromjacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>
Date2015-06-21 22:52 +0200
Message-ID<mm783t$o0t$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#63747
Le 21/06/2015 22:20, Keith Thompson a écrit :
> jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> writes:
>> Le 21/06/2015 16:31, Reinhardt Behm a écrit :
>>> This is the 9 billionth re-invention of the wheel.
>> Yes. Wheels *ARE* useful.
>>
>> Do not be afraid of reinventing wheels. Reinvent them rather than not
>> use them!
>>
>> What I would like to stress here is that the C standard, with all its
>> new stuff like "generics", etc, did NOT seem to have discovered this wheels!
>
> I don't think it's a matter of not discovering them.  Rather, adding
> these features to the standard would impose a burden on implementers.
> For example, there is no portable way to determine whether a given
> pointer value is valid or not.  Some implementations might have a
> non-portable way to do so; others might not.  I suspect the authors of
> the standard just made a deliberate tradeoff.
>


Excuse me but since we have

malloc(size);

I do not see how would it be so difficult to return the size of a memory 
block!!!

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#63759

FromKeith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org>
Date2015-06-21 14:43 -0700
Message-ID<lnoak8eo02.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org>
In reply to#63752
jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> writes:
> Le 21/06/2015 22:20, Keith Thompson a écrit :
>> jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> writes:
>>> Le 21/06/2015 16:31, Reinhardt Behm a écrit :
>>>> This is the 9 billionth re-invention of the wheel.
>>> Yes. Wheels *ARE* useful.
>>>
>>> Do not be afraid of reinventing wheels. Reinvent them rather than not
>>> use them!
>>>
>>> What I would like to stress here is that the C standard, with all its
>>> new stuff like "generics", etc, did NOT seem to have discovered this wheels!
>>
>> I don't think it's a matter of not discovering them.  Rather, adding
>> these features to the standard would impose a burden on implementers.
>> For example, there is no portable way to determine whether a given
>> pointer value is valid or not.  Some implementations might have a
>> non-portable way to do so; others might not.  I suspect the authors of
>> the standard just made a deliberate tradeoff.
>>
>
>
> Excuse me but since we have
>
> malloc(size);
>
> I do not see how would it be so difficult to return the size of a memory 
> block!!!

Implementations of malloc can typically allocate more memory than was
asked for in the call.  A conforming implementation needn't store the
requested size; it can store only the actual allocated size (since
there's currently no requirement to be able to retrieve either).  I can
imagine implementations where neither size is stored explicitly (say, if
all allocations are managed in multiple linked lists, one for each
size).

I'm not saying it would be a large burden, or even that I'd oppose
adding msize() to the standard, but it would be imposed on *all*
malloc() calls, whether the program calls msize() or not.

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org  <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Working, but not speaking, for JetHead Development, Inc.
"We must do something.  This is something.  Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"

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#63761

FromJames Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net>
Date2015-06-21 17:50 -0400
Message-ID<mm7bhi$420$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#63759
On 06/21/2015 05:43 PM, Keith Thompson wrote:
> jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> writes:
>> Le 21/06/2015 22:20, Keith Thompson a écrit :
>>> jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> writes:
>>>> Le 21/06/2015 16:31, Reinhardt Behm a écrit :
>>>>> This is the 9 billionth re-invention of the wheel.
>>>> Yes. Wheels *ARE* useful.
>>>>
>>>> Do not be afraid of reinventing wheels. Reinvent them rather than not
>>>> use them!
>>>>
>>>> What I would like to stress here is that the C standard, with all its
>>>> new stuff like "generics", etc, did NOT seem to have discovered this wheels!
>>>
>>> I don't think it's a matter of not discovering them.  Rather, adding
>>> these features to the standard would impose a burden on implementers.
>>> For example, there is no portable way to determine whether a given
>>> pointer value is valid or not.  Some implementations might have a
>>> non-portable way to do so; others might not.  I suspect the authors of
>>> the standard just made a deliberate tradeoff.
>>>
>>
>>
>> Excuse me but since we have
>>
>> malloc(size);
>>
>> I do not see how would it be so difficult to return the size of a memory 
>> block!!!
> 
> Implementations of malloc can typically allocate more memory than was
> asked for in the call.  A conforming implementation needn't store the
> requested size; it can store only the actual allocated size (since
> there's currently no requirement to be able to retrieve either).

