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Video: What is a PID Controller?

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  Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <seemywebsite@myfooter.really> - 2016-05-04 16:48 -0500
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? eric.jacobsen@ieee.org (Eric Jacobsen) - 2016-05-04 21:58 +0000
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Les Cargill <lcargill99@comcast.com> - 2016-05-04 18:30 -0500
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Martin Riddle <martin_ridd@verizon.net> - 2016-05-04 19:43 -0400
      Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <seemywebsite@myfooter.really> - 2016-05-04 18:57 -0500
        Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Clifford Heath <no.spam@please.net> - 2016-05-05 09:07 +1000
          Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <seemywebsite@myfooter.really> - 2016-05-04 19:52 -0500
            Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <seemywebsite@myfooter.really> - 2016-05-04 20:08 -0500
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? robert bristow-johnson <rbj@audioimagination.com> - 2016-05-04 16:51 -0700
      Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <seemywebsite@myfooter.really> - 2016-05-04 18:54 -0500
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Randy Yates <yates@digitalsignallabs.com> - 2016-05-04 23:44 -0400
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2016-05-04 23:21 -0700
      Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <tim@seemywebsite.com> - 2016-05-05 01:49 -0500
        Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2016-05-05 00:58 -0700
          Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Jeff Liebermann <jeffl@cruzio.com> - 2016-05-05 18:14 -0700
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Bob Penoyer <bob@NOSPAMbobpenoyer.com> - 2016-05-05 10:07 -0700
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? OG <freenews@freenewsspam.net> - 2016-05-05 11:01 -0700
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Baron <baron@linuxmaniac.net> - 2016-05-05 20:55 +0100
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? eric.jacobsen@ieee.org (Eric Jacobsen) - 2016-05-05 20:37 +0000
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? piglet <erichpwagner@hotmail.com> - 2016-05-06 11:02 +0100
      Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Randy Yates <yates@digitalsignallabs.com> - 2016-05-06 12:21 -0400
      Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <seemywebsite@myfooter.really> - 2016-05-06 12:52 -0500
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Steve Underwood <steveu@dis.org> - 2016-05-06 22:45 +0800
      Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? makolber@yahoo.com - 2016-05-06 08:13 -0700
        Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <seemywebsite@myfooter.really> - 2016-05-06 12:52 -0500
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? gyansorova@gmail.com - 2016-05-06 14:09 -0700
      Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <seemywebsite@myfooter.really> - 2016-05-06 18:11 -0500
        Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? gyansorova@gmail.com - 2016-05-08 11:46 -0700
          Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? Tim Wescott <tim@seemywebsite.com> - 2016-05-08 15:20 -0500
    Re: Video: What is a PID Controller? ChesterW <iamsnoozin@yahoo.com> - 2016-05-06 20:51 -0500

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#31464

piglet <erichpwagner@hotmail.com> writes:

> On 04/05/2016 22:48, Tim Wescott wrote:
>> Just posted a video.  It's my first real effort and, as videos go, rough
>> as a cob -- but I think the information is solid.
>>
>> I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video into
>> that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book of haiku.
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2elEXcv0AV8
>>
>> YouTube time limit
>> complex subject, 15 minutes
>> very hard.
>>
>
> Thank you Tim, really nice to hear the fan working harder/softer - an
> inspired choice of actuator!
>
> Good clear demonstration, I now can't wait to see a demo of the
> effects of too much D or too much I and not enough D / I etc and then
> an introduction on how to tune these or even explain how self-tuning
> works.

Yes! I had the same questions.

> piglet

--Eeyore

-- 
Randy Yates, DSP/Embedded Firmware Developer
Digital Signal Labs
http://www.digitalsignallabs.com

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#31465

On Fri, 06 May 2016 11:02:53 +0100, piglet wrote:

> On 04/05/2016 22:48, Tim Wescott wrote:
>> Just posted a video.  It's my first real effort and, as videos go,
>> rough as a cob -- but I think the information is solid.
>>
>> I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video
>> into that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book of
>> haiku.
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2elEXcv0AV8
>>
>> YouTube time limit complex subject, 15 minutes very hard.
>>
>>
> Thank you Tim, really nice to hear the fan working harder/softer - an
> inspired choice of actuator!
> 
> Good clear demonstration, I now can't wait to see a demo of the effects
> of too much D or too much I and not enough D / I etc and then an
> introduction on how to tune these or even explain how self-tuning works.

