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Groups > comp.lang.c > #53464 > unrolled thread

the language

Started byRosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid>
First post2014-11-26 21:54 +0100
Last post2014-12-19 02:34 +0100
Articles 20 on this page of 177 — 31 participants

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  the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-26 21:54 +0100
    Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-26 21:56 +0100
      Re: the language John Bode <jfbode1029@gmail.com> - 2014-11-26 13:45 -0800
        Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-28 11:52 +0100
        Re: the language "Bill Cunningham" <nospam@nspam.invalid> - 2014-12-01 23:25 -0500
        Re: the language "Bill Cunningham" <nospam@nspam.invalid> - 2014-12-02 00:56 -0500
          Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-04 14:52 +0100
            Re: the language "Osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2014-12-04 08:07 -0600
              Re: the language Geoff <geoff@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-04 10:20 -0800
    Re: the language Mark Storkamp <mstorkamp@yahoo.com> - 2014-11-26 15:11 -0600
      Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-28 12:16 +0100
        Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-28 12:18 +0100
    Re: the language John Bode <jfbode1029@gmail.com> - 2014-11-26 13:12 -0800
      Re: the language Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-11-27 00:37 +0000
      Re: the language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-11-27 01:13 +0000
    Re: the language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2014-11-26 22:45 +0000
      Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-27 07:41 +0100
    Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-27 08:12 +0100
      Re: the language Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com> - 2014-11-27 01:43 -0600
        Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-28 11:56 +0100
          Re: the language Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com> - 2014-11-28 09:08 -0600
            Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-28 20:58 +0100
              Re: the language Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com> - 2014-11-28 19:22 -0600
                Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-02 02:59 +0100
                  Re: the language Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-12-02 02:53 +0000
                    Re: the language Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2014-12-01 21:25 -0600
                      Re: the language Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-12-02 06:22 +0000
    Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-11-27 08:37 +0000
      Re: the language Reinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com> - 2014-11-27 16:44 +0800
        Re: the language gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2014-11-27 15:35 +0000
          Re: the language Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-11-27 11:58 -0500
            Re: the language jt@toerring.de (Jens Thoms Toerring) - 2014-11-27 22:44 +0000
              Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-28 09:52 +0100
              Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-11-28 12:53 -0800
            Re: the language Thomas Jahns <jahns@idontlikespam.dkrz.de> - 2014-11-28 10:07 +0100
              Re: the language Thomas Jahns <jahns@idontlikespam.dkrz.de> - 2014-11-28 14:57 +0100
              Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-11-28 13:09 -0800
      Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-28 12:01 +0100
        Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-11-28 14:46 +0000
      Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-11-28 13:16 -0800
        Re: the language gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2014-11-28 22:09 +0000
          Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-01 03:40 -0800
        Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-11-28 14:42 -0800
          Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-01 03:22 -0800
        Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-11-28 23:09 +0000
          Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-11-28 16:14 -0800
            Re: the language BartC <bc@freeuk.com> - 2014-11-29 01:42 +0000
            Re: the language Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-11-29 01:42 +0000
              Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-11-29 04:03 -0800
            Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-01 00:55 -0800
              Re: the language glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-02 05:42 +0000
          Re: the language Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-11-28 19:25 -0500
          Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-01 03:21 -0800
            Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-01 14:02 +0000
              Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-05 10:18 -0800
                Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-07 08:25 +0000
                  Re: the language Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2014-12-07 10:44 -0800
                    Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-07 19:17 +0000
                      Re: the language Öö Tiib <ootiib@hot.ee> - 2014-12-07 15:48 -0800
                        Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-08 05:45 +0000
                        Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-08 03:27 -0800
                  Re: the language Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-12-08 06:00 +0000
                    Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-08 06:17 +0000
                      Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-08 03:37 -0800
                        Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-08 12:53 +0000
                  Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-16 04:21 -0800
                    Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-16 12:43 +0000
                      Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-16 14:46 -0800
                        Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-17 00:23 +0000
                        Re: the language JohnF <john@please.see.sig.for.email.com> - 2014-12-17 07:01 +0000
                          Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-17 07:22 +0000
                            Re: the language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-17 11:56 +0000
                              Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-17 05:43 -0800
                                Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-18 18:30 +0100
                                  Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-18 18:41 +0100
                              Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-17 14:34 +0000
                                Re: the language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-18 02:15 +0000
                                  Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-17 22:31 -0500
                                    Re: the language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-18 17:19 +0000
                                  Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-18 07:52 +0000
                                    Re: the language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-18 17:21 +0000
                                      Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-18 18:15 +0000
                                        Re: the language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-19 01:20 +0000
                                          Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 07:48 +0000
                                            Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-19 07:40 -0500
                                              Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 12:54 +0000
                                                Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-19 09:54 -0500
                                                  Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 15:19 +0000
                                                    Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-19 11:00 -0500
                                                      Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 16:13 +0000
                                                        Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-19 11:27 -0500
                                                          Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 16:45 +0000
                                                            Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-19 13:48 -0500
                                                              Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 19:10 +0000
