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[telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars

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  [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "danny burstein" <dannyb@panix.com> - 2023-05-18 12:48 +0000
    Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Bill Horne" <malQRMassimilation@gmail.com> - 2023-05-18 11:13 -0400
      Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Marco Moock" <mo01@posteo.de> - 2023-05-19 08:41 +0200
        Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Bill Horne" <malQRMassimilation@gmail.com> - 2023-05-19 18:22 -0400
      Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Michael Trew" <michael.trew@att.net> - 2023-05-19 23:44 -0400
        Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Bill Horne" <malQRMassimilation@gmail.com> - 2023-05-20 09:52 -0400
          Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Garrett Wollman" <wollman@bimajority.org> - 2023-05-20 16:51 +0000
        Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Garrett Wollman" <wollman@bimajority.org> - 2023-05-20 16:18 +0000
          Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "John Levine" <johnl@iecc.com> - 2023-05-21 16:45 -0400
            Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Fred Atkinson" <fatkinson@mishmash.com> - 2023-05-23 05:31 +0000
              Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Bill Horne" <digest-replies@telecomdigest.net> - 2023-05-23 10:25 -0400
              Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Garrett Wollman" <wollman@bimajority.org> - 2023-05-23 20:07 +0000
                Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Fred Atkinson" <fatkinson@mishmash.com> - 2023-05-24 22:30 +0000
                  Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Garrett Wollman" <wollman@bimajority.org> - 2023-05-25 21:25 +0000
                    Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Fred Atkinson" <fatkinson@mishmash.com> - 2023-05-26 20:31 +0000
                      Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Garrett Wollman" <wollman@bimajority.org> - 2023-05-27 21:17 +0000
                        Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Bill Horne" <digest-replies@telecomdigest.net> - 2023-05-28 18:28 -0400
                          Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Fred Goldstein" <invalid@see-sig.invalid> - 2023-05-30 11:24 -0400
                            Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Bill Horne" <digest-replies@telecomdigest.net> - 2023-05-30 13:13 -0400
                        RE: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Patton Turner" <address-withheld@invalid.telecom-digest.org> - 2023-05-31 02:06 +0000
            Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Bill Horne" <digest-replies@telecomdigest.net> - 2023-05-23 08:39 -0400
            Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Fred Goldstein" <invalid@see-sig.invalid> - 2023-05-23 11:30 -0400
          Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Michael Trew" <michael.trew@att.net> - 2023-05-30 15:57 -0400
            Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Bill Horne" <digest-replies@telecomdigest.net> - 2023-05-31 09:07 -0400
              Re: [telecom] Congress moves to preserve AM radio in cars "Marco Moock" <mo01@posteo.de> - 2023-05-31 16:54 +0200

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#14149

On Sun, May 21, 2023 at 04:45:00PM -0400, John Levine wrote:
> It appears that Garrett Wollman <wollman@bimajority.org> said:
> >And guess what? Your phone gets the same emergency alerts as the radio
> >stations do.  That excuse simply doesn't hold water any more.
> 
> I'm guessing you don't spend a lot of time driving around out in the boondocks.
> 
> As soon as you get off main roads in a hilly area, cell signals are
> hit and miss. Here in not particularly rural upstate NY I can show you
> places on state highways where there's no cell signal at all.  I expect
> western Mass is the same way.

s/in a hilly area/south of the Mason-Dixon Line/
s/not particulasrly rural upsate NY/the hills of western North Carolina/
s/expect/know/

Bill "We're not at the end of the world, but we can hear the waterfall" Horne

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#14150

On 5/21/2023 4:45 PM, John Levine wrote:
> It appears that Garrett Wollman<wollman@bimajority.org>  said:
>> And guess what? Your phone gets the same emergency alerts as the radio
>> stations do.  That excuse simply doesn't hold water any more.
> I'm guessing you don't spend a lot of time driving around out in the boondocks.
>
> As soon as you get off main roads in a hilly area, cell signals are
> hit and miss. Here in not particularly rural upstate NY I can show you
> places on state highways where there's no cell signal at all.  I expect
> western Mass is the same way.

Western Mass. definitely is that way. Mobile phone coverage is spotty.
Hilly terrain gets in the way. The same applies elsewhere in the
Appalachian region, probably even up north into Canada.

Besides that, the experience of a car radio is different from a mobile 
phone, and safer. I can turn on the radio and hear continuous 
programming, and change the station with a button. Mobile Devices use 
touch screens, which are inherently dangerous when driving. And the 
canned programming you usually get on a mobile device leaves you out of 
touch with news alerts anything short of a very serious emergency.

-- 
Fred R. Goldstein      k1io    fred "at" interisle.net
  Interisle Consulting Group
  +1 617 795 2701

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#14170

On 5/20/2023 12:18, Garrett Wollman wrote:
> In article<omX9M.808180$PXw7.515043@fx45.iad>,
> Michael Trew<michael.trew@att.net>  wrote:
>
>> As Marco said, in many new cars, you can't install an after-market
>> radio.  One part of me wants to agree with you, that it's the
>> manufacturer's right to not include an AM radio... but setting that
>> precedent will be the death of broadcast AM.
>
> It's already dead.  FM and satellite are not far behind.  With 4G and
> 5G wireless there is simply no reason for anyone to still use
> broadcast radio: you can get all the same programming and much, much
> more, streamed to your mobile device which you control using CarPlay
> or Android Auto through the dashboard touch-screen.
>
> And guess what? Your phone gets the same emergency alerts as the radio
> stations do.  That excuse simply doesn't hold water any more.

Satellite radio is built into every new car with subscriptions.  I know 
quite a number of people who use it (anecdotal, I know).  Car 
manufacturers must have something going with the satellite radio people 
-- kind of like Microsoft of yore and Internet Explorer.  Further, it's 
easy to disable emergency alerts on the mobile phones; it's right there 
in the settings.  Flip phones tend to not have the emergency alerts. 
The same can't be said for broadcast radio.

Either way, I'll take your point that it's moot to argue AM radio being 
vital to emergency broadcast, in general.  I'm probably the oldest 28 
year old on the planet, but I enjoy my broadcast radio, and I 
particularly enjoy pulling in distant clear-channel stations at night. 
You'll regularly find me tuning into 650 AM WSM from Nashville on my 10 
PM commute home in Western PA/Eastern Ohio.  I'd like to see amplitude 
modulation and broadcast radio, in general, to live on.

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#14172

On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 03:57:03PM -0400, Michael Trew wrote:
> I'm probably the oldest 28 year old on the planet, but I enjoy my
> broadcast radio, and I particularly enjoy pulling in distant
> clear-channel stations at night. You'll regularly find me tuning
> into 650 AM WSM from Nashville on my 10 PM commute home in Western
> PA/Eastern Ohio.  I'd like to see amplitude modulation and broadcast
> radio, in general, to live on.

In 1978 and 1979, I worked at radio stations in Santa Barbara,
California, while I attended college there. The first station I worked
at had purchased a Volkswagon "Thing" automobile from a soldier who
brought it home from Germany. It had an AM radio that tuned the
European broadcast band, around 200 KHz, and every week, I would drive
it up to the top of the Los Padres forest to check the station's
transmitter.

I could here Deutsche Welle all the way up and all the way back down,
all during the ride, on about 200 KHz, which is the low end of the
band where aircraft marker beacons operate in the U.S. IIRC, I could
even hear the marker beacon at the Santa Barbara airport.

I was the happiest 26 year old in the world. I even learned a few
words of German!

Bill 

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#14174

Am 31.05.2023 um 09:07:56 Uhr schrieb Bill Horne:

> On Tue, May 30, 2023 at 03:57:03PM -0400, Michael Trew wrote:
> > I'm probably the oldest 28 year old on the planet, but I enjoy my
> > broadcast radio, and I particularly enjoy pulling in distant
> > clear-channel stations at night. You'll regularly find me tuning
> > into 650 AM WSM from Nashville on my 10 PM commute home in Western
> > PA/Eastern Ohio.  I'd like to see amplitude modulation and broadcast
> > radio, in general, to live on.  
> 
> In 1978 and 1979, I worked at radio stations in Santa Barbara,
> California, while I attended college there. The first station I worked
> at had purchased a Volkswagon "Thing" automobile from a soldier who
> brought it home from Germany. It had an AM radio that tuned the
> European broadcast band, around 200 KHz, and every week, I would drive
> it up to the top of the Los Padres forest to check the station's
> transmitter.

> I could here Deutsche Welle all the way up and all the way back down,
> all during the ride, on about 200 KHz, which is the low end of the
> band where aircraft marker beacons operate in the U.S. IIRC, I could
> even hear the marker beacon at the Santa Barbara airport.

In Europe an Asia, 3 bands are used for AM transmissions: long wave
(153 kHz to 179, long time ago until ~350 kHz), medium wave (520-1620
kHz) and SW (many bands).

Long wave hasn't been used in all countries, some are still on air.
Deutsche Welle is a German foreign station that operated on SW and a
little bit on MW, bot newer on long wave (LW).
200 kHz might be the BBC from England. Their TX is still on air on 198
kHz.
In Germany, 153, 207 (Deutschlandfunk) and 177 (DRadio, former GDR) were
on air. In Burg was 261 on air with a German transmission, but only some
years after the soviet army moved out that has been closed.
Except for Burg, all other LW TX were demolished in the last years.

Burg is still on air on a lower frequency for controlling power meters.

Now LW is almost dead, stations are being switched off and antennas are
going to be demolished.

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