I'm not sure if I'll do self-tuning, but yes, the other two need to go 
into a video -- or two, to fit into YouTube's time limits.

-- 

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

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#31462

On 05/05/2016 05:48 AM, Tim Wescott wrote:
> Just posted a video.  It's my first real effort and, as videos go, rough
> as a cob -- but I think the information is solid.
>
> I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video into
> that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book of haiku.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2elEXcv0AV8
>
> YouTube time limit
> complex subject, 15 minutes
> very hard.

To convey one's mood
In seventeen syllables
Is very diffic
(John Cooper Clarke)

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#31463

> >
> > I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video into
> > that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book of haiku.
> 
My 2cents

the audio is pretty good, if you would like it to be a bit better next time,
move the lav mic a bit away from your neck, more down on your shirt.

Mark

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#31466

On Fri, 06 May 2016 08:13:15 -0700, makolber wrote:


>> > I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video
>> > into that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book
>> > of haiku.
>> 
> My 2cents
> 
> the audio is pretty good, if you would like it to be a bit better next
> time,
> move the lav mic a bit away from your neck, more down on your shirt.
> 
> Mark

Thanks.  I'll try that.

-- 

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

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#31467

On Thursday, May 5, 2016 at 9:48:17 AM UTC+12, Tim Wescott wrote:
> Just posted a video.  It's my first real effort and, as videos go, rough 
> as a cob -- but I think the information is solid.
> 
> I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video into 
> that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book of haiku.
> 
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2elEXcv0AV8
> 
> YouTube time limit
> complex subject, 15 minutes
> very hard.
> 
> -- 
> 
> Tim Wescott
> Wescott Design Services
> http://www.wescottdesign.com

Not bad. Would be good if you could demonstrate structural resonance too as the limiting factor on bandwidth. That bit is always missed in books.

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#31468

On Fri, 06 May 2016 14:09:34 -0700, gyansorova wrote:

> On Thursday, May 5, 2016 at 9:48:17 AM UTC+12, Tim Wescott wrote:
>> Just posted a video.  It's my first real effort and, as videos go,
>> rough as a cob -- but I think the information is solid.
>> 
>> I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video
>> into that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book of
>> haiku.
>> 
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2elEXcv0AV8
>> 
>> YouTube time limit complex subject, 15 minutes very hard.
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com
> 
> Not bad. Would be good if you could demonstrate structural resonance too
> as the limiting factor on bandwidth. That bit is always missed in books.

Much later video.

In some mechanisms it's not structural resonance.  Sometimes it's a 
pileup of grotty 1st-order poles, sometimes it's grotty nonlinearities 
like backlash or stiction (geared mechanisms, in particular, tend to 
this), sometimes it's other things -- it's always something, though, and 
it's usually grotty.

-- 

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

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#31480

On Saturday, May 7, 2016 at 11:11:43 AM UTC+12, Tim Wescott wrote:
> On Fri, 06 May 2016 14:09:34 -0700, gyansorova wrote:
> 
> > On Thursday, May 5, 2016 at 9:48:17 AM UTC+12, Tim Wescott wrote:
> >> Just posted a video.  It's my first real effort and, as videos go,
> >> rough as a cob -- but I think the information is solid.
> >> 
> >> I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video
> >> into that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book of
> >> haiku.
> >> 
> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2elEXcv0AV8
> >> 
> >> YouTube time limit complex subject, 15 minutes very hard.
> >> 
> >> --
> >> 
> >> Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com
> > 
> > Not bad. Would be good if you could demonstrate structural resonance too
> > as the limiting factor on bandwidth. That bit is always missed in books.
> 
> Much later video.
> 
> In some mechanisms it's not structural resonance.  Sometimes it's a 
> pileup of grotty 1st-order poles, sometimes it's grotty nonlinearities 
> like backlash or stiction (geared mechanisms, in particular, tend to 
> this), sometimes it's other things -- it's always something, though, and 
> it's usually grotty.
> 
> -- 
> 
> Tim Wescott
> Wescott Design Services
> http://www.wescottdesign.com