                                                            Re: the language Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com> - 2014-12-19 21:17 -0600
                                                            Re: the language Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com> - 2014-12-19 21:32 -0600
                                            Re: the language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-19 16:49 +0000
                                              Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 17:00 +0000
                                                Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-19 13:57 -0500
                                                  Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-19 14:31 -0800
                                                Re: the language Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2014-12-19 20:29 +0000
                                                  Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 20:36 +0000
                          Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-17 07:18 -0800
                            Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-17 15:45 +0000
                              Re: the language glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-17 16:50 +0000
                                Re: the language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2014-12-17 17:24 +0000
                                Re: the language Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2014-12-18 02:07 -0600
                                  Re: the language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2014-12-18 12:04 +0000
                                    Re: the language Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-12-18 08:06 -0500
                                      Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-18 08:30 -0500
                                        Re: the language Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-12-19 00:11 -0500
                                          Re: the language glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-19 07:00 +0000
                                          Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-19 08:43 -0800
                                            Re: the language Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-12-19 23:29 -0500
                                              Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-20 00:37 -0800
                                                Re: the language gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2014-12-20 08:45 +0000
                                                Re: the language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2014-12-20 09:45 +0000
                                                  Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-20 03:17 -0800
                                      Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-18 06:09 -0800
                                        Re: the language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2014-12-18 14:30 +0000
                                      Re: the language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2014-12-18 14:23 +0000
                                      Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-18 08:18 -0800
                                    Re: the language Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2014-12-20 12:22 -0500
                                      Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2014-12-20 13:36 -0500
                                        Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-20 11:43 -0800
                                      Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-20 11:37 -0800
                                        Re: the language glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-20 20:10 +0000
                                        Re: the language Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2014-12-21 15:02 -0600
                                          Re: the language Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2014-12-21 22:02 +0000
                                            Re: the language Stephen Sprunk <stephen@sprunk.org> - 2014-12-21 23:49 -0600
                                      Re: the language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2014-12-21 17:45 +0000
                                  Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-18 10:29 -0800
                                    Re: the language Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2014-12-20 05:29 -0600
                                      Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-20 11:32 -0800
                                        Re: the language Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2014-12-21 15:23 -0600
                                          Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-22 23:39 -0800
                                      Re: the language glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-20 20:22 +0000
                              Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-18 10:24 -0800
                                Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-18 18:36 +0000
                                  Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-19 09:24 -0800
                                    Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 17:53 +0000
                                      Re: the language Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2014-12-20 11:48 -0800
                              Re: the language JohnF <john@please.see.sig.for.email.com> - 2014-12-19 02:20 +0000
                                Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 08:31 +0000
                                  Re: the language JohnF <john@please.see.sig.for.email.com> - 2014-12-19 09:31 +0000
                                    Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-19 10:10 +0000
                                    Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-19 07:08 -0800
                                      Re: the language JohnF <john@please.see.sig.for.email.com> - 2014-12-20 06:39 +0000
                                        Re: the language John Forkosh <forkosh@panix.com> - 2014-12-20 07:32 +0000
                                    Re: the language Greg Martin <greg.at.softsprocket@dot.com> - 2015-01-04 17:02 +0000
                                      Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-01-04 12:40 -0500
                                        Re: the language Greg Martin <greg.at.softsprocket@dot.com> - 2015-01-04 18:02 +0000
                                          Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-01-05 09:47 -0500
                                            Re: the language Greg Martin <greg.at.softsprocket@dot.com> - 2015-01-05 15:14 +0000
                                              Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-01-05 08:42 -0800
                                                Re: the language glen herrmannsfeldt <gah@ugcs.caltech.edu> - 2015-01-06 00:14 +0000
                                              Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-01-05 13:19 -0500
                                        Re: the language Richard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org> - 2015-01-04 15:59 -0500
                                          Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2015-01-04 14:30 -0800
                                          Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2015-01-04 15:44 -0800
                                          Re: the language James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2015-01-05 13:36 -0500
    Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-11-28 12:07 +0100
    Re: the language "ocq (an evil corporate man)" <ocq@maili.ng> - 2014-12-02 23:16 +0100
      Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-03 02:23 -0800
        Re: the language "ocq (an evil corporate man)" <ocq@maili.ng> - 2014-12-03 15:55 +0100
        Re: the language Nobody <nobody@nowhere.invalid> - 2014-12-03 15:42 +0000
          Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-04 04:49 -0800
            Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-04 09:07 -0800
              Re: the language Malcolm McLean <malcolm.mclean5@btinternet.com> - 2014-12-04 10:08 -0800
                Re: the language Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2014-12-04 11:49 -0800
                  Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-05 12:32 +0100
            Re: the language raltbos@xs4all.nl (Richard Bos) - 2014-12-04 22:17 +0000
    Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-18 18:17 +0100
      Re: the language Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> - 2014-12-18 18:12 +0000
        Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-18 23:15 +0100
          Re: the language Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> - 2014-12-18 23:50 +0100
      Re: the language "ocq (an evil corporate man)" <ocq@maili.ng> - 2014-12-19 02:34 +0100

