Re: C arithmetic question.

From	James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net>
Newsgroups	comp.lang.c
Subject	Re: C arithmetic question.
Date	2012-01-24 15:40 -0500
Organization	A noiseless patient Spider
Message-ID	<4F1F1734.2020509@verizon.net> (permalink)
References	(9 earlier) <0cd427df-7380-4af4-9b20-eef98dfd57a3@pt5g2000pbb.googlegroups.com> <4F1EF731.80107@verizon.net> <cebb0677-e7b3-4c02-82c8-81ab679d3c03@v6g2000pba.googlegroups.com> <4F1F07FF.3010001@verizon.net> <a52b651f-d69e-43d5-8ef1-ea4e2bd191a1@i10g2000pbl.googlegroups.com>

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On 01/24/2012 03:02 PM, Chad wrote:
> On Jan 24, 11:35 am, James Kuyper <jameskuy...@verizon.net> wrote:
...
>> OK - I'm confused. What do you think Michael's case is? I thought it was
>> (ULONG_MAX-57)%37.
>>
>> Alternatively, you could be referring to the case he mistakenly thought
>> was relevant, (-58)%37? C requires a value of -21 for that case, while
>> the rule you describe requires 16. However, both of those values satisfy
>> the criterion he complained about being violated:
>>
>>> x = y (mod m) if and only if x - y  is divisible by m.
>>
>>         -58 - (-21) = -37 == -1*37
>>         -58 - (16) = -74 == -2*37
>>
>> So the issue you raise is irrelevant to his complaint.
> 
> I'm going to sidestep your question for a minute...
> 
> I interpret something like a = mq + r as being equivalent to
> 
> a mod m = r
> 
> This means that Michael's example becomes
> 
> -58 % 37 = r
> 
> -58 = 37q + r
> 
> if the remainder is allowed to be negative, this expression could
> become something like
> 
> -58 = 37 * (-1) + (-21)
> 
> 
> However, you clearly showed that the correct answer is..
> 
> 4294967238 = 116081095*37 + 23.
>
> This in turn would lead me to believe there is the additional
> restriction to the math forumla (definition) that the remainder has to
> be positive.

In so far as there's an official "math definition" of the modulus
operator, what I "clearly showed" doesn't tell you anything about that
definition. I was using C rules for the % operator, not "math" rules for
the modulus operator. Those C rules specified that, in this context, -58
gets converted to ULONG_MAX-57. The C result is non-negative only
because ULONG_MAX-57 is positive, it has nothing to do with any general
requirement that a%b be non-negative.

a%b is not merely allowed to be negative; If a is negative, larger than
b and not a multiple of b, a%b is required to be negative. However,
because 'a' was ULONG_MAX-57, that doesn't apply

