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Re: lvalues from the ternary op

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From Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org>
Newsgroups comp.lang.c
Subject Re: lvalues from the ternary op
Date Wed, 18 Jan 2017 18:08:59 -0800
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supercat@casperkitty.com writes:
> On Wednesday, January 18, 2017 at 4:39:58 PM UTC-6, Keith Thompson wrote:
>> But structure and union definitions *do* create multiple overlapping
>> objects.  Introducing this idea of a "view" is neither necessary nor
>> helpful.
>
> The C Standard doesn't really cope well with the existence of multiple
> overlapping objects.

Sure it does, at least for the purposes of what we're discussing at the
moment.

Given:

    struct { uint32_t x, y; } s1;

s1, s1.x, and s1.y are all objects.  Again, if you disagree, consult the
standard's definition of the word "object" and explain how it doesn't
apply to all three of them.  And if s1.x isn't an object, that's going
to break a lot of the existing wording in the standard.

>                       It is helpful to have a concept to describe a region
> of storage with a well-defined lifetime which is disjoint from all other
> such regions.

In other words, an object that's not part of another object.  Perhaps it
would be helpful in some contexts -- but the Standard copes perfectly
well, as far as I can tell, without a specific term for that concept.
If you want a term for it, I suppose "full object" would do, by analogy
with the existing terms "full expression" and "full declarator".

>                It is also useful to have a concept to describe a view of
> a region of storage whose lifetime may be shorter than that of the storage
> thus described, and which can only overlap other "live" views in limited
> circumstances.  Using the same term to describe both concepts, however,
> seems less helpful.
>
> Given struct s { uint32_t x,y;} *p1,*p2; in what cases, if any, would a
> compiler be allowed to assume that p1->x and p2->y cannot alias?

In this context, I don't care.  The question of whether a given
expression is an lvalue or not isn't about aliasing.  I see no point in
bringing in irrelevant complications.

[...]

-- 
Keith Thompson (The_Other_Keith) kst-u@mib.org  <http://www.ghoti.net/~kst>
Working, but not speaking, for JetHead Development, Inc.
"We must do something.  This is something.  Therefore, we must do this."
    -- Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn, "Yes Minister"

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Thread

Re: lvalues from the ternary op Manfred <noname@invalid.add> - 2017-01-04 19:46 +0100
  Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-04 11:08 -0800
  Re: lvalues from the ternary op Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-01-04 21:10 +0000
    Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-04 13:48 -0800
      Re: lvalues from the ternary op Ian Collins <ian-news@hotmail.com> - 2017-01-05 11:07 +1300
        Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-04 14:20 -0800
      Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-04 14:41 -0800
        Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-04 15:21 -0800
          Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-04 15:52 -0800
            Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-04 16:37 -0800
            Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-04 18:31 -0800
              Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-13 17:26 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-13 17:49 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-15 22:53 -0800
    Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-13 17:08 -0800
      Re: lvalues from the ternary op Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-01-14 02:15 +0000
        Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-15 22:51 -0800
      Re: lvalues from the ternary op luser droog <luser.droog@gmail.com> - 2017-01-16 23:09 -0800
        Re: lvalues from the ternary op Manfred <noname@invalid.add> - 2017-01-18 14:51 +0100
          Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-18 09:59 -0800
            Re: lvalues from the ternary op Lew Pitcher <lew.pitcher@digitalfreehold.ca> - 2017-01-18 13:12 -0500
            Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-18 12:11 -0800
              Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-18 12:45 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-18 14:07 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-18 14:40 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-18 16:10 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-18 18:08 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-19 06:44 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-19 08:40 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-19 12:32 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-20 06:01 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-20 08:15 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-20 10:51 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-20 11:32 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-20 13:41 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-23 07:04 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Ike Naar <ike@iceland.freeshell.org> - 2017-01-23 17:59 +0000
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-23 10:57 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-31 08:45 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-01-31 09:13 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-31 10:17 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-02-01 01:51 +0000
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-01 14:24 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2017-02-02 03:07 +0000
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-04 04:43 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-04 08:01 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-09 09:06 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-09 11:56 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-12 10:29 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-12 13:43 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-19 21:44 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-20 08:15 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-24 07:58 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-24 10:00 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op scott@slp53.sl.home (Scott Lurndal) - 2017-02-24 18:58 +0000
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-24 13:03 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-02-24 14:11 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-02-24 12:42 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-02-24 13:49 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-24 13:58 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2017-02-24 14:56 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat <flatfinger@casperkitty.com> - 2017-02-25 14:00 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-25 09:23 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-25 09:43 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> - 2017-02-01 22:47 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-02 10:12 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-04 07:51 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-02-04 08:18 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-09 08:58 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-04 04:00 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Kelsey Bjarnason <kbjarnason@gmail.com> - 2017-02-04 09:35 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-04 09:35 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2017-01-31 13:36 -0600
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op supercat@casperkitty.com - 2017-01-31 12:23 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-02-01 13:48 -0800
                Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-31 08:53 -0800
            Re: lvalues from the ternary op Manfred <noname@invalid.add> - 2017-01-19 14:10 +0100
        Re: lvalues from the ternary op Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2017-01-30 12:05 -0800

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