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#53586

FromMorris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com>
Date2014-11-28 09:08 -0600
Message-ID<m5a364$vac$1@speranza.aioe.org>
In reply to#53566
On 11/28/14 4:56 AM, Rosario193 wrote:
> On Thu, 27 Nov 2014 01:43:59 -0600, Morris Dovey wrote:
>
>> On 11/27/14 1:12 AM, Rosario193 wrote:
>>
>>> than it seems nobody think about multi instruction for line
>>> and minimize key words of the language for make fit all the routine in
>>> one screen of PC and artistic apparence of routine self explained
>>> what it does using indentation
>>
>> I think you can do all of this in C - but some applications will require
>> larger screens than others. :-)
>
> the routines that not fit in a 8'' tablet screen are not ok or to be
> only very few...

I’m just getting started and already I’m in trouble (8" tablet isn’t 
working for me - mind the wrap)...

#include <math.h>
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
/* Physical Constants																			*/
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
#define Vm 24.78959842						/* Molar Volume (L/mol) at 25˚C			*/
#define Na  6.0221E23						/* Avogadro Number (/mol)					*/
#define R   8.314462175						/* Ideal Gas Constant						*/
#define MI 25.4								/* Millimeters per inch						*/
#define ND  8.908								/* Density of Nickel (g/cc)				*/
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate net reaction chamber volume													*/
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
double volume(double nm)
{	double nv = nm / ND;						/* Nickle volume								*/

	double ch = 3.250 * MI;					/* Height of reaction chamber				*/
	double cd = 0.875 * MI;					/* Diameter or reaction chamber			*/
	double cr = cd / 2;						/* radius of reaction chamber				*/
	double cv = cr * cr * M_PI * ch;		/* Volume of reaction chamber				*/

	double hh = 3.000 * MI;					/* Height of heater tube					*/
	double hd = 0.375 * MI;					/* Diameter of heater tube					*/
	double hr = hd / 2;						/* Radius of heater tube					*/
	double hv = hr * hr * M_PI * hh;		/* Volume taken by heater tube			*/

	return cv - hv - nv;						/* Net reaction chamber volume			*/
}
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate molecules of hydrogen as Na * (n = PV/RT)								*/
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
double molecules(double p,double v,double t)
{	double n = (p * v) / (R * t);
	return Na * n;
}
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate mean distance between molecules as cube root of 
volume/molecule	*/
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
double distance(double nm,double p,double v,double t)
{	return pow(volume(nm)/molecules(p,v,t),1.0/3.0);
}
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate approximation of energy from T = E / m  as  E = m * T				*/
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
double energy(double m,double t)
{	return m * t;
}
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
/* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic_energy
/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
double velocity(double e,double m)
{	return sqrt(2 * E / m);
}

:-)

-- 
Morris Dovey
http://www.iedu.com/Solar/

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#53612

FromRosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid>
Date2014-11-28 20:58 +0100
Message-ID<odkh7adlr9t08ie16v7n87lhclhuvcbs44@4ax.com>
In reply to#53586
On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 09:08:55 -0600, Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com>
wrote:

>On 11/28/14 4:56 AM, Rosario193 wrote:
>> On Thu, 27 Nov 2014 01:43:59 -0600, Morris Dovey wrote:
>>
>>> On 11/27/14 1:12 AM, Rosario193 wrote:
>>>
>>>> than it seems nobody think about multi instruction for line
>>>> and minimize key words of the language for make fit all the routine in
>>>> one screen of PC and artistic apparence of routine self explained
>>>> what it does using indentation
>>>
>>> I think you can do all of this in C - but some applications will require
>>> larger screens than others. :-)
>>
>> the routines that not fit in a 8'' tablet screen are not ok or to be
>> only very few...
>
>I’m just getting started and already I’m in trouble (8" tablet isn’t 
>working for me - mind the wrap)...
>
>#include <math.h>
>/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
>/* Physical Constants																			*/
>/*----------------------------------------------------------------------------*/
>#define Vm 24.78959842						/* Molar Volume (L/mol) at 25?C			*/

i not would use tab... than one way for use the code is cut and paste
and if something going wrong with these long lines would be a
problem...

i not see any problem to make that code fit in a 5'' cell phone...

#include <math.h>

/*-------------------*/
/* Physical Constants*/
/*-------------------*/

/*-----------------------------------*
 * Vm = Molar Volume (L/mol) at 25?C *
 * Na = Avogadro Number (/mol)       *
 *  R = Ideal Gas Constant           *
 * MI = Millimeters per inch         *
 * ND = Density of Nickel (g/cc)     *
 *-----------------------------------*/

#define Vm 24.78959842
#define Na  6.0221E23
#define R   8.314462175
#define MI 25.4
#define ND  8.908

/*--------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate net reaction chamber volume*/
/*--------------------------------------*/
double volume(double nm)
{double nv= nm/ND;    /* Nickle volume               */
 double ch= 3.250*MI; /* Height of reaction chamber  */
 double cd= 0.875*MI; /* Diameter or reaction chamber*/
 double cr= cd/2 ;    /* radius of reaction chamber  */
 double cv= cr*cr*M_PI*ch;     /* Volume of reaction chamber  */
 double hh= 3.000*MI; /* Height of heater tube       */
 double hd= 0.375*MI; /* Diameter of heater tube     */
 double hr= hd/2;     /* Radius of heater tube       */
 double hv= hr*hr*M_PI*hh;     /* Volume taken by heater tube */
 return cv-hv-nv;     /* Net reaction chamber volume */
}

/*----------------------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate molecules of hydrogen as Na*(n= PV/RT)   */
/*----------------------------------------------------*/
double molecules(double p,double v,double t)
{double n=(p*v)/(R*t); return Na*n;}

/*------------------------------------------*
 * Calculate mean distance between          * 
 * molecules as cube root of volume/molecule*
 *------------------------------------------*/
double distance(double nm,double p,double v,double t)
{return pow(volume(nm)/molecules(p,v,t),1.0/3.0);}

/*-------------------------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate approximation of energy from T=E/m as E=m*T */
/*-------------------------------------------------------*/
double energy(double m,double t){return m * t;}

/*----------------------------------------------*/
/* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic_energy */
/*----------------------------------------------*/
double velocity(double  e,double  m){return sqrt( 2*E/m );}

i dont know if it is correct to use the letter E and e... because of
1.0e24 etc

if one use as double "f64" could be even more restrict...