Thread

C arithmetic question. Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2012-01-18 10:32 -0800
  Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-18 14:03 -0500
    Re: C arithmetic question. TheGunslinger <mikiesrunsbaal.sec@sbcglobal.net> - 2012-01-18 19:30 -0800
      Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-19 08:10 -0500
  Re: C arithmetic question. Markus Wichmann <nullplan@gmx.net> - 2012-01-18 21:14 +0100
    Re: C arithmetic question. "BartC" <bc@freeuk.com> - 2012-01-19 10:44 +0000
      Re: C arithmetic question. Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2012-01-21 21:32 +0000
  Re: C arithmetic question. Peter Nilsson <airia@acay.com.au> - 2012-01-18 13:51 -0800
    Re: C arithmetic question. Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2012-01-18 15:51 -0800
      Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-18 20:50 -0500
        Re: C arithmetic question. Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2012-01-20 12:41 -0800
          Re: C arithmetic question. Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-01-20 14:11 -0800
            Re: C arithmetic question. gazelle@shell.xmission.com (Kenny McCormack) - 2012-01-20 22:43 +0000
          Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-20 17:19 -0500
            Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-20 17:32 -0500
              And jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-01-20 23:52 +0100
                Re: And Markus Wichmann <nullplan@gmx.net> - 2012-01-21 19:23 +0100
                Re: And Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-01-21 13:20 -0800
                Re: And jacob navia <jacob@spamsink.net> - 2012-01-21 23:02 +0100
                Re: And Markus Wichmann <nullplan@gmx.net> - 2012-01-22 15:24 +0100
                Re: And Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-01-22 15:40 +0000
                Re: And blp@cs.stanford.edu (Ben Pfaff) - 2012-01-21 11:02 -0800
          Re: C arithmetic question. Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 18:53 +0000
      Re: C arithmetic question. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-01-19 02:09 +0000
      Re: C arithmetic question. Joe Pfeiffer <pfeiffer@cs.nmsu.edu> - 2012-01-18 23:00 -0700
        Re: C arithmetic question. Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2012-01-18 23:14 -0800
          Re: C arithmetic question. Ike Naar <ike@sverige.freeshell.org> - 2012-01-19 08:41 +0000
            Re: C arithmetic question. Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2012-01-20 12:43 -0800
              Re: C arithmetic question. Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2012-01-20 22:17 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2012-01-21 00:12 -0800
              Re: C arithmetic question. Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2012-01-21 21:32 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-01-21 23:21 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2012-01-22 00:48 -0600
                Re: C arithmetic question. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-01-22 11:45 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. Robert Wessel <robertwessel2@yahoo.com> - 2012-01-22 21:46 -0600
                Re: C arithmetic question. Kaz Kylheku <kaz@kylheku.com> - 2012-01-23 04:17 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-01-23 11:19 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. Tim Rentsch <txr@alumni.caltech.edu> - 2012-01-26 10:41 -0800
                Re: C arithmetic question. Seebs <usenet-nospam@seebs.net> - 2012-01-23 07:58 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-01-23 11:06 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-23 07:03 -0500
                Re: C arithmetic question. Ben Bacarisse <ben.usenet@bsb.me.uk> - 2012-01-23 17:27 +0000
          Re: C arithmetic question. Keith Thompson <kst-u@mib.org> - 2012-01-19 02:38 -0800
            Re: C arithmetic question. Dr Nick <3-nospam@temporary-address.org.uk> - 2012-01-20 07:30 +0000
          Re: C arithmetic question. Nomen Nescio <nobody@dizum.com> - 2012-01-19 12:28 +0100
            Re: C arithmetic question. Michael Press <rubrum@pacbell.net> - 2012-01-20 12:44 -0800
              Re: C arithmetic question. 88888 Dihedral <dihedral88888@googlemail.com> - 2012-01-20 13:14 -0800
          Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-19 08:45 -0500
          Re: C arithmetic question. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 08:14 -0800
            Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-24 12:15 -0500
              Re: C arithmetic question. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 09:26 -0800
                Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-24 12:39 -0500
                Re: C arithmetic question. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 10:03 -0800
                Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-24 13:23 -0500
                Re: C arithmetic question. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 10:40 -0800
                Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-24 14:35 -0500
                Re: C arithmetic question. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 12:04 -0800
                Re: C arithmetic question. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 12:02 -0800
                Re: C arithmetic question. Kleuske <kleuske@nowhere.net> - 2012-01-24 20:26 +0000
                Re: C arithmetic question. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 13:45 -0800
                Re: C arithmetic question. James Kuyper <jameskuyper@verizon.net> - 2012-01-24 15:40 -0500
                Re: C arithmetic question. Chad <cdalten@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 12:09 -0800
      Re: C arithmetic question. Rui Maciel <rui.maciel@gmail.com> - 2012-01-24 18:48 +0000
    Re: C arithmetic question. "osmium" <r124c4u102@comcast.net> - 2012-01-19 08:12 -0600
  Re: C arithmetic question. Geoff <geoff@invalid.invalid> - 2012-01-20 15:33 -0800
    Re: C arithmetic question. Kleuske <kleuske@nowhere.net> - 2012-01-27 08:17 +0000
      Re: C arithmetic question. Geoff <geoff@invalid.invalid> - 2012-01-27 13:37 -0800

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