That shouldn't be a problem - it's the actual allocated size that is
usually desired when people ask for such a feature.

> I can
> imagine implementations where neither size is stored explicitly (say, if
> all allocations are managed in multiple linked lists, one for each
> size).

If it can find the allocation, for the purposes of free()ing it, it
should be able to determine the allocated size - otherwise how would it
know how much space to free?
-- 
James Kuyper

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#63763

Fromjacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>
Date2015-06-22 00:21 +0200
Message-ID<mm7db6$dom$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#63761
Le 21/06/2015 23:50, James Kuyper a écrit :
> hat shouldn't be a problem - it's the actual allocated size that is
> usually desired when people ask for such a feature.

As I said elsewhere, the standard could just say:

The value may be adjusted by the implementation and not necessarily be 
the original requested size.

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#63766

FromJames Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net>
Date2015-06-21 18:39 -0400
Message-ID<mm7ec6$h77$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#63763
On 06/21/2015 06:21 PM, jacobnavia wrote:
> Le 21/06/2015 23:50, James Kuyper a écrit :
>> hat shouldn't be a problem - it's the actual allocated size that is
>> usually desired when people ask for such a feature.
> 
> As I said elsewhere, the standard could just say:
> 
> The value may be adjusted by the implementation and not necessarily be 
> the original requested size.

I think is should say "increased" rather than "adjusted". I'm not
suggesting that this would change the actual meaning - the only possible
way it could be adjusted is upward. I just think it's clearer to be more
specific.
-- 
James Kuyper

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#63768

Fromjacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr>
Date2015-06-22 00:44 +0200
Message-ID<mm7elv$i2r$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#63766
Le 22/06/2015 00:39, James Kuyper a écrit :
> I think is should say "increased" rather than "adjusted".

You are right, it can only be increased, so it is better to say so.

A standard function msize would make life easier for programmers trying 
to avoid buffer overflows. Besides it could save many extra parameters 
to functions since if you know it is a malloced block you can get the 
size at any moment.

Imagine then how easy would be to check for buffer overflows!

We are stuck with the memory allocation schema of the last century.

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#63770

FromMalcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com>
Date2015-06-21 16:00 -0700
Message-ID<864e6e2c-5cc0-4c1e-985a-4513ef2ebb01@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#63768
On Sunday, June 21, 2015 at 11:44:39 PM UTC+1, jacobnavia wrote:
> 
> We are stuck with the memory allocation schema of the last century.
>
The problems of automatically freeing expired items completely
dominates some languages, and turns them into a mess, particularly
when you've got facilities for marking an object as "retained"
for passing it on to a module written in another language, or
as "freed" if you need to destroy it before it goes out of scope 
for efficiency reasons.
Any fix would be  blessing. But experience has shown that it's a
hard thing to get right. The C method is reasonable, but a weakness
is that there's no way of saying which pointer holds the "master"
copy of the memory.

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#63867

Fromraltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos)
Date2015-06-22 21:03 +0000
Message-ID<55887349.15301328@news.xs4all.nl>
In reply to#63768
jacobnavia <jacob@jacob.remcomp.fr> wrote:

> Le 22/06/2015 00:39, James Kuyper a écrit :
> > I think is should say "increased" rather than "adjusted".
> 
> You are right, it can only be increased, so it is better to say so.
> 
> A standard function msize would make life easier for programmers trying 
> to avoid buffer overflows.

This is the most sensible thing you've said in this thread, and it _is_
important. If this were a tool which could make bad programmers avoid
buffer overflows, it would be a very good thing indeed, and you are
quite correct to want it. Unfortunately, I fear you overestimate the
average bad programmer; the kind who fail to check whether malloc()
succeeded, and who assume a default memory size to their functions, are
the very same who will also fail to call msize(). Sad - and I'd be on
your side if it weren't true - but it _is_ true.

> Besides it could save many extra parameters to functions since if you
> know it is a malloced block you can get the size at any moment.

_If_, is the operant word. What happens if you don't know that? A
user-library function can't always know that, and may well want to.
Take, for example, a function to add a new node to a tree, with the
pointer pointing at the payload. If the existing payload was
malloc()'ed, all is well. But what if it's a declared object? What if
it's a string literal? Do we expect msize() to know the sizes of those
as well? If so, it's a headache to implement. If not, it's a headache to
write the function that calls it on pointers of unknown provenance.
Either way, msize() _seems_ the solution, but is in fact a red herring.