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#53637

FromMorris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com>
Date2014-11-28 19:22 -0600
Message-ID<m5b750$472$1@speranza.aioe.org>
In reply to#53612
On 11/28/14 1:58 PM, Rosario193 wrote:
> On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 09:08:55 -0600, Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com>
> wrote:
>
>> On 11/28/14 4:56 AM, Rosario193 wrote:
>>> On Thu, 27 Nov 2014 01:43:59 -0600, Morris Dovey wrote:
>>>
>>>> On 11/27/14 1:12 AM, Rosario193 wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> than it seems nobody think about multi instruction for line
>>>>> and minimize key words of the language for make fit all the routine in
>>>>> one screen of PC and artistic apparence of routine self explained
>>>>> what it does using indentation
>>>>
>>>> I think you can do all of this in C - but some applications will require
>>>> larger screens than others. :-)
>>>
>>> the routines that not fit in a 8'' tablet screen are not ok or to be
>>> only very few...
>>
>> I’m just getting started and already I’m in trouble (8" tablet isn’t
>> working for me - mind the wrap)...

>
> i not would use tab... than one way for use the code is cut and paste
> and if something going wrong with these long lines would be a
> problem...

“Something” is nearly always programmer. I use the methods that have 
worked most reliably for me. Those may, or may not, be the same methods 
that work most reliably for you. If you don’t like tabs, then don’t use 
them. :-P

> i not see any problem to make that code fit in a 5'' cell phone...

I don’t have time to search through that compressed mess...
...and, in time, you too will have difficulty reading text on a 5" 
screen. I guarantee it. :-)

This code isn’t intended for cell phone or tablet. After test and debug 
it will be used to add predictive / heuristic capabilities in a new 
version of the project described at the link below – there is a link 
near the bottom of that page to images of some of the original C source.

-- 
Morris Dovey
http://www.iedu.com/Solar/Electricity/

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#53732

FromRosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid>
Date2014-12-02 02:59 +0100
Message-ID<r77q7apfstf1g7flonp2k42oo5293at438@4ax.com>
In reply to#53637
On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 19:22:40 -0600, Morris Dovey wrote:
>On 11/28/14 1:58 PM, Rosario193 wrote:
>> On Fri, 28 Nov 2014 09:08:55 -0600, Morris Dovey <mrdovey@iedu.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> On 11/28/14 4:56 AM, Rosario193 wrote:
>>>> On Thu, 27 Nov 2014 01:43:59 -0600, Morris Dovey wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> On 11/27/14 1:12 AM, Rosario193 wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> than it seems nobody think about multi instruction for line
>>>>>> and minimize key words of the language for make fit all the routine in
>>>>>> one screen of PC and artistic apparence of routine self explained
>>>>>> what it does using indentation
>>>>>
>>>>> I think you can do all of this in C - but some applications will require
>>>>> larger screens than others. :-)
>>>>
>>>> the routines that not fit in a 8'' tablet screen are not ok or to be
>>>> only very few...
>>>
>>> I’m just getting started and already I’m in trouble (8" tablet isn’t
>>> working for me - mind the wrap)...
>
>>
>> i not would use tab... than one way for use the code is cut and paste
>> and if something going wrong with these long lines would be a
>> problem...
>
>“Something” is nearly always programmer. I use the methods that have 
>worked most reliably for me. Those may, or may not, be the same methods 
>that work most reliably for you. If you don’t like tabs, then don’t use 
>them. :-P
>
>> i not see any problem to make that code fit in a 5'' cell phone...
>
>I don’t have time to search through that compressed mess...
>...and, in time, you too will have difficulty reading text on a 5" 
>screen. I guarantee it. :-)

>This code isn’t intended for cell phone or tablet. 

is not intended but it is possible read it in a tablet or in a phone
and think on it 

>After test and debug 
>it will be used to add predictive / heuristic capabilities in a new 
>version of the project described at the link below – there is a link 
>near the bottom of that page to images of some of the original C source.

it seems something about gas variables
i would write it so:

#include <math.h>

/*-------------------*/
/* Physical Constants*/
/*-------------------*/

/*-----------------------------------*
 * Vm = Molar Volume (L/mol) at 25?C *
 * Na = Avogadro Number (/mol)       *
 *  R = Ideal Gas Constant           *
 * MI = Millimeters per inch         *
 * ND = Density of Nickel (g/cc)     *
 *-----------------------------------*/

#define Vm 24.78959842
#define Na  6.0221E23
#define R   8.314462175
#define MI 25.4
#define ND  8.908
#define f64 double

/*--------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate net reaction chamber volume*/
/*--------------------------------------*/
f64 volume(f64 nm)
{f64  nv= nm/ND;    /* Nickle volume               */
 f64  ch= 3.250*MI; /* Height of reaction chamber  */
 f64  cd= 0.875*MI; /* Diameter or reaction chamber*/
 f64  cr= cd/2 ;    /* radius of reaction chamber  */
 f64  cv= cr*cr*M_PI*ch;     /* Volume of reaction chamber  */
 f64  hh= 3.000*MI; /* Height of heater tube       */
 f64  hd= 0.375*MI; /* Diameter of heater tube     */
 f64  hr= hd/2;     /* Radius of heater tube       */
 f64  hv= hr*hr*M_PI*hh;     /* Volume taken by heater tube */
 return cv-hv-nv;     /* Net reaction chamber volume */
}

/*----------------------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate molecules of hydrogen as Na*(n= PV/RT)   */
/*----------------------------------------------------*/
f64 molecules(f64 p,f64 v,f64 t)
{f64 n=(p*v)/(R*t); return Na*n;}

/*------------------------------------------*
 * Calculate mean distance between          * 
 * molecules as cube root of volume/molecule*
 *------------------------------------------*/
f64 distance(f64 nm, f64 p, f64 v, f64 t)
{return pow(volume(nm)/molecules(p,v,t),1.0/3.0);}

/*-------------------------------------------------------*/
/* Calculate approximation of energy from T=E/m as E=m*T */
/*-------------------------------------------------------*/
f64 energy(f64 m, f64 t){return m * t;}

/*----------------------------------------------*/
/* https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kinetic_energy */
/*----------------------------------------------*/
f64 velocity(f64  e, f64  m){return sqrt( 2*e/m );}

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#53733

FromKaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com>
Date2014-12-02 02:53 +0000
Message-ID<20141201184558.179@kylheku.com>
In reply to#53732
On 2014-12-02, Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> wrote:
> #define f64 double

Failed code review; we got typedef in the 1890's, so it's okay to use it.

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#53734

FromLes Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com>
Date2014-12-01 21:25 -0600
Message-ID<m5jbdf$8cm$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#53733
Kaz Kylheku wrote:
> On 2014-12-02, Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>> #define f64 double
>
> Failed code review; we got typedef in the 1890's, so it's okay to use it.
>

Epic typo! It only feels like that long ago.  McKinley for President!

-- 
Les Cargill

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#53738

FromKaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com>
Date2014-12-02 06:22 +0000
Message-ID<20141201221942.571@kylheku.com>
In reply to#53734
On 2014-12-02, Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> wrote:
> Kaz Kylheku wrote:
>> On 2014-12-02, Rosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>> #define f64 double
>>
>> Failed code review; we got typedef in the 1890's, so it's okay to use it.
>>
>
> Epic typo! It only feels like that long ago.  McKinley for President!

That is not a typo for 1980, because of course, typedef is older than 1980; it
is described in K&R1, 1978.

I really wanted 1800's, and went through several edits, in which I ascribed the
invention of typedef to some historic personalities from that era. That was
too elaborate.

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#53498

FromRichard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid>
Date2014-11-27 08:37 +0000
Message-ID<kpBdw.5607$n97.3994@fx05.am4>
In reply to#53464
Rosario193 wrote:

> one language for program has to have no undefinite behaviour
> and has to be simple...the one that program has to think to the
> problem one want resolve more than language laws etc

It turns out to be surprisingly difficult to design a language that has both 
of the following characteristics:

(a) has no undefined behaviour;
(b) is sufficiently powerful to be interesting.

Imagine a one-bit machine (by which I mean the address bus is one bit wide, 
giving two addressable locations, each one bit wide), with a single register 
that is automatically zeroed when the program is loaded, and which has an 
LED attached to it so that you can see the state of the register, OFF or ON. 
Here is an assembly language for that machine:

Opcode 0: HALT - stop the program
Opcode 1: FLIP - toggle the register bit.

This machine only has four possible programs:

00 - HALT HALT
01 - HALT FLIP
10 - FLIP HALT
11 - FLIP FLIP

The first three are all right, but what about the fourth? It's the only 
interesting program out of the four of them, and the reason it's interesting 
is that it doesn't have a HALT instruction, so the question arises of what 
happens when it doesn't stop. Does it stop anyway? Does it wrap around? At 
present, this is undefined. But you could define it, of course, and then 
carefully make sure that the hardware does in fact behave as you define it 
to behave.

It's trivial to write a VM to support the above machine. I suggest you try 
it as an exercise. Make sure that the assembly language does not allow the 
possibility of undefined behaviour. Then write a high level language that 
will save you from having to write in assembly language, and make sure that 
/that/ language has no undefined behaviour.

Since the language has no need to deal with data, iteration, selection, or 
functional decomposition, it shouldn't be that difficult.

One-bit machines are interesting only in the same way that 1x1 Sudoku is 
interesting. So the next stage is to increase the machine's power. Design a 
machine with 2-bit bytes, a 2-bit data bus and address bus, and an assembly 
language consisting of four single-byte (i.e. two-bit) instructions. What 
they are is up to you, but remember the goal: no undefined behaviour.

Then write the assembler, and then a high-level language, again making it 
impossible for the behaviour to be undefined. You will find that this is 
more difficult.

By three bits, you have eight instructions, so you can afford a primitive 
jump command. Now things start to get more difficult. What happens if the 
program doesn't quite fill memory, and the program flow jumps outside the 
memory occupied by the program into some other zone. Your language must 
define what happens in this circumstance. Otherwise, it has undefined 
behaviour.