well it's anything that gives you lots of phase lag. Designers should have a phase budget. Two much fiddling PID nowadays. yes they work but don't give the best. You can often fit a second integrator at low frequencies and even a second phase advance.

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#31482

On Sun, 08 May 2016 11:46:53 -0700, gyansorova wrote:

> On Saturday, May 7, 2016 at 11:11:43 AM UTC+12, Tim Wescott wrote:
>> On Fri, 06 May 2016 14:09:34 -0700, gyansorova wrote:
>> 
>> > On Thursday, May 5, 2016 at 9:48:17 AM UTC+12, Tim Wescott wrote:
>> >> Just posted a video.  It's my first real effort and, as videos go,
>> >> rough as a cob -- but I think the information is solid.
>> >> 
>> >> I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video
>> >> into that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book
>> >> of haiku.
>> >> 
>> >> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2elEXcv0AV8
>> >> 
>> >> YouTube time limit complex subject, 15 minutes very hard.
>> >> 
>> >> --
>> >> 
>> >> Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com
>> > 
>> > Not bad. Would be good if you could demonstrate structural resonance
>> > too as the limiting factor on bandwidth. That bit is always missed in
>> > books.
>> 
>> Much later video.
>> 
>> In some mechanisms it's not structural resonance.  Sometimes it's a
>> pileup of grotty 1st-order poles, sometimes it's grotty nonlinearities
>> like backlash or stiction (geared mechanisms, in particular, tend to
>> this), sometimes it's other things -- it's always something, though,
>> and it's usually grotty.
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> Tim Wescott Wescott Design Services http://www.wescottdesign.com
> 
> well it's anything that gives you lots of phase lag. Designers should
> have a phase budget. Two much fiddling PID nowadays. yes they work but
> don't give the best. You can often fit a second integrator at low
> frequencies and even a second phase advance.

I've worked on projects where we handed out phase budgets to the circuit 
guys -- of course, it was because the lead electrical guy was stuck on 
"it's sampling, therefore it must have an anti-alias filter", and I COULD 
NOT get him talked down.  But at least I ended up without too too much 
phase lag in the system.

-- 
Tim Wescott
Control systems, embedded software and circuit design
I'm looking for work!  See my website if you're interested
http://www.wescottdesign.com

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#31469

On 5/4/16 4:48 PM, Tim Wescott wrote:
> Just posted a video.  It's my first real effort and, as videos go, rough
> as a cob -- but I think the information is solid.
>
> I have a 15-minute time limit -- trying to fit an informative video into
> that is kind of like explaining General Relativity with a book of haiku.
>
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2elEXcv0AV8
>
> YouTube time limit
> complex subject, 15 minutes
> very hard.
>

Hi Tim,

Nice video, thanks for posting. I thought the controlled system was the 
neatest part. My suggestion is that you lead off with showing what the 
system can do - command a few angles, introduce a few upsets, maybe in 
rapid succession, and watch the system respond. Then the audience will 
be receptive to listen to how to achieve those results. I'm not sure how 
you do that with the time limit. It's a challenge.

-- 

Best Regards,

ChesterW
+++
Dr Chester Wildey
Founder MRRA Inc.
Electronic and Optoelectronic Instruments
MRI Motion, fNIRS Brain Scanners, Counterfeit and Covert Marker Detection
Fort Worth, Texas, USA
www.mrrainc.com
wildey at mrrainc dot com

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