Don't get me wrong, I don't think msize() is useless /per se/. But
neither do I believe it's the panacea you make it out to be.

> We are stuck with the memory allocation schema of the last century.

...and you drop into the morass of attempted sarcasm again. You are no
good at that, and it's time you learned that lesson. For one, it would
help you get your message across more acceptably to people who, face it,
have decades more experience at C programming _and_ English-language
sarcasm than you do.

If you want to get out of a "last century" allocation scheme and into a
next-century one, adding a piddly little msize() function is risible.
What you need to do is get rid of malloc() altogether, skip even you
beloved C++'s new/destroy (which, after all, has its own 21st century
problems all of its own, rather more convoluted and _definitely_ more
MIPS-costly than malloc()/free()), and go straight to automagic memory
allocation where you can just copy one constant string to another
declared object and one array of structures to another dynamically
allocated area, and trust that it all goes away when it goes out of
scope.
Which many people have had a shot at, and nobody has yet hit.

Richard

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#63874

FromRobert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com>
Date2015-06-22 18:47 -0500
Message-ID<5c7hoahdkbv3cvbfpsidc05u80rraj1cro@4ax.com>
In reply to#63867
On Mon, 22 Jun 2015 21:03:28 GMT, raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos)
wrote:

>If you want to get out of a "last century" allocation scheme and into a
>next-century one, adding a piddly little msize() function is risible.
>What you need to do is get rid of malloc() altogether, skip even you
>beloved C++'s new/destroy (which, after all, has its own 21st century
>problems all of its own, rather more convoluted and _definitely_ more
>MIPS-costly than malloc()/free()), (...)


Why would new/delete be more expensive than malloc/free?  Certainly if
the ctors and dtors actually do something, they may be, but if you
have ctors and dtors doing something, you'd probably be coding
something similar after/before the malloc/free anyway.  On most
platforms the *memory* allocation actually goes through the same code
for both malloc/free and new/delete (it doesn't have to, of course).

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#63886

FromMalcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com>
Date2015-06-23 00:50 -0700
Message-ID<6ce25ac1-fcd4-4756-a091-824b0df91505@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#63874
On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 12:47:43 AM UTC+1, robert...@yahoo.com wrote:
> 
> Why would new/delete be more expensive than malloc/free?  Certainly if
> the ctors and dtors actually do something, they may be, but if you
> have ctors and dtors doing something, you'd probably be coding
> something similar after/before the malloc/free anyway.  On most
> platforms the *memory* allocation actually goes through the same code
> for both malloc/free and new/delete (it doesn't have to, of course).
>
Yes, C++ tends to be less efficient that C because it's harder and
less convenient for the human programmer to use, not because the
underlying mechanisms are inherently less efficient than C. A
ctor / dtor pair written in C is obviously executing code, the
calling programmer is fully aware. So he tends to avoid unnecessary
calls. A C++ programmer can easily call a constructor on an empty
object, call another one to construct a valid object, and then call
a copy constructor to assign to the empty object, soaking up lots of
cycles, where a C programmer would have assigned to a null pointer,
called the unavoidable valid constructor, and then assigned the 
temporary to the null.
 

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#63889

FromIan Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com>
Date2015-06-23 20:19 +1200
Message-ID<cusj56Fmh53U1@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#63886
Malcolm McLean wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 12:47:43 AM UTC+1, robert...@yahoo.com wrote:
>>
>> Why would new/delete be more expensive than malloc/free?  Certainly if
>> the ctors and dtors actually do something, they may be, but if you
>> have ctors and dtors doing something, you'd probably be coding
>> something similar after/before the malloc/free anyway.  On most
>> platforms the *memory* allocation actually goes through the same code
>> for both malloc/free and new/delete (it doesn't have to, of course).
>>
> Yes, C++ tends to be less efficient that C because it's harder and
> less convenient for the human programmer to use, not because the
> underlying mechanisms are inherently less efficient than C. A
> ctor / dtor pair written in C is obviously executing code, the
> calling programmer is fully aware. So he tends to avoid unnecessary
> calls.