Keep playing this game, with ever-wider bytes, until you realise just how 
impossible a task it is. It's like playing tennis and rugby at the same time 
- you can only keep it up for so long before you start losing at least one 
of the games. There comes a point where you either give up the game of 
making the computer more powerful/useful, or give up the game of keeping 
every possible behaviour well-defined.

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#53500

FromReinhardt Behm <rbehm@hushmail.com>
Date2014-11-27 16:44 +0800
Message-ID<m56o8r$g27$1@dont-email.me>
In reply to#53498
Richard Heathfield wrote:

> Rosario193 wrote:
> 
>> one language for program has to have no undefinite behaviour
>> and has to be simple...the one that program has to think to the
>> problem one want resolve more than language laws etc
> 
> It turns out to be surprisingly difficult to design a language that has
> both of the following characteristics:
> 
> (a) has no undefined behaviour;
> (b) is sufficiently powerful to be interesting.
> 
This reminds me very much of Gödel. ;-)
-- 
Reinhardt

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#53516

Fromgazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack)
Date2014-11-27 15:35 +0000
Message-ID<m57gcm$20f$2@news.xmission.com>
In reply to#53500
In article <m56o8r$g27$1@dont-email.me>,
Reinhardt Behm  <rbehm@hushmail.com> wrote:
>Richard Heathfield wrote:
>
>> Rosario193 wrote:
>> 
>>> one language for program has to have no undefinite behaviour
>>> and has to be simple...the one that program has to think to the
>>> problem one want resolve more than language laws etc
>> 
>> It turns out to be surprisingly difficult to design a language that has
>> both of the following characteristics:
>> 
>> (a) has no undefined behaviour;
>> (b) is sufficiently powerful to be interesting.

I think you need to add:

    (c) Is "arbitrarily portable" like C. [*]

That is, you *can* achieve (a) and (b) if you control all implementations
and platforms.

[*] Although I haven't defined the term, I hope it is reasonably clear what I
mean by "arbitrarily portable".

-- 
Faced with the choice between changing one's mind and proving that there is
no need to do so, almost everyone gets busy on the proof. 

    - John Kenneth Galbraith -

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#53520

FromRichard Damon <Richard@Damon-Family.org>
Date2014-11-27 11:58 -0500
Message-ID<YKIdw.878897$yK.495811@fx14.iad>
In reply to#53516
On 11/27/14, 10:35 AM, Kenny McCormack wrote:
> In article <m56o8r$g27$1@dont-email.me>,
> Reinhardt Behm  <rbehm@hushmail.com> wrote:
>> Richard Heathfield wrote:
>>
>>> Rosario193 wrote:
>>>
>>>> one language for program has to have no undefinite behaviour
>>>> and has to be simple...the one that program has to think to the
>>>> problem one want resolve more than language laws etc
>>>
>>> It turns out to be surprisingly difficult to design a language that has
>>> both of the following characteristics:
>>>
>>> (a) has no undefined behaviour;
>>> (b) is sufficiently powerful to be interesting.
>
> I think you need to add:
>
>      (c) Is "arbitrarily portable" like C. [*]
>
> That is, you *can* achieve (a) and (b) if you control all implementations
> and platforms.
>
> [*] Although I haven't defined the term, I hope it is reasonably clear what I
> mean by "arbitrarily portable".
>

It strictly isn't portability that cause some things to be undefined, 
but the desire to make valid code run as fast as possible. I believe 
that virtually all of the "undefined behavior" in C could be defined at 
the cost of a lot of run-time checking and enforcing defined results. 
(Pointers would need to become "fat" to hold/point to bounds checking 
info). What can't be checked at run time should be able to be checked at 
(post) compile time to find all the undefined behavior caused by 
mis-matches between translation units.

Portability may make something go from Language Defined to 
Implementation Defined to keep any semblance of performance on some 
platforms, but because all Turing complete machines are "equivalent" at 
one level, you can enforce common behavior if you want (some systems may 
become "too small" to implement it, but that is really a given, as some 
are already too small for C)

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#53528

Fromjt@toerring.de (Jens Thoms Toerring)
Date2014-11-27 22:44 +0000
Message-ID<cdpnqnFr5qjU2@mid.uni-berlin.de>
In reply to#53520
Richard Damon <Richard@damon-family.org> wrote:
> It strictly isn't portability that cause some things to be undefined, 
> but the desire to make valid code run as fast as possible. I believe 
> that virtually all of the "undefined behavior" in C could be defined at 
> the cost of a lot of run-time checking and enforcing defined results. 
> (Pointers would need to become "fat" to hold/point to bounds checking 
> info). What can't be checked at run time should be able to be checked at 
> (post) compile time to find all the undefined behavior caused by 
> mis-matches between translation units.

What about stuff also not uncommon to be done in C (or, more
precisely, very often is done in C), i.e. controlling hardware?
If a certain device is for example memory-mapped (i.e. to com-
municate with the device one has to write data to that memory
location or read from it), then one needs to be able to access
that address without C keeping you from doing that. According
to the standard this invokes "undefined behaviour" - you are
going to use a pointer to something you didn't allocate. And
no standard will ever be able to "define" what such accesses
will do (the standard can't prescribe, at least in any reason-
able way, what kind of hardware is to be mapped to a certain
memory address and what that hardware is supposed to do). So
any attempt to disallow at least this kind of "undefined be-
haviour" would rob C of what it was initially written for,
writing operating systems and code near to the metal. A huge
chunk of what C is regularly used for would vanish.

                             Regards, Jens
-- 
  \   Jens Thoms Toerring  ___      jt@toerring.de
   \__________________________      http://toerring.de

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#53555

FromRosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid>
Date2014-11-28 09:52 +0100
Message-ID<kadg7atpirefkhqe6ss4thu8raeho935l1@4ax.com>
In reply to#53528
On 27 Nov 2014 22:44:41 GMT, jt@toerring.de (Jens Thoms Toerring)
wrote:

>Richard Damon <Richard@damon-family.org> wrote:
>> It strictly isn't portability that cause some things to be undefined, 
>> but the desire to make valid code run as fast as possible. I believe 
>> that virtually all of the "undefined behavior" in C could be defined at 
>> the cost of a lot of run-time checking and enforcing defined results. 
>> (Pointers would need to become "fat" to hold/point to bounds checking 
>> info). What can't be checked at run time should be able to be checked at 
>> (post) compile time to find all the undefined behavior caused by 
>> mis-matches between translation units.
>
>What about stuff also not uncommon to be done in C (or, more
>precisely, very often is done in C), i.e. controlling hardware?
>If a certain device is for example memory-mapped (i.e. to com-
>municate with the device one has to write data to that memory
>location or read from it), then one needs to be able to access
>that address without C keeping you from doing that. According
>to the standard this invokes "undefined behaviour" - you are
>going to use a pointer to something you didn't allocate. And
>no standard will ever be able to "define" what such accesses
>will do (the standard can't prescribe, at least in any reason-
>able way, what kind of hardware is to be mapped to a certain
>memory address and what that hardware is supposed to do). So
>any attempt to disallow at least this kind of "undefined be-
>haviour" would rob C of what it was initially written for,
>writing operating systems and code near to the metal. A huge
>chunk of what C is regularly used for would vanish.
>
>                             Regards, Jens

pheraps UB about: basic type size and all operator on these...

one time one has basic types size u8  u16  u32  u64
  one time one had basic pointers size pointers8u,pointers16u, 
  pointers32u,  pointers64u[means 64 bit pointer act as unsigned in 
  operators] 

one time one has operators on them act the same in all computer
remain only UB of some address as above

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#53619

FromTim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu>
Date2014-11-28 12:53 -0800
Message-ID<kfnk32ft5ce.fsf@x-alumni2.alumni.caltech.edu>
In reply to#53528
jt@toerring.de (Jens Thoms Toerring) writes:

> Richard Damon <Richard@damon-family.org> wrote:
>> It strictly isn't portability that cause some things to be
>> undefined, but the desire to make valid code run as fast as
>> possible.  I believe that virtually all of the "undefined behavior"
>> in C could be defined at the cost of a lot of run-time checking and
>> enforcing defined results.  (Pointers would need to become "fat" to
>> hold/point to bounds checking info).  What can't be checked at run
>> time should be able to be checked at (post) compile time to find
>> all the undefined behavior caused by mis-matches between
>> translation units.
>
> What about stuff also not uncommon to be done in C (or, more
> precisely, very often is done in C), i.e. controlling hardware?
> If a certain device is for example memory-mapped (i.e. to com-
> municate with the device one has to write data to that memory
> location or read from it), then one needs to be able to access
> that address without C keeping you from doing that.  According
> to the standard this invokes "undefined behaviour" - you are
> going to use a pointer to something you didn't allocate.  [snip]

I disagree.  There is nothing in the Standard that says no
other objects exist.  The semantics of '*' requires only
that the pointer designate an object, not one allocated by
the program.  Obtaining such a pointer most likely depends
on implementation-defined behavior (eg, by converting an
integer), but as long as that pointer refers to "a region of
data storage in the execution environment, the contents of
which can represent values", the behavior is defined, not
undefined (assuming of course alignment requirements are
satisfied, appropriate qualifier restrictions are observed,
etc).  Nothing prevents an implementation from designating a
specific memory location as such a region;  the behavior in
such cases can be implementation specific, but it is not
ipso facto undefined.

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#53556

FromThomas Jahns <jahns@idontlikespam.dkrz.de>
Date2014-11-28 10:07 +0100
Message-ID<m59dvr$2kar$1@gwdu112.gwdg.de>
In reply to#53520
On 11/27/14 17:58, Richard Damon wrote:
> It strictly isn't portability that cause some things to be undefined, but the
> desire to make valid code run as fast as possible. I believe that virtually all
> of the "undefined behavior" in C could be defined at the cost of a lot of
> run-time checking and enforcing defined results. (Pointers would need to become
> "fat" to hold/point to bounds checking info). What can't be checked at run time
> should be able to be checked at (post) compile time to find all the undefined
> behavior caused by mis-matches between translation units.

One example of things in C that cannot be converted to "defined behaviour" in 
this way is e.g. the conversion of pointers to intptr_t and back. See the 
documentation of MemSafe[1] where some very motivated people tried to get all 
illegal references out of C run-time, which is hard enough already.

Thomas

[1] http://www.ece.umd.edu/~barua/scam.pdf

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#53582

FromThomas Jahns <jahns@idontlikespam.dkrz.de>
Date2014-11-28 14:57 +0100
Message-ID<m59v0j$6kv$1@gwdu112.gwdg.de>
In reply to#53556
On 11/28/14 10:07, Thomas Jahns wrote:
> One example of things in C that cannot be converted to "defined behaviour" in
> this way is e.g. the conversion of pointers to intptr_t and back. See the
> documentation of MemSafe[1] where some very motivated people tried to get all
> illegal references out of C run-time, which is hard enough already.

Also there's SoftBoundCETS[2]

Thomas

[2] http://www.cs.rutgers.edu/~santosh.nagarakatte/softbound/

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#53621

FromTim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu>
Date2014-11-28 13:09 -0800
Message-ID<kfnfvd3t4li.fsf@x-alumni2.alumni.caltech.edu>
In reply to#53556
Thomas Jahns <jahns@idontlikespam.dkrz.de> writes:

> On 11/27/14 17:58, Richard Damon wrote:
>> It strictly isn't portability that cause some things to be
>> undefined, but the desire to make valid code run as fast as
>> possible.  I believe that virtually all of the "undefined
>> behavior" in C could be defined at the cost of a lot of run-time
>> checking and enforcing defined results.  (Pointers would need to
>> become "fat" to hold/point to bounds checking info).  What can't
>> be checked at run time should be able to be checked at (post)
>> compile time to find all the undefined behavior caused by
>> mis-matches between translation units.
>
> One example of things in C that cannot be converted to "defined
> behaviour" in this way is e.g. the conversion of pointers to
> intptr_t and back.  See the documentation of MemSafe[1] where
> some very motivated people tried to get all illegal references
> out of C run-time, which is hard enough already.

This conclusion isn't right.  It may not be easy or convenient,
but it is possible.  The people who did MemSafe were operating
under additional constraints that ruled ways of doing this that
would allow 100% safety in such cases.

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#53567

FromRosario193 <Rosario@invalid.invalid>
Date2014-11-28 12:01 +0100
Message-ID<tblg7at61jsr06vv4b4j8gceg34g7alqs0@4ax.com>
In reply to#53498
On Thu, 27 Nov 2014 08:37:36 +0000, Richard Heathfield
<invalid@see.sig.invalid> wrote:

>Rosario193 wrote:
>
>> one language for program has to have no undefinite behaviour
>> and has to be simple...the one that program has to think to the
>> problem one want resolve more than language laws etc
>
>It turns out to be surprisingly difficult to design a language that has both 
>of the following characteristics:
>
>(a) has no undefined behaviour;
>(b) is sufficiently powerful to be interesting.
>
>Imagine a one-bit machine 

why one bit machine [that are far[lontane] from human think] if we
have good 32 bits cpus?

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#53585

FromRichard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid>
Date2014-11-28 14:46 +0000
Message-ID<gV%dw.11067$u_7.339@fx08.am4>
In reply to#53567
Rosario193 wrote:

> On Thu, 27 Nov 2014 08:37:36 +0000, Richard Heathfield
> <invalid@see.sig.invalid> wrote:
> 
>>Rosario193 wrote:
>>
>>> one language for program has to have no undefinite behaviour
>>> and has to be simple...the one that program has to think to the
>>> problem one want resolve more than language laws etc
>>
>>It turns out to be surprisingly difficult to design a language that has
>>both of the following characteristics:
>>
>>(a) has no undefined behaviour;
>>(b) is sufficiently powerful to be interesting.
>>
>>Imagine a one-bit machine
> 
> why one bit machine [that are far[lontane] from human think] if we
> have good 32 bits cpus?

It's for the same reason that mathematicians consider a spherical cow. You 
start off with a simple case, make sure you understand it thoroughly, and 
then proceed to a more complicated case.

It turns out that, even in a one-bit machine, you have to have pretty close 
control over the hardware (or virtual hardware) design if you are to avoid 
undefined behaviour in the case of a program with no HALT instruction. 
Either that, or you make both opcodes mean HALT, which kind of defeats the 
point of having the computer in the first place.

As you increase the power of the machine, its capacity to do crazy stuff 
expands exponentially.

Show me a language with no undefined behaviour, and I'll show you a language 
that is insufficiently powerful.

-- 
Richard Heathfield
Email: rjh at cpax dot org dot uk
"Usenet is a strange place" - dmr 29 July 1999
Sig line 4 vacant - apply within

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#53622

FromTim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu>
Date2014-11-28 13:16 -0800
Message-ID<kfnbnnrt49d.fsf@x-alumni2.alumni.caltech.edu>
In reply to#53498
Richard Heathfield <invalid@see.sig.invalid> writes:

> Rosario193 wrote:
>
>> one language for program has to have no undefinite behaviour
>> and has to be simple...the one that program has to think to the
>> problem one want resolve more than language laws etc
>
> It turns out to be surprisingly difficult to design a language
> that has both of the following characteristics:
>
> (a) has no undefined behaviour;
> (b) is sufficiently powerful to be interesting.
>
> [snip elaboration]

Either what you mean is different from what it appears you
are saying, or the claim is, well, let's say wrong in the
high-order bit.  An ordinary deterministic Turing machine
(ie, as a class of programs) satisfies both properties.

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