That's pretty nonsensical, isn't it?

If code needs to run, how can the programmer avoid running it?

> A C++ programmer can easily call a constructor on an empty
> object, call another one to construct a valid object, and then call
> a copy constructor to assign to the empty object, soaking up lots of
> cycles, where a C programmer would have assigned to a null pointer,
> called the unavoidable valid constructor, and then assigned the
> temporary to the null.

I don't really get that bit either.  If you are saying what I think you 
are, you are describing a sequence of events the compiler would optimise 
away.

-- 
Ian Collins

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#63893

FromMalcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com>
Date2015-06-23 01:46 -0700
Message-ID<e24af939-ff75-42a1-a633-a0dea7633a05@googlegroups.com>
In reply to#63889
On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 9:19:58 AM UTC+1, Ian Collins wrote:
>
> > Yes, C++ tends to be less efficient that C because it's harder and
> > less convenient for the human programmer to use, not because the
> > underlying mechanisms are inherently less efficient than C. A
> > ctor / dtor pair written in C is obviously executing code, the
> > calling programmer is fully aware. So he tends to avoid unnecessary
> > calls.
> 
> That's pretty nonsensical, isn't it?
> 
> If code needs to run, how can the programmer avoid running it?
> 
> > A C++ programmer can easily call a constructor on an empty
> > object, call another one to construct a valid object, and then call
> > a copy constructor to assign to the empty object, soaking up lots of
> > cycles, where a C programmer would have assigned to a null pointer,
> > called the unavoidable valid constructor, and then assigned the
> > temporary to the null.
> 
> I don't really get that bit either.  If you are saying what I think you 
> are, you are describing a sequence of events the compiler would optimise 
> away.
> 
Consider this

BigObject obj;  /* we've called the default constructor, it's an empty or null object */

BigObject temp( data); /* real constructor */

if(temp.issuitable())   /* if it passes certain tests, we want obj to be that object */
   obj = temp;


The same in C

BIGOBJECT *obj = 0;
BIGOBJECT *temp = 0;

temp = bigobject(data):
if(bigobject_issuitable(temp))
{
   obj = temp;
   temp = 0;
}

They're not exactly equivalent, but they're the obvious way to write the code. However the 
C++ may or may not be doing a lot of unnecessary work, you can't tell by looking
at the source itself. But the copy is likely expensive.
You can avoid it by making obj a pointer and calling new, however the code then looks
a mess if the normal code convention is to create objects on the stack.

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#63896

FromIan Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com>
Date2015-06-23 21:07 +1200
Message-ID<cusluqFmh53U2@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#63893
Malcolm McLean wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 23, 2015 at 9:19:58 AM UTC+1, Ian Collins wrote:
>>
>>> Yes, C++ tends to be less efficient that C because it's harder and
>>> less convenient for the human programmer to use, not because the
>>> underlying mechanisms are inherently less efficient than C. A
>>> ctor / dtor pair written in C is obviously executing code, the
>>> calling programmer is fully aware. So he tends to avoid unnecessary
>>> calls.
>>
>> That's pretty nonsensical, isn't it?
>>
>> If code needs to run, how can the programmer avoid running it?
>>
>>> A C++ programmer can easily call a constructor on an empty
>>> object, call another one to construct a valid object, and then call
>>> a copy constructor to assign to the empty object, soaking up lots of
>>> cycles, where a C programmer would have assigned to a null pointer,
>>> called the unavoidable valid constructor, and then assigned the
>>> temporary to the null.
>>
>> I don't really get that bit either.  If you are saying what I think you
>> are, you are describing a sequence of events the compiler would optimise
>> away.
>>
> Consider this
>
> BigObject obj;  /* we've called the default constructor, it's an empty or null object */
>
> BigObject temp( data); /* real constructor */
>
> if(temp.issuitable())   /* if it passes certain tests, we want obj to be that object */
>     obj = temp;
>
>
> The same in C
>
> BIGOBJECT *obj = 0;
> BIGOBJECT *temp = 0;
>
> temp = bigobject(data):
> if(bigobject_issuitable(temp))
> {
>     obj = temp;
>     temp = 0;
> }
>
> They're not exactly equivalent, but they're the obvious way to write the code.

Or it could be a dangerous way if the C object isn't safe to copy (say 
it contains a pointer to some allocated memory).  Then there's the 
question of who frees the object now pointed to be both temp and obj.

> However the
> C++ may or may not be doing a lot of unnecessary work, you can't tell by looking
> at the source itself. But the copy is likely expensive.

In modern C++, the copy could be a move assignment, which does very 
little work.

> You can avoid it by making obj a pointer and calling new, however the code then looks
> a mess if the normal code convention is to create objects on the stack.

But your example creates two objects in C++ and one in C.  So it's bound 
to be doing more work, isn't it?  It also begs the question why create 
temp and assign it to obj?

-- 
Ian Collins

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#63897

FromRichard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk>
Date2015-06-23 10:22 +0100
Message-ID<mmb8em$h5t$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#63896
On 23/06/15 10:07, Ian Collins wrote:

<snip>

> But your example creates two objects in C++ and one in C.  So it's bound
> to be doing more work, isn't it?  It also begs the question why create
> temp and assign it to obj?

<AOL>I was going to make the same point</AOL>, but I see you've made it 
for me. So, instead, I will simply take issue with the phrasing. It does 
not /beg/ the question. It /raises/ the question.

http://begthequestion.info/ explains the matter very simply, and from 
the nature of the domain name we can perhaps infer that the author of 
that site may have done a little basic research into the matter. :-)

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#63898

FromIan Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com>
Date2015-06-23 21:27 +1200
Message-ID<cusn4gFmh53U3@mid.individual.net>
In reply to#63897
Richard Heathfield wrote:
> On 23/06/15 10:07, Ian Collins wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> But your example creates two objects in C++ and one in C.  So it's bound
>> to be doing more work, isn't it?  It also begs the question why create
>> temp and assign it to obj?
>
> <AOL>I was going to make the same point</AOL>, but I see you've made it
> for me. So, instead, I will simply take issue with the phrasing. It does
> not /beg/ the question. It /raises/ the question.
>
> http://begthequestion.info/ explains the matter very simply, and from
> the nature of the domain name we can perhaps infer that the author of
> that site may have done a little basic research into the matter. :-)

Thank you for the educational link Richard!

-- 
Ian Collins

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#63954

FromKeith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org>
Date2015-06-23 08:30 -0700
Message-ID<lnoak6a1ch.fsf@nuthaus.mib.org>
In reply to#63897
Richard Heathfield <rjh@cpax.org.uk> writes:
> On 23/06/15 10:07, Ian Collins wrote:
>
> <snip>
>
>> But your example creates two objects in C++ and one in C.  So it's bound
>> to be doing more work, isn't it?  It also begs the question why create
>> temp and assign it to obj?
>
> <AOL>I was going to make the same point</AOL>, but I see you've made it 
> for me. So, instead, I will simply take issue with the phrasing. It does 
> not /beg/ the question. It /raises/ the question.
>
> http://begthequestion.info/ explains the matter very simply, and from 
> the nature of the domain name we can perhaps infer that the author of 
> that site may have done a little basic research into the matter. :-)

Yes -- and we have this problem because "beg the question" is a
poor and misleading translation of the Latin "petitio principii".

The English phrase "beg the question", in the absence of the original
Latin, would be a halfway reasonable way to say "raise the question"
-- though "raise the question" would be a clearer way to express it.

To beg the question is to assume the conclusion -- and "assume the
conclusion" is a clearer way to say that.

Using the phrase "beg the question" to mean "raise the question"
is verbal shorthand for "please correct my usage and tell me a
little about Latin and Aristotle", though it's not usually intended
that way.

Using the phrase "beg the question" to mean "assume the conclusion"
is verbal shorthand for "I'm educated, and I'm hoping for an
opportunity to tell you a little about Latin and Aristotle".
(Not that that's a bad thing.)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Begging_the_question

It's sort of like "ANSI C".  We know what it *really* means in
pedanticallyl correct usage (the version of C endorsed by the
American National Standards Institute, currently the 2011 standard),
and we know what most people use it to mean (C89, the only version
of the C standard that was *originally* published by ANSI).  We can
avoid confusion by using less ambiguous terms (ISO C, C89, C90,
C95, C99, C11).

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org  <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Working, but not speaking, for JetHead Development, Inc.
"We must do something.  This is something.  